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ekeverette
07-01-2015, 19:06
Between what shelters will I be involved in the roller coaster. I'm coming from HF.

Tuckahoe
07-01-2015, 19:28
I can not recall right off hand the shelter, but roughly between RT 50 (actually a little north of that point, I just dont have my guide book handy) at the southerly end and Blackburn Trail Center.

Coffee
07-01-2015, 19:30
According to my 2014 AWOL guide, the north end of the roller coaster is mile 1003 and the south end is mile 989.6. The north end is a few miles north of Snickers Gap and Bear's Den hostel. The south end is just north of Rod Hollow Shelter. I hiked this segment NOBO last year. Honestly I thought it was a bit over-hyped. I hiked the majority of the roller coaster as part of a 22.8 mile day from Manassas Gap Shelter to Bear's Den. My suggestion, if going SOBO, is to do HF-Bears Den, stay at Bear's Den (great hostel) and then do the rest of the roller coaster the next day.

Slo-go'en
07-01-2015, 19:37
The David Lesser Memorial shelter is about 7 miles north of the start of the Roller coaster. The Rod Hollow shelter is just south of the end of the Roller Coaster. In between you have the Blackburn AT center, Bears Den Hostel and the Sam Moore Shelter. There are also tent sites at the bottom of nearly all the bumps.

ekeverette
07-01-2015, 20:08
thanks guys, just trying to be prepared, it's probably nothing.....

Malto
07-01-2015, 20:38
Completely, positively overhyped!

Slo-go'en
07-01-2015, 20:55
Well, when you hit it the 2nd and 3d day of your hike and it's 80 with humidity out, it's a serious work out. If you've come all the way from Georgia, then yea, no big deal. Your best bet is to break it up into two parts. The second half is harder then the first. (going SOBO)

Malto
07-01-2015, 22:18
Well, when you hit it the 2nd and 3d day of your hike and it's 80 with humidity out, it's a serious work out. If you've come all the way from Georgia, then yea, no big deal. Your best bet is to break it up into two parts. The second half is harder then the first. (going SOBO)

Sorry have to call BS. I came off the couch and hiked this section in the middle of the summer. Had it not been for the stupid sign I wouldn't have even known it existed. It's just another section.

THEDON
07-02-2015, 05:38
Blackburn trail center is quite nice Chris (the caretaker) is a wealth of info. A killer view at Bears Den and another nice facility. Lesser shelter is also the nicest one between Front Royal and Pen-Mar (IMHO). Maybe a tenth of a mile off the trail to the shelter, an additional 1/4 mile to camping area and a spring. The coaster itself, with trail legs, not horrendous but don't under estimate it, as a day hike it's sucks. Then again.. I'm 63 and starting to feel it.

illabelle
07-02-2015, 05:58
The rollercoaster wouldn't have the reputation it has (overrated perhaps) if everyone found it to be no big deal. As I recall, the reputation isn't for the difficulty so much as it is for the annoyance of it.

Definitely recommend staying at Bears Den.

Lots of poison ivy through this area. Pick your path carefully if you need to go off trail.

tdoczi
07-02-2015, 06:08
everyone likes to say the roller coaster isnt that bad. is it the whites? not even close. that said, between rockfish gap (maybe even further south, i dunno firsthand) and probably somewhere in VT if not NH itself, it is the hardest prolonged section of the AT you will find. anyone who says its no big deal want to offer one thats harder through the middle of the trail? not talking about one single climb, so lehigh gap orany other single isolated hard climb of a couple miles doesnt qualify. i'm talking about a consistently hard day or days long hike.

Coffee
07-02-2015, 06:26
I reiterate that I thought it was "a bit overhyped", not that it is easy. Part of the difficulty, I believe, is mental because you gain all of these small ridges only to descend and do it all over again. Obviously that's how the roller coaster got its name. For some people gaining and losing elevation like that can be discouraging. It was a pretty good workout but not overwhelming to me. Part of it could have been that I literally had almost no food. I was planning to stay at Bears Den and buy the pizza/ice cream deal, then buy snacks to get to Front Royal the next day. And I don't think I carried much water either. (Maybe 1L) So my total weight was probably high teens at worst at that point.

