Basic skills

[Francis Sawyer]

I've been on Whiteblaze for a while and I am just freaked out by the fact that people ask for the dumbest advice like " what do I do if I get cold" or " how much should my pack weigh"'.
I'm no Sgt Rock or some military operator ( by the way ,thank you guys for your service. You are ALL heroes.) but jeeze , I learned enough in cub scouts to go on a hike without encountering disaster. Does anybody else feel this way or am I being to harsh?

[perrymk]

I understand where you're coming from, but I'd rather someone ask an obvious (to some not to others) question than risk serious harm.

[TNhiker]

It's a discussion board---people discuss....

[BirdBrain]

Ignorance and inability can be cured through experience. I took my wife, youngest son, and his wife to Acadia this past weekend. I was the only one having fun. I was the only one carrying a pack. I was the only one who knew where to put my feet. They were trying. It was painful to watch. My wife did okay. The young couple were hopelessly lost. We take our base knowledge and muscle memory for granted. We are not superior. We were all clueless too at one point. It is why I try to answer the mundane questions. There are many more qualified people that can answer. I am still learning. Those asking are trying.

Yes. You are being too harsh. They are not dumb. They lack knowledge. They are asking for knowledge. They should not be made to feel stupid in the process.

[Pedaling Fool]

Is this the thread where I can ask how long cheese lasts on the trail.

[BirdBrain]

Is this the thread where I can ask how long cheese lasts on the trail.

Yes.........

[Francis Sawyer]

The cheese will last for a while. Right up until the point that it spoils it will still be good.

[cphobes]

I've been on Whiteblaze for a while and I am just freaked out by the fact that people ask for the dumbest advice like " what do I do if I get cold" or " how much should my pack weigh"'.
I'm no Sgt Rock or some military operator ( by the way ,thank you guys for your service. You are ALL heroes.) but jeeze , I learned enough in cub scouts to go on a hike without encountering disaster. Does anybody else feel this way or am I being to harsh?

I think people asking those questions lack practice, I know for me even the simplest of tasks seemed tough on my first hike (and 2nd, 3rd...). Then you start to figure out how you need to get things done. Getting yourself organized to cook a meal is a simple thing but if you've never done it before on the trail it takes some thought. Asking questions like do I have all the utensils I need etc.

So it shows lack of practice but also that they are trying to figure it out which is good. :) The more they figure out behind the keyboard the more enjoyable their trip will be.

-Stephen

[bill1980]

Since I have only again taken up backpacking in the last 2 years (40 years after doing so for Uncle Sam), I am far from an expert. While I learned what I could from this forum and others, I always listened to any experienced hiker to see if I could learn more. I found that especially important when talking about gear, since new products come out that can rapidly change, such as footwear, lighter tentage, better designed packs, etc. I find myself, rookie that I am, even informing young persons on the trail about the dangers of bluejeans and cotton clothing, but not all accept the suggestions. Hopefully, they are among the minority.

[Bronk]

I live near about 100,000 acres of national forest where it is legal to camp pretty much anywhere, yet people will pay to set up their tent in a campground and buy firewood for $5 a bundle when they could quite legally set up their tent just yards away and gather firewood for free. I'll never understand it. I guess they need the security of being around other people and staying in an 'official' campsite. And some people don't know how to take a dump without a public restroom. I would never be interested in camping the way that these people do anymore than they would be interested in doing it the way I do...I just don't understand the mentality and aura of helplessness that goes along with it.

[GreatDane]

I have to admit that sometimes I too shake my head and wonder, but often as I read the posts I either learn something new (imagine that!), have my opinion confirmed (always nice!) or not, or begin to realize, once again, that people with basic questions are only beginning to learn and they ask because they are truly interested and want to do it "right". Hopefully, they are as excited as I was when I first started. And as excited as I get every time I start planning another trip. Plus, I'd really rather, for their sakes, that they know more before they go out and not end up having to burn their clothes and/or be rescued.

