first time dumb questions

[sittinguy]

Looking at starting at springer and going for 5-6 days starting April 26th. I could punk out fast, or make it to deep gap NC,, who knows, I'm shooting for Dick's creek. As it gets closer, and I have never hiked the AT, I have some dumb questions.

Is my timing for the trip OK? seasonal/distance

What to do with unwanted food? small leftovers

What to do with garbage? freeze dry pouches with food in them

Bears,, hang food and garbage everynight?

Can I just get dropped off at the approach trail, as a novice and start hiking north with no worries?

Heres the BIG question.... This plan may seem stupid, but I need honesty.

When I get dropped off, That ride is a one way trip, I'm committed ,, I have to get myself home back to Central florida. My plan is to call the nearest car rental place, somehow get them to help me get a ride/cab to them, rent a car a drive home.

Thanks, I'm have more dumb questions, but this should do for now.

[GoldenBear]

> What to do with unwanted food? small leftovers
You carry it in, you carry it out. Period.
Do NOT dump human food either in the woods, in a fire pit, or in any latrine.

> What to do with garbage? freeze dry pouches with food in them
See above comment, except change "human food" to "food containers."
Believe me, hikers do NOT want to see this on The Trail.
http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=59997
And, BTW, plastic does NOT burn in wood fires -- it melts.
So don't believe those lazy slobs who toss their plastic into the fire pit and claim, "It'll burn."

> Bears,, hang food and garbage every night?
Yes. Once a bear is taught that "human" equals "easy food," then that bear is as good as dead.
And the person who helped make that connection basically signed that bear's death warrant.
Worse, the person who has to carry out the execution is someone who did NOT become a game warden in order to kill bears.

> Can I just get dropped off at the approach trail, as a novice and start hiking north with no worries?
Depends on how you define "no worries."
Some newbies make it all the way to Katahdin. Others don't last for one day.
You'll probably fall somewhere in between.

If you plan and prepare properly, you'll likely succeed in your plan.

> My plan is to call the nearest car rental place,
> somehow get them to help me get a ride/cab to them, rent a car a drive home.

You'll have to arrange the ride to the car rental place on your own.
Not even Enterprise ("We'll pick you up") Car Rental will go all the way to a trail head.

[10-K]

Looking at starting at springer and going for 5-6 days starting April 26th. I could punk out fast, or make it to deep gap NC,, who knows, I'm shooting for Dick's creek. As it gets closer, and I have never hiked the AT, I have some dumb questions.

Is my timing for the trip OK? seasonal/distance

What to do with unwanted food? small leftovers

What to do with garbage? freeze dry pouches with food in them

Bears,, hang food and garbage everynight?

Can I just get dropped off at the approach trail, as a novice and start hiking north with no worries?

Heres the BIG question.... This plan may seem stupid, but I need honesty.

When I get dropped off, That ride is a one way trip, I'm committed ,, I have to get myself home back to Central florida. My plan is to call the nearest car rental place, somehow get them to help me get a ride/cab to them, rent a car a drive home.

Thanks, I'm have more dumb questions, but this should do for now.

As for getting home - if you make it to Dicks Creek Gap you can hitch a ride or call a shuttle from Hiawassee, go into town and get a room at a hotel, eat, and figure out the rental car situation after you clean up and rest for a few hours. I also believe there is a hostel within walking distance of Dicks Creek Gap - that would be another option.

It should be pretty trivial to figure out how to get a car and get home, I wouldn't worry about that too much.

[Walkintom]

One way rental cars tend to get pricey.

I'd suggest a bus ticket back home. You should be able to hook up with a shuttler fairly easy in most areas to get to a bus pickup.

[4eyedbuzzard]

Looking at starting at springer and going for 5-6 days starting April 26th. I could punk out fast, or make it to deep gap NC,, who knows, I'm shooting for Dick's creek. As it gets closer, and I have never hiked the AT, I have some dumb questions.

