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smokymtnsteve
11-20-2005, 20:37
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051120/hl_nm/antibiotics_dc

Just Jeff
11-20-2005, 23:55
Sounds like the study found a correlation rather than a causation (contrary to the first sentence in the article), as evidenced by the quote in last paragraph: "'Biologic data more strongly support the hypothesis that antibiotic use is an indicator of infection and consequent inflammation, which may increase the risk of NHL, and that high cumulative NSAID use is a marker of chronic inflammation,' they conclude."

I also wonder how much the increased lifespan is reflected in the "increased" incidence of certain diseases. Since we live longer, we have a greater chance of X disease developing. I have no idea how much of an impact that would have, though.

Either way, I'll continue to eat Motrin when I need it!

smokymtnsteve
11-21-2005, 00:05
I prefer the Natural pain relievers ;)

Just Jeff
11-21-2005, 01:25
Dude, payote doesn't relieve your pain. Might make you think a pink elephant caused it, though...which is probably a lot funnier than what actually happened!

smokymtnsteve
11-21-2005, 01:29
i wuz thinking more about the O-pie-ates ....

Nightwalker
11-21-2005, 01:57
i wuz thinking more about the O-pie-ates ....
You know, when my head hurts bad enough, I think that 2 demarols and 2 beers would be just about right. Unfortunately, that's just short-term and causes bounce-back.

smokymtnsteve
11-21-2005, 02:12
You know, when my head hurts bad enough, I think that 2 demarols and 2 beers would be just about right. Unfortunately, that's just short-term and causes bounce-back.

It's the Beer Frank..U know dat ole demon ALKYHOL,

now a good ole MJ cig could smooth u right out :jump

Jaybird
11-21-2005, 08:25
SMokyMtnSteve:

for hikers this is ALL the info they need: (in red)

NEW YORK (Reuters Health) - Using antibiotics more than 10 times in childhood increases the likelihood of developing non-Hodgkin's lymphoma (NHL), a cancer that affects the body's lymphatic system, new research suggests.....blah,blah,blah....

......marginally increased NHL risk among heavy users of non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs ( NSAIDs), such as ibuprofen (Motrin, Advil), but no association between the disease and any other types of medication.


NO NEED to spread ALARM...when none is needed.

ANd another thing...when did WHITEBLAZE turn into a FORUM for POT SMOKING & PEYOTE eating???

justusryans
11-21-2005, 08:35
ANd another thing...when did WHITEBLAZE turn into a FORUM for POT SMOKING & PEYOTE eating???

You say that like it's a bad thing!:rolleyes:

icemanat95
11-21-2005, 10:23
I've been using naproxen Sodium recently for my anti-inflammatory pain relief...works pretty good and I don't get anything like the stomach irritation Motrin used to cause me. Celebrex kicked butt though...no pain, no inflammation, no stomach problems at all.

fiddlehead
11-21-2005, 12:05
Americans take WAY TOO MANY pills! YOu don't need them. TV will tell you differently. Doctors will tell you differently, Pharmacists too. But in reality, you don't need 95% of them.
my mother in law is 75 years old and has never been to the doctor! Her knees aren't so good anymore, but she still works sometimes.
I took 2 ibupros on one thru hike and about 6 on another. The last time, i didn't take any. Don't let the brainwashing control you.

smokymtnsteve
11-21-2005, 17:23
SMokyMtnSteve:

for hikers this is ALL the info they need: (in red)

NEW YORK (Reuters Health) - Using antibiotics more than 10 times in childhood increases the likelihood of developing non-Hodgkin's lymphoma (NHL), a cancer that affects the body's lymphatic system, new research suggests.....blah,blah,blah....

......marginally increased NHL risk among heavy users of non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs ( NSAIDs), such as ibuprofen (Motrin, Advil), but no association between the disease and any other types of medication.


NO NEED to spread ALARM...when none is needed.

ANd another thing...when did WHITEBLAZE turn into a FORUM for POT SMOKING & PEYOTE eating???


