A silly winter question; heavy hiking

[squeezebox]

Of the Jan 1st group 1 person reported to be carrying 120 lbs. 'geez that's a lot. rumor is a month of food and a gal. of water. there's 1/2 the wt. right there. So if you were going to carry everything inc. the kitchen sink. What would you bring? My fold up bucket weighs 2.5 oz. by the way.
Ild bring an expadition 100L pack 7lbs? a 6 lb tent. a white gas stove with a 1/2 - 1gal of fuel. 3 pot cookset, extra down jacket, a bigger thicker self inflate pad, a chair 1.5 lb, 2 nalgene hot water bottles, maybe a tarp to add to the tent for hang out space, Soto makes a gas lantern that fits on a canister, extra flashlight. a notepad, extra batteries. more long underwear. puffy pants. duck boots as camp shoes
That's my start what would you add?

[Malto]

I don't have 120lbs of gear to take. Why someone would ever carry a gallon of water is beyond me. Hope it doesn't freeze into a solid block of ice, that would be some dead weight.

[chknfngrs]

Cans of ravioli

[soumodeler]

Don't forget the gallon size hand sanitizer he had in one of the side pockets of the pack for easy access while walking!

There were between 6-8 green propane tanks, the already mentioned gallon or more of water, a $20 Walmart tent, and a gallon size tub of protein powder.

The guy had an 80 liter pack and the rest was in 2 clear plastic bags. I still don't know how he made it to Springer in a day, let alone up the stairs at the falls.

[Sir Setsalot]

You all fail to mention Mingo, he carried one of his bags for him about two miles. By the way Mingo ended his hike with pain in the neck issues.

[4eyedbuzzard]

Of the Jan 1st group 1 person reported to be carrying 120 lbs. 'geez that's a lot. . . .What? No one carried a porta-potty?

Inre 120lbs of "stuff". Okay, so I just got back to TX from NH. I flew with 2 checked bags and one carry on. 40, 50 and 25 lbs respectively. 115 lbs total. Long story as to why I did this, but I needed to relocate some stuff here (TX) from NH and Southwest gives you 2 checked bags for free, and I was there, and I'm che--frugal. For whatever reason, it seemed like a good plan at the time - and cheaper than UPS. :-? Upon arrival in DAL, the elevator in the terminal at baggage claim to lower level and shuttle buses was broken. :( Maybe try the escalator I thought? :eek: Nope, nixed that idea to avoid a Darwin Award. Finally found a ramp all the way at the other end of the terminal. I damn near died trying to maneuver it all from baggage claim to the parking lot shuttle. :o 120 lbs, huh? I don't think Sherpas carry anywhere near that.

[juma]

check with tipi.

[kayak karl]

cans of spinach....

[George]

how about a portable propane hot water heater system and portable forced air tent heater - add steaks, potatoes, fresh fruit + veggies

that should help get the weight up

[Weather-man]

Best might be to bring a .22 rifle and hunt along the way. I've carried close to a months worth of food but used a pulk, if that helps.

[nsherry61]

It's actually pretty easy to get up toward 100 lb range even with good gear and reasonable gear management as soon as you add up a couple weeks or more of food, fuel, and technical climbing gear along with skis/snowshoes.

Base weight with basic winter gear for extreme conditions ~ 20 lbs
14 days of food ~ 30+ lbs
Rope, harness, crampons, ice axe, snow stakes, screws, etc ~ 15 lbs
Skis/snowshoes, boots, poles ~10 lbs

Also, FWIW, Sherpas often carry more than 200 lbs on their backs supported only by their hands and the strap on their forehead (trump strap). I wonder how much weight Donald could carry with a gold Trump strap?

[Harrison Bergeron]

Of the Jan 1st group 1 person reported to be carrying 120 lbs. 'geez that's a lot. rumor is a month of food and a gal. of water. there's 1/2 the wt. right there. So if you were going to carry everything inc. the kitchen sink. What would you bring? My fold up bucket weighs 2.5 oz. by the way.

