View Full Version : Leg Cramping
I have trouble with leg cramping. I can get cramps in my calfs during the day but I can usually just press out the cramp by doing a calf stretch. When I did my first 20 mile day I had cramps in both my legs that night. Both my calfs and the front and back of both of my thighs cramped up. Man, that was a rough night.
What's the best way to avoid cramping? Would doing some leg stretching before or at the end of a day's hike prevent it? I hear potassium helps with cramps so would a change in diet help?
Too Tall Paul
I gather too little potassium or too little salt can cause cramping, especially if you have sweated a lot during the day.
saimyoji
11-23-2005, 20:37
Eat more :banana:banana:banana:banana:banana:banana:banana: banana:banana:banana:banana
I gather too little potassium or too little salt can cause cramping, especially if you have sweated a lot during the day.
Yep, I sweat alot when I hike / backpack. so much that you can see white streaks in my cloths, cap and on my backpack sometimes. Salt! My right calf cramped up on me during my last section hike over ole Roan Mtn a few weeks ago. Had to stretch it out. I try to drink alot of water before, during and after each day along with Gatorade or Powerade drinks. Diet can help too. I try to stretch out before I start but sometimes forget. :datz
Next physical I will ask my doctor about salts tablets (don't want any high blood pressure). During high school football season we would take salt tablets to ward off any problems. Don't know if this is the answer or not or if something else may be of help but I want to know.
Happy Trails,
Chip:)
Eat more banana
:banana = Potassium
Too Tall Paul
i took this combo on my last hike in oct,i never had foot pain either
600 mg calcium 200 mg magnesium 100 mil potassium,no leg cramps or foot pain:cool: neo
I have trouble with leg cramping.
I feel your pain......
smokymtnsteve
11-24-2005, 01:16
I feel your pain......
yea LEG cramping but not Legs cramping...:eek:
my legs are gonna hurt tonite..been snowshoeing and packing trail
Kerosene
11-24-2005, 10:05
See what the doctor says about salt, but I've found that simply hydrating a lot more, both before I start and while I'm hiking, makes a material difference in whether I cramp or not. I learned to "camel up" after a long hot day of hiking in Vermont. My buddy and I were trying to play cards at the shelter and I had to stop because my hands kept cramping, keeping me from holding the cards in my hand. I finally stopped cramping an hour or so after I chugged over a liter of water.
I feel your pain......
And I can't comprehend your pain :(
Too Tall Paul
fiddlehead
11-24-2005, 17:31
I get terrible cramps too sometimes. I've tried everything: potassium, salt, bananas, massage. I believe it comes from dehyration more than anything. When i finished the Leadville 100 in 2001, my whole body cramped up, all night. It was some of the worst pain i've ever felt. Would i do it again? sure, if i had the time to train like that again. good luck, i'll be watching this thread to see if there's any new solutions to try.
Whistler
11-24-2005, 20:56
Good water and mineral balance is important. How about massage for prevention and response? For me, it's a good way to get blood flowing back in the tissue, and maybe help flush out some of the waste build-up in the muscles. It will also help keep things relaxed without the strain that over-stretching can cause. A light rub while you're hiking can be nice, maybe during your lunch break. And about 99% of the time I stretch and massage before bed to try to keep from tightening too much.
-Mark
rambunny
11-25-2005, 13:38
Add more instant mash potatoes to your diet along with the afore mentioned, hydration and salt. My cure is having a big bowl of ramen noodles with instant mashed potatoes with hot sauce.
ALL suggestions are so TRUE!
HYDRATE! HYDRATE! HYDRATE!
stretches are always good....but, enuff POTASSIUM in your diet is better.
look for TRAIL SNACKS that feature salt & POTASSIUM.
if not, you'll be carrying more pills to "buddy" up with that "VITAMIN I"!:D
saimyoji
11-26-2005, 03:39
Cramping is a result of muscle tissue inability to contract properly. When the ion balance inside/outside muscle cells is upset, or when there is long term oxygen debt (resulting in lactic acid build-up) the result is muscle "misfire." (There's much more biochemistry involved, but this should be enough for our discussion.) This misfire results in the muscle tissue locking in a contracted position, straining on other tissues, hence the pain of the cramp.