Is my timing for the trip OK? seasonal/distance Are you starting at Springer or at the Approach Trail as noted later in your post (add 9 miles, uphill, both ways;))? Given the 5 or 6 day time frame it all adds up. The difference between the two end points is some 20 miles. Roughly 64 and 83 miles respectively from Springer, but 73 and 92 adding the Approach trail. 73 miles over 6 days is 12/day. But 92 (adding the Approach) over 5 days is 18+/day. So that's a really big range. 12 miles per day may not sound like a lot, but unless you are accustomed to hiking in the mountains, it will likely be all you want and more. You want to ENJOY the hike, not push to the point of exhaustion to make an arbitrary location. FWIW, Lots of hikers struggle making 10/mpd in the beginning. Also the shelter and established campsite locations tend to dictate good stopping points for the end of a day as there is usually water available nearby, so often these kind of determine daily stopping points and mileage. The weather can also cut the number of miles you can do, especially cold rain. Plenty of place to camp along the way. You want to make camp and eat before the sun goes down. There are other places to bail along the way if needed. Old saying, "It's about the smiles, not the miles."

If you don't have a trail guide like the GATC guide, or ATC companion, or AWOL guide that shows shelters, camps, roads, water sources, etc. get one.


What to do with unwanted food? small leftovers

What to do with garbage? freeze dry pouches with food in them

Bears,, hang food and garbage everynight?Gallon ziplock for all garbage. Eat every morsel you prepare. Trash ziplock gets hung with food. So does cookware, toothbrush/toothpaste (sweet smell). See what other hikers are doing, but hanging it or bear box never hurt.


Can I just get dropped off at the approach trail, as a novice and start hiking north with no worries?Make sure you practice pitching your tent/shelter/hammock a few times first. Also practice with your stove and cooking gear. Post a gear checklist here on WB. Don't worry about all the nickle and dime comments on a few extra pounds of gear weight that you may get, but pay attention to critiques regarding warmth of sleeping bag, clothing, and items that many see as missing or totally unneeded. An extra 5 lbs of slightly heavier gear won't ruin your hike, but being unprepared to deal with cold and/or rain will.


Heres the BIG question.... This plan may seem stupid, but I need honesty.

When I get dropped off, That ride is a one way trip, I'm committed ,, I have to get myself home back to Central florida. My plan is to call the nearest car rental place, somehow get them to help me get a ride/cab to them, rent a car a drive home.

Thanks, I'm have more dumb questions, but this should do for now.Hitchhike or shuttle to nearest town when done. I don't know the area, so you are on your own on that aspect.

[MuddyWaters]

Your plan is fine, if you can manage 15 mpd or so.

Carry out whatever you bring, you seriously have to ask this ??? . there are no garbage cans along trail. Plan on any at road crossings being locked as well. Eat all your food as well. Or else please do everyone a favor and just stay off the trail.
Bring a gallon ziplock and put your trash in it. Do not cook food you dont want to eat, or more than you will eat.

Anywhere you stay in Hiawassee or other will be able to advise you on getting home. Bus works. Not hard, thousands have paved the way for you...

[sittinguy]

Thank you so much!, As for the garbage question, I just thought there would be somewhere like Neel gap where I could unload some garbage at my 1/2 way point. I always pack out my garbage when camping, but I've never camped more than 2 nights, and some of the meals I am thinking of bringing are 2 serving.

Some have mentioned getting a shuttle to get to Enterprise rental? What is this?

I am a little concerned about my sleeping bag,, Live in Florida, I have never even seen snow, and I'm 42.
What should I expect in late April for temps?
I have an Ozark Trail 30. Its kinda wimpy, but I've camped in the 40s with it and I was cold but got by. For cold temps my plan was to where my coat while sleeping, and possibly wrap up with a reflective blanket over the bag. That last part I have never tried, will it work/help?

[Lone Wolf]

woody gap and neel gap have garbage cans.

[Starchild]

Be open to opportunities and be flexible and you may be surprised. For my thru I had the big questions when to start and how to get down there also the question how to get back, but that was a long way off. Met someone who offered to drive me during her spring break, she also drove me home from Katahdin.

[sittinguy]

There we go.. Thanks

[sittinguy]

Also I am thinking of starting at the approach trail about a mile from springer on amicola park rd, not the falls.

[Lone Wolf]

Also I am thinking of starting at the approach trail about a mile from springer on amicola park rd, not the falls.

that would be USFS 42, 1 mile north of Springer Mtn.

[bigcranky]

It can be pretty cold in late April in the southern Appalachians. I would certainly be prepared for some nights around freezing or below. Heck, we had frost on our tents at Springer the first week in June several years ago.