Lone Wolf
07-02-2015, 06:35
Completely, positively overhyped!

yup. much ado over nothin'

tdoczi
07-02-2015, 08:58
I reiterate that I thought it was "a bit overhyped", not that it is easy. Part of the difficulty, I believe, is mental because you gain all of these small ridges only to descend and do it all over again. Obviously that's how the roller coaster got its name. For some people gaining and losing elevation like that can be discouraging. It was a pretty good workout but not overwhelming to me. Part of it could have been that I literally had almost no food. I was planning to stay at Bears Den and buy the pizza/ice cream deal, then buy snacks to get to Front Royal the next day. And I don't think I carried much water either. (Maybe 1L) So my total weight was probably high teens at worst at that point.

and my point is, calling it "the hardest prolonged section of the AT for a 1000 mile stretch" sounds like hyperbole and yes, it probably isnt as hard as that statement makes it sound, but, never the less, that statement is probably 100% accurate.

Coffee
07-02-2015, 09:22
and my point is, calling it "the hardest prolonged section of the AT for a 1000 mile stretch" sounds like hyperbole and yes, it probably isnt as hard as that statement makes it sound, but, never the less, that statement is probably 100% accurate.

I haven't thru hiked the AT and only have done sections relatively close to where I live. But if the roller coaster is the hardest stretch in 1000 miles, that would mean that the AT is very easy over those 1000 miles compared to everything I've hiked out west.

tdoczi
07-02-2015, 09:38
I haven't thru hiked the AT and only have done sections relatively close to where I live. But if the roller coaster is the hardest stretch in 1000 miles, that would mean that the AT is very easy over those 1000 miles compared to everything I've hiked out west.

that may very well be true, though i will say that although my "out west" hiking is very limited, anything i have done out west has been comparatively easy.

its generally stated that from damascus, va to glencliff, nh is the easiest part of the at, and thats more than half the trail. i havent hiked much south of rockfish gap, va, but aside from that, and with the caveat that we're talking about a prolonged, full day hike and not a single climb taking a couple hours at most, the rollercoaster is the hardest section. some people talk about the west of the hudson section of NY, and they may be right. my living near there and hiking both the AT and other trails in the area frequently on dayhikes has blurred my perception of how hard or not the AT is through there.

Coffee
07-02-2015, 09:43
Fair enough, I don't have enough personal experience outside a 300 mile area of the AT that is close to home and very little in the Smokies. I do think the roller coaster is not that big of a deal for a hiker who is in shape and only reason I mentioned that it might be a bit overhyped is because I don't think there is any need to "dread" the section. That's all.

Pedaling Fool
07-02-2015, 09:59
that may very well be true, though i will say that although my "out west" hiking is very limited, anything i have done out west has been comparatively easy.

its generally stated that from damascus, va to glencliff, nh is the easiest part of the at, and thats more than half the trail. i havent hiked much south of rockfish gap, va, but aside from that, and with the caveat that we're talking about a prolonged, full day hike and not a single climb taking a couple hours at most, the rollercoaster is the hardest section. some people talk about the west of the hudson section of NY, and they may be right. my living near there and hiking both the AT and other trails in the area frequently on dayhikes has blurred my perception of how hard or not the AT is through there.I do believe the roller coaster is somewhat tough, but much overrated, but these things are relative. I know as a thru-hiker I didn't even notice the roller coaster.

However, I take issue with Damascus to Glencliff as the easiest part of the AT; first off, I've never heard that, but more importantly, there are some very tough sections between Damascus and Rockfish Gap and then you got sections in Vermont that can be grueling.

Many of these areas I'd put up against the Roller Coaster section as being tougher.

I believe the Roller Coaster section stands out for a few reasons, one being that on either side of it is relatively easy terrain (especially SNP), secondly it's in a section that gets a lot of locals that don't have their hiking legs and who are comparing this section to the already mentioned areas north and south of this section and as someone already pointed out, you get a few false peak sightings in this section, which just adds to the psychological toughness of this section, for the uninitiated (long-distance hikers have learned to ignore false peaks). And lastly, it is somewhat of a roller coaster, in that you keep going up and down in kind of a sine wave fashion and it even looks that way on the map, but the climbs really are not that tough, except for the person that doesn't have much mileage on their legs.