For 120 lbs, I'd bring a sherpa.

My fold-up bucket only weighs 0.5 oz (I made it myself). And I ALWAYS carry a kitchen sink -- the bottom of a gallon milk jug, 0.3 oz.

But as long as someone else is carrying it, the first thing I'd throw in his pack is a big-ole 4-man dome tent with LED lighting and a camp chair.

[Marta]

I led a group overnight hike (Max Patch to Hot Springs) on which a guy showed up with 80-100 lbs. He couldn't even fit it all in the 80 liter pack, but had an LL Bean book bag that he lashed to the big pack.

I never saw the full contents of his load but among other things he had: A coated nylon four-person tent tall enough for him to stand up in and a one-burner Coleman stove, which promptly failed, coating everything with soot, and resulting in him borrowing another hiker's cooking setup.

It was a very painful experience for everyone involved, although most of all for him. He was literally groaning as he walked along. Fortunately we were able to get a cell signal from the top of Bluff Mountain and arrange for him to be picked up at the next gravel road.

I also led two separate (short--I had learned my lesson about letting people I hadn't met sign up for anything longer than five-mile shakedown trips) hikes in which people showed up carrying heavy blue tarps as their tent groundcloths. One of the women who did this actually fell to the ground and was pinned down by her load, unable to rise without assistance.

Some things I've seen people carrying in Georgia:
A sleeping bag that weighed 10-11 lbs. (Winter bag, kapok.)
A #10 can of ravioli
A Tupperware box containing a couple dozen toaster pastries
A week's worth of MREs
A Jan. 1 starter with three outer jackets, which looked to be plucked from his closet at home and didn't work together in any sort of sensible layering system, and a heavy, but not warm 20 degree sleeping bag. He also announced that his budget for the entire AT hike was $400. I think he quit at Blueberry Patch.
A food supply of two one-gallon bags full to the ziplocks with raisins and peanuts, plus a plastic grocery sack containing king-sized jars of Bama peanut butter and grape jelly--abandoned to their fates at the Cheese Factory site.

AWITW movie, because they decided to be propaganda for Leave No Trace, did not do justice to the chaos that is Georgia in the spring. Too bad because it's pretty hilarious.

[Marta]

Oh, yes, how could I forget the guy who brought a full-size Coleman lantern and a wooden folding camp stool?

[LittleRock]

Of the Jan 1st group 1 person reported to be carrying 120 lbs. 'geez that's a lot. rumor is a month of food and a gal. of water. there's 1/2 the wt. right there. So if you were going to carry everything inc. the kitchen sink. What would you bring?

Recliner, case of beer.

[Puddlefish]

I'd want a nice memory foam mattress in my silly pack.

[George]

hiked with a guy who pulled out a full size watermelon and knife to slice it on 2nd day of a hike - it was devoured in minutes

[DavidNH]

for a 120 pounds of gear... you are going to need a 12 pound pack (weight when empty) just to carry it. I would not have made it to the summit of Springer with a load like this.. never mind hike the trail!

[Oslohiker]

Some people here say winter hiking is crazy, but you are only crazy if you not have prepared for a winter hike. Among the preparations is bringing the right stuff for winter hiking. Going light is NOT comparable with winter hiking. Tipi Walters pack looks about right to me. But you can't just bring any stuff, you still have to be super picky.