Once you are done hiking, you can get a ride to the nearest town. From there you can get to Gainesville GA and get the bus home. Your other option is to drive yourself if possible, and then it's really easy to get back to your car and drive home. What will take you many days to walk is only a couple of hours driving.


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[sittinguy]

It said approach trail, I thought it was south of springer, my bad. I will have to rethink this. Any suggestions?

[sittinguy]

Wait a minute, I am looking at the intersection of amicaliua mt rd and amicola park rd,, looks like it is south of springer to me. Google maps has a little tree there at that intersection, and it says approach trail? I'm confused.

[Lone Wolf]

oh. when you typed 1 mile from springer i assumed you meant fs 42

[sittinguy]

Maybe a couple miles I guess. Am I correct this is south?

[Sandy of PA]

Like about 8 miles. Some starters don't even make it to Springer on the first day on the approach trail.

[illabelle]

If you don't have a trail guide like the GATC guide, or ATC companion, or AWOL guide that shows shelters, camps, roads, water sources, etc. get one.

Earlier someone made the above suggestion. I thought it was worth repeating. AWOL (www.theatguide.com) is less than $20 and absolutely worth every penny. You can also educate yourself about a lot of the basic issues by reading everything at www.appalachiantrail.org. We're happy to help, but you're going to get fragments from us, when what you need is comprehensive.

[sittinguy]

I thought it was 8 miles from amacola falls? Am I wrong?

[Lone Wolf]

it's 7.6 miles from Amicalola Lodge Road

[bigcranky]

There are a couple of road crossings between the park headquarters (where the falls are, the start of the Approach Trail), and the summit of Springer. I assume the OP is looking at one of these.

To the OP: your best bet is to start at either the park HQ, 8 miles south of Springer, or on FS42 one mile *north* of Springer (and then walk south to tag the summit then start walking north again).

[Lone Wolf]

park HQ is 8.8 miles from springer

[sittinguy]

intersection of amicaliua mt rd and amicola park rd,, looks like it is south of springer to me. Google maps has a little tree there at that intersection, and it says approach trail? I'm still confused.

If someone could look for the little tree on google maps I'm talking about, I want to make sure what I'm thinking of will work.

thanks, sorry for being such a newb

[xrayextra]

. . . I just want to second everything that 4eyedbuzzard said. GREAT POST!

[1234]

All what they said and I would like to add that in you carry food like tuna, salmon, smelly stuff, I recommend getting a odor proof bag. That way you do not call all the possums and skunks and racoons and bears in the forest to our camp sites. Most outfitters have them and !!$3 each and they will last a long time, and they will not pop open in your pack.

[ChrisJackson]

All what they said and I would like to add that in you carry food like tuna, salmon, smelly stuff, I recommend getting a odor proof bag. That way you do not call all the possums and skunks and racoons and bears in the forest to our camp sites. Most outfitters have them and !!$3 each and they will last a long time, and they will not pop open in your pack.

Good advice 1234. Made me smile as I remembered starting in ME with loads of sardines. Got to the Monson area with all these empty, smelly cans. Was terrible.

[sittinguy]

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Amicalola+Falls+State+Park+%26+Lodge/@34.6002355,-84.2223774,16z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x0:0xcf6a81f76f7c3349

I think this will show where I am talking about starting,, I think.
copy and paste it into browser maybe

[Lone Wolf]

just get to the park and have your driver head up to the lodge. just before you get to the lodge,200 yards or so, the blue blazed approach trail crosses the road. get on there and go left NOBO 7.6 miles to springer

[sittinguy]

OK,,I'm just going to start at the Falls.

[4eyedbuzzard]

OK,,I'm just going to start at the Falls.sittinguy, You NEED a map. This one (http://joomla.georgia-atclub.org/publications/GA-ATMap-Profile.pdf) from GATC's website will give you a basic idea of the Georgia routing, but it doesn't show water sources, campsites other than shelters, and so many other things. And you NEED a guidebook of some sort for that. Having one will make both your planning and hiking much easier, and SAFER. If you just show up and start hiking, you will wind up asking other hikers to see theirs, which is poor trail etiquette (many other people call it by another name - annoying). Seriously, this will be the best $10 to $20 purchase you will make.

[sittinguy]

I have the conservancy map, and data book. I will be reading them again soon.