I don't have my maps with me, but IIRC, it's only like 3 or 4 of these humps.

colorado_rob
07-02-2015, 10:03
Just one more opinion... I actually hit the RC on day 2 of my long section hike and thought it was way WAY overrated in terms of difficulty. But this was in the spring, in the summer heat it might have been a different story.

++++ on the quality of staying at the Bear's Den. fantastic place.

tdoczi
07-02-2015, 10:08
I do believe the roller coaster is somewhat tough, but much overrated, but these things are relative. I know as a thru-hiker I didn't even notice the roller coaster.

However, I take issue with Damascus to Glencliff as the easiest part of the AT; first off, I've never heard that, but more importantly, there are some very tough sections between Damascus and Rockfish Gap and then you got sections in Vermont that can be grueling.

Many of these areas I'd put up against the Roller Coaster section as being tougher.

I believe the Roller Coaster section stands out for a few reasons, one being that on either side of it is relatively easy terrain (especially SNP), secondly it's in a section that gets a lot of locals that don't have their hiking legs and who are comparing this section to the already mentioned areas north and south of this section and as someone already pointed out, you get a few false peak sightings in this section, which just adds to the psychological toughness of this section, for the uninitiated (long-distance hikers have learned to ignore false peaks). And lastly, it is somewhat of a roller coaster, in that you keep going up and down in kind of a sine wave fashion and it even looks that way on the map, but the climbs really are not that tough, except for the person that doesn't have much mileage on their legs.

I don't have my maps with me, but IIRC, it's only like 3 or 4 of these humps.

i agree with you about VT, totally. and like i said, south of rockfish gap i dont know much of. but yeah, look around this board and others and youll see the term "damascus to glencliff" thrown around a lot. that said, i still feel confident in saying the rollercoaster is the hardest full day hike between rockfish gap and at least VT. no one has yet to ever claim theres a harder one, and while that doesnt make the rollercoaster hard in the grand scheme of things, it is noteworthy. to claim it isnt is just grandstanding.

its like 13 bumps, btw. havent counted since i did it, but its def way more than 3 or 4. and more than that, each one of is steep. the profile looks like teeth with every other one missing.

Coffee
07-02-2015, 10:14
its like 13 bumps, btw. havent counted since i did it, but its def way more than 3 or 4. and more than that, each one of is steep. the profile looks like teeth with every other one missing.

Looking at my 2014 guide it is more like 8 or 9 that are well defined but they are typically like 500 feet, sometimes less.

Pedaling Fool
07-02-2015, 10:19
Geez, I wish I had my maps.

Like I said in my last post, I'm going off memory and I seem to only remember 3 or 4 humps, but that's not to say there are not more I definitely know it's not flat), maybe those just stuck in my memory because they were the largest. At some point (at least in my mind) it seems kind of is pointless to count a bump as part of the roller coaster if it's below a certain size, maybe that's why I seem to only remember 3 or 4 humps.

Damn, I wish I had my maps...:mad:

tdoczi
07-02-2015, 10:46
this is most, but not all of it, and is a pretty lousy scale.31202

Pedaling Fool
07-02-2015, 11:01
Yeah, I went looking for the map as well and I found an image of the same map I had and it's more than 3 or 4 as I said above, but (in my defense) those other ones are just too tiny for me to really consider as climbs, despite them being back to back; furthermore, there are some relatively flat areas in there.

