Collateral Ligament Injuries

[rocketsocks]

Two weeks ago I pulled my Lateral Collateral Ligament (LCL) along with maybe the Anterior Cruciate Ligament (ACL). I presented with "Effusion of the Knee" (water on the knee), it was very swollen and caused me to limp for a bout a week. After an ex-ray and follow up appt. the conventional thinking of my Doctors is a sprain with the fore mentioned, continue to use it as I feel I can.

It's still quit tender, and short walks are felt the following morning as if to say, "you over did it kid, chill, lay up, let momma get it for you" ;) (thanks momma :))This was the dumbest thing, I didn't fall, no traumatic flailing about, just a quick little stutter step on a slippery floor that caused it to hyper extend it I think...barely noticeable at the time, just felt it "go out"...till the next morning, then Wow, "What the %$#&@"...couldn't hardly walk, so I employed Rice, which helped but 5 days later it was time to go to see the Doc.

Rest
IceCompressionElevate

My question are...

Have you had this before?
How long did it take for it to heal before you felt like your old self?
Does it still bother you?
How long has it been?

[rocketsocks]

For reference

http://orthoinfo.aaos.org/topic.cfm?topic=a00550

[rocketsocks]

Two weeks ago I pulled my Lateral Collateral Ligament (LCL) along with maybe the Posterior Cruciate Ligament (PCL). I presented with "Effusion of the Knee" (water on the knee), it was very swollen and caused me to limp for a bout a week. After an ex-ray and follow up appt. the conventional thinking of my Doctors is a sprain with the fore mentioned, continue to use it as I feel I can.

It's still quit tender, and short walks are felt the following morning as if to say, "you over did it kid, chill, lay up, let momma get it for you" ;) (thanks momma :))This was the dumbest thing, I didn't fall, no traumatic flailing about, just a quick little stutter step on a slippery floor that caused it to hyper extend it I think...barely noticeable at the time, just felt it "go out"...till the next morning, then Wow, "What the %$#&@"...couldn't hardly walk, so I employed Rice, which helped but 5 days later it was time to go to see the Doc.

Rest
IceCompressionElevate

My question are...

Have you had this before?
How long did it take for it to heal before you felt like your old self?
Does it still bother you?
How long has it been?
Correction...Posterior, not anterior.

[Pedaling Fool]

No, I've never injured my LCL, but it's something I've given some thought to because I have twisted my knee a little and know how painful that is, so I'm very cognizant over knee issues. I also have a knee injury I sustained as a little kid that persists to this day to my Patella tendon (not shown in your link so they can illustrate the Cruciate Ligaments).

I sustained an injury to my shoulder back in my early 20's when I was "invencible" due to lifting too much weight (I didn't need no stinkin' warm-up); my first lesson in connective tissue issues. All I know is that it takes a long, long time for them to heal and how you do it is key, basically it's better to under do it than over do it. However, by under doing it, I don't mean do nothing. You body heals best when stressed, at least in my experience. But you can't do it in a way where you're feeling too much pain, just a little, if any.

I bought these at a sporting store just to work on my connetive tissues in the knee
http://www.academy.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10151_10051_882603_-1__?N=117009180&affcode=42&kwid=ps_cse&cid=PLA_024942609&gclid=CjwKEAjwpIefBRCuir7wy-f1kCwSJADXBi2aX8LYElAeqx7SHTK2rZwcIOzj7wzk1exL8QXu NAZ5GRoCeVPw_wcB

I also try and do a little in the way of running that requires twisting motions, because that's what causes a lot of these exercises. You know when you tell the Doc it hurts when you do this _____ and he says, "Well then, stop doing that...":)

He's wrong, you gotta do it to build the body up.


So in short, my answer is the same as always. Weights, because they stress the body and you can pick exactly what body part(s) to stress. However, any thing that stresses the body is good, such as running, especially running with quick turns sometimes, but the reason weights are good is because it gets those parts of the body that any one activity such as running or hiking or biking... don't get at.

I really do believe it's why I came out of my latest bike accident so well at 50 years of age.

[Just Bill]

No idea about this kind of injury-
Just sending a little sympathy your way brotha.

[Traveler]

My question are...

Have you had this before?
How long did it take for it to heal before you felt like your old self?
Does it still bother you?
How long has it been?

