Stove for AT

[Mr Liberty]

I'm looking at doing a 2016 SOBO on the AT (~early July through late Oct) and I'd like some advice on what I should use as a stove on the AT. It seems that alcohol stoves are the by far the lightest, so that's what I'd like to use. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it also seems that yellow HEET is the easiest alcohol fuel to find (being in gas stations and whatnot) other than isopropyl. I'm not opposed to making my own stove, but I want it to be very reliable. What are some stoves (or just diy designs) recommended that burn yellow HEET or isopropyl that would be appropriate for use on the AT?


I found this stove (http://www.flatcatgear.com/shop/iso-25-stove/), which cleanly burns isopropyl alcohol, but it costs money (unlike diy stoves) so I've held off on it. Have any of you used it? Do you like it? I think if it works well and is reliable then it's the best choice as far as fuel availability goes, and weighs only 33g (1.16 oz)
(http://www.flatcatgear.com/shop/iso-25-stove/)

[BirdBrain]

The stove in this thread is a good place to start. There are better choices depending on your preferences. Keep it simple and functional to start. This stove is both.

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/111418-Identify-this-DIY-design

[Turtle-2013]

Do the math and you MIGHT find that a titanium Jetboil is lighter ... remember to add in the pot, windscreen needed with an alcohol stove, and most important the fuel requirements. I just did 5 days, Springer to Dick's Creek Gap, and used 1.2 oz of fuel. Since I used to use an alcohol stove I can tell you that for the same amount of cooking I would have used 7-8 oz of fuel. When I did the math, I found that any trip longer than 3 days I came out lighter with my titanium Jetboil than I did with my superlight alcohol stove, with a titanium kettle, and enough fuel.

[Another Kevin]

Isopropyl is a very poor choice. No alcohol stove works really well on isopropyl, partly because of the water content. 87% iso is as high as it can be distilled. Drying it further gets into some oddball chemistry. 70% is the highest you're likely to find in a drugstore. Also, it's very difficult to get the fuel-air mixture right for isopropyl, and a cheap and lightweight stove will either burn with a sooty flame or overheat.

The stove you link to is 'designed for 91% but will burn 70%.' 91% is hard to find, except for Iso-HEET, which has additives you don't want to cook with.

Yellow HEET works well, as does denatured alcohol from a hardware or paint store. If you're talking about an A-T hike, a lot of establishments in A-T trail towns stock both. Many hostels and other establishments that cater to hikers will sell denatured alcohol by the ounce. Worst case, go in with another hiker or two and get a quart of the stuff. Or if they sell it only by the gallon, go in with a larger group. If you're in a town where it's available only by the gallon and are hiking in the bubble, you'll have no trouble finding a whole bunch of other hikers with the same problem.

If simplicity is what you're after, build a Supercat. Or buy a stove from Zelph, QiWiz or one of the other cottage makers.

By no means should you start messing around with pressurized burners, capillary burners, carbon wicks and the like. You'll wind up like me and the other mad stovers on the other discussion threads, all to save a few grams of alcohol per burn. We can all post 'Confessions of an Alcohol [Stove] Addict.'

[BirdBrain]

Do the math and you MIGHT find that a titanium Jetboil is lighter ... remember to add in the pot, windscreen needed with an alcohol stove, and most important the fuel requirements. I just did 5 days, Springer to Dick's Creek Gap, and used 1.2 oz of fuel. Since I used to use an alcohol stove I can tell you that for the same amount of cooking I would have used 7-8 oz of fuel. When I did the math, I found that any trip longer than 3 days I came out lighter with my titanium Jetboil than I did with my superlight alcohol stove, with a titanium kettle, and enough fuel.

Jetboil is a great choice. However, 8 oz of fuel would last me 9 days.

[jimyjam]

Stoves and cook systems I find to be a matter of choice. My personal choice is the caldera cone system...the keg system comes with the pot and everything you need.
http://www.traildesigns.com/cone-comparison


Life is full of ups and downs! Hike on!

[Mr Liberty]

The stove in this thread is a good place to start. There are better choices depending on your preferences. Keep it simple and functional to start. This stove is both.

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/111418-Identify-this-DIY-design

Ok, I'll try making one tomorrow and see how it goes. :)


Isopropyl is a very poor choice. No alcohol stove works really well on isopropyl, partly because of the water content. 87% iso is as high as it can be distilled. Drying it further gets into some oddball chemistry. 70% is the highest you're likely to find in a drugstore. Also, it's very difficult to get the fuel-air mixture right for isopropyl, and a cheap and lightweight stove will either burn with a sooty flame or overheat.

