View Full Version : How did you increase your MPD?
Hey guys. I just got into backpacking in June of this year and I can hike 15-16 miles at the "outer edge" of comfortable hiking. I could do more, but it is slower and just not as fun. I want to increase my MPD. I really, really want to break this limit I seem to hit around that mileage. How did you increase your MPD? I would love to get closer to 20 mpd.
I have a 30-32 lbs fully loaded pack. I know hiking could be easier if I get lighter, but I just bought all my gear this year. For a while at least, I can't spend more money on hiking. As my gear started to wear, I will buy better gear.
For an indication of how many miles I do on AT and where, here is a list of this month's hikes:
3 night, 4 day hike:
Day 1: Parking lot to Springer to Gooch Gap Shelter: ~17 miles Started hiking around 9:30 am and finished around 6:00pm
Day 2: Gooch Gap Shelter to Neel Gap: ~ 16 miles. Started hiking at 8:30 am and finished 5:15 pm.
Day 3: Neel Gap to Wolf Laurel Top, back to Neel Gap (dropped camera) to Low Gap Shelter: ~ ~19 miles. Started hiking at 9:00 am to 7:15 pm.
Day 4: Low Gap Shelter to Unicoi Gap: 9.7 miles. Started at 8:30 am. Finished at 12:15 Pm.
This weekend I did:
Day 1: Unicoi to Tray Mountain Shelter: 5.7 miles. Started at 6 pm and finished 8:30pm.
Day 2: Tray Mountain Shelter to Deep Gap Shelter and back to Tray Mountain Shelter: ~16 Started at 10:15 am finished at 6:00 pm.
Day 3: Tray Mountain Shelter to Unicoi Gap. 5.7 miles. Started at 9:15 pm and finished 11:50pm.
Does anyone have ideas on how I could get my MPD up?
soumodeler
09-21-2014, 21:24
Pack weight is obviously going to be the big thing, but I understand not wanting to buy new gear to replace brand new stuff.
A few of thoughts:
Switch to trail runners as your pack weight comes down. Less weight on your feet means you don't get tired as fast.
Trekking poles can help.
Start earlier in the day and take more breaks. 10:15 is a super late start for me. I like to be on the trail by 8 if possible.
Carry only enough water to get to the next water source to lower weight. Can be tricky if it is dry and you also need to know how much you will need. Takes some trial and error. Always err on side of caution if in doubt.
At home, lower body and core exercises will definitely help you out.
I used to live down in your neck of the woods, Kennesaw so you will be walking many of my paths.
early in my hiking career I was hiking a lot out in the Sierra on weekend trips. In order to get to cool places I had to do some higher mile days, 20-25. Soon that was not enough. I had read that Skurka could hike 30+ miles a day and this seemed absolutely impossible. One Sunday, after still being on a high from Skydiving on Saturday I hiked a 32 mile day along the Chatooga. I could hardly walk the next day. That was a huge day for me because it broke a mental barrier, a 30 mile day was possible. Over the next couple of years I repeated that distance until it became "normal". In 2011 I thru hiked the PCT and averaged well over 30 miles per day on full hiking days. Since then I have continued to push the limits and now view a sub 40 mile day taking it easy. What's the point? IMHO 90% of the battle is mental regardless of what your mileage goal may be. If you don't believe something is possible then it most likely won't be.
a couple of tips to increase your mileage.
1) start early, you can never make up the wonderful early morning hiking hours.
2) don't hike fast, hike consistent. minimize breaks and try to keep a consistent pace.
3) go light. My 8 lb. base goes a long way to enabling high miles.
4) learn to setup and break camp quickly. less stuff helps but it is more technique.
There are other factors such as overall fitness and nutrition. You can find more on that here.
http://postholer.com/journal/viewJournal.php?sid=2384d6eddcbf3ec9d8919132918c38 08&entry_id=20018 (http://postholer.com/journal/viewJournal.php?sid=2384d6eddcbf3ec9d8919132918c38 08&entry_id=20018I)
garlic08
09-21-2014, 21:35
For me, it was all about lightening the load. And it took many years. It'll be nearly a miracle if all the gear you just bought is exactly the "right stuff." You'll probably be selling and buying sooner than you think. For me, it took three packs, three bags, three tents, five pairs of shoes, and many tries at simply leaving stuff at home. As it turns out, the stuff I ended up with is quite a bit cheaper than the stuff I started with, with the exception of the sleeping bag.
But I was in my late forties during this effort. As a younger person, you might be able to do it differently.
It sounds like you're starting pretty early. One thing I do now is stop along the trail for dinner and a rest, then hike a couple more hours and maybe an extra five or six miles before camping at sunset.
Some hikers have a "12 x 12" goal, twelve miles by noon. If you do that, another eight miles in the afternoon is no big deal. I can sometimes push 30 if I get a 12 x 12 on a long summer day.
Being consistent day after day is important. Don't push 20 miles one day if you won't be able to hike at all the next. Near the end of the day I always ask myself if I'll be able to do the same mileage again tomorrow. If the answer is no, I'll stop.
Good luck and most important, have fun.
rocketsocks
09-21-2014, 21:37
...start early finish late, don't take long breaks. Your pace is pretty much your pace, sure it can be increased a little, but if you try and go faster with weight on your back, you may injure yourself. Slower and steadily wins this race.
@ soumodeler
Right now I have hiking boots. I am sorta clumsy and they have saved my ankles at least once every trip. Given weight of pack, I also think they are a must.
I have trekking poles, cheapos from walmart, but they work fine.
