View Full Version : Bear Spray for AT thru hike
yay or nay? What about a small stun gun? I am a 5 foot, 100 pound woman hiking alone. Am I making myself paranoid? Pepper spray? I also have a load horn (small), a bear bell, PLB, and cell phone. I don't want to be neurotic but I don't want to be stupid either. Need advice...
Sarcasm the elf
01-20-2015, 19:50
The cell phone is by far the best item that you mentioned. The A.T. is a heavily traveled trail and most people don't carry a PLB, though if you're hiking alone then I wouldn't fault you for it, especially if it helps you or someone at home sleep better at night.
Bear spray is a personal choice. There really isn't much of a need to carry it for bears on the East coast and the vast majority of hikers don't, but it's your call.
Bear bells are useless, the manufacturers have never offered any evidence that they work and the expert advice i've seen os of the opinion that the bears don't seem to notice them either way.
Cross the stun gun right off the list, it will just get you into legal trouble.
The air horn certainly would be fun to use as an early morning wake up call those occasional hikers that hiked into camp at 1:00am and made a huge racket :D
no matter what you choose, have fun!
puffturtle
01-20-2015, 19:56
I only saw 2 bears on the entire AT. One in New Jersey that ran off so fast I could not get my camera out. The only up and close personal shot I got of a bear on the AT was caged in the zoo that the AT goes through at the Hudson River. If you are really worried, make noise hiking along, you won't see bear or any other wildlife as well. Worry more about crossing roads with fast traffic Puff Turtle
You have virtually no chance of getting hurt by a bear on the AT.
People do present some risk, but it is relatively small. If you decide to carry something for self defense and elect to go with pepper spray, make sure you buy the same quality as used by law enforcement.
This company is said to have good stuff
http://www.foxlabs.com/products/pepper-spray.html
A good gun shop (or your friendly police officer) would be a good place to ask and to get something that makes sense.
You are more likely to hurt yourself with a stun gun or bear spray than fending off a bear on the AT. Nay
You are more likely to hurt yourself with a stun gun or bear spray than fending off a bear on the AT. Nay
I can't speak to the stun gun, but the temptation to check out the claimed effects of bear/defensive spray can be hard to resist, that's for sure. :)
Bears aren't a threat to be concerned about. There are very few encounters that are dangerous. Pepper spray for other problems might be a good idea, but make sure you understand the effective range and be aware of wind speed and direction. A cell phone is certainly good for keeping in touch, but of course it won't do any good at all if you are in immediate danger. Chances are that you might see a bear and it will happen so fast that you couldn't react anyway. I have seen several while hiking and was bluff charged by a bigun in SNP - I couldn't even get my camera ready fast enough to take a pic. Just enjoy the hike and don't worry about bears.
2NewKnees
01-20-2015, 21:05
I started carrying bear spray this year and spot basically to appease my family. I've never seen a bear on the trail and have hiked a lot of miles. But peace of mind for me and them is good when you're hiking alone. My best friend thru hiked in '96 and saw several bears in the Smokies and SNP. Mostly off the trail in a tree or running away he said.
Sarcasm the elf
01-20-2015, 21:17
I can't speak to the stun gun, but the temptation to check out the claimed effects of bear/defensive spray can be hard to resist, that's for sure. :)
I feel like there's more to that story than you're letting on.:cool:
GoldenBear
01-20-2015, 21:49
IMHO, bear spray on the A.T. would be close to the most useless piece of equipment you could have.
Fatal attacks by wild black bears in the Eastern U.S. are far less common than deaths by tasers -- the ratio is about 120 to 1.
http://electronicvillage.blogspot.com/2009/05/taser-related-deaths-in-united-states.html
The reason is simple: black bears in the wild almost invariably run from people. All four of the ones I've seen on The Trail were gone before I could even get my camera out of its pouch.
The other stuff is personal taste.
But bear spray in the Eastern U.S. is simply wasting money.
sparky2000
01-20-2015, 22:05
One biker carried bear spray for dogs. She triggered it in her enclosed tent. She kept carring the spray.
The ole saying - if ur ready it won't happen.
rock steady
01-20-2015, 22:13
PM me if you want to.I agree with forget stun gun:accuracy is not there and no way to re-load quickly. The pepper spray is a good idea if you are aware of your surroundings and wind direction. IMHO 'bear' spray is not worth the expense,weight, or hassle. Your pepper spray should be oleoresin capsicum 5% or 10% but no mixture with tear gas, riot gas or CS gas. Gas goes all over the place while the pepper spray is more like a stream. Practice with it. prepare yourself by deciding when you will use it and how. Pepper spray is really,really good stuff. Good hiking and God bless.