[4eyedbuzzard]

They have been assimilated into the collective. We are Borg. Resistance is futile.

On a serious note, there are many people who just aren't the type to figure things out on their own or even attempt to. Typically they lack the initiative to learn independently, though sometimes they want to be taught. But ultimately, there is a big difference.

I have a loser relative who is always saying things like, "It's lucky you know how to do that," and, "I would do anything to be able do that." Well, it isn't lucky that I know how to do something (any particular thing) - it took time and effort to learn how. And you wouldn't do anything to be able to do whatever it is - because you would never invest the time or put forth the effort.

[rocketsocks]

I think for someone new it can be somewhat overwhelming. they are often in overload, and when they get here it may go something like this...

"Guy's, I've read all this stuff, and bought all these things...tarps, tents, filters, ditty bags, sleeping bags, bag balm and first aid kit, ect ect, and I'm at 40 pounds"

And somewhere between the brain and keyboard they shorten it to, "So how much should a pack weigh" not really a big deal, help em out when you can.

[BirdBrain]

They have been assimilated into the collective. We are Borg. Resistance is futile.

On a serious note, there are many people who just aren't the type to figure things out on their own or even attempt to. Typically they lack the initiative to learn independently, though sometimes they want to be taught. But ultimately, there is a big difference.

I have a loser relative who is always saying things like, "It's lucky you know how to do that," and, "I would do anything to be able do that." Well, it isn't lucky that I know how to do something (any particular thing) - it took time and effort to learn how. And you wouldn't do anything to be able to do whatever it is - because you would never invest the time or put forth the effort.

So much truth there. Your "loser relative" praises your superior skill set as a tool to justify his laziness. My 1st car was a 1970 Ford Torino that paid $50 for. It had a broken timing chain, a cracked water pump, and a punctured radiator. I had never worked on a motor before. I bought a Chilton's book that covered the repairs. I did not get any help. I fixed it. I don't have "mad skills". There are observers and there are doers. The observers can if they would just try. Those asking "stupid" questions should be met with open arms instead of being ridiculed. They are learning and trying and soon will be doing.

[4eyedbuzzard]

...There are observers and there are doers. The observers can if they would just try. Those asking "stupid" questions should be met with open arms instead of being ridiculed. They are learning and trying and soon will be doing.Yep. It is amazing how much knowledge is "out there", and how many helpful people are also "out there" willing to answer questions and help someone that is interested and putting forth the effort to learn. We all ask what could be called "stupid questions" to experienced folks when in the novice/beginning stages of learning about something new or trying to learn a new skill. Given the ease of access to information and knowledge that has come about with the WWW, it has never been easier to educate oneself.

EDIT: And now I feel bad about calling my relative a "loser", but, but, but, it's just infuriating the number of times every week we hear the same, "Where did you learn to do that?" It's like we went to college or something to learn how to change a light bulb . . .

[imscotty]

Yes, you are being too harsh.

Congratulations for having the opportunity to learn in scouts. Many kids develop a love of natures and an understanding of outdoor skills thanks to youth organizations and loving dedicated parents. Unfortunately we exist in a culture where kids are becoming increasingly removed from the natural world. Many of their parents lack basic outdoor skills and it can be sometimes hard to find an urban scout troop that actually goes camping.

I teach in an urban Community College. Many of my students have zero experience in the outdoors. Sometimes I will share a photo or a story from one of my hikes. Some are dismayed that anyone would camp alone in the woods willingly, a few are intrigued. I have had students say I have inspired them to try camping (I am talking car camping here, in a developed campground) and come back all excited after this life changing experience. I am happy to lend a hand, however small, to set them on this path.

I hope that the more experienced Whiteblaze posters remain diligent against developing an elitist attitude. Yes, sometimes the questions can seem like something everyone should know. But unfortunately, not everyone does. And if we can educate and lead them on a path to enjoy the natural world safely, you will have improved their lives, and I think made this world a better place.

