Anything wrong with just Bleach/Aquamira

[HikerJ]

I've always used bleach or Aquamira drops when hiking. Is there any significant disadvantage to using drops on the A.T.? Everyone seems to be using the Sawyer Mini. I don't know of any problems, aside from having to wait to drink. Will I be fine if I stick with drops instead of a filter for a thru hike?

[Starchild]

You may be carrying extra weight when you consider the weight of water that is typically carried per purification method as the weight of water carried usually far surpasses the weight of the purification method.

[MuddyWaters]

AM is all thats needed.

I know several people that tried the mini, and went back to the full size.

Drink at sources, and on the AT, most of the year, you could get by without carrying any water.

If your pack is light enough...............

[peakbagger]

Bleach is better than nothing but not by much. Stick with Aquamira. Even if someone has a mechanical filter they should have a backup like Aquamira as filters plug/break.

[nsherry61]

FYI: Bleach works pretty well for viruses and bacteria, but fails on gyrardia cysts and chryptosporidium cysts, two of the bugs that are the greatest concern to many people. Aquamira works on the protozoa cysts, but takes 3 hrs to do it. Filters remove and UV deactivates the cysts as part of the standard process.

[colorado_rob]

Just a wild guess, but I bet maybe 25-30% of folks I saw on the AT used Aqua Mira, myself included.

I'm a big Sawyer fan for here out west where the water isn't as clear and it's nice to filter out the stuff besides the microorganisms, but on the AT for the most part, the water is pretty darn clear.

[dudeijuststarted]

AM is good stuff. The catch with chlorine is that if you overuse / underdilute, over time you put your gut flora at risk. Not something you want to do on a thru hike. Consider a filter with AM as a backup. You'll also appreciate having it at shallow or stagnant water sources!

[Traveler]

For what its worth, if you are going to use chemicals in your water, in my view its best to stay with products like Aquamira drops as opposed to bleach. Dosing can be an issue with chlorine (both in not enough for the water load or too much) and it won't affect cysts that carry intestinal parasites, which for me is one of the primary reasons I filter all my water.

Sodium hypochlorite is the ingredient in bleach where chlorine comes from and should be between 4% and 6% by volume. Depending on the bleach product, if that range is lower it may not perform the way you need it to, higher levels could create a health problem. Keep in mind chlorine is one of the most lethal toxins to living organisms there is, killing off your digestive system "bugs" can easily be done using chlorine and is not pleasant, never mind other impacts chlorine can have if it spills.

[Cheyou]

I always used a Sawyer filter . What is if any the advantage of Aquamira?

Thom

[coat4gun]

The biggest disadvantage to a filter is that they will freeze up when winter trekking, and they aren't always easy to thaw in the field. I use Aquamira when the temps are below 25 or so.

[Cheyou]

Yes freezing can b a problem . Good point . I like to camel up at water source . Filter works better I think for this.

Thom

[colorado_rob]

I always used a Sawyer filter . What is if any the advantage of Aquamira?

ThomI use both depending on where I am, and I find using AM slightly easier, plus an AM drops kit is lighter than the regular SS, assuming you include the syringe and bag in the total weights. Small differences though, but if in a place where the water is generally clear, I just simply prefer AM. No backflushing, no squeezing a bag, no bag for that matter. Just a simple preference in methods.

Cameling-up at a water source is nice though, and I do that as well when carrying a filter. It is a bit frustrating to have to wait 1/2 hour.

[burger]

I only use Aqua Mira. On the AT specifically, I wouldn't even think about using a filter. Most of the water sources are streams or springs with decent-quality water.

FWIW, I used only AM on the PCT and CDT (where some of the water sources are super gross cow ponds) and never got sick. YMMV.

[jshannon]

I'd bet 25% or more that use Sawyer/Platypus filters end up leaving them out in freezing weather, supposedly rendering them not trustworthy of working properly. That kinda sucks.

