View Full Version : How many on this forum have donated to the ATC?
JohnnySnook
10-09-2014, 02:03
Just wondering? It was more about this site so you get the picture.
I posted a similar type thread in the members section and figured I'd test out the general section. Please don't get this thread locked! It was more about this site so you get the picture.
Can you post a thread here with a user poll attached? It makes it so you're choice of A, B, C won't be shown to others but we can see the results.
It would be interesting to see the the percentage of poor, middle class, and rich percentages. I doubt many rich out there. They don't get rish by donating unless its to a mayor, governor, or congress member to get their projects passed!
I think it would be fun to do one for this popup AD free site also.
Just Sayin….
Sailing_Faith
10-09-2014, 07:56
I donate to show appreciation for the help that I have received here. That and the stickers are ways I feel I can give something back.
One thing to consider though, most of the banners that indicate donations only stay up for a year after the donation is made.
Many who post here have made a donation in the past.... Or even many donations in the past.
Others give in other ways, there are many trail maintainers here (God bless every one of you!).
bangorme
10-09-2014, 09:19
I used to donate, but they've got too much into the wilderness hotel business for me. They've also bought up some camps which they are fixing up (I assume to rent). I really appreciate the trail side to what they do, but there's nothing worse than walking up to a motel on the trail, full of day trippers eating steaks and drinking wine. Then of course, you have to camp a certain distance from the thing... so it's just a pain and not what I think the ATC should be involved in.
Speakeasy TN
10-09-2014, 09:30
Donated before I did my first overnight on the AT. My wife has seen the work they do and the community and is all in for continued membership.
A few times.... Planning now to donate to the cause to fight the Tuxedo hotel plan in Sterling Forest. I'd recommend the same if you don't want to see a ginormous hotel marring your trail views when hiking through NY. How these developers can get around federally protected land that's already been fought for and won reeks of corrupt politicians accepting bribes from wealthy developers. More info here: http://www.appalachiantrail.org/who-we-are/news/2014/08/20/the-appalachian-trail-conservancy-voices-strong-opposition-to-proposed-sterling-forest-resort-in-tuxedo-new-york
Without the ATC, we wouldn't have the trail as we do today. It's important to help them if you want your trail protected!
Tuckahoe
10-09-2014, 10:06
I used to donate, but they've got too much into the wilderness hotel business for me. They've also bought up some camps which they are fixing up (I assume to rent). I really appreciate the trail side to what they do, but there's nothing worse than walking up to a motel on the trail, full of day trippers eating steaks and drinking wine. Then of course, you have to camp a certain distance from the thing... so it's just a pain and not what I think the ATC should be involved in.
I believe that you may be confusing the ATC (Appalachian Trail Conservancy) with the AMC (Appalachian Mt. Club).
Just Bill
10-09-2014, 11:04
I donate directly, rather than keep up a membership. While nothing is wrong with them; I found I didn't read or make use of the publications from ATC, Sierra Club, and others. So to get the most bang for my limited buck, I just donate and forgo the membership so the money gets spent on the organization rather than on newsletters or magazines.
FWIW, I believe there is an option to simply opt out of mailings/publications, but easier for me to just send a check when I can.
Rain Man
10-09-2014, 11:23
Yes, I'm a member and donate and also give gift memberships occasionally.
Rain Man
.
Deer Hunter
10-09-2014, 11:30
I have donated the past few years.
Sugarfoot
10-09-2014, 11:37
I am pleased to be able to support ATC annually and have provided for it in my estate plan.
I am a member also, have donated in the past and plan to continue...
Been a life member since 1980. Donate annually at the minimum and have been a volunteer on the ATC trail crews probably 15 times.
Kerosene
10-09-2014, 11:59
I am an ATC Life Member, and pay MATC annual dues.
I am finding the original post a bit difficult to decipher. A, B, C? Poor, middle class, rich?
I live and hike in the midwest. I find this site to be a fantastic resource for hiking, camping and outdoors life-style tips. I participate on Whiteblaze for the abundance of information applicable to trails in general rather than AT specific.
I am a supporter of the Superior Hiking Trail. I am a member of the SHT association. I choose license plates for my vehicles that add an annual premium which is funneled to caring for my state's critical habitats. My tax form includes a Wildlife Check off which allows my to direct dollars to a world I value.