Starchild
01-20-2015, 22:50
I do not think you will need either. If you want a 'security blanket' you might consider a personal defense pepper spray (much lighter and 'may' work on bears), but the chances of you needing it on a AT Thru, even as a threat, are about exactly zero. The AT forms a community on the thru and does look out for each other. You most likely are more at risk sitting at home typing this of attack then on the trail.
I am a 5'2' female who saw 14 bears while hiking the SNP. I did not have bear spray and would never carry it on the A.T. (I WOULD carry it if backpacking out west!). The A.T. bears run from you like deer in Michigan. (What is funny is the deer in SNP just sit there and look at you!).
I have thought of taking pepper spray; however, I am not sure I would be aware of the wind direction in an emergency, which could result in my spraying myself. For this reason, I have opted to not carry it.
Bear bells make many hikers giggle when someone walks by.... it is definitely entertaining, but not to the bears!
Good luck!
Odd Man Out
01-21-2015, 01:23
IMHO, bear spray on the A.T. would be close to the most useless piece of equipment you could have.
Fatal attacks by wild black bears in the Eastern U.S. are far less common than deaths by tasers -- the ratio is about 120 to 1.
http://electronicvillage.blogspot.com/2009/05/taser-related-deaths-in-united-states.html
The reason is simple: black bears in the wild almost invariably run from people. All four of the ones I've seen on The Trail were gone before I could even get my camera out of its pouch.
The other stuff is personal taste.
But bear spray in the Eastern U.S. is simply wasting money.
Interesting link there GB. But I think you underestimated. If you count just the deaths in the AT states, I come up with 11 taser deaths per year and 0.0434 bear deaths per year for a 250/1 ratio!
Don't bring anything you listed. Be smart in camp. Cook away from your sleeping area. Clean up before bed. Hang your food. Most bears will run away. I have had to give a couple some encouragement by shouting and banging my poles together.
takethisbread
01-21-2015, 05:21
yay or nay? What about a small stun gun? I am a 5 foot, 100 pound woman hiking alone. Am I making myself paranoid? Pepper spray? I also have a load horn (small), a bear bell, PLB, and cell phone. I don't want to be neurotic but I don't want to be stupid either. Need advice...
1. No you don't want to take it.
2. If you leave April 1 or so you will not be alone
3. Cell phone yes! The other stuff is a waste
4. No chance to bring a stun gun.
I hiked the trail with 5' 100lb woman and she was always safe. There is a greater danger to you walking down main st of your hometown. Yes there are bears, I saw a dozen at least. They are afraid of you so long as you don't provoke it.
Good luck!!!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I carried bear spray on my first section hike, but there after left it at home. Weighed the risk versus the weight and just didn't seem worth it. We were however hiking the AT in late June, and there are far less people on the trail then. If you're hiking within the "bubble", I really wouldn't worry. Hikers seem to take care of each other.
What is that old joke about identifying bear scat? Smells like pepper and has bells in it..
Offshore
01-21-2015, 08:03
Pepper spray is illegal to possess in NJ in an amount over 3/4 of a fluid ounce.
daddytwosticks
01-21-2015, 08:13
Not to change the subject or get you more scared...you probably are at more risk from lightning strikes, hypothermia, heat stroke, bee stings, etc. :)
Lone Wolf
01-21-2015, 08:32
yay or nay? What about a small stun gun? I am a 5 foot, 100 pound woman hiking alone. Am I making myself paranoid? Pepper spray? I also have a load horn (small), a bear bell, PLB, and cell phone. I don't want to be neurotic but I don't want to be stupid either. Need advice...
you need to worry about defending yourself against humans, not bears
semicolon
01-21-2015, 09:03
you need to worry about defending yourself against humans, not bears
+1
I recommend this book.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0899972640/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Enjoy your hike!
peakbagger
01-21-2015, 09:30
Spend you money on Pemetherin and keeping an eye out for ticks, if paranoid get a script for doxycycline and take it when you find a tick latched in. Tick borne diseases, like Lyme's disease have a much higher chance of injuring you. The biggest issue with bears in the east will be at established campsites where there are plenty of people around and unless you are carrying a gun and kill the bear, spray and or a stun gun will not stop a bear or even scare it away.
saltysack
01-21-2015, 11:19
you need to worry about defending yourself against humans, not bears
Take a self defense class.....its lighter....[emoji1]
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
the only thing on your list worth bringing is the phone
Lakota6420
01-21-2015, 11:58
Always to be safe
Rain Man
01-21-2015, 12:17
Interesting link there GB. But I think you underestimated. If you count just the deaths in the AT states, I come up with 11 taser deaths per year and 0.0434 bear deaths per year for a 250/1 ratio!
