Itinerary Review - The Whites

[bemental]

After reading through a few threads here on WB, and the relevant sections of Baltimore Jack's Resupply Guide, I have a tentative itinerary for review of my time spent in The Whites. I'm not as much worried about the resupply locations as I am the locations I'll stay in the evening, as I didn't want to assume I would be able to comfortably hike more than 10-12 miles/day.

I'll be starting my flip-flop hike along the NY/CT border, my start date being the end of May. This will give me approximately 30-40 days of hiking time before arriving in The Whites.





Date


Marker


Mileage


Landmark


Remarks




Fri 19 Jun


1745.6


13.2


Hanover, NH


Resupply: Hanover, NH




Sat 20 Jun


1758.0


12.4


Moose Mountain Shelter







Sun 21 Jun


1770.3


12.3


Fire Warden’s Campsite







Mon 22 Jun


1783.2


12.9


Ore Hill Campsite







Tue 23 Jun


1791.4


8.2


Jeffers Brook Shelter







Wed 24 Jun


1799.8


8.4


Eliza Brook Shelter


Resupply: Glencliff, NH




Thu 25 Jun


1811.3


11.5


Kinsman Pond Shelter







Fri 26 Jun


1822.5


11.2


Greenleaf Hut


Resupply: North Woodstock, NH




Sat 27 Jun


1831.9


9.4


Guyout Shelter







Sun 28 Jun


1840.9


9.0


Ethan Pond Campsite







Mon 29 Jun


1850.2


9.3


Mizpah Spring Hut







Tue 30 Jun


1860.5


10.3


Perch Shelter


Cafe atop Mt. Washington; Glen, NH (Crawford Knotch)




Wed 1 Jul


1869.8


9.3


Stealth Camping: Peabody River


ACYE @ Pinkham Notch; Resupply: Gorham, NH




Thu 2 Jul


1882.9


13.1


Imp Campsite







Fri 3 Jul


1897.5


14.6


Stealth Camping: Brook


Gorham, NH

[rickb]

Distance between Greenleaf Hut and Garfield can't be that far.

I am confused by where you listed North Woodstock resupply .

Something looks off.

[BirdBrain]

A couple of suggestions:

July 1 - Stealth at Square Ledge. Great view of Presidentials.

July 2 - Stealth at treeline just before Mt Hight peak. One of the best stealth spots in NH. Wildcats and Carter Dome will wear you out. Last day is long, but very doable with light pack.

[bemental]

In my 2015 AWOL it says you can get to North Woodstock from US 3, accessible at mile marker 1816.1; I place the town/resupply next to the day that it will be available as an FYI to myself. (i.e. on my way to Greenleaf, from Kinsman Pond, I can hit up North Woodstock for resupply if I need to).

-----

You're correct, that should read Guyout Shelter, not Garfield; thanks.

[rickb]

Jeffers Brook to Eliza Brook has to be farther. Tough miles, too.

[bemental]

You got it Rick. That's supposed to be Beaver Brook - looks like I had a few transposing errors. Here's an updated copy.





Date


Marker


Mileage


Landmark


Remarks




Fri 19 Jun


1745.6


13.2


Hanover, NH


Resupply: Hanover, NH




Sat 20 Jun


1758.0


12.4


Moose Mountain Shelter







Sun 21 Jun


1770.3


12.3


Fire Warden’s Campsite







Mon 22 Jun


1783.2


12.9


Ore Hill Campsite







Tue 23 Jun


1791.4


8.2


Jeffers Brook Shelter







Wed 24 Jun


1798.3


6.9


Beaver Brook Shelter


Resupply: Glencliff, NH




Thu 25 Jun


1811.3


13.0


Kinsman Pond Shelter







Fri 26 Jun


1822.5


11.2


Greenleaf Hut


Resupply: North Woodstock, NH




Sat 27 Jun


1831.9


9.4


Guyout Shelter







Sun 28 Jun


1840.9


9.0


Ethan Pond Campsite







Mon 29 Jun


1850.2


9.3


Mizpah Spring Hut







Tue 30 Jun


1860.5


10.3


Perch Shelter


Cafe atop Mt. Washington; Glen, NH (Crawford Knotch)