Jaybird in my years of hiking on the AT I have heard many if not most LD hikers talk about using a LOT of Ibuprofen,,,so common is the use that it is called Vitamin I in hiking community.

so many LD hikers are HEAVY Ibuprofen users,,, I have had friends DIE from lymphoma, so be aware of the potenial risks involved with the use of this chemical.

no one is spreading alarm ..just sharing scientific information. the longer "modern" medicine is around and the more users and heavier use (as Vit I is in the hiking world) the more adverse side effects will come forward.


Use a LOT of Vit I JBIRD???

hopefulhiker
11-21-2005, 17:35
Three doctors told me that it was fine.. I survived off of Vitamin "I" and Snickers bars.. As long as I ate there were no side effects.

the goat
11-21-2005, 17:36
now a good ole MJ cig could smooth u right out :jump

always does the trick....:D

smokymtnsteve
11-21-2005, 17:46
always does the trick....:D

Better than Vit.I any Morning!

RISE AND SHINE!!!

smokymtnsteve
11-21-2005, 17:46
Three doctors told me that it was fine.. I survived off of Vitamin "I" and Snickers bars.. As long as I ate there were no side effects.

yep sounds like a real healthy diet to me ;)

the goat
11-21-2005, 17:48
RISE AND SHINE!!!

wake'n bake is usually on my breakfast menu, ahhhh the b-fast of champions :sun

justusryans
11-21-2005, 19:49
Ya'll are trying to corrupt me with your loose morals! It's working!! :D

smokymtnsteve
11-21-2005, 20:21
Ya'll are trying to corrupt me with your loose morals! It's working!! :D


Loose Morals ???

who are U accusing of haivng Loose Morals??? :eek:

The Immoral ones are the NAZIS that bother Peace Loving Folks ,

who are just using Natural Plants, Plants that our Mother Earth has given us!

LOVE AND RESPECT YOUR MOTHER!!!

Frolicking Dinosaurs
11-21-2005, 22:11
I've been using naproxen Sodium recently for my anti-inflammatory pain relief...works pretty good and I don't get anything like the stomach irritation Motrin used to cause me. Celebrex kicked butt though...no pain, no inflammation, no stomach problems at all.

This has been my experience as well. A question for those who use these while long-distance hiking: Do they continue to work well or do they lose effectiveness like SmokySteve's natural remedies? :D

saimyoji
11-21-2005, 22:48
I was on Naproxen for a while, still take it when my old wounds act up. I find that a milder dose (500mg) has a better effect than a stronger hit (1500mg).

hammock engineer
11-21-2005, 23:20
I used to take I a lot. I think that over time it did lose it effectivness. My doctor told me that I told take 800mg before I work out and 800mg after a long as there was 5 hours inbetween and I eat. I now take Naproxen or something stronger when needed. I think in terms of pain killers, you can develop a immunity to any of them over time.

One thing to remember. Make sure you eat when you are repeatedly taking any form or pain killers. Over time this can have bad effects on your stomach lining if you don't. This might of been said, but taking to many pain killers can mask the real problem and make big problems out of small problems.

smokymtnsteve
11-21-2005, 23:32
This has been my experience as well. A question for those who use these while long-distance hiking: Do they continue to work well or do they lose effectiveness like SmokySteve's natural remedies? :D

Natural remedies lose effectiveness???

Not Yet!!!:D

Bjorkin
11-21-2005, 23:43
Natural remedies lose effectiveness???

Not Yet!!!:D

Agree. Until big Pharma & uncle sam can figure out a way to regulate and tax a product which anyone can grow, it will remain evil and a bad drug unlike nicotine or alcohol. In the meantime, feel free to get a refill on that Percodan, Vicodin, Percoset or anything else that can only be made in a lab and taxed. :mad:

weary
11-22-2005, 00:01
Americans take WAY TOO MANY pills! YOu don't need them. TV will tell you differently. Doctors will tell you differently, Pharmacists too. But in reality, you don't need 95% of them.
my mother in law is 75 years old and has never been to the doctor! Her knees aren't so good anymore, but she still works sometimes.
I took 2 ibupros on one thru hike and about 6 on another. The last time, i didn't take any. Don't let the brainwashing control you.
One reason that we have the highest health costs of any industrial nation and rank about 20th in longevity and overall health, I'm convinced, is the advertising and resultant over prescribing of drugs.

