Hiking (and life) without Electronic Giismos (Confessions of a Luddie)

[Dan Roper]

I do all my hiking and backpacking without a cellphone or any other type of electronic device. This is natural since I've never owned a cellphone or any other type of portable electronic device. Years ago I made the decision to this effect - a vow of "cell-ibacy."

This comes up pretty often - it's amazing how many times hikers ask about signals or mention using a phone in such a way that it's natural for me to mention that I don't have one. The near universal reply is, "I wish I could do without a cellphone." People seem to love them and hate them at the same time.

Are there any other Luddites out there, either in terms of refraining on the trail or refraining totally? I'm sure there are, but I'd like to hear from others. We are probably an endangered species.

[Dan Roper]

I apologize for the typos. There doesn't seem to be a way to edit my previous post (or I can't find it, anyhow). I meant "Gizmos" and "Luddite."

[Hikingjim]

since I'm from Canada and do a bunch of hiking in the states, i'm too cheap to bother using my phone in the US a lot (surcharges). And many hikes in Canada there is no cell signal for many days at a time. I enjoy being totally disconnected for stretches of time, and then I use it in towns for wifi if needed or the odd call if I want, or it's there for emergency GPS or calls

I embrace technology for certain purposes and use make use of it, and I reject the notion that I should be reachable by work or other people at all times. If people have an emergency, I think they should call 911, not me

[Lone Wolf]

I do all my hiking and backpacking without a cellphone or any other type of electronic device. This is natural since I've never owned a cellphone or any other type of portable electronic device. Years ago I made the decision to this effect - a vow of "cell-ibacy."

This comes up pretty often - it's amazing how many times hikers ask about signals or mention using a phone in such a way that it's natural for me to mention that I don't have one. The near universal reply is, "I wish I could do without a cellphone." People seem to love them and hate them at the same time.

Are there any other Luddites out there, either in terms of refraining on the trail or refraining totally? I'm sure there are, but I'd like to hear from others. We are probably an endangered species.

no dumbphone for me. i walk with no gizmos. i do own a flip phone.. i only carry it when i drive out of town. which ain't often

[Feral Bill]

. If people have an emergency, I think they should call 911, not me Yes! Yes indeed.

[fiddlehead]

What about a camera?
Flashlight?
Notepad and pencil?
Map?
Data book?
Town guide?

IF you carry all of the above separately, perhaps opening your mind to a smart phone would help you save some weight and have a lot of stuff in one device.


If you haven't seen the advantages of a smart phone yet, most likely you never will.

(didn't even bother to mention GPS, phone, texting, email possibilities or google)(above)

[Dan Roper]

I know what I'm forsaking. For me it's worth it.

[Tipi Walter]

It would the height of folly for me to even utter the word "luddite" no matter how little electronics I take out on a backpacking trip while at the same time posting such comments on a computer using a thousand components with vast connections to the Interwad. I think the real Luddites are the guys you'll never see using a computer or living with electricity.

[Grampie]

Folks who long distance hike and have to rely on a cell phone don,t know how much more they could enjoy the outdoors without relying on a cell phone. The whole idea of going out and hiking is to enjoy the outdoors and not have to always stay connected.

[colorado_rob]

What about a camera?
Flashlight?
Notepad and pencil?
Map?
Data book?
Town guide?

IF you carry all of the above separately, perhaps opening your mind to a smart phone would help you save some weight and have a lot of stuff in one device.


If you haven't seen the advantages of a smart phone yet, most likely you never will.

(didn't even bother to mention GPS, phone, texting, email possibilities or google)(above)Well said! Best piece of gear I've ever owned, my zillion-purpose cell phone. ramble on, Oh Fuddie-duddies! Quite amusing.

[Traveler]

Unfortunately for a lot of people the speed of business today literally requires a smart phone for a number of reasons. While there are a lot of people who carry these devices who don't need them necessarily for business reasons, they are a common feature of 21st century life. Given the number of apps, relative ease of use, and combined functions of these devices, if you have to have one anyway why not utilize it for this or other activities. Though its not something I personally use for trail pursuits, I have few problems with anyone who does.