[Jordan's Dad]

I think of it this way: I owe a debt to the scoutmasters, hikers, folks on the old Backpacker.com message boards and others who helped me when I was learning about this stuff. I can never repay them, so pay it forward to the ones looking for information now. I don't begrudge it, it is a privilege.

[BirdBrain]

EDIT: And now I feel bad about calling my relative a "loser", but, but, but, it's just infuriating the number of times every week we hear the same, "Where did you learn to do that?" It's like we went to college or something to learn how to change a light bulb . . .

I grasp your intent. He could succeed more (win) if he tried and did. Because he won't, he does not realize his potential (loses). It is not ability. It is reality.

[Ashepabst]

...the old Backpacker.com message boards...

may she rest in peace...

[billnchristy]

I've gone in and out of several hobbies (addictions?) over the years and the process is always the same. When I start gathering interest I obcess over things and learn as much as I can. Things that are alien start to take shape as something I recognize and I begin to get preferences on those things. Then the actual doing happens and you fall in love but there are aspects that bother you, mostly gear or preperation type stuff.

I remember going into outfitter type stores looking for disc golf stuff (most have a tiny rack) and looking at hiking packs, tents, and other gear thinking it looked really cool, but was terribly confusing as to what was needed.

Now I am at the point where I wonder how am I supposed to fit 5 days of food in my pack when a day's worth is taking up too much space.

I'm grateful to live in a time when going online and asking these dumb questions is easy.

I don't mind going out and learning, but there are some things you should know.

So, in essence, thanks for not chasing us new folks away.

[Rolls Kanardly]

Is this the thread where I can ask how long cheese lasts on the trail.

I believe that this is a two part question. How long will cheese be edible on the trail and how long with it last when starting to munch the cheese.
Good hard cheese, many miles, After the first bite two blocks. he he
Rolls

[TOW]

I've been on Whiteblaze for a while and I am just freaked out by the fact that people ask for the dumbest advice like " what do I do if I get cold" or " how much should my pack weigh"'.
I'm no Sgt Rock or some military operator ( by the way ,thank you guys for your service. You are ALL heroes.) but jeeze , I learned enough in cub scouts to go on a hike without encountering disaster. Does anybody else feel this way or am I being to harsh?Yep you are harsh friend, not everyone was adept to learning at a very young life like you you did in the Cub Scouts and I bet if you take an honest jab at it you too will realize you have needed instruction on something so yo asked a question..........


Ignorance and inability can be cured through experience. I took my wife, youngest son, and his wife to Acadia this past weekend. I was the only one having fun. I was the only one carrying a pack. I was the only one who knew where to put my feet. They were trying. It was painful to watch. My wife did okay. The young couple were hopelessly lost. We take our base knowledge and muscle memory for granted. We are not superior. We were all clueless too at one point. It is why I try to answer the mundane questions. There are many more qualified people that can answer. I am still learning. Those asking are trying.

Yes. You are being too harsh. They are not dumb. They lack knowledge. They are asking for knowledge. They should not be made to feel stupid in the process.

[jjtrindc]

I'm less distressed by the basic questions. I've asked a few myself here and on other hobby forums. What bothers me is the lack of research before asking those questions. There is a wealth of info here (thanks to many of you)and on other sites that is easily searchable. I just wish people would take a few moments to look for it and ask basic, but more informed questions.

[BirdBrain]

The more I see my answer, the more I think I may have been too harsh. I think I could have expressed the same points without being so blunt. After all, his was a question too. Therefore, I apologize for the bluntness of my answer. He sought an opinion and I rediculed his words. Sorry. It was not my intent. My focus was too narrow. It should have included the OP. I should have started my answer with "no question is stupid, including yours".

[mtntopper]

Some people here on WB have WAY to much time on their hands............

[Feral Bill]

I'm torn here. I was a beginner once, asking questions (pre-internet), and I am happy to help others learn. On the other hand, a trip to a library or a decent book store can yield a wealth of carefully organized information between two covers. Shouldn't that be the starting place?