- Normally you bring a full sett of an extra shift og clothes, except for the outer layers. You don't leave camp again until the clothing are not using that day is completely dried out. Generally you take a lot of quality thin merino wool items with you.
- A lot of fuel, to melt snow/ice. But if there is just frozen water on grounds (ice, no snow), its hard to extract that, and you would need to bring extra water with you. Ypu also need a larger pot and a wind screen.
- If there will be much snow, you'll need a shovel. You can also make a cold pit, and a kitchen inside the tent. Put snow on the outer skirt of the tent.
- A quality four season tent. On the Appalachian trail I would use Hilleberg Allak or Soulo. They are both freestanding. They are easier to set op on frozen grounds. A tunnel tent if there is a load of snow there.
- A quality knife. Both to cut yourself out of the tent if it catch fire, and chop stakes for supporting gay lines in the snow, and for wood for fire.
- A high quality headlight, with a least 250 lumen.
- Extra food, if you have to stay put.
-Double system sleeping pad. A gossamer gear thin pad, under a high r-rated sleeping pad
-Buffy sleeping bag. You choose the rating after the all time low on the trail. That is perfekt. Also take a pillow, for those long winter nigths. Bring a book.
-Sunglass/even ski goggles. And sun screen.
-A buffed up down jacket. You use it is camp and every time you stop. You can also use it on the foot part on your sleeping bag. A WM Snojack parka is perfect for this task.
-You could also bring down pants, if you don't have enough wool for your legs.
-Gloves. I don't use liners. I use cross-country ski gloves (I bring two pairs), that easily grip stuff, and outer down mittens, and protective water resistant liner on top of that.
-Two or three warm beanies/hats. To put on a dry hat is sometimes like heaven.
-A beefed up medical kit, with more blister treatment (with a heavy pack you get moer blisters, even at your hips and shoulders. More creams. Emergency bag.
-Booties.
-And a big enough bag, that everything goes inside.

[George]

there are some gregory denali packs still out there 8# and 400$

suitable mystery ranch packs go 8-9 lbs for 400-700$

[fiddlehead]

The heaviest load I've ever seen was a Tamang porter in Nepal carrying 8-2" steel pipes 20' long each!
He had to turn sideways every time he met someone coming the other way on the trail.
At a rest stop, I tried to pick it up and couldn't even budge it.
I had 2 Sherpas come over to help me if I had budged it and fell over.

One of them picked it up, but only briefly, and set it right back down.
I figured it weighed at around 200 lbs.
I've never seen a Sherpa carry more than 3 backpacks at a time (throws them in their basket called a dopo)
If they have to carry more, they either get a Sherpani to do it (woman Sherpa), or one of those Tamang porters.
They are old guys usually, who are in flip flops with a short cane stick used mostly to rest their load on when they rest so they don't have to take it off!
Yes, they put all the weight on their neck with the rope (and a rag) on their forehead.

What would I take if I had unlimited weight?
Chair, guitar, frying pan, steaks, bacon, pesto, big battery charger so I could run my business while I'm out there, lots of fuel, my bigger sleeping bag.
It's all a dream.
Ain't gonna happen!

[rocketsocks]

The heaviest load I've ever seen was a Tamang porter in Nepal carrying 8-2" steel pipes 20' long each!
He had to turn sideways every time he met someone coming the other way on the trail.
At a rest stop, I tried to pick it up and couldn't even budge it.
I had 2 Sherpas come over to help me if I had budged it and fell over.

One of them picked it up, but only briefly, and set it right back down.
I figured it weighed at around 200 lbs.
I've never seen a Sherpa carry more than 3 backpacks at a time (throws them in their basket called a dopo)
If they have to carry more, they either get a Sherpani to do it (woman Sherpa), or one of those Tamang porters.
They are old guys usually, who are in flip flops with a short cane stick used mostly to rest their load on when they rest so they don't have to take it off!
Yes, they put all the weight on their neck with the rope (and a rag) on their forehead.

What would I take if I had unlimited weight?
Chair, guitar, frying pan, steaks, bacon, pesto, big battery charger so I could run my business while I'm out there, lots of fuel, my bigger sleeping bag.
It's all a dream.
Ain't gonna happen!
That is truly something, and many vex over shoes, packs, poles, and weight.

[brazossticks]

I would also add to that a hiking stick/staff.

[sliverstorm]

Why someone would ever carry a gallon of water is beyond me. Hope it doesn't freeze into a solid block of ice

One upside, a bigger reservoir is going to stay liquid longer.