The only issue I have with these things is when the phone rings in the middle of nowhere and startles me, or someone talking loudly on them as they pace around a view point. All the work to reach that point and escape the trappings of work are ruined when that occurs.

[Engine]

Unfortunately for a lot of people the speed of business today literally requires a smart phone for a number of reasons...

This is an unfortunate aspect of my current career position, and losing that tether is one of the shining benefits I look forward to in retirement. (only 31 more days :banana)

Having said that, I do "carry" when I'm hiking but it's turned off and in the pack 23.75 hours out of the day.

[MuddyWaters]

For years I just carried a dumb prepaid flip phone.
I send a text to wife/kids in evening when possible. Often it's not, they don't worry about me.


But if you need to travel on public transport, having smartphone comes in real handy to and from destinations for making arrangements., Buying tickets, etc. That's my primary reason. Entertainment in town also and while travelling.

[Maydog]

As much as I like being away from electronics, I also like communicating with my wife at least once daily. Just a quick text will do the trick.

[MtDoraDave]

Smart phone is a pretty small and light camera that doubles as a communication device if necessary (injury or other emergency) and if I happen to get lost, the google maps ap actually shows most trails if you zoom in far enough (AT, FT, etc) .

I keep it in airplane mode during the day for battery longevity, so I can take a pic quickly when I see a shot I want to capture.

My last trip was my first solo trip - my business partner and his wife were a little too worried about me, so to ease THEIR worries, I downloaded the facebook ap so I could update every day or two, lest they think I fell off a mountain and call the rangers to come look for me.

So no, no Luddite here (at least in regards to cell phone technology) :)

[Slo-go'en]

It's pretty amazing how quickly smart phones have became indispensable in most peoples lives. And they sure are annoying when people start talking to themselves at shelters and on top of mountains.

I got a cell phone to use as my "home" phone and it's no problem to carry it along on hiking trips. Last year I finally broke down and got a cheap pre-paid smart phone just to use on the trail. If for no other reason, it sure is nice to be able to get the local weather report and see the radar everyday.

I just bought a ZTE phone with a 5.5" HD screen and 13 Meg camera to use with the Guthook app. I found one really cheap ($75) but is locked to a prepaid provider which doesn't service many areas (Boost Mobile) so it will only be used as a tablet and connect to the world when wifi is available. So, I guess I'll just have to carry a second phone too.

BTW, shouldn't this thread be in the gear forum?

[Puddlefish]

I never used electronics on the trail before this year, not out of any sense of superiority, I just wasn't interested in keeping in touch. I didn't think electronics would make my hike better.

For my AT thru hike attempt, I got a crappy old Iphone, just to keep in touch with my family. I eventually upgraded to a new smart phone with a good camera, and installed Guthook's navigation app. I used the camera often, I occasionally texted out a picture to family, I loved the Guthook app. I didn't really use any substantial data for entertainment or such.

Now that my AT hike is suspended, I'm just starting to hike my local trails and rehab my knee. The smart phone still comes along as a camera, but I don't otherwise feel the need to use it.

As for it being a more pure experience, that's silly. I know how to use a sextant, but my sailing/hiking experience would not be in any way more pure if I relied on one instead of the more modern tools available for navigation. Don't be afraid of smart phones, it's a tool like any other, you can choose to use it as often, or as little as you choose.

[Mags]

Read these articles...

http://www.christownsendoutdoors.com/2012/09/controversy-1-smartphones-gps-in-hills.html (http://www.christownsendoutdoors.com/2012/09/controversy-1-smartphones-gps-in-hills.html)

http://www.christownsendoutdoors.com/2015/03/smartphones-distractions-in-hills.html

[ChuckT]

I'm a professional photographer (50 yrs) and am accustomed to dealing with electronic gizmos _and_ their short-commings.
I will not put myself in the postion of relying on a cell phone on a hike. Period, end of story. The cell networks are urban centric.
In Sept I'm doing a 3 day on the AT and will carry my cell and an inReach and a battery pack. I will also carry a small electronic camera and _maybe_ a GPS. But I like gadgets and staring at greenery does get old (duh). I'd like to put all those together into one emcompassing device. Haven't found that "one" yet,
if it works for you - do it.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Tapatalk

[Tipi Walter]

I'm a fan of Chris Townsend but then who wouldn't be? I especially like his take on ultralight gear and his comments regarding it---

http://www.christownsendoutdoors.com/2012/10/ultralight-lightweight-traditional-or.html

Beyond all this, I'm old school and regard gadgets with a sour eye as I've had several digital cameras die in the field and a half dozen small am/fm radios get blown out and all the rest. My 12 year old walmart Tracfone is stick kicking but it's used only as a sort of SPOT device to call home when things get weird. Give me a decent topo map and a few hours at home googling where I'm headed and I'm ready.

