View Full Version : Sleeping Bag Liners
mtntopper
03-06-2016, 21:40
Any thoughts on sleeping bags liners? What materials are best? Weight? Best Bag for the buck? Thanks for your help.
Lady Grey
03-06-2016, 22:02
I'm a big fan of sleeping bag liners. They keep the dirt and grime out of the bag, and they're especially good on warm nights, when you can sleep in the liner on top of your bag. When I hiked the AT I carried a Sea to Summit Cool Max liner, which I really liked. In the interest of a lighter option, I just purchased the Western Mountaineering whisper sleep liner, which I think will work well.
Lady Grey AT NOBO '13
mtntopper
03-06-2016, 23:33
I'm a big fan of sleeping bag liners. They keep the dirt and grime out of the bag, and they're especially good on warm nights, when you can sleep in the liner on top of your bag. When I hiked the AT I carried a Sea to Summit Cool Max liner, which I really liked. In the interest of a lighter option, I just purchased the Western Mountaineering whisper sleep liner, which I think will work well.
Lady Grey AT NOBO '13
What sleeping bag did you use?
http://www.cocoon.at/eng/show.php?doc=frameset&page=material
Different ones with different properties with different prices for different goals.
FWIW, for what I'm usually achieving I like a 100% silk /silk rip stock mummy liner at the lowest wt which as far as I know is about 4 oz that provides about a 5*f - 8*f temp boost. The silk is easy to wash, doesn't cling so much so it's easy for even someone like me as a side sleeper toss and turner not to get hung up in(although there are two silk liners I know of that have lycra side stretchy panels incorporated into the silk), is minimal bulk, etc but it does come at a $$ cost that some might find to be high. Good silk isn't the cheapest material.
Had my mom make me one....
sketched out an outline using my sleeping bag and she went to town...
used a few yards of fleece to make liner and carry case/pillow case...
sure, it's a little bulky and not as light as silk, but it does the job and was cheap---like ten or so dollars.....
A polyester bed sheet can be adapted for a liner at a reasonable cost.
MuddyWaters
03-07-2016, 07:52
Any thoughts on sleeping bags liners? What materials are best? Weight? Best Bag for the buck? Thanks for your help.
Theres 4 reasons to want a liner:
1. You want to keep your bag cleaner
2. You want to carry ~8 oz for an additional 2-3F of warmth
3. You enjoy being tangled up in loose folds of cloth
4. You believe marketing spin with the words "Up To X F " on the label
If you could get 15F out of a cloth sack, people would use two cloth sacks for $40, instead of a $300 40 F down quilt.
Not worth it for what it does.
BlueRidgeBackpacking
03-07-2016, 09:31
Anyone have any experience with the Cocoon Silk Mummy Liner? (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001DX5O6I?colid=1V8DEY7TQPIOK&coliid=I57DBUZOTBGNV&psc=1&ref_=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl)
I'm considering purchasing it with a dual purpose in mind: Summer bag (NC Hikes) / Bag Liner. As a liner it would be paired with my Sierra Designs BackCountry Bed (2 Season, 600 fill). Even when I am very clean I have oily skin. I'm a backpacking newbie and haven't hiked with my setup yet but I did do a trial run in my backyard (29 degrees with ice all over the tent!), and I noticed the oils from my face were all over the sleeping bag. Maybe I'm stressing too much over keeping my nice new down sleeping bag clean...
nsherry61
03-07-2016, 13:10
Theres 4 reasons to want a liner:
1. You want to keep your bag cleaner
2. You want to carry ~8 oz for an additional 2-3F of warmth
3. You enjoy being tangled up in loose folds of cloth
4. You believe marketing spin with the words "Up To X F " on the label
If you could get 15F out of a cloth sack, people would use two cloth sacks for $40, instead of a $300 40 F down quilt.
Not worth it for what it does.
+1
Sleep in your long underwear. It's warmer. It's dual purpose.
Harrison Bergeron
03-07-2016, 16:40
I can't for the life of me imagine sleeping in the same unwashed sleeping bag for 6 months while only taking a shower once a week. I wouldn't consider it optional.