10:15 start was a bit of anomaly for me. It was raining and I just didn't want to get out of my tent. So far, I have been blessed with weather. I haven't had to do much hiking on all-day rainy conditions. I decided to wait the rain out. The big problem for me is that it takes me 1 + hrs to break camp. I have awful blisters which require mole skin. I usually try to break camp around 8:00 -8:30. I usually wake up around 7ish. Spend 10 minutes laying there looking at map for day. From that point forward it takes me at least an hour to break camp, and I don't even cook anything. My breakfast is usually a cliffbar and a granola bar. I really don't why it takes me so long. I need a system.
I carry a lot of water because I get dehydrated easily. I sweat a lot. I usually carry 2-3 liters at a minimum. It is so annoying because you never know exactly where/how the water if flowing. Water is one thing I can't go without. I could care less about food if I don't have water. But it does get annoying when I do 10 miles with a 2 L platypus on my back that I haven't touched.
@ Malto
Starting early: Starting earlier would give me more time, but I hit a wall around 12-13 miles that I can keep hiking, but it is slower. I can't keep my previous pace after that point. When I hike, I always tell myself, "where you can, set the pace. Where you can't, try. When that fails, just keep moving." My pace starts pretty good. Close to 3 mph, but it slows after 2ish hours. Then it is 2.5 for an 1-2 hours. Then it 2.0 for 2 hours. After that, it becomes zombie hiking. I just try to keep moving. By end of day, I generally average of 2 miles per hiking hour. I don't take many breaks. I don't eat a "lunch." Just another clif bar and granola bar. The only breaks I really take are to getting water and possibly switching my socks and mole skin. I get awful blisters (my feet sweat a lot), but even with soaked socks, 1/2 the time I refuse to stop. I just keep pushing.
Sub8 base weight? Jesus, my sleeping system is 7 lbs 7 oz alone. Maybe one day.
Tips to setting up and breaking camp? It seems like it takes me 50% longer than everyone else.
Thanks for the journal. I will be devouring that soon.
It's pretty much been covered. Increasing time and/or speed is the only way to go further.
It's just math.
The only thing I'd add is to find some hikers faster than you to hang out with and try to keep up with them. I fell in with a bunch of 20somethings on the PCT and soon I was hiking quite a bit faster and I credit it with trying to keep up with them. I cut them loose in Washington but I can now hike faster than I used to and I'm getting older too.
It's pretty much been covered. Increasing time and/or speed is the only way to go further.
It's just math.
The only thing I'd add is to find some hikers faster than you to hang out with and try to keep up with them. I fell in with a bunch of 20somethings on the PCT and soon I was hiking quite a bit faster and I credit it with trying to keep up with them. I cut them loose in Washington but I can now hike faster than I used to and I'm getting older too.
I wish I knew some people like that. Everyone I seem to meet on the trail seems impressed by my MPD, but to me it is just mediocre.
I probably need to consider bring more food per day. I usually bring about 1 lbs of food per day. This last trip, I had my dinner for lunch (baco-cheese w/ mashed potatoes) and took an 1hr break. After the break I did 3 miles in first hour. I had nice boast of energy. I never had that before since my normal lunch is a bar or two + water. At night, when I made camp, I just ate one of the bars. I think I am going to start doing this. Eating a real lunch and taking 1 30-40 minute break for lunch.
Usually, from the moment I start hiking until i finish in the morning until I make camp, I don't take a break unless I need water.
the good advice already given here. Simple algebra: Distance per day (mpd) = Velocity (mph) x Time (hr). To hike more miles per day, hike faster or hike longer. Starting earlier in the day is the easiest thing you can do...... there's only so many hours of daylight each day. I'm usually awake at first nautical twilight and on the trail NLT 7 a.m. My hiking buddy on the Long Trail last year had a simple saying: "Good things happen whey you start early". To increase your hiking speed, drop your pack weight, and work on your aerobic fitness levels. Most hikers are pretty close to equal speed on flat terrain. Of course taller hikers with longer legs have a great advantage over shorter hikers on flat terrain. Where I see the biggest difference between the slower and faster hikers is on the uphills. If you want to keep up with the gazelles on the trail, work on your hill training, do repeat staircase cycles at home with a weighted vest or backpack, or do hill repeats at home with a weighted pack. And reduce your pack weight, get it down below 30 lbs, below 25 lbs. is even better. You should notice on the trail that you can hike faster uphill if you work on that at home.
I probably need to consider bring more food per day. I usually bring about 1 lbs of food per day.
Well... there you go.
A *lot* of people like to hike for the weight loss benefit however temporary it may be.... but you can't go on a diet, burn 4k+ calories a day, and expect to hike big miles.
(not saying you personally are going on a diet - I meant "you" in 3rd person) My point is that you have to fuel the body with food to have the energy to go far.
Well... there you go.
A *lot* of people like to hike for the weight loss benefit however temporary it may be.... but you can't go on a diet, burn 4k+ calories a day, and expect to hike big miles.
(not saying you personally are going on a diet - I meant "you" in 3rd person) My point is that you have to fuel the body with food to have the energy to go far.
The "you" applies to me too. Three months ago, I weighed 261lbs. I now weigh 211lbs. I do use hiking as an form of exercise. I go to the gym every day during the week, but on weekends, well I don't see the gym on weekends. So, when I hike, it helps greatly. Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, and Friday, for example, I go a AM weightlifting workout and a PM 10 mile cardio day. Wednesday is either a pool day or rest day.
But I do hike to help lose weight, but I don't bring more or less food to lose weight if that makes sense. I want the physical activity on weekends. I just bring less food because I usually don't eat a whole lot, especially on the trail. I am never hungry on the trail, but I do notice dips in energy. I will add one more meal per day and see how that helps.
