Couple of (maybe stupid) questions about water bladders

[Patrick]

I've always been a fan of just carrying water in old soda bottles or whatever. I usually use two 1-liter Aquafina bottles.

I've avoided water bladder/drinking tube systems for hiking because they've always seemed too complicated, possible leaking seems like a pretty bad thing, and I don't know how sanitary it is to have that tube forever. If soda bottles get dirty, they're easy to replace.

On my last trip, two things happened to make me rethink this plan. One is that I brought along a 2-liter Platypus for camp water, which helped me trust them a little more. The second was that I wasn't drinking enough, largely because I didn't feel like dealing with hiking poles/getting water out/unscrewing caps enough to be drinking as much as I should. What would happen is that I'd wind up dehydrating all day, then drinking tons at night to fill back up. Not good, I know, not least because it meant I was pissing as many as FIVE times after I went to bed.

So, my plan now is to replace my two Aquafina bottles with a second 2-liter Platypus with drinking tube. I still don't want to keep it inside my bag (water gets warm, possible leak, etc), but I found that my 2-liter fits fine in my side pockets (I have a ULA P-1). Actually, just to stay balanced, maybe I'll get two one-liters instead and just switch caps.

Finally, my questions.

I'm going to have to put them in upside down (cap down), right? I was thinking I might be able to stay cap-up if I was careful to squeeze out all the air when I filled them, but I'm guessing air will seep in via the tube. I'm paranoid about leaks.

How big of a pain is the tube? I'm going to run it either up over my shoulder or up along the bottom of the shoulder strap. I guess they have clips on them that, in conjunction with the d-rings on my straps should keep the mouthpiece close and in place. Anyone ever have a problem with the tube catching on branches or anything?

How sanitary are they? Is the mouthpiece going to get nasty? I don't know if I'll be able to just tilt my head to get at it or if I'll need to give it a bump with my hand (which I don't mind). I'll be sure not to touch the mouthpiece itself with my hand, but does it get gross? How about the tube? Does stuff build up in there? How often do you have to clean them?

I've read about using them with filters. Is this realistic and safe? I have a Hiker. I like the idea of losing the clean hose in the bag and just plugging a hydration hose into it and pumping directly into the bladder.

I figure that even if every part of the system goes south on the trail, the worst I'll have to do is go back to what I use now.

Okay, thanks for reading. I'm looking forward to hear everyone's input.

[Saluki Dave]

I use a couple of Platys, both 2 liter, andsometimes a botle as well. One of the platys I keep in my pack lid and drink from it with a tube. The other stays rolled up when for camp or when I need extra capacity. The bottle is a treat, like Gatorade etc. My biggest problem with the bite valve is it is the perfect dirt/puddle finder. Every time I drop my pack, damn thing finds the dirtiest nearby surface to touch (no matter how diligent I am). Sorta defeats the purpose of filtering. In general though, I drink more with a tube and valve, although by no means enough.

[Patrick]

Thanks for the feedback. I'm trying to think if there's a way to keep it clean. Nothing comes to mind yet. Maybe I'll pick one up on the way home and mess with it.

[soulrebel]

Here's some weight's from our gear list and pros/cons to think about

Camelback 1L 6.3oz
Generic high sierra 2L 4.9oz
Insulating Hose Cover .8oz
Nalgene CSW 2L 5.8oz
Nalgene CSW 3L 6.5oz

CSW is the toughest material of the bunch, is supposed to be flavor resistant, albeit heavier. The main thing however is the quick release hose connect which won't leak unlike the other models which are nozzle or screw based which will leak. The csw has a nice round "bite me" valve that is easy to slide off and clean--it is not a single "nub" with a slit in it. and oh yeah the nalgene has a lil magnet there that connects to another circular magnet that you can place on your shoulder strap...

Shorten the hose a bit to help prevent the nasty's, I found trying to cover the valve w/ a piece a fabric is troublesome.