And "2-3 degrees" is nonsense. Maybe if you're talking about one of those pointlessly lightweight silk things that also aren't thick enough to keep your bag clean.
Mine easily adds 10 degrees. It's advertised as 15 degrees, but that would put me at 15 degrees with my 30 degree bag. The lowest I've ever seen is 20. I slept OK but I had to wear socks. 15 would be pushing it. Sea To Summit Reactor Thermalite. 8.5 oz.
...Anyone have any experience with the Cocoon Silk Mummy Liner?
(http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001DX5O6I?colid=1V8DEY7TQPIOK&coliid=I57DBUZOTBGNV&psc=1&ref_=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl)
I limit gear critiques and opinions especially if I'm going to be cynical to gear I've extensively used or at least have extensively observed in use.
I've had four of the Cocoon silk mummy liners linked extensively utilizing them. I like them. One was stolen along with a backpack. One I burnt holes in sleeping only in it too close to a campfire.
I recognize liners as yet another additional way to tweak the character of sleep systems that can possibly be combined with other gear, techniques, and strategies. I will possibly use a liner alone in mid summer as a SUL minimal bulk minimal wt comfortable in humid conditions "sleeping bag." I also enjoy a silk liner as a travel sheet to use at hiker hostels, as a sheet on public transportation, etc.
I will pair a SILK mummy liner with a rather tight fitting down mummy sleeping bag or form fitting cut quilt to boost the temp rating, decrease moisture from entering down slightly preserving down loft, and reduce/eliminate drafts in a quilt as a side sleeper who tosses from side to side all night long, and lastly keep some oils/grime, etc from a sleeping bag/quilt. My main goal is avoiding drafts in a quilt and boosting temp rating of the sleep system.
With that specific Cocoon Ripstop SILK/SILK mummy liner I unequivocally obtain about a 5- 6* temp boost. Many a time I've tested this temp boost rating with and without the liner using a thermometer. While MAYBE the temp boost claimed by marketing COULD slightly be exaggerated with some liners(AGAIN, there are different liners possibly used to address different goals which is why I linked to Cocoon's Liner Table, I also haven't demoed all types of the many liners available!) it is my contention it is NOT highly exaggerated marketing claims that is the primary culprit in not achieving cited specked temp boost but USER ability/inability! If one treats this mummy liner essentially as a sleeping bag within a sleeping bag bundling up inside the liner using the attached drawstring and hood as one does with a sleeping bag/quilt alone it makes a difference in warmth realized! From what I've largely observed most liner users simply slide into this type of liner not utilizing all its features to bundle up to trap the most amount of warmth!
Being a side sleeper tossing and turning all night long neither do I experience the entanglement issues some have cited with this mummy SILK liner. It is with fleece, cotton, etc "clingy, grabby" liners that I have the entanglement issues. Perhaps, my lean med frame in relation to the dimensions and cut of this SILK mummy liner used in conjunction with already minimal dimension mummy sleeping bags/quilts also have something to do with me having no entanglement issues.
Regarding NSherry's comments I don't see it always as an either/or liner verse sleeping clothes debate. A liner can add to the sleep warmth WHILE ALSO adding to sleep warmth wearing sleeping clothing. This allows the sleep system to be additionally tweaked to an even lower temp rating. Basically, with the addition of this 4.3-4.7 oz silk liner alone I'm converting a 40* quilt where I MIGHT have some draft issues into a 35* quilt which might be what makes the difference in a comfortable night's sleep without much additional bulk. Combing various other gear pieces(bivies, sleeping clothes(gloves, socks, hat for example), added under insulation, chemical heat packs, hot water bottles, calisthenics, hearty hot dinner meal, campsite consideration, etc with a liner with while in an enclosed battened down tent one can tweak a sleeping bag/quilt temp rating easily 20*+ lower all with one main sleeping bag/quilt possibly allowing not needing to purchase an additional sleeping bag/quilt.