[colorado_rob]

I wonder if back, say in the late 60's/early 70's when down started being used, what people said about this confounded new insulating material.... or what folks said about nylon back in the 50's.... "What's with this confounded nylon stuff! My father used a canvas tent and backpack, and his father before that, and darn it, I'm going to keep using canvas until the day I die! (or a broken back, no doubt) REAL outdoorsmen use canvas and wool and beaver pelts ONLY"
..
I realize this is not a good analogy, but I'm making it anyway.
..
I do agree ringing cells and talking loudly on them while others are around is bad form, but carrying a cell for camera / kindle reader / backup light / emergency GPS / emergency communication / non-emergency loved-one communication is a fantastic convenience on the trail. Stick it on "airplane mode" and the battery lasts a long time. Amazing devices. We live in a golden age of convenience. But maybe too convenient sometimes? Perhaps.
..
Enjoy you own hike! I sure do, as much as anyone on here, and with my phone.

[adamkrz]

No phone for me either- nothing but bad news, I still bring along a paperback, Radio and candles. I also enjoy the element of surprise as far as the weather goes.

[jefals]

Folks who long distance hike and have to rely on a cell phone don,t know how much more they could enjoy the outdoors without relying on a cell phone. The whole idea of going out and hiking is to enjoy the outdoors and not have to always stay connected.

Last week on TRT I came to an unexpected T junction. Left or Right - that was the question. More tracks going left, so that seemed like the way to go. But a quick check of Guthook told me to go right. I Really enjoy hiking a lot more with my cell phone!

[greenpete]

I'm with you, Dan. And we're not "endangered" as long as we stay strong! I notice that many of those who choose "gadgets" can be very snarky and defensive (like some on this thread). They remind me of certain meat-eaters who confront vegans. It's almost as if they feel a trifle guilty having to rely on digital technology during their time in the wilderness. I use a cell, but only because my wife (whom I love) insists I use one. Don't even think about smartphones or GPS devices! In my opinion, it's heading down a bad road, and those luxuries soon become necessities. And I can (almost) guarantee: it won't be long before personal drones will be buzzing through the trees. Ugh.


"Wilderness is a place where things work like they're supposed to work" - Walkin' Jim Stoltz

[colorado_rob]

I'm with you, Dan. And we're not "endangered" as long as we stay strong! I notice that many of those who choose "gadgets" can be very snarky and defensive (like some on this thread). Yeah, like your response (snarky, as is my response, admittedly), and in fact, the OP sounds basically like a self-defense/justification of ancient-school anti-tech.

"Hey, I'm stuck in the 90's and feeling lonely... lets see if anyone else is as well". Of course, lots of folks are (stuck in the 90's). HYOH!

Yeah, I'm snarky. I love that word.

[Tipi Walter]

I'm with you, Dan. And we're not "endangered" as long as we stay strong! I notice that many of those who choose "gadgets" can be very snarky and defensive (like some on this thread). They remind me of certain meat-eaters who confront vegans. It's almost as if they feel a trifle guilty having to rely on digital technology during their time in the wilderness. I use a cell, but only because my wife (whom I love) insists I use one. Don't even think about smartphones or GPS devices! In my opinion, it's heading down a bad road, and those luxuries soon become necessities. And I can (almost) guarantee: it won't be long before personal drones will be buzzing through the trees. Ugh.