Yeah, the facts simply don't add up to being "neurotic" about bears or snakes, even the two-legged kind, any more than in every day life.
Not to change the subject or get you more scared...you probably are at more risk from lightning strikes, hypothermia, heat stroke, bee stings, etc. :)
Again, agreed that there are far greater (still miniscule) dangers than bears and humans. In fact, the smaller the critter, the greater the actual danger. Gnats, mosquitoes, bacteria, and viruses are actual problems for every hiker.
Spend your money on Pemetherin and keeping an eye out for ticks....
Agreed. Far better advice on the continuum of actual concerns than bears or humans.
the only thing on your list worth bringing is the phone
Hit the nail on the head!
Rain Man
.
shakey_snake
01-22-2015, 02:00
I wear a bandana with The American Flag on it. The Bears know.
The ticks only respond to the permethrin, though.
ny breakfast
01-22-2015, 07:46
bear spray on a threw hike i wouldn't, very rare you would every need it.there's many people out on the trail during the threw hiker season. that being said i do carry bear spray with me on select solo backpacking trips, and get judged for it, to each there own. i would not carry it during hiker bubble it's not worth the weight. the only time i ever came across a bear was in Maryland and was about 10 ft away from me night hiking and just ran off. there was only one time i used my bear spray and i was glad to have it on me. i was on a rail trail with a river on one side and a canal on the other side. this person coming at me had 2 dogs one going crazy and the other coming at me only to realize not a dog, but rabid racoon. lets just say it got the bear spray and went for water instead of me or the dog and it's owner. The dog and it's owner was very thankful and so was i. still i don't carry it much on high traffic trails such as the AT and if i do it's for 100 miles or so at a time not 2180 miles
I have had many encounters w bears on AT in Ga and NC and have never been threatened. In all cases they watched me closely as I did them. Bear spray is heavy and not necessary. Better to be prepared not to panic and to be cautious. I walked up on a cub on the mountain top north of Hogpen Gap. I was alone and soon discovered mama bear about 30 feet from the cub. Mama stood up and stared at me as I slowly walked away, keeping her in the corner of my vision. I didn't stare at her, which would have been a threat to her and her cub. .She never chased me nor did she follow me. 30 years earlier had a similar experience on top of Mt Leconte. You will see bears so be prepared. Never threaten them and don't run from them. They can run up a tree faster than you can run downhill. Forget the spray.
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misterfloyd
01-22-2015, 09:36
Regarding bears,
I'm a Chicago Bears fan, and always when I hike I have that on as a dew rag. I think I have had no problems because they may recognize me as my own :) Either that or the stink on me
Bear bells, I promised my daughter when I started hiking that I would put one on my trekking pole because she was concerned. From Springer to Damascus, I have seen the back end of two running away. Didn't see any going through the GSMNP but saw PLENTY of fresh scat going around blind corners.
I do large sections in the June, and there have been times I had not seen people for 3 days. I know that really was amazing. As a musician my bell helps me keep a beat, and a pace. If it is annoying it is doing its job!
Not certain I will use it fro a large section from Damascus to.......this June.
My two cents
Floyd
Some of the more Liberal Nanny states don't allow a woman to carry self defense items such as a taser or spray.
If you want to carry a small spray for excellent defense look into Cold Steel Inferno - comes in a small canister and is BRUTAL. Its an orange foam that sticks to skin, ive had it tried on myself when I got it for the wife - before she started to CCL - It's PAINFUL and lasts for hours and hours without vinegar water or a certain type of saline diluent. The small canister is legal most everywhere, and is all you will need.
Traveler
01-22-2015, 10:16
Some of the more Liberal Nanny states don't allow a woman to carry self defense items such as a taser or spray.
If you want to carry a small spray for excellent defense look into Cold Steel Inferno - comes in a small canister and is BRUTAL. Its an orange foam that sticks to skin, ive had it tried on myself when I got it for the wife - before she started to CCL - It's PAINFUL and lasts for hours and hours without vinegar water or a certain type of saline diluent. The small canister is legal most everywhere, and is all you will need.
How did it work on the wife? :D
Sarcasm the elf
01-22-2015, 10:20
Some of the more Liberal Nanny states don't allow a woman to carry self defense items such as a taser or spray.
If you want to carry a small spray for excellent defense look into Cold Steel Inferno - comes in a small canister and is BRUTAL. Its an orange foam that sticks to skin, ive had it tried on myself when I got it for the wife - before she started to CCL - It's PAINFUL and lasts for hours and hours without vinegar water or a certain type of saline diluent. The small canister is legal most everywhere, and is all you will need.
