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Wendigo
04-24-2015, 18:46
I've recently noticed on a number of thru-hiking blogs photos of hikers camping on Max Patch, atop Kinsman mountain in NH, etc. I thought camping at these locations was prohibited? While I understand the necessity of stealth camping in an emergency or due to injury and such, am I witness a new trend, i.e. "camping where I damn well please!" on the AT and other trails?

rickb
04-24-2015, 18:56
Were the trees less than 8 feet tall at the camping spot on Kinsman?

Starchild
04-24-2015, 19:00
Was camping on Max Patch a no-no?

BirdBrain
04-24-2015, 19:02
Stealth is not synonymous with illegal. The illegal areas are clearly marked in the Whites. There are radius areas around established AMC sites and tree line areas around peaks that are marked off. Sometimes the paper portion is missing. After you have seen a few of these signs the intent is obvious even without the paper. It is possible to camp legally near the peaks of many hills in NH. Some do it wrong. Many don't.

Donde
04-24-2015, 19:16
Camping is not prohibited on Max Patch

Donde
04-24-2015, 19:18
Further more there is plenty of legal camping in the Whites, I have gone through the Whites twice and both times stealth camped all but one night, without violating the rules.

BirdBrain
04-24-2015, 19:24
I believe it is possible to camp near the peak of North Kinsman legally. I am not sure. The climb up South Kinsman is very steep. I doubt there is a suitable spot in that area. The col between the Kinsmans is wooded. Not sure of that area. The point is that it is not a given that it is illegal if someone camped near a Kinsman peak.

Lone Wolf
04-24-2015, 19:47
define camping

Astro
04-24-2015, 22:11
define camping

Setting up your personal shelter: tent, tarp, hammock?

BirdBrain
04-24-2015, 22:19
Setting up your personal shelter: tent, tarp, hammock?

It's just boiling water, sleeping, and boiling water. Channeling someone.

magic_game03
04-24-2015, 23:26
define camping

Why does it not surprise me that YOU are in of a definition. You should also ask about hiking. It's a great experience that you should try, like camping.


(I suspect that you will go crying to some moderator like you always do and get this post deleted, but I will be laughing for at least a half hour!) :)

Lone Wolf
04-25-2015, 04:42
sure kid:D

bamboo bob
04-25-2015, 06:32
I had no idea I wasn't allowed to camp on Max Patch. Unless it's a storm I bet there's someone camped there every night. But in the Whites anywhere above treeline I recall as not OK. Maybe the rules changed?

rickb
04-25-2015, 07:09
Bob,

In the Whites you definitely cannot camp above treeline -- except on something like 2' of snowpack in some places. No exceptions.

Treeline is defined as where the trees are less than 8'. That is why I asked about tree height on Kinsman in the second post in this thread. That matters with respect to where on Kinsman the campsite was.

Oddly, along many of the trails in the Whites -- and even along miles of the AT -- there is no rule/law that you need to be 200' from the trail. That blanket prohibition applies in Wilderness Areas and in some other sections too, but is not across the board.

None of that has to do with practicing good LNT camping, of course. That should be followed too and people should not camp everywhere it is legal to do so. For my part, I think it is important to know the rules/laws as much to moderate my internal reaction to others legal camping choices (especially their legal choices in places I would pass on) as to guide my own decisions.

BirdBrain
04-25-2015, 10:24
define camping

I grasp your point... I think. I doubt anyone would suggest it is illegal to take a nap at 2 PM most anywhere on the trail. So at what point does napping become objectionable? It would depend on one's definition of camping. Am I close?

Slo-go'en
04-25-2015, 10:39
While camping on top of a bald maybe technically legal, it's really not a good idea to do so. It's not a place to be if a thunderstorm comes along with strong winds, heavy rain and lightning. And thunderstorms can and often do come out of seemingly nowhere in the middle of the night.

MuddyWaters
04-25-2015, 10:54
I grasp your point... I think. I doubt anyone would suggest it is illegal to take a nap at 2 PM most anywhere on the trail. So at what point does napping become objectionable? It would depend on one's definition of camping. Am I close?

If you make that assumption in Shenandoah national park, you would be wrong. Camping in shenandoah is defined as using shelter/sleeping gear at any time, day or night.