[The Splitter]

I've been on Whiteblaze for a while and I am just freaked out by the fact that people ask for the dumbest advice like " what do I do if I get cold" or " how much should my pack weigh"'.
I'm no Sgt Rock or some military operator ( by the way ,thank you guys for your service. You are ALL heroes.) but jeeze , I learned enough in cub scouts to go on a hike without encountering disaster. Does anybody else feel this way or am I being to harsh?

I don't think your being harsh. We all start out somewhere and I get that. But there is such a thing as a dumb question. When people are asking questions like "what do I do if I get cold?" Or "should I bring my rain gear?" Are a good example. By simply going online and looking at weather forecasts one can quickly determine weather or not they need to worry about being cold or wet without wasting my precious bandwidth.

I'm more than happy to answer beginner questions, I'm still learning too but there is a point where one needs to use s little common sense. Idk dude, is it supposed to rain?


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[The Splitter]

"no question is stupid, including yours".

I respectfully disagree Bird Brain. There are such things as stupid questions and I've asked them. Pappa Splitter used to say "you ask a stupid question you get a stupid answer." Which consequently got me to become more independent and start thinking things through before I just asked. I used to also get a lot of "I don't know, figure it out."

My old man wasn't (isn't) a dick, and was always willing to teach me something he knew I couldn't do but he also knew where to draw the line between raising a helpless child and being a total ass hole.

On the flip side my sisters had everything handed to them and as a result, neither can find their ass with a mirror. Ones starting to come around a little but it's certainly painful to watch.

Some people just don't belong in the woods, in fact most people don't. Most people probably should have one of those 4,000 lb rolling killing machines we call a "car" either, but they still do.

I think if someone is asking questions like "should I bring a jacket" it's only a matter of time before old Uncle Darwin has them come sit on his lap.



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[bangorme]

I'm not a beginner, but every time I see what I think is a novice question, I see an answer to it that teaches me something I didn't know. Guess I don't know everything... and never will.

[greentick]

Experience is something you get right after you need it.

[MuddyWaters]

I've been on Whiteblaze for a while and I am just freaked out by the fact that people ask for the dumbest advice like " what do I do if I get cold" or " how much should my pack weigh"'.
I'm no Sgt Rock or some military operator ( by the way ,thank you guys for your service. You are ALL heroes.) but jeeze , I learned enough in cub scouts to go on a hike without encountering disaster. Does anybody else feel this way or am I being to harsh?

Yep, your being too harsh
People new to hiking are apprehensive about everything.
All the what-ifs...
What if they are cold
what if they are wet
what if they get hurt
what if they run out of water
what if they run out of food
what if they get attacked by a deranged inbred hillbilly drunk on impure corn liquour
what about .....BEARS...
On top of that , they have no idea how far they can walk per day
they have no idea how hard it really is
they dont know what they should really wear, carry, or use
Should they listen to the bozo at REI that wants to sell them every gadget in the store, or not?

they are looking for re-assurance about just about everything

The good thing, is 1) they are smart enough to ask questions. That gives them a good chance of success. 2) it only takes a few days on a trail for them to see how paranoid they were being about everything.

[BirdBrain]

I respectfully disagree Bird Brain. There are such things as stupid questions and I've asked them.

True. I just felt like I was saying "don't ask such a stupid question". I will concede your point. I just don't want to be the guy saying so. I don't want to come off like that.

[egilbe]

True. I just felt like I was saying "don't ask such a stupid question". I will concede your point. I just don't want to be the guy saying so. I don't want to come off like that.

I had an Army instructor once, who said, "There is no such thing as a stupid question" then under his breath ("Only stupid people asking questions"). I never forgot that and it still makes me laugh thinking about it. I do research before I ask questions because of that moment in the past and in the research, I usually find the answer to my question. I often times won't answer a question without referring to the source to try to teach people to find their own answers.