[burger]

Cameling-up at a water source is nice though, and I do that as well when carrying a filter. It is a bit frustrating to have to wait 1/2 hour.

There's really no disadvantage to aqua mira with respect to your ability to camel up. You can take your break at a water source and just wait for the water to be treated. Where water is scarce, we usually plan ahead for this and take our breaks at the water.

And if you can't wait, there's almost no advantage to drinking at the water source vs. carrying it til the AM has had its time. In terms of weight on your feet, it doesn't matter if you've drunk the water or are carrying it in your pack--same total weight. You probably can't drink more than 1-2 L at a sitting, so it's not like you'd be carrying 10 extra pounds of water in your pack that would otherwise be in your stomach. And if it's warm out and the water is clear (true for most of the AT), you only need to wait 15 minutes, not 30. That's not long to wait, even if it means a few extra pounds in your pack. One friend on the PCT used to carry her AM caps in her hand during the 5 minutes that the components were reaction so she could make miles in the interim.

[TexasBob]

Aqua Mira doesn't claim to kill giardia or cryptosporidia only bacteria and viruses (it does kill giardia and cryptosporidia but they haven't done the testing to claim it). Portable Aqua chlorine dioxide tablets do claim to kill giardia and cryptosporidia after 4 hours! The Army Public Health Center (link below) says that under normal conditions of water temperature and pH chlorine dioxide will kill giardia in as little as 6 minutes or as long as 79 minutes with Cryptosporidia it takes 2-15 hours. Bacteria are killed very quickly but viruses take almost as much time as giardia to be killed. Bleach is about as effective as Aqua Mira in killing bacteria, viruses, and giardia but is not effective against cryptosporidia. Waiting times for bleach are similar to chlorine dioxide. So you have to ask yourself, are you going to wait for hours to drink your treated water? If not then Aqua Mira really isn't much better bleach. What about filters? If they work properly they will take care of everything except viruses. The only method that is going to work quickly against everything is UV light - steripen. Wait you say, steripen does work well with cloudy water and you are right but then neither do any of the chemicals.
Personally, I am most worried about bacteria and viruses because they are by far the most common contaminants. Luckily chemicals of all kinds and UV work well for bacteria and viruses. I carry a steripen and use bleach for backup.

http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA453968

[QiWiz]

There are lots of ways to handle water treatment. I personally like to have Aqua Mira drops for treating larger volumes of water overnight or in-camp and a 3 oz SteriPen or Sawyer Squeeze for quick treatment of water on trail when I just want to "camel-up" and not carry much water.

[Another Kevin]

The biggest disadvantage to a filter is that they will freeze up when winter trekking, and they aren't always easy to thaw in the field. I use Aquamira when the temps are below 25 or so.

A ceramic filter element that has frozen is no longer effective and must be discarded. Water expands as it freezes, and the filter pores get opened by microscopic cracks that are big enough to let the nasties pass through.

[sliverstorm]

The biggest disadvantage to a filter is that they will freeze up when winter trekking, and they aren't always easy to thaw in the field. I use Aquamira when the temps are below 25 or so.

Good point about the filter, although treatment times can get extremely long (multiple hours) for near-freezing water. I think that leaves you with boiling and UV.

[Another Kevin]

Good point about the filter, although treatment times can get extremely long (multiple hours) for near-freezing water. I think that leaves you with boiling and UV.

By that point, you may well be melting your drinking water. If you have to melt it, you might as well boil it while you have a fire going.

[Casey & Gina]

Chemical treatment requires about 4 hours to make water safe to drink - the filter takes seconds. The filter shouldn't be allowed to freeze, but that's what pockets and sleeping bags are for. I've used our Sawyer filter without incident on several sub-freezing backpacking trips down to 10 degrees F.

Boiled water I believe is safe to drink immediately after boiling.