To avoid cramping: make sure you stay hydrated with plenty of electrolytes (however you get them: bananas, Gatorade, etc.). This will help to avoid the ionic imbalance. Stretching before/after excercise has proven to be of little scientific help to muscle tissue, save to prepare the tissue for contraction (use). Long term, serious stretching/flexibility training is required to make a noticeable difference in flexibility, muscle elasticity (do yoga for six months before your hike). Make sure you are getting enough oxygen. Breath properly. If you are straining up the mountain, huffing and puffing, you are more likely to have CO2 build up in your blood, reducing O2 to you cells, building up lactic acid. SLOW DOWN, catch your breath. There are powdered drinks that target lactic acid (Cytomax is one) that will reduce lactic acid in your muscles. These need to be drunk(drank?) on a regular basis to be effective.
I follow my own advice and rarely cramp up. I find I only cramp when I'm dehydrated or dead tired.
Youngblood
11-26-2005, 11:41
Cramping is a result of muscle tissue inability to contract properly. When the ion balance inside/outside muscle cells is upset, or when there is long term oxygen debt (resulting in lactic acid build-up) the result is muscle "misfire." (There's much more biochemistry involved, but this should be enough for our discussion.) This misfire results in the muscle tissue locking in a contracted position, straining on other tissues, hence the pain of the cramp.
To avoid cramping: make sure you stay hydrated with plenty of electrolytes (however you get them: bananas, Gatorade, etc.). This will help to avoid the ionic imbalance. Stretching before/after excercise has proven to be of little scientific help to muscle tissue, save to prepare the tissue for contraction (use). Long term, serious stretching/flexibility training is required to make a noticeable difference in flexibility, muscle elasticity (do yoga for six months before your hike). Make sure you are getting enough oxygen. Breath properly. If you are straining up the mountain, huffing and puffing, you are more likely to have CO2 build up in your blood, reducing O2 to you cells, building up lactic acid. SLOW DOWN, catch your breath. There are powdered drinks that target lactic acid (Cytomax is one) that will reduce lactic acid in your muscles. These need to be drunk(drank?) on a regular basis to be effective.
I follow my own advice and rarely cramp up. I find I only cramp when I'm dehydrated or dead tired.Nice post!
SGT Rock
11-26-2005, 13:11
Great post saimyoji. Dang, if'n there was a little more meat there about stuff, that would make a great save for the article section. Ever thought about doing an article?
saimyoji
11-26-2005, 13:43
Gimme some time and I'll see what I can do.
Great post! Thanks!
To avoid cramping: make sure you stay hydrated with plenty of electrolytes (however you get them: bananas, Gatorade, etc.). This will help to avoid the ionic imbalance.
Is there any way to get electrolytes without the sugar? Bananas don't carry well on the trail unless dehydrated ahead of time. Does dehydrating a banana also ruin them as a source of electrolytes? Gatorade might be too much sugar. What are other good sources of electrolytes?
Make sure you are getting enough oxygen. Breath properly. If you are straining up the mountain, huffing and puffing, you are more likely to have CO2 build up in your blood, reducing O2 to you cells, building up lactic acid. SLOW DOWN, catch your breath. There are powdered drinks that target lactic acid (Cytomax is one) that will reduce lactic acid in your muscles. These need to be drunk(drank?) on a regular basis to be effective.
Thanks for the tip on Cytomax! A quick Google and it looks like I'd prefer the Cytomax Lite (gotta be watching my blood sugar nowadays). Got any experience with the other powders I saw listed with Cytomax?
Too Tall Paul
Clark Fork
11-26-2005, 15:47
Great post! Thanks!
Is there any way to get electrolytes without the sugar? Bananas don't carry well on the trail unless dehydrated ahead of time. Does dehydrating a banana also ruin them as a source of electrolytes? Gatorade might be too much sugar. What are other good sources of electrolytes?
Thanks for the tip on Cytomax! A quick Google and it looks like I'd prefer the Cytomax Lite (gotta be watching my blood sugar nowadays). Got any experience with the other powders I saw listed with Cytomax?
Too Tall Paul
I was also impressed with Cytomax and their Cytomax Lite. In another post "Gumby" pointed out the sugar content of three well known products. I wrote Cytomax and asked them about their "Lite" brand:
Here is what they said:
"The LGI contains 12 grams of sugar and 16 grams of total carbohydrates. LGI
is lower glycemic index because we use a different blend of carbohydrates
(less maltodextrin which is very high-glycemic)than the regular product.
Please let me know if you have more questions,
Martina"
Here is what Gumby reported. I added the Cytomax Lite to the line up.