Wed 1 Jul


1869.8


9.3


Stealth Camping: Peabody River


ACYE @ Pinkham Notch; Resupply: Gorham, NH




Thu 2 Jul


1877.3


7.5


Stealth Camping: Treeline before Mt. Hight







Fri 3 Jul


1889.0


11.7


Rattle River Shelter







Sat 4 Jul


1897.5


8.5


Stealth Camping: Brook


Gorham, NH

[bemental]

Didn't see a Square Ledge in the guidebook, have a mile marker I could use to look out for it?

[Suz&Shell]

Could someone tell me how to post a question I can't seem to figure it out?... im not very hip with technology :-)

[BirdBrain]

Didn't see a Square Ledge in the guidebook, have a mile marker I could use to look out for it?

I do not have any maps or guides in front of me. It is visiable from the Pinkham Notch Visitor Center. It is a short climb directly across the road.

By the way. The walk from Rattle River to the road is about as easy as it gets. Gradually descent on a good path.

[bemental]

I do not have any maps or guides in front of me. It is visiable from the Pinkham Notch Visitor Center. It is a short climb directly across the road.

By the way. The walk from Rattle River to the road is about as easy as it gets. Gradually descent on a good path.

Might be at 1871.2 in the AWOL; stated as "View" (Pinkham Notch is at 1869.8)

I'll BOLO for it when I'm in the area, thanks for the tips.

[BirdBrain]

A couple observations on Mt Hight: Mt Hight offers the best views from the Carter Moriah Range. It is only a hundred yards to a 360° view. This is great for sunset and sunrise. It has one small issue. There is no water. Take enough water from Carter Hut to get you to the stream before Imp the next morning. The water at Zeta Pass is unreliable unless you go down the adjacent trail a ways.

[illabelle]

Could someone tell me how to post a question I can't seem to figure it out?... im not very hip with technology :-)

Click on forum at the top, then find the sub-forum for your question - General Forum works good for most stuff. Then click on post new thread at the top. Welcome to White Blaze!

[HighLiner]

I stayed at Lake on the Clouds Hut for $20 bucks and got to eat leftovers and sleep on dining room floor. Best money I ever spent. The huts on your list are expensive. Mileage wise you have made this an easy as possible trip. The Whites were the hardest hiking I have ever done! Good luck.

[bemental]

I stayed at Lake on the Clouds Hut for $20 bucks and got to eat leftovers and sleep on dining room floor. Best money I ever spent. The huts on your list are expensive. Mileage wise you have made this an easy as possible trip. The Whites were the hardest hiking I have ever done! Good luck.

I don't plan on staying at any of the huts, but the ones I have chosen have camp sites associated with them. I'm hiking with a service dog so I'm not anticipating any work for stays.


Thanks!

[BirdBrain]

The view of the Franconia Range from Beaver Brook Shelter is great for sunset and sunrise. I loved Moosilauke. The grassy dome had me searching for Heidi or Laura Ingalls.

[BirdBrain]

I need to get my maps out at home so I can make more sure comments. Kinsman Pond to Greenleaf Hut is aggressive. There are stealth spots after Garfield Campsite on the flat and before the big dip before Greenleaf. I will be able to better describe that area when I home. If you stealth in that area, it might better divide that day with the next day to Guyot. The walk to Guyot is not as tough as the Franconia and Garfield day.

[rickb]

I don't plan on staying at any of the huts, but the ones I have chosen have camp sites associated with them. I'm hiking with a service dog so I'm not anticipating any work for stays.


Thanks!


FYI, There is no camping site associated with Greenleaf.

