View Full Version : Bleach:water ratio - how little can I get away with?
I hope this is the appropriate place to ask as this question isn't strictly AT or camping related.
Backstory: I live in the Colorado Rockies and love to run on trails. During the summer I will try to get out for a long run at least once a week where I'll run out of water in my 50oz hydration pack before I'm finished. Typically this has meant staying close enough to town to re-fill but this summer I'd like to be able to refill my bladder on the run, so to speak, and widen the area in which I can explore without coming home.
My Idea: Since the area has clear, fast moving streams all over the place and I want to carry as little as possible I've landed on the bleach method of disinfecting water. I figure I can carry a little eye dropper of 8.25% chlorine bleach and add a drop or two to my bladder once it's filled up at a creek, wait 30 minutes and then enjoy.
Question: how little bleach can I get away with while still protecting myself from giardia? Are there other bugs that bleach doesn't kill? Is it right to say that if a source appears to be clean (i.e. clear, fast moving water at 9,000'+) less bleach can be used than if water were coming from a stagnant pool near a ranch? I knew a few people who just drink straight from the source(s) without any treatment and they claim to not have had issues but I'm a little more cautious than they are I guess haha
Thanks in advance!
Walkintom
03-09-2015, 22:20
This is an iffy subject. Lots of people will tell you that using bleach in your water won't help. Lots will tell you that it will.
I'm not honestly sure if bleach will do it or not. I was once put down for 6 days off trail by something that got by my religiously used chemical treatment and took a Z pack to clear up. I switched to filtration and have had no issues since.
Here's what I suggest: get a sawyer inline filter. It WILL work. And it won't change the taste of your water or kill the flora in your gut. Here's a link. https://sawyer.com/products/sawyer-mini-filter/
GoldenBear
03-09-2015, 23:23
http://water.epa.gov/aboutow/ogwdw/upload/2006_09_14_faq_fs_emergency-disinfection-drinkingwater-2006.pdf
Page 2 has specific instructions on how to disinfect water with household chlorine bleach.
Just note these very unambiguous words about using bleach: "somewhat effective in protecting against exposure to Giardia, but may not be effective in controlling more resistant organisms like Cryptosporidium.
Because of this, bleach is considered a "Use only if you have absolutely no other choice" option.
If you do decide to go the bleach route, also note: "The water should have a slight chlorine odor." If you don't smell chlorine in the water when you're finished, it's not ready for drinking.
garlic08
03-09-2015, 23:42
I live in the Front Range, and before I "dip and sip," I consult my map and consider the land use of what's upstream of me. If it's pristine snowpack in protected Wilderness, I go ahead and drink with no worries. If there are beaver ponds, sheep/cattle pasture, or human use I'll move on or use the Aquamira drops (chlorine dioxide) I usually carry with me. If there are abandoned mines, I just move on and won't touch it.
What I'm saying is different measures for different risks, and avoid the risks if possible.
I live in the Front Range, and before I "dip and sip," I consult my map and consider the land use of what's upstream of me. If it's pristine snowpack in protected Wilderness, I go ahead and drink with no worries. If there are beaver ponds, sheep/cattle pasture, or human use I'll move on or use the Aquamira drops (chlorine dioxide) I usually carry with me. If there are abandoned mines, I just move on and won't touch it.
What I'm saying is different measures for different risks, and avoid the risks if possible.
Interesting - is Aquamira that much more effective than bleach?
Fortunately I think the risk is low around me. Most of my longer runs take me up Buffalo Pass and into the Mt Zirkel Wilderness. There are a few streams that flow out of reservoirs (Fish Creek) and minor mining (Uranium Mine *gulp*) but most sources are spring fed or snow melt up there so I'm really just looking to cover my butt. I've drunk out of these streams untreated before but never more than a mouthful or two. I'm not really comfortable drinking liters of the stuff. I hear giardia is no fun!
squeezebox
03-10-2015, 02:55
The in-line sawyer sounds best to me. No muss no fuss no waiting. You could even get a 2nd hose, 1 with a filter, 1 without.
Hot Flash
03-10-2015, 08:39
Interesting - is Aquamira that much more effective than bleach?
Hell yes. It's what is used in most city water systems to process your drinking water. It's super lightweight, has a long shelf life, easy to use. I really like it, been using it for years and never had a problem.
garlic08
03-10-2015, 09:44
Interesting - is Aquamira that much more effective than bleach?