Again, I just started this June. I am still learning, but I will get there. I hate losing or giving up. I am stubborn. It will happen. Ideally, I want to be able to put together four 20 mile days together with a reasonable amount of comfort.
lonehiker
09-21-2014, 23:43
Part of it is your pack weight and pace. Short term you don't want to do anything about your pack so nothing to be done about that. But, you are tiring yourself out by pushing the 3 mph pace early. Hike 2 mph from the start and you won't tire as quickly. Additionally, listen to what others have posted. It is generally good info.
jimmyjam
09-22-2014, 06:26
...start early finish late, don't take long breaks. Your pace is pretty much your pace, sure it can be increased a little, but if you try and go faster with weight on your back, you may injure yourself. Slower and steadily wins this race.
Lighten your load and do as RS says above .
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peakbagger
09-22-2014, 07:44
I found stopping for a 5 minute break every hour even in the morning made a big difference over a day. The first couple of breaks feel sort of useless and easy to skip but it makes a difference in the afternoon.
Starchild
09-22-2014, 08:09
To increase your m/d don't try to increase your m/d - let it happen naturally, but there are things you can do to help this.
my $0.02...
Trying to increase m/d just for it's own sake is a recipe for hurting yourself or deeply depleting energy stores which may give you a day or so at that higher distance but it will also tend to give you less total mileage over the rest of the week due to recovery needed. So yes yo may be able to say you did a 20 but backpacking is not about going to that extreme, it is about sustainable travel.
Work on gaining experience, and getting that pack weight down, which comes from gaining experience. This and if needed losing weight / getting in better shape is the best thing you can directly do to get ready to increase m/d.
Gain experience by backpacking with other people, sign up for group backpacks, from multiple groups/hiking clubs to see what others are using, see what works for you and what doesn't. This goes for gear choices and for hiking strategies (get up early or late). This will help you know how your body likes to hike when you are 'self directed' (not part of a group), matching the hike to how your body likes to hike should increase m/d.
Along with the above find out what type of fuel your body needs on and off the trail, it may not be what you expect, it may not be conventional wisdom of what a diet should be. Listen to your body's food cravings and try to answer it correctly.
If you can swing it plan a backpack of at least 4-5 weeks in duration you will get your trail legs in that time - they do stay with you to varying degrees after the long duration hike - not to the thru hiking standard but there is something extra I now have and can draw upon. Also on this long duration hike don't set distance goals, just hike is the main plan and let the distance happen.
...
During my thru I started doing regularly 15 mile days, but could not break 20, got to 19 on a few, till I got my trail legs, my average went from 15 to 25 per day and it was a amazing feeling of well being on the trail. My own observations was the days I got in the most miles were, counter-intutivally, the days I slept in a little and was the last one to leave the campground/shelter area, Having enough sleep time gave me what I needed to pull those long mile days (most was 36 m/d). Getting up early seemed to have me stop sooner in the evening and not travel as fast, resulting in lower m/d.
Also use your incentive days as challenge days. Town days seem to add speed to most thru hikers pace, the excitement of real food and a beer in hand can quicken your stride and also is most likely the safest time to pull a long day as coming into town for resupply is the lightest you pack will be, the excitement may also tend to keep one alert and avoid injury. Again this is listen to your body, let the miles happen on their own. Your body will tell you if it wants to continue or not.
Without eating enough to provide your body the fuel to actually do the work everything else is kind of a waste of time.
It's like building a hot rod and not putting enough gas in the tank to drive it.
So if losing weight is your primary objective I'd suggest backing off the desire to go a lot further every day - otherwise you're chances of not having a good time, or at least being in a shi**y mood, goes way up.
There's nothing wrong with hiking to lose weight - it's a lot more fun than going to a gym for sure - but losing weight and hiking far are in opposition to each other.
TroutknuT
09-22-2014, 08:51
Got to fule your motor. Hydrate at camp, evening and morning,good breakfast,snack all day. Slower and a steady pace with fule ie... food, will help keep you from( Bonking )!
Got to fule your motor. Hydrate at camp, evening and morning,good breakfast,snack all day. Slower and a steady pace with fule ie... food, will help keep you from( Bonking )!
Yes sir! And my comments are based on the OP saying he only carries 1 lb of food a day.
That would not get me very far.
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slbirdnerd
09-22-2014, 08:59
I'm still working my way up to where you are now, but the following things help me:
1. The right trail runners for me (Brooks Cascadia)
2. The right insole for me: FIT green
3. The right socks: Injinji trail tow socks
4. Pack weight 25-30 pounds max
5. Get up and get going (takes discipline)
6. Don't stop too early for the day (but I do have this general "in camp by 6 p.m." rule so I have time to pitch tent, hang bear bag, visit with new friends, etc.)
7. Take breaks, don't rush. Enjoy the sights, sit down for lunch and get your shoes and socks off. This is good to recharge your body/feet and your mind for more hiking. See #3 and you'll have more time for this. :)
I also found this year that while I enjoy hiking solo, it was fun to hike with a friend as well and the miles just kinda ticked by. It was also easier to make myself take breaks. The trick is finding a friend with a similar hiking style and speed and camping style.
Gambit McCrae
09-22-2014, 10:43
+100 ON LIGHTENING THE LOAD, eliminating useless things, and everyday exercise. I would also suggest loosing the boots and going with trail runners with a stiff bottom. I try and spend my walking time pretty conentrated, the best way I can describe my pace is like a business man in new york, a swift and concentrated stride, I think that full leg extensions and "walking with intent" go along way in my distances. I dont take alot of breaks, but I listen to my body, not my brain. The Brain wants to quit, especially after hot tired long days. You have to know what part of the body is "complaining" and what part is saying "I have seriously had enough for the day".