Three years ago I somewhat reluctantly agreed to having a heart valve replaced. After I left the hospital my cardiologist, put me on nine different medicines. All went well for a month. I was walking five miles a day. Then suddenly my lungs started acting up and I could hardly walk 200-feet to pick up my mail. I went back to the heart doctor and was told not to worry. "Keep exercising and you'll be all right," he said, before discharging me for a year.

I ended up in the hospital two days later. The lung specialist spent an hour asking questions and then decided one of the medicines must be to blame. He told me to stop them all. Immediately. My lungs immediately improved somewhat, but have never totally recovered. An internet search revealed why. I read dozens of warnings about a common and often fatal side effect of one of the heart medicines was fibrosis of the lungs.

A year later I returned to the cardiologist for a checkup on my heart. He exclaimed, "Aren't you glad now that you had the surgery. Look at you. You're 74 years old and no longer have to take any medicines!"

I looked at him with disgust and walked away.

Weary

smokymtnsteve
11-22-2005, 00:21
another Weary,,we spend TOO MUCH $$$ on ole farts in thier last days,,;)

not that we should give comfort and help to ole farts but we shouldn;t be torturinf them with extraordinary measures as we do just to give them 2 more days.

more effective end of life care such as Hopice, and spend the $$$ on preventative measures for the younger and healthier,
also a change in lifestyle and eating habits could go a long way to reducing health care spending.

also universal coverage for all Amerikans would reduce the total $$$ spent as folks we get treatment at earlier stages of sickness when less costly treatments could be effective.

uhh..pass the morphine please :rolleyes:

weary
11-22-2005, 00:40
another Weary,,we spend TOO MUCH $$$ on ole farts in thier last days,,;)

....more effective end of life care such as Hopice, and spend the $$$ on preventative measures for the younger and healthier,
also a change in lifestyle and eating habits could go a long way to reducing health care spending.
also universal coverage for all Amerikans would reduce the total $$$ spent as folks we get treatment at earlier stages of sickness when less costly treatments could be effective.
uhh..pass the morphine please :rolleyes:
I couldn't agree more. We have the limited public health care system totally backwards. We subsidize care for old folks, therefore keeping them alive on average, a few days or weeks longer, but ignore the kids facing a lifetime of living.

The current administration has compounded the wrong, adding medicines to the elderly health care mix, and slashing help for poor families and their kids.

Weary

Blue Jay
11-22-2005, 01:09
This has been my experience as well. A question for those who use these while long-distance hiking: Do they continue to work well or do they lose effectiveness like SmokySteve's natural remedies? :D

Everything loses it's effectiveness and even becomes harmful if over used. Using any pain killer while continuing to perform the activity that caused the pain is a very effective way to make that pain permanent.

Just Jeff
11-22-2005, 08:12
The current administration has compounded the wrong, adding medicines to the elderly health care mix, and slashing help for poor families and their kids.

That's because old people vote, and generally vote on a few specific issues - obviously health care is one of them. Targeting health care has a higher return on votes than programs for the poor, I'd imagine.

Regardless, I agree that the biggest issue is a change in lifestyle. Wanna hear something funny? When I was in Italy for 3 months, I'd often be walking behind a good-looking 20-something with nice legs in a modest skirt. Then she'd turn around and be about 60 instead of the 20 I expected. Because they walk/bike everywhere - no McDonalds, no elevators! Those two things can be the downfall of our society, I tell ya!

As long as we can have fat-bomb fast-food delivered to our door while the brain-sludge-machine tells us "you don't have to exercise to lose weight", we're in for a hurtin!

Now if you carry your fat-bomb in your pack for 10 miles before you eat it, that's a different story...

gumby
11-22-2005, 11:17
Just a word of warning. Vitamin I or tylenol can damage your liver if taken in large doses for extended periods of time. I am a medical assistant and always advise my patients (per the Doc I work for) not to take more than 4 grams per day. So if you use the 500 mg tablets then you only can take 8 per day.