Fortunately I think the risk is low around me. Most of my longer runs take me up Buffalo Pass and into the Mt Zirkel Wilderness. There are a few streams that flow out of reservoirs (Fish Creek) and minor mining (Uranium Mine *gulp*) but most sources are spring fed or snow melt up there so I'm really just looking to cover my butt. I've drunk out of these streams untreated before but never more than a mouthful or two. I'm not really comfortable drinking liters of the stuff. I hear giardia is no fun!
Like Jupiter says, chlorine dioxide is commonly used in municipal systems but, I hear, the sale of Aquamira has not been approved in the US for water treatment by consumers. I like it because the chlorine odor dissipates in the time it takes to work on the nasties. I don't like to use it or any other chemical long-term, so I use it sparingly. One set lasts me several years and many thousands of miles.
I pictured Buffalo Pass when you said you ran out of Steamboat. I hiked through there on the CDT a few years ago and what a great area. I saw some exotic-looking wild sheep with ear tags in a small herd up there--any idea what those were? I met a few Basque shepherds too and that was fun--their dogs behaved just fine despite some stories I'd heard.
Dirty Harry
03-10-2015, 11:36
I've used an eye dropper on both thru hikes on the AT. just make sure the bleach is fresh. it looses it potency after a while. 2 drops per liter.
scyankee
03-10-2015, 11:53
Does the sawer do viruses? I heard that it did not
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No filter does viruses AFAIK. You'd need an incredibly small pore size. That said, I don't think viruses are a concern anywhere along the AT.
Walkintom
03-10-2015, 14:48
Katadyn makes a Virustat filter. It's only good for like 26 gallons though due to having activated carbon in it to improve water flavor. Depending on the situation that might be a great or horrid fit.
Hot Flash
03-10-2015, 16:11
Like Jupiter says, chlorine dioxide is commonly used in municipal systems but, I hear, the sale of Aquamira has not been approved in the US for water treatment by consumers. I like it because the chlorine odor dissipates in the time it takes to work on the nasties. I don't like to use it or any other chemical long-term, so I use it sparingly. One set lasts me several years and many thousands of miles.
Actually, I said it, not Jupiter, and Aquamira (EPA Reg.#9150-9-717660) is widely available for consumer use in the USA.
Also, everything is a chemical. Water is a chemical. Air is a chemical. Anything that has mass and occupies space is matter. Matter consists of particles. So, basically anything you can taste, smell, or hold consists of matter and is therefore a chemical. You are made of chemicals. Just because something is a "chemical" doesn't mean it's dangerous for you to use, breathe, or consume.
garlic08
03-10-2015, 17:29
Actually, I said it, not Jupiter, and Aquamira (EPA Reg.#9150-9-717660) is widely available for consumer use in the USA.
Also, everything is a chemical. Water is a chemical. Air is a chemical. Anything that has mass and occupies space is matter. Matter consists of particles. So, basically anything you can taste, smell, or hold consists of matter and is therefore a chemical. You are made of chemicals. Just because something is a "chemical" doesn't mean it's dangerous for you to use, breathe, or consume.
Yeah, I caught my quote error after a cup of coffee this morning. Apologies.
Years ago when I hiked the PCT, Aquamira was not available at all in CA, and sold in OR only as a "storage enhancer" or something like that. I'm glad to hear it's now approved by the EPA.
And yes, you caught me on the chemical issue. Even pure oxygen is corrosive, dangerous stuff, right? And too much water can definitely kill. heck, life itself is a fatal disease, sexually transmitted yet :).
A Steripen gets one completely out of chemicals, but has the weight penalty. I use this because I dehydrate very quickly and I can stop, Pen, and drink in minutes. Definitely not for everyone.....
abrilnicol
03-11-2015, 18:46
I filled one of those small bottles used for eye drops with basic bleach and put two drops in a single "smart water" bottle. Later on I switched to using a sawyer squeeze mini just to filter out small debris and gross stagnant pond water, especially between VA to MA. I tried to find the water sources with algae or from a spring if I could
Rolls Kanardly
03-11-2015, 19:14
http://survival.about.com "water purification with bleach" in the search window.
Just another view on the subject.
Rolls