View Full Version : Snake safety in NC/TN?
slbirdnerd
07-23-2015, 13:19
I have yet to see a snake on the AT myself, however, I've seen some posts on various sites lately that people have seen some lately (rattlers). I'll be hiking for a few days with my 13-year-old son in a couple weeks and, without freaking him out, want to make sure I talk to him about snake safety. What's the word? What do you do when you encounter a potentially dangerous snake on the trail? Tips for watching out for them? (FYI, I'm not afraid of snakes and totally respect them.)
Thank you in advance!
illabelle
07-23-2015, 13:42
We've hiked almost all of the AT in GA, NC, and TN and have not seen many snakes - probably between 12 and 20. Several of those were garter snakes or similar, and were simply crossing the trail hoping not to be stepped on. Maybe there were hundreds more within a few inches of the trail watching us pass by that we never saw because we were focused on where to put our feet. Maybe if we'd been there at warmer times of the year, we'd have seen more. Maybe in rockier places like Pennsylvania, there are snakes everywhere.
The only interaction I recall with a venomous snake was when I was standing barefoot in the grass just above a shelter in the north half of the Smokies (Pecks? Tri-Corner?). I was startled by movement across my foot when a snake slithered away from me. I'm sure it was a pit viper (copperhead or rattler) because of the body and head shape and general markings, but I guess I was too started to get a good enough look to determine which one.
I'm not particularly afraid of them, but the consequences of a bite in the backcountry can be pretty serious. FWIW, it didn't try to eat me.
bigcranky
07-23-2015, 14:25
On the trail we mostly see black snakes and garters. We've seen a couple of rattlers on the trail very early in the morning trying to warm up. One copperhead on a state park trail near our house, and another one in our garden a couple of years ago. :)
Basic snake safety: don't put your hands into places you can't see. Don't pick up the snake and try to kiss it (while telling your friends "Hold my beer and watch this!").
Moosling
07-23-2015, 14:38
Observe from a distance, normally they will move away from you if they sense your presence, a little poke with a trekking pole should do the trick if you want to get that close, if not grab a longer branch or something, Snakes don't chase people contrary to popular belief. I don't see you having a problem. You could always walk around them too.
Gambit McCrae
07-23-2015, 14:48
Don't keep two ear buds in your head while walkin in summer. Watch out in rocky and "fallen tree" areas. if he is on the trail and not coiled up, wait him out. If he is coiled up on trail simply walk around him and give him respectable space. I have walked 700 miles mostly in snake weather(70-90 degrees) and have seen non. But they are out there. The "national venom/ poison center" <<name is not exact, had a very good in case bitten list which can be found if searched
Here's probably the most applicable answer to your question:
Don’t let your fear keep you from enjoying the outdoors. Rattlesnakes are actually quite docile and shy when left undisturbed and will only strike in self defense when harassed or startled. Use caution when hiking in rattlesnake country. Wear sturdy shoes or boots and loose fitting pants. Stay on established trails and keep pets on a leash, even if they are well behaved. Scan the area in front of you and be aware of where you are placing your feet. Use caution when placing your hands or feet atop or among rocks and crevices. Avoid running or allowing children to run, especially in dense vegetation, as you may startle a snake or you may not see it until it is too late. If you do encounter a rattlesnake, keep a safe distance from it and leave it alone. Most rattlesnake bites result from the snake being harassed or picked up!
Only four venomous snakes in the U.S. and the likelihood of encountering a Coral or Cottonmouth, although possibly, is very unlikely on the AT in NC and TN. Copperheads and various Rattlesnake species being the only venomous snakes to be largely aware of in NC and TN on the AT. Leran to positively identify the few venomous snakes in the U.S. and their habits. Then, know, and hopefully avoid, under what scenarios humans are typically bitten by these venomous snakes where you'll be and the activities you'll be engaged.
Personally, I've encountered quite a few snakes on the AT mostly non venomous though. Copperheads I usually encounter around rock piles, wooded ravines not far from streams and water sources, at the base of large trees, and sometimes near shelters. I'm yet to encounter an aggressive one. Non venomous water snakes can resemble them. I've had Copperheads creep over my sleeping bag and over my feet. Beautiful creatures. Rattle snakes I have often alarmingly come across immediately adjacent to or on the trail where they were likely warming themselves in a sunny spot as I've startled them where the trail was thick with underbrush when I was absently minded zooming along at a high pace wearing both earbuds just as Gambit McCrae said to avoid. I've come dangerously close to stepping on several agitated rattlesnakes as a result of my actions. Be alert around old farmsteads, buildings, including the AT shelters, and docks, dams, riprap, and rocky shoreline as snakes food sources are usually present there that can attract them. Be alert, aware and knowledgable but not fearful. Knowledge, wisdom, and non human centered cooperation is always better than ignorance, undue fear, and human arrogance. When I've maintained my distance and sought not to harass or pick snakes up and have some idea of their habits I have had zero issues.
Jake (the Snake) and I have a long standing agreement - I leave him alone and he leaves me alone.
