View Full Version : Headlamp with red light
SGT Rock
12-03-2005, 12:37
I remember some company made a backpacking headlamp that had a red lense or red light. Anyone know what model this was?
Thanks.
SGT. I got an Eveready headlamp at the Home Depot with two white leds and a red led for $12.95 that works great. I only drawback is it has a sliding switch that can turn itself on if not stored properly. Runs on 3 AAA's.
I colored over the clear lense in my headlamp with a red sharpie. Now It shines red. Wears off after a while, so I just clean it off with denatured alcohol and color it again.
I remember some company made a backpacking headlamp that had a red lense or red light. Anyone know what model this was?
Thanks.
Sarge:
I have one I can try and dig out and send to you. I found it on the trail in 2000 and use it rarely. It's an elastic strap headband with a place to slip in the small cigar shaped light. I don''t know what it weighs, but its pretty light. PM me your address and I'll drop it in the mail.
Just don't try and read the AT trail maps at night with the light. The trail "magically disappears with the red light. Took me a few minutes to figure that one out. Doh! :D
Whistler
12-03-2005, 13:21
Petzl Tactikka models have a changeable red lense.
-Mark
I remember some company made a backpacking headlamp that had a red lense or red light. Anyone know what model this was?
Thanks.
Is this for your trip east? Maybe if you could tell us what you need it for, someone might have a suggestion. Not that you need any suggestions from any civilians or less experienced military types.
I remember some company made a backpacking headlamp that had a red lense or red light. Anyone know what model this was?
Thanks.
Is this for your trip east? Maybe if you could tell us how it will be used, someone might have a suggestion or alternative. Not that you need any suggestions from any civilians or less experienced military types. ...Oops, somehow I missed Whistler's post....
SGT Rock
12-03-2005, 14:24
This is so I can read in a tactical enviroment if I need to and then switch to having white light sometimes. Riding a house sometimes makes a headlamp a good idea
MacGyver2005
12-03-2005, 14:25
Petzel sells interchangeable lenses. I know they are available for the Tekka and Tekka Plus, and probably more.
Regards,
-MacGyver
GA-->ME
Riding a house sometimes makes a headlamp a good idea
Pardon this civilian's ignorance, but what is "riding a house"? I was thinking it was a type and you meant "horse", but we don't really use horses in Iraq or do we? Oh, "raiding" a house??
SGT Rock
12-03-2005, 14:32
Pardon this civilian's ignorance, but what is "riding a house"? I was thinking it was a type and you meant "horse", but we don't really use horses in Iraq or do we? Oh, "raiding" a house??
I meant Raiding a house. Sorry about that ;)
I meant Raiding a house. Sorry about that ;)
Well, if you ever decide to raid my house because of any of my blathering here, don't bother with the headlamp, I will leave the light on. ;)
SGT Rock
12-03-2005, 15:00
I come in at about 0200. I normally just shoot your door off the hinges, but in your case I'll knock ;)
What about one of those sweet little County Comm lights someone posted a few days ago? These were made for just what you described. Reading/writing at night. You can leave this little red light clipped to whatever you may need to read and then be free to use any white headlamp you choose.
http://www.countycomm.com/light.htm
I come in at about 0200. I normally just shoot your door off the hinges, but in your case I'll knock ;)
:jump We are going to miss you Rock. Can't we send you with a satellite uplink and a hardened laptop with extra batteries to tide you over until you are near the generator?
Ramble~On
12-03-2005, 15:27
Petzel sells interchangeable lenses. I know they are available for the Tekka and Tekka Plus, and probably more.
Regards,
-MacGyver
GA-->ME
Rock Petzl red inserts snap into the headlamp and it takes about a second to change them. I picked mine at up at an REI. I think I paid $4.95 for a pack of three lens covers...worth it to me.
betic4lyf
12-03-2005, 16:06
just an ideam, but maybe buying a bunch of red led's from an elxtronic store, or online, especially bright ones, and making one yourself.
johnny quest
12-03-2005, 16:29
as i recall the old angle head issue flashlights came with red and blue lenses. i used to steal those for use in lighter more dependable civilian-issue lights.
are you going to post your address for folks to send you goodie packages...or am i out of line asking that?