Right now I am planning a week hiking in WV and VA and although I have not selected huge miles, I want to get them done timely and successfully, so I am setting a goal of being able to run 4 miles by the time I leave, I quit smoking and I walk/run 7 miles a day. With time, you find that you can handle bigger miles, its more of a mental thing than physical
JohnnySnook
09-22-2014, 10:56
Sounds like a lot good info here for anyone to read.
If you're burning more calories than your eating any activity isn't going to be fun.
I'd also say your problems with your feet isn't helping at all. Maybe try different insoles, socks, and sock liners till something helps.
Some people just aren't morning people and will never like starting a hike at 6 or 7am so a 9am start may be better for that person.
Hiking with others will probably help. I'm sure there are many groups out there to join.
I've been reading a lot trail journals and when a crew gets together the miles seem to melt away.
As stated above its amazing the miles and MPH these hikers do when they are heading into town for food and lodging when there is a cut off time or they are just ready for real food and a hot shower.
I'm not someone giving advice from experience but from what I've noticed doing research to start hiking.
Slo-go'en
09-22-2014, 11:03
All of the above advice is helpful, but it really takes consistent hiking to achieve high MPD numbers. Thru-hikers typically take 2 to 4 weeks to get up to the point which they can hike all day and obtain a decent MPD average. 15 mile days are pretty good for an occasional weekend hiker.
While I agree in general with 10k and others that you have to fuel your body in order to push any endurance activity, I disagree that you can not run a deficit, even a substantial one while doing said activity. you body can provide you with a substantial energy source but to use it effectively it must be trained to do so. I saw a substantial difference over the years in my ability to hold off "hitting the wall" even while eating less calories. part of that is due to my body adapting and optimizing its ability to burn fat.
Another point that I firmly believe is that many are eating the wrong food for endurance activities. Clearly someone hiking low miles could eat just about anything and have ample energy. But that is not true as the miles increase. I first saw major issues with my fueling on a fairly aggressive Sierra High Route trip. While we were only doing high teens in mileage, much of it was off trail and we had up to four 12k passes in a day. My standard high calorie per ounce diet that is fairly typical just wasn't cutting it. It had too much fat and protein and not enough carbs. Over time I morphed my food and reduced the fat and protein considerably especially for short duration trips. (A thru hike diet should have high ratio of fat because overall calorie balance is just as important as daily fueling.). While my calorie per ounce average dropped from about 150 to 125 calories per ounce, I am able to take fewer overall calories and get superior fueling for the day. Again, this strategy needs to morph a bit for a thru hike, think jar of PNB.
rocketsocks
09-22-2014, 11:58
...also have your Iron and B-12 levels checked, could be a thing.
A lighter load, Trail runners instead of boots, and at least one completed thru-hike to learn how, stuff like this doesn't happen over night it takes most folks years to learn how to get their miles up.
lonehiker
09-22-2014, 13:02
A lighter load, Trail runners instead of boots, and at least one completed thru-hike to learn how, stuff like this doesn't happen over night it takes most folks years to learn how to get their miles up.
A completed thru-hike is not a prerequisite for increasing your mpd.
joshuasdad
09-22-2014, 13:16
To add to the above, in my experience, hiking anywhere north of Georgia and south of New Hampshire helps MPD. The ups and downs in Georgia really lessen my desire to put in 20+ mile days.
While I agree in general with 10k and others that you have to fuel your body in order to push any endurance activity, I disagree that you can not run a deficit, even a substantial one while doing said activity. .
I totally and completely agree 1000%. Thru hikers, a lot of them anyway, lose a lot of weight while they're increasing their mileage.
But stereotypically, these hikers are eating anything and everything not nailed down every chance they get - they're not packing 1 pound of food per day trying to hike with the intention of losing weight as I get the vibe the OP is doing.
Huge, big difference.
I was waiting on someone to say this - no surprise it was you! :)
I totally and completely agree 1000%. Thru hikers, a lot of them anyway, lose a lot of weight while they're increasing their mileage.
But stereotypically, these hikers are eating anything and everything not nailed down every chance they get - they're not packing 1 pound of food per day trying to hike with the intention of losing weight as I get the vibe the OP is doing.
Huge, big difference.
I am trying to lose weight, but I am not doing that by bringing 1 lb of food per day. I am rarely hungry on the trail. Most of the time, I don't even eat that 1 lb of food. If there is a drop box at a hostel, I tend to drop 1-2 cliffbars and 2-3 granola bars which I didn't eat. I am NOT starving myself. I am NOT fighting off the urge to eat. I am simply not that hungry. However, I will add a more substantial lunch meal plus a 30-40 minute break around 1ish and see how that works. It will give me time to put pack down (usually for first time all day) and get a little rest, energy, replace socks and mole skin.
On the trail, I only eat when I am hungry. In some cases, that may be whole day. Day 2 of my Labor day section hike, I had a cliffbar for breakfast. I didn't get hungry all day. Even after a 16 mile day from Gooch Gap Shelter to Neel gap, I wasn't even the slightest bit hungry when I made it to the hostel. I eat because I knew I needed to eat.
I don't bring or leave food at home as a means to lose weight. I hike on weekends (1) because I love it, and (2) if i didn't, unlike during the week, my weekends usually don't involve the gym but do involved watching sports all weekend. Hiking is an aid to losing weight, not my solution.
You'll figure it out..
Bottom line is if you're not hungry, not eating enough, and losing weight - that's a better place to start looking to get your miles up than not eating enough, not being hungry, losing weight, and on top of all that trying to hike more hours every day, take shorter breaks, and wearing lighter shoes to make more miles.