Yes I've had this type of injury before, so I can relate very well. Though there is little to no pain, the swelling in the knee stops you from walking with sure steps.

How long it took to heal depends on what I did to it. My right knee would be fine with exception of some localized ache/pain here and there that came and went. The knee would mysteriously swell up periodically, sometimes without doing much of anything to cause it. That swelling usually didn't last more than a few days. When I did do something to that knee like pound my way down steep terrain without being gentle on it, if it swelled up, it would be about a week to 10 days to go away and feel like my old self. I suspect a sprain diagnosis would be about 14 to 18 days of recuperative time depending on severity.

My right knee went on like this for a number of years until an MRI found a small tear in the miniscus that was repaired. Since then, the knee is is still sore (arthritis related mostly, but some lack of cushioning from a miniscus wearing thin) but comes up to a set level of discomfort and does not get any worse. I have been told this is normal for this type of injury, at my age, doing what I do. So it bothers me a little only when I notice it. I have found as I age I am able to manage pain far better today than at 20 so I tend to ignore it and its out of mind.

For me, I have found a few things to help mitigate the injury/condition, as my left knee now has some issues similar to what you describe. First, I use poles, which take about 25% or so of the impact off the knees. I also use a compression sleeve from Tommy Copper (tommycopper.com) that really works very, very well. I use these on both knees now and they fare much better. Sometimes I will use a band around the upper knee on one or both as I seemed to have developed "runners knee" according to the MD guess.

Does that help? Bottom line is, the condition is likely to improve with rest. If I could manage to follow my own advice I would likely repair faster too!

[rocketsocks]

Thank you all, this helps tons, and well wishes are always appreciated. :)

I'm very committed to letting this heal, and doing whatever it takes. Of all the ails over the years, this one has me freaked out a bit (I don't get real excited about stuff as you might could tell) to not be able to walk would be the death of me, figuratively and quit possibly literally in as much as the beginning of the end. Walkin' is my hobby, my regime, my stress reducer, so again I appreciate the input.

Pedalin' Fool- after reading your posts over the last few years, I know from where you come on working the body for total fitness, and more and more I'm on board with this kinda thinking, it just makes sense to me. I have some things here that I can use to fashion one of those bands, good idea, may be a couple weeks though as that particular motion is out for now...just thinkin' about any side ways pull is painful.

JB-thanks,and at the expense of complaining...this blows!


AT Traveler- well yeah, that's what I figured, gonna take a long time to heal. I bought a knee brace that I'm not real happy with (it binds and is uncomfortable) so think I'll try another, might as well give Tommy a shot (though I have always been skeptical of the copper impregnation. Doing pipe work for thirty + years you can imagine the number of hours spent with hands in contact with copper (they'd turn green) and I still have hand and wrist issues) time to test this theory first knee. :D I thought about ditching two poles for one a while back...but now that's out...two pole ploddin' for me from now on.

[Kerosene]

I tore my MCL as a 50-year old. My ortho told me that it would be a 4-week recovery time if I was 18, but at my age he projected a 4-month recovery. I tried to get back out on the soccer field after 12 weeks, but it took me another month to feel whole. Now, an MCL tear will eventually heal because it gets quite a bit of blood flow, whereas some of the other ligaments take quite a bit longer. You should at least be thankful that it's the PCL and not ACL, but even that can take a long time to heal.

In the end, take it slow, follow RICE principles, and start coming back slowly. Best of luck.

[rocketsocks]

I tore my MCL as a 50-year old. My ortho told me that it would be a 4-week recovery time if I was 18, but at my age he projected a 4-month recovery. I tried to get back out on the soccer field after 12 weeks, but it took me another month to feel whole. Now, an MCL tear will eventually heal because it gets quite a bit of blood flow, whereas some of the other ligaments take quite a bit longer. You should at least be thankful that it's the PCL and not ACL, but even that can take a long time to heal.

In the end, take it slow, follow RICE principles, and start coming back slowly. Best of luck.Thanks Kerosene, yeah I'm really gonna have to be protective of the thee ol' knees, really don't want this thing draggin' on for years...but those are my wants, the man upstairs may have different plans for me...time will tell.

