View Full Version : Bear question: Bag vs Canister?
Indigo Hawk
06-11-2016, 14:57
I'm planning my first section hike NOBO from Springer to Deep Gap in either Spring or Fall 2017. I can't decide between a bear canister or a bag? I was leaning toward a canister because I'm super short and don't know how I'd manage to hang a bag (I'm 5 foot). Any input? Oh! And my food is all going to be dehydrated and vacuum sealed. 10 days worth. I don't know it that makes a difference or not.
MuddyWaters
06-11-2016, 15:34
Virtually no one uses a cannister on the AT, because arent required.
Except one little 5 mile section in spring from Jarrard Gap to Neel Gap.
You arent going to get 10 days of that food in any reasonable size cannister, nor will you want carry it. Plan to resupply at Neel Gap (no brainer), and probably Hiawassee, or not.
If you want to bring a cannister, its a great idea, go for it imo, although its not really needed.
Personally, I would like to see them required everywhere, to protect bears and avoid problems .
The bear cannisters worked absolute wonders in the Sierra, a tremendous success story.
Even 1 or 2 bears killed per year as a result of stupid people is too many. It would make people more respectful of wildlife. Also make them leave behind some of the crap they end up leaving in woods anyway. If lazy people would just stay home as well, so much the better.
I'm planning my first section hike NOBO from Springer to Deep Gap in either Spring or Fall 2017. I can't decide between a bear canister or a bag? I was leaning toward a canister because I'm super short and don't know how I'd manage to hang a bag (I'm 5 foot). Any input? Oh! And my food is all going to be dehydrated and vacuum sealed. 10 days worth. I don't know it that makes a difference or not.
I use an Ursack, but it would be hard pressed to get 10 days worth of food in there. It's really more to keep mice away from my goodies.
Indigo Hawk
06-11-2016, 18:21
I say 10 days as a safety. It'll be more like 8. I suppose I could resupply.
CarlZ993
06-11-2016, 21:52
Use a bear bag. Look up the PCT method of bear bagging on YouTube. It works like a champ. Your height is not a factor to perform this properly.
I've carried 9-10 days of food once. I'll never do that again if I can help it. Resupply if at all possible.
Happy trails!
I use a food bag. It weighs an ounce. The bear proof bags are to heavy. And the canister....forget it.
BlackCloud
06-12-2016, 18:05
Oh the weight of the canister. Go with a bear bag. But the canister does make for a perfect seat....
HooKooDooKu
06-12-2016, 23:39
Ballpark bear canister calculations... you'll need about 100 cubic inches of space per day (and even then you are packing extremely tight or you're not getting enough calories).
The two largest bear canisters include the Bear Vault BV500 with something like 750cuin, weights about 2-1/2 pounds at a cost of around $80, and the Bearikade Expedition with something just under 1,000cuin, weights about 2 pounds at a cost of around $375 (because it's made of carbon fiber to be the lightest canisters for their size.
I'm planning my first section hike NOBO from Springer to Deep Gap in either Spring or Fall 2017. I can't decide between a bear canister or a bag? I was leaning toward a canister because I'm super short and don't know how I'd manage to hang a bag (I'm 5 foot). Any input? Oh! And my food is all going to be dehydrated and vacuum sealed. 10 days worth. I don't know it that makes a difference or not.
Whether you are short or tall or strong or weak should really not make any difference when hanging a bear bag.
A bit a practice in the back yard or local park can help.
Some things to consider are having a small pouch you can put rock in to tie to the end of your cord, and rather than attempting an overhand throw, simply twirl the weighted end of the line like a windmill and just let the line go to send it over the branch.
Of course if your pouch gets bit stuck up there and you need to pull it hard to retrieve, be careful not to bonk yourself in the head :).
SteelCut
06-13-2016, 06:48
Bear bag.
10 days of food is 15-20 pounds depending upon your needs. Instead, consider resupplying at Neel Gap and Dick's Creek Gap (Hiawassee).
daddytwosticks
06-13-2016, 07:08
I use an Ursak Minor. Not for bears, but for rodent protection. It only weights maybe 2 or 3 ounces more than a typically sized silnylon food bag. Resupply during your section hike and just properly hang your food in a rodent-proof bag. If you do these things, you should not have problems with any critters getting at your food. Enjoy your hike. :)
Turk6177
06-15-2016, 19:51
If you Hang your bag PCT method you will be fine. If you are near a shelter you can use their bear cables.