It looks like you are in Massachusetts. Do you happen to know the legal status of pepper spray in your state? I know that it had been a felony to carry without a state issued permit a few years back, however I heard that may have changed recently. Would be interested to hear what the current status is.
Traveler
01-22-2015, 12:34
It looks like you are in Massachusetts. Do you happen to know the legal status of pepper spray in your state? I know that it had been a felony to carry without a state issued permit a few years back, however I heard that may have changed recently. Would be interested to hear what the current status is.
MA State law for carrying self defense spray changed last September. People no longer have to obtain a permit to purchase or carry human self defense sprays, however they are only available through licensed firearms dealers. Animal defense sprays I don't believe were included in that old rule, which is moot at this point. Animal defense sprays can be purchased on-line and presumably sold in sporting goods spray, but do not have the same strength as human repellants.
CarlZ993
01-22-2015, 12:38
Bear spray outside of Grizzly country? I'd say no in almost all circumstances. A 'maybe' in locations where the bears are not fearful of humans (i.e. Yosemite) & you wish some peace of mind (I still wouldn't personally carry even then). Along the AT? Definitely no if it is for bears. For humans? 'Maybe' if you think pepper spray would put you or your loves ones at ease. Just remember, pepper spray is not 100% effective. I've seen pepper spray used on people who continued to fight (I'm a retired cop).
Stun gun? Nope. I'm not familiar w/ the civilian stun guns. The police stun guns work pretty good on people (I have been 'zapped' in training before). Taser makes a gun for animals. In a training video, they dropped a huge bull like a rock. After the 5-sec cycle, the bull got up & charged the gate the shooter was behind. Rammed it pretty hard. I wonder if a bear would do the same.
PBL? Maybe. I've carried a SPOT on almost all of my hikes to keep the wife & family members worry free. Highly unlikely that it is needed for your hike. But, you never know. I've had to send an 'SOS' message once in NZ when I came upon a bad motorcycle accident in the middle of nowhere (no cell service). It was nice to have the capability to summon help.
Bear bells? No. Waste of weight & they get irritating after a while (used them in Grizzly country before).
Phone? Yep. Hardly saw anyone w/o a phone on the AT.
Note: I hiked w/ a female who was small. She was scared severely by a crazy guy she met on the trail in NJ ("Lucifer" was his trail name) while hiking alone. She had seen this guy in a hostel a few days prior (he was kicked out of the shelter for basically acting crazy). The guy was hiking with his big dog. She thought she heard the guy say something like "let's get her." She took off running & hid in the bushes off the trail. She grabbed her small container of pepper spray, grabbed her whistle, & phone me on her cell phone (I was a few minutes behind her but didn't get the call). She stayed hidden on the trail even after the guy walked by. When I came upon her, she came out of the bushes & told me what had happened. I told her that it was possible that she misunderstood what he said. We continued northbound on the trail. I told her that if we saw him on the trail that we would just calmly walk by him. If there was any confrontation, I'd deal with him while she kept the dog off of me. We met up with him on the trail. Some casual comments were passed between he & I. We passed w/o incident. We never saw him again. We did meet a Ridgerunner later that day & told him about the guy. He had received a call about him from someone else & was walking back to find him.
It really impressed upon me how much this incident terrified her. She rarely hiked solo for the rest of her thru-hike. She hiked with other guy or in a group (usually not me; I couldn't keep up w/ her; she'd team up w/ someone faster).
I was 54 and a male when I hiked half and carried a one oz. bear spray. I just felt safe as I walked from late Aug. To Nov. and was alone most of the trip. I was more concerened about crazy people than crazy bears.
goodtime
01-22-2015, 16:46
IMHO:
Bear Spray is a must for Grizzly Bears on all trails in Wyoming and Montana even on high traffic trails near roads and in non-bear like habitat! Fatal bear attacks in WY and MT are dramatically rising in the last ten years. It is totally un-necessary on the AT for black bears. Bear encounters in the east are 99,9999999% non-threatening, even when there are cubs involved, if you find yourself in situation with eastern black bear simply follow common bear-sense. Never approach bears to take pictures it is simply poor etiquette unless you have a hunting permit and are going to kill it.
trailblaser
01-22-2015, 16:54
i totally agree with the elf.....just have fun and not ruin it with fear
goodtime
01-22-2015, 17:05
Bear bells? No. Waste of weight & they get irritating after a while (used them in Grizzly country before).
CarlZ993, we call them "dinner bells" LOL
strogiyogi
01-30-2015, 15:02
We didn't carry anything on our thru and didn't see a single bear. If I were to hike alone I would carry pepper spray, but not to protect from bears (to protect from the humanoids!). Safe travels!
