New York liquor laws?

[Arden]

Hi;
Last week I hiked the AT from Bear Mtn. Inn to Pawling NY. At the "AT Deli" at the junction of US 9 and SR 403, I purchased a can of beer and a slice of pizza. I started eating/drinking inside at one of the small tables they have in front. After I was about halfway through my beer, one of the store employees told me that I wasn't allowed to drink the beer in the store, but offered me a coffee cup to pour the beer from the can into. I was a bit confused at first, but shortly took my beer (still in the can) to an outside table to finish. I later went back inside and bought a second beer, which I took outside to drink.

So, I'm curious as to why I am "allowed" to drink outside but not inside. It appeared that the tables outside were also owned by the store, so what difference did it make where I consumed my beer?
Later, on the trail, another hiker told me that, although he wasn't sure, perhaps the law says that it is illegal to consume an alcoholic beverage in public, unless it is "concealed" in another container, or a paper bag. So, if I had poured the beer into the coffee container, then it would have been legal for me to drink it either inside or outside?
The hiker also suggested that the store was only concerned about my consuming alcohol inside, but not outside. That would be to say that if I were to be seen by a cop drinking outside the establishment that it would be my problem, not the owner of the establishment?
That wouldn't make sense to me if that owner also owns the property outside the store.
Several years ago I was running a 50K training run in NY state, and was carrying a bran muffin from DD in my hand as I ran. A cop slowed down and appeared to take a look at what I had in the bag, for as I removed the muffin and began eating it, he drove away. My thinking was that he thought I might be carrying alcohol or perhaps something else illegal in public.

For future reference, I would like to know when and where I am allowed to drink an alcoholic beverage, whether concealed or unconcealed.
If I am caught drinking illegally on the property of the store where I purchased the alcohol, who is responsible, me, the store owner, or both of us?

Funny end to this story: A couple minutes after I had finished my unconcealed can of beer and tossed it into the trash outside the store, and was shouldering my backpack, the sherrif showed up. He didn't get out of his car.

Arden

[mandolindave]

I'm not sure, but perhaps it had to do with licensing. It could be that the store was licensed to sell packaged goods, but was not a bar. In Pennsylvania, at one Pizza place you could not buy more than two six packs. You could not drink any of the two six packs in the store, but if you bought one beer you could. Down the road at The Beer Barn, you could buy as much as you want. In some municipalities, in N.J., you need an entertainment license if patrons are going to be dancing.

[Starchild]

The liquor laws varying by state is just part of AT trail life, all part of the overall adventure.


A restaurant needs a differing licence to sell alcohol for consumption vs a deli selling it for carry out purposes. You are also illegal to consume in public (outside), but concealing it via a brown bag or pouring it into a non-conspicuous cup makes it unreasonable for the cops to question you about it, and laws about self incrimination basically give you the right to tell the cop to go take a hike (most likely where you don't want them to be). But as you say, consume inside and it's the owner's licence on the line, consume outside and it's your issue.

Many cops frequent the deli, also they seem quite comfortable with thru's and quite accepting of enjoying a brew on your journey, perhaps some of them should apply for work at Baxter, but that's another issue.

[Hangfire]

It sounds like New York and California are about the sames in regards to alcohol sales and consumption. There is a whole lot of paper work and extra permits needed to let people drink inside of your business and it's a pretty complicated process to get your hands on one. Most small deli's in the beach area sell beer but have signs strictly prohibiting its consumption on the premises. I tried to explain to people who had trouble with the rules on the AT to just wait until you get out to Cali to do the PCT, we make Baxter rules look elementary.

[orthofingers]

Yeah, liquor laws are funny. When I was in college I played in a band one summer in Massachusetts. We played 6 nights a week at this fancy restaurant/bar. Back then (1968) we had to stop playing at 11:45 pm on a Saturday because there could be no liquor served on a Sunday.
I never understood that. Did they feel that more people would attend church on Sunday morning if the bars were cleared out by midnight Saturday?

Not to hijack this but there is an island 13 miles off the coast of Rhode Island called Block Island where I do quite a bit of work. (Extensive network of beautiful walking trails there, by the way). It's a popular summer tourist destination and often visitors will get arrested for consuming alcohol on the street. (My understanding is that the local police won't bust you if you just get rid of it but the ones that get arrested are the ones that get mouthy and belegerent with the cops.)
Anyway, the funny thing is that when they publish the "Police Blotter" in the local newspaper once a week with the names of the arrested, they almost always mention what the perpetrator was drinking.

"Martin Green of Saratoga, NY was arrested on Saturday evening on Water St. For consuming alcohol in public. He had a Corona and a Sam Adams Light with him at the time."

For some reason it just strikes me as funny.

[egilbe]

Liquor laws vary from state to state and there is no discernible rhyme or reason to them. In Maine, there is no drinking in public. Period. You can purchase beer, wine and alcohol just about anywhere. You can only consume it in a place that is licensed for it, such as a bar, or restaraunt, or at home.

for those interested, your campsite or lean to ,that you paid for, is considered your "home". Walk away from that area drinking a beer and you can be cited for drinking in public.

What always amazed me were drive up beer and liquor stores, or places that could sell beer and wine only, but no hard liquor, or package stores.

[One Half]

Liquor laws are very odd. Just recently moved to Texas and don't often buy or drink alcohol but it seems that a preponderance of the time it just so happens I wish to do so on a Sunday. Obviously during football season that would seem to make sense. However, as an infrequent consumer, if I feel like having a drink I am usually in need of purchasing it then. Tried to stop by a liquor store one Sunday and it was closed. Oh gees. Okay, there's another not far away, I'll try that one. Oh ok. Maybe liquor stores are closed. Yep, no liquor on Sundays.