I also recognize a liner as a multipurpose piece of gear. It is a sheet of silk offering MANY possible functions! It does not have to be a single use piece of gear! At times I've used a liner draped over my shoulders for warmth while hiking, attached it under a tarp to add shade or under a single wall tent to provide a barrier between me and condensation, made a hanging seat, made an afternoon siesta cooling sun tarp, added it UNDER me for a ground cloth or additional under insulation, etc. It also makes a good impromptu toga when all your other gear is being cleaned and dried on the trail.:D
Silk is easy to clean, doesn't absorb moisture like cotton, feels awesome next to skin, etc.....
If one is seeking to save some do re mi a MYOG DIY liner is one of the easiest projects to tackle. Even TNhiker's Mother can do it.:p
U can wash every night . Plus wash your bag once in a while.
BlueRidgeBackpacking
03-07-2016, 17:19
Wow! Thanks a bunch for the thorough analysis of the Cocoon Silk Mummy Liner. I suspected it would be a versatile addition to my sleep system and your thoughts confirm that.
Even TNhiker's Mother can do it.:p
her sewing daze maybe over this week...........
im up in MD for her neck surgery this week..............
mtntopper
03-07-2016, 21:38
Thanks all for the information!:)
nsherry61
03-07-2016, 22:49
I just find liners redundant. They are much heavier for a given temperature change than a bag/quilt with a little more fill, and I'm already carying extra insulation in the form of clothing. I can see their use for people insisting on sleeping naked but, that's about it.
It appears silk is preferred due to its weight; however, is there a lighter weight 100% cotton or a 100% merino wool recommended by anyone? (Silk and me do not get along!)
The first few deacdes of outdoor in my life I went just in the bag (if I had one), without a liner.
The bags became terribly filthy.
Then cotton liners became popular, but after giving it some tries I skipped that, because they were not slippy enough and everything got mangeled in the bag - limby, liner, clothes.
Got my first silk liner a few years back, and loved it - mostly. This silk liner was rather simple square shape, with an extra flap to cover the pillow/hood. While the fabric is great, providing a very soft and cosy feeling on the skin, the design of it is no good.
I never found any improvement of temperature rating due to a cotton or silk liner - I seriousely doubt that there is any.
I have a very old bivy bag thats mummy shape with a front zip halfway down and a very nice hood and straps to close the front opening down to a small hole to poke the nose out. Its made of simple nylon (not waterproof), and thats what I use nowadays as a liner. Its slippy enough to let the limbs move freely around, keeps the filth away from the bag, slows down the moisture escaping into the bag insulation, and it definitely improves the temperature rating of the whole system by a few degrees. I also use it as a bug protection in very hot nights (needs some extra protection for the exposed face though)
Not everybody will like the feeling of pure nylon on the skin - I like it.
If ever this old bivy bag breaks I will make a new one myself (you can't buy such simple low-tech stuff any more nowadays).
Midwest Mike
03-08-2016, 08:39
+1
Sleep in your long underwear. It's warmer. It's dual purpose.
This is what I don't understand, and maybe someone could explain it to me. I don't understand the advantage of, say, a silk liner over silk pajamas of the same thickness. To me, it's intuitive that the latter would be at least as warm (because it's form fitting) for less material and so less weight, and protect the bag almost as well (almost because the hands are uncovered). But then I've only used long underwear as PJs, and I've never tried a liner.
DuneElliot
03-08-2016, 13:51
I always struggled with a liner too. My mom used to make us use them in bags when we were younger and I'd always get caught up in them. I much prefer a pair of light-weight long-johns/pyjamas to sleep in for double purpose (a consistently dry set of clothes, and keep my bag cleaner). I just prefer to sleep in jammies when camping. For a 4oz liner I'd rather upgrade the temp rating of my bag.
Modularity has advantages over permanency in a sleep system ie; greater versatility, greater tweakability, ability not to carry more/less than one currently desires, etc
My problem is I don't like sleeping in clothes. Part of my problem sleeping on the trail is the clothes feel like they're binding me. I've been considering getting a liner to free me up, so to speak.
Modularity has advantages over permanency in a sleep system ie; greater versatility, greater tweakability, ability not to carry more/less than one currently desires, etc
Agreed. I carry one in the winter to supplement my 20 degree bag if I think it will be in the low teens. I do think it is heavy for what it does, but spending money on a 5 or 10 degree bag just wouldn't work for me right now.