So, is the question an attempt to determine how environmentally conscientious are the members? Or, perhaps what type of individual is a contributor to the ATC? What is it that you are "Just sayin' "?
I donate by going to different locations and making purchases, like this weekend. I took my wife, dog and two friends to the Appalachian trail museum in PA. Bought the book Thru, a orange bandana for Knucklehead [our dog], and a few things to give as gifts this holiday season. My two friends spent well over $100.00 as well.
I also spend well over $1000.00 dollars a year purchasing hunting and fishing lic. in both NJ and PA, and sometimes NY. This money ay not go directly to the AT but it does help protect some of the land the AT goes through.
I guess I can do more.
RUNT ''13''
slbirdnerd
10-09-2014, 12:32
I am a member of the ATC and I donate to WB.net.
I donate by going to different locations and making purchases, like this weekend. I took my wife, dog and two friends to the Appalachian trail museum in PA. Bought the book Thru, a orange bandana for Knucklehead [our dog], and a few things to give as gifts this holiday season. My two friends spent well over $100.00 as well.
I also spend well over $1000.00 dollars a year purchasing hunting and fishing lic. in both NJ and PA, and sometimes NY. This money may not go directly to the AT but it does help protect some of the land the AT goes through.
I guess I can do more.
RUNT ''13''
ooops! sorry for the double post
Rolls Kanardly
10-09-2014, 13:12
I donate every year to the ATC and to Whiteblaze.net. I wish I could do more for both of them.
Rolls
Life member of ATC and MATC but also contribute money and time annually.
The Kisco Kid
10-09-2014, 13:58
I've been an ATC member since 1994.
Member since 1989, usually give a bit more besides. Also donate occasionally to MATC and Maine AT Land Trust.
I used to donate, but they've got too much into the wilderness hotel business for me. They've also bought up some camps which they are fixing up (I assume to rent). I really appreciate the trail side to what they do, but there's nothing worse than walking up to a motel on the trail, full of day trippers eating steaks and drinking wine. Then of course, you have to camp a certain distance from the thing... so it's just a pain and not what I think the ATC should be involved in.One thing that I think is lost on a lot of people on this forum is that literally millions of people use the trail every year and only a very small percentage of that number are backpackers. The vast majority are day hikers, car campers, people picnicing or just stopping at a scenic overlook. Most people will never venture more than a mile from a road. So I don't know where this idea comes from that the ATC should cater to thruhikers or even section hikers. That is not the way the vast majority of people use the trail. The trail wouldn't be there but for all of these other uses that make thruhiking possible.
Old Hiker
10-09-2014, 14:40
Just wondering? It was more about this site so you get the picture.
I posted a similar type thread in the members section and figured I'd test out the general section. Please don't get this thread locked! It was more about this site so you get the picture.
Can you post a thread here with a user poll attached? It makes it so you're choice of A, B, C won't be shown to others but we can see the results.
It would be interesting to see the the percentage of poor, middle class, and rich percentages. I doubt many rich out there. They don't get rish by donating unless its to a mayor, governor, or congress member to get their projects passed!
I think it would be fun to do one for this popup AD free site also.
Just Sayin….
I guess I'm the only one to raise my eyebrows on someone asking how and where I CHOOSE to donate anything. My stock, rude answer is NUNYA, as in None of YOUR Business. How and where and how much and how often is MY business. I consider it rude to ask about other people's money, but that's the way I was raised.
How will you decide who is rich, middle class or poor? We going to have a "fair share" of donations now? Taxes aren't enough?
As to the (my opinion) snarky "rich" comment, most of the rich get rich by working, not whining. Yes, there are questionable practices, but aren't they mostly legal? Is it a crime to make over a certain amount and donate to a politician?
Rant over. Apologies.
BuckeyeBill
10-09-2014, 16:00
I guess I'm the only one to raise my eyebrows on someone asking how and where I CHOOSE to donate anything. My stock, rude answer is NUNYA, as in None of YOUR Business. How and where and how much and how often is MY business. I consider it rude to ask about other people's money, but that's the way I was raised.
How will you decide who is rich, middle class or poor? We going to have a "fair share" of donations now? Taxes aren't enough?
As to the (my opinion) snarky "rich" comment, most of the rich get rich by working, not whining. Yes, there are questionable practices, but aren't they mostly legal? Is it a crime to make over a certain amount and donate to a politician?
