Tyvek vs poly for tarp ground sheet...

[saltysack]

Never really used a ground cloth much as I've always used a tent with bathtub floor. Since I ordered the cuben duomid but not dropping the $ on inner or bivy just yet...curious what is better....I assume tyvek is heavier but more durable than poly....thoughts


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[Sandy of PA]

Tyvek is not completely waterproof, poly is but very slippery. Another type to consider is the window covering stuff polycro. I used a cuben bathtub floor, until I moved to a Solplex tent.

[Engine]

I experimented with a poly ground sheet and hated it. It's so light that getting it laid down in even a light breeze is a real pain and it also doesn't seem like it would add much protection. I'm considering either Tyvek or a Cuben ground cloth.

[MuddyWaters]

Polycro is good 1-2 oz
SOL PE space blanket works too and is pretty tough light 3-4 oz
mylar space blanket is replaceable at any walmart and is noisy, but dirt cheap and extremely lightb 1-1.5 oz
tyvek house wrap is 1.85 oz/sqyd 4-5 oz
lighter tyvek is 1.43 oz/sq yd

you can get cuben thats 1.1 oz/sq yd
You can rig a zpacks bathtub floor cuben to work

You can just bring a bug bivy

[Hosh]

I have used poly-cro for many years and it is very durable and light weight. Walmart has an off brand of patio door thermal window film that is wide enough for most tent footprints.

Tyvek is noisy unless ran through a washer several times, it is also heavier. I used it for several years before switching.

I have roll of Tyvek left over from building a house, if you want some, pay shipping and it's yours.

[MuddyWaters]

I have used poly-cro for many years and it is very durable and light weight. Walmart has an off brand of patio door thermal window film that is wide enough for most tent footprints.



Probably not in Florida.....Its a cold weather thing mostly I think.

My main gripe about polycro, is its hard to tell which side is the dirty side by looking at it. I put a few pieces of duct tape on it on one side, and dedicate that side to up . Does it matter? yeah, when you lay it on wood soaked with mouse urine and feces (lord knows what else) in shelters too, it kind of does.

[fghester]

I used a Tyvek sheet under my Lunar Solo on a long AT section hike last June/July. The Lunar Solo has a bathtub floor but I wanted the extra protection against the wet ground. It worked very well. Weighs almost nothing and, in the wind, I used four titanium pins to hold it down while I pitched my tent on top of it. Important to void having the Tyvek stick out from under the tent or it just channels rain water right under your floor.

[Venchka]

I used a ground sheet for the first time in Colorado. 2 mil painters drop cloth from Ace Hardware. I'm pretty sure I can get 4 4'x8' pieces. The piece I used for 2 weeks is fine. Plenty of use left in it. I didn't weigh it. I could weigh it if you care.
Wayne


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[colorado_rob]

I've been a polycro proponent for years, and so far, the only thing I've used for my zpacks tent floor (the solo+, with mesh floor).

But talking to a triple crowner recently (I met him on the Long Trail this September), he swears by 1443R Tyvek. Lighter than the Tyvek a lot of folks use, and makes zero noise, so I bought 3 meters of it, and cut it into a bath tub floor for my zpacks, and will try it out.

Here's the link:

https://www.amazon.com/Kitemaking-Material-Durable-Lightweight-Breathable/dp/B00G28H9QW/ref=pd_lpo_21_bs_t_2?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=1Q6WR8RDTGQ2HF8F9WS5

My polycro floor was 2 ounces, the 1443 Tyvek floor is just over twice that, basically the same as the cuben, around 4.5 ounces. We'll see how I like it, probably go back to polycro though, because that has always worked fine.

[Hosh]

Probably not in Florida.....Its a cold weather thing mostly I think.

My main gripe about polycro, is its hard to tell which side is the dirty side by looking at it. I put a few pieces of duct tape on it on one side, and dedicate that side to up . Does it matter? yeah, when you lay it on wood soaked with mouse urine and feces (lord knows what else) in shelters too, it kind of does.

Opps, it's 32 F here spitting snow so my frame of reference needs calibrated.

It is hard to tell which side was down. I use it mostly as way to keep my tent bottom clean and as a clean staging area for items waiting to go in the pack. The tape markings are a good idea.