MDSHiker
12-03-2005, 17:16
I bought my 8yr old daughter a headlamp at Wally World. It has two white and one red. We used it on a night hike in the Smokies. The ranger leading the hike had instructed that everyone only bring a red light...white lights not allowed. We had a great time. At one point, everyone in the group was instructed to turn off their headlamps and wade barefoot across a creek...good time for the kids!
SGT Rock
12-03-2005, 18:27
as i recall the old angle head issue flashlights came with red and blue lenses. i used to steal those for use in lighter more dependable civilian-issue lights.
are you going to post your address for folks to send you goodie packages...or am i out of line asking that?
Little Bear has said he is going to send me the one he found.
As to packages, I plan to give that out as soon as I know myself. Last trip over the WhiteBlazers were great, they started mailing some things before I even left, so once in country, I was the first one in my unit to have packages. Of course I shared them with everyone in my troop.
SGT. I got an Eveready headlamp at the Home Depot with two white leds and a red led for $12.95 that works great. I only drawback is it has a sliding switch that can turn itself on if not stored properly. Runs on 3 AAA's.
I'm not too keen on this light because the clear plastic lens housing reflects stray light all over the place.
Another possibility is the Pelican L1, red led version. Waterproof, breakway lanyard so you can hang it around your neck, very rugged.
Doug Frost
MisterSweetie
12-05-2005, 21:43
Rock, others have mentioned it, but here's a link:
http://www.petzl.com/petzl/LampesProduits?MotRecherche=Quick+Search&pays=0&Langue=en&Gamme=48&Critere=0&Produit=482&ProduitAssocie=
Petzl TACTIKKA PLUS
Alternates easily between white and red light simply by moving the pivoting filter over the LEDs.
Sounds like exactly what you're asking for. $45 on rei. $42 on ebay buy it now including shipping.
Good luck!
FFTorched
12-05-2005, 22:32
I have this Headlamp and love it. I use it for Hunting, Fishing, Hiking, Drinking, and a slew of over activities. It's still on it's origional batteries and it's nearly a year old, though I keep it in heavy rotation with my black diamond headlamp. Backcountry.com has it for $45.
http://www.backcountry.com/store/PTZ0064/Petzl-TacTikka-Plus-Headlamp.html?id=aKxFKPxc
illusionistG
12-05-2005, 22:34
Sarge... check out these two products
Petzl Tactikka Plus Led http://www.cabelas.com
Master Vision Cap Light "Stealth" (Cats Eyes) http://www.thequickstore
SGT. I got an Eveready headlamp at the Home Depot with two white leds and a red led for $12.95 that works great. I only drawback is it has a sliding switch that can turn itself on if not stored properly. Runs on 3 AAA's.I have a Wal-mart lite, also with 2 white and 1 red LEDs, I think for $12.77
The switch does the same thing to me (turns itself on in my pack). I use a tiny square of duct tape to keep it from moving.
I used the red light only once, in hte Ironmasters Hostel when I left about 3:00 am and didn't want to wake anyone. I didn't wake anyone up, but evidently I didn't see my gloves and left them behind, probably under the bunk.
Tim Rich
12-06-2005, 08:07
Rock, others have mentioned it, but here's a link:
http://www.petzl.com/petzl/LampesProduits?MotRecherche=Quick+Search&pays=0&Langue=en&Gamme=48&Critere=0&Produit=482&ProduitAssocie=
Petzl TACTIKKA PLUS
Sounds like exactly what you're asking for. $45 on rei. $42 on ebay buy it now including shipping.
Good luck!
Tactikka Plus is also at Brigade Quartermasters website for 39.99. Drawback is it may use a nonstandard battery? (Uses 3 round AAA-LR3 batteries supplied with product)
Rock, I live about four miles from Brigade Quartermasters' main office in Kennesaw, GA. They offer special pricing for military personnel, but you have to register at http://www.actiongear.com/cgi-bin/tame.exe/agcatalog/professional/mp2.tam to get it.
Take Care,
Tim
LostInSpace
12-17-2005, 02:46
This is so I can read in a tactical enviroment if I need to and then switch to having white light sometimes. Riding a house sometimes makes a headlamp a good idea
Here's a interesting article that deals with red flashlights and their effectiveness at maintaining night vision.