Rant over. Apologies.
+1 Nice rant if you ask me.
I donate directly, rather than keep up a membership. While nothing is wrong with them; I found I didn't read or make use of the publications from ATC, Sierra Club, and others. So to get the most bang for my limited buck, I just donate and forgo the membership so the money gets spent on the organization rather than on newsletters or magazines.
FWIW, I believe there is an option to simply opt out of mailings/publications, but easier for me to just send a check when I can.
I'm a life member. You can opt out of the print version of magazine and still get it electronically, which lets you read it without adding cost to the ATC or paper to the recycling bin.
I guess I'm the only one to raise my eyebrows on someone asking how and where I CHOOSE to donate anything. My stock, rude answer is NUNYA, as in None of YOUR Business.
OP asked whether you had donated. Not how much. Doesn't seem to warrant an Ayn Rand Going Galt freakout.
imscotty
10-09-2014, 16:29
Member since 1981.
OP asked whether you had donated. Not how much. Doesn't seem to warrant an Ayn Rand Going Galt freakout.
Respectfully, the Original poster went on after the question with some mysterious gibberish that undermined question. After reading the entire Original Post it is difficult to know what information the poster is seeking. I believe a rant is warranted.
Perhaps the original posted could edit the post and have it moved to straight forward if they are seeking simply yes/no responses.
Been a member for many years.
bangorme
10-09-2014, 17:05
I believe that you may be confusing the ATC (Appalachian Trail Conservancy) with the AMC (Appalachian Mt. Club).
Thank you for clearing that up. I believe you are right!
What are the pros and cons of donating to a local club like the PATC vs. the ATC itself? I try to make a point to donate to trail organizations where I've hiked significant miles during the year but have procrastinated when it comes to the Appalachian Trail because I'm not sure which organization to choose and I don't want to split a donation between the two.
Lone Wolf
10-09-2014, 17:41
Just wondering? It was more about this site so you get the picture.
I posted a similar type thread in the members section and figured I'd test out the general section. Please don't get this thread locked! It was more about this site so you get the picture.
Can you post a thread here with a user poll attached? It makes it so you're choice of A, B, C won't be shown to others but we can see the results.
It would be interesting to see the the percentage of poor, middle class, and rich percentages. I doubt many rich out there. They don't get rish by donating unless its to a mayor, governor, or congress member to get their projects passed!
I think it would be fun to do one for this popup AD free site also.
Just Sayin….
i donate to St. Judes and ALS
What are the pros and cons of donating to a local club like the PATC vs. the ATC itself? I try to make a point to donate to trail organizations where I've hiked significant miles during the year but have procrastinated when it comes to the Appalachian Trail because I'm not sure which organization to choose and I don't want to split a donation between the two.
Your choice. ATC is mostly an umbrella organization, coordinating the efforts of numerous trail-maintenance organizations, eg. PATC, NYNJTC, GMC, AMC, etc. As you've seen above -- several people also give to other similar land-trust and conservation organizations like MATLT. Here in MA there are (for example) the Trustees of Reservations, and even more locally, the Sudbury Valley Land Trust. I've never given money directly to AMC, other than fees for staying at shelters and campsites.
CrumbSnatcher
10-09-2014, 19:26
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oldwetherman
10-09-2014, 19:52
ATC....yes
theoilman
10-09-2014, 19:55
Member and encourage others.
I usually donate to the ATC anonymously but also have a membership. Donate to WB too not making a big deal of announcing it. Financially support the PCT, CDT, FHT, NJ/NY Trail Conference, American Hiking Society, and a couple of trail groups in Hawaii(Na Ala Hele, etc) as well.
I financially support the AMC in their mission despite so much of the animosity towards them here.
Been a member of the AMC, ATC, and GMC. I see the ATC as more of a lobbying group. Almost a necessary evil. The ATC well over 10 years in a row. On and off before. AMC on and off since the late 70's. AMC is the most difficult for me to give to because I just get a funny feeling of them going in to many directions and being way too structured. The GMC regularly for over 20 years. The GMC is the one I'm most comfortable supporting. The level depends on what I can afford in a given year, Being semi retired it isn't what it used to be but it's been enough to get invites to special get togethers.