Tennessee Viking
07-24-2015, 07:57
I have only seen garters and racers. I have never seen a rattler myself. But there are plenty from the stories and pictures I have seen.
Keep your eyes on the trail.
Watch where you squat.
Be alert in rocky areas.
On stepovers. Step onto the down tree or rock and then step down passed it. Or rake the blind spot.
Hang your food at shelters. Accessible food brings mice. Mice brings snakes.
Hike around snakes on the trail when you can. Sometimes you have to use your poles to pull them off.
Use your poles to push through brush and weedy areas.
Never kill them.
slbirdnerd
07-24-2015, 08:30
Great advice, everyone, thank you! And thanks TN Viking--just the stuff I wanted to relay to my son!
Abatis1948
07-24-2015, 08:59
I keep my eyes on the trail so much that my wife says my name should be “Heads Up”. I try to always play it safe while hiking. I check the other side of any dead fall in the trail before stepping or crawling over it. In the three years I have been hiking the AT I have seen one rattlesnake and one copperhead. I just walked around both. About a month ago one of my fifteen year old grandsons (I have two) and I were hiking between Unicoi Gap and Dicks Creek. He looked down and was straddled a four foot rattlesnake. The snake froze, but Dustin did not. He was amazed that the snake just lay there trying to blend into its surroundings. He took a few pictures and moved on. By the time I reached that part of the trail the snake was long gone. Just keep your eyes open and follow the advice others have given you here.
TREKMAN001
07-24-2015, 12:14
To me, the crazy thing about snakes is that if they are not moving, they just don't register in my vision! It is their ability to blend in with their surroundings that makes them so startling to see.
Keep your eyes open, not only for movement, but for color patterns. After my encounter with a Timber Rattler last May, I have learned to look for repeating color patterns...
It's a learning thing. Instinctively, you will become more aware.
It was a beautiful creature, by the way. The one I saw last May... The first I have seen since I was a kid!
Guy.
Mr. Bumpy
07-24-2015, 19:45
The other week my son stepped over a smallish rattler that was hanging out on some rocks on the ridgeline in Madison County, and I see all varieties of snakes often on summer time hikes. I take it as a privilege of hiking to see these types of critters. I think about snake first aid but as far as a concern, bees, wasps, and lightening when hiking on a ridge are more to the front.
Well, I must be a snake magnet. On my recent epic (for me) section, from Damascus to Amicalola, I encountered two rattlesnakes, maybe six or seven king snakes (one of which dropped out of the rafters of a shelter and onto the shoulders of a fellow hiker I was chatting with), a ring snake, a garter snake, and about three brownish mottled two-foot-long snakes. I've seen plenty on other sections, too. They sometimes startle me, but I like to see them, just as I like to see all wildlife. Gambit McCrae and Dogwood offer good advice.
MuddyWaters
07-24-2015, 20:52
Snakes not an issue.
They avoid people, especially poisionous.
If you see one, be thankful. Give it space, you are in its house.
Remember, they keep the mouse population in check.
Just watch where you step, especially off trail. And watch where you put hands.
Mountain Dog
07-30-2015, 17:52
I'm not into holistic medicine. BUT, I worry about my German Shepherd when hiking. He is very inquisitive. Can't get or afford anti venom and when you can't get to a vet really fast there is not really much need to go. I read some articles about holistic medicine that seems to prevent really serious damage when a rattler hits. I carry the inexpensive pills in my cars and packs all the time now. Do not know if they will work as I have read and really do not want to find out. But, at least I'll try something rather than hope he is not killed. I will not provide the names of the pills because there are several supposedly holistic medicines out there. Might pay everyone that is worried about snakes to google holistic remedies.
I was taught that if you kill and eat a rattler, don't eat the head
Another reason to have Trekking Poles. I was hiking in Ohio and went to clear the trail by moving a tree branch with my pole. Problem was the branch was alive, coil and rattled! While he maintained his fluids, my leaked as I backed away. Cool Timber Rattler that was swallowing a chipmunk maybe... I just notice the bulge behind his head. He would not leave the trail and not wanting to be desert, I gave him the trail and a wide berth and moved around him. One helpful thing you can share with your son is that mature venemous snakes don't like to waste their venom on objects that they know are not food and too large. I am actually most leery of baby copperheads.
The cool thing is that once you come across a rattler, your senses become heightened. A few months later, I heard that same rattle sound and jumped away and spun to see a large black snake hitting his tail on leaves. Once he knew he was had, he glinded across the trail and downhill will out any "S" movement. Very cool to see.
Encounters with nature can alway's be a worthwhile experience if respect is always deomonstrated.
Traveler
07-31-2015, 10:04
I've always found putting ones face near small openings in rocks and brush piles, making kissing sounds often yields interesting results. Those who don't do that a lot usually have a relatively peaceful day and avoid dangerous man eating snakes. :D
PatmanTN
07-31-2015, 10:42
FWIW, I see timber rattlers almost exclusively in the Smokies this time of year. Rare that I see anything else. They usually rattle in plenty of time to stop or swerve. On a couple of occasions I've been zoned out and not paying attention and walked within inches of them. Rangers told me that when they just lay there all stretched out and seem unresponsive, they likely just ate; that seemed to be the case when I've unintentionally gotten so close to them.