You need to double check your milages-- Rattle River Shelter is so close to Route 2 you are virtually "done".

Not sure the spot BB is referring to, but Zeta Pass -- where a couple trail intersect below MT Hight --is a restricted use / Forest protection area. No camping at all within 1/4 mile.

[Scrum]

Beaver Brook Shelter is great, just an outstanding view from the shelter. The stretch from that shelter to your next stay at Kinsman Pond is tough. Really steep decent down into Kinsman Notch and a long, sometimes very steep climb over and down from North and South Kinsman.

You have better resupply options in Lincoln than North Woodstock. The stretch from Kinsman Pond to Greenleaf Hut is a long day, not sure how you will fit in a resupply as well.

There is no camping at the Greenleaf Hut, so make a reservation now before it is fully booked (just checked and there is still space - $127 for the night - $11 less for AMC members). You will need papers to show that your dog is a service dog not a pet.

Don’t pull into the Guyout Shelter late on a Saturday night, it may fill up if the weather is nice that weekend.

The stretch from Guyout Shelter to the Ethan Pond Shelter is relatively easy, especially the stretch from Zealand Falls to Ethan Pond. You could stretch out the day by continuing on to the Webster Cliffs where there is some good stealth camping.

Let us know how it goes.

[bemental]

FYI, There is no camping site associated with Greenleaf.

You need to double check your milages-- Rattle River Shelter is so close to Route 2 you are virtually "done".

Not sure the spot BB is referring to, but Zeta Pass -- where a couple trail intersect below MT Hight --is a restricted use / Forest protection area. No camping at all within 1/4 mile.



Beaver Brook Shelter is great, just an outstanding view from the shelter. The stretch from that shelter to your next stay at Kinsman Pond is tough. Really steep decent down into Kinsman Notch and a long, sometimes very steep climb over and down from North and South Kinsman.

You have better resupply options in Lincoln than North Woodstock. The stretch from Kinsman Pond to Greenleaf Hut is a long day, not sure how you will fit in a resupply as well.

There is no camping at the Greenleaf Hut, so make a reservation now before it is fully booked (just checked and there is still space - $127 for the night - $11 less for AMC members). You will need papers to show that your dog is a service dog not a pet.

Don’t pull into the Guyout Shelter late on a Saturday night, it may fill up if the weather is nice that weekend.

The stretch from Guyout Shelter to the Ethan Pond Shelter is relatively easy, especially the stretch from Zealand Falls to Ethan Pond. You could stretch out the day by continuing on to the Webster Cliffs where there is some good stealth camping.

Let us know how it goes.


Regarding Rattle River Shelter and being 'done', I'm thru hiking so while I'm asking for deliberate assistance with planning for this particular segment, I haven't figured out what I'm doing yet after I get out of the Whites - probably just shelter it up until I determine whether or not I'll be staying in town or not.

Replaced Greenleaf with Liberty Springs Campsite; that makes the day only around 7.5 miles which should provide me a bit of extra time to get into town for a resupply as well.

Replaced Guyout with Garfield; with the dog I specifically prefer campsites for the sake of others. No reason to take up extra space in a shelter or invade in another's space with a dog.

-----

Haven't checked yet, but are the rules about camping around shelters in the Whites the same as down at GSNP? I'm assuming yes (if the shelter isn't "FULL", you'd better be in it), but a yea/nea would be appreciated.

