View Full Version : Protein powder, one better than others?
MtDoraDave
04-23-2016, 10:52
I was inspired by the breakfast bomb thread, and have been looking into other recipes (here and elsewhere) for a breakfast that I can go with on the trail(s) - because oatmeal doesn't cut it (for me).
At the healthfood store, I was pretty much overwhelmed by the different protein powders. Plain, flavored, soy, whey, rice, "isolate" ... one boasts no bovine growth hormones... Does that matter?
I'm neither vegetarian nor vegan, but am certainly not opposed to using a vegan option if its benefits outweigh the higher costs I associate with things catered to vegans.
Looking for experience and knowledge for guidance so I don't have to go through any more of a learning curve than necessary.
rocketsocks
04-23-2016, 11:43
Many of those are for repairing muscle after having worked them, what you're in the morning before the work begins is some slow burning carbs to carry ya through the task at hand, a balance of proteins, fats and carbs. At least that's my understanding.
http://www.defensenutrition.com/warrior-whey/
https://www.gardenoflife.com/content/product/why-choose-raw-protein/
https://myvega.com/products/vega-protein-and-greens/
FWIW, I personally only inconsistently supplement with any of these on the trail. It depends on where I'm at physically and how I'm tweaking the rest of what's in my trail food bag to go along with these. So, for me I'm considering a larger context than just protein or convenience. The rest of my trail food(snacks(nuts, seeds, dried hummus, cookies, energy bites, etc), bars, meals, etc) typically contain more than enough protein already. I might add one of these powders to a heated, maybe even cold, B-fast of millet, oatmeal, quinoa(cooked the night before) with some fruit and an oil(coconut, flax, borage, etc). More rarely I'll make a drink to sip. Two of the benefits I'm after in supplementing with any of these on trail is not so much the protein but the other nutrients that some "protein powders" include and reducing food volume.
I hear you about the overwhelmed feeling attempting to wade through the protein powder varieties. Good luck. From what I can tell, and that may not be a lot, there's a larger segment of the protein powder market geared towards body builders. The market is also geared towards others perhaps involved in different activities such as overall fitness, or alternative non "pump it up" lifestyles(diet, possibly LD backpackers, etc). Obviously, sometimes marketers will sell to whomever so not so much a clear line on what products are geared to whom. Trying to separate what products are geared towards different people can be confusing. IMO, backpacking is not in the same ballpark activity or nutritional wise as one seeking to "bulk up", hit the weight bench, etc so you might take that into consideration when and where you're making "protein" powder choices and to whom you get advice from. Consider where those giving advice are accustomed. A backpacker is not "ripping" muscle and having to repair it to the extent a body builder is. Then, LD backpacking activity and nutritional requirements changes things up yet again.
rocketsocks
04-23-2016, 12:30
Many of those are for repairing muscle after having worked them, what you're in the morning before the work begins is some slow burning carbs to carry ya through the task at hand, a balance of proteins, fats and carbs. At least that's my understanding.oops, should have read...what you're after
My reading and experience supports use of a grass-fed whey protein such as Blue Bonnet. Avoid soy unless you need more estrogen--that's how the body uses soy. Generally avoid products made (meat, milk, whey, etc) from industrial mega-feedlot operations using grain-fed cattle because these animals are obese and unhealthy.
Having said that, you don't need a lot of protein in your diet for hiking. No more than 20%.
IMO what you really need to boost is quality fat if you want to shift your body into clean, efficient fat-burning mode from the more common and metabolically messy sugar-burning mode. That means cheese, eggs, avocados rather than candy, pop tarts, and Little Debbies... You shouldn't need to supplement if you eat the correct diet.
there's good info on protein powder supplements on marksdailyapple.com (http://www.marksdailyapple.com/whey-isolate-concentrate-hydrolysate/#axzz46gIWiFgP)
When my doctor recommended a high protein diet, I was told to only use the "Whey Isolate" variety of protein powders. I believe it was because the other type has more carbs and calories. I guess it depends on where you are at weight/nutrition.