[left52side]

As stated above I used tyvek for quite some time and still do on occasion.
I use polycryo now mostly all the time for my longer hikes though.
I have found that it holds up quite well surprisingly for how light and thin it is.
One piece lasted my A whole SHT thru hike and is still perfectly fine.
Yes it has its downsides like mentioned it is A pain to work with in the wind but I will set my tarp up first then it blocks most of the wind.
Also as mentioned finding the upside vs the side that is on the ground can be hard to decipher,but A small piece of tape works,what I did was put A mark in the right corner of mine with magic marker and I always knew that it was in the right corner so it was always the clean side/

[Dogwood]

If it's largely for use where you live nice to make arrangements for those FL torrential down pours with a bathtub floor and perhaps offering some protection from fire ants and palmetto bugs whatever fabric you use.

[cmoulder]

I've been a polycro proponent for years, and so far, the only thing I've used for my zpacks tent floor (the solo+, with mesh floor).

But talking to a triple crowner recently (I met him on the Long Trail this September), he swears by 1443R Tyvek. Lighter than the Tyvek a lot of folks use, and makes zero noise, so I bought 3 meters of it, and cut it into a bath tub floor for my zpacks, and will try it out.

Here's the link:

https://www.amazon.com/Kitemaking-Material-Durable-Lightweight-Breathable/dp/B00G28H9QW/ref=pd_lpo_21_bs_t_2?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=1Q6WR8RDTGQ2HF8F9WS5

My polycro floor was 2 ounces, the 1443 Tyvek floor is just over twice that, basically the same as the cuben, around 4.5 ounces. We'll see how I like it, probably go back to polycro though, because that has always worked fine.

I think you're going to like polycryo better because that kite stuff is kinda fuzzy and picks up dirt, twig and leaf debris. I found polycryo very slippery, even on grass and leaves, and just crazy slippery on snow. Maybe different with the mesh floor. I went back to using no ground sheet with my Duplex and have not had any problems. Gets a little dirty from time to time but washes off easily.

[TexasBob]

I like 3 or 4 mil plastic sheeting.
1. weighs about the same as tyvek but waterproof and stays cleaner
2. polycro works and is light but is so light that wind makes it frustrating to use

[Hosh]

It is easier to place the polycro underneath a freestanding tent after pitching if it's windy.

[Dogwood]

If you are going to have your boy and JRT in the DuoMid along maybe consider using something a bit more durable, a bit more stay put, a bit more heavier as a ground sheet for those times?

[Wil]

I experimented with a poly ground sheet and hated it. It's so light that getting it laid down in even a light breeze is a real pain and it also doesn't seem like it would add much protection. I'm considering either Tyvek or a Cuben ground cloth.I like very thin poly for weight; it's tougher than it seems.

I put a dab of tape in each corner, doubled over so it grabs on each side of the corner. Then I paper-punch a hole through the tape. I then use shepherd hook stakes to hold each corner down, not tight but with a little slack. First thing I do in camp.

Makes it easy to lay down on it, both directions, maybe move the setup around in various spots to make sure I'm not going to be trying to sleep head downhill or rolling side to side. This would be a major PITA when the flimsy stuff blows around in the wind. The tape is felt-pen-marked so I know which side is "clean" and up.

This stable clean platform is nice to have to lay stuff on when I'm unpacking and packing up next morning. As I'm setting up I may remove the corner stakes for other purposes once there is weight on the sheet; if I'm cowboying that night I just leave the stakes in. Over time I have evolved to using four of those very thin titanium shepherd hook stakes for this purpose and leaving them in, those four stakes serving double duty as my extra "batten down" stakes for tent or tarp in a major storm.

The sheet usually lasts a very long time; a corner will tear or stretch out more often and require re-taping, maybe every 20-30 nights. Since the plastic is so light I cut it over-sized and spray all around the perimeter, top & bottom, with permethrin since I cowboy so often. The permethrin needs to be re-applied every 15+ nights or so because it doesn't "take" to the plastic as it does to fabric.

[naturlred]

Tyvek....cheap,light weight, and easy to find.

[fastfoxengineering]

I don't like how everything sticks to tyvek. At least in my experiences.

I have a gossamer gear polycro ground sheet that I haven't used yet.

If cuben floors weren't so expensive I'd prob go that route. However, as a ground sheet, what advantages do they have over polycro or tyvek?

Some companies out there make a nice silnylon ground sheet.