I carry a knife and a small can of police issue OC spray. The most dangerous animal on the trail is a human.
That being said, I've only ever met one shady person in 3 years on the trail.
IMHO:
Bear Spray is a must for Grizzly Bears on all trails in Wyoming and Montana even on high traffic trails near roads and in non-bear like habitat! Fatal bear attacks in WY and MT are dramatically rising in the last ten years...
Just to keep things in perspective, there has been an average of less than one person killed per year by grizzlies in the United States over the last ten years. In 2011 alone, 41 people were killed by falling televisions.
Bear spray is the last thing I'd carry on the AT.
Walkintom
01-30-2015, 19:58
Bear spray is really not necessary and I'd not worry overly much about the humans either. Most hikers will give you the shirt off their back. Mind you, it will be sweaty and stink but they'd give it up if they thought you needed it.
On our 2013 AT hike we saw well over a dozen bears and all but two ran away immediately. One of the remainders stopped 40 feet off trail and peered myopically at us until I got bored banging my sticks and shouting. I'm sure he thought we couldn't see him. The other was a bit more worrisome as it was just 20 feet off the trail in NJ and absolutely unwilling to move - too busy eating blueberries. Both ears were tagged. After ten minutes of making noise it grudgingly shifted about a foot and went back to eating. We hustled by nervously and were completely ignored, just like when we were trying to scare him off. Never a sign of aggression, just too busy eating to pay us any mind. From the way he peered around, I'd bet he was near sighted, even for the species.
goodtime
01-30-2015, 20:42
Just to keep things in perspective, there has been an average of less than one person killed per year by grizzlies in the United States over the last ten years. In 2011 alone, 41 people were killed by falling televisions. Not correct in the west, more than 6 people killed last year by bears. Don't know about TVs though I don't watch them. I agree with you bear spray not necessary on AT
Not correct in the west, more than 6 people killed last year by bears. Don't know about TVs though I don't watch them. I agree with you bear spray not necessary on AT
Here's my quote you were referring to: Just to keep things in perspective, there has been an average of less than one person killed per year by grizzlies in the United States over the last ten years. In 2011 alone, 41 people were killed by falling televisions.
Wikipedia shows the bear stats are accurate as written. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_bear_attacks_in_North_America) By my count there were nine fatal grizzly attacks in the entire U.S. 2004-2014. That's eleven years.
Here are the falling television stats (http://theweek.com/articles/469421/shocking-number-deaths-caused-by-falling-tvs).
Sarcasm the elf
01-30-2015, 22:14
Here's my quote you were referring to: Just to keep things in perspective, there has been an average of less than one person killed per year by grizzlies in the United States over the last ten years. In 2011 alone, 41 people were killed by falling televisions.
Wikipedia shows the bear stats are accurate as written. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_bear_attacks_in_North_America) By my count there were nine fatal grizzly attacks in the entire U.S. 2004-2014. That's eleven years.
Here are the falling television stats (http://theweek.com/articles/469421/shocking-number-deaths-caused-by-falling-tvs).
Should I carry television spray then?
Fireonwindcsr
01-31-2015, 00:39
At 6'6" 285 lbs..... I've been accused of being as big as a bear. Please don't spray, shoot, or startle me. I'm an old bear..... doing Ga to Maine. I may be cay yin a Pic-A-Nic basket
bear spray, I say no. I had a bear come by my tent at the Priest shelter, over a dozen people there. The bear wanted me. I carried fire crackers and lit off 2 and the bear ran away. ONLY he came back to kiss me later. I packed up and took off. The folks at the shelter were irritated I set off the fire crackers and said there was no bear. THEY were sleeping. It was a night I do not want to repeat.
It is like flying the risk is so low you do not need to worry, however, planes fall out of the sky and the folks in them seldom survive. Bears seldom attack but when they do they eat you alive ripping the muscles off your legs while you simply scream. If you cannot live with the possibly of this happening best have some kind of fall back plan. In the states with legal bear chase and hunting you should fear little, these bears spook with any noise. In states that do not have hunting the bears get old and unable to feed themselves so they can see you as a food source. The parks for sure.
Sheriff Cougar
02-02-2015, 21:53
i totally agree with the elf.....just have fun and not ruin it with fear
I don't know of anyone who is afraid when they have their 'bear spray, gun, mace, etc. That is why they carry it.
MuddyWaters
02-02-2015, 21:59
bear spray, I say no. I had a bear come by my tent at the Priest shelter, over a dozen people there. The bear wanted me. I carried fire crackers and lit off 2 and the bear ran away. ONLY he came back to kiss me later. I packed up and took off. The folks at the shelter were irritated I set off the fire crackers and said there was no bear. THEY were sleeping. It was a night I do not want to repeat.