...and best of luck to you on your up coming hike, I see/read your comin around the club house turn to your completion of a long pilgrimage...2,000 miler, very cool.

[DLP]

No idea about this kind of injury-
Just sending a little sympathy your way brotha. Same here!

I dislocated my kneecap in March 2005 (which isn't the same as you... but it sounds a little like the same... my knee was hyper extended and then there was a "popping" and after the "pop", I fell. I was skiing. :(

I also had that feeling of, "Instability — the feeling that your knee is giving way". It isn't exactly confidence inspiring.

I was in physical therapy for 12 weeks. I did go hiking and water skiing at about 16 weeks out. :)


I'm very committed to letting this heal, and doing whatever it takes. Of all the ails over the years, this one has me freaked out a bit (I don't get real excited about stuff as you might could tell) to not be able to walk would be the death of me, figuratively and quit possibly literally in as much as the beginning of the end. Walkin' is my hobby, my regime, my stress reducer, so again I appreciate the input. I can relate. Walking or exercise is what keeps me (more or less) sane. I was really bummed to be on crutches and so inactive. Not to mention that the snowpack was 140% of normal 2004/2005 and people were snow skiing Memorial Day and July 4th.

Get thee to a sports doctor or physical therp and find out what you can do to prevent future injuries! One good thing about the PT is that it really did a good job of building up my muscles to support all the ligaments, etc. I've never had another knee injury... knock on wood! I should go do some squats or lunges...

Best wishes and hang in there!

[rocketsocks]

Same here!

I dislocated my kneecap in March 2005 (which isn't the same as you... but it sounds a little like the same... my knee was hyper extended and then there was a "popping" and after the "pop", I fell. I was skiing. :(

I also had that feeling of, "Instability — the feeling that your knee is giving way". It isn't exactly confidence inspiring.

I was in physical therapy for 12 weeks. I did go hiking and water skiing at about 16 weeks out. :)

I can relate. Walking or exercise is what keeps me (more or less) sane. I was really bummed to be on crutches and so inactive. Not to mention that the snowpack was 140% of normal 2004/2005 and people were snow skiing Memorial Day and July 4th.

Get thee to a sports doctor or physical therp and find out what you can do to prevent future injuries! One good thing about the PT is that it really did a good job of building up my muscles to support all the ligaments, etc. I've never had another knee injury... knock on wood! I should go do some squats or lunges...

Best wishes and hang in there!Thanks DLP, sounds like you've rebounded nicely, good deal. Squats is a great way to build those muscles to make the up hills all that much easier, no doubt, I need to do more of them, perhaps with the aid of hiking poles or using two chairs for support (saw that on line, and other exercises for this particular condition) The Doctor didn't order PT yet, that's next months conversation depending on how it's coming along.

[Traveler]

AT Traveler- well yeah, that's what I figured, gonna take a long time to heal. I bought a knee brace that I'm not real happy with (it binds and is uncomfortable) so think I'll try another, might as well give Tommy a shot (though I have always been skeptical of the copper impregnation. Doing pipe work for thirty + years you can imagine the number of hours spent with hands in contact with copper (they'd turn green) and I still have hand and wrist issues) time to test this theory first knee. :D I thought about ditching two poles for one a while back...but now that's out...two pole ploddin' for me from now on.

I hear you on the brace, no matter what I get they seem to be in the way and real cranky or restricting. The Tommy Copper sleeves are compression sleeves, not really a brace but they act like one for me most of the time. And, I've not had green knees yet! Not sure what the copper does, if anything, but they feel pretty good for me.

[The Solemates]

ligaments dont heal quite the same as before....they usually become more brittle and not as strong. this is especially true the older you are. they arent like bone that self-heals easily and even gets stronger after healing. thats not to say you cannot gain sufficient strength to perform the activities you love, it just may not be as strong or elastic as before.

as gauges for you: i sustained a partial PCL tear 3 months ago. Its still not healed. for what its worth, i havent really taken it easy on it, and I'm in my mid 30s. its more nagging than anything, but its also activity dependent. i certainly notice it...especially the hrs following a 2 hr session of bball and the next day. but water skiing, for instance, which i do every week as well, doesnt bother it too bad. I'm extremely active and have been my whole life...so I am used to these aches...but it certainly is a nuisance and you have to listen to your body. i aint 18 any more!

a friend of mine tore his MCL a few years back. he was in his early 50s. it healed, but took several months and he wore a brace a good bit.