14 days of food ~ 30+ lbs
Rope, harness, crampons, ice axe, snow stakes, screws, etc ~ 15 lbs
Skis/snowshoes, boots, poles ~10 lbs


And of course you burn more energy staying warm, so you need a lot more food. Additionally, if you're carrying a standard 60m 9.8mm rope, that's nearly 8lbs, so your technical gear is probably more like 20-25lbs unless you're going fast & light. Lastly, even pretty light skis are 6lbs/pair, tech bindings are 2.5lb/pair, and many AT boots are probably 8lbs/pair... 16lbs :)

[sliverstorm]

Which is why snowshoes are the clearly lighter option, at ~8lb/pair. That said in deep snow you might well save energy going with the heavier ski setup.

As for technical gear, whether you are going fast & light is of course much more a function of your objectives, mortal risk tolerance, and personal skill level than your dedication to ultralight.

[colorado_rob]

Which is why snowshoes are the clearly lighter option, at ~8lb/pair. That said in deep snow you might well save energy going with the heavier ski setup.

As for technical gear, whether you are going fast & light is of course much more a function of your objectives, mortal risk tolerance, and personal skill level than your dedication to ultralight.All the snowshoes I've ever owned are all less than 4lb per pair (I've owned 3 pair, actually still do). When we're on a glacier and roped up, we use 8mm or even 7.8mm ropes, no reason for 10mm for this kind of hiking/climbing, and we're usually either 30 meters (for 3) or 45 meters (for 4), or two 30's for a four man team for spacing flexibility. 8mm 30M ropes are about 2.75 pounds. My ice axe, pretty much a mountaineering standard, the BD Raven Pro is just about a pound. Same with crampons, a pound (BD contacts, stainless steel). Harness: 8 ounces, with another pound of misc. hardware on the harness (slings and biners and maybe an ice screw). 15 ounce snow picket. So yeah, technical gear adds up, but no need to carry 15 pounds of it, just buy good, light stuff.

UL truly is relative; my first Denali climb, I started out with 120 pounds (incl 40 pounds of food and 7 pounds of fuel, 1 gallon). Next trip, 7 years later I was in the low 90's, same food and fuel (21 days worth). Some start up a Denali climb with 150 pounds. Most of them don't make it. Denali NP climbing Rangers start from base camp with ~80 pounds, going solo.

[sliverstorm]

Yeah, if we are talking lite glacier travel, it gets lighter and the rope you need gets smaller & shorter. I saw "ice screws" and thought he might have been talking about ice/mixed/etc climbing.

You're also right on snowshoes, I mistakenly took the specs I was looking at as per-single rather than per-pair. Companies that insist on listing per-single weights on items sold as pairs, drive me up the wall. Half the time they don't tell you it's per-single.

[peakbagger]

I don't think used to go over 100 pounds but when I used to winter camp for a few days we would load up sleds (called pulks) that had poles connecting to a hip belt that we dragged behind us to a base camp. I would lay my big winter backpack in with the straps facing up and then filled in around it with bulk stuff well tied in. On occasion we would have to cross streams where the pulk would get wet or in the way and on occasion I would just put on the backpack pulk and all to get back to where I could put it back on the ground. It was fun but with less than 8 hours of daylight and cold nights it was an acquired taste. I still have the gear but not the motivation for -20 degree temps. I switched over to long winter day hikes instead.

Part of the fun was designing pulks from stuff around the house. There are commercial models available but half the fun is coming up with a better design. Since I would go with group of engineers, fancy stuff like spherical rod ends would occasionally be used but the weak link was normally the cheap sled some folks used. Mine was based on sled built for ice fisherman and was a lot tougher plastic.

I am not much of skier and skiing downhill on any sort of slope with a pulk behind adds a whole new level of terror to the run out. Some of the commercial rigs were equipped with ski brakes that engaged when heading down hill.

[peakbagger]

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