It is like flying the risk is so low you do not need to worry, however, planes fall out of the sky and the folks in them seldom survive. Bears seldom attack but when they do they eat you alive ripping the muscles off your legs while you simply scream. If you cannot live with the possibly of this happening best have some kind of fall back plan. In the states with legal bear chase and hunting you should fear little, these bears spook with any noise. In states that do not have hunting the bears get old and unable to feed themselves so they can see you as a food source. The parks for sure.
They didnt wake up when you hollered " go away bear"??
Bears dont see people as a food source. They dont know they can eat us. We like to keep it that way so we kill the ones that discover that little secret, or attempt it anyway.
The problem with mace, guns or bear spray is the laws differ where you are, for example, the AT passes thru several states, more counties and more townships, plus national parks and state parks, etc. all of which have applicable laws, different laws.
This is how you can get to be a felon.
Left Hand
02-02-2015, 22:56
Um...no. None of them (except for the phone for town use).
I've been hiking the AT since the early 70's. Have come to the conclusion that Lone Wolf is correct. Humans are the biggest danger and they can be avoided. Carrying a weapon is just a waste of weight., plus uncomfortable keeping in any place that can allow it to be brought into action in a split second. Best to hide from any danger and that's going to be human. I carry one hiking pole. With some professional instruction that can be used with deadly force.
Sarcasm the elf
02-09-2015, 19:24
I've been hiking the AT since the early 70's. Have come to the conclusion that Lone Wolf is correct. Humans are the biggest danger and they can be avoided. Carrying a weapon is just a waste of weight., plus uncomfortable keeping in any place that can allow it to be brought into action in a split second. Best to hide from any danger and that's going to be human. I carry one hiking pole. With some professional instruction that can be used with deadly force. Hipbelt pockets are quite comfortable, both the Ruger LCP and several S&W airlight .38spl models work well for this. I generally don't carry on the A.T., but if I did, I would find one of those add on pockets made to carry cameras that has a velcro top closure and modify that to hold a small pistol.
Hipbelt pockets are quite comfortable, both the Ruger LCP and several S&W airlight .38spl models work well for this. I generally don't carry on the A.T., but if I did, I would find one of those add on pockets made to carry cameras that has a velcro top closure and modify that to hold a small pistol.
That is, if you know each and every applicable law in that specific jurisdiction: city park, county park, city or county building, federal building including post office, town, city limits, "parish" or county, or state, and, if you have a "concealed carry" permit.
Sarcasm the elf
02-09-2015, 19:44
That is, if you know each and every applicable law in that specific jurisdiction: city park, county park, city or county building, federal building including post office, town, city limits, "parish" or county, or state, and, if you have a "concealed carry" permit.
Knowing the laws is far easier to do than you may think. It's also been discussed ad nauseum on this site, so I'll just leave a link for the best resource I've found.
http://www.usacarry.com/concealed_carry_permit_reciprocity_maps.html
Nice reference.
No it isn't easy. I am a felon because of free-lance advice.
I even asked for a courtesy inspection for legal transport and carry (up to the Sacramento Gun Show) from the SF Polce Department gun range special weapons rangemaster at the gun range in Sonoma County because I was concerned about traveling thru San Francisco, were there any new laws, state laws or city or county ordinances since I last resided in California.
I passed.
In San Francisco, I protected myself with minimum force from an attampted armed car jacking.
The police confiscated the guns inside my vehicle.
The lady judge said, that looks like an assault weapon. I did not plead guilty.
No one cares. My life was ruined.
I had also checked with the NRA website, state by state, and, BATF (new name, by then) beforehand.
I had no criminal intent.
That Sacramento Gun Show is a law enforcement gun show public allowed.
I was traveling there to sell one or keep one and have the others I had collected for the purpose of destruction destroyed.
My dad was a highly honored police officer. I had no police record. No incidents. Nothing.
That's a fact: decent person became a felon.
CarlZ993
02-09-2015, 20:43
CarlZ993, we call them "dinner bells" LOL
Reminds me of the joke of what Grizzly bear scat looks like: has an odor of pepper spray & has bear bells in it. :)
barich942
02-10-2015, 21:47
Depending when you leave you won't have problums with bears. And you won't be alone. Hook up with some cool hikers and have fun.