"Wilderness is a place where things work like they're supposed to work" - Walkin' Jim Stoltz

To me it's all about "temptation". No outdoorsman or backpacker should EVER get on the internet while they are out and about. Control yourself. Isn't home use and work use enough? Do we still have to be interwad-connected even on a hiking trip? I get my giggles on the 'Wad here at home with this forum and such and Facebook but it's temporary and once I hit the trailhead I desperately need the discipline of NO MO' INTERWAD!!!

The worst are guys who post their daily trip reports live-action from out in the field on their fartphones. Give it a rest. And god help the guys who have their movements tracked on an hourly basis at home. When you head out, let us wonder what you're up to and let us imagine, and then when you get home after a week or a month then file your trip report.

And please PLEASE do not post your gps waypoints of a trip!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't want to know. Let me look at Mt Zeb from the trail below it or on my map, don't reduce it to a number.

And never fly your personal idiot-drones over the forest and into wilderness areas. Thank you for the rant.

[Dan Roper]

I didn't intend for this to devolve into a criticism of either way of hiking, but there are indeed alot of snarky comments here. I've noticed that pretty frequently in the WB forums. That seems to be an artifact of the digital age. I think pefectly nice people (a description which undoubtedly applies to nearly everybody here) just get snarky in a forum environment. They don't realize how they come across. It also seems that people become grumpier as they age. Not everybody, of course, but the trend is pretty clear here on WB.

Like everybody else, I like the way I hike. I'm not criticizing anybody's method. I'm just interested in hearing from others who have intentionally minimized or sworn off technology. From the early samples in this thread, we are a minority.

[colorado_rob]

I didn't intend for this to devolve into a criticism of either way of hiking, but there are indeed alot of snarky comments here. I've noticed that pretty frequently in the WB forums. That seems to be an artifact of the digital age. I think pefectly nice people (a description which undoubtedly applies to nearly everybody here) just get snarky in a forum environment. They don't realize how they come across. It also seems that people become grumpier as they age. Not everybody, of course, but the trend is pretty clear here on WB.

Like everybody else, I like the way I hike. I'm not criticizing anybody's method. I'm just interested in hearing from others who have intentionally minimized or sworn off technology. From the early samples in this thread, we are a minority.Well said, points taken and I, for one, will attempt to be less snarky.

[Tipi Walter]

It's hard to have a snark-free rant but I'll try.

[Odd Man Out]

I like the term "cell-ibacy". Thanks for that. While not completely cell-ibate, I don't rely on many electronics. I carry a camera because I like to take pictures and cell phone cameras suck. I have a Photon Freedom light. Otherwise, the cell phone stays put away and is used for what they do best - phone home at night if I have service.

[greenpete]

I didn't intend for this to devolve into a criticism of either way of hiking, but there are indeed alot of snarky comments here. I've noticed that pretty frequently in the WB forums. That seems to be an artifact of the digital age. I think pefectly nice people (a description which undoubtedly applies to nearly everybody here) just get snarky in a forum environment. They don't realize how they come across. It also seems that people become grumpier as they age. Not everybody, of course, but the trend is pretty clear here on WB.

Like everybody else, I like the way I hike. I'm not criticizing anybody's method. I'm just interested in hearing from others who have intentionally minimized or sworn off technology. From the early samples in this thread, we are a minority.

I agree, confrontations are everywhere on the internet, and some can get quite nasty. Now that we can communicate without having to physically face each other, it's given many folks license to be jerks (and I'm often guilty, as well). For me, one of the attractions about the trail, and eliminating as much technology as possible, is a return to a more humanistic state. I'm not opposed to all technology (Lord knows how it's helped advance medicine), just leisure technology that's becoming a necessity and a crutch for many people. It's pulling us away from each other, as well as the natural world. The trail is good for rejuvenating the body, mind, and soul. And I apologize for using the word "snarky." Where the heck did that goofy word originate?? :)

[Dan Roper]

35663 This is a PDF of "Vow of Cell-ibacy," an article on the topic of the AT and technology that appeared in the Spring 2010 issue of Georgia Backroads magazine.

[DuneElliot]

Phone off while hiking and only turned on to write my daily journal entry, or if I'm really bored (hiking ATV roads for long periods of time) and I want to listen to a little bit of music (also good for alerting bears to your presence).
I'll only be turning my InReach on to either send my daily "I'm stopping here for the night" message so the parents don't worry, or for the SOS, otherwise it stays off. If I wasn't hiking solo so much I wouldn't have even worried about a GPS locator.