I hope that makes sense, I feel like I have a lack of clarity today... :)
AO2134: "Three months ago, I weighed 261lbs. I now weigh 211lbs. I do use hiking as an form of exercise." BINGO. Good for you! Keep up the exercise and hiking program. As you lose body weight, you will feel better and have more energy, and your miles per day will likely also increase on the trail. You are on the right track. Losing that much weight in only 3 months is really fantastic, just don't overdo it. From what I've learned, losing 50 lbs. in 3 months is quite aggressive. I don't know what your target weight is, but losing a max. of 2 lbs. per week might be better from a health viewpoint. When I started AT section hikes in 2009, I was weighing around 190 lbs, and I really suffered through those first few section hikes. Now I'm down to 155-160, and attribute the weight loss to hiking and smarter diet. Keep at it, you are doing great!
Ok my 2 cents for what it is worth. 1) Look at what you are doing to stay in shape between your hikes. If you are running, walking or biking during the week try to slowly increase your mph. If you are not doing this adding on miles on the trail on weekends will be hard as it will take awhile to get your trail legs. 2) Eat more: Unless you are carrying freeze-dried super calorie dense food 1 pound a day is not enough to keep the engine going. 3) I echo what others have said; find a hiking partner that hikes faster than you do. For this try a meet-up site for your area. Lastly, Start earlier, early enough that you can have breaks. Short breaks can help you go farther in the long run.
fiddlehead
09-22-2014, 20:55
Didn't read all the posts, and maybe someone covered this, but, it's tough for a section hiker to be in the kind of shape that a long distance hiker gets in to.
After my 1st thru, I found myself taking less breaks.
After a while, I only took two a day.
One for lunch, one for dinner.
Then hike after dinner (usually), till dark.
That's what got me into high mileage days.
But if I had to go out and do that now, after taking 10 years off from thru-hiking, I know I couldn't do it, unless I was out there at least a few months.
Violent Green
09-22-2014, 21:19
I will echo one thing that has already been said - Bigger miles is 90% mental. Lightening the load is the other 10%. I was always a 10-15mpd hiker until I decided to see if I could hike the Lakeshore Trail in the Smokies in one day just as a personal challenge. Myself and two friends got up early and knocked out 37mi in about 14hrs. After that, I wasn't so intimidated by those big mile days & knew I could press for longer distances. Now I've done many days in the 30's and working to get into the 40's occasionally.
I've figured out +40mi is a different animal.
Ryan
During Summer. hike Light... runn'in shorts and tank tops, Maybe truckers Hat. Winter.. well, go see TiPi:)
squeezebox
09-23-2014, 07:31
MHO
Training is way different than doing a long hike. When bicycle racing I did a fair amount of intervals, fast top sped for 2 minutes, slow rest for 2 minutes, but keep moving to flush out lactic acid etc. don't cramp up. This increases speed. Do some long slow distance to increase endurance. LSD training!! Push your self to the limit, or close. Save some for tomorrow.
For hiking the time lengths will increase but the same principal.
When racing I had to go out every day for a ride, no matter how bad I felt, after 15 minutes I could go home, 1/2 the time I worked it out and kept on riding.
When on an extended hike 2) 15 mile days are better than a 20 & a 0, save enough for tomorrow.
Last day push your speed and endurance. You can rest at home tomorrow.
But the rules for a 6 month hike are way different.
90% mental 20% physical, does mean that you need to learn to push through the pain of over exertion and rest after.
But if you are trashing you ankles, knees etc, you need to know when to stop and heal.
MHO
QHShowoman
09-23-2014, 07:43
@ soumodeler
Starting earlier would give me more time, but I hit a wall around 12-13 miles that I can keep hiking, but it is slower. I can't keep my previous pace after that point.
This may have something to do with your nutrition while hiking because at 28, unless you are out of shape or severely overweight, this shouldn't be happening. I try to eat something -- usually half a Luna bar -- every two hours or so, even if I am not feeling hungry. I keep a couple in my hip belt pocket so that i don't need to stop and take off my pack to eat. I keep myself on a schedule because if I don't, I won't eat at all and then I get bonky and it's too late for me to easily recover. Also, make sure you are hydrating. I switched to using a bladder because when relied on bottles, I didn't want to stop to drink and I'd get dehydrated.
CrumbSnatcher
09-23-2014, 17:59
might be as simple as some can just hike longer or faster than others, as long as you are enjoying it who cares? :-)
on a thru hike i might only go shelter to shelter in GA. and no way i would go off trail more than a half mile or so(like the Whitley Gap Shelter in Georgia 1.2 miles off trail) never ever been there, but over the course of the hike you get in a little better shape maybe unload a few small items and over all just more comfortable physically and mentally in the hike, and start rocking out more miles! by the time i reached the whites like on Franconia Ridge i dropped off the trail to Green leaf hut 1.0 mile straight down just cause i heard they had lemonade and some left over stale bread, even though i still had more miles to go on a big day.
CrumbSnatcher
09-23-2014, 18:00
just keep hiking and try to postpone the dirt nap as long as possible :-)
Just Bill
09-23-2014, 20:16
My pace starts pretty good. Close to 3 mph, but it slows after 2ish hours. Then it is 2.5 for an 1-2 hours. Then it 2.0 for 2 hours. After that, it becomes zombie hiking. I just try to keep moving. By end of day, I generally average of 2 miles per hiking hour. I don't take many breaks. I don't eat a "lunch." Just another clif bar and granola bar. The only breaks I really take are to getting water and possibly switching my socks and mole skin. I get awful blisters (my feet sweat a lot), but even with soaked socks, 1/2 the time I refuse to stop. I just keep pushing.