[Hoofit]

Hope this isn't a dumb question but.......
Does anyone know of a backpack with helium pockets to 'lighten the load'?

[BirdBrain]

Hope this isn't a dumb question but.......
Does anyone know of a backpack with helium pockets to 'lighten the load'?

Most have pockets. What you put in them is up to you. However, made of helium? No. :D

[bangorme]

I invented one, but every time someone took their backpack off it disappeared. :(

It was a commercial failure.

[4eyedbuzzard]

I invented one, but every time someone took their backpack off it disappeared. :(

It was a commercial failure.Hmm, :-? Skyblazing?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/96/Cloudhoppers.jpg

http://d3gls0gl48g4d4.cloudfront.net/dims4/NGV/f5ed6ae/2147483647/thumbnail/354x199%3E/quality/75/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fpmdvod.nationalgeographic.com%2F NG_Video%2F996%2F847%2F62532_1_1280x720_640x360_17 7593411852.jpg

[Traveler]

There is really no such thing as a stupid question if one doesn't know the answer. Basic questions to those with vast experience and are at the top of the Bell curve can sound "stupid". To those who are at the flat line part of the learning curve these issues are genuine. We are all new at whatever we do at some point. Think of that the next time you are in an unfamiliar airport with 6 terminals, 20 minutes to catch a flight on a regional carrier, and can't discern what route to take. Asking someone how you get to Gate F33 from the B concourse sounds kind of stupid if you know your way through the maze. Though I can make my way around O'Hare, DFW, or Atlanta with my eyes closed now, I remember how daunting it seemed when I was new to it.

As a consideration, asking basic questions has other purposes beyond looking for knowledge. Validation of an opinion, concept, or existing knowledge may be the driver for asking. Sometimes its just a place to start a conversation in something the OP can join in on at the level of experience they have. Rather like coming into a new group of people at a Christmas party, you have to start a conversation somewhere about something if you are going to participate, "does the egg nog have rum in it" is sometimes the best ice breaker.

[gbolt]

To me, the thread title is an important key. This title, "Basic Skills" means that I expected some very simplistic questions and answers. So under a thread like this, No question is to dumb, IMHO. Yet, even under this thread I have learned things. I learned Bird Brain is reflective and doesn't mean to be blunt except when on purpose. People new to hiking are just apprehensive and some threads aren't about the specific question, but a way to get their feet wet. Like Bangor, I seem to learn something from every thread I read - otherwise, I just skip the thread next time. Matter of fact, I had skipped this one and almost missed "helium pockets" and when would any of us type helium pockets into the search engine! lol Now back to my egg nog and virgin rum.

[WingedMonkey]

Sometimes there are more stupid answers than questions.

:p

[rdljr]

it never fails to amaze that with all the gathered information of the world at our finger tips what we do with it. We watch videos of kittens and ask questions about stupid questions. Just need to pass out a few more signs.:)

[Five Tango]

Sheesh,now I can't decide if this is the "stupid questions thread or the "stupid people thread".All I want to know is what kind of belts people like and what the best and lightest coffee mug might be.I like a belt for my pants but my pack belt sometimes wants to conflict with it.I've taken to using a waistband over it but wonder what other people do.When I was younger I would not have asked such a stupid question,but at my age nothing is off limits now!

[BirdBrain]

Sheesh,now I can't decide if this is the "stupid questions thread or the "stupid people thread"....

This was a "stupid questions thread". However, I am sure no one will object to expanding it to include "stupid people". :D

[imscotty]

I have a "Stupid Hiker" story to add to the mix.

Took an easy 5.5 mile walk today on the historic Battle Road Trail in Minute Man National Historic Park in Concord this morning. I cleverly suggested we both bring our cars to park at each end so we could make it an easy one-way trip. And hey, we don't need to bring any water because how long can 5.5 miles take? When we got to the end I pulled out my keys and realized I had brought the wrong keys for that end. D'oh!