See link:
http://www.stlplaces.com/night_vision.html
Uncle Silly
12-17-2005, 11:37
I have a Wal-mart lite, also with 2 white and 1 red LEDs, I think for $12.77
The switch does the same thing to me (turns itself on in my pack). I use a tiny square of duct tape to keep it from moving.
I think I have that same light. Walmart special. The lense housing (where the switch is mounted on top) pivots, so after I noticed it getting turned on in my pack, I started stowing it pivoted so that the switch was facing the battery pack. (Ie, if I'd been wearing it and turned it on, the light would point straight up.) Once I started packing it this way I had no more accidental switch-ons.
This is not a particularly well-manufactured light; the first one I got went bad (one of the white LEDs died, probably from vibration or moisture killing its contact), but Walmart replaced it with a new one. It's bright, but obviously not as bright as a three- or four-LED headlight. It does have a battery-life advantage though: you're only burning one or two LEDs at a time, so batteries last longer than the three- or four-LED models I've seen.
pdhoffman
12-17-2005, 14:50
The Photon Fusion has one red LED that increases in intensity as you hold down the left side of the switch. It will stop and hold at that intensity when the switch is released. It also has six white LED's. The white LEDs have low, mid, high and several flashing modes it cycles through when right side of switch is held down and stays in the selected mode for switching off/on. Also has a extra bright setting when left side if pressed and released.
Run on three AA batteries.
Stay safe.
Pete Hoffman
Old Corpus
CaptChaos
12-22-2005, 11:13
Hi All:
Try this link:
http://www.optcorp.com/ProductList.aspx?uid=105-281-285
I am new to astronomy but this site has flashlights and other equipment that is used in the field to protect your vision from the light when viewing stars.
Also understand that the mil is using amber light now so I guess it depends what you need it for.
Hope this helps.
John in KY
OhCanada
12-30-2005, 21:11
Rock, Petzl sells lens for the Plus while the Tactical has a flip down one already attached.
I bought the Petzl Tikka XP tonight, it's an upgrade that has a sliding lens to go from spot to flood. You can get a lens kit as well but you insert it from the inside so the colour will always be in the shorter flood mode. The lens kit gives you several colours to choose from.
You might want to concider that the XP has a rubber gasket which will help keep out the sand. The Plus has no gasket.
neighbor dave
12-30-2005, 21:18
http://www.flashlightreviews.com/index1.html
hope this helps!
:welcome :sun
greentick
12-30-2005, 21:49
Hey Rock, blue is supposed to be less visible and more like "starlight." If you are using it for non-tactical purposes. They used to have blue lights in the back of the M113 series troop compartment. Unfortunately, the maps are red lens compatible.
snarbles
11-16-2006, 10:54
Reincarnating an old thread due to my current research.
I've been looking for a new headlamp with a night vision led and found this:
http://www.brunton.com/product.php?id=399
Looks like a winner and only 2oz.
you can buy this headlamp at Walmart for around 11.00. It has 2 white and 1 red LED, batteries included. I have had mine for 2 yrs without any problems
http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/botach_1724_17427939
Rock, go with Sly and Ewkers responses. 10-15 dollars and very durable. I have two that my son and I use for hunting and hiking and for when the power goes out (which in the winter can be often)
Be careful out there.
What is the purpose of a "red" light?
RockyTrail
11-16-2006, 12:57
Red light does not kill your night vision like a white light does.
It takes about 15-20 minutes in darkness for your eyes to adjust to starlight and work at peak efficiency; turning on a white flashlight even for a moment resets the process, but red is less so.
generoll
11-16-2006, 15:48
like Mowgli said, a red light will make red colors disappear. So if you are reading a map, anything written in red on the map will not show up. I think that most nautical charts now avoid the use of red lettering for that reason.
SGT Rock
11-16-2006, 15:59
The question is sort of old. When I got to my team they issued me a 2,000,000 candle power spot light with the rest of the gear for the truck turret. So light discipline is not that big of a deal this trip over here as it was in OIF 1 when we were trying to sneak around the battlefield still.
SuperTroll
11-16-2006, 16:15
Red is used Tacticly for it's Light scatering properties not to retain night vision...
The US Military is now transitioning to BLUE btw.