[LittleRock]

If you're starting at Amicalola Falls and doing the approach trail, I'd plan on taking 6 days to get to Dick's Creek Gap.

I made it from Springer to Deep Gap, NC in 6 days, but I started at USFS 42 and stayed at the Springer Mtn Shelter in order to get an early start on Day 1 and hiked roughly 15 mi/day for 6 days straight.

[squeezebox]

Is it okay to put the stinky sardine cans etc in the fire to burn off the stink, and then pull them out to crush & pack them.

[GoldenBear]

> Is it okay to put the stinky sardine cans etc in the fire to burn off the stink, and then pull them out to crush & pack them?

No.
Inevitably, you'll either leave the smell of human food near a shelter or leave the cans in the fire ring.
You won't INTEND to do so when you start out, but you WILL end up doing so.

If you don't want to pack OUT stinky cans, then don't pack them IN.

[4eyedbuzzard]

Is it okay to put the stinky sardine cans etc in the fire to burn off the stink, and then pull them out to crush & pack them.


> Is it okay to put the stinky sardine cans etc in the fire to burn off the stink, and then pull them out to crush & pack them?

No.
Inevitably, you'll either leave the smell of human food near a shelter or leave the cans in the fire ring.
You won't INTEND to do so when you start out, but you WILL end up doing so.

If you don't want to pack OUT stinky cans, then don't pack them IN.Provided squeezebox pulls the cans out of the fire and packs out the cans (that now stink like smoke rather than food), as he stated, I don't see where this practice is any worse from a smell or impact standpoint than doing something ghastly like cooking food. Even an olfactory challenged critter like me can smell bacon cooking in the morning a mile away. A decent fire will completely burn any organic matter. We always leave the smell of our food and presence around shelters/camps to some degree, no matter how careful we are.

[GoldenBear]

Re-reading the question and my answer, I now realize that I was WAY too harsh.

Is it a good idea to burn out the food residue from your cans prior to hauling them away?

I now realize the answer is yes.

Would I recommend trying to do so?

Still no, as I conclude the attempt to remove charred cans from the ashes of a fire will inevitably result in the cans being left behind.


But if anyone did take the time and effort to burn out food residue AND did, indeed, remove the cans, I'd think s/he did a good thing.

So my advice would NOW be: see if you can do it. If you can, continue. If you can't, then cease to try.

[MuddyWaters]

Know what bait wildlife researchers commonly use to attract bears ?

Sardines

[4eyedbuzzard]

Know what bait wildlife researchers commonly use to attract bears ?

SardinesI didn't know that. So, I checked into it a bit, and you are right. Old stinky fish seems to be quite popular as the scent travels a long way. The typical use seems to be to let some fish rot for a couple of weeks in a container and then open it up at the baiting area. Salmon, mackerel, and sardines were mentioned. But they also listed a ton of other foods that are used and work well including hiker favorites like bacon (especially grease), peanut butter, sugary snacks, lots of berry scents, and of course, honey. BTW, I'm wasn't suggesting throwing a half eaten can of tuna (or sardines) onto the fire, just a pretty much empty can that had some minimal residue and odor. So I honestly wonder if it is better to burn it off at one time, or let it fester in one's garbage ziplock, which would produce quite an "attractive" aroma every time the bag is opened, and a more minimal scent that followed you wherever you went?

[MuddyWaters]

My point, is that a few bears in some places, like in smokies, have already learned sardines=food thru their participation in research activities.

A grad student from UT was doing bear research, and baiting traps with sardines but the bears kept getting the bait. When he showed up to bait a trap one day, there was a bear there already patiently waiting for him and the sardines. He wanted to see what would happen, so he baited the trap and stood back, and watched the bear cautiously take the bait and eat it. Then he tried several more times, with variations. Each time the bear was able to successfully get the food.

He figured that bear was too smart, so he left to go bait another trap a few miles away.

When he got to the next trap, the same bear was already there, lying down and waiting for him.

[glenlawson]

Unless you have your heart set on walking north, might I suggest starting at Dick's Creek Gap and heading south? The 8 miles from Amicalola to Springer has a lot of uphill and can be pretty intimidating. Also, if you are headed south, you are getting closer to hostels and shuttles that are typically headed into Gainesville for the bus station.

The trail seems a little more forgiving when you are headed south in terms of long uphill stretches. You have Neels Gap and the outfitter at roughly the midpoint no matter which way you go.