Another big factor when looking at profile maps is checking the vertical exaggeration scale, depending of the scale some areas can look very scary, but be really not much at all. Here's a good depiction of that https://www.google.com/search?q=vertical+exaggeration&biw=1298&bih=683&tbm=isch&imgil=pOa_3hLiD5gHQM%253A%253BR3u7kk2AW03rJM%253Bh ttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwmblogs.wm.edu%25252Fcmbai l%25252Ftaming-the-fixey%25252F&source=iu&pf=m&fir=pOa_3hLiD5gHQM%253A%252CR3u7kk2AW03rJM%252C_&usg=__h6XzzjIh2tQY0euU93b-lScXn5c%3D&ved=0CD4Qyjc&ei=hFGVVYncAYKx-QGmtomACg#imgrc=pOa_3hLiD5gHQM%3A&usg=__h6XzzjIh2tQY0euU93b-lScXn5c%3D


Here's the map I used when I hiked the roller coaster section between Rod Hollow Shelter and Snicker's Gap
https://www.google.com/search?q=elevation+profile+of+roller+coaster+secti on+of+appalachian+trail&biw=1298&bih=683&tbm=isch&imgil=ULx-OInkaUjPKM%253A%253BnRr-PZ-tapSXHM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fiwalktherefor eiam.com%25252F2012%25252F04%25252F23%25252Fa-walk-in-the-woods%25252F&source=iu&pf=m&fir=ULx-OInkaUjPKM%253A%252CnRr-PZ-tapSXHM%252C_&dpr=1&usg=__KpVTGyulPfBTa1z5LBbVXIsP7tc%3D&ved=0CC4Qyjc&ei=5k6VVYtvxuX4Ab7wmOgL#imgrc=ULx-OInkaUjPKM%3A&usg=__KpVTGyulPfBTa1z5LBbVXIsP7tc%3D

Traveler
07-02-2015, 11:02
I have heard it said (probably trail lore) the Roller Coaster was one of the areas that contributed to the PUD acronym (pointless up and downs).

Coffee
07-02-2015, 11:05
My understanding is that the trail is a roller coaster in that area rather than gaining and maintaining the ridge line due to private property and inability to get easements.

Pedaling Fool
07-02-2015, 11:12
this is most, but not all of it, and is a pretty lousy scale.31202

BTW, that map goes beyond the northern boundary of the Roller Coaster section. The roller coaster section is between Rod Hollow Shelter and Snicker's Gap, but the map goes about 4 miles north of Snicker's Gap, i.e. outside the roller coaster section. However, it does look like it starts about at the beginning of the RC.

tdoczi
07-02-2015, 11:16
Yeah, I went looking for the map as well and I found an image of the same map I had and it's more than 3 or 4 as I said above, but (in my defense) those other ones are just too tiny for me to really consider as climbs, despite them being back to back; furthermore, there are some relatively flat areas in there.

Another big factor when looking at profile maps is checking the vertical exaggeration scale, depending of the scale some areas can look very scary, but be really not much at all. Here's a good depiction of that https://www.google.com/search?q=vertical+exaggeration&biw=1298&bih=683&tbm=isch&imgil=pOa_3hLiD5gHQM%253A%253BR3u7kk2AW03rJM%253Bh ttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwmblogs.wm.edu%25252Fcmbai l%25252Ftaming-the-fixey%25252F&source=iu&pf=m&fir=pOa_3hLiD5gHQM%253A%252CR3u7kk2AW03rJM%252C_&usg=__h6XzzjIh2tQY0euU93b-lScXn5c%3D&ved=0CD4Qyjc&ei=hFGVVYncAYKx-QGmtomACg#imgrc=pOa_3hLiD5gHQM%3A&usg=__h6XzzjIh2tQY0euU93b-lScXn5c%3D


Here's the map I used when I hiked the roller coaster section between Rod Hollow Shelter and Snicker's Gap
https://www.google.com/search?q=elevation+profile+of+roller+coaster+secti on+of+appalachian+trail&biw=1298&bih=683&tbm=isch&imgil=ULx-OInkaUjPKM%253A%253BnRr-PZ-tapSXHM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fiwalktherefor eiam.com%25252F2012%25252F04%25252F23%25252Fa-walk-in-the-woods%25252F&source=iu&pf=m&fir=ULx-OInkaUjPKM%253A%252CnRr-PZ-tapSXHM%252C_&dpr=1&usg=__KpVTGyulPfBTa1z5LBbVXIsP7tc%3D&ved=0CC4Qyjc&ei=5k6VVYtvxuX4Ab7wmOgL#imgrc=ULx-OInkaUjPKM%3A&usg=__KpVTGyulPfBTa1z5LBbVXIsP7tc%3D


well in reading any profile you have to look at the vertical exaggeration and not just be impressed, one way or the other, but the contour line. that goes both ways, you can make something really had look really flat if you dont exaggerate it enough.

