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TomN
10-27-2014, 08:49
Looking for advice/thoughts on my White Mtns section hike next year. Was thinking July or August, I heard that earlier than that black flies can be bad? Trying the decide if I want to hammock or tent. I know tent sites are hard to find and stealth camping is easier in a hammock but I am more comfortable and warmer in a tent. How hard is it to find tent spots? I did Great Smokey Mtns National Park last year, is the difficulty level similar between those 2 sections or are the Whites a lot harder? Thanks

illabelle
10-27-2014, 09:02
I can't answer all your questions, but I can tell you for certain the Whites are a WHOLE lot harder! The Smokies are no joke, but the Whites will beat you to death.

hikernutcasey
10-27-2014, 09:05
Looking for advice/thoughts on my White Mtns section hike next year. Was thinking July or August, I heard that earlier than that black flies can be bad? Trying the decide if I want to hammock or tent. I know tent sites are hard to find and stealth camping is easier in a hammock but I am more comfortable and warmer in a tent. How hard is it to find tent spots? I did Great Smokey Mtns National Park last year, is the difficulty level similar between those 2 sections or are the Whites a lot harder? ThanksI'm also planning on doing a section of the whites next year and recently started a thread asking some of the same questions you have. I got a lot of good information and if you scroll down I posted my itinerary of what I plan to do. Here is the thread. (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/106769-Section-hiking-the-Whites)

TomN
10-27-2014, 09:19
Sweet thanks!

Cookerhiker
10-27-2014, 09:39
My experience was the black flies were miserable in early July but not afterwards. From July 15 onward, you should be fine.

The Whites are much harder than the Smokies.

The first time I hiked the Whites - Pinkham Notch south to Franconia Notch - I stayed in the Perch Shelter the first night (it's below treeline less than 1 mile on side trail) and Ethan Pond the third night. Mizpah Hut has tent platforms so you could conceivably hike Night 1 at Perch, Night 2 at Mizpah, and Night 3 in the Ethan Pond area.

Kerosene
10-27-2014, 10:54
Yep, Whites are a whole lot harder than anything else to the south. As a rule-of-thumb, you will be walking a full mile-an-hour slower than you average elsewhere (this "rule" held for me as well as thru-hikers for the most part).

If you have the option, I'd go after Labor Day when there is less chance of the afternoon thunderstorm, less rain on average, no bugs to speak of, and a lot fewer people on the trail (at least during the week). Note that trees don't start turning in earnest until October.

In my opinion, it is much easier to setup a hammock at a designated tent site than try to setup a tent on one of those platforms.

peakbagger
10-27-2014, 11:15
Yup, black files are an issue usually until mid July. The only hiking similar to the whites south of New England is Dragons Tooth in SW VA and the stretch North of Le High Gap, with much greater elevation changes. Realistically unless you are in great shape and have lots of long term hiking in rough terrain under your belt, it would be easy to get overwhelmed by the whites. Take the daily mileage you did in the smokies and cut it in half.

rafe
10-27-2014, 12:08
I'm not ashamed to say, my average walking speed in the Whites with a full pack is around 1 mile per hour.

I surprised myself a month or two back by doing 11+ miles in just under six hours (Osseo Trail) -- but that was a day hike, perfect weather, light pack and not on the AT. Osseo Trail goes up Mt. Flume, just south of the AT on Mt. Liberty.

Slo-go'en
10-27-2014, 12:49
The White Mountain section (Franconia Notch to Gorham, NH) is primarily above tree line where camping is prohibited. There are few designated tenting areas which fill up quickly during the peak season of July and August. So called "stealth sites" are far off the trail and down the side of the mountain. Yes, using a hammock is a little easier, but you still have to get down into the hardwoods which are below about 3000 feet, meaning you'll have to loose up to 2000 feet of elevation. The trails leading down off the side of the ridge line to get a possible hammock area are very steep. Down right vertical if you pick the wrong one to go down.

Because of the limitations and restrictions on camping, the best way to do this section is to pony up the big bucks and stay at the AMC huts. You can bitch about having to pay the AMC so much money all you want, but that's the way it is. And it does make the hike SO much easier. You don't have to carry a heavy pack since your main meals are supplied and you have a comfy bunk to sleep on each night. So all you need to carry is some water, snacks for lunch and some clothes.

I need to do this myself sometime. I've hiked most the AT twice and much of it 3 or more times, with the exception of NH. Of course, living here I've done a lot the AT through NH and all the major summits, but not as a point A to point B hike, due to all the restrictions and therefore have some significant gaps in the NH section.

joshuasdad
10-27-2014, 15:59
The Smokies are mostly a horse path, while the Whites are a goat path on average. While my physical scars have healed, I'm not sure that some mental scars will ever heal (e.g., descending Wildcat SOBO with night and inclement weather approaching, hail and thunder above treeline on Madison, ascending Beaver Brook trail in ice/snow...). If your only backpacking experience is the Smokies, I would definitely stick to day hikes or hut-to-hut hiking until you learn the special type of "hiking" required in the Whites. Have fun...

TomN
10-27-2014, 18:09
LOL thanks, glad you made it out alive.


The Smokies are mostly a horse path, while the Whites are a goat path on average. While my physical scars have healed, I'm not sure that some mental scars will ever heal (e.g., descending Wildcat SOBO with night and inclement weather approaching, hail and thunder above treeline on Madison, ascending Beaver Brook trail in ice/snow...). If your only backpacking experience is the Smokies, I would definitely stick to day hikes or hut-to-hut hiking until you learn the special type of "hiking" required in the Whites. Have fun...

rickb
10-27-2014, 19:44
Because of the limitations and restrictions on camping, the best way to do this section is to pony up the big bucks and stay at the AMC huts. You can bitch about having to pay the AMC so much money all you want, but that's the way it is. And it does make the hike SO much easier. You don't have to carry a heavy pack since your main meals are supplied and you have a comfy bunk to sleep on each night. So all you need to carry is some water, snacks for lunch and some clothes.

Huts are most definitely not the best way for everyone. In fact, they may be the absolute worst way to enjoy the Whites.

That said, they do have good restrooms and you should always feel most welcome (entitled in fact) to make as much or as little use of them during the day as you want. They really are for everyone, whether you stay there or not.

If you do go over to the dark side, Lakes of the Crowds is the only one offering real logistical benefits, so you wouldn't be completely insane if you elected to stay there. Still not so tough to avoid, really.

rafe
10-27-2014, 20:45
Nobody's mentioned the Hermit Lake shelters at the bottom of Tuckerman's Ravine. OK, a good ways down, but could be an alternative to staying at the Lakes of the Crowds hut.

Slo-go'en
10-27-2014, 23:35
Nobody's mentioned the Hermit Lake shelters at the bottom of Tuckerman's Ravine. OK, a good ways down, but could be an alternative to staying at the Lakes of the Crowds hut.

That would be one heck of a detour! You'd loose a good hour or two in the mourning climbing back up! And pray there is room for you when you show up at the end of the day.

Second Hand
10-27-2014, 23:47
I feel like this thread is pretty discouraging lol.
The Whites are amazing and you will love it. Bring some extra cash, give yourself time, and if you go during the summer be ready to chat with an awful lot of folks.

Prior to doing the LT this year, I was focused on knocking off NHs 48 peaks over 4,000 feet. I've spent a lot of time up there in the last 4 years and it's just a special place. I agree with rickb, even if you don't stay in the huts use them for water, BRs and to take a break.