Lots of good advice on this thread-
This jumped at me a bit. Getting going, you should probably worry more about hiking all day, rather than your actual MPH. Miles per day is what matters, not MPH. As you said, on a trail like the AT you're going to have to "take what the trail gives you". A strategy you could implement right away is to pace yourself for a fuller day. At 6-8 hours of walking and 15 miles or so, you're better off walking 2MPH for 10 hours and hitting that 20. Ignore your MPH, concentrate on completing an 8, 10, and 12 hour day.
Fastest hiker around- JPD- 3.83 MPH. Not fast, but she did it 15-17 hours a day. Hiking hours per day, not MPH is the key.
The tortoise always beats the hare, if for no other reason than rabbits don't carry a pack that well.
As you go-
Efficiency is helpful, but not that critical yet. But you can work on quicker transitions both to camp and from camp. A decent way to do it and get breaks would be a morning, afternoon, and evening shift. You can expand these blocks as your stamina builds, but part of moving all day is to pace yourself in regards to your hours hiked as well as speed. If pushing to 3 or 2.5 miles, or worse, pushing to hold that pace over different terrain poops you out in 6-8 hours you are going too fast for your current fitness level and/or trail conditions.
Forcing yourself to take an easy first hour helps a lot too, you loosen up, warm up, and don't burn as much energy. Getting out of the gate screaming fast and going for a four hour block leads to the pattern of hiking you mention. A slow hour, two hour decent pace, half hour break, two hour block, half hour break brings you to 6 hours. Have an early dinner and a take a full hour break, stretch and head back out. Again, force yourself to take an easy hour, then if you can get two more hours in you'll be on your way! In a ten hour day, you'll have hiked 8 hours, two of them at a "resting" pace. This will "only" get you 16 miles or so, but once your body adapts to a full day you can start to expand these blocks of time and eventually, your speed.
Finally- if you fall into the zombie shamble- stop. Especially on the AT, I like to swing into a shelter and visit with folks. Have a small fire, take a nap, read the journal, or read a book for a while by yourself. You are better off resting a full hour and getting in another decent hour or two. You could shamble in exhaustion at 1mph and demoralize yourself, or stop, refresh, and still cover the same distance with a much better experience overall. As your skill at setting up camp improves, hiking until dark will become more pleasant overall. Do your daily chores during the day on your breaks and there is little to do at camp than simply sleep. Much more pleasant doing laundry and washing up at 1:00pm in the hot sun than at 8:30pm with the skeeters nippin yer balls anyhow.:)
When you stop for dinner, set up your pack for the next day, get your gear ready for quick setup at camp. Getting going early mostly has to do with futzing around. If you get in the habit of getting your stuff organized the day (not the night) before at dinner you'll find setting and breaking camp faster without trying. That easy first hour I mentioned...many hikers eat breakfast, drink their coffee, etc during that first hour while in motion. We all linger over breakfast really...but faster hikers take theirs to go and "commute" to work before really getting going. I find jumping up and motoring counterproductive in the long haul.
Weight-
Congrats on the weight loss! That alone will make a huge difference.
Packweight- is what it is for now- but you could practice trimming items out. Leaving things home is free!
Mental-
Agree 1000% with the others regarding the mental blocks. I strongly recommend some balls to the wall day hikes to break mileage barriers. 20,25,30,35, and on. Get out early, bring water, snacks, and a flashlight. Stay on the trail until you hit the distance. Simply knowing you have done it, means you can do it again. It is so simple sounding but makes a massive difference.
Socks-
You got a problem there.
Likely better ventilated trail runners is step one.
Step two, even though it may seem counter intuitive, I would highly recommend some Darn Tough Hiking weight Merino socks. They will wick, and work better for you when damp. The heavier weight will hold it's shape better and protect your feet. I often carry four pairs, one only for sleep, and three to wear. Wash them frequently, and find a way to secure them to your pack so pairs are always drying. I use hair ties on my daisy chains. If that doesn't work, back to liner socks.
Step three- walk barefoot around your neighborhood, three times a week for 15-20 minutes. No bruce willis broken glass crap, just walking a bit to toughen up on smooth pavement at a very slow pace.
Bad feet means no miles at some point, you shouldn't be having that many problems. If you don't solve that problem you're going nowhere.
Second Hand
09-23-2014, 20:58
I think most of what I have to say has already been said. My advice is.....
1.) Start early and end late. If my goal is knock out big miles, I try to sleep in shelters so I have less packing up to do, be on the trail as light breaks. I use noon as my half way point and try to set a goal of 10 miles by noon, which is easily obtainable if your hiking by 6AM.
2.) My pace hasn't changed much since I started hiking, even by dropping pack weight. With experience, my endurance has improved. The uphills don't bother me as much and I don't feel dead after 10 miles anymore.
3.) Take frequent short breaks. After all, what is the point of being in the woods if you don't stop to enjoy it?
Drybones
09-23-2014, 20:59
1. Eat well, keep fuel in you.
2. Wear lightweight shoes, it's more important than the weight in your pack.
3. Lighten the pack load.
4. It's 75% mental.
5. Take breaks at regular intervals.
6. Keep putting one foot in front of the other.
7. You don't need to hike fast, just put in the hours.
Lowering pack weight, and body weight too, does help with this. No denying it.
As for me though. My 'MPD' went up just through the conditioning that a thru-hike gave me. After about 1 month I could go farther, and faster, than I would have thought in the beginning. Granted terrain, weather, and your mental state also impact your potential MPD.
MuddyWaters
09-23-2014, 23:52
Hike farther, by hiking longer.
For practical purposes, you really can't go much faster, except maybe uphill.