Camera...I'm an avid photographer, so nuff said there!

I never worry about cell signals while hiking...couldn't care less. I'm going out into the wilderness to get away from all that

[Mags]

How communication technology is used in the hills is up to the individual of course. There are no rights or wrongs. I see no reason not to check emails and social media or even make phone calls if you find it satisfying any more than I can see a reason not to read in the hills (and I have been told at times that it’s ‘wrong’ to carry a book). The key is for you to control it and not the other way round. If it becomes intrusive and you think it’s spoiling your enjoyment the answer is simple. Switch the damn thing off!

Of course, the slippery slope is when people expect 24/7 connectivity FROM you in the backcountry because it can be used in a such a way. Getting calls on vacation is an expectation now for most folks. Will it be an expectation in the backcountry, too?

That's another ball of wax, however.

[Another Kevin]

And please PLEASE do not post your gps waypoints of a trip!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't want to know. Let me look at Mt Zeb from the trail below it or on my map, don't reduce it to a number.

Yes and no. I don't post track logs of off-trail trips in wilderness areas. You can find your own way, thank you very much. (Moreover, NYSDEC asks hikers to refrain from doing so.) I did post a couple a few years ago because I didn't know better. Now I do. In any case, you'd be crazy to follow the tracks that I posted, with all the crazy wandering and backtracking. I didn't have good luck with route finding on those trips!

I do post track logs of on-trail trips - because I'm one of the people that supply the track logs to the guys that make the trail maps. I see my tracks on paper trail maps fairly often. Nowadays, trail alignments on the maps all come from citizen-mappers. A smartphone is a heck of a lot more convenient than an alidade, plane table, sighting rod and measuring tape or wheel, which is what I'd be lugging on some trips if I didn't have GPS. That's how I did it in the '70s. I'm glad that I can do the same job with a few ounces of smartphone instead. (And I'm still navigating with map and compass, because if the trail map on my smartphone had the information I need, I would be mapping somewhere else!)

I tried carrying a (rented) SPOT on one trip. My wife came around to my point of view and decided she didn't need all that badly to know where I was, so I haven't carried one since.

I do carry a PLB, at least when solo, or off trail, or in winter. I think I carry it responsibly. I was tempted to light it once, but walked out 15 miles on a sprained knee instead. I said to myself, "if I call, what are the rangers going to do? Put an Ace bandage on it and walk me out, probably. I can do that." I needed a cane for six weeks after I got home.

I've also been in the situation where I'd have a customer who'd pitch a tantrum if I didn't call him back in about 15 minutes, even when I was not the guy on call. I briefly turned into one of those people who's chained to the cell phone (this was back when they were all dumb phones). The boss eventually decided that we didn't need that bastard's money that badly, and fired the customer. Then I was once again able to go to places without cell coverage. (I'll tell you the rest of that story in front of a fire sometime, whether in a fireplace in a nice pub or out in the field somewhere. It was a cool job in some ways, but soul-crushing in the end. I'm glad that everyone moved on.)

The noisiest flying objects that belong in a wilderness area are the grouse. A wilderness should stay wilderness usque ad coelam et ad inferos.

A smart-ass phone is a tool, like any other. You can use a hammer to drive a nail or go on a rampage breaking skulls with it.

And this is the perspective of a grumpy old man.

[Tipi Walter]

It was a cool job in some ways, but soul-crushing in the end.

The noisiest flying objects that belong in a wilderness area are the grouse. A wilderness should stay wilderness usque ad coelam et ad inferos.

A smart-ass phone is a tool, like any other. You can use a hammer to drive a nail or go on a rampage breaking skulls with it.

And this is the perspective of a grumpy old man.

No one grumpier than me.

It was a cool job in some ways, but soul-crushing in the end.

Now this made me laugh hard for a few seconds. Sort of like "It was the best of times, it was the worst of times" etc. Cool job . . . .but soul crushing.

I like your Latin quote---what does it mean? "Unless your colon becomes an inferno"?????