Purchased the small pepper/mace spray dispensers for my daughters years ago. Just buy a couple of extra cans to practice with so you are aware of the effective range. Get the ones that shoot a stream and aim for the eyes nose mouth of the target with a sweeping motion. Probably wont be needed for wildlife. But as a Dad better safe than sorry. By the way using the above technique allowed one of my girls to temporarily disable a drunk out of control ex boyfriend of a close friend. They were able to safely leave the area unharmed.
bamboo bob
02-11-2015, 21:24
No No No No o
comanche8f
02-21-2015, 14:36
I will be carrying bear spray. I agree, most likely not needed, but since I am going solo, I figured why not. I don't think I am in any danger from a bear or a person, but better safe than sorry....... And my wife told me I couldn't go if I didn't carry it
I will be carrying bear spray. I agree, most likely not needed, but since I am going solo, I figured why not. I don't think I am in any danger from a bear or a person, but better safe than sorry....... And my wife told me I couldn't go if I didn't carry it
Wow, bear spray and bear canister. You are likely to get eaten by a bear due to dying on the trail from exhaustion carrying a bunch of needless weight.
comanche8f
02-21-2015, 15:31
Wow, bear spray and bear canister. You are likely to get eaten by a bear due to dying on the trail from exhaustion carrying a bunch of needless weight.
Haha, you weren't suppose to know I was carrying both. I am good on weight... for now, at least that is what I tell myself
Sarcasm the elf
02-21-2015, 15:42
I will be carrying bear spray. I agree, most likely not needed, but since I am going solo, I figured why not. I don't think I am in any danger from a bear or a person, but better safe than sorry....... And my wife told me I couldn't go if I didn't carry it
That last reason alone makes it worth it to carry the bear spray. :)
saltysack
03-02-2015, 11:01
That last reason alone makes it worth it to carry the bear spray. :)
Yep....mine made me get a Spot locator....
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Deer Hunter
03-13-2015, 20:18
This should work. :)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/03/13/grizzly-defense-former-marine-invention-could-aid-escape-from-bears/?intcmp=latestnews
Traveler
03-14-2015, 06:50
Given the source, I suspect a lot of dead, half consumed folks who smell like pepper spray.....
Sarcasm the elf
03-14-2015, 09:13
This should work. :)
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/03/13/grizzly-defense-former-marine-invention-could-aid-escape-from-bears/?intcmp=latestnews
Yes!!! Finally the advantage I need stop people from passing me on the trail! I can't wait until someone uses one of these to win the Vermont 100. :D:eek:
Not worried about it on the AT.... If I were hiking in Yellowstone, it would be different.
My AT experience? Virginia and PA: 14 bear - ran from me when they saw me!
tim.hiker
03-17-2015, 13:12
I would take bear spray for Bears and in case you run into any idiots, better to safe than sorry... :)
comanche8f
03-21-2015, 11:46
I didn't bring any, but at times I have regretted it. Hiking a few times at night, around caves, would have been nice to have. Also, sometimes in the middle of the night I have wished I had it. It may be a false sense of security, probably never even need it. Just wish at times that I had brought it. It would stay buried in my pack most of the time, but then there would be those times it would be easily accessible
BirdBrain
03-21-2015, 12:12
Personal choice. No bad choice here. Statistics favor those that don't carry it. Peace of mind favor those that need it. I carried it in NH because I fear my mother more than bears. She made me promise to carry it.
If you're lucky you'll see a few bears. I saw several on my thru-hike 2011. If you hang your food from trees you'll need the pepper spray, teaser and probably the gun, either way you'll need extra food to replace the food taken by the bear. I found that a cellphone can chill out a situation, I pretended to use one on two occasions (no cell coverage) and the human aggressor left. I think the best defense is situational awareness and willingness to walk away is the best method. I haven't found any documented instance of anyone ever being attacked by a bear on the AT, so I'll put the probability at zero.
Plus I second carrying a script for Lyme. Several of us got lyme and none of us ever saw the tick. Only way we knew was from the "bullseye rash".
BirdBrain
03-22-2015, 13:01
If you're lucky you'll see a few bears. I saw several on my thru-hike 2011. If you hang your food from trees you'll need the pepper spray, teaser and probably the gun, either way you'll need extra food to replace the food taken by the bear. I found that a cellphone can chill out a situation, I pretended to use one on two occasions (no cell coverage) and the human aggressor left. I think the best defense is situational awareness and willingness to walk away is the best method. I haven't found any documented instance of anyone ever being attacked by a bear on the AT, so I'll put the probability at zero.
I must be doing something wrong. I hang every night unless there is a bear box available. I am yet to lose food or see a bear when I hang it. Perhaps I should hang it lower or closer to the tree.
A proper PCT hang can be difficult depending upon the available trees, but it will keep the bears from getting the food. A bad hang is worse than no hang, so you are better off keeping it with you in your tent. That said, don't leave the food unattended, ever.