[rocketsocks]

ligaments dont heal quite the same as before....they usually become more brittle and not as strong. this is especially true the older you are. they arent like bone that self-heals easily and even gets stronger after healing. thats not to say you cannot gain sufficient strength to perform the activities you love, it just may not be as strong or elastic as before.

as gauges for you: i sustained a partial PCL tear 3 months ago. Its still not healed. for what its worth, i havent really taken it easy on it, and I'm in my mid 30s. its more nagging than anything, but its also activity dependent. i certainly notice it...especially the hrs following a 2 hr session of bball and the next day. but water skiing, for instance, which i do every week as well, doesnt bother it too bad. I'm extremely active and have been my whole life...so I am used to these aches...but it certainly is a nuisance and you have to listen to your body. i aint 18 any more!

a friend of mine tore his MCL a few years back. he was in his early 50s. it healed, but took several months and he wore a brace a good bit.

Yep, my days of pick up and cut and run type sports have been over for a number of years.As a kid I've sprained both ankles many times, and into adulthood as well. Once I stopped the football games and rough housing at beer party's, the joints got better. Go figure. So yeah I think your right, age has a lot to do with it. Thanks Solemates and wish you well in your continued good heath.

"What Mother nature gives us, Father time takes away"....just somethin' I read once, seemed fitting.

[johnnybgood]

In 2010 my MRI suggested that I might have a small tear of my meniscus. My swelling included a "bakers cyst" directly behind the knee ,PCL damage for sure with prospects of surgery looming.
I was told by my orthopod that the RICE method and ibuphren daily would help with the swelling . I kept walking ( limping along ) at work for about 4 weeks while getting physical therapy from my physicians PA. Luckily for me I worked in the same surgery center alongside my physician & his PA twice a week.
I would continue staying as active as your knee will allow . Ice packs will become your friend so embrace them . Ibuphren too.

[johnnybgood]

In 2010 my MRI suggested that I might have a small tear of my meniscus. My swelling included a "bakers cyst" directly behind the knee ,PCL damage for sure with prospects of surgery looming.
I was told by my orthopod that the RICE method and ibuprofen daily would help with the swelling . I kept walking ( limping along ) at work for about 4 weeks while getting physical therapy from my physicians PA. Luckily for me I worked in the same surgery center alongside my physician & his PA twice a week.
I would continue staying as active as your knee will allow . Ice packs will become your friend so embrace them . Ibuprofen too.

[rocketsocks]

In 2010 my MRI suggested that I might have a small tear of my meniscus. My swelling included a "bakers cyst" directly behind the knee ,PCL damage for sure with prospects of surgery looming.
I was told by my orthopod that the RICE method and ibuprofen daily would help with the swelling . I kept walking ( limping along ) at work for about 4 weeks while getting physical therapy from my physicians PA. Luckily for me I worked in the same surgery center alongside my physician & his PA twice a week.
I would continue staying as active as your knee will allow . Ice packs will become your friend so embrace them . Ibuprofen too.

Interesting, had a bakers cyst twice now, though it's been years. Just had my knees injected about 2 months ago now, up until this mishap I was doin fairly well with them. He gave me some anti-inflammatory with a antihistamine component to reduce the swelling...hmm, never heard of this before.

[Another Kevin]

I had a bad LCL sprain at about age 50. Took me about four months before it felt stable, another couple before I was up to backpacking. Never did anything for it but PRICE (Protect, Rest, Ice, Compress, Elevate) and ibuprofen. Get a twinge every now and then but it still holds me up.

The doc did ask me, "just how did you manage to sprain an LCL?" They seldom get hurt; the usual cause is an impact from the inside. Which is exactly what happened. I slipped on ice and as I was falling managed to pull the snowblower over backwards on top of my knee, which was turned outward.

[rocketsocks]

I had a bad LCL sprain at about age 50. Took me about four months before it felt stable, another couple before I was up to backpacking. Never did anything for it but PRICE (Protect, Rest, Ice, Compress, Elevate) and ibuprofen. Get a twinge every now and then but it still holds me up.