Speaking of tools, well, sure a smartass phone is a tool. So is a chainsaw and a pneumatic hammer and a roaring short-pipe Harley. Most tools don't belong in wilderness. Monkey bipedal humans with opposable thumbs can on occasion get out into nature without all their favorite tools.

[Another Kevin]

I like your Latin quote---what does it mean? "Unless your colon becomes an inferno"?????.

Pretty close, at least with the "inferno" part. "All the way up to Heaven and down to Hell."


Speaking of tools, well, sure a smartass phone is a tool. So is a chainsaw and a pneumatic hammer and a roaring short-pipe Harley. Most tools don't belong in wilderness. Monkey bipedal humans with opposable thumbs can on occasion get out into nature without all their favorite tools.

And my smartass phone, sitting there quietly in a pocket recording a GPS log, on airplane mode (so it isn't going to bleat at me all of a sudden), isn't disturbing you any. Comparing it to an air hammer, a chainsaw, or a Hog is just a little over the top. The worst you'll find is me pecking at the screen, and if I know you're around I'll scribble in a notebook instead. If just knowing that it's there is going to bother you that much, I'm not sure that should be my problem.

For that matter, I've served as chainsaw mule on a trail maintenance trip. (A sawyer generally needs at least a mule and two swampers in his support team for maximal effectiveness. That way he can carry the saw, and focus on cutting, while the rest of the team carries his fuel and oil and wedges and slings and come-along and all that stuff, and clears the debris.) We use the power gear only with permission of the managing agency, which is usually granted only for one or two weeks out of the year. None of the crew has enough time on their hands to go in with bucksaw and wedges to clear the bigger blowdowns. We clear the trail so that we don't get social paths all over the landscape, but steer hikers onto a durable route.

I'm not sure there's ever an excuse for a short-pipe Harley, anywhere. But I've had a Harley driver call me a "f***ing cager," so obviously there's something I don't get.

[Greenlight]

This falls squarely in the category of HYOH.

If you fall down and snap your tibia, I'm sure there will be dozens of fellow hikers who will be happy to phone the rescue team for you with their techie devices. Unless you stand on principle and insist on hopping unassisted to the next road crossing to thumb a ride to the emergency room. :eek:


I do all my hiking and backpacking without a cellphone or any other type of electronic device. This is natural since I've never owned a cellphone or any other type of portable electronic device. Years ago I made the decision to this effect - a vow of "cell-ibacy."

This comes up pretty often - it's amazing how many times hikers ask about signals or mention using a phone in such a way that it's natural for me to mention that I don't have one. The near universal reply is, "I wish I could do without a cellphone." People seem to love them and hate them at the same time.

Are there any other Luddites out there, either in terms of refraining on the trail or refraining totally? I'm sure there are, but I'd like to hear from others. We are probably an endangered species.

[colorado_rob]

No one grumpier than me...

Speaking of tools, well, sure a smartass phone is a tool. So is a chainsaw and a pneumatic hammer and a roaring short-pipe Harley. Most tools don't belong in wilderness. Monkey bipedal humans with opposable thumbs can on occasion get out into nature without all their favorite tools.I thought we were trying to be nicer?

Anyway, this thread has taught me a few things, or reinforced a few things:

1) I now know what a "luddite" is! Never had heard the word.
2) It really is easy to be mean and rude online, as greenpete implies, in real life, like sitting around a campfire together tipping a brew, we'd probably all be good pals. We do share a common interest! We just have different styles.
3) In the immortal words of Robert A. Heinlein “Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.” I've tried to live by these wise words, but occasionally falter....
4) I really do have to try to use my cell less; I do find myself (in "real" life) using it too much. I think most devices add just a little bit of tension to our lives.
5) I think I will finally buy and learn to shoot a gun; call it training for when I see my first drone in the wilderness.... Probably a sawed-off shotgun in the weapon of choice. Carbon fiber, of course, to stay UL.

[rafe]

If you don't like cell phones don't take one into the woods. All the same to me. Why would you need to advertise that fact?

[RockDoc]

Those of us who grew up in the age prior to most computers, cell phones and other gadgets know that they are unnecessary and often interfere with real living. Convenient, yes. Necessary, no.