The biggest argument for heading north is that you will have plenty of company headed in that direction.

[Last Call]

"When he got to the next trap, the same bear was already there, lying down and waiting for him." - Hilarious!

[sittinguy]

I have to be able to say I did the approach trail, From all I have heard you guys are spooking me about how tough it is, but, I am still going to go for it. And hopefully it will be the first section hike,, next time I would start at Dick's and continue north for another section.

[bigcranky]

The Approach Trail is fine, a pleasant hike generally uphill to Springer.

It's not any tougher than the rest of Georgia. Enjoy it.

[MuddyWaters]

I have to be able to say I did the approach trail, From all I have heard you guys are spooking me about how tough it is, but, I am still going to go for it. And hopefully it will be the first section hike,, next time I would start at Dick's and continue north for another section.

Only tough , if you are in poor shape carrying too much weight.
Its the same as the rest of the southern AT, easier than the second half of GA actually, not as rocky .

You go up, you go down, very little time is spent walking on level ground. Its just a bit of shock to people that thought they were going out for a stroll like they practiced around their block.

[sittinguy]

Thankyou for the reassurance. I am on track so far. I have my pack sitting in the corner of my bedroom,, ready and waiting.
I will be packing around my neighborhood soon. People are going to call the cops, thinking I am homeless. :) That will be a new thread soon.

[Connie]

Ah, that's why we have "fancy" clothing and gear in bright colors.

If not bright colors then looking brand new.

Be well-heeled. New "stylish" hiking shoes.

In town, wear expensive brand name eyeglasses or not too dark tint expensive brand name sunglasses and an expensive but not-too-flashy watch: something conservative but money. Lenscrafters has half-off sale of reasonably famous brand names, or used to. The watch? I do not recommend a knock-off.

Looking like a military vet is not welcome: I got rid of nearly all my OD and camo.

I have a nice fisherman's stylish shirt. I have bicyclist clothing. I have a golf jacket. It all helps with the active outdoor look, for walking, depending on season and location.

It isn't easy "out and about" with a backpack.

Even a backpack, especially "camping gear" in a car is a problem.

Look "stylish" or perhaps "athletic" in a jogging outfit.

Other strategies?

I go to the reasonably nearby National Park.

I do not recommend the town park or the county park. Those are strictly for families and kids, apparently. Not for people with backpacks.

At least get off the sidewalks: dirt roads near town are better. There, you can wear old trail shoes. Jog. Walk. It looks like you are "getting in shape".

I considered gym membership; it just isn't the same.

[fastfoxengineering]

Thankyou for the reassurance. I am on track so far. I have my pack sitting in the corner of my bedroom,, ready and waiting.
I will be packing around my neighborhood soon. People are going to call the cops, thinking I am homeless. :) That will be a new thread soon.

Difference between you and I, if you were walking around in new sneakers and fancy hiking clothes with a fancy backpack where I'm from, people would definitely call the cops. To protect you from all the homeless. If you look like a thru-hiker does after 2months, people don't even blink an eye.

After one of my long hikes, I took public transportation into Boston. Needed to walk from South to North Station. During that 15 minute walk. No lie, 6 bums asked me if I was on the streets and gave me pointers for cheap booze and offered me drugs. I politely refused and kept walking.

Trail magic is a hell of a thing.

Good luck on your hike!

Connie, I'm confused by your post. Most thru-hikers I've met don't fit most of your criteria. On the AT, wearing a nice watch shouldn't be a problem. Other places, I wouldn't dare throw on anything besides a Timex. I'm not made of money, and even if I was, I wouldn't want to show I have it in an unfamiliar place.

[rock steady]

Agree with all the above! I've only hiked Springer to Chattahoochee gap (N of Low gap shelter) I took off at Jacks knob W over to Brasstown Bald.(!!only after I advised homebase where I was going and received acknowledgement msg!!) Anyway I hitched into Blairsville to the Enterprise lot and they had wheels under me in no time flat! A great company Enterprise! The hitchhiking was new--haven't hitchhiked since about 50 years ago--darn long time!
Oh, I'm only going to do about 8MPD until legs feet & ligaments are adjusted.I've been practicing on the side of Lookout Mtn.Tn,and still I needed to get used to the AT.Good hiking and God bless!