The doc did ask me, "just how did you manage to sprain an LCL?" They seldom get hurt; the usual cause is an impact from the inside. Which is exactly what happened. I slipped on ice and as I was falling managed to pull the snowblower over backwards on top of my knee, which was turned outward.
ah Price, I like this much better, and have unknowingly been doing just that...protecting it, good one!

I read up on LCL after the Doctor diagnosed it, and was very surprised to find what you just said, as this was just the dumbest little slip, a very fast hyper locking ouch caught myself no biggie, don't even recall any twisting. Crazy.

[Pedaling Fool]

The whole knee needs to be worked and worked and worked...so it'll work right for you. Some videos on here to show what a step up is

http://www.stack.com/2014/08/18/vmo-muscle/



Excerpt:

"A big, strong VMO is associated with bodybuilders who desire defined, sculpted quads. If you're an athlete, your VMO doesn’t need to look like it's bursting through your skin, but it still needs to be strong.

The VMO, or vastus medialis oblique, is one of the four muscles of your quadriceps. If you flex your quads, you’ll notice a large muscle toward the inner part of your thigh. That’s your VMO.

The VMO contributes to running, jumping and nearly every other basic athletic movement, because together with your other quad muscles, it’s a powerful knee extensor. Anytime you push off the ground, your VMO is involved.

It’s also an important knee stabilizer—a critical function that’s often overlooked.


The VMO attaches to the patella (i.e., your kneecap) to maintain its position relative to the femur (i.e., your thigh bone), allowing for normal knee function—especially during squatting and multi-directional movements. “If you don’t have a strong VMO, you may experience knee pain and nagging injuries,” says Mark Roozen, owner of Coach Rozy Performance.

Specifically, Roozen refers to patellofemoral pain syndrome. A misaligned patella results in pain on the front of the knee, ultimately caused by a weak VMO. This is particularly problematic for young athletes, who often lack sufficient VMO strength to support their high level of activity. According to the University of Southern California, patellofemoral pain syndrome is the root cause of 75 and 33 percent, respectively, of adolescent female and male knee pain.

A stronger VMO will enhance your performance and prevent nagging knee pain,which can range from annoying to completely debilitating.

How to Strengthen Your VMO

The go-to exercise for VMO strength is the Leg Extension, but we’ve already discussed why this exercise is a poor choice (http://www.stack.com/2014/04/29/never-do-leg-extensions/).

Instead, Roozen recommends Step-Up variations, saying, “You still get knee extension, but through different ranges of motion. The loads come from different angles. This prepares your VMO to stabilize against multi-directional movement—essential for athletes who play team sports."

Integrate the following three Step-Up variations into your workouts once per week. Choose a box that’s about the same height as your knee."

[Another Kevin]

Instead, Roozen recommends Step-Up variations, saying, “You still get knee extension, but through different ranges of motion. The loads come from different angles. This prepares your VMO to stabilize against multi-directional movement—essential for athletes who play team sports."

Integrate the following three Step-Up variations into your workouts once per week. Choose a box that’s about the same height as your knee."

Step-Up Variations. This differs from the knee exercise that I get on every trip from rock scrambling .... how, exactly? :)

[Pedaling Fool]

Step-Up Variations. This differs from the knee exercise that I get on every trip from rock scrambling .... how, exactly? :)

I guess I stepped into that one.:D


I know I push single-leg exercises a lot, but I don't mean to say they are the be-all, end-all. It's actually amazing how some exercises that seem so unexceptional and run-of-the-mill, yet they're some of the most beneficial to the whole body. A good example of this is the simple deadlift. http://articles.elitefts.com/features/interviews/defending-the-deadlift-an-interview-with-coach-and-powerlifter-eric-cressey/

http://trainheavy.com/people/ten-unique-benefits-of-the-deadlift/



Excerpt:

What are the unique benefits of deadlifting?

First, I’d say that (along with box squats) it’s the single-most effective movement for training the posterior chain (glutes, hamstrings, adductor magnus, and lumbar erectors). The posterior chain is of paramount importance to high-level performance; watch the best sprinters run, and you’ll see that they seem to just “float”—and it’s because they’re running with their hamstrings and glutes. In contrast, watch a guy who runs with his quads, and you’ll see that his hips are bouncing up and down; there’s a lot of wasted movement. The glutes and hamstrings are all fast-twitch fibers with a lot of strength, speed, and size potential—potential you’ll never realize without deadlift variations.