My parched wife waited patiently baking in the hot sun while I sort of jogged the 5.5 miles back to my car. Stupid can happen to anyone, but it seems to happen to me more than most :)

[bangorme]

I have a "Stupid Hiker" story to add to the mix.

Took an easy 5.5 mile walk today on the historic Battle Road Trail in Minute Man National Historic Park in Concord. I cleverly suggested we both bring our cars to park at each end so we could make it an easy one-way trip. And hey, we don't need to bring any water because how long can 5.5 miles take? When we got to the end I pulled out my keys and realized I had brought the wrong keys for that end. D'oh!

My parched wife waited patiently baking in the hot sun while I sort of jogged the 5.5 miles back to my car. Stupid can happen to anyone, but it seems to happen to me more than most :)

But, you learned something! I learned to stake down my tent when it blew into my alcohol stove. And those are lessons we won't forget lol.

[Jordan's Dad]

Sheesh,now I can't decide if this is the "stupid questions thread or the "stupid people thread".All I want to know is what kind of belts people like and what the best and lightest coffee mug might be.I like a belt for my pants but my pack belt sometimes wants to conflict with it.I've taken to using a waistband over it but wonder what other people do.When I was younger I would not have asked such a stupid question,but at my age nothing is off limits now!

Bison makes a nice flat web belt with a flat plastic friction "buckle" that doesn't conflict with my pack's hip belt. I've bought them in Manhattan, ks and in East Glacier, mt, you can probably get them through REI.

[kayak karl]

Sheesh,now I can't decide if this is the "stupid questions thread or the "stupid people thread".All I want to know is what kind of belts people like and what the best and lightest coffee mug might be.I like a belt for my pants but my pack belt sometimes wants to conflict with it.I've taken to using a waistband over it but wonder what other people do.When I was younger I would not have asked such a stupid question,but at my age nothing is off limits now! i use my hammock tree straps for a belt and other for a dog leach, but when i hang my hammock my dog runs away and my pants fall down when i chase it. :(

[OCDave]

i use my hammock tree straps for a belt and other for a dog leach, but when i hang my hammock my dog runs away and my pants fall down when i chase it. :(

Thanks, I no longer need to post my question.

[bangorme]

Spec-Ops makes some nice web belts of various widths. After they are broken in the buckles lay fairly flat. Warning: it takes awhile to break them in.

[JumpMaster Blaster]

Bill, you and I are in the exact same position. "Backpacking" for Uncle Sam is exponentially different from backpacking as we do now. I learned a boatload in the last two years; constantly refining. I've seen some questions that make me scratch my head, then try to see if I maybe had that same "dumb" question last year. Sometimes I did.

What I DO stress is that people new to this need to do a quick overnight hike, and review what worked, what didn't what they needed to bring, what they didn't need. I'm always fine tuning my setup.

Some people are kinda lazy, and spend all their internet time asking questions that they could find just by using Google. Not gear/section/etc opinions, but FACTS, like how does my phone work, etc. I throw a lot of time researching everything I can about the trail, and love to advise people against making the stupid mistakes I have made, but at a certain point, folks need to do their homework as much as possible. What worked for me could be very uncomfortable for you.

However, when new hikers ask "how is cell service in such-and-such area" and "what are some good GPS devices" and they get shot down & shut up with "you don't need that crap, leave it at home", it paints a bad picture on veteran hikers. Try answering the question. If you don't have an answer, skip past it.

[JumpMaster Blaster]

They have been assimilated into the collective. We are Borg. Resistance is futile.

On a serious note, there are many people who just aren't the type to figure things out on their own or even attempt to. Typically they lack the initiative to learn independently, though sometimes they want to be taught. But ultimately, there is a big difference.

I have a loser relative who is always saying things like, "It's lucky you know how to do that," and, "I would do anything to be able do that." Well, it isn't lucky that I know how to do something (any particular thing) - it took time and effort to learn how. And you wouldn't do anything to be able to do whatever it is - because you would never invest the time or put forth the effort.