[bemental]

Date


Marker


Mileage


Landmark


Remarks




Fri 19 Jun


1745.6


13.2


Hanover, NH


Resupply: Hanover, NH




Sat 20 Jun


1758.0


12.4


Moose Mountain Shelter







Sun 21 Jun


1770.3


12.3


Fire Warden’s Campsite







Mon 22 Jun


1783.2


12.9


Ore Hill Campsite







Tue 23 Jun


1791.4


8.2


Jeffers Brook Shelter







Wed 24 Jun


1798.3


6.9


Beaver Brook Shelter


Resupply: Glencliff, NH




Thu 25 Jun


1811.3


13.0


Kinsman Pond Shelter







Fri 26 Jun


1818.8


7.5


Liberty Springs Campsite


Resupply: Lincoln, NH




Sat 27 Jun


1826.4


7.6


Garfield Ridge Campsite







Sun 28 Jun


1840.9


14.5


Ethan Pond Campsite







Mon 29 Jun


1850.2


9.3


Mizpah Spring Hut







Tue 30 Jun


1862.0


11.8


Madison Spring Hut


Cafe atop Mt. Washington; Glen, NH (Crawford Knotch)




Wed 1 Jul


1869.8


7.8


Stealth Camping: Square Ledge


ACYE @ Pinkham Notch; Resupply: Gorham, NH




Thu 2 Jul


1877.3


7.5


Stealth Camping: Treeline before Mt. Hight







Fri 3 Jul


1889.0


11.7


Rattle River Shelter







Sat 4 Jul


1897.5


8.5


Stealth Camping: Brook


Resupply: Gorham, NH

[BirdBrain]

FYI, There is no camping site associated with Greenleaf.

You need to double check your milages-- Rattle River Shelter is so close to Route 2 you are virtually "done".

Not sure the spot BB is referring to, but Zeta Pass -- where a couple trail intersect below MT Hight --is a restricted use / Forest protection area. No camping at all within 1/4 mile.

Correct. Zeta Pass is an illegal spot. Do not camp there. Camp legally here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFPhnlb8BEA

I agree. The last 2 miles are cake. No need for extra day.

8.5 miles from Rattle River Campsite will put you 6.5 miles into the Mahoosucs.

[bemental]

Correct. Zeta Pass is an illegal spot. Do not camp there. Camp legally here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFPhnlb8BEA

I agree. The last 2 miles are cake. No need for extra day.

8.5 miles from Rattle River Campsite will put you 6.5 miles into the Mahoosucs.

Looks great, thanks!

I see what you mean about Rattle River, will change accordingly.


Thanks again for the advice everyone.

[BirdBrain]

Date




Marker




Mileage




Landmark




Remarks






Fri 19 Jun




1745.6




13.2




Hanover, NH




Resupply: Hanover, NH






Sat 20 Jun




1758.0




12.4




Moose Mountain Shelter








Sun 21 Jun




1770.3




12.3




Fire Warden’s Campsite








Mon 22 Jun




1783.2




12.9




Ore Hill Campsite








Tue 23 Jun




1791.4




8.2




Jeffers Brook Shelter








Wed 24 Jun




1798.3




6.9




Beaver Brook Shelter




Resupply: Glencliff, NH






Thu 25 Jun




1811.3




13.0




Kinsman Pond Shelter








Fri 26 Jun




1818.8




7.5




Liberty Springs Campsite




Resupply: Lincoln, NH






Sat 27 Jun




1826.4




7.6




Garfield Ridge Campsite








Sun 28 Jun




1840.9




14.5




Ethan Pond Campsite








Mon 29 Jun




1850.2




9.3




Mizpah Spring Hut








Tue 30 Jun




1862.0




11.8




Madison Spring Hut




Cafe atop Mt. Washington; Glen, NH (Crawford Knotch)






Wed 1 Jul




1869.8




7.8




Stealth Camping: Square Ledge




ACYE @ Pinkham Notch; Resupply: Gorham, NH






Thu 2 Jul




1877.3




7.5




Stealth Camping: Treeline before Mt. Hight








Fri 3 Jul




1889.0




11.7




Rattle River Shelter








Sat 4 Jul




1897.5




8.5




Stealth Camping: Brook




Resupply: Gorham, NH





This is a good plan. The early distances are rightfully long. The terrain is manageable. Moosilauke will slow you down and Beaver Brook is a great spot. June 25 will be a long day, but doable. South Kinsman is steep. Don't miss the view point just off the trail on North Kinsman. I like your adjustments in the Pemi's. Bears can be a pain in that area. It is best to not stealth through there. It was too aggressive to go to Galehead Hut (I assume that is what you meant by Greenleaf Hut). Your plan over Washington is solid. Okay... I think I have dominated this thread enough. :D