[garlic08]

One of the reasons I go hiking is to get away from the phone, and to get a break from computers and smart things.

[rafe]

Why does it have to be a binary choice? All-in or not at all? Total escape from civilization, or total immersion in it?

For me, hiking is a recreation. I try to avoid the worst parts of civilization, but not necessarily all of it. On-trail or off.

[Slo-go'en]

Those of us who grew up in the age prior to most computers, cell phones and other gadgets know that they are unnecessary and often interfere with real living. Convenient, yes. Necessary, no.

I grew up without all that stuff too, but I embrace technology which makes my life easier/better/more enjoyable.

[MtDoraDave]

Typically, people's use of smart phones isn't intrusive. ~topic shift~ A few times, I've been at a shelter where someone had some mini-speakers for their cell phone or I-pod. Even when car camping, I don't want to hear music (unless someone brought a guitar and people sing around the campfire). Fortunately for me, the music was of the classic rock genre or some other neutral form of music that I didn't find offensive... but if it had been "bad" music, I would have been disturbed.

I think the people who bring speakers think they are going to make everyone happy with their gift of music, or else they don't think about others at all.
While I am one who uses a cell phone on a hike, I do not prefer to hear other people's music.

[Tipi Walter]

One of the reasons I go hiking is to get away from the phone, and to get a break from computers and smart things.

Exactly. Bring a book. Write in your trail journal. Sleep with a black bear. Talk to a rattlesnake. Study the stinging habits of yellow jackets. Be hand-fed by gophers.


Why does it have to be a binary choice? All-in or not at all? Total escape from civilization, or total immersion in it?

For me, hiking is a recreation. I try to avoid the worst parts of civilization, but not necessarily all of it. On-trail or off.

Well, with 90,000 jets flying over America on a daily basis, there is no total escape from civilization no matter how long I'm out. I can pretend that there is and pray for rainstorms or big waterfalls or high winds, anything to blunt the cursed jet noise. "Hiking is a recreation" is sort of a strange comment. By hiking do you mean "mere" dayhiking? A wholly different beast than backpacking (and the interaction with electronic devices). Just because it's a recreation doesn't have much relevance to whether we carry and use electronic gear or not. You could go out with little to nothing and still call it recreation.

By "recreation" you may mean it's supposed to be fun and enjoyable, therefore a justification to bring the gadgets.

[ChuckT]

Disagree - it's a matter of privacy.
If you're blasting your tunes that's just rude. While I'm alive it's _my_ choice to appreciate them or not, not _your_ choice.

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[imscotty]

I do not use cell phones in my daily life, much to the annoyance of my wife. That works out fine, I just go for a walk and since I have no cell phone she cannot call me to complain about it :)

Last year on my JMT hike the lack of communication with home became the hardest part of the hike for me. Imagining all the things that could go wrong back home while I hiked, became very worrisome. All was fine, I had a great hike, but I promised myself I will finally become part of the cell-phone majority on my next hike.

So this summer I picked up a cheap disposable phone at Wally World and brought it with me on a PCT section hike. I used it for nothing but a few calls and text, turned it on every couple of days and checked in. On this hike things were going bad at home. The dog had to be put down, and various family issues were pitting a great deal of stress on my wife. After two weeks I could hear in her voice that it was time to come home, so I cut my hike short.

Because of that cell phone I am home now instead of hiking, but on the positive side my wife is happier and the marriage is preserved. I guess I will call that a win.

If you can hike without a cell phone my hat is off to you, I am envious. You are a free man :)

[rafe]

"Hiking is a recreation" is sort of a strange comment. By hiking do you mean "mere" dayhiking? A wholly different beast than backpacking (and the interaction with electronic devices). Just because it's a recreation doesn't have much relevance to whether we carry and use electronic gear or not. You could go out with little to nothing and still call it recreation.

By "recreation" you may mean it's supposed to be fun and enjoyable, therefore a justification to bring the gadgets.

Strange? Really? There are at least 191 hits on the word "recreation" on ATC's webiste. I just checked.


recreation: activity done for enjoyment when one is not working.
"areas used for recreation such as hiking or biking"
synonyms: pleasure, leisure, relaxation, fun, enjoyment, entertainment, amusement;


I use that word to describe all hiking I do. Duration or total distance are irrelevant.