I have osteoarthritis in both knees, I can't hike the AT until I get replacements, I take mobic 15 mg per day, my Doc has me go to the lab every 3 months to check my liver enzymes to make sure that everything was ok. Anyone taking celebrex should also do the same.

gumby

weary
11-22-2005, 11:29
....Now if you carry your fat-bomb in your pack for 10 miles before you eat it, that's a different story...
I wiled away dull moments on the trail planning an "all you can eat of anything you want" dieting business. I would guarantee weight loss -- providing you first carried everything you consumed daily for 15 miles up and down hills in a 40 pound pack.

Weary

Bjorkin
11-22-2005, 15:46
...As long as we can have fat-bomb fast-food delivered to our door while the brain-sludge-machine tells us "you don't have to exercise to lose weight", we're in for a hurtin!...



Right on. We are a society of consumers.

- Too fat? Buy a pill. Don't worry about exercise, that was sooo 1984.

- No friends or girlfriend? Buy some beer or a car. They'll flock to you.

- Looking a little aged? C'mon dog you need botox. Extreme makeover!

- Just not feeling right? Ask your doctor how "____" can help you. Hey, it's FDA approved. Gotta be good for you!

- Have you been hurt in an auto accident? Call Dewey, Cheatham & Howe. Sure as hell wasn't your fault.

- Can't afford that new Xbox360? Visa takes you where you want to go. Priceless.

- In debt? Your problem isn't a simple spend to earn ratio. No, you need to consolidate at 20% and buy your way out of debt.

How did we ever get by before commercials? You are a target market.

Just Jeff
11-22-2005, 16:44
My favorite are the AMEX commercials. No preset spending limit. So spend the hell out of the credit card without worrying about those embarassing credit limits.

Save the embarassment until they repo your car and lein your house. Then charge the Ibuprofen for the headaches on your other cards.

whitedove
11-22-2005, 18:04
Agree. Until big Pharma & uncle sam can figure out a way to regulate and tax a product which anyone can grow, it will remain evil and a bad drug unlike nicotine or alcohol. In the meantime, feel free to get a refill on that Percodan, Vicodin, Percoset or anything else that can only be made in a lab and taxed. :mad:

Exactly! You hit the nail on the head!

bfitz
11-23-2005, 03:09
I prefer the Natural pain relievers ;)
No doubt. :p

bfitz
11-23-2005, 03:11
People are so damned stupid about taking care of themselves and so woefully undereducated about health and nutrition and medicine it is shocking...another example of evolution in action I guess...

bfitz
11-23-2005, 03:12
Basic awareness on the part of the public would solve all of these problems...as well as most of the rest of our problems I guess...go figure...

rhjanes
11-23-2005, 14:48
Also, really on all drugs, but the synthtic tylenol's and such, if they are going to expire in a month, TOSS THEM. buy new. my dentist told me they break down very quickly and can cause liver damage in high dosese or when expired. the generic is cheap. toss and buy new.

neo
11-23-2005, 16:29
i use much less now that i were super feet inserts and take a combo of calcium potassium and magnesium,foot pain almost zero now:cool: neo

bfitz
11-23-2005, 18:39
Also, really on all drugs, but the synthtic tylenol's and such, if they are going to expire in a month, TOSS THEM. buy new. my dentist told me they break down very quickly and can cause liver damage in high dosese or when expired. the generic is cheap. toss and buy new.
Tylenol is the number 1 cause of liver failure in the US. Doesn't mix well with another popular painkiller, booze, either. Good ol' asprin plus a little coffee and smoke a joint, and my pain is gone...unless its real bad pain, and nothing over the counter will help with that. My greatest power hike occured one day on a combination of vicodin, caffeine and ephedrine...and weed of course...talk about no pain, plus I was eating up miles like they were pizza. Can't do that every day though, but once in a while painkillers will get you through the pain. No drug is good for your liver in large quantities...except weed, of course....

fiddlehead
11-24-2005, 17:36
I too have had some of my biggest mileage days ever while being baked. What's up with that? (i've also had my lowest) go figure

the goat
11-25-2005, 12:22
I too have had some of my biggest mileage days ever while being baked. What's up with that? (i've also had my lowest) go figure

me too. i've been trying to decipher the mystery for some time now, to no avail. oh well, guess i'll have to keep "researching":D

smokymtnsteve
11-25-2005, 15:07
I too have had some of my biggest mileage days ever while being baked. What's up with that? (i've also had my lowest) go figure

your a everyday baker//??????

