View Full Version : What to do with food at night?
jacko213
07-04-2016, 21:59
What is y'all's opinions on what to do with my food at night? I will be going for a 7 day section out and back hike in North Carolina at the end of July and don't know which method to take to secure my food.
soumodeler
07-04-2016, 22:36
Hanging is the safest. Learn to hang PCT style and it takes all of 2 minutes to hang your food.
I have also slept many times with my food with no bad results. YMMV.
+1 PCT Method
I slept with my food, until small critters chewed thru my backpack.
I had food in the back of my truck: porcupines put teeth marks thru every heavy foil package.
Now, I live in grizzly bear country. The only problem isn't grizzly bears.
MtDoraDave
07-05-2016, 07:12
I just googled PCT style, and will do that next time out. I have, in the past, used the other method where you tie off to a different tree than the one the food bag is hanging from - but finding an appropriate pair of trees is sometimes challenging; this PCT style opens up possibilities.
I keep my cordage wrapped around a section of pvc pipe to prevent it from getting tangled. The pvc, can be used to help get water from a trickle into a cup or bottle for filtering, and now another use for it has presented itself to me. Good stuff.
I have never considered sleeping with my food because I don't want to make myself smell any more appetizing to critters than necessary, nor do I wish to help bears or other critters associate tents with food.
Only hang if you can get it at least 12' above the ground, and more than 6' from the tree trunk.
In practice, this is rarely doable on the AT.
I've seen many hangs less than 6' off the ground. Good luck with that...
You are doing a huge disservice if bears or other animals are able to reach the food, and begin to rely on bad hangs as a regular source of food.
The large evergreen trees in the Cascades make it a lot easier there.
The PVC pipe can also be used as the "stick" for the PCT method and if you google it, there is a way to slide the rope through a hole to secure the bag even better.
MuddyWaters
07-05-2016, 22:39
A poor hang is worse than no hang at all.
Finding the right limb often takes a lot of walking and looking. Best to hang line when get to camp, hang foodbag later.
You want food at least 6+ ft from trunk
Branch at trunk bigger than about 6" so bear wont chew it off
Tapering to about 1-2" at point of hang so its too unstable to support bear and allow to chew line or branch
And about 20-25 ft off ground so cord will be long enough, and will end up 10' above ground , and 10' below branch
No other branches in way below it or around it to tangle things up
Not on steeply sloped ground you cant stand on
Branches like that arent that ez to find on spur of moment. It can take 30 min+
Five Tango
07-11-2016, 08:27
How effective is an Ur-sack?The idea is that "they" can't smell it so my question is "if they can't smell it,is it even there?"So if the hang was less than optimal distance from tree trunk but plenty high off the ground,how effective would it be?
Odd Man Out
07-11-2016, 10:16
Ursack are not odor barrier containers. They are bulletproof bags the bear's can't chew through. Like hardshell canisters, bears learn that they can't get food from them and leave them alone. However, an ursack hanging from a tree will look like a regular bag so I'm not sure the bear will learn the distinction as they would for a hard canister sitting on the ground. There are odor barrier bags you can use as a liner inside your food bag to cut down on the smell but they do nothing to keep a bear out. I doubt anything is odor proof. But minimizing smells is probably a good idea plus they are waterproof. Typical zip bags and garbage bags are polyethylene and are very ports to odors. There is a thread on odor barrier bags ongoing.
garlic08
07-11-2016, 10:25
And don't just think about night time. Secure your food every time you leave it, even just for a sec. The worst food thefts I've had were during the day, getting water or admiring a viewpoint. Both times my pack got damaged, just a few steps away from me. Once was an ermine, once was ravens.
seattleboatguy
07-11-2016, 12:08
Hanging is the safest. Learn to hang PCT style and it takes all of 2 minutes to hang your food.
I have also slept many times with my food with no bad results. YMMV.
Once the bag is hung, are rodents able to get at your food by navigating down the rope to your bag?
Another Kevin
07-11-2016, 12:40
In places where it's hard to find an appropriate limb, you sometimes have to resort to heaving the line across two nearby trees, and hanging the bag from the middle of the line. That's a little complicated to set up, but it's often faster than the search for a good limb for a PCT hang.
With the PCT hang, I like coiling the line before I let the stick up. That leaves nothing at ground level to get fouled. Fish the coil down with a trekking pole or something in the morning. It looks like this when it's done. (Sorry that the branch it's hanging on is out of sight at the top of the picture.)