Skip the Sawyer mini and get a Sawyer 3-way or Sawyer Squeeze which will keep you happier. The 3-way is nice because it has built-in fittings for quick-disconnect hoses. I put quick-disconnect adapters in the middle of our bladder lines and refill the bladders without having to take them out of the packs. Bladders aren't great in the winter though - the hoses froze up in our last trip and one of the plastic quick disconnects ended up cracking from the expanding ice inside. I hear you can blow air back up the hose after you take a drink to prevent this sort of thing, but I'll just use a titanium water bottle next time I'm out in the winter.

[Don H]

Per instructions:
Shake or stir and let stand for 15 more minutes. If water is very cold or turbid, let stand for 30 minutes. http://www.aquamira.com/products/aquamira-water-treatment-drops/

[TexasBob]

Per instructions:
Shake or stir and let stand for 15 more minutes. If water is very cold or turbid, let stand for 30 minutes. http://www.aquamira.com/products/aquamira-water-treatment-drops/
per thier website:
"Aquamira Water Treatment unlocks the power of Chlorine Dioxide to kill bacteria and enhance the taste of treated water." 30 minutes will kill bacteria, viruses and giardia but not cryptosporidia. Aquamira doesn't claim to kill crypto, it will in several hours of contact time but Aqua Mira leaves off crypto so they can reduce the contact time to 30 minutes.

[nsherry61]

If I were hauling large amounts of water for desert hiking like I might on the southern California PCT, AM would be a great solution because it is minimum effort and the water is having to be hauled anyway. But, in most of my hiking, I like drinking at the water source and carrying very little between sources. Arriving at the water source, and then having to treat and carry the freshly acquired water another 30 minutes before I drink it is just too much for me when there are other alternatives. So, although I have used AM in the past, I have quit doing so in exchange for either a steripen or sawyer filter.

[Don H]

per thier website:
"Aquamira Water Treatment unlocks the power of Chlorine Dioxide to kill bacteria and enhance the taste of treated water." 30 minutes will kill bacteria, viruses and giardia but not cryptosporidia. Aquamira doesn't claim to kill crypto, it will in several hours of contact time but Aqua Mira leaves off crypto so they can reduce the contact time to 30 minutes.

You are absolutely correct Bob, AM doesn't work on Crypto well.

Filters have their own issues, a cracked ceramic element (as can happen if the unit freezes) will let pathogens through, improper maintenance and cross contamination from tubing or attachments. And depending on the filter element pore size some bacteria can pass through.

Of course the Steripen has its own issues. I own two pens and have had them malfunction to where they wouldn't do a complete cycle. Drop it and break the light tube and its trash. Then of course there's the issue of batteries.

Point is no single method is fool proof except maybe boiling. If I could find the perfect system I'd buy it.

[MuddyWaters]

If you dont understand ClO2, stick with your filter.If you are intertested in facts, theres no shortage of treatment studies published by EPA and military.


Realize that blanket instructions are failsafe for the average idiot.

You dont need as much if you have time.
You dont need as long if you use reccomended concentration
Crypto isnt a normal problem, or the am users would get sick....which they dont

[Don H]

For Aquamira you can use half the dose for double the time, or twice the dose for half the time. I often treated water overnight with half the dose.

[TexasBob]

....Crypto isnt a normal problem, or the am users would get sick....which they dont

I am sure you you are correct. One thing I have often wondered is how many people who report they have gotten giardia actually were diagnosed by a doctor with giardia and treated for it or just assumed it was giardia because they got a bad case of diarrhea. Not trying to start an argument or saying people are wrong, just curious.

[MuddyWaters]

I am sure you you are correct. One thing I have often wondered is how many people who report they have gotten giardia actually were diagnosed by a doctor with giardia and treated for it or just assumed it was giardia because they got a bad case of diarrhea. Not trying to start an argument or saying people are wrong, just curious.

My guess is a significant portion.
A good part of the US population (5-10%) may carry giardia lamblia and are asymptomatic.