I'd recommend getting one larger bladder rather than two, considering the weight of the screw in lids. However if you were to do singles the nalgene csw would allow you to quick swap bladders w/o leaking or hassle..

here's a few pics:
first one is the camelback then generic high sierra, then nalgene csw

[Oracle]

I use a 3-liter platypus and a Sweetwater filter (when the sweetwater takes a dump, I'll be switching over to a Katadyn Hiker, a friend has one and I really like it). To fill it up, I just keep the platypus in my bag, slip the bite valve off the end of the hose, and plug in the outlet of my filter straight into the drinking hose, and pump while I'm wearing the pack standing over the stream or whatever. Works like a charm.

I thread my hose into my pack straps a little, so the bite valve and hose don't hit the ground when I take off my pack. Also, taking the bite valve off to clean it is very easy with a platypus, so as long as you do this occasionally you should be fine.

[Footslogger]

I've been using a hydration system now for several years and have yet to experience a leak or other problem.

I use the 1.8 Liter Platypus "hoser". After my pack is loaded I take the platy, lay it horizontally, wrap it in the storm collar and then secure it with the compression straps at the top of my pack (Granite Gear Vapor Trail). That system has served me well and made it all the way from Springer to Katahdin in 2003.

You asked about the hose getting in the way. To be honest I don't even notice it now. The hose just drapes down over my right shoulder and sits about chest high next to my shoulder strap.

Does the moutpiece get nasty ?? Well ...it can if you let it drag on the ground when you're not wearing your pack. I just tuck it under a strap so that it stays off the ground.

I should mention that I also carry a 20 oz gatorade bottle and strap it to my left shoulder strap using light weight shock cord. I start off each morning with that 20 oz bottle filled with gatorade, Tang or a mixture of the two (I carry the powder). I often use this bottle as my water "scoup" to refill my platy.

I do not carry a filter any more. I own one of every filter ever made and until about 3 years ago I generally carried a PUR Hiker. I was never happy with the idea of filtering water and then wrapping up the device (still wet from pumping) and stuffing it in my pack until the next use. In my opinion, the warm, wet environment is perfect for the growth of bacteria and other pathogens. When AquaMira was made available for general use I read the literature and talked to several scientist friends who confirmed it's viability. I switched to AquaMira and use it exclusively nowadays when I feel it's necessary to treat water before drinking it.

'Slogger

[Rain Man]

Thanks for the feedback. I'm trying to think if there's a way to keep it clean. Nothing comes to mind yet. Maybe I'll pick one up on the way home and mess with it.

I've heard of people using a 35mm film cannister. Drill a hole in the bottom. Slide the cannister down over the tube. Put the bite valve back on the tube. Slide the cannister up over the bite valve and pop the cap on the cannister. Bite valve stays clean.

My daughter Grass had a bite valve chewed up really good one night we stayed in the cabins on Mt. LeConte in the Smokies. Learned a lesson about what all mice will chew on.

Rain:sunMan

.

[Alligator]

...Finally, my questions.

I'm going to have to put them in upside down (cap down), right? I was thinking I might be able to stay cap-up if I was careful to squeeze out all the air when I filled them, but I'm guessing air will seep in via the tube. I'm paranoid about leaks..I place mine upside because once in a while the whole platypus bends and prevents flow. Rather than stop and fix this, I just leave it upside down. Air never goes back in unless you blow into the tube or you have a leaking bite valve. The only time mine has leaked is when I have screwed the cap on crooked.


How big of a pain is the tube? I'm going to run it either up over my shoulder or up along the bottom of the shoulder strap. I guess they have clips on them that, in conjunction with the d-rings on my straps should keep the mouthpiece close and in place. Anyone ever have a problem with the tube catching on branches or anything?.I have a small clip on my shoulder strap. Works good. Also, if you have the cap on the bottom (bladder upside down), slack in the tube is used up.