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5347/10282471433_6c1264261f.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/gECmwe)
Five Tango
07-11-2016, 13:41
Ursack are not odor barrier containers. They are bulletproof bags the bear's can't chew through. Like hardshell canisters, bears learn that they can't get food from them and leave them alone. However, an ursack hanging from a tree will look like a regular bag so I'm not sure the bear will learn the distinction as they would for a hard canister sitting on the ground. There are odor barrier bags you can use as a liner inside your food bag to cut down on the smell but they do nothing to keep a bear out. I doubt anything is odor proof. But minimizing smells is probably a good idea plus they are waterproof. Typical zip bags and garbage bags are polyethylene and are very ports to odors. There is a thread on odor barrier bags ongoing.
I have some ursacks from years ago that are a glorified ziplock sack.Thanks for clearing that up.I guess most of the odor barrier bags are made by Lok-Sak and Op-Sak or something..............I researched the indestructible style URsack and they do recommend the odor barrier which makes sense.
Speakeasy TN
07-11-2016, 14:59
AMEN! I have a great pic from last year where a hiker had stood on an old roadbed and had a decent looking hang going at about 8 feet high but only about 3 feet out from the tree. From the road it looked great. When I climbed the 4 foot bank of the roadbed to go water a tree ................ not so much. Eye level and arms length!
[QUOTE=RockDoc;2078904]Only hang if you can get it at least 12' above the ground, and more than 6' from the tree trunk.
re.[/]
I want full details of hanging a food bag TWELVE FEET from the ground. I'm 5'-8" and I was able to get the low point of the bag 7'-2" from the ground. 7'-10" from the trunk was easy with the limb I was using in my backyard.
Standing by.
Wayne
Old. Slow. "Smarter than the average bear."
[QUOTE=RockDoc;2078904]Only hang if you can get it at least 12' above the ground, and more than 6' from the tree trunk.
re.[/]
I want full details of hanging a food bag TWELVE FEET from the ground. I'm 5'-8" and I was able to get the low point of the bag 7'-2" from the ground. 7'-10" from the trunk was easy with the limb I was using in my backyard.
Standing by.
Wayne
Old. Slow. "Smarter than the average bear."
You need a higher, taller horizontal limp to loop the rope over.
[QUOTE=Venchka;2079954]
You need a higher, taller horizontal limp to loop the rope over.
When I follow the visual instructions online, the bag will go as high as the clove hitch around the stick. The clove hitch can only be tied as high as I can reach. In my case that is 7'-2".
I could throw my rope over a limb 30' off the ground and the stick and bag will still only be 7'-2" off the ground.
Where does the 12' height come from?
Wayne
Old. Slow. "Smarter than the average bear."
nsherry61
07-11-2016, 20:13
[QUOTE=Hosh;2079975]When I follow the visual instructions online, the bag will go as high as the clove hitch around the stick. The clove hitch can only be tied as high as I can reach. In my case that is 7'-2".
I could throw my rope over a limb 30' off the ground and the stick and bag will still only be 7'-2" off the ground.
Where does the 12' height come from?
Wayne, your math is a bit off.
With the PCT, you pull the bag back up to the branch, then tie the clove hitch as high as you can reasonably reach, and then release the line until the bag and clove hitch meet. That is actually 1/2 way between the height you tied the clove hitch and the height of the branch. If you use a 20' high branch and you reach 6' high, then the bag will end up at about 13' above ground.
If that's not good enough for you, you can use the method I commented on in this thread (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/112951-New-safer-amp-easier-bear-bag-hanging-method?highlight=) which gives you a 2:1 raising of the knot relative to the bag. So given the same branch and reach, you would be able to achieve more like a 16' hang, with the bag being only 4' below the branch, or there about.
Have fun. There is a masochistic joy in practicing hanging bear bags.
Thanks. I think you're right. I don't remember pulling the bag all the way to the branch. I'll practice a bit more tomorrow. Height above ground is measured with my trusty Stanley tape.
Wayne
Old. Slow. "Smarter than the average bear."
I did better this afternoon. Pulled the bag all the way up to the limb. Tied a #2 pencil as high as I could reach. Let the bag slide down to the pencil. The bag was nice and high.
Thanks for clarifying the process.
Wayne
Old. Slow. "Smarter than the average bear."
Situations like this remind me of what my father would say if something didn't work, " ..... is it plugged in? "
These words of wisdom have served me well, I hope my kids carry on!
I would get a masochistic joy out of hanging bears and mice. "I hates those meecesess to pieces!"
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