The stove you link to is 'designed for 91% but will burn 70%.' 91% is hard to find, except for Iso-HEET, which has additives you don't want to cook with.

Yellow HEET works well, as does denatured alcohol from a hardware or paint store. If you're talking about an A-T hike, a lot of establishments in A-T trail towns stock both. Many hostels and other establishments that cater to hikers will sell denatured alcohol by the ounce. Worst case, go in with another hiker or two and get a quart of the stuff. Or if they sell it only by the gallon, go in with a larger group. If you're in a town where it's available only by the gallon and are hiking in the bubble, you'll have no trouble finding a whole bunch of other hikers with the same problem.

If simplicity is what you're after, build a Supercat. Or buy a stove from Zelph, QiWiz or one of the other cottage makers.

By no means should you start messing around with pressurized burners, capillary burners, carbon wicks and the like. You'll wind up like me and the other mad stovers on the other discussion threads, all to save a few grams of alcohol per burn. We can all post 'Confessions of an Alcohol [Stove] Addict.'

I've never seen a drugstore/walmart that sold 70% and not 91%, but it might be different along the AT... I'll trust your judgement. But basically, you're saying that (as far as the AT goes) the best alcohol fuel is either yellow HEET or denatured?

I won't be hiking the bubble, I'm doing a SOBO; hopefully I'll be able to find fuel in reasonably small quantities (I have no qualms with getting a quart for myself, just means I wouldn't have to get fuel for a while :p).

I'll look into the supercat, I've seen it mentioned several times but never took a look at it.

And haha, I think I caught a weaker version of the stovemaking virus, because I think it's quite a good time, too! :D

[Starchild]

Of fuel types on the AT, both alcohol and canisters are readily available. Quite a few hikers ended up carrying a yellow HEET bottle out of town, some carried 2 canisters with them. Part of the weight equation is how are you going to actually use it. Yes technically you may only need 8 oz, but what are you going to do with the extra 4? If you will carry it it is additional weight in your cookset.

FWIW What I really liked about the Jetboil is the smallest canister lasted so long that I didn't need to concern myself about fuel on many town resupply stops (1 small canister = over 10 liters of boiling water). That eliminated a step of searching for them.

[MuddyWaters]

I prefer alcohol because its quiet, and I know exactly how much fuel I have.
I dislike the roar of loud cannister stoves in the woods.
In a pinch its a good firestarter too, but so is a cannister stove.

It really comes down to preference. You dont need to lug a lot of weight to have a fuel efficient cannister setup. A windscreen and optimizing the heating rate (slow it down) will cut the fuel usage. For some reason people are in a huge hurry to boil water in the woods....baffles me. One or two or 5 minutes is inconsequential unless too many people are sharing the same stove.

[BirdBrain]

I prefer alcohol because its quiet, and I know exactly how much fuel I have.
I dislike the roar of loud cannister stoves in the woods.
In a pinch its a good firestarter too, but so is a cannister stove.

It really comes down to preference. You dont need to lug a lot of weight to have a fuel efficient cannister setup. A windscreen and optimizing the heating rate (slow it down) will cut the fuel usage. For some reason people are in a huge hurry to boil water in the woods....baffles me. One or two or 5 minutes is inconsequential unless too many people are sharing the same stove.

Agreed. I like the way you express the noise thing. To me the noise just seems unnatural. I like the simplicity of an alcohol stove. Carrying something with O-rings and threads makes me feel like I am lugging a machine. I guess that explains my aversion to electronics too. I agree with the time issue as well. How can saving 2 minutes on a boil time possibly matter.

Once I got by your ridiculously low pack weight, I can see how much I agree with you way of thinking. Now I am paying attention. I will not go as low as you. However, I will glean rather than doubt.

[bemental]

I prefer alcohol because its quiet, and I know exactly how much fuel I have.
I dislike the roar of loud cannister stoves in the woods.
In a pinch its a good firestarter too, but so is a cannister stove.

It really comes down to preference. You dont need to lug a lot of weight to have a fuel efficient cannister setup. A windscreen and optimizing the heating rate (slow it down) will cut the fuel usage. For some reason people are in a huge hurry to boil water in the woods....baffles me. One or two or 5 minutes is inconsequential unless too many people are sharing the same stove.


