View Full Version : Titanium Esbit Wing Stove
right now i'm using a titanium GigaPower stove and canister. i was looking to go lighter and stumbled across this one.
has anyone here tried this stove? thoughts? reviews?
Titanium Esbit Wing Stove (http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/titanium-esbit-wing-stove.html)
Lanthar Mandragoran
12-21-2005, 14:43
The guys over on the BPL forums seem to like it, those who have bought it at least. As you can tell from the pics on the site, there is a limit to the minimum size pot you can use.
I'll post a short preview when I get it. I sometimes don't feel like looking for the right height matching rocks for a pot support. I may be getting spoiled with age.
Lanthar Mandragoran
12-22-2005, 11:10
I'll post a short preview when I get it. I sometimes don't feel like looking for the right height matching rocks for a pot support. I may be getting spoiled with age.
Or getting wiser... often a little luxury is worth the added grams... wisdom is learning to balance that (and cost and durability and versatility) to maximize enjoyment of the outdoors
bulldog49
12-22-2005, 14:32
Or getting wiser... often a little luxury is worth the added grams... wisdom is learning to balance that (and cost and durability and versatility) to maximize enjoyment of the outdoors
Amen. Arguing that a particular piece of gear is preferable soley because it's a few grams lighter than another is so silly. I place greater emphasis on quality, durability and convenience over weight. Hence things like alcohol stoves and poncho tarps will never be on my gear list.
Amen. Arguing that a particular piece of gear is preferable soley because it's a few grams lighter than another is so silly. I place greater emphasis on quality, durability and convenience over weight. Hence things like alcohol stoves and poncho tarps will never be on my gear list.I'm not sure it's silly. It is just a different paradigm. If your goal is convenience, then weight is a non-issue. If your goal is to walk more comfortably, then weight is the issue.
Durability is highly over-rated. Will it do the job, that is the main question. I have packs that are 20 years old that would last another hundred even if I still used them. I don't.
No one wants to replace gear unnecessarily, but if a $125 pack lasts only three years but it saves you 3 pounds, then you are paying $40 a year, $40 per thruhike, to carry 3 less pounds the entire hike. $40 is nothing to sneeze at, but if you avoid a single night in a motel and campout you can get that money back. One night out of a bed is worth carrying thre pounds for 2000 miles, isn't it?
bulldog49
12-22-2005, 15:19
I'm not talking about, say using a 6 lb pack because it's more durable. I'm talking of, for instance, choosing a 2 lb 10 oz Osprey Atmos 50 over a 2 lb Granite Gear Vapor Trail because the Atmos allows me to better organize my gear. Or using a 4 oz Snow Peak Giga stove instead of a 3 oz alchol stove because it's more efficient and convenient. The relatively insignificant wt difference has little or no effect on walking comfortably. The minor weight addition makes my overall hiking experience better, not worse.
The point is, I believe the discussions on these boards give too much emphasis to weight and not enough to other qualities. Hence, the threads where folks are competing to see who has the lightest pack. Kinda reminds me of when I was a kid and we would compete to see who had..... well, you know what I mean.
Red's post above is the perfect example of what I'm talking about. He's currently using a 3 oz stove and wants to change to a lighter one. Why? Is knocking another oz from his load really going to make his walking any easier? Is it worth that oz to spend an extra 10 minutes after a cold wet day on the trail waiting for a hot meal? Not to me.
Lanthar Mandragoran
12-22-2005, 15:45
Amen. Arguing that a particular piece of gear is preferable soley because it's a few grams lighter than another is so silly. I place greater emphasis on quality, durability and convenience over weight. Hence things like alcohol stoves and poncho tarps will never be on my gear list.
I'm not sure it's silly. It is just a different paradigm. If your goal is convenience, then weight is a non-issue. If your goal is to walk more comfortably, then weight is the issue.
Durability is highly over-rated...
But, that is exactly the point. Too many people have the 'silly' paradigm that weight is the ONLY issue, and they schlep everything else into 'non-issues'. Or (as was the old paradigm) that durability is the issue, making everything else 'non-issues'. OR people take convience as the main issue...
The reality is that EVERYTHING is an issue to some extent or another. The key is how much things contribute to enjoying the outdoor experience, or the likelihood of you a long-distance thru hike (if that is more important to you than enjoying the outdoors). Finding the balance of these issues is wise / zen / best / whatever you want to call it.
If you want an example, browse yourself over to BPL.com, and check out the Spreadsheet Contest (http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/backpacking_light_gear_list_spreadsheets_2005.html ) entries, if you scroll down through all of the glorified checklists, about half-way down you'll find Vick Hines and my entry (http://www.backpackinglight.com/backpackinglight/images/bpl-gear-list-spreadsheet-contest-josh-mitchell.xls). Unlike every other submission, we submitted a tool to decide what gear you should take, based on how important certain criteria are to you.
I haven't mentioned it anyplace other than in mine and Vick's emails to each other, because I wanted to wait and see if it got 'discovered'.
Basically it's a tool to help you 'Hike your own hike'
Now, I'm not one to downplay others opinions but, frankly, basing all your gear decisions on a single criteria is silly. Maybe focusing solely on weight isn't as silly as focusing solely on ensuring all of your gear is colored in matching shades of blue, but it's still silly.