MuddyWaters
04-23-2016, 22:23
Whey is generally best. Dissolves easiest and high quality. But totally unnecessary. You will get enough protein eating 4000 cal per day. What you wont get, is enough calories, making the protein effort worthless anyway.
MtDoraDave
04-24-2016, 13:03
Thank you for your replies and links.
Tipi Walter
04-24-2016, 13:32
Like every other backpacker out there, I've been thru the whole protein powder, nido powder, soy milk powder and green powder quest. Not sure any of them really helped. On my next trip I'm taking several bags of organic raw sunflower and pumpkin seeds. These babies pack a wallop and darn near have everything a human needs to stay alive.
Vegan Packer
04-27-2016, 01:29
I use Now Pea Protein.
http://www.nowfoods.com/Pea-Protein-Powder-2lbs.htm
One more I'm trying now first at home before I use on trail. https://www.amazinggrass.com/store/protein-superfood-pure-vanilla.html I have had very good experiences and like several of the Amazing Grass products.
And, once again it expands more nutritional value than just narrowly examining protein amounts. In short, I sometimes cringe at the phrase "protein powder" because it gives the impression that "protein powders" CAN'T include so much more beneficial nutrition than just protein.
FWIW, this is something I'm trying likely for a limited time on a LD hike due to anticipated long food hauls between resupplies at the beginning of a 2900 mile hike addressing fresh food bulk and wt and its possible lack of regular availability and the possible need for some added gear wt and gear volume I usually don't carry(crampons, ice axe, heavier sleep system, etc). 800 miles of the hike will have some high navigational challenges(not using GPS though) and substantial strenuous elevation changes in rocky heavily forested mountainous terrain on unknown routes(bushwhacking and traversing trail less above treeline) and rarely maintained or used single track(Canada). I'm seeking 25+ MPD and moving 15 hour per day avgs. Here, the "protein powder" may assist addressing these concerns.
It took my wife and I some serious detective work, but we finally found Hemp Protein from Manitoba Harvest and NaturesPlus Pea Protein that we could both eat.
Minimum ingredients and NO STEVIA. Stevia is a deal breaker for both of us.
The products listed above, in our book, fail to list ingredients online, ingredient lists longer than 1 line or Stevia.
Happy with hemp and peas in East Texas.
Wayne & Lisa
Sent from somewhere around here.
It took my wife and I some serious detective work, but we finally found Hemp Protein from Manitoba Harvest and NaturesPlus Pea Protein that we could both eat.
Minimum ingredients and NO STEVIA. Stevia is a deal breaker for both of us.
The products listed above, in our book, fail to list ingredients online, ingredient lists longer than 1 line or Stevia.
Happy with hemp and peas in East Texas.
Wayne & Lisa
Sent from somewhere around here.
Good for you in East Taxas. :D
Two things;
1) why the pooh poohing of stevia? Educate me.
2) I hear you about the short ingredient lists but, for me, even with a longer list if the ingredients are things I can commonly understand without needing a chemistry degree, things like ALL the ingredients in the Amazing Grass Protein Superfood, which BTW contain both Organic Pea and Organic Hemp Protein, I don't mind the longer lists. Amazing Grass, as also the other reputable product manufacturer's I listed, do indeed transparently publish their complete nutritional labels including ingredient lists on line.
One of the deal breakers for some protein powder supplement users are added sugars/sugar including stevia. For that reason, and perhaps others, Amazing Grass Protein Superfood has very little sugar and VERY little Stevia by wt, volume, and total caloric load.
Venchka, dont know where you get or how much you pay for your Shelled Hemp but I've purchased Manitoba Harvest Organic Shelled Hemps seed in 28 oz packages for about $11 at Costco. That's a darn good price per pound for organic shelled hemp seed. Costco sells 100% Vega brand Pea and Greens Protein at a retail price hard to beat as well.
CoconutTree
04-27-2016, 17:04
Jarrow's Formula Unflavored Whey Protein Poweder from Amazon or elsewhere. By itself it has a very mild milk flavor. I always mix it in with dinner, which is some type of rice side or pasta side. Easy to do.