SuperTroll
11-16-2006, 16:16
ok, so where is the EDIT button for thunder thumbing mistakes? I mean I DO know how to spell...
generoll
11-16-2006, 17:30
yeah, it is a pretty old thread. that of course never prevents anyone from flaunting their wisdom or expressing an opinion. :)
Since i'm in theatre, I always have a blue or red light on me for backstage/dark. I was suprised at how many people asked/complimented me on my walmart white & red headlamp (just like the ones described in this thread). other hikers noticed the white was very bight and said that they would have never thought about having a red light. I had the same problem w/ the switch coming on, so i made sure it was in a pocket facing out, that way it would be noticed if it did come on.
There is a debate in the technical theatre world about red vs. blue as well. A good quailty (IMO) blue has alot of red in it, so that doesn't matter as much, but when you use dicroic glass or another colored item w/ a 'pure' blue that has blue w/ little else in it.
you can ask these companies for a 'lighting gel/filter' swatchbook, they will mail it to you for free, its a swatchbook of all the gel colors that the company makes and its the perfect size for putting infront of a small flashlight
www.leefilters.com www.rosco.com www.gamonline.com
This is so I can read in a tactical enviroment if I need to and then switch to having white light sometimes. Riding a house sometimes makes a headlamp a good idea
Oh, o.k., thought maybe you wanted it for some 'Black Out' hiking. LOL
I'm surprised you guys don't have these for the purpose you mentioned. ?
RockyTrail
11-16-2006, 18:08
Red is used Tacticly for it's Light scatering properties not to retain night vision...
That's not what I was taught in Flight School...use of red light will protect your night vision. It's in any flight manual. And my understanding is that astronomers also use red...But the first time I tried using a red light was flying at 7500 feet on a very dark night over south Georgia....then I realized I couldn't see the red lettering on the sectional (airway) chart!
On a related note, they also taught us when flying at night near thunderstorms (not a real smart idea BTW) to wear an eye-patch (Wiley Post style) over one eye. That way if lightning flashes nearby and temporarily blinds one eye, you can switch to the good eye and not lose control of the airplane. Otherwise you can get into a death-spiral in less than 3 minutes like JFK Jr did waiting for your eyesight to return. Today there is a lot of problems with ground-based lasers flashing up at aircraft, that can be a real danger at night....sorry, back to hiking:)
orangebug
11-16-2006, 21:08
Don't go to a star gazing party with anything but red. At the very least, wait until someone gives you a bit of red cellophane to cover your lamp.
Once you get dark accomodated and start seeing real stars (Peliades, Andromeda, anything by telescope), you will understand why red works and anything else exhales briskly.
Two Speed
11-16-2006, 21:43
....then I realized I couldn't see the red lettering on the sectional (airway) chart!My first LED light was red. Seemed pretty good for retaining night vision, and things were working out pretty well until I decided to think about the next day's hike about dark-thirty or so one evening. Getting a little gloomy, so I broke out the ol' LED, switched it on and the trail was impossible to discern on the map. Turn the light off, barely make it out. Turn it on, gone. Hmmm, spark the lighter, sho 'nuff, the trail was marked with a heavy red line. Not as hazardous as not being able to read the airway charts, but sure had me screwed up for a few minutes. :datz
Has anyon seen/used the (new?) Petzel e+lite?
http://www.ems.com/catalog/product_detail_square.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=8455 24442591685&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=282574489160699&emssrcid=adwords_petzl+e+lite
Pretty slick!
Here's a interesting article that deals with red flashlights and their effectiveness at maintaining night vision.
See link:
http://www.stlplaces.com/night_vision.html
I'm not so much concerned about night vision. I heard/read that animals couldn't see red light, so you can watch them coming and then snap on the high (white) beam wwhen they get close to freak 'em out! :p
Cool Sly.:cool: My local outfitter is expecting some after Christmas.:)
Jerry Kahil
12-10-2006, 18:39
I have a Nightblaster by Optronics. The Red LED feature will also conserve battery life, as opposed to the white spotlight it also has. I have noticed that it works with the three AAA batteries that came with it (also made by optronics), but not with brand new duracells. Anyone else have that happen?
Cool Sly.:cool: My local outfitter is expecting some after Christmas.:)
They are cool. I like the adjustable strap and the 360* clip-on tilting base which swivels around to protect the LED's.