Actually feel the trail workers and maintenance people do the most, they are the youngest and give a lot of bang per hour. So I do whatever I am able to make sure they have the tools and equipment necessary. Only thing about GMC that mildly upset me is that when I tried to link up with director on linkedin I pretty much was ignored and that just isn't wize with someone who's tossed in 4 figures over the years.
rocketsocks
10-10-2014, 17:42
I guess I'm the only one to raise my eyebrows on someone asking how and where I CHOOSE to donate anything. My stock, rude answer is NUNYA, as in None of YOUR Business. How and where and how much and how often is MY business. I consider it rude to ask about other people's money, but that's the way I was raised.
How will you decide who is rich, middle class or poor? We going to have a "fair share" of donations now? Taxes aren't enough?
As to the (my opinion) snarky "rich" comment, most of the rich get rich by working, not whining. Yes, there are questionable practices, but aren't they mostly legal? Is it a crime to make over a certain amount and donate to a politician?
Rant over. Apologies.I agree.
But this is how we do it in my house hold. We have a list of charity's, foundations and causes we like, if I see one I want to give to, I ad it to the list, same goes for my other family members, but they have to justify (speak as to why they'd give) and when that charity, foundation, or cause comes to the top of the list, a payment is sent. I am not a member of the ATC but it is on my list...same with my local trail club NY/NJ trail conference.
One thing to keep in mind is that supporting one or two organizations with a larger amount is usually more efficient than supporting a dozen or two organizations with small amounts. The reason for this has to do with the costs organizations incur when it comes to keeping in contact with donors and soliciting new donations. If you donate to a few organizations rather than a few dozen, this overhead is lower in aggregate making the giving more efficient overall. I wish there was a way to make a small conditional donation to a charity with the stipulation that the donation is being made conditional upon never receiving any mail or marketing materials in return. I guess this could be done anonymously through a cash donation.
rocketsocks
10-10-2014, 18:10
One thing to keep in mind is that supporting one or two organizations with a larger amount is usually more efficient than supporting a dozen or two organizations with small amounts. The reason for this has to do with the costs organizations incur when it comes to keeping in contact with donors and soliciting new donations. If you donate to a few organizations rather than a few dozen, this overhead is lower in aggregate making the giving more efficient overall. I wish there was a way to make a small conditional donation to a charity with the stipulation that the donation is being made conditional upon never receiving any mail or marketing materials in return. I guess this could be done anonymously through a cash donation.You absolutely can do just that, never had one returned before being canceled...money is money no matter how small.
You absolutely can do just that, never had one returned before being canceled...money is money no matter how small.
Do you just send cash through the mail?
rocketsocks
10-10-2014, 19:08
Do you just send cash through the mail?
My wife called first, we were giving to a charity and exactly what you suggested was happening...to much mail received for our givings...problem is after a while you eventually may get dumped back in the system again and then we just called again.
rocketsocks
10-10-2014, 19:12
Oops, sorry didn't answer your question. We usually pay by check, weather she makes it out to cash or whatever she is told over the phone I don't know, but I think it is goes across the desk of the person she spoke with so they know what to do with it, this is not an uncommon request these days, many people want to give but for whatever reason don't care to become full members.
jimmyjam
10-10-2014, 19:53
I donate regularly to ATC, also to the Sierra Club, Grand Canyon Association, and National Park Foundation. Our natural open areas are priceless, let's preserve, protect and enjoy them.
QHShowoman
10-10-2014, 21:12
One thing to keep in mind is that supporting one or two organizations with a larger amount is usually more efficient than supporting a dozen or two organizations with small amounts. The reason for this has to do with the costs organizations incur when it comes to keeping in contact with donors and soliciting new donations. If you donate to a few organizations rather than a few dozen, this overhead is lower in aggregate making the giving more efficient overall. I wish there was a way to make a small conditional donation to a charity with the stipulation that the donation is being made conditional upon never receiving any mail or marketing materials in return. I guess this could be done anonymously through a cash donation.
We love our low dollar donors! They're our bread and butter! Donations at the low dollar level (<$250) make up the bulk of many nonprofits' fundraising from private individuals. We don't care if you only give us $25/year -- just stay loyal to us year after year. We also find many of our major and planned giving donors from our low dollar universe.