Whey protein is one of the better protein supplements to promote muscle growth. If you want to build leg muscles, the more protein the better as far as I am concerned, within reason. However I eat much less protein than a body builder, just gets hard to eat more. If you don't eat enough protein, your body will scavange protein from your upper body to build up your leg muscles.
rocketsocks
04-27-2016, 18:23
...and eating excess amounts of protein will over work the kidneys.
Stevia: In a nutshell, tastes horrible to us.
We don't have access to Costco. Sam's Club selection is not to our liking. We buy from local mom and pop shops.
Wayne
Sent from somewhere around here.
SGTJones
04-29-2016, 12:59
In general whey protein from any major supplier will do just fine. The main difference between brands is the flavor. Personally I like Optimum Nutrition, Cellucor, Prophorm, Dymatize, EAS. The protein you get from Wal-Mart works just fine and is made by EAS.
I received a *****load of protein samples from Cellucor for my YouTube channel(literally 800 4 serving packets of protein). So I'm going to have a bounce-box filled with protein sample packets. The plan will be to take in 50g/day. 25g in the morning in an oatmeal/quinoa/flaxseed/chia seed/cranberry blend and 25g at lunch.
You might try reaching out to different supplement manufacturers and ask if you can buy sample packets from them. Hell they might just give you a bunch of free protein if you agree to post about it to your social. I find most supplement companies are really good about giving out free samples.
Then you'd have a super convenient way of carrying protein with you on the trail and not have to parse it out to ziplock baggies yourself.
As to the overwork of the kidneys - not true. There is no clinical evidence to suggest that taking protein supplements adversely effects the kidneys in a healthy human adult. Or creatine for that matter. It's a huge myth in the fitness community. The only studies that have ever shown any causal link have been with people who have a pre-existing condition with their kidneys.
Also - it's a myth that you can only absorb 20g of protein in a setting. I do intermittent fasting(only eat 1-2 big meals a day) and have had no problem with meals that had 200g protein.
CamelMan
04-30-2016, 14:04
I've been using Vega One because of the added ingredients, but also soy protein from Walmart, Olympian Labs 8-in-1 (similar to Vega One), and MLO Rice Protein from Kroger. (That last one was just convenient to buy, and has a higher carb content than the others.) The reason I'm doing this is because I'm trying for the 1.8g/kg that nitrogen balance studies show is the most that an endurance athlete (like myself, of course) can utilize daily and I'm getting used to a new workload. My meals are a starchy staple + low calorie vegetables/fruit in some ratio, so I could just use beans for my starchy staples, and/or add some canned peas but I think I get some flexibility this way. I can eat just protein and fruit for a low-fat breakfast. Olympian labs is 20% calories from fat anyway--ridiculous!
One problem I saw with the breakfast "bomb" was that it had something like 120 calories. 2 cups uncooked (so you can eat it) 1-minute oats + 1/2 cup raisins + 1 scoop of Vega One is a nice 980 calorie breakfast with 43 grams of protein to get you going. Add another 1/2 cup raisins to make it 1200.
(Animal protein will kill you: http://nutritionfacts.org/video/which-type-of-protein-is-better-for-our-kidneys/)
I thought of you when I read Prof Tim Noakes "Idiots guide to LCHF and banting" which you can find on the web.
He says "A healthy high-protein diet for humans doesn’t exist. If your diet was 100% protein, you’d get sick and die."
Again there's no need to raise protein intake above 15-20%, and you can generally do that with food.
As usual, the vegans are coming out of the woodwork to attack meat eating. Don't listen, just consider the source: a diet based on left-wing politics. Why not base your diet in 2.5 million years of healthy eating?
MtDoraDave
05-01-2016, 08:07
One of the things I try to be careful about is the L - argenine vs L - lysine content. Years of battling cold sores and online research has taught me that L - argenine intake can bring on cold sores, while L - lysine consumption tends to suppress the chance of a breakout.
Many of these protein powders have some of both amino acids, but the pea powder was higher in Argenine than Lysine. The whey protein powders I looked at in the health food store were much higher in Lysine than Argenine.