Sugar content in Emergen-C is 5 grams, Cytomax has 11, Cytomax Lite has 12 grams, Electro-Mix has none.
Over the winter I am going to try Electro-Mix. I don't want to be bonked :datz with as dose of sugar no matter how disguised.
http://www.mothernature.com/shop/detail.cfm/sku/42474#Description (http://www.mothernature.com/shop/detail.cfm/sku/42474#Description)
Regards,
Clark Fork.
Went looking for Cytomax today. Shaws grocery store didn't carry it. GNC only had a can with a water bottle. Didn't want the water bottle so I passed. Next was Dick's Sporting Goods which didn't carry it. They recommended I try a ski/bike shop here in Concord named S&W Sports. Supposedly Cytomax is big with the endurance bike crowd. S&W had a can of Cytomax but no Cytomax Lite. I bought the can but want to try the Cytomax Lite.
That ElecroMix looks nice. No sugars! One packet would work great for a Nalgene. I'll have to try that too.
Thanks,
Too Tall Paul
Cramping is a result of muscle tissue inability to contract properly. When the ion balance inside/outside muscle cells is upset, or when there is long term oxygen debt (resulting in lactic acid build-up) the result is muscle "misfire." (There's much more biochemistry involved, but this should be enough for our discussion.) This misfire results in the muscle tissue locking in a contracted position, straining on other tissues, hence the pain of the cramp.
To avoid cramping: make sure you stay hydrated with plenty of electrolytes (however you get them: bananas, Gatorade, etc.). This will help to avoid the ionic imbalance. Stretching before/after excercise has proven to be of little scientific help to muscle tissue, save to prepare the tissue for contraction (use). Long term, serious stretching/flexibility training is required to make a noticeable difference in flexibility, muscle elasticity (do yoga for six months before your hike). Make sure you are getting enough oxygen. Breath properly. If you are straining up the mountain, huffing and puffing, you are more likely to have CO2 build up in your blood, reducing O2 to you cells, building up lactic acid. SLOW DOWN, catch your breath. There are powdered drinks that target lactic acid (Cytomax is one) that will reduce lactic acid in your muscles. These need to be drunk(drank?) on a regular basis to be effective.
I follow my own advice and rarely cramp up. I find I only cramp when I'm dehydrated or dead tired.
I am a brand-new user of whiteblaze, so forgive me if I don't follow the proper protocol. I have a question about dehydration and possible long-term effects. In the summer of 2004 I went on a hike along the Knobstone Trail in southern Indiana (some people call it the mini-appalachian). Because the state sent us an obsolete map, we didn't cache water properly and, long-story-short, I got terribly dehydrated. Even though I was sick and cramping terribly, I had to climb the next escarpment in order to get rescued. I could make the ascent only two or three steps at a time, stopping to massage my legs so that I could take another few steps. Pretty awful. But I made it to the top and someone called for help. The medic administered two IV bags of fluid on the spot, then they carried me off the mountain. Ever since that event, I can't walk more than 300 feet without my calves seizing up and burning like hellfire. Is there some connection? (Please don't say it's mental!) Is there a resource out there where I can learn how to get my legs back? Many thanks for your helpful post and for any other information you might offer me. Regards, Lisa.
saimyoji
04-01-2006, 08:59
Lisa,
Wow, that sucks. It sounds like you have some soft tissue damage. My advice to you: get to a physical therapist. Go see someone who is trained to treat these kinds of injuries (I'm not).
Question: Why have you waited nearly two years before seeking help? :confused:
passinBYE
04-01-2006, 12:12
I too feel... hell... on my calfs. but oddly enough only why playing basketball on the hardwood floors...luckly enough not while on the trail.
I have trouble with leg cramping. I can get cramps in my calfs during the day but I can usually just press out the cramp by doing a calf stretch. When I did my first 20 mile day I had cramps in both my legs that night. Both my calfs and the front and back of both of my thighs cramped up. Man, that was a rough night.
What's the best way to avoid cramping? Would doing some leg stretching before or at the end of a day's hike prevent it? I hear potassium helps with cramps so would a change in diet help?
Too Tall Paul
lack of potassium,calcium and magnesium,i had major problems with calf cramping due to diabetes,i wasdrinking water and peeing constantly
once my diabetes was under control that went away,my main point is
keep up your electrolites:cool: neo
Catsgoing
04-01-2006, 14:13
I am not a doctor but worked the as a Medical Surgical Tech most of my working years.