Agreed. I like the way you express the noise thing. To me the noise just seems unnatural. I like the simplicity of an alcohol stove. Carrying something with O-rings and threads makes me feel like I am lugging a machine. I guess that explains my aversion to electronics too. I agree with the time issue as well. How can saving 2 minutes on a boil time possibly matter.

Once I got by your ridiculously low pack weight, I can see how much I agree with you way of thinking. Now I am paying attention. I will not go as low as you. However, I will glean rather than doubt.

Wish I would have met you guys sooner.

Just got out of the military and I carried a Jetboil there out of conveniences sake, same reason I use it on the trail.

It agree about the noise, the machine-like nature, the timing and speed. But you still can't beat the Jetboil's convenience factor (you sure can beat it's weight though).

[fastfoxengineering]

I agree with BirdBrain and MW.

My favorite stove now is my ti-tri... alcohol and wood. i'll never go back to a canister unless fire restrictions call for it

[Mr Liberty]

Ok, good to know about the fuel availability as far as the AT goes.

I'd still like to stick with alcohol, however, because I'd like to be able to use this stove on other trips (not on the AT). I still think I like the flat cat gear Multi-Fuel 2.5 stove best, because I can use isopropyl if I have to with it (it also accepts HEET and pretty much any other fuel you can think of). Does anyone have any experience with it (or previous versions)?

[Don H]

When I section hike I carry a Zen Chimney alcohol stove. http://zenstoves.net/Stoves.htm

When I thrued I started off with the alcohol stove but switched to a MSR Pocket Rocket canister stove. It just seemed faster and easier to set up and use.

With both stoves I used a Snowpeak 600 ml Ti cup as a pot.

[Billiard Yeti]

I love my fancy feast stove. It weighs just under an ounce. Boils 2 cups in 6 - 8 minutes. Lights easy with no priming. Has a built in pot stand. All you need is a wind screen and maybe a vapor barrier (but you need them for all alcohol stoves). And you can get a simmer ring for it too...

[Walkintom]

Another thing you may want to consider to improve your overall efficiency: a pot with a heatsink built onto it.

Optimus has some nice options that aren't too hard on the pocketbook. The Terra Weekend HE weighs 9.7 oz and is enough for my needs. I use it with a canister stove but I see no reason why you couldn't use it with an alcohol stove. Costs about $30, reg price.

[BirdBrain]

I love my fancy feast stove. It weighs just under an ounce. Boils 2 cups in 6 - 8 minutes. Lights easy with no priming. Has a built in pot stand. All you need is a wind screen and maybe a vapor barrier (but you need them for all alcohol stoves). And you can get a simmer ring for it too...

I assume by vapor barrier you mean shielding from the ground. If so, not all stoves require one. Mine runs fine on an ice block or in a pool of water. I don't carry any shielding for the bottom of my stove. If you meant something else, please forgive my ignorant assumption.

[zelph]

I'm looking at doing a 2016 SOBO on the AT (~early July through late Oct) and I'd like some advice on what I should use as a stove on the AT. It seems that alcohol stoves are the by far the lightest, so that's what I'd like to use. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it also seems that yellow HEET is the easiest alcohol fuel to find (being in gas stations and whatnot) other than isopropyl. I'm not opposed to making my own stove, but I want it to be very reliable. What are some stoves (or just diy designs) recommended that burn yellow HEET or isopropyl that would be appropriate for use on the AT?



The Fancee Feest is an easy build DIY stove with integrated pot support. Countless number of folks have made them using the cat food can and an aluminum beer bottle. You already have the fiberglass wick. The stove originated here at WB.


http://whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/27262-Fancyfeast-Stove


The Fancee Feest has become Shugs's GOTO stove.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKAFAsPfC4s



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42nCgENAmeA

[walkingdead]

Enjoyed watching your video on the Fancee Feast... you' ve got an interesting sense of humor!

[Dogwood]

"It seems that alcohol stoves are by far the lightest, so that's what I'd like to use" Depends! Your assumption CAN BE incorrect. It depends on things like how often you are out for or how often you plan on resupplying with fuel, availability of fuel(IMO the AT overall has an ABUNDANCE of availability of fuel sources for both types of stoves), how, how often, and what you cook, what times of yr temp wise you'll be cooking, the rest of your cook set, etc. A stove in itself is only part of the cooking equation! It's not so cut and dried especially when you start prioritizing the gram weenie game.