your map looks about like what my map at home looks like. at a glance its not that bad, and again, i dont mean to say it is, but anyone care to find a harder 20 miles in the very large area i've outlined? SNP has a few long, slow ups, followed by long, slow downs, with excellent footing the whole way. MD, PA, NJ are nearly flat aside from very widely spaced occasional short, steep climbs, as is east of the hudson, NY and CT. MA is sort of like SNP, minus any good views from the tops of any of the mountains. the only possible equal is west of hudson, ny.

Spirit Walker
07-02-2015, 12:43
Just a heads up if you're planning on camping in that section, I saw a post a week or so ago that David Lesser Shelter is closed at the moment for some renovation.

illabelle
07-02-2015, 13:04
Just a heads up if you're planning on camping in that section, I saw a post a week or so ago that David Lesser Shelter is closed at the moment for some renovation.

When we went through there, EVERYBODY stopped at D Lesser to get water. Water is a ways down a blue-blaze, but not hard to get. Next water is a few hours away. As I recall, we counted around 30 tents/hammocks set up below the shelter. Maybe the camping area is still open?

Grinder
07-02-2015, 15:32
I hiked the roller coaster a few years back. I remember mild excitement at finally reaching one of the noted stretches of the Trail. I, too, was not overly impressed. The Bears Den made a much bigger impression. I love hot baths!! <G> At my level of fittness, all of the trail is "hard".

I reached Vermont this year. You wanna talk 'hard" I think there to South Maine defines it pretty well.

Pedaling Fool
07-02-2015, 16:30
BTW, that map goes beyond the northern boundary of the Roller Coaster section. The roller coaster section is between Rod Hollow Shelter and Snicker's Gap, but the map goes about 4 miles north of Snicker's Gap, i.e. outside the roller coaster section. However, it does look like it starts about at the beginning of the RC.
There seems to be some confusion of where the northern boundary of the RC section is located. I said it's located at Snicker's Gap, but after going back and reading other's posts, both here in other sites on the web, many claim it's a section of about 14 miles long, which would put the northern boundary ~4 miles north of Snicker's Gap (the descriptions of the southern boundary are all about the same).

I've always remembered hearing that it ended at Snicker's gap, but I've never seen a sign, the only sign I've seen is the one in vicinity of Rod Hollow shelter (pic below)


The ATC site doesn't clearly define the section, but they also seem to have the northern boundary at Snicker's Gap

http://www.appalachiantrail.org/about-the-trail/terrain-by-state/virginia


Excerpt:

"In northern Virginia, the Appalachian Trail follows a long, low ridge, including a notoriously strenuous “roller-coaster” section south of
Snickers Gap."




Sign in vicinity of Rod Hollow Shelter

http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/files/6/9/3/6/3-06-08_088.jpg

Jake2c
07-02-2015, 16:35
I suppose it is your definition of bad when some people say it isn't that bad and some say it is terrible. In my hikes, and specifically with my AT this coming spring, I look at challenges as the reason I am there. If it wasn't challenging and everyone could do it easily then I wouldn't be doing this. Overcoming challenges is where the feeling of accomplishment comes from for me.

ekeverette
07-02-2015, 19:06
thanks guys, I know its a pain in the ass, I just wanted to know where it started from HF...... I can handle it...

Malto
07-02-2015, 19:07
the northern end of the roller coaster is quite clear......... It is located in N. Maine.

THEDON
07-02-2015, 21:16
PATC map profile Snickers Gap to Chester Gap

31209

tdoczi
07-02-2015, 21:27
PATC map profile Snickers Gap to Chester Gap

31209


there a couple more miles of it north of there on the next map. it definitely starts maybe 2-3 miles before bears den.

Studlintsean
07-03-2015, 11:43
It's starts just north of Rod Hollow and ends just south of Raven Rock (a few miles north of Snickers Gap).