[LoneStranger]

Garfield to Ethan Pond includes the South Twin climb and down Zealand with plenty of rocks between. There are some great stealth spots along the Whitewall Brook if you're too pooped to push on to the shelter, though it is quite easy going trail. If you drop down via the Zeacliff trail after passing the Zealand Hut there are some flat areas to the south before you reach the water. I don't advise coming straight down Zeacliff because it is pretty much straight down. LNT if you use that area because I drink from that watershed a lot :)

[Scrum]

Haven't checked yet, but are the rules about camping around shelters in the Whites the same as down at GSNP? I'm assuming yes (if the shelter isn't "FULL", you'd better be in it), but a yea/nea would be appreciated.

No - there is not requirement to occupy the shelter first nor is there any different treatment for thru/long distance hikers v. short trippers. Spaces are available on a first come basis. Note that in the Whites, there are specific designated areas for camping at many of the locations (with or without a shelter), generally on platforms and there will be a caretaker. This will be the case at Kinsman Pond, Liberty Springs, Garfield Ridge, Ethan Pond, Newman tent site (at Mizpah Spring Hut), see the list here: http://www.outdoors.org/lodging/campsites/campsites-profile.cfm

These sites can fill up, especially on the weekend, so plan to get in to them at a decent time. The caretakers do their best to squeeze everyone in, but are not always able to do it.

Also, at the caretaker locations there is an $8 per person fee at the caretaker maintained sites (the year mention of which will almost certainly take this thread off into an anti-AMC tangent).

Finally, there is no camping at the Madison Hut - You may want to shoot for the Osgood Campsite - other options listed here: http://home.earthlink.net/~ellozy/npresi.html

[Scrum]

Sorry for the typo - meant to say "the mere mention of which" to "year" - I have auto correct.

[BirdBrain]

Finally, there is no camping at the Madison Hut - You may want to shoot for the Osgood Campsite - other options listed here: http://home.earthlink.net/~ellozy/npresi.html

Good point. The original plan of stopping at Perch seems to divide the distances fairly well. There are stealth spots just below the tree line as you start down the Osgood Trail. I am not sure it is a good plan to stealth anywhere in the Presidentials though.

Gratuitous opinion on my part, but the caretakers are awesome.

[peakbagger]

There is camping at the Valley Way tentsite near Madison hut. There are two spots for tents they get heavy use and its long walk down Valley way to get to terrain suitable for camping if valley way is full. With the exception of one small steath site on Osgood Trail just after treeline (also gets a lot of use) there are no good overflow options near Madison Hut unless you go way down Osgood Trail.

[Gray Bear]

Good point. The original plan of stopping at Perch seems to divide the distances fairly well. There are stealth spots just below the tree line as you start down the Osgood Trail. I am not sure it is a good plan to stealth anywhere in the Presidentials though.

Gratuitous opinion on my part, but the caretakers are awesome.


I'm a fan of the Perch. great water close by. a little off course for a thru.

[Hangfire]

Just pouring through my battered awol guide to check all of your spots and found myself becoming nervous and full of butterflys as if I was planning this for myself. I think your plan looks pretty solid, your mileage looks very realistic, no crazy long days. Of course that being said, it's the Whites so there may be all sorts of tweaks and changes that need to be made as you go, but by this point of the trail you will be able to roll with the punches, no doubt.

Approaching the Whites on a northbound thru is like nothing I can describe, the excitement of finally getting there is off the charts! Then you start climbing up mountains...

[bemental]

Thanks Gary, I appreciate the perspective :-)