[Singto]

Nobody is talking about it but I believe it has been proven that the lightest practical cooking fuel/system is the Esbit/solid fuel cooking system. I'd do strictly Esbit if I knew it were readily available along the AT. There seems to be some contradictory information as to it's availability. I carry 2 tablets as a secondary cooking fuel in the case my primary should ever fail. It's also a very good fire starter and unused portions can be extinguished and re-lit.
The new folding Titanium Esbit stove (with pot stand) is .4 ounces, homemade foil windscreen .15 ounces and an Esbit tablet (enough to boil 2 cups of water) is .5 ounces. If you read a little, you'll find tips on how to extend the use of the tablets and keep clean up minimal. Buying in bulk and placing in your mail drops is a way to mitigate the cost. But then again, I don't believe cost has been introduced into the equation here as a major consideration.

[Parrott65]

I'm looking at doing a 2016 SOBO on the AT (~early July through late Oct) and I'd like some advice on what I should use as a stove on the AT. It seems that alcohol stoves are the by far the lightest, so that's what I'd like to use. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it also seems that yellow HEET is the easiest alcohol fuel to find (being in gas stations and whatnot) other than isopropyl. I'm not opposed to making my own stove, but I want it to be very reliable. What are some stoves (or just diy designs) recommended that burn yellow HEET or isopropyl that would be appropriate for use on the AT?


I found this stove (http://www.flatcatgear.com/shop/iso-25-stove/), which cleanly burns isopropyl alcohol, but it costs money (unlike diy stoves) so I've held off on it. Have any of you used it? Do you like it? I think if it works well and is reliable then it's the best choice as far as fuel availability goes, and weighs only 33g (1.16 oz)
(http://www.flatcatgear.com/shop/iso-25-stove/)


Check out the Rucas Alcohol Stove on ebay. It is a really good stove and it's only $20.

[zelph]

Nobody is talking about it but I believe it has been proven that the lightest practical cooking fuel/system is the Esbit/solid fuel cooking system. I'd do strictly Esbit if I knew it were readily available along the AT. There seems to be some contradictory information as to it's availability. I carry 2 tablets as a secondary cooking fuel in the case my primary should ever fail. It's also a very good fire starter and unused portions can be extinguished and re-lit.
The new folding Titanium Esbit stove (with pot stand) is .4 ounces, homemade foil windscreen .15 ounces and an Esbit tablet (enough to boil 2 cups of water) is .5 ounces. If you read a little, you'll find tips on how to extend the use of the tablets and keep clean up minimal. Buying in bulk and placing in your mail drops is a way to mitigate the cost. But then again, I don't believe cost has been introduced into the equation here as a major consideration.

Esbit is more efficient if a Brian Green Esbit tray is used to support the cube:

http://www.woodgaz-stove.com/brian-green-esbit-tray.php

[Another Kevin]

Nobody is talking about it but I believe it has been proven that the lightest practical cooking fuel/system is the Esbit/solid fuel cooking system.

The fumes of Esbit really bother me. The dead fish smell is bad enough, but I get a headache and nausea and wind up not able to eat the food that I just cooked. I'll stick with methanol.

[BirdBrain]

Personally, I think a Jetboil is about as good as it gets. I like creating. I like having my fingerprints on things. Therefore, I build as many things as I can. The alcohol stove system is just one of those things. Second choice is to have things built by some other human (not mass produced). Because I have given away so many of my stoves, I have received many custom items in return. My 2 favorite are my TrafficJam sleeping hat and my ShellieShuttle survival bracelet.

[bullseye]

I second zelph on the Fancy Feast. Good little stove that's east to make.

[Venchka]

Just for grins & giggles I fired up my Primus Himalayan MFS Sunday night. I had the flame low, but probably not at the absolute minimum. The fuel was Coleman brand, French made 220 gram iso-butane canister. The stove boiled 1 cup of water in 6 minutes and burned 1 gram of iso-butane per minute.
How does that compare with alcohol?
For my next test I'll use white gas in the Primus MFS, Svea 123 and Coleman Peak 1 Apex stoves. That should be fun.
I also learned that my aluminum Optimus 124 .88 liter cook pot & lid is lighter than a Snow Peak .88 liter titanium pot & lid. That cured my titanium envy.