Bear spray is absolutely unnecessary in the east. If you are worried about humans, then focus on that. If that is the case, then certainly stay out of any US cities, where the statistical likelihood of violence is much higher.
I must be doing something wrong. I hang every night unless there is a bear box available. I am yet to lose food or see a bear when I hang it. Perhaps I should hang it lower or closer to the tree.
Yes, hanging works if there's no bears. I've yet to see a hang defeat a bear. Seen many attempts that were defeated by bears. Bear poles and wires generally work. Once a bear got a food bag from a wire. Sleeping with your food works 100% of the time unless you leave the food near the door of the open tent. The rule should be to simply never leave your good unattended. When it's in a tree it's unattended and most any bear will get it if they come around.
BirdBrain
03-23-2015, 11:54
Yes, hanging works if there's no bears. I've yet to see a hang defeat a bear. Seen many attempts that were defeated by bears. Bear poles and wires generally work. Once a bear got a food bag from a wire. Sleeping with your food works 100% of the time unless you leave the food near the door of the open tent. The rule should be to simply never leave your good unattended. When it's in a tree it's unattended and most any bear will get it if they come around.
I live in Maine. We have a few bears up here. Bears are not the issue though. I have zero worries about a bear getting into my bear hang. If a bear gets it, it was hung wrong. The real culprit is a raccoon. They are bold and smart. They will stand on your face if that will get them food. The 2nd culprit is "minibear" (squirrels). I hang in a way that bears have no hope of getting it. If you sleep with mice (in shelters), you have another thief to contend with. It can be done. You are wrong. However, I am trying to thwart the efforts of the primary threats to my food. I am not saying it is the only viable method. Sleeping with your food is a good option if done right. It has its own perils though. Ask the hiker that had a bear rip his tent down to get his food at Liberty Springs while he was in it. I am not going to be ignorant and say he did it wrong. Blanket statements are ignorant. I am saying it works if done right. I do it right. I do it in bear country. Now call me a liar if you want to persist in your ignorance.
@ BirdBain, one must learn that one's anecdotal experience isn't proof of a good method. I agree that mice, squirrels and chipmunks are the real problem. That's why I use a Ursack. I won't call you a liar because you seem to honestly believe what you're statements, but your just wrong. As proof of my position I'll refer you to all the areas where hanging has been prohibited and bear canisters are required. Why prohibit food hanging if it works? It's prohibited simply because it's been proven not to work. Perhaps a rare individual will camp a site that has proper trees with bears that don't know how to grab a bag, but the vast majority of hikers either don't know how to hang, are to lazy to hang properly or the bears know how to get the food bag either way. I believe all three occur. So, the question is should you hang or not hang the food if you're in a black bear area. The rangers in problem bear areas have spoken, 'm food bag hanging, bear canisters required'. You may think you're disagreeing with me, but you're actually disagreeing with the experience of rangers that have collectively concluded that only bear canisters work, and food hanging doesn't.
BirdBrain
03-23-2015, 13:14
The only thing that you, I, rangers, and anyone that has hiked the trail to any extent agree on is that the vast majority of hikers do not know how to do a proper hang. Improper hangs create problem bears. It is not the only thing that creates problem bears, but it is part of it. This reality has created places where people must be protected from their own inabilities, stubbornness, and ignorance. It is done to protect the bears. I begrudgingly agree with that practice when it is done because I do not want bears killed because of ignorant lazy hangers. The only place I have ever had a bear mess with me was at a spot that required my food to be in a bear box. That bear went from tent to tent waking people up all night long. I hike where bears are present. I hang my food where bears are present. I know how to do it and it works. I am not going to convince you and you are not going to convince me. I grant you that hanging food creates many problems on the trail for the hanger and everyone that follows because bears are getting trained to get free food. This problem will likely cause more restrictions. I see the logic. These restrictions are necessary to protect bears from lazy people unwilling to learn how to hang properly. It is easy to restrict hangs and solve the issue. It is impossible to force information into a closed mind and thus force them to do it right. I am passionate about this because it can be done right. I do it right where bears are around. Unfortunately all hangs are judged by the people who are too lazy to learn to do it right. I am an early riser. I am on the trail early and at camp early. I have spent as much as an hour searching for a proper place to hang. There is an easier way. Just sleep with it. I choose to hang... where I am allowed. If you could hear and believe me, you would see that I do not disagree with much of what you say. I protest the statement that it cannot be done. It can. I do it where bears are present.
I am not going to continue this debate. Those that know how to do a proper hang know what I am talking about. Besides, this does little to contribute to the OP.