Second, strengthening the posterior chain with closed-chain movements like deadlifts also reduces injury risk. Weak hamstrings are a serious risk factor for anterior cruciate ligament (ACL) injuries, patellofemoral pain, and a host of other problems at the knee, hip, ankle, and lower back. Conversely, leg curls simply won’t get the job done, as they don’t require co-contraction of the glutes and hamstrings, are open-chain, and occur in a fixed line of motion. Our body is far smarter than some piece of selectorized equipment.

Third, deadlifts enable a lifter to train hip and knee extension together without learning the full Olympic lifts, which have a big learning curve.

Fourth, deadlifts enable a lifter to use more loading, thus ensuring that more motor units and, in turn, muscle fibers will be recruited all over the body. The more fibers you recruit, the greater your stimulus for growth. And, if you’re looking to shed body fat, the post-exercise oxygen debt will be larger from recruiting more muscle mass, meaning that your metabolic rate will be really jacked up for longer after the end of your training session.

Fifth, you can train deadlifts several different ways. Light weights (~30% 1RM) with high velocities develop speed-strength, mid-range loading (45-70% 1RM) develop strength-speed, and circa-maximal weights enhance maximal strength. Pulls at 90% can have tremendous benefits in terms of both power and maximal strength development.

Sixth, deadlifts are quite possibly the best exercise for enhancing rate of force development (RFD)—also known as explosive strength. This refers to how quickly you can develop tension in a muscle, and is obviously of tremendous importance to athletic success. Movements that are initiated from a dead-stop are superior methods of enhancing RFD; box squats and Anderson squats are great as well. Olympic lifts can be tricky in this regard, as the first pull is actually somewhat slow compared to what you’ll see in a speed deadlift; Olympic lifters are more interested in setting themselves up for the second pull.

Seventh, as noted earlier, deadlifts have a better functional carryover to real world performance than leg curls, glute-blasters, and all the other silly machines out there.

Eighth, deadlifts are unparalleled in their ability to wallop loads of muscle mass on your upper back. The better my pull has gotten, the bigger my upper back has grown—and by accident! It’s actually gotten to the point that I’ve had to bump up a weight class because my upper back, hamstrings, and glutes have grown so much from pulling that I have been forced to do so!

Ninth, deadlifts train supporting grip like nothing else. If you can’t grip it, you can’t deadlift it.

Tenth, believe it or not, deadlifts can be a tremendously valuable corrective training exercise if coached correctly. I’ve used them in the correction of IT [iliotibial] band friction syndrome, lower back pain, lateral knee pain, groin pain, and a host of other torso and lower extremity problems. The secret rests with the proper execution of the exercise.

[rocketsocks]

The whole knee needs to be worked and worked and worked...so it'll work right for you. Some videos on here to show what a step up is

http://www.stack.com/2014/08/18/vmo-muscle/



Yeah I tried that, what's in the video...I fell over. The knee still is not quite right, much better, but just not there yet. My plan is to do some steps when it's better...I hate steps more than squats. :D

[Pedaling Fool]

Yeah I tried that, what's in the video...I fell over. The knee still is not quite right, much better, but just not there yet. My plan is to do some steps when it's better...I hate steps more than squats. :DStatus update?:)

In the meantime...I found this on the IT band, pretty interesting illustration of just how it works (I know the OP wasn't about the IT, but still in that area). Notice how running is NOT described as a jarring activity, rather it's springy kind of thing.

And it is, once you get some miles under your feet, it's more like being a kangaroo. http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2015/08/understanding-the-it-band/?utm_source=SilverpopMailing&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=08.27.2015%20%281%29


Excerpt:

“We found that the human IT band has the capacity to store 15 to 20 times more elastic energy per body mass than its much-less-developed precursor structure in a chimp,” Eng said.

“We looked at the IT band’s capacity to store energy during running, and we found its energy-storage capacity is substantially greater during running than walking, and that’s partly because running is a much springier gait. We don’t know whether the IT band evolved for running or walking; it could have evolved for walking and later evolved to play a larger role in running.”