Wayne

[Odd Man Out]

Just for grins & giggles I fired up my Primus Himalayan MFS Sunday night. I had the flame low, but probably not at the absolute minimum. The fuel was Coleman brand, French made 220 gram iso-butane canister. The stove boiled 1 cup of water in 6 minutes and burned 1 gram of iso-butane per minute.
How does that compare with alcohol?...

It is important to remember that alcohol stoves are widely divergent and that the performance of an alcohol stove is quite variable depending on the whole system (pot, pot stand, wind screen). The last boil test I did with my alcohol system I boiled 2 cups of water in just under 4 min with 13 mL of methanol/ethanol (50/50). So I would expect to boil one cup in just under 2 min with half as much fuel which would be about 5.2 g when converting to mass instead of volume. I believe this to be about the best efficiency you can get with an alcohol stove. Many alcohol systems will be less efficient. Gas (liquid and iso-butane both) has a much higher energy density than alcohol so typically the mass of fuel burned per boil is more for alcohol. However the great differences in the weight of the stove and fuel containers, amount of fuel carried, etc... makes direct comparisons of the whole system very complex.

[Venchka]

Unless you believe as I do that alcohol is for drinking and hydrocarbons are to be used for fuel. Disclaimer. The petrochemical industry has been very good to me and my family. Oil funds my toys.

Wayne

[BirdBrain]

I am with OMO. Our systems are fairly similar. As I have said before, it is hard to beat a Jetboil. I prefer alcohol stoves for 2 reasons. 1) I like to build stuff. 2) my stove won't break down. I cannot count the times I have seen hikers fiddling with their isobutane whatever because something ain't working right. As an added bonus, it rivals or even beats the weight of the isobutane setup depending on length of trip. However, being honest again. I like the stoves I build. The are fun, effecient, and beautiful.

[Donde]

A snow peak ti-lite is pretty light and much faster easier and safer than an alchy. I haven't heard of any forest fires, and assorted lower extremity burns from ti-lite and pocket rockets. whereas vast swaths of California, and every picnic table (and most shelter floors) on the AT can attest to the volitility of alchy stoves.

[BirdBrain]

This is where I post my stove running in my hand

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTr4kHkllzM

and Zelph posts his starlyte (I will do it)

http://www.woodgaz-stove.com/starlyte-stove.php

and someone posts an article about white gas stoves leaving burn marks everywhere.

I am not totally disagreeing with you. Alcohol stoves can present a problem. Just saying the problem is exaggerated and the burn marks are most often caused by another type of stove.

[Donde]

Undoubtedly there are idiots with other stoves, and safe experienced backpackers with alchys. What makes me cringe is inexperienced newbies worshiping at the UL altar getting gear they don't know how to use correctly. When this means putting 35LBs in their frameless CF pack its their problem. When it means setting **** on fire it is all of our problems. If you have to ask the internet what stove to use, then an alchy stove is not it. Later that might change.

[Odd Man Out]

I would be more worried about the people who are not asking for advice.

[zelph]

An experienced scoutmaster teaching our future backpackers:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90hsmfBwkyU

It's all about user error, not the stoves we use. Some stoves are more safe than others. The StarLyte is one of the more safe due to non-spill feature.

[Berserker]

It seems that alcohol stoves are the by far the lightest, so that's what I'd like to use.
I've crunched the numbers, and I don't know if I'd say they are "by far the lightest". If you have to carry a significant amount of alcohol (i.e. between re-supplies), then they can actually end up being heavier. At any rate, almost all of my experience is with canister and alcohol stoves. The canister stove makes a lot of noise, but it is fast and simple to use. The alcohol stove is silent, slower and requires a bit more time to setup.

I've used a few different alcohol stove setups and my favorite is the Caldera Cone. It's just so dang easy to use and it's almost impervious to wind, which can be an issue with other stoves that require a separate wind screen.

[Odd Man Out]

I've crunched the numbers, and I don't know if I'd say they are "by far the lightest". If you have to carry a significant amount of alcohol (i.e. between re-supplies), then they can actually end up being heavier. At any rate, almost all of my experience is with canister and alcohol stoves. The canister stove makes a lot of noise, but it is fast and simple to use. The alcohol stove is silent, slower and requires a bit more time to setup.

I've used a few different alcohol stove setups and my favorite is the Caldera Cone. It's just so dang easy to use and it's almost impervious to wind, which can be an issue with other stoves that require a separate wind screen.

Yes, a lot of people have tried to compare the net weight of alcohol vs canister systems and there are just to many variable to make definitive conclusions.