I went to REI this afternoon to pick up a package I ordered online and before I got out the door I noticed these and couldn't help but buy one! If you get one, make sure to check it out at the store. My switch seems to be a little flakey and sometimes not all beams want to work, mostly the economy white beam.
The light itself weighs 27 grams and the case 18g
dixicritter
12-11-2006, 09:27
I'm not so much concerned about night vision. I heard/read that animals couldn't see red light, so you can watch them coming and then snap on the high (white) beam wwhen they get close to freak 'em out! :p
Well Sly somebody needs to tell my dog he can't see red lights then, cause he just loves chasing a red dot laser pointer around the house...LOL. ;)
Flying Monkey
12-11-2006, 09:52
I'm not so much concerned about night vision. I heard/read that animals couldn't see red light, so you can watch them coming and then snap on the high (white) beam wwhen they get close to freak 'em out! :p
That IS partially true. Deer can see green and blue, but not red. Red light may be detectable in some other capacity for them, but not in the same way as blue or green. Most other animals (all that I know of) can detect red, and in fact, because of the frequency of red, it is signifigantly more noticable than Blue is. (Hence why the military is moving over to blue lights. Red carries much further than other detectable lightwaves.)
SGT Rock
12-11-2006, 09:57
Who says they cannot "see" red. I thought they could just not distinguished the difference in red from any other color - hence an orange vest is just as good when trying to hide from a deer as green, but as far as I know animals can still see it.
Flying Monkey
12-11-2006, 09:59
Since i'm in theatre, I always have a blue or red light on me for backstage/dark.
There is a debate in the technical theatre world about red vs. blue as well. A good quailty (IMO) blue has alot of red in it, so that doesn't matter as much, but when you use dicroic glass or another colored item w/ a 'pure' blue that has blue w/ little else in it.
It's my understanding that in typical color filters (gel) a good (read: "true") blue would be a 0,0,225 in the RGB scale, and in fact contain no red. Adding red would start bringing you to violet. And while the typical gel absorbs (in this case) green and red, a dichroic filter would in fact contain no blue, but instead 225,225,0, and would reflect green and red (and for that matter infrared if it's a filter) leaving only Blue to travel through.
Red is going to be much easier to see at night, but will leave you with a killer reverse effect when you turn it off. You will have to adjust back.
Flying Monkey
12-11-2006, 10:09
Who says they cannot "see" red. I thought they could just not distinguished the difference in red from any other color - hence an orange vest is just as good when trying to hide from a deer as green, but as far as I know animals can still see it.
Deer lack the proper cones to see red light. We have three, they only have two. A recent grouping of deer cone studies has helped us understand our own color sight much better. Rather exciting, really.
“Deer have photopigments to sense two colors and allow for determining the range of hues between those colors. Research has shown deer to have photopigments that can detect colors in the blue and green range. Input from rods may also be used by deer to further discriminate colors. Of course deer may not interpret colors in the same manner humans do, but it makes sense for deer to have sensitivities to blue and green colors. Determination of various shades of green may be useful in identification of edible plants. Blue light discrimination aids vision in low light conditions.-- From this website: http://www.realtree.com/community/feature-detail.tpl?ID=299
Here's another one:
Findings of the Study
The results of our study confirmed that deer possess two (rather than three as in humans) types of cones allowing limited color vision (Figure 1). The cone that deer lack is the “red” cone, or the one sensitive to long wavelength colors such as red and orange. This suggests that wearing bright colors while hunting does not affect hunting success. This does not mean that these colors are invisible to deer, but rather that they are perceived differently.
Deer are essentially red-green color blind like some humans. Their color vision is limited to the short (blue) and middle (green) wavelength colors. As a result, deer likely can distinguish blue from red, but not green from red, or orange from red. Therefore, it appears that hunters would be equally suited wearing green, red, or orange clothing but perhaps slightly disadvantaged wearing blue.
http://www.qdma.com/articles/details.asp?id=48
SGT Rock
12-11-2006, 10:14
Wait a sec there Flying Monkey, that quote you posted contridicts what you just said:
"This does not mean that these colors are invisible to deer, but rather that they are perceived differently."
and
"Deer are essentially red-green color blind like some humans."
Now I know some people that are color blind, but they can still "see" a red light, they just couldn't tell you it is red.
Who says they cannot "see" red. I thought they could just not distinguished the difference in red from any other color - hence an orange vest is just as good when trying to hide from a deer as green, but as far as I know animals can still see it.
