View Full Version : Won't get through the Smokies in 8 days on thru-hiker pass. What are the options?
I will begin my hike at least 50 miles prior to the Smokies and end at least 50 miles beyond the Smokies so I want to take advantage of the thru-hiker permit. However, I have a small problem. I intend on staying in Gatlinburg for a few days so I won't complete the Smokies within the 8 day timeframe the thru-hiker permit allows. It looks like I'll be beyond the Smokies on the 9th or 10th day. Is there anything I can do to stay "legal"?
HooKooDooKu
03-02-2016, 01:08
Get a pair of general backpacking permits... however you would have to get reservations for the exact dates you plan to stay at each shelter.
Otherwise, call up the back country permit office and discuss your situation with them. Perhaps there is some manual modification the rangers can do in the office that the online rules don't allow.
865-436-1231
I intend on staying in Gatlinburg for a few days
Why?
Disclaimer: Gatlinburg is not one of my favorite places.
Enjoy your hike.
Wayne
MuddyWaters
03-02-2016, 09:46
Stay in gatlinburg on the way, or after, and just hike thru the park in 5 days without stopping
illabelle
03-02-2016, 09:57
Let's say a person has a thru-hiker permit dated April 1 (so valid from April 1 through May 8). The way I understand the intent is that they don't want you to be wandering around in the park for weeks. They want you to get in and get out in 8 days. What difference does it make whether it's the first 8 days (April 1-8) or some other 8 days (April 1-4 and May 5-8)?
A Thru-Hiker Permit is valid for up to 38 days from the date you obtain it. Thru-Hikers have 8 days to get through the Smokies. A break to rest or resupply in a nearby town does not negate one's standing as a thru-hiker.
Why? Because America. Does it matter why? You must have misread the question. I didn't ask the location of your favorite place. I apologize for the confusing nature of my question.
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I suggest you hike through the park and then take the time to visit Gatlinburg.
Why?
Disclaimer: Gatlinburg is not one of my favorite places.
Enjoy your hike.
Wayne
its his/her trip and not yours.....
Slo-go'en
03-02-2016, 10:57
If I can do the park in 5 days, anyone can. That leaves you with 3 days in town. Surely that's long enough?
If you stay at the Mt Collins shelter, you can get to New Found Gap before noon and be in Gburg early in the afternoon, giving you most of the day there. Then take a full day off, heading back up the next morning. That way you spend 2 nights in town, but really only loose one day out of your 8.
rgarling
03-02-2016, 11:43
Let's say a person has a thru-hiker permit dated April 1 (so valid from April 1 through May 8). The way I understand the intent is that they don't want you to be wandering around in the park for weeks. They want you to get in and get out in 8 days. What difference does it make whether it's the first 8 days (April 1-8) or some other 8 days (April 1-4 and May 5-8)?
This explanation is compelling. In other words, over a period of 38 days, you can spend up to 8 days hiking in the park.
HooKooDooKu
03-02-2016, 12:24
This explanation is compelling. In other words, over a period of 38 days, you can spend up to 8 days hiking in the park.
I called the back country office to get clarification.
The rule is that once you enter the park, your permit is valid for only 8 continuous days.
The way it was explained is that when you enter the park, you validate your permit by writing your entry date on the permit. Any ranger that asks to see your permit only has that date to go by to determine if your permit is valid. So while a side trip to Gatlinburg doesn't negate your thru-hiker permit, it also doesn't extend the 8 day deadline.
Why? Because America. Does it matter why? You must have misread the question. I didn't ask the location of your favorite place. I apologize for the confusing nature of my question.
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its his/her trip and not yours.....
It was early. I was at work. My penultimate week at work. Before my first cup of coffee. I'm old. I'm grumpy.
I'm still at work. I'm in a better mood now. 9 days and a wake up until my permanent release from work & Houston.
3+ months from now I will be in the Blue Ridge Mountains of North Carolina. Going backpacking at Grandfather Mountain with my grandson. I promise I will be in a way better mood then.
Have a great hike. Enjoy the Smokies and Gatlinburg.
Wayne
is there any restriction to getting 2 through permits? it would cost 40$ but that could be made up be reducing the visits to riplies and tshirt shop purchases over the 3 days
. Enjoy the Smokies and Gatlinburg.