The IT band runs along the outside of the thigh, from just above the hip to just below the knee, and is made up of fascia, an elastic connective tissue found throughout the body. Though often compared to tendons — the two can serve similar functions — fascia is composed of large sheets, while tendons are more rope-like.


Fascia is “a sheath that encloses muscles, connects muscles to bone and … compartmentalizes muscles that serve a similar function, and the IT band is the largest piece of fascia in the human body,” Eng said.


The notion that the IT band acts as a spring to aid in locomotion runs counter to the decades-old belief that its primary function is to stabilize the hip during walking.

“Unlike many clinicians and anatomists, we use the lens of evolution to think about how humans are adapted not just for walking, but also for running, so we look at the IT band from a totally different perspective,” Lieberman said. “When we looked at the difference between a chimp and a human, we saw this big elastic band, and the immediate idea that leapt out at us was that the IT band looked like another elastic structure, like the Achilles tendon, that might be important in saving energy during locomotion, especially running.”


The findings, Biewener said, “will have key importance for basic science and clinical studies that seek to integrate the role of this key fascial structure into programs of sports-exercise training and gait rehabilitation.”

[capehiker]

I stretched my LCL 2 years ago. It was literally the most painful thing I endured for the next few days. Once things relaxed and I got seen by an orthopedist (hurt myself during a huge snowstorm), my healing went pretty well. I'm as close to 100% as possible. There are times, though, when the little voice in the back of my head tells me to watch that next step

[Another Kevin]

I stretched my LCL 2 years ago. It was literally the most painful thing I endured for the next few days. Once things relaxed and I got seen by an orthopedist (hurt myself during a huge snowstorm), my healing went pretty well. I'm as close to 100% as possible. There are times, though, when the little voice in the back of my head tells me to watch that next step

An LCL sprain had me hobbling with a cane for about six weeks, seven or so years ago. First question from the doc: "Just how did you manage to sprain an LCL?" Mine was snowstorm-related too. I slipped on a patch of black ice in my driveway and fell, and the snowblower toppled over backward onto my knee. Now I wear Microspikes when I'm clearing the snow.

[BirdBrain]

I mainly have articular cartilage and meniscus issues. All the ligaments have been stretched a bit too much as well. My patella floats all over the place. I picked a fight with a big chrome bumper and my knee while doing a wheelie on my dirt bike. The bumper won... in the short term. I bet that thing has been recycled by now. :D Things get jammed from misalignments every so often (mostly when I climb down a ladder). What I did was to see an expert and then totally ignore him. Took it easy for a bit and then have spent the rest of my life pushing it as much as I can bare.

Ya...., don't get advice from me. I would not be chiming in now. However, I know my buddy feels my pain... in more than one area. Stop getting old already RS! :p

[capehiker]

An LCL sprain had me hobbling with a cane for about six weeks, seven or so years ago. First question from the doc: "Just how did you manage to sprain an LCL?" Mine was snowstorm-related too. I slipped on a patch of black ice in my driveway and fell, and the snowblower toppled over backward onto my knee. Now I wear Microspikes when I'm clearing the snow.

Ouch! Mine happened when I was digging out my car. My leg was in 2 feet deep snow and I was bent over digging out behind the tire. I stood up but my leg did not turn with my body. Yeeee-ouch!

[rocketsocks]

Status update?:)

In the meantime...I found this on the IT band, pretty interesting illustration of just how it works (I know the OP wasn't about the IT, but still in that area). Notice how running is NOT described as a jarring activity, rather it's springy kind of thing.

And it is, once you get some miles under your feet, it's more like being a kangaroo. http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2015/08/understanding-the-it-band/?utm_source=SilverpopMailing&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=08.27.2015%20%281%29


Excerpt:

“We found that the human IT band has the capacity to store 15 to 20 times more elastic energy per body mass than its much-less-developed precursor structure in a chimp,” Eng said.

“We looked at the IT band’s capacity to store energy during running, and we found its energy-storage capacity is substantially greater during running than walking, and that’s partly because running is a much springier gait. We don’t know whether the IT band evolved for running or walking; it could have evolved for walking and later evolved to play a larger role in running.”