I'm also not saying everyone focuses only on weight, but sometimes the discussions around here do get extremely focused solely on weight.
My guess is that tinker is thinking that the convience, security (not worrying about the rocks spilling your water / meal), enviromental impact (not leaving soot on the rocks), and fuel savings (from having the right 'height' everytime, though this by itself won't make up the weight) is worth the few grams penalty of carrying the ti-stove.
btw... for what it's worth, you can get ti foil for 15$ / sqft over at titaniumgoat.com now... slightly thicker / heavier than the stuff that BPL sells, but a good bit cheaper too (cost is important to me)...
Now, I'm not one to downplay others opinions but, frankly, basing all your gear decisions on a single criteria is silly. Maybe focusing solely on weight isn't as silly as focusing solely on ensuring all of your gear is colored in matching shades of blue, but it's still silly.I think perhaps you misunderstood my post, or perhaps I worded it very poorly.
The question at hand that I saw was durability and convenience were "good" criteria and weight was silly.
There are always trade-offs in any decision-making process. The key is making priorities. In my decision-making process, weight is much higher than convenience, and durability is not even on the charts. This may be silly to you and the other fella, but it isn't to me.
Given equal functionality (not conveneince, but functionality) I feel it is best to go with the lighter choice. Durability is much less important than doing the job at hand. In doing the job at hand, weight is more important than whether the gear will be around in ten years or not.
To the question posed the other guy, "Is knocking off one ounce going to make my hike easier?" the answer is of course it will. To say it won't is akin to saying "There is no sense in voting because it is only one vote agaisnt millions of other people."
Your vote counts and your ounce counts. Individual votes add up and so do individual ounces. And if your goal is to reduce ounces, then cut that ounce. If your goal is to have a comfortable experience in camp, or at least a less uncomfortable one, then go with the convenience factor.
There is nothing wrong with carry gear that is dsigned for comfort. The old adage is that you can go light and hike comforably or go heavy and camp comfortably. What is wrong is assigning the judgement "silly" to the values espoused by other people, simply because they aren't your values. If someone wants blue gear, it's no skin of my nose. It's not something I would do, but I don't see why others can't color coordinate if they want to. Personallyh, I prefer earth tones.
If you want an example, browse yourself over to BPL.com, and check out the Spreadsheet Contest (http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/backpacking_light_gear_list_spreadsheets_2005.html ) entries, if you scroll down through all of the glorified checklists, about half-way down you'll find Vick Hines and my entry (http://www.backpackinglight.com/backpackinglight/images/bpl-gear-list-spreadsheet-contest-josh-mitchell.xls). Unlike every other submission, we submitted a tool to decide what gear you should take, based on how important certain criteria are to you.I downloaded this a few days ago, along with other spreadsheets that caught my eye. Nice job, and I'm sure very useful for a hiker who is not sure what gear he wants. I didn't use it personally only because I have tons of gear and already know which piece I want for each trip determined by distance/weather/season/compamnions etc etc.
Red's post above is the perfect example of what I'm talking about. He's currently using a 3 oz stove and wants to change to a lighter one. Why? Is knocking another oz from his load really going to make his walking any easier? Is it worth that oz to spend an extra 10 minutes after a cold wet day on the trail waiting for a hot meal? Not to me.
when you hike on a regular basis with 2 rebuilt knees (shattered & tore all the ligaments), every once counts.
Footslogger
12-22-2005, 17:56
when you hike on a regular basis with 2 rebuilt knees (shattered & tore all the ligaments), every once counts.
================================================
Knees aren't rebuilds (yet anyway) but at my age your logic is sound in my opinion.
I remember getting ready for my thru in 2003. I was weighing items individually and amazed at how fast it adds up. All it takes is 16 itsy bitsy 1 ounce items to make a pound. I made some important decisions involving trade-offs in weight/performance and it really did come down to ounces in some cases.
'Slogger
It weighs 11 grams, and the ti foil windscreen with holes weighs 9 grams. The foil is just a little too tall to fit into my Evernew 1.3l ti pot.
My Snow Peak cheapo ti pot doesn't sit on the stove well. The bottom is slightly rounded and doesn't sit flat on the pot supports, yet it's too large( 3-3/4" ) to nest between them.
I haven't tested it yet, but it looks durable enough for regular use (not a throw away after a week hike ul item).
The rivet around which the pot supports swing is rather small, and I highly doubt it's made of ti. Time will tell whether it will rust or not.
I also got the Rainstopper suit ($9.00). I didn't weigh it, but it's very light, has welded seams and a full front zipper (no pit zips for $9.00). I'll test it Sunday when it rains.
Happy holidays. Enjoy them!:banana :jump :)
thanks for the preview. :)
i got mine in the mail a couple days ago.
my Snow Peak Ti Mini Solo sits well on the stove, but my Evernew Ti 0.9L does not... maybe this is a good excuse to upgrade to the 1.3L.
and i can see having trouble with that rivet down the road... but that's no big deal, i can replace it with an aluminum one when necessary.