You'd be surprised at how many people spend all their waking hours on a smartphone, but can't figure out what the weather is supposed to be tomorrow.

It's akin to trying to pound a nail in a 2x4 with a rock when you have a hammer next to you.

[Another Kevin]

However, when new hikers ask "how is cell service in such-and-such area" and "what are some good GPS devices" and they get shot down & shut up with "you don't need that crap, leave it at home", it paints a bad picture on veteran hikers. Try answering the question. If you don't have an answer, skip past it.

Uhm. Yeah. I don't need my gadget, but I like having it, even to the extent of carrying a heavy external battery for it. (I like trying to get trails on Open Street Map.)

And I have people on here occasionally telling me that I'm ruining their wilderness experience just by having it, even when it's in my pack and turned off and I don't take it out in front of them.

I guess my failure to understand how its presence in my pack ruins their experience is part of the cluelessness of a clueless weekender.

[BirdBrain]

Uhm. Yeah. I don't need my gadget, but I like having it, even to the extent of carrying a heavy external battery for it. (I like trying to get trails on Open Street Map.)

And I have people on here occasionally telling me that I'm ruining their wilderness experience just by having it, even when it's in my pack and turned off and I don't take it out in front of them.

I guess my failure to understand how its presence in my pack ruins their experience is part of the cluelessness of a clueless weekender.

Your gadgets don't bother me. That stuff is just humorous distractions. When a person has better food than me.... well.... that bothers me. :D

[Five Tango]

Thanks to everyone who answered my "belt question".Before I got your suggestions I did see in another thread someone talking about their Thomas Bates belt so I ordered me one off of Amazon for $13.95.I like the fact that you cut it to fit and then burn the edge.Wound up ordering the REI 3.5 oz mug because I used my titanium Snowpeak 700(?) and maybe it's just me but I can't stand to drink coffee out of it.I have a Kleen Canteen insulated pint mug/cup but its a whopping 10.2 oz so that is out of the question!

[Sarcasm the elf]

Your gadgets don't bother me. That stuff is just humorous distractions. When a person has better food than me.... well.... that bothers me. :D
AnotherKevin carries better food than most of us, I can vouch for that.

[bangorme]

For drinking coffee, and all my cooking, I use the GSI Outdoors Halulite Minimalist Cookset. But, I'm not much of a cook and do exclusively freezer bag cooking.

[Traveler]

Uhm. Yeah. I don't need my gadget, but I like having it, even to the extent of carrying a heavy external battery for it. (I like trying to get trails on Open Street Map.)

And I have people on here occasionally telling me that I'm ruining their wilderness experience just by having it, even when it's in my pack and turned off and I don't take it out in front of them.

I guess my failure to understand how its presence in my pack ruins their experience is part of the cluelessness of a clueless weekender.

I am sure its due to the fact it broadcasts satanic messages from deep inside your pack telling them to put their faces near holes they find in rocks, ground, or trees and make little kissing sounds to lure out whatever lives there. That, in turn, ruins the wilderness experience.

[BirdBrain]

I want my walk to be enjoyable and my sleep comfortable. Everything else is negotiable. Everything else suffers from those priorities.

[Another Kevin]

I want my walk to be enjoyable and my sleep comfortable. Everything else is negotiable. Everything else suffers from those priorities.

We agree on those basic points. We differ on precisely what makes for an enjoyable walk.

"De gustibus non disputandum est—that is, there is no disputing against Hobby-Horses; and for my part, I seldom do." - Laurence Sterne, Tristram Shandy

[BirdBrain]

We agree on those basic points. We differ on precisely what makes for an enjoyable walk.

"De gustibus non disputandum est—that is, there is no disputing against Hobby-Horses; and for my part, I seldom do." - Laurence Sterne, Tristram Shandy

I separate the camp experience from the walk experience. I don't go for the walk to experience the camp. Many do. Many enjoy that part and prioritize accordingly.