.
Anyone who suffers from cold sores' southern cousin (iykwim) can also benefit from increasing Lysine and reducing Argenine.
.
As I said in my initial post, I'm not anti-vegan, but in this case it is not a viable option for me.
CamelMan
05-01-2016, 08:44
Don't listen, just consider the source: a diet based on left-wing politics.
Then do some research. Greger doesn't conduct the studies, he merely reports what the vegan conspiracy tells him. Lots of the stuff is available as full text on PubMed and anyone can fact check it for themselves.
Do you know anybody more annoying than vegans? We were put on Earth to spoil your BBQ--and good riddance! ;) However, not everybody is vegan for ethical reasons, and ethical reasons are not political ones. I would be vegan for health reasons regardless of the ethics, and neither of those things has anything to do with my left-wing politics except that it's a convenient fit if somebody cares about the planet and human life, as well as animals.
Protein "needs" are going to depend on what you're doing. The RDA is only 0.8g/kg but nitrogen balance studies show that people engaged in strength or endurance activities can utilize more.
CamelMan
05-01-2016, 08:51
Why not base your diet in 2.5 million years of healthy eating?
Well, besides the fact that it begs the question that what they ate was healthy and not just easier to get, or what they ate to begin with, I still hope I can do better than a cave man. ;)
Btw I just finished Noakes' book, Waterlogged. It's a great read, if there were a Pulitzer for science writing it should be in the running. Towards the end he does suggest the idea of a "fat adapted athlete" so I'll try to find the article you mentioned.
MtDoraDave
05-01-2016, 15:34
Let's try to stay on topic.
I don't want to see this wonderful HIKING forum turn into a vegan vs omnivores battleground. That argument can be almost as bad as politics or religion arguments.
CamelMan
05-01-2016, 18:20
Yeah, true, sorry.
The Lewis & Clark Expedition proved that living exclusively on a diet of elk, venison and bison was most unhealthy.
Wayne
Sent from somewhere around here.
I thought of you when I read Prof Tim Noakes "Idiots guide to LCHF and banting" which you can find on the web.
He says "A healthy high-protein diet for humans doesn’t exist. If your diet was 100% protein, you’d get sick and die."
Again there's no need to raise protein intake above 15-20%, and you can generally do that with food.
As usual, the vegans are coming out of the woodwork to attack meat eating. Don't listen, just consider the source: a diet based on left-wing politics. Why not base your diet in 2.5 million years of healthy eating?
Was on board with this post up until you alienated all the Vegans/vegetarians as left wing. Umm, you do know Hindus, Buddhist, followers of Judaism,... North Africans, Indians, Chinese, Japanese, Israelis, Taiwanese, Filipinos, Austrians, Swedes, Australians, Brazilians,......have measurable populations of vegetarians/Vegans?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarianism_by_country
Oh sorry Wikipedia is a left wing site.
As CamelMan says people's dietary choices extend far beyond political reasons. Dietary choices are not really a political issue and this comment is not about politics.
NaturesPlus Pea Protein:
A 20 gram serving has 15 grams of protein. How's that for efficiency on the trail?
Wayne
Sent from somewhere around here.
I have directly observed the dietary practices of two endurance athletes: one a senior men's cyclist and one a "fitness" walker that walked more than a marathon practically every day. If he had "zero" days, I did not see that. I know the bicyclist had "zero" days and a schedule he had to "peak" for a race.
Their dietary practice was measured, as you describe.
The cyclist had home-made yoghurt, in addition to fruit, grains and his protein powders. He also used brewer's yeast. I saw him use it with popcorn.
The marathoner had seeds, nuts, and fruit. I never saw him have protein powders or yoghurt, or anything else. He varied the "mix" but he seemed to only have the bag of the "mix" he had made each time I saw him.
I did not see either one have eggs or avocados.
I cannot vouch for their food dietary practices, then, because I did not see all of it.
However, both were at the top of their sport, fit, and apparently in good health.
I have no other comment, other than to say an endurance athlete decidedly has a different dietary practice.