Wayne
on one winter trip in the smokies I did both at once twice in one day
started early, still in the dark, a clear area gave me a view of the lights in gatlinburg - finished that evening also in the dark with the added view of the solid traffic from pidgin forge, looked kind of like a giant tail - to me it was an ideal way to see G burg
reality - G burg is a decent trail town, easy hitches, every thing you need is a short walk
HooKooDooKu
03-02-2016, 20:00
is there any restriction to getting 2 through permits? it would cost 40$ but that could be made up be reducing the visits to riplies and tshirt shop purchases over the 3 days
Two thru permits wouldn't fly...
To get 'A' permit, your hike must start and end 50 miles beyond the park boundaries.
Besides, it's not about the $20... that cost (in part) comes from the park moving to an automated reservation system and needed a way to pay for it.
Actually, other than having to register online and printing your own permit (and the $20) nothing has changed for AT thru hikers going thru the park. AT thru hikers have always had to write their entry date on their permit and have always had 8 days from the date on the permit to leave the park.
Compare that to the rest of the GSMNP backpackers. Now we not only have to pay a daily fee (which tops out at $4/night for a max of $20 and a max of 7 nights... sound familer?) but we have to have a reservation for a specific day for every campsite we want to stay at.
By comparison, AT thru hikers have it easy.
Sounds like Baxter is already implementing a plan to require AT thru hikers to register before they enter Baxter State Park... with talk that if conditions continue to get worst, they might start limiting the number of thru hikers per day allowed to enter the park.
I myself am planning a thru hike of the JMT this summer. If you want to hike the WHOLE trail (starting in Yosemite), you have to enter a lottery to get a permit... of which only 20 permits per day are issued (actually, there are more, but that's for starting somewhere OTHER than at the official start of the JMT). I don't know about numbers for this year, but the park service said that last year, 800 people per day were entering that lottery.
Two thru permits wouldn't fly...
To get 'A' permit, your hike must start and end 50 miles beyond the park boundaries.
why couldnt it be two regular permits and not the AT thru hiker permit?
reserve the shelters to stay at for the southern half----then reserve the shelters for the northern half....
one would just have to know how many days to stay in gatlinburg and then afterwards just pick the trail back up and hike on.........
Slo-go'en
03-02-2016, 21:37
why couldnt it be two regular permits and not the AT thru hiker permit?
reserve the shelters to stay at for the southern half----then reserve the shelters for the northern half....
one would just have to know how many days to stay in gatlinburg and then afterwards just pick the trail back up and hike on.........
Getting a thru hiker permit allows for flexibility. It allows you to show up when ever you get there and stay at what ever shelters meet your schedule. Besides doing the extra 100 miles, that maybe one of reasons the OP wants to go that way.
MuddyWaters
03-02-2016, 21:41
Suppose you run into the same backcountry ranger or ridgerunner.........twice.......
Getting a thru hiker permit allows for flexibility. It allows you to show up when ever you get there and stay at what ever shelters meet your schedule. Besides doing the extra 100 miles, that maybe one of reasons the OP wants to go that way.
i realize that, but the OP also wanted to stay "legal"....
this allows it....
and to be honest, getting through the northern half of the park, can be done pretty easily by knowing which shelters you want to stay at......after all, there's only 5 shelters...........four if one doesnt stay at icewater......
so, make a reservation at pecks, tricorner, cosby and davenport..........
stay in each one and bam=----OP is legal...........
or a variation of those shelters...........
Starchild
03-02-2016, 21:52
Combine your thru permit with the regular 'Joe' nightly permits for the remaining nights could allow it. You will not enjoy the flexibility that the thru hiker permits allow for that second section. Also your Thru Hiker Permit does allow 7 nights, which even with a extended stay in G-burg could allow the first day returning to be on your Thru Permit.
It does seem like some way of suspending the thru hike permit should be allowed, extended stays in places like G-burg or Cherokee can occasionally be expected.
HooKooDooKu
03-03-2016, 01:58
Combine your thru permit with the regular 'Joe' nightly permits for the remaining nights could allow it.
I doubt that... because converting yourself to a general backpacking permit logically means that you've terminated your thru hiker status... yet didn't end that hike 50 miles beyond the park.
I think bottom line, the park service is being extremely flexible towards thru hikers (compared to general backpackers) and simply subjects them to a couple of simple rules. One of these rules is the 8 day limit.
If your plans deviate from what the thru hiker permit allows, then your only other legal choice is general backpacker permits.
WingedMonkey
03-03-2016, 11:25
Back before there was "the online permits" I did a thru hike that required me to spend three days in Gatlinburg. I wasn't even planning originally to go there.