Hike easier, by being in shape, with a light pack.
squeezebox
09-24-2014, 01:39
On your training hikes alternate between light pack (50% of what you expect to carry) and a heavy pack (50% more than what you expect to carry)
This will help with your endurance to carry weight, and carry it faster
Join a gym and do some wt. training.
rocketsocks
09-24-2014, 04:30
Squats with a nap sack helped me.
daddytwosticks
09-24-2014, 07:10
Squats with a nap sack helped me.
What's a nap sack? :)
colorado_rob
09-24-2014, 08:02
1. Eat well, keep fuel in you.
2. Wear lightweight shoes, it's more important than the weight in your pack.
3. Lighten the pack load.
4. It's 75% mental.
5. Take breaks at regular intervals.
6. Keep putting one foot in front of the other.
7. You don't need to hike fast, just put in the hours. Good summary, especially #7, but except #5, I basically find that breaks are not necessary when I hike a methodical pace of 2.2-2.5 MPH. I only stop for photo, social or bathroom breaks, essentially, all day; the pace I do just doesn't require breaks. I get passed all the time, but by the end of the day, I cover more miles than 90% of the hikers out there (rough guess), including the much younger/stronger hikers.
W.R.T. #2, A rule-of-thumb that floats around say "a pound on your feet is like 5 pounds on your back", and I agree with this, so work on hiking comfortably with lighter shoes/boots if you can.
And finally w.r.t. #1, I basically eat continuously all day in very gradual amounts to keep the blood sugar up, very important for me on my long days (most days). Most days no "lunch stop", just continuous snacking while walking (I keep all day's worth of trail food in hip pockets of pack).
rocketsocks
09-24-2014, 12:09
What's a nap sack? :)
hmm:-?...good question...book bag, day pack, small back pack.
aaaah!...and now I see my mis take, thanks daddywosticks. :) I had to look it up.;)
Knapsack
CarlZ993
09-24-2014, 15:16
Good summary, especially #7, but except #5, I basically find that breaks are not necessary when I hike a methodical pace of 2.2-2.5 MPH. I only stop for photo, social or bathroom breaks, essentially, all day; the pace I do just doesn't require breaks. I get passed all the time, but by the end of the day, I cover more miles than 90% of the hikers out there (rough guess), including the much younger/stronger hikers.
W.R.T. #2, A rule-of-thumb that floats around say "a pound on your feet is like 5 pounds on your back", and I agree with this, so work on hiking comfortably with lighter shoes/boots if you can.
And finally w.r.t. #1, I basically eat continuously all day in very gradual amounts to keep the blood sugar up, very important for me on my long days (most days). Most days no "lunch stop", just continuous snacking while walking (I keep all day's worth of trail food in hip pockets of pack).
When I'm trying to crank a lot of miles (for me), I hike similar to Colorado_Rob. I keep a pace that I feel I can keep going all day long. I have my snack/lunch bag readily accessible. I reach back & grab it (a 1L roll-top dry bag). Take some food out & eat while hiking. On big-mile days, I'll only rest while treating water (chemically) or watering a rock.
daddytwosticks
09-24-2014, 15:42
hmm:-?...good question...book bag, day pack, small back pack.
aaaah!...and now I see my mis take, thanks daddywosticks. :) I had to look it up.;)
Knapsack
I knew that...just yanking your chain! Have a great day. :) :)
rocketsocks
09-24-2014, 15:46
I knew that...just yanking your chain! Have a great day. :) :)
...and at the expense of the dreaded white back grounded forum, my chain has always been very yankable...wait, nevermind :D
OnlyJohn
09-29-2014, 15:19
I increased my mileage by getting rid of my hiking partner.
Hey guys. I just got into backpacking in June of this year and I can hike 15-16 miles at the "outer edge" of comfortable hiking. I could do more, but it is slower and just not as fun. I want to increase my MPD. I really, really want to break this limit I seem to hit around that mileage. How did you increase your MPD? I would love to get closer to 20 mpd.
I have a 30-32 lbs fully loaded pack. I know hiking could be easier if I get lighter, but I just bought all my gear this year. For a while at least, I can't spend more money on hiking. As my gear started to wear, I will buy better gear.
For an indication of how many miles I do on AT and where, here is a list of this month's hikes:
3 night, 4 day hike:
Day 1: Parking lot to Springer to Gooch Gap Shelter: ~17 miles Started hiking around 9:30 am and finished around 6:00pm
Day 2: Gooch Gap Shelter to Neel Gap: ~ 16 miles. Started hiking at 8:30 am and finished 5:15 pm.
Day 3: Neel Gap to Wolf Laurel Top, back to Neel Gap (dropped camera) to Low Gap Shelter: ~ ~19 miles. Started hiking at 9:00 am to 7:15 pm.
Day 4: Low Gap Shelter to Unicoi Gap: 9.7 miles. Started at 8:30 am. Finished at 12:15 Pm.
This weekend I did:
Day 1: Unicoi to Tray Mountain Shelter: 5.7 miles. Started at 6 pm and finished 8:30pm.
Day 2: Tray Mountain Shelter to Deep Gap Shelter and back to Tray Mountain Shelter: ~16 Started at 10:15 am finished at 6:00 pm.
Day 3: Tray Mountain Shelter to Unicoi Gap. 5.7 miles. Started at 9:15 pm and finished 11:50pm.
Does anyone have ideas on how I could get my MPD up?
This is a topic from each persons perspective.
Young ? Older? Fit? Overweight? Etc
For the average hiker with a good overall pack weight, lets just agree on that at 30 lbs all in for this discussion, I think that HOURS HIKED PER DAY will win this debate
Isn't that the turtle and the hare story?