It's pretty cheap to mail in bulk to a low dollar donor (usually <$300 per thousand pieces mailed). There's little personalization, we get bulk discounts on printing and production, and most mail at 3rd class nonprofit rate. The more names we mail, the cheaper it costs. High dollar donors, in contrast, often get costlier stationery, more personalization, first class postage AND stamped reply envelopes. In addition, organizations usually employ extra staff to manage relationships with high dollar donors, so they spend more money to make more money.
Some things to note when supporting non-profits:
1. You absolutely can ask an organization not to solicit you in the future or send you any marketing materials and most will flag your record in that way and respect that wish. But bear in mind that if an organization hasn't heard from you in 4-5 years, they'll likely remove those flags and start re-soliciting you.
2. You can earmark your gift for something specific, but gifts that are restricted are the least useful to an organization and often times, create more work for the organization to process. If there isn't an account set up for that specific restriction, it's quite a pain in the but to set one up in finance and in the donor database. It's best to let the organization decide where they need to spend the money.
3. Don't assume that the national headquarters of an organization is sharing revenue with a local chapter of the same organization (or vice-versa). Relatively few non-profits are that coordinated. While many have revenue or name sharing agreements, some organizations are not connected at all to their local affiliates. Don't be afraid to ask questions about how your money will be spent.
4. The absolute BEST way to make your money go the furthest to the charity of your choice is to become a monthly sustaining member. By making even modest gifts on a monthly basis and having them automatically deducted from your checking account or charged to your credit card, it cuts down on a lot of the overhead of processing donations, the organization won't need to mail you additional solicitations on a monthly basis, and they'll know they can depend on your gift each month.
5. Beware of fundraisers on sites like "GoFundMe" if they're not sponsored by the non-profit directly. For example, Jane Doe sets up a Go Fund Me page to raise money to buy blankets for the homeless shelter in town. When you make a donation, that money is going to JANE, not the homeless shelter. Even if she uses every cent she raises to donate blankets to the homeless shelter, she's the only one getting a receipt for tax purposes. Skip the middleman and give to the charity directly.
QHShowoman
10-10-2014, 21:19
Also, I forgot to mention that most organizations won't bother to mail anyone who has given less than $5-10 dollars. So if that's what you give each year, it's not costing them anything to keep you on file.
3. Don't assume that the national headquarters of an organization is sharing revenue with a local chapter of the same organization (or vice-versa). Relatively few non-profits are that coordinated. While many have revenue or name sharing agreements, some organizations are not connected at all to their local affiliates. Don't be afraid to ask questions about how your money will be spent.
Many national organizations that have local chapters have found that the locals bleed the national organization dry, and thus they end up being completely separate financially and each raises their own funding.
capehiker
10-11-2014, 10:59
I've donated 10 out of the last 16 years and will donate this year.
JohnnySnook
10-13-2014, 01:29
I thank all of you for your replies. I'm just getting back into hiking after many years of of just dreaming about. its a whole new world compared to the life I've lived the last 20 years. I've always dreamed about my younger years spent in the mountains even though life has since took other paths. I'm sure this will be touched on many time during my blog of this journey.
Yes, asking what people donate and their status in financial world may be taken harshly by some and others think its fine. Either way this thread has opened up my mind to the mentality of those in the hiking community. Which seems to be in fine shape compared to many other groups that raise money. Yes, as any group the sub-cultures fight among themselves. Nothing new anywhere in society.
My mom has donated small amounts of money to many of the NFP's that she believes in. She's a teacher close to retiring so when she can she sends a $5 check to this group or that group. I just over looked this when I was younger. Now that I'm a bit older I see the value; Not just financially but personally in my life.
As a surfer and fisherman I'm all for protecting the worlds resources. Fisherman often get the short end of there stick as we kill things and are far from united as a group. Maybe this will change as the right to catch fish in given areas changes.
As surfers we are well respect in our goal of protecting wildlife and surfing areas. We are not a bunch of W@@D smoking, non-working, losers. Most surfers are people that love the natural world and are people that train quite hard to be able to surf. The Pros all travel with trainers etc. Doctors at every event.
I just felt I could get a better gauge on a group of people from many ranges of life and financial situations. from what I can tell most feel donating is a good thing. That this is a group, involved in an individual activity, but united toward the end goal. Saving natural areas, hiking areas, and multi-use areas.