My most memorable snake encounter over the years was at the Sugar Cove site the smokies (Gabes mtn), just after crossing the creek into the cove, a large black rat snake stood up like a cobra and hissed at me; One of the freakiest things I've seen and somewhat traumatizing.lol
Another Kevin
07-31-2015, 15:36
Well, I must be a snake magnet. On my recent epic (for me) section, from Damascus to Amicalola, I encountered two rattlesnakes, maybe six or seven king snakes (one of which dropped out of the rafters of a shelter and onto the shoulders of a fellow hiker I was chatting with), a ring snake, a garter snake, and about three brownish mottled two-foot-long snakes. I've seen plenty on other sections, too. They sometimes startle me, but I like to see them, just as I like to see all wildlife. Gambit McCrae and Dogwood offer good advice.
You and me both. I came upon a whole ball of garter snakes in the Catskills a couple of summers ago. They scooted when they felt my boots vibrating the rock. This group wasn't even a quarter of them - the rest scooted before I could get the camera out. I think I was interrupting something and the last few had been, uhm, kind of distracted.
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3695/9514584439_bd46d346d4_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/fuLJti)
Why does it always have to be snakes? (https://flic.kr/p/fuLJti) by Kevin Kenny (https://www.flickr.com/photos/ke9tv/), on Flickr
Mostly I hike far enough north that coral snakes, moccasins and even copperheads are unheard of, although sometimes I make it down into the northern end of the copperheads' range. (There has never been one sighted in the Adirondacks, or in the Catskills above West Saugerties (there is one den of them down in the valley there). There are a few dens of timber rattlers, and a lot of the hikers can tell you exactly where they are. The snakes never make it more than a few hundred yards from the den, so the rest of the Catskills are viper-free. I understand that the situation is similar up in the Adirondacks, and for that matter, over in the Taconics and Green Mountains, but I haven't hiked enough there yet to be able to tell you where the dens are.
Tipi Walter
07-31-2015, 17:15
My most memorable snake encounter over the years was at the Sugar Cove site the smokies (Gabes mtn), just after crossing the creek into the cove, a large black rat snake stood up like a cobra and hissed at me; One of the freakiest things I've seen and somewhat traumatizing.lol
Hey Patman, I saw a similar sight on the Big Stack Gap trail several years ago---
https://tipiwalter.smugmug.com/Backpacking2008/Ricky-Bobby-and-the-Southern/i-ptrZffS/0/L/Trip%2077%20032-L.jpg
And for backpackers who are really paranoid, get these---
https://www.turtleskin.com/webstore/content/images/thumbs/0000019_snake-gaiters_300.jpeg
Six ounces each from Turtleskin.
slbirdnerd
07-31-2015, 20:41
Great info, everyone, thank you! Looking very forward to our trip next week!
Five Tango
08-02-2015, 10:07
I'm not into holistic medicine. BUT, I worry about my German Shepherd when hiking. He is very inquisitive. Can't get or afford anti venom and when you can't get to a vet really fast there is not really much need to go. I read some articles about holistic medicine that seems to prevent really serious damage when a rattler hits. I carry the inexpensive pills in my cars and packs all the time now. Do not know if they will work as I have read and really do not want to find out. But, at least I'll try something rather than hope he is not killed. I will not provide the names of the pills because there are several supposedly holistic medicines out there. Might pay everyone that is worried about snakes to google holistic remedies.
FWIW,my wife has her little dog vaccinated for snakebite annually.Dog got the shot on Monday and then received a pretty good bite from a rattler on Friday.It worked!
Mountain Dog
08-03-2015, 18:28
FWIW,my wife has her little dog vaccinated for snakebite annually.Dog got the shot on Monday and then received a pretty good bite from a rattler on Friday.It worked!
Interesting. I've read about the vaccination. The general consensus from "experts" in the east is that it does not work because it was developed in the west for a particular western rattle snake. Also, it supposedly does not work for cottonmouths. Your experience is a much better argument for the vaccine than the "expert" reasoning.
Five Tango
08-03-2015, 18:45
Interesting. I've read about the vaccination. The general consensus from "experts" in the east is that it does not work because it was developed in the west for a particular western rattle snake. Also, it supposedly does not work for cottonmouths. Your experience is a much better argument for the vaccine than the "expert" reasoning.
So I asked the wife today what she paid and she said it was $52 for the shot and the booster.The snake that bit the little lap dog was likely a rattlesnake like we have here in Central Ga.And judging for the bite marks,the snake was a healthy sized adult.
Mountain Dog
08-04-2015, 15:34
So I asked the wife today what she paid and she said it was $52 for the shot and the booster.The snake that bit the little lap dog was likely a rattlesnake like we have here in Central Ga.And judging for the bite marks,the snake was a healthy sized adult.
Thanks for the info. I'll explore it. I hike mostly in north Georgia and rattlers worry me more than cotton mouths because the cotton mouths are somewhat limited in their range, mostly but not always near water.