A fall all the way back at before before I even entered the park twisted my knee or something.
It wasn't until I got off at Gatlinburg that I was able to find a substantial knee brace at the drug store. (a brace I wore all the way to about Atkins). Stayed in town for the three days to recover from walking without one.
I continued on to Maine. A thru hiker.
Rather they need to put it in writing or leave it up to the Rangers on trail, some sort or arrangement needs to be made. Rather or not they want to consider a leisure three days off or a medical three days off the same is another story.
Another Kevin
03-03-2016, 14:37
Back before there was "the online permits" I did a thru hike that required me to spend three days in Gatlinburg. I wasn't even planning originally to go there.
A fall all the way back at before before I even entered the park twisted my knee or something.
It wasn't until I got off at Gatlinburg that I was able to find a substantial knee brace at the drug store. (a brace I wore all the way to about Atkins). Stayed in town for the three days to recover from walking without one.
I continued on to Maine. A thru hiker.
Rather they need to put it in writing or leave it up to the Rangers on trail, some sort or arrangement needs to be made. Rather or not they want to consider a leisure three days off or a medical three days off the same is another story.
Given the mentality of some folks, we should probably account ourselves fortunate that they don't try to go after those who have to abandon their hikes for medical or other reasons - after all, they were on thru-hiker permits which called for the hike to end at least 50 miles past the park. If some bright young functionary starts seeing that the fine from that sort of thing could be a profit center, I could see it happening. A big swath of politicians would back it up as a way, no matter how minor, to reduce the burden on the taxpayer - the way some small towns use traffic enforcement.
Just saying:
I have hiked over 1500 miles of the Trail. I have never seen a ranger on the trail.
I did see one man In the park,who was taking a poll of passing hikers and had a uniform of some sort. He never asked to see my permit. I remember being a bit nervous because I had read about the permit requirement.
Also, I have never made a reservation for a shelter. Never really knew when (or if) I would get there. Again, no one ever confronted me, with their reservation paperwork, demanding space. If fact I've only seen totally full shelters one or two times in four of five months of hiking. I have seen a few trail angels, but they had no interest in checking papers.
Don't want to make trouble, just atating my experience.
I have hiked over 1500 miles of the Trail. I have never seen a ranger on the trail.
while that may be true on other parts of the trail-----inside the Park, during thru hiker season, there is a ridgerunner for the north half and one for the south half (or there might just be one now----at one point there was two)..
also, inside of the Park, on high traffic areas such as the AT and LeConte, they make it a point to have rangers out and about...
while its true that one may never see one-----that doesnt mean one can skirt the laws and regulations they have in place......
HooKooDooKu
03-03-2016, 15:48
while that may be true on other parts of the trail-----inside the Park, during thru hiker season, there is a ridgerunner for the north half and one for the south half (or there might just be one now----at one point there was two)...
In the roughly 20 years I've been camping in GSMNP, I've never been asked to show a permit... until the new permit system went into effect.
Rangers have seen me with my pack on at busy trailheads (like Clingman's Dome Parking lot) and asked to see my permit.
And it's not just 'thru-hiker' season. My half dozen trips last year included a total of two nights at two different GSMNP AT shelters. One night was in July, the other in October. Both times, the ridge runner "Twinkle Toes" happened to be spending the night at the same shelter.
i guess i define thru hiker season as march to october.........
i guess i should have rather have said----"general hiker season"..........when the majority of the hikers are out.........
ive been asked a few times under the old system-----mainly when it was a large group in the campsite.....and up at leconte shelter........if i was solo----then no............and at deep creek trailhead when a ranger had seen me drive in from the back way and then i was on the trail within minutes...........he figured i hadnt stopped by the kiosk to fill out a permit----but i had at sugarlands on my way in.....
i havent been backpacking in the park since the new system took effect...........
I said "trail angels" I think I meant "ridge runners"
WingedMonkey
03-03-2016, 17:07
Just saying:
I have hiked over 1500 miles of the Trail. I have never seen a ranger on the trail.
In fact when this happened, a Ranger appeared in the morning at the next shelter before we all headed out.
He did check all out permits (hang tags at the time). He didn't pay much attention to me.
His questioned everyone about a couple at the shelter that where in like their 80's and if we knew them as thru-hikers.
Seems he didn't believe anyone that old could be thru hiking. We did know them and it wasn't their first thru-hike.
:sun