How sanitary are they? Is the mouthpiece going to get nasty? I don't know if I'll be able to just tilt my head to get at it or if I'll need to give it a bump with my hand (which I don't mind). I'll be sure not to touch the mouthpiece itself with my hand, but does it get gross? How about the tube? Does stuff build up in there? How often do you have to clean them?.A little bleach in water goes in after returning home. Sometimes the bite valve gets dirty, rinse it off. I doubt you'll be that fastidious after a few weeks. Stuff builds up if you put sugar in them, much less frequently if you don't. Also, once in a while I'll run a coat hanger with cloth through the tube, otherwise, bleach.



I've read about using them with filters. Is this realistic and safe? I have a Hiker. I like the idea of losing the clean hose in the bag and just plugging a hydration hose into it and pumping directly into the bladder..I have pumped straight in when carrying a filter. Alone, I use iodine.


I figure that even if every part of the system goes south on the trail, the worst I'll have to do is go back to what I use now. .Mine has been very reliable. Don't roll them up or fold them (platypus)

I carry a 2.5 and 3 liter. Then I can camel up and camp in dry spots.

[Big Dawg]

Patrick,,, I've used my hydration system for years, & have yet to have a problem. I like staying hydrated, & seem to drink more when I have access to a sippy tube while hiking. My hiking partner just switched from regular bottles & loves it. Now he doesn't have to stop hiking, ungrip one of his poles, finagle out his bottle from side pack pocket, drink, put bottle back in place, regrip pole, & then begin hiking. As you now know, hosers simply direct mouthpiece to mouth, & drink while continuing to hike. Love it!!!

Anyway, I just wanted to show you what I use to cover my mouthpiece,, it's lightweight & works great. http://www.rei.com/product/47912736.htm?

[flyfisher]

So, my plan now is to replace my two Aquafina bottles with a second 2-liter Platypus with drinking tube. I still don't want to keep it inside my bag (water gets warm, possible leak, etc), but I found that my 2-liter fits fine in my side pockets

Finally, my questions.

I'm going to have to put them in upside down (cap down), right?

How big of a pain is the tube? I'm going to run it either up over my shoulder or up along the bottom of the shoulder strap.

How sanitary are they? Is the mouthpiece going to get nasty?

I figure that even if every part of the system goes south on the trail, the worst I'll have to do is go back to what I use now.


I have used a platy 2 liter in the side of my pack for 3 years. I have eventually worn out two of the bags. They end up leaking where they bend near the mouth of the bladder. But I have been using the same tube and nipple for all three years.

I dry the bag after a trip by inflating it and letting it sit upright in a sunny window for a few days. The convection currents dry the bottle. I dry the tube by taking the nipple off and letting the tube hang by the plastic fitting from the top of a window. It dries out completely. Once every few trips, I take the nipple apart. The green plastic rolls down off the yellow central core. I use a little soap and a washcloth or a tooth brush to get rid of the little bit of algae that forms in the space between the two parts.

I also put it in the side of my bag, upside down, and route the tube up and out of the pocket and then through the hang loop between my pack straps. Then the tube runs over one of my shoulders and is at hand all the time. Right side up, even with no bubbles, the top of the platy colapses and it is really hard to get any liquid out.

When filling the platy, it is simple to fill it partway, attach the tube and just suck the air out rightside up. Then I turn it upside down and put it in the pack.

For winter use, below freezing, I blow a little air into the tube after taking a drink. This keeps the tube free from water and makes it much easier to get a drink. Every few hours, I need to vent the accumulated air from the bladder, just like when filling it. I take it out of the pack, turn right side up, and suck the air out.

When I put my pack down, I am usually concened with where the nipple is. I don't want it in the dirt, but even more important, I don't want it under the pack. It is easy to lose all my water if I set the pack on the nipple and rest for a while. Same thing when putting a pack in the back of a shuttle vehicle. I always check to see where the end of the tube is before we leave for a trip.

I do carry an extra bladder in my pack. I use it when it looks like it will be more than 10 miles to the next water. (I get about 10 miles of hot hiking in with a 2 liter platy) It also gives me a spare for the time when I eventually wear out another one.