Rules get made, to combat people that try to circumvent what is supposed to be simple. I expect gsmnp to adopt snp definition one day as well.

WingedMonkey
04-25-2015, 14:15
I've recently noticed on a number of thru-hiking blogs photos of hikers camping on Max Patch,


From the Forest Service:


Max Patch sits next to the Tennessee state line in the Harmon Den area. At 4,629 feet this bald offers 360-degree vistas of Mount Mitchell to the east and Great Smoky Mountains to the southwest. An abundance of ferns and grasses blanket the bald, making it perfect for picnics. Fishing is offered at the pond past the main parking lot. Camping is prohibited at the bald.

http://www.fs.usda.gov/recarea/nfsnc/null/recarea/?recid=48620&actid=64

BirdBrain
04-25-2015, 16:50
Never been tempted to camp in places where rules prohibit it. I need to be well below the tree line to hang my food right.

peakbagger
04-25-2015, 18:49
Some folks camp down below treeline and bring a sleeping bag up above treeline to watch the stars and or sunrise.

rickb
04-25-2015, 19:18
define camping

It really runs the gamut from a responsible weekender pitching a tent at an approved and monitored site at a National Park, to some young punk sleeping in the bushes just outside of Madison Hut.

BirdBrain
04-25-2015, 19:20
Or some old bearded guy sleeping outside the Lakes of the Crowds Hut ;)

Wendigo
04-25-2015, 20:23
Yes, they were.

RockDoc
04-25-2015, 23:08
Camping freely in the woods is one of the greatest pleasures of the AT. There are very few areas where it is illegal.

Fredt4
04-27-2015, 10:29
If a hiker falls in the forest, and there's not a tree around to hear him, does he make a sound?

Only if he falls on the Spot.

JumpMaster Blaster
04-27-2015, 12:10
Just read the ATC Guide and AWOL's guide and neither say anything about NOT being allowed to camp on Max Patch. All that's metioned is no campfires allowed.

Never camped there, but would have assumed it was okay unless specified. Does this mean I have to reserach the USFS site in depth now? Not complaining, just saying that folks are probably camping on MP because nothing in their guides say NOT to.

BirdBrain
04-27-2015, 12:24
Just read the ATC Guide and AWOL's guide and neither say anything about NOT being allowed to camp on Max Patch. All that's metioned is no campfires allowed.

Never camped there, but would have assumed it was okay unless specified. Does this mean I have to reserach the USFS site in depth now? Not complaining, just saying that folks are probably camping on MP because nothing in their guides say NOT to.

That is the point of LW's quip.... I think. For some, camping means stringing up Christmas lights and putting out pink flamingos in front of the RV. For others it can mean finding a rock for a pillow. Much depends on what you intend to do at your "camp".

JumpMaster Blaster
04-27-2015, 12:44
Tent. That's all. Nothing that can't be pulled up in 5 minutes.

BirdBrain
04-27-2015, 12:50
A little common sense goes a long way. If you sleep in a spot not designated by the stewards of the trail, do so in a manner that no one can tell you were ever there. If you sleep in a spot designated by the stewards of the trail, use it as designed. If a sign says don't sleep here, don't sleep there. Usually there is a spot within walking distance where you can sleep. It is not that tough, even in the Whites.

Tennessee Viking
04-27-2015, 13:08
I only know of camping being prohibited on Roan-Round Knob and at the old Deep Gap shelter site near Mt Rogers.

JumpMaster Blaster
04-27-2015, 20:53
I know you can't camp at Bald Mtn shelter. Camping is prohibited except at certain locations between Pickle Branch & Daleville. Some shelters in AWOL's guide don't have the camping icon, but I can't tell if it's prohibited or not.

Alligator
04-27-2015, 22:12
I know you can't camp at Bald Mtn shelter. Camping is prohibited except at certain locations between Pickle Branch & Daleville. Some shelters in AWOL's guide don't have the camping icon, but I can't tell if it's prohibited or not.I'm pretty sure the camping icon just means there are usable tent spots at the site, not to indicate whether or not camping is restricted outside the shelter. A shelter on a hill in dense woods for instance would not have the icon. Sometimes there are still some tent sites available without the icon but I don't gamble on it myself. (I prefer to tent if anyone is in the shelter.)