Hammock Underquilt

[hammock engineer]

I am planning on making a down underquilt for my HH ultralight. I was reading a review of one on another site and someone was complaining about the down settling overnight causing cold spots. Has anyone else ever had this problem?

Being the engineer I am tring to over think everything before I do it. Would overstuffing each baffle with down fix this? Another option I was thinking about would be to sew in baffles across the baffles, making the space the down could move smaller causing it to shift less. I saw this in a down bed comforter. But this would cause a lot of extra sewing. I would buy a JRB one, just can't afford it yet.

[The HotDog]

Hi, I haven't heard of that problem, But, I'm sure over stuffing and sewing baffles across baffles would fix any settling problems. I too, am looking to make a underquilt instead of buying one cause of the price of the JRB underquilts. I'm sure I've found a Pattern somewhere for sewing a underquilt so if you don't already have one I might be able to dig it back up for you.
Good Luck and Keep us posted on the results.

The HotDog

[Just Jeff]

I mentioned the down shifting in my BGT review of the JRB quilts. I have since gotten the overstuff and it helps quite a bit. (JRB's quilts all come with the overstuff now.)

So yes - overstuffing will help.

There's a lighter underquilt pattern at thru-hiker.com (less than 12 oz)...check the kits and patterns link.

[hammock engineer]

Thanks for the advice. I think I will go with overstuffing to make it easier.

I found the design on thru hiker. I am planning a thru hike next year and am getting my gear together. Is 1.5 inches thick enough to keep me warm or should I go thicker. I am also planning on making a top quilt with around 3 inches of loft. I know this is something talked about on a lot of other threads.

I have slept comfortably and sweat a little into the low to mid 40's with a heavy 0 deg bag, a CCF pad, and fleece pants and shirt. I just don't like the spending 10 minutes it takes to get into a sleeping bag and onto a pad, and looking for something a little lighter.

[Just Jeff]

Depends on a lot of factors, but I wouldn't want to thru-hike in the colder temps with a 1.5" underquilt unless I had some backup.

Maybe make a 1.5" thru-hiker style underquilt, then a 1.5" JRB style one. In the colder parts, you can use both on bottom and another bag inside. When it gets warmer, send the heavy bag home and use the JRB-style one as a top quilt.

Or just bring a pad and use it in addition to the underquilt until it gets warmer.

[Nameless]

I've been looking into making an underquilt for my Hennesy, and was wondering if there was an exact pattern to be found somewhere. All I could find on thru-hiker.com (there is probably more somewhere, but I didnt see it) is that page writting how someone else made the underquilt, but there is no pattern. I pretty much need a pattern because I only have a sewing machiene avalible at my parents house, which I only occasionally get to visit. I will not be there long enough to measure out how much of everything I need, and then have it delivered then and sewn. I need to arive at home with my matierals ready to sew. I was also confused how the underquilt described on the site had thicker baffles where the person slept with their kidneys and back. If they baffeled the underquilt from side to side as it appeared they did, then wouldnt they have to stuff the whole baffle to 1.5 in, not just the part directally under them? And how cold could someone expect to be able to take this underquilt to using a WM Ultralight as a top quilt? I sleep cold, and will figure that into my own estimation, but how cold have others taken an underquilt such as this?

Thankyou
Pink

[Just Jeff]

I sleep cold, and I took an overstuffed JRB (2+") underquilt to 30 F, comfortable to ~37 F or so, with the same thickness in a top quilt. Other folks have been comfortable to mid-20s with the same set.

If you use a 1.5" underquilt, you'll likely get cold on the bottom before you get cold from the bag on top.

I don't remember the exact pattern at thru-hiker, but if you cut your baffles to different thicknesses you can get more insulation underneath you. Otherwise, just shaking it to the center can put more down in the center and less around the edges. Eventually, it will equalize and you'll have to shake it down again.

[hammock engineer]

Thanks for the info. I think I will start with 2 inches of loft and overstuff. I will have to do some backyard tests this winter and spring to find my confort level. It won't bother me to sleep with an extra layer of clothes if needed.

For a pattern I am going buy some cheap fabric and try different designs before I make the real thing. Nameless, you should be able to do this at home with a pair of scissors, then use that as a pattern when you go to your parents house. That is my plan.