Jaybird
11-25-2005, 15:18
Three doctors told me that it was fine.. I survived off of Vitamin "I" and Snickers bars.. As long as I ate there were no side effects.


SMS: Just like "Hopeful Hiker" (who I hiked with for a few days...til he left me in the dust)...i took "Vitamin I" every day (approx 800mg)...no problems.....but, i did have some "withdrawal" symptoms when i stopped eating several SNICKERS bars a day when i came off the trail......hehehehehe:D

smokymtnsteve
11-25-2005, 15:27
SMS: Just like "Hopeful Hiker" (who I hiked with for a few days...til he left me in the dust)...i took "Vitamin I" every day (approx 800mg)...no problems.....but, i did have some "withdrawal" symptoms when i stopped eating several SNICKERS bars a day when i came off the trail......hehehehehe:D

give it some time J bird...NHL takes some time to develop...maybe you'll get lucky :D

DLFrost
11-28-2005, 10:08
I too have had some of my biggest mileage days ever while being baked. What's up with that?
Explantion #1: Yea, but you were going in the wrong direction! :datz
Explantion #2: You just thought you were cranking big miles. Actually you just woke up at the same shelter and Remembered Kinda Funny.


I bring aspirin and Acetaminophen. Since they work differently you can take 'em together--and both are anti-inflammatory as well as painkillers.

Doug Frost

Teatime
11-28-2005, 10:28
You accuse others of being Nazis yet now you are deciding who should live and who should die? Maybe we should euthanize dope smoking hippies, eh?
another Weary,,we spend TOO MUCH $$$ on ole farts in thier last days,,;)

not that we should give comfort and help to ole farts but we shouldn;t be torturinf them with extraordinary measures as we do just to give them 2 more days.

more effective end of life care such as Hopice, and spend the $$$ on preventative measures for the younger and healthier,
also a change in lifestyle and eating habits could go a long way to reducing health care spending.

also universal coverage for all Amerikans would reduce the total $$$ spent as folks we get treatment at earlier stages of sickness when less costly treatments could be effective.

uhh..pass the morphine please :rolleyes:

Skeemer
11-28-2005, 11:09
...you make me sick. If you continue the personal attacks on my hero SMS I will take up a collection and put out a contract on you...I mean it! He has made over 3,300 contributions to this site and you a measly 150.

In the future, please confine your WB comments to the, "Who's your hero" thread where they belong.:eek:

fiddlehead
11-28-2005, 15:42
Seriously, i did my biggest mile day on the JMT run in 2000 while baked. We did a 60 that day and it was the only day i smoked. My partner said: what got into you today?
I was going to try it for the last part of the leadville 100 but decided not to when the time came. Figured i'd just stop and lay down.
I think there must be something to this, really. I'll have to keep studying the phenomenom. (sp?)

Skeemer
11-28-2005, 16:44
Why do they call it "being baked?':confused:

smokymtnsteve
11-28-2005, 16:50
Why do they call it "being baked?':confused:

because ur cooked, dude :D

smokymtnsteve
11-28-2005, 17:32
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051128/hl_nm/buttocks_dc

bfitz
11-28-2005, 17:41
SMS- I can always find something I agree on with each person I meet.:D

And I've been injecting by butt for years and the insulin makes these little fat deposits form at the injection site, so finding a good spot to shoot up into can be irritating, especially since you know it wont last...:datz

bfitz
11-28-2005, 17:45
I find that weed helps me get into that mental zone where you are singlemindedly focused on a repetitive task but still entertained and motivated...and pain is dimly percieved. Seems like a cuople of bars of "zipity doo dah..." and its already lunchtime and we've done 15 miles...

justusryans
11-28-2005, 20:09
...you make me sick. If you continue the personal attacks on my hero SMS I will take up a collection and put out a contract on you...I mean it! He has made over 3,300 contributions to this site and you a measly 150.

In the future, please confine your WB comments to the, "Who's your hero" thread where they belong.:eek:

Me too! Steve's good people....:D