The IT band runs along the outside of the thigh, from just above the hip to just below the knee, and is made up of fascia, an elastic connective tissue found throughout the body. Though often compared to tendons — the two can serve similar functions — fascia is composed of large sheets, while tendons are more rope-like.


Fascia is “a sheath that encloses muscles, connects muscles to bone and … compartmentalizes muscles that serve a similar function, and the IT band is the largest piece of fascia in the human body,” Eng said.


The notion that the IT band acts as a spring to aid in locomotion runs counter to the decades-old belief that its primary function is to stabilize the hip during walking.

“Unlike many clinicians and anatomists, we use the lens of evolution to think about how humans are adapted not just for walking, but also for running, so we look at the IT band from a totally different perspective,” Lieberman said. “When we looked at the difference between a chimp and a human, we saw this big elastic band, and the immediate idea that leapt out at us was that the IT band looked like another elastic structure, like the Achilles tendon, that might be important in saving energy during locomotion, especially running.”


The findings, Biewener said, “will have key importance for basic science and clinical studies that seek to integrate the role of this key fascial structure into programs of sports-exercise training and gait rehabilitation.”

Well that makes good sense, all the joints working together. I was thinking about this thread about three weeks ago and thought I'd give an update as it's been a year now since this happen...than I forgot.

Long story short, this knee injury took every bit of about 9 months to heal, some days I can still feel it if I turn my knee a particular way. Getting older sure does take its toll on healing times.

[Pedaling Fool]

Keep the weight very low and keep at it. I would really try and do a few deep squats with no weight. If it hurts stop, but see if you can go all the way down overtime and maybe add some weight. Watch this for a little motivation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYQWVdPgQl0

I think there's also something about how to do a deep squat on that video :D

[rocketsocks]

Keep the weight very low and keep at it. I would really try and do a few deep squats with no weight. If it hurts stop, but see if you can go all the way down overtime and maybe add some weight. Watch this for a little motivation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYQWVdPgQl0

I think there's also something about how to do a deep squat on that video :DThat works! :)

[Pedaling Fool]

Status update?

Just wanted to show more information on importance of full Range of Motion (ROM); doesn't have to be done with weights to get started. And it will cause you to reduce weight, but IMO it's more important to work thru full ROM than lifting the heaviest possible weight. Good video that shows what's happening inside you and why you need to do full ROM. https://vimeo.com/118162021

And this guy is good at explaining it, I think his name is Lone Wolf... or something:D https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQWzAs2m0ck

.

[egilbe]

Thats Lone Wolf. Doesn't look like a skinny through hiker. I do agree with his version of squat depth, rather than the girl's, who cautions about going lower than parallel.

[Charlocity2]

For a third perspective on barbell squats, which I feel is the most objective one, I encourage interested parties to google "Starting Strength". Besides squat depth, a critical question asked and answered is, "Which barbell squat is most effective, overall: high bar, or low bar?" The difference refers to where the trainee carries the barbell: high, on the trapezius; or a few inches lower, on the rear deltoids.

The man's video briefly mentions a low bar squat. The woman's video has her doing a high bar squat.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Pedaling Fool]

For a third perspective on barbell squats, which I feel is the most objective one, I encourage interested parties to google "Starting Strength". Besides squat depth, a critical question asked and answered is, "Which barbell squat is most effective, overall: high bar, or low bar?" The difference refers to where the trainee carries the barbell: high, on the trapezius; or a few inches lower, on the rear deltoids.

The man's video briefly mentions a low bar squat. The woman's video has her doing a high bar squat.
That was just one of his videos, he goes in depth on squats in this video, which is a relatively long video... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bs_Ej32IYgo


But then he has a shorter one which specifically addresses the low/high bar squat: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQuCi2h_kNI

He also has another video where he talks about the importance of doing a front squat. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezRP5-ick9Q

[Puddlefish]

This was the dumbest thing, I didn't fall, no traumatic flailing about, just a quick little stutter step on a slippery floor that caused it to hyper extend it I think...barely noticeable at the time, just felt it "go out"...till the next morning, then Wow,

Some of my most painful injuries have been due to stupid little things that I never would have believed might hurt. I once sneezed and threw out my back for three months. Yes, it's a violent muscle contraction, but still, a sneeze!