[Just Jeff]

Get $1/yd ripstop nylon at Walmart for the pattern. Sometimes you can even find DWR and silnylon, but they usually have some form of ripstop.

I had extra clothes on when I hit the low with the underquilt. If you're interested:
http://www.geocities.com/jwj32542/ColdWeatherTenLakes.html

[Patrick]

Don't know if this is any help, but here's the pattern I use for my synthetic underquilt.

Sewing the darts at the side corners together helps it fit the shape of the occupied hammock.

I'm 6'1" and this size covers me well from head to foot when I'm stretched out. The finished length winds up about 80" and the width is about 48"

Also, I highly recommend sewing perimeter elastic with cord locks. It really helps the fit.

Good luck with your project and be sure to post pictures when you're done.

[Rambler]

I just finished posting over on thru-hiker.com (aka Pancho, Nov. 12) how I came up with a non-scientific pattern. Basically, I hung a piece of plastic drop cloth over a hung hammock with some weight in the hammock for shape. Then I just traced the curve of the hammock with a magic marker onto the plastic, cut out the shape, and cut off the pointed ends.
Also, since the feet and head ends are narrower than the middle, less down will go into those areas than into the middle sections where the back and kidneys will be.
I prefer the speer-type hammock with the double layer or pocket where one can slide in a pad and not worry about it slipping around. The mosquito netting can also be left off. I do wonder, however, if mosquito netting will help keep the hammock warmer by trapping a little heat or blocking a bit of wind?

[Just Jeff]

I do wonder, however, if mosquito netting will help keep the hammock warmer by trapping a little heat or blocking a bit of wind?

I can tell a difference between my HH and homemade Speer w/o the bugnet, so I think the HH bugnet does trap some heat.

If you really want a windblock for a Speer, make a DWR cover to the same specs as the Speer bugnet. Maybe put a "window" of bugnet over your head for venting. Or maybe even make the very ends sil to rebuff any windblown rain, then DWR for most of it, with a window of bugnet over your head.

Or make a Travelsock (www.imrisk.com (http://www.imrisk.com)) or a Hammock Sock (www.tothewoods.net/HomemadeGearHammockSock.html (http://www.tothewoods.net/HomemadeGearHammockSock.html)).

[reh1966]

Forgive my ignorance as I am still trying to learn all this. When you use the underquilt are you still using the pads for additional warmth and are you sleeping in a bag. I have tried the pads and a 20 degree bag and was OK down to about 34 degrees. With a little additional clothing could have made it a little more I suppose. I am still trying to test the hammock for cold weather and really appreciate all your input. Thanks.

Rex

[Just Jeff]

Rex,

Generally it's an underquilt OR a pad, but it's fine to use both when temps get too cold for one alone.

Underquilts let you roll around however you want to inside the hammock without worrying about sliding off the pad. They're also breathable so I don't worry about condensation issues like I had with CCF pads. For me, these two things make a big difference in comfort.

However, underquilts have to be fitted precisely to the hammock, whereas you can just throw a pad in the hammock and go to sleep (as long as your shoulders are covered). CCF pads are also orders of magnitude cheaper than underquilts ($15 vs $200...so one order of magnitude, I guess :) ) A CCF pad is a cheap backup/range extender for an underquilt if you're not sure about temps, and it gives you something to lay around camp on.

I'm testing a Downmat at the moment ($140), and I don't have ANY condensation issues with it, even when slightly overheated, but I still have to worry about staying on the pad. It's very comfy, though...almost as good as the underquilt, IMO.

If you're using a Speer or similar, the PeaPod looks awesome, too.

Jeff

[Patrick]

reh1966,

Sounds like you're doing great with your set-up, but since you asked...

I think you'll find that a lot of folks using underquilts are using them with no pad and with a top quilt rather than a sleeping bag.

A pad in combination with an underquilt will get you down very warm for winter camping, but either alone is probably good enough for most three-season weather.

A pad does a good insulating job by itself and it's a bargain. Target's green pad is wide enough for most and costs ten or fifteen bucks. It's also zero-maintenance, which is great. Plus, they're lighter than any quilt.