[ChrisJackson]

31515
Current setup: 20 oz Esbit pot, Trangia stove, DIY pot stand (19 gauge mesh). Works great but will start tinkering around with some cat cans soon. I love that Esbit pot. Perfect size for me.

[Odd Man Out]

Current setup: 20 oz Esbit pot, Trangia stove, DIY pot stand (19 gauge mesh). Works great but will start tinkering around with some cat cans soon. I love that Esbit pot. Perfect size for me.

What's the mesh size on that hardware cloth? I make the same kine of pot stands (not sure of the gauge though - it's a piece of galvanized steel hardware cloth with 1/2" squares I got at the store a while back). I found that I can cut out every other wire to turn it in to 1" square hardware cloth and it is plenty sturdy for my 1 L pot with as much food as I usually cook. I tried cutting out every all but every third wire and it got too flimsy, but cutting every other one works fine. this cuts the weight of the pot stand nearly in half. I prefer center burning stoves that require a pot stand over cat can stoves.

[ChrisJackson]

It's 1/4 inch squares. Home Depot. $12 for a roll. Have enough left over for gobs of stands!

EDIT: correction-> it is 1/2 inch squares. Just went down to check the packaging.

[Odd Man Out]

It's 1/4 inch squares. Home Depot. $12 for a roll. Have enough left over for gobs of stands!

EDIT: correction-> it is 1/2 inch squares. Just went down to check the packaging.

This is what mine looks like after cutting off every other wire. This one is two inches tall. You see I stagger the wires. Not sure if this helps, but it looks pretty.


31522

[Moosling]

This is my Supercat, I switched from Canister stove. In Tests I have reached rolling boil in 4m20s (16 oz of water) in my garage, I haven't taken it out on the trail yet. I had some aluminum flashing laying around that I made the windscreen with. Hopefully I'll get at least close to the same time with a little wind and lower temps not really sure how slight of a temperature increase will effect boil time. This is my first attempt at a Alcohol stove, so we'll see how it goes, the stove acts as its own pot stand so with the stove under the windscreen the pot will sit at an correct level, I had to cut the wind screen down a little so the pot handle wouldn't get in the way.

Anyway I look forward to using it, any suggestions on why this design may not work very well I'm happy to accept.



31523

[Odd Man Out]

This is my Supercat, I switched from Canister stove. In Tests I have reached rolling boil in 4m20s (16 oz of water) in my garage, I haven't taken it out on the trail yet. I had some aluminum flashing laying around that I made the windscreen with. Hopefully I'll get at least close to the same time with a little wind and lower temps not really sure how slight of a temperature increase will effect boil time. This is my first attempt at a Alcohol stove, so we'll see how it goes, the stove acts as its own pot stand so with the stove under the windscreen the pot will sit at an correct level, I had to cut the wind screen down a little so the pot handle wouldn't get in the way.

Anyway I look forward to using it, any suggestions on why this design may not work very well I'm happy to accept.



31523

Your wind screen looks pretty much the same as mine. The Super Cat stove has been very popular for years and has been used successfully by many long distance hikers. However it does have some limitations. Andrew Skurka has been a proponent of this stove for some time, but has recently publish a blog post about its limitations. Again, it can and does work fine. Many people like it because of its simplicity and low cost. You seem to have an effective wind screen which will solve some (but not all) of the problems highlighted by Skurka.

http://andrewskurka.com/2015/super-cat-fancy-feast-backpacking-alcohol-stove-flaws/

[Wil]

a blog post about its limitationsThe comments in the blog contain answers to most of the limitations. I'd add even more emphasis on the windscreen as the key to pot stability. Sized JUST larger than the pot and extending about 1/2 way up; and yes the pot has to be wide enough to cover the flame jets. I have a few small holes near the bottom of the screen, all that is needed for oxygen, and in high wind I hook some tent stakes through it. The usual dual rows of jets does make priming go quicker but that's silly to design for. One row is a far more efficient use of fuel overall. You hold the pot just off the stove rim during priming so there is little/no waste of fuel.

I'd emphasize that you should hold onto the pot handle while stirring, as with most stoves. Finally, I carry a small piece of cardboard covered with aluminum foil that I use as a stove base. That becomes my smooth, level surface (with sometimes some landscaping underneath). I shove the cardboard square somewhere in the pack where it presses against a flat surface to keep from getting warped during travel. I figured I'd have to replace this every couple of trips but my original square is in its fourth year.