[Venchka]

I used a ground sheet for the first time in Colorado. 2 mil painters drop cloth from Ace Hardware. I'm pretty sure I can get 4 4'x8' pieces from the original package. The piece I used for 2 weeks is fine. Plenty of use left in it. I didn't weigh it. I could weigh it if you care.
Wayne


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So I got bored. I weighed my ground sheet.
2 mil plastic sheet. Nominally 4' x 8'.
3.62 ounces / 103 grams. Approximately $2.50 - $3.00 each from a larger piece of plastic.
Not bad for an impulse buy at the hardware store.
Wayne


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[colorado_rob]

If cuben floors weren't so expensive I'd prob go that route. However, as a ground sheet, what advantages do they have over polycro or tyvek?
Well, in the case of zpacks "ground sheets" for zpacks tents, they are sewn nicely into a bath tub shape. One can do this themselves, of course, with Tyvek, as I have recently sort of done this. A little tougher to do with polycro. I would think the cuben ground sheets are also a bit tougher than polycro or Tyvek. But yeah, expensive. Looks like 2-mil plastic is about twice as heavy at polycro, might be slightly tougher, I don't know.

[Dogwood]

I like very thin poly for weight; it's tougher than it seems.

I put a dab of tape in each corner, doubled over so it grabs on each side of the corner. Then I paper-punch a hole through the tape. I then use shepherd hook stakes to hold each corner down, not tight but with a little slack. First thing I do in camp.

Makes it easy to lay down on it, both directions, maybe move the setup around in various spots to make sure I'm not going to be trying to sleep head downhill or rolling side to side. This would be a major PITA when the flimsy stuff blows around in the wind. The tape is felt-pen-marked so I know which side is "clean" and up.

This stable clean platform is nice to have to lay stuff on when I'm unpacking and packing up next morning. As I'm setting up I may remove the corner stakes for other purposes once there is weight on the sheet; if I'm cowboying that night I just leave the stakes in. Over time I have evolved to using four of those very thin titanium shepherd hook stakes for this purpose and leaving them in, those four stakes serving double duty as my extra "batten down" stakes for tent or tarp in a major storm.

The sheet usually lasts a very long time; a corner will tear or stretch out more often and require re-taping, maybe every 20-30 nights. Since the plastic is so light I cut it over-sized and spray all around the perimeter, top & bottom, with permethrin since I cowboy so often. The permethrin needs to be re-applied every 15+ nights or so because it doesn't "take" to the plastic as it does to fabric.


Good stuff. I've used stick on fiber binder ring hole washers to strengthen stake holes in polycro. To prevent the polycro from tearing, like you said you do, I don't put much force on it and attach some of the lightest wt micro bungee cord(1.2 mm) I but at Hobby Lobby or JoAnns fabrics to it to keep it almost taut but enough force that it stays put as a ground sheet with a 3-4" high bathtub edge. i stretch the nine out LOOSELY to my tarp stake so no extra stakes are need. It's the lightest wt bathtub floor I've made yet for a MLD Solomid and MLD Duomid. It's not as durable as Joes's ZPack's 1.o oz/sq yd bathtub floor but for sub $15 I can make two and one doesn't cost me $100+.

[Dogwood]

I agree with you 1.0 CF ground sheet bathtubs last longer than Tyvek 1443 in like conditions. But, again, as you say 1443 is like 1/6 - 1/8 the cost of CF 1.o.

[Engine]

I like very thin poly for weight; it's tougher than it seems.

I put a dab of tape in each corner, doubled over so it grabs on each side of the corner. Then I paper-punch a hole through the tape. I then use shepherd hook stakes to hold each corner down, not tight but with a little slack. First thing I do in camp.

Makes it easy to lay down on it, both directions, maybe move the setup around in various spots to make sure I'm not going to be trying to sleep head downhill or rolling side to side. This would be a major PITA when the flimsy stuff blows around in the wind. The tape is felt-pen-marked so I know which side is "clean" and up.

This stable clean platform is nice to have to lay stuff on when I'm unpacking and packing up next morning. As I'm setting up I may remove the corner stakes for other purposes once there is weight on the sheet; if I'm cowboying that night I just leave the stakes in. Over time I have evolved to using four of those very thin titanium shepherd hook stakes for this purpose and leaving them in, those four stakes serving double duty as my extra "batten down" stakes for tent or tarp in a major storm.