Even if its caught from others, direct fecal-oral is as probable vector as waterborne. Wash hands, dont handle items others do.

[dgoggins]

I am an AM user here...mainly b/c I hike with small groups and AM does a great job with efficiency...I can treat several liters of water...or even gallons...very quickly. I had a sawyer mini and didn't like the hassle factor even with treating water for 1-2 people. Out west, as soon as I get high enough in elevation I can usually find water sources that require no treatment anyway (water coming out of the ground, nothing above the water source, etc).

Now...I have been getting aggravated at the little dropper bottles that I use to decant only the amount of AM that I need for the trip...sometimes I'm getting them where they are leaking, so I need to find new dropper bottles. I might even switch to tablets and see how I like those ....even though I know they cost more (but again, I don't do massive amounts of treatment anyway).

[Harrison Bergeron]

I took a visine-size bottle of bleach last year, thinking I'd use it along with the filter if the water looked questionable. Then I ran out of water at one point and had to filter at Tesnatee Gap. The water source was a drain culvert running under the forest road, and was not even noted as a water source in the guidebook. But I needed water and several other people were filling up, so I applied two drops per liter and waited half an hour before drinking any. It tasted a little funny, but more like the algae in the culvert than the bleach.

By the time I reached camp, my stomach was turning and I was belching a lot and it sort of burnt coming back up. I was pretty miserable and didn't feel like eating much that night, but I forced myself, thinking it might dilute it. By morning I was fine, but I tossed the bleach at the next opportunity.

It was plain, unscented Clorox, but I still think they must be putting something else in it these days. Two drops in a liter shouldn't have made me sick like that. I had to get water from a drain culvert one other time (I don't remember where, except that I remember it was in the book as a water source). It tasted a little like algae again, but didn't make me sick. So I'm sure it was the Clorox.

[Jayson74]

To treat 1 liter/quart you should use 4 to 6 drops not 2.

http://www.doh.wa.gov/Emergencies/EmergencyPreparednessandResponse/Factsheets/WaterPurification

[TexasBob]

To treat 1 liter/quart you should use 4 to 6 drops not 2.

http://www.doh.wa.gov/Emergencies/EmergencyPreparednessandResponse/Factsheets/WaterPurification

Most sources say 2 drops/liter if the water is clear

http://www.cdc.gov/healthywater/pdf/emergency/09_202278-B_Make_Water_Safe_Flyer_508.pdf

https://www.clorox.com/dr-laundry/disaster-preparedness-purifying-water/

https://ndep.nv.gov/bsdw/docs/disinfect_drinking_water.pdf

http://www.healthlinkbc.ca/healthfiles/hfile49b.stm

[Jayson74]

I see that. Huh weird how some say 2 drops per and some say 4. I have always used 4 drops and never had an issue. Granted I live in Northern Ontario and most water sources are probably safe without any treatment.

[coat4gun]

My guess is a significant portion.
A good part of the US population (5-10%) may carry giardia lamblia and are asymptomatic.

Even if its caught from others, direct fecal-oral is as probable vector as waterborne. Wash hands, dont handle items others do.

My brother-in-law is a big time fisherman. He got Giardia from clipping off the excess fishing line from his fish hooks with his teeth. It's not a pleasant experience I hear.

[sheperd80]

I never understood using aquamira over a Sawyer filter for 3-season. The Sawyer is so cheap, light, fast, versatile, convenient and available everywhere. No waiting for purification, and it filters out debris. I feel the same about life straw and steripen... why?

The only exceptions i can think of are virus protection and freezing, both of which are typically moot for 3-season use here in the US. Gram counting also seems a bad excuse because, as mentioned above, youre carrying undrinkable water for an hour.

Not trying to be argumentative, what am i missing? Is it the Skurka stamp of approval that people flock too? ;-)

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

[jshannon]

Many users of the sawyer mini are going back to the sawyer squeeze. I say use both ; ).