BTW, there is a lifetime guarantee against leaking due to material failure. It does not apply to wear and tear. By the time I have used a platy for a month of hiking, I pretty well feel the leak that finally springs is from wear and tear. I have the two old ones, in case I start to feel otherwise. (They also work very well upright as a second bag, because the leak is always at the neck.

[Just Jeff]

I have two 100 oz CamelBaks, a 70 oz Camel Bak, and a 3L Platy. The only one that hasn't leaked is the 70 oz, which is also the oldest.

My 100 oz ones both leaked where the tube attaches to the hard plastic on the bladder (one just as I was entering a combat zone...not happy). I trimmed the tube, which gave me a tighter fit, and tried again. I had to use a hair drier to get the tube pliable enough to slip it on, and it still leaked. I trimmed again, added some aquarium silicone sealant, and tried again. One leaked, and I haven't really tried the other one enough to say if it worked or not.

My Platy leaked where the soft plastic meets the hard plastic on the corner of the bladder. The bending at that point, caused by sitting upright in my pack and stressing that point, caused the leak right at the intersection. I added the same sealant, and it worked for a while before leaking again.

I like the Platy bite valve and have never had a problem with it leaking. It's easy to slip on and off when I want to fill a cookpot or something (unlike my Camel Bak ones). The Camel Bak ones aren't bad, though.

My biggest problem was filling. The bladder pocket in my Speed is right against the back, so it was hard to stick a full bladder back inside without unpacking half of my pack. Also, filling it from a very shallow stream was sometimes tough if I didn't have a dipper. I always seemed to get sediment kicked up, so I stuffed part of my bandana into the top, with the edges outside, and used it as a filter. Small hassle, but works fine.

I have to hold the bite valve in my mouth during refillings or it will fall into the water or onto the bank.

Using a filter would alleviate this, but I don't want the extra weight.

Even with all of this, I like bladders. I don't bring mine every time, but it sure is convenient to have the bite valve there, and I like carrying lots of water into camp so I don't have to make multiple trips. I easily go through two 20 oz bottles between dinner and breakfast.

One note - make sure no water seeps into the tube if you're treating. After filling and adding the drops, I blow into the tube to make sure all the water gets mixed in before the waiting period.

[Patrick]

Very excellent replies everyone -- thank you very much. Tons of useful tips there.

I couldn't wait to try them, so stopped by REI on the way home last night. I want to use my side pockets for the bladders. I was worried that 2 liters in one would be too much weight off to one side of the pack, so I picked up two 1 liters and a Platypus hose.

I did a kayak overnight on the river late last night and I already love it. Carrying a water bottle in the kayak with the skirt on is a pain and it gets in my way if it's strapped on deck. Last night, I put the platy under a deck line and clipped the hose to my vest. On the way back this morning I kept the bladder below deck and was able to run the hose under the skirt just fine. This worked so well that I'm going to get a huge one to keep behind my seat.

I played with it on my backpack and the hose seems just long enough if upside down and a little too long right side up. Seems like it won't get in the way at all and I'll heed the good advice about keeping the mouthpiece clean.

On one of the 1 liters, I punched two holes in the support plastic on the bottom and threaded a tiny carabiner through them. I used that to clip it to a ridgeline loop in my hammock end last night. Kept the bladder completely out of the way and I clipped the mouthpiece to the ridgeline near my head. Worked very well and the carabiner folds up out of the way so the bottle still stands up fine.

So, I'm sold already. Thanks so much again for all of the help and information.

[peter_pan]

Recommend that you put a positive on off valve before the bite valve...keep it off if not hiking...i've seen two different folk kneel on bite valves in shelter and have pretty messy water leaks before it was caught.....

Also if you install a schencelle (sp) or other in line filter you can hang your bladder and do gravity filtering in camp and control it all with the on off switch.... nice set up...also if the bite valve is mice chewed or otherwised dammaged the on off can be used as a manual type flow control...works fine.

Pan