Couple months go by, I'm grocery shopping and thinking, oh a beer would be good with the steak tonight. Let's grab a six pack. Get to the register, "ma'am, we can't sell this to you, it's only 11:30am, no alcohol sales before noon on Sunday." Crud.

On the other hand, I can go to brunch on Sunday morning and get a good decent bloody mary at 10am for $4! I can also show up to a bar at 10am for a Sox/Patriots game and start getting soused with 60 of my newest friends and then drive home?! So if I want to drink on a Sunday and I don't have anything at home guess I have to go "out" to start drinking.

[nsherry61]

It would be fun to compile a list of ridiculous liquor laws in different states throughout the country.
There are some pretty entertaining foreign liquor laws also, like lock-ins in Ireland?

Then there was my experience hitchhiking in Alaska in the late 80's where, with one exception, everyone that picked me up (probably 12 or 15 hitches that summer) offered me a beer when I got in the car. When I finally asked one of my rides if Alaska didn't have an open container law like every other state I was aware of, I was told, yes, they do. :-? . . . You gotta appreciated a little frontier mentality.

[Old Grouse]

Liquor laws tend to be politicized in every state. In Connecticut, the liquor retailers’ association has maintained a strong “small business” lobby, which has resulted in price floors for liquor. The rationale is that big box retailers would put mom-&-pop package stores out of business by undercutting their prices. They point to the loss of so many hardware stores after the arrival of Home Depot & Lowes.

Connecticut groceries can sell beer (no wine or liquor) until 8:00 PM. Sunday sales were illegal until recently. And since Connecticut is a “home rule” state, some towns elected to remain “dry” after prohibition. My own town went “damp” in 1993 (meaning restaurants could sell booze), and finally went “wet” in 2010. These moves were spearheaded by local real estate brokers who argued that it would enhance the value of housing in the town. Since the median price of residential home sales in my town is currently $697,000 (and that’s down 20% from last year) I guess the booze works, at least to deaden the pain!

[Arden]

So far as I know, here in NJ, one cannot purchase liquor before noon on Sunday, but any other day there is no restriction. I don't believe it is legal to consume alcohol in public anywhere in the state, but as others have said, if one "conceals" the liquor, then the cop needs to suspect something in order to question. I also read somewhere that in NY, a cop cannot ticket you for drinking in public if he/she doesn't know what the brand is. That's probably why the store employee offered me the coffee cup for the beer.
In any case, I think I should have been able to "wiggle" out of being issued a fine if that sherrif had caught me with the open can of beer outside the store. Being from out of state, and not being familiar with a law that is not obviously posted should be a reasonable excuse.
I was heading for the friary, and had thought I would consume the beer there, but I was extremely thirty, after having climbed the mountain just north of the Bear Mtn Bridge, and had run out of water just before I arrived at the deli. When I got to the friary, I read their rather obvious signage stating their prohibition of alcohol on the grounds. That said, I don't think anyone would have questioned me. I wasn't even on their main field. I was up on the bluff, just off the road, which looks down on the fields.

[Farr Away]

This information is from 20 years ago, but at that time NYS had an open container law which technically made it illegal to return your empties to get your deposit back. The way it was worded made it illegal to have any container that used to have alcohol in it in public. The presumption was that if you were carrying an open alcohol container in public, you were drinking in public.

Fraternities suggested rinsing your red cup before you left one party to go to another.

-FA


Oh, and ignorance of the law is no excuse. They'll be happy to explain the law while they're ticketing you.

[TNhiker]

a cop cannot ticket you for drinking in public if he/she doesn't know what the brand is.




that is not correct.........

a cop doesnt need to know the name of a brand in order to ticket someone....

just needs to know if its an alcoholic drink or not......

seen many a person get a ticket for open consumption in parking lots of grateful dead shows....

[rocketsocks]

seen many a person get a ticket for open consumption in parking lots of grateful dead shows....Yup, and in the late 80's...enter "The Coozie"

[rocketsocks]

The self respecting drunkard would go anywhere without thier coozie.

[Googan]

I'm pretty sure there's a few different liquor licenses in NY. One which allows a business to sell liquor, and another that allows consumption.

[Miel]

The first time I ever saw a drive-thru liquor was in 1982 in Louisiana. I was in my 20s by then. I thought it was reckless. Yet, in my neighborhood there's a bar that opens its doors at 8am. You can't drink and drive, but you can get ****faced inside the bar and then walk down to the beach a few blocks away and be obnoxious there. I got stopped for running a red light in Baton Rouge (not coming to a full stop - yes, idiotic and very dangerous on my part) but the open containers weren't even a thing for the police officer who stopped me.

[Old Grouse]

OK, I looked it up. The AT Deli almist certainly has a permit typical of grocery and convenience stores. You can buy it but you can't consume it in the place. Once you step outside, even to their picnic tables, you (and they) are OK. It's that simple. Contrast that with a bar or restaurant type of permit where indoor drinking is anticipated.

[rocketsocks]

In jersey we have bring your own booze to restaurants that don't serve alcohol...hmm, wonder if they have to have some kind of provisional Lic?

[Pedaling Fool]

The first time I ever saw a drive-thru liquor was in 1982 in Louisiana...The first one I saw was on a bike tour I did up and down the east coast back in '93 when transiting the outer banks.




If you felt a bump...CHECK FOR A BODY! :D

http://www.thedacrons.com/road/dixie/hatteras/brew_thru.jpg