I choose that word partly to exclude feats of extreme speed, endurance, etc. One could also argue that thru-hikes are kind of borderline, in that they're not always pleasant, relaxing, amusing, or fun.

[rafe]

FWIW, Benton MacKaye's original proposal for the AT (link below) is nine pages long. There are eight uses of the word recreation or recreational. So the word was central to his thinking and writing.

Distance of hike is irrelevant. The key thing is that it not be work. At least not if we're to call it recreation.

MacKaye AT Proposal (1921) -- https://www.appalachiantrail.org/docs/default-document-library/2011/04/16/An%20Appalachian%20Trail-A%20Project%20in%20Regional%20Planning.pdf

[Dogwood]

What about a camera?
Flashlight?
Notepad and pencil?
Map?
Data book?
Town guide?

IF you carry all of the above separately, perhaps opening your mind to a smart phone would help you save some weight and have a lot of stuff in one device.


If you haven't seen the advantages of a smart phone yet, most likely you never will.

(didn't even bother to mention GPS, phone, texting, email possibilities or google)(above)

I refrain from internet connectivity on hikes. However, I don't usually totally abstain. I do take pics on a separate small camera(no WiFi), take a cheapy Trac Phone, and a separate Mp3 player though. Of course, I have a headlamp that takes 3 AAA's. To consider how much I use a ph on trail I started this latest 1100 miles total multi trail hike 3.5 wks ago near Portland with 385 mins on that Trac Phone. Checking it now I have 309 mins left after 355 miles.

I'm of Fiddlehead's opinion that I like keeping my options open because as he says NO DOUBT electronics under some scenarios can be damn right useful AND WEIGHT, VOLUME, and COMPLEXIBILITY SAVING!

Where your badges of honor as you deem right though as you're not hurting anyone by wanting to be a Luddite.

[Traveler]

Strange? Really?

I use that word to describe all hiking I do. Duration or total distance are irrelevant.

I choose that word partly to exclude feats of extreme speed, endurance, etc. One could also argue that thru-hikes are kind of borderline, in that they're not always pleasant, relaxing, amusing, or fun.

Well said.

[Alligator]

Several of you totally hijacked this thread which was placed into Straight Forward. Please pay attention to which forum threads are placed. Clearly the questioner indicated no desire to be convinced about bringing a cell.

[Dan Roper]

The OP (me) did not state an opinion. I just expressed a preference for not having electronic gizmos on the trail and asked if there were others out there that felt the same.

[Alligator]

The OP (me) did not state an opinion. I just expressed a preference for not having electronic gizmos on the trail and asked if there were others out there that felt the same.You were fine with your first post. The way some folks answered is exactly why we have straight forward, because they can't seem to allow someone to express their preference without making it a debate. For instance, a question about alcohol stove a vs alcohol stove b here in Straight Forward does not mean the person is wanting to debate alcohol vs gas or going stoveless. (And this stove example is not intended for further discussion. If you need further information about a warning placed in a thread PM the moderator. Continuing to post about removed posts breaks #3 of the user agreement.)

[Hosh]

To me it's all about "temptation". No outdoorsman or backpacker should EVER get on the internet while they are out and about. Control yourself. Isn't home use and work use enough? Do we still have to be interwad-connected even on a hiking trip? I get my giggles on the 'Wad here at home with this forum and such and Facebook but it's temporary and once I hit the trailhead I desperately need the discipline of NO MO' INTERWAD!!!

The worst are guys who post their daily trip reports live-action from out in the field on their fartphones. Give it a rest. And god help the guys who have their movements tracked on an hourly basis at home. When you head out, let us wonder what you're up to and let us imagine, and then when you get home after a week or a month then file your trip report.

And please PLEASE do not post your gps waypoints of a trip!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't want to know. Let me look at Mt Zeb from the trail below it or on my map, don't reduce it to a number.

And never fly your personal idiot-drones over the forest and into wilderness areas. Thank you for the rant.

I guess this defines the boundaries of Hike Your Own Hike.

Maybe if electronics weighted as much as a watermelon, it would be ok?