All that said I'm intrigued by the sub-one ounce $10 Chinese isobutane burner which I'm still awaiting.

[Moosling]

The comments in the blog contain answers to most of the limitations. I'd add even more emphasis on the windscreen as the key to pot stability. Sized JUST larger than the pot and extending about 1/2 way up; and yes the pot has to be wide enough to cover the flame jets.

All that said I'm intrigued by the sub-one ounce $10 Chinese isobutane burner which I'm still awaiting.

Thanks for the advice, in my windscreen design I pinch it together with one of my wife's bobby pins, that seems to do the trick and I can keep the windscreen tight around the cooking pot which seems to help a ton to contain the heat around the bottom of the pot.

Hope the $10.00 Iso burner works well for you, my friend had ordered one and loves it. And that pot in my picture is another Chinese items $10.00 a wallet friendly replacement for my old dingy pot.


Your wind screen looks pretty much the same as mine. The Super Cat stove has been very popular for years and has been used successfully by many long distance hikers. However it does have some limitations. Andrew Skurka has been a proponent of this stove for some time, but has recently publish a blog post about its limitations. Again, it can and does work fine. Many people like it because of its simplicity and low cost. You seem to have an effective wind screen which will solve some (but not all) of the problems highlighted by Skurka.

http://andrewskurka.com/2015/super-c...l-stove-flaws/ (http://andrewskurka.com/2015/super-cat-fancy-feast-backpacking-alcohol-stove-flaws/)

- I appreciated the advice and the link you shared, the simplicity of the supercat makes me want to stick with it, like you said its tried and true. But as I mentioned I haven't taken it out of the trail yet so I'm looking forward to whatever tweeks and fixes I need to make, even to the point of throwing it out and going another direction :)

[Odd Man Out]

The comments in the blog contain answers to most of the limitations. I'd add even more emphasis on the windscreen as the key to pot stability. Sized JUST larger than the pot and extending about 1/2 way up; and yes the pot has to be wide enough to cover the flame jets. I have a few small holes near the bottom of the screen, all that is needed for oxygen, and in high wind I hook some tent stakes through it. The usual dual rows of jets does make priming go quicker but that's silly to design for. One row is a far more efficient use of fuel overall. You hold the pot just off the stove rim during priming so there is little/no waste of fuel.

I'd emphasize that you should hold onto the pot handle while stirring, as with most stoves. Finally, I carry a small piece of cardboard covered with aluminum foil that I use as a stove base. That becomes my smooth, level surface (with sometimes some landscaping underneath). I shove the cardboard square somewhere in the pack where it presses against a flat surface to keep from getting warped during travel. I figured I'd have to replace this every couple of trips but my original square is in its fourth year....

Good call on the aluminum covered cardboard. I have done the same, but I cut a round disk sized to fit in the bottom of the pot. The cardboard helps insulate the stove from cold surfaces which inhibits fuel vaporization. The foil helps reflect heat up and protects the surface from burning.

As for the wind screen, this is what I have done to get the optimum air flow. I make a wind screen with no vents, but prop it up perhaps 1/2 inch on some blocks and do a boil test. I then drop it down on a flat surface, punch a couple of air holes in the bottom of the screen, and do another test. You will probably notice the boil time suffer from lack of air flow. Then repeat, punching more holes until you get boil times that are close to the control test.

I too have used this type of stove with one row of holes. The original plans for calls this a Simmer Cat. You do get a less powerful stove but that goes with more efficiency. One trick with alcohol stoves is to get a balance of efficiency and power that you are comfortable with. Another advantage with one row of holes is you have a much larger fuel capacity, if you need longer burn times.

There is one more modification I have used with this stove. I have used a pot stand (just like the one pictured above) so the pot is suspended a couple of mm above the stove. This has a few advantages. One it makes the pot less likely to tip over with a wider pot stand. Also, the simmer-cat stove will burn hotter (between the simmer and super cat in terms of power). Also, you can put the pot on the stove (really it is just above the stove) right after lighting without having to wait for it to prime. This is more convenient and it also helps with efficiency as less fuel is wasted while the stove is priming. The stove will burn slowly as the fuel heats and then will bloom. If you get the gap between the stove and pot correct, it will not go out during this slow burn phase with the pot in place. Many people claim the built-in pot stand feature of this design as a big asset. I personally found that using this stove with a pot stand provides quite a few benefits and is not really much of an inconvenience.