1. Your not drinking enough fluids.
2. You could be a diabetic. Have you had a glucose test?
3. Over use of that muscle hiking.
Take a good multivitamin and if it happens often potassium does help but most people take potassium when on a diuretic (pill that helps you go more).
Those cramps do hurt stretch it out and they seem to attack in the middle of the night... Get up and walk around.....
Good Luck Keep A Watch On The Cramps If Your One That Doesn't Go For Physicals You Should. I feel all thru hikers should have a complete physical before they leave bring some extra medication just in case. Most Doctor's will give you a few day supply of medication you might need on the trail than having to run into town........... Which can be far away....
saimyoji
04-01-2006, 14:25
I've posted this reply in other threads with regards to other people's problems:
If you have a serious problem in your life (marital, substance abuse, mental, medical) the last place you should seek advice is in an online forum full of strangers, many of whom would be happy to hear about your suffering (right swoondick? :D).
Go to the doctor, see a PT, GET MEDICAL ATTENTION.
Oh, and again, why did you wait 2 years? You said you can't walk more than 300 feet without problems? This is way more than a simple electrolyte imbalance.
Good luck.
I am genuinely touched by your responses. How kind you all are! Why did I wait two years? This isn't the first time I've sought help. (Alas, it has been the most helpful!) At first I thought I wasn't stretching out or that I needed new footwear. Then I spoke to my doctor who suggested it might be thyroid trouble (I had some other symptoms that also suggested thyroid); but my thyroid results showed a lower-than-normal number, but within the normal range. I revisited that doctor again for more suggestions about the cramps, but he just shrugged. I guess I kept thinking it would go away. Anyway, most recently I spoke with a new physician who suggested there might be a connection between my cramps and my mountain 'adventure,' but that she couldn't say exactly what. And then I remembered years ago taking a class in college in which we learned about ATP, lactic acid, and all that. So I thought I would just take matters into my own hands and start doing some research. By the way, I continue to walk, I just try to walk through the pain and stop to stretch periodically. Which would you recommend I see first: a physical therapist or an exercise physiologist? Once again, thanks so much for your kind help. lisa
saimyoji
04-01-2006, 17:46
Lisa,
I have no further advice other than to seek medical attention, in whatever form will help: PT, EP? I'm not sure. I would suggest that it depends on the doctor. Always get a 2nd and 3rd opinion. One guy may just want your money, the other may go out of his way to make sure you get help. Doctors no longer hold a position of high esteem until they prove themselves. At least to me.
If you can't walk more than 300 ft, well, that sounds pretty damn serious to me. The event that you described could have resulted in permanent tissue damage, the reason being that muscle tissue does not regenerate at the rate other tissues do (think years/decades instead of days), if at all (this is not certain-we used to believe that nerve tissue did not regenerate, but have since observed otherwise). If you've caused serious scarring to your calve muscles, this may cause the pain you're feeling. There may or may not be a solution.
You may be a candidate for medicinal marijuana. :D
Thank you for the guidance; I will seek medical attention. And regarding medical marijuana, my appetite is bigger than it ought to be right now. Oh my. I would weigh 800 pounds, for sure. Best regards, lisa.
I have experienced this problem for life, during football and hiking, but recently discovered that almonds will supply the potassium to remendy the problem.
Clark Fork
05-04-2006, 02:48
One easy way besides eating bananas :banana regularly to boost potassium is to switch to Morton Lite salt. Serving size is 1/4 teaspoon. Regular salt has 590 mg sodium per serving, Morton Lite salt has 290 mg of sodium and 340 mg of Potassium. Don't wait for the Dr. to tell you to reduce sodium in your diet.:eek:
On the trail I am using Electro Mix. No sugar and it has Mg of potassium, Mg calcium, 20 mg Magnesium, .5 Mg manganese and 5mcg Chromium. I like the lemon-lime flavor. It even fizzes. Made by the same folks that make Emergen-C. Alacer.
See previous post for sugar content and web address.
On leg cramps, don't forget to slip into long pants or warm-ups and to generally keep warm. If you body is chilled, circulation to your limbs will lessen. Chilled legs don't help matters. Second on all the advice to hydrate.
Clark Fork
:p I'm not a doctor, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. Just joking.
Other than cytomax, also look at endurox. It is supposed to be good at preventing cramps and providing energy over time.
Great post Saimyoji!