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Another Kevin
06-16-2016, 16:14
I use a canister only where the law says I must. One of those places is Eastern High Peaks in the Adirondacks, where you can't use a BearVault, so an expen$ive Bearikade may be in my future. Right now, I've just been there a few times, with a rented Garcia can.
I can't see where your height would make a big difference in being able to hang a bag. It doesn't involve reaching or climbing, just slinging a rock or 'biner tied to a line. It doesn't even take a great throwing arm if you learn the technique of whirling and casting. Oh yes, and how to coil the line so that it will pay out cleanly. That's probably the trickiest bit to learn, but makes a huge difference in your quality of life on the trail.
MuddyWaters
06-16-2016, 21:18
I use a canister only where the law says I must. One of those places is Eastern High Peaks in the Adirondacks, where you can't use a BearVault, so an expen$ive Bearikade may be in my future. Right now, I've just been there a few times, with a rented Garcia can.
I can't see where your height would make a big difference in being able to hang a bag. It doesn't involve reaching or climbing, just slinging a rock or 'biner tied to a line. It doesn't even take a great throwing arm if you learn the technique of whirling and casting. Oh yes, and how to coil the line so that it will pay out cleanly. That's probably the trickiest bit to learn, but makes a huge difference in your quality of life on the trail.
i thought the trickiest thing was people learning not to step on the line. Funniest thing to see them sling the rock up , and it comes right straight back at them.:)
Sandy of PA
06-16-2016, 21:28
At the end of a day of hiking the last thing I want to do is attempt to throw a rock perfectly over a branch to hang a bag. I have carried a canister for over 2000 miles of AT section hikes. No bears or other critters have ever gotten one scrap of my food.
kickatree
12-12-2016, 13:47
I'm giving this bag a try. it is supposed to be a complete odor barrier and very lightweight. I'm using it to line my "bear bag" we'll see. BaseCamp Odor-Barrier Bag, Assorted https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00GHH5GK4/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_SgUtyb89QMFCD
ScareBear
12-12-2016, 20:27
Ack to the can unless required. Learn to throw a rock over a tree branch....don't forget to hang your bag a good 100 yards away from your tent....I know the bear cables are right next to the shelters....don't forget to hang your bag a good 100 yards from your tent....get some Lawson line or slick rope...
We used to just string a sil nylon bag up trees or poles. Have had more problems with critters than bears. Recently got the Ursack Major. Big enough for 10 days of food, especially if the critters don't spoil any. Will be using poles when available, otherwise, following the Ursack instructions.
jj dont play
12-14-2016, 16:03
Bag.
Hawk Mtn Campsite 7.4(7.4) Boxes
Gooch Mtn Shelter 8.4(15.8) Cables
Lance Creek Campground 8.7(24.5) Cables
Low Gap 18.7( 43.2) Cables
Blue Mtn Shelter 7.3(50.5) Cables
Tray Mtn 8(58.5) Cables
May not all work with your mileage but if you camp elsewhere I'm sure you'll have no problem finding someone to hang your bear bag with. I'm pretty sure someone else hung my bag for me with their's for all of Georgia.
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life scout
06-18-2017, 15:30
Bear proof boxes have been placed at all popular spots in GA this year. A bear canister is not need just use a line when stealth camping.
Please remember, pack out you trash. The bear proof containers are not trash cans and the volunteer ridge runners are not garbage collectors.
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Maineiac64
06-19-2017, 07:04
Bear proof boxes have been placed at all popular spots in GA this year. A bear canister is not need just use a line when stealth camping.
Please remember, pack out you trash. The bear proof containers are not trash cans and the volunteer ridge runners are not garbage collectors.
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Which spots have boxes?
slbirdnerd
06-20-2017, 11:59
I started using a bear can this year in advance of a trip out west this August where they are required. I don't mind hanging (do it correctly, PCT style) but honestly the bear can is just so easy, and so useful as it also serves as a seat, table, and if you get a BearVault you can see into it to get out what you need. I have the 500 right now but plan on picking up the 450 for my shorter trips.