Jenn Pharr hiked for a LOT of hours each day
As for pace while hiking, my experience there is that my wife paces me on the weekends, we can do 5 MPH. Alone, nowhere close on the AT
Last thought...........a MILE IS NOT A MILE ON THE AT.
Our local trail is 5-6 miles, some miles on the AT are tons harder than that loop
brian039
10-02-2014, 17:12
It really takes about a week of continuous hiking before you can start upping mileage. Also, the sections that you have done aren't the easiest either. I'd be satisfied with your pace so far.
If you're through hiking the AT don't worry about your weight, your weight will be down soon enough. Worry about your diet as you'll need to eat properly to fuel the body. During my 2011 thru hike every one lost weight, I got to 135 from 185 and as someone pointed out thru-hiker eat everything they can and still lose weight. I hit 20+ days but preferred to keep it below or at 20. The long distance hikers were starting early and ending late. I would occasionally pass them but since I stopped frequently they would soon leave me behind. Several long distance hikers commented to me that they weren't having fun and eventually dropped out. When I started I thought it would be difficult to get in 12+ days but I found that it was easy given the hours, so my average early on was 18+. Did 30+ in my younger days but don't see the point of doing so now. Besides longer hours and lower Pack weight your mileage will be easy if you wish for it.
Rethink some gear weight, needed gear and down sizing your pack. I had a 65l and just bought a 45l pack. I am at that almost 20 too. Hope that helps.:cool:
Trying to increase m/d just for it's own sake is a recipe for hurting yourself..
Big +1 to this. Don't injure yourself! Build up slowly.
1. Hike in lighting storms! I hike my very fastest while terrified of dying! This is especially effective for getting up and over a pass. ;)
2. Avoid near misses with rattle/poisonous snakes. You will hike your absolute slowest after almost stepping on a snake. You will pick along the trail at a snail's pace seeing "snakes" in every stick and shadow.
3. Set up iPod play lists with music for flats, up and down hill. Music that is just a little above my usual steps/beats per minute really helps me speed up almost effortlessly.
mdbamabrad
10-15-2014, 12:49
your body will adjust and tell you whether you can speed up or slow down. Sometimes we want to keep going but we shouldn't. Pack weight is a killer.
There was a telling segment in Chris Gallaway's film of his AT hike. Here's a fit young guy who nearly knocked himself off the trail, trying to follow some fast hikers doing 30 miles per day for several days in a row. It was enough of a hit to require medical attention and some zeroes. Queried after the film about what he might do differently next time around, he answered without hesitating, "I'd go slower."
There was a telling segment in Chris Gallaway's film of his AT hike. Here's a fit young guy who nearly knocked himself off the trail, trying to follow some fast hikers doing 30 miles per day for several days in a row. It was enough of a hit to require medical attention and some zeroes. Queried after the film about what he might do differently next time around, he answered without hesitating, "I'd go slower."
But the real question is what was different between Chris and those that were doing 30mpd without getting hurt? Were they lighter weight, in better trail shape? There are folks that I know that could take four months off and still knock out a fifty mile day. Or not do any multiday trips and knock out 30 plus mile days consecutively. There can be a huge difference between being in shape and being in "high mile hiking shape."
brian039
10-15-2014, 16:30
But the real question is what was different between Chris and those that were doing 30mpd without getting hurt? Were they lighter weight, in better trail shape? There are folks that I know that could take four months off and still knock out a fifty mile day. Or not do any multiday trips and knock out 30 plus mile days consecutively. There can be a huge difference between being in shape and being in "high mile hiking shape."
Genetics. It takes really good joints to be able handle the stress you are putting on them.
But the real question is what was different between Chris and those that were doing 30mpd without getting hurt? Were they lighter weight, in better trail shape? There are folks that I know that could take four months off and still knock out a fifty mile day. Or not do any multiday trips and knock out 30 plus mile days consecutively. There can be a huge difference between being in shape and being in "high mile hiking shape."
One diff is that Chris was carrying a lot of camera and audio gear, so his pack was certainly well above optimal. Otherwise, the dude is young and fit and clearly has nothing to atone or apologize for. Also: Chris deployed that gear, he didn't just carry it for jollies, ya know? So he actually had a job to do (serious cinematography) as well as just, you know, hiking.
^^ Sorry about the sarcastic tone of my last post. I think the world of Chris and Sunshine, so I got defensive. I guess I disagree about your (Malto's) idea of "the real question." AT hikers often injure themselves trying to keep up with faster, fitter hikers -- it's a very common scenario and one place where HYOH would have avoided the problem.
Chris readily admitted that his camera work was a significant extra burden. In the question and answer session he said, "I did this so nobody else would have to." That got a good chuckle out of the crowd.
MuddyWaters
10-15-2014, 21:43
I'm in good shape with a light pack. I can come off the sofa and do 20 mile days. Always have. However my comfortable mileage is in 18 to 20 range. Multiple 20 to 25s in a row start to wear me down after 4 days and leave me tired. If you take a nearo, you give up the gains you made on the higher mileage days.
A pace you can maintain will get you there fastest.
^^ Sorry about the sarcastic tone of my last post. I think the world of Chris and Sunshine, so I got defensive. I guess I disagree about your (Malto's) idea of "the real question." AT hikers often injure themselves trying to keep up with faster, fitter hikers -- it's a very common scenario and one place where HYOH would have avoided the problem.
Chris readily admitted that his camera work was a significant extra burden. In the question and answer session he said, "I did this so nobody else would have to." That got a good chuckle out of the crowd.
Actually, didn't take it sarcastically at all. You answered the "real question". He chose to carry extra gear for his passion. But it also likely explains why he wasn't able to do what the other hikers did.