Still, it is nice not to have to deal with one inside the hammock (folding, shifting, etc) and an underquilt will probably get you down to colder temps. An underquilt also compresses smaller in your pack than a pad. And an underquilt is a very breathable and adjustable solution for when it's a bit warmer. Sleeping on a pad on the ground when it's warm out is no big deal, but when it's wrapped around you in a hammock it can get clammy.

As you've probably read, sleeping bag insulation beneath you isn't doing much because your weight is compressing it. That means the bottom of the bag is mostly just extra weight that isn't doing much for you. Add to that the complexity of dealing with getting in and out of one in a hammock and a quilt becomes a pretty good option.

Hanging in the air with a good quilt below you and another on top of you is a very nice way to spend the night.

[Patrick]

Beat me, Jeff.

[Rambler]

I just recently finished a quilt from the design at thru-hiker. Since I use a Speer I just made it sraight, so that the elastic in the middle is not on an angle. This made sewing it in much easier. When I first tried it out in the woods, there was a strong cross-wind. I could literally feel the heat the quilt held in. When I pushed it away with my hand while in the hammock, it was amazing the difference I could feel. I made a doubled layer hammock with a slot for the pad. The pad is held in place all night. An underquilt does stop the draft that comes from beneath. Even a thin underlayer in the summer has made a difference for me when I first used a Hennessy. If it is reallycold well below freezing, for me the warmest place would be on the gound over a thick pad., so in cold weather I would have my hammock low as possiible to the ground.
To answer your question about shifting down, I made a sleeping bag that has gotten me down to +10 from the plans on thru-hiker. I did put more down where I thought the down would be ontop, and it has not shifted noticeably, if at all. It really lofts quickly, too. A few years back I made a quilt from patterns at thru-hiker, and someone then suggested putting in horizontal as well as vertical baffles. I do not remember how I did it, but I do not remember it being too complicated, just took more time. One benefit was enjoyed when a mouse in a shelter gnawed a hole in the quilt while I slept in a NH shelter one fall. He only took the down from one small square! The quilt was not made quite wide enough. It kept slipping off my shoulders, so I joined the edges with a piece of nylon and I also added a strip of material to help hold the pad in place. It works great both on the ground and in my hammock.
By chance with my hommade sleeping bag, I found it is great to have a bag that is more warmly rated than the air temps one sleeps in. This is in the fall (now!) when there is a definite chill in the air. Staying warm without having to put on a lot of extra clothes makes for a much more comfortable sleep. I am better rested and have more energy in the mornings. Making one's own bag probably saves around $100, but that does not include the time spent on the project. The hardest part was trying to figure out the measurements for the pattern.
Over on the hammock message board at Yahoo, someone named Coy has a photo of himself in a hammock enclosed in what looks like a sleeping bag with the hammock coming right out of an opening in the circular bottom of the bag. It looks like something that would work with a modified sleeping bag. Check it out if you can!

[hammock engineer]

For those of you that have made underquilts for the HH, did you put a slit in the bottom for the enterence? I am seeing 2 basic designs, one with and the other without. I think I saw on Jeff's site that he did not put it in, but I saw on other sites that they did have it.

What are some of your experiences with both? I am thinking about not putting it in. This way it would be easier to make and easier to use as a top quilt when the weather got warmer.

Also where is everyone ordering down? I found the thru hiker down, but it is a little expensive. I found a site that sells 5 pounds of 800 fill, but it is $300 plus shipping. That would put it around $4/oz, which is a lot better deal. But it will leave me with a lot extra. Maybe that is just a sign that I need to make a sleeping bag.

[Just Jeff]

I got my 900fp down from www.speerhammocks.com (http://www.speerhammocks.com).

I haven't had any problems using an underquilt without a slit. Using shockcord allows me to push it aside to enter the hammock, and it pops right back into place.

The slit does help me get a good fit by holding the quilt tighter to the hammock at that part, though, and I really like the head slit in the No Sniveller because I can wear it as a poncho.

Leaving the slit out would make it much easier to sew, though.

[Patrick]

No slit here. Getting in and out is still a no-brainer and it's simpler to sew and probably a bit lighter.