One leg of my trip WILL be 10 days and I do think, with the type of food I bring, I can get 10 days in it and have had numerous other people say the same. You have to try it at home, and it does require careful planning and packing, but it "can" be done. ;)
Personally, I think I'm a convert. Better for us and our food, and better most importantly for the bears. And just SO EASY.
If you decide to hang, practice this as well and you'll get it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgBLDMuPuvE&t=3s
mbqhappy
10-04-2017, 11:25
New Hiker considering doing Thru Hike NOBO 2018....
Concerned about the weight of the BV Canister! Aside from the Georgia section requiring bear canister should I need to set camp there.....What other Forest or states require the use of Bear canister? Would greatly appreciate also, If you can same as some people identified above the trail section to skip setting camp to not be required the use of it in GA, if possible identify roughly # of miles (regulated if any)
Thank you
bigcranky
10-04-2017, 11:57
10 days of food is a lot to carry, for me that would be >20 pounds. It's also a lot to try to pull up into a tree (and it sure won't fit in a canister).
Your height doesn't matter for hanging a bag - you'll need to find a branch 20 or 25 feet off the ground, so the difference between being 5 feet or 6 feet tall sorta pales in comparison. Do look at the PCT Method on youtube, it's easy and works pretty well.
An Ursack will keep small critters from chewing into your bag, though I think the max I can get in one is about 6 days. Lately we've been using the Zpacks food bag, which is larger and works well with the PCT Method hang, though I would discount any "critter resistance" as we had a critter get in easily the one time I didn't get everything inside the odor proof liner bag ("OP Sack").
Starchild
10-04-2017, 12:15
i thought the trickiest thing was people learning not to step on the line. Funniest thing to see them sling the rock up , and it comes right straight back at them.:)
Not funny at all, *** is wrong with you people.
Another Kevin
10-04-2017, 13:30
i thought the trickiest thing was people learning not to step on the line. Funniest thing to see them sling the rock up , and it comes right straight back at them.:)
I was glad that I was alone the time that I found a branch that was a few feet farther up than usual, and nailed it on the first cast - only to watch the entire line sail over the branch. I missed grabbing the bitter end as it went by. It did come to rest a little bit after the stone hit the ground, but I couldn't reach the end of the line. There was nothing to do but pull it down and cast it again. And of course the next few shots were misses. :o
Tip: Don't stand anywhere near Another Kevin when he's trying to hang a bear bag.
MuddyWaters
10-04-2017, 15:40
Tip: Don't stand anywhere near Another Kevin when he's trying to hang a bear bag.
Dont stand near anyone trying to hang a bag...
On the plus side, its good entertainment
When it comes to hanging bear bags, it's an adventure for most.
Riocielo
10-06-2017, 20:54
Ursack when bear cables aren't available.
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Sarcasm the elf
10-06-2017, 21:44
Dont stand near anyone trying to hang a bag...
On the plus side, its good entertainment
It's great entertainment! Especially when they screw up and the rock comes back at them.
For some reason they never seem to like it when I yell "fore!" as I spectate. :D
LittleJimmy
10-14-2017, 16:45
If you want to foil a bear who can open a BV500, drill a hole in the side with the cap closed. Drill through the cap and the can. Use a large sheet metal type screw, one that will grip the two holes. One that's large enough to use a dime to screw and unscrew is ideal. It's one extra step but a small one.
nsherry61
10-16-2017, 12:14
If you want to foil a bear who can open a BV500, drill a hole in the side with the cap closed. Drill through the cap and the can. Use a large sheet metal type screw, one that will grip the two holes. One that's large enough to use a dime to screw and unscrew is ideal. It's one extra step but a small one.
According to a ranger I was talking to in the Adirondacks High Peak region last winter, (and the example show-and-tell cans he had) the bears tear the BV canisters apart, they don't deftly open them. Accordingly, that screw idea shouldn't make much difference and it might give the bear one more spot (maybe even a weakened one, to get a grip on for tearing apart the canister?
Either way, I don't know that the BearValts are being breached regularly anywhere outside of the Adirondacks High Peaks region and it doesn't matter what modifications you make on your BV, they won't accept them for use in the Adirondacks High Peaks region, so again, I don't see the use, albeit a creative idea, of modifying your BV with an extra screw even if it did work.