There are all kinds of groups that support the trail. As a group we all want the trail (And other trails and natural areas) to be there forever for our kids and grandkids to enjoy. Some groups want to make money but still give back. Some don't think thats right. Either way if the money is used to keep the trail intact than its all for the good of hikers. Will it one day become extremely commercialized? Possibly. Hopefully it can be restricted to trail towns.
Well these are just some of my initial thoughts and I'll re-read each post a few more times.
I will say of all the donations I've made I usually just get an email back saying thank you. It was very nice to get a call from a real person from the ATC thanking me for my donation. My donation wasn't anything special. I'm sure compared to others that donate publicly or privately. Either way it was something that meant a lot to me personally. I wish i could of chatted a bit more with her about the trail but i was on a job that will go down as one of the worst ever and couldn't. Maybe when i make it there i can asking in person who calls the people.
Mrs Baggins
10-13-2014, 04:06
Yes, been a member many years.
Furlough
10-13-2014, 07:04
Trail Maintainer, Member of PATC, Member of ATC.
Yes, donate to ATC. Appreciate all they do for AT
theinfamousj
11-18-2014, 11:46
I donated to both that ATC and WB before being laid off. Since then I have been underemployed with very little money to spend, even on good causes, so I offered what I had instead: time. I volunteered with trail maintaining and wherever else help was needed.
Just landed a new, good, full time job and am looking forward to being able to give money again.
I donate regularly to the PCTA and AMC but not to the ATC or WB
peakbagger
11-18-2014, 12:07
I guess I am donating a small amount to ATC every few weeks as I set up Amazon Smile to donate to ATC when I buy something. I am quite surprised that ATC doesn't publicize this in the magazine as its relatively painless way to get some income.
I did notice that once I became a life member of ATC that they were more restrained in asking for donations. Sure I get an occasional request but a lot less than when I was a annual member. Of course they may have just changed their approach.
Speaking about groups that send things for donations, take a look at it this way:
Our Troop does an annual 5K race. We get local businesses as sponsors at various levels, starting at $50. There has been discussion before if it’s worth sending letters every year to businesses that haven’t replied in the past, but even with postage at $0.49 (regular rate) you figure you can send 100 letters for $50 (no cost to print them as troop members do that, just postage and envelopes on sale). So if even 1 of the letters gets you a sponsor at the lowest level, you’ve covered the cost for all those letters. Any beyond that are positive income towards the race costs.
When you look at it that way, it makes much more sense to send the letters, as you never know when someone will say yes – it has happened after 2 or 3 years of no response, if you get the right person opening the mail.
bamboo bob
11-18-2014, 18:12
Just wondering? It was more about this site so you get the picture.
I posted a similar type thread in the members section and figured I'd test out the general section. Please don't get this thread locked! It was more about this site so you get the picture.
Can you post a thread here with a user poll attached? It makes it so you're choice of A, B, C won't be shown to others but we can see the results.
It would be interesting to see the the percentage of poor, middle class, and rich percentages. I doubt many rich out there. They don't get rish by donating unless its to a mayor, governor, or congress member to get their projects passed!
I think it would be fun to do one for this popup AD free site also.
Just Sayin….
Accept many of what we call National Parks were in fact donated by the Rockefellers and Laurence Rockefeller was an environmentalist of the first order. Carnegie built libraries all over the country and Gates is THE major doner of the 21st century. The 1% has a bad press.
Accept many of what we call National Parks were in fact donated by the Rockefellers and Laurence Rockefeller was an environmentalist of the first order. Carnegie built libraries all over the country and Gates is THE major doner of the 21st century. The 1% has a bad press.
With regard to on-going, substantial and simply awe-inspiring generosity and commitment to the AT, and to land preservation along and beyond the trail, one need only look to the co-founder of Burt's Bees, Roxanne Quimby, and her family. I am sure the depth of her commitment wasn't because one or both of her children (?) were thru hikers, but then again it could have hurt...
jonrocmtn
11-18-2014, 21:54
Member of ATC, monthly ATC Trail Guardian, member Nantahala Hiking Club, trail maintainer and volunteer shuttle.
Another Kevin
11-18-2014, 23:25
I don't ordinarily donate to ATC. I give to a few of my local trail clubs (NYNJTC, ADK, BNRC) instead.
Donate to this forum, to edit, if you do not have much in the way of discretionary funds.
This forum brings the ATC to the attention of others, possibly more than anyone anywhere.