OK, this isn't where I originally read it and I was mistaken in my wording... apparently animals aren't disturbed by red light during night time observation...
http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0022-2372(195911)40%3A4%3C591%3AOONABR%3E2.0.CO%3B2-5 (http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0022-2372%28195911%2940%3A4%3C591%3AOONABR%3E2.0.CO%3B2-5)
Flying Monkey
12-11-2006, 12:19
Wait a sec there Flying Monkey, that quote you posted contridicts what you just said:
"This does not mean that these colors are invisible to deer, but rather that they are perceived differently."
and
"Deer are essentially red-green color blind like some humans."
Now I know some people that are color blind, but they can still "see" a red light, they just couldn't tell you it is red.
You're absolutely right. While I know a few things about light, I only know what exoerts tell me about deer. There was part of one of those articles that said that deer only "detect" green and Blue, and the other one said that they don't have a the third cone required to see red light (as it applies to humans, which is where the extent of my knowledge ends). I tried (and apparently failed) to say in one of my earlier posts that they still may have some relationship with red light, but that my best GUESS is that the response would be the same with a "white" light of the same receptive output. While it seems that they only can tell the difference between Blue and Green (and maybe some combinations therein), red light is still light, and I assume brightens that space without appearing red.
Don't know really. Best guess, going off how humans receive/interpret light.
Flying Monkey
12-11-2006, 12:35
But, back from Deer.....short answer (after many posts) is that Blue will be much more visible, due to the sensitivity of your cones to that wavelength, but Red will cause less ruin of nightvision because it barely affects the cones (which take over in low-light condition..hence color loss as it darkens). Red will be more comfortable, but blue will actually allow you to see further, which is the opposite in bright light conditions. Depends whether the rod or cones are in charge. Day/Night.
So..there's that.
If you have an LED lamp, you can buy a red LED cheaply, and if you have a standard lamp, you can put a color in the head of the case. An earlier post pointed out that you can get a free "swatchbook" from a gel (color sheet) manufacturer. Great Idea. You'll be able to cut up any color you want..depending on the company they'll have 50-150 colors depending on which book they send you. I prefer Gam.com for Blues, and Rosco.com for reds, but it probably won't matter.
FM
Flying Monkey
12-11-2006, 12:37
I meant to say that rods take over in low light, not cones, but who cares anyways?
rswanson
12-11-2006, 14:57
Seems I've noticed a lot less of a bug problem at night when I have the red LED on. Or am I imagining things?
johnny quest
12-11-2006, 15:00
i dont think you are. ive noticed the same thing. i guess they arent attracted to the red one.
Flying Monkey
12-11-2006, 15:07
That would make sense. If they do have all three cones like humans, they'd also have rods, which are least sensitive to red out of all colors at night (when the rods are fully funtioning).
MosaicMaker
12-11-2006, 18:43
There are a wealth of choices here. But, it is still worth mentioning this one more: Pak-Lite.:banana At around 1.5 ounces available with a lithium battery that yeilds 80= hours of use. They have what they call the "Pilot" model with one red and one white LED. See it here: http://www.9voltlight.com/inc/sdetail/5980
I know you have the Pak-Lite that came with your Torch-Lite stove. That was their introductory model, but they have much more. I think they are fantastic!
Yup, at REI they had an entire rack of headlamps. Today I went back and exchanged my e+lite since it had a faulty switch. I had to take the demo, since I bought the last packaged one yesterday, but weaseled the batteries out my trade-in.
it's an awesome little light, I predict it being a huge seller.
Greg Dunlap
06-04-2009, 19:43
The two best things about using a red headlamp is that for one they do not destroy your night vision and two and most important, they don't attract bugs. Flying nasties that are attracted to white light, moths, gnats, skeeters, can't see the red light and don't bug ya when you have it on.:banana
That in itself makes it worth it's weight in gold!!
kayak karl
06-04-2009, 21:32
The two best things about using a red headlamp is that for one they do not destroy your night vision and two and most important, they don't attract bugs. Flying nasties that are attracted to white light, moths, gnats, skeeters, can't see the red light and don't bug ya when you have it on.:banana
That in itself makes it worth it's weight in gold!!
why did u dig this up:rolleyes:???