The sheet usually lasts a very long time; a corner will tear or stretch out more often and require re-taping, maybe every 20-30 nights. Since the plastic is so light I cut it over-sized and spray all around the perimeter, top & bottom, with permethrin since I cowboy so often. The permethrin needs to be re-applied every 15+ nights or so because it doesn't "take" to the plastic as it does to fabric.

Thanks for the tape and stake idea, I'll give that a go.

[saltysack]

I like very thin poly for weight; it's tougher than it seems.

I put a dab of tape in each corner, doubled over so it grabs on each side of the corner. Then I paper-punch a hole through the tape. I then use shepherd hook stakes to hold each corner down, not tight but with a little slack. First thing I do in camp.

Makes it easy to lay down on it, both directions, maybe move the setup around in various spots to make sure I'm not going to be trying to sleep head downhill or rolling side to side. This would be a major PITA when the flimsy stuff blows around in the wind. The tape is felt-pen-marked so I know which side is "clean" and up.

This stable clean platform is nice to have to lay stuff on when I'm unpacking and packing up next morning. As I'm setting up I may remove the corner stakes for other purposes once there is weight on the sheet; if I'm cowboying that night I just leave the stakes in. Over time I have evolved to using four of those very thin titanium shepherd hook stakes for this purpose and leaving them in, those four stakes serving double duty as my extra "batten down" stakes for tent or tarp in a major storm.

The sheet usually lasts a very long time; a corner will tear or stretch out more often and require re-taping, maybe every 20-30 nights. Since the plastic is so light I cut it over-sized and spray all around the perimeter, top & bottom, with permethrin since I cowboy so often. The permethrin needs to be re-applied every 15+ nights or so because it doesn't "take" to the plastic as it does to fabric.

Good idea....does any permethrin actually stick to the poly?


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[saltysack]

So is the poly Mld sells same as window film etc? I think it's $8...pre cut for 2....


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[saltysack]

I have used poly-cro for many years and it is very durable and light weight. Walmart has an off brand of patio door thermal window film that is wide enough for most tent footprints.

Tyvek is noisy unless ran through a washer several times, it is also heavier. I used it for several years before switching.

I have roll of Tyvek left over from building a house, if you want some, pay shipping and it's yours.

Appreciate offer but think I'll just try poly.....


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[saltysack]

If it's largely for use where you live nice to make arrangements for those FL torrential down pours with a bathtub floor and perhaps offering some protection from fire ants and palmetto bugs whatever fabric you use.

The places I camp in this hell hole require a full net......it's doubtful I'd every carry the mid here....can't imagine trying no net in the glades!


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[RockDoc]

I like Tyvek. Good under the tent, good to put down on a shelter platform. Durable, not slippery like nylon. cheap.
We dressed ours up with a few lines of racing bibs sewn on the edges for more width and some visual interest... it has served about 8 years now, still going strong.

[Hosh]

The places I camp in this hell hole require a full net......it's doubtful I'd every carry the mid here....can't imagine trying no net in the glades!


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thread drift warning:

Curious what precautions are need in alligator country. Seems like they would be hard to scare off.

I have heard stories of golfers praying they don't get drug into a lake or canal. It would be pretty scary to wake up with a 10'er outside your tent, cuben fiber or otherwise

[saltysack]

thread drift warning:

Curious what precautions are need in alligator country. Seems like they would be hard to scare off.

I have heard stories of golfers praying they don't get drug into a lake or canal. It would be pretty scary to wake up with a 10'er outside your tent, cuben fiber or otherwise

I'm no more afraid of them than black bears....I thru paddled the 312+ mile st.johns river on my 17'6" expedition SUP in 2012...counted well over 1,000 gators and one was definitely record breaking size well over 15'....less than 50' away...pucker factor was high with that dinosaur. He made the common 10' gators look small. I actually was lil nervous when I stopped to camp that night a few miles later. Only time I stay well away is when they are rutting in late spring.

[saltysack]

thread drift warning:

Curious what precautions are need in alligator country. Seems like they would be hard to scare off.

I have heard stories of golfers praying they don't get drug into a lake or canal. It would be pretty scary to wake up with a 10'er outside your tent, cuben fiber or otherwise

Hear is a pic from that campsite the next morning over my tent.....http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161204/90fe37a793cc726e3d964b379643249c.pnghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161204/82d07500a8db5d90df28f4680096f063.png


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[Dogwood]

What's better depends on conditions of use and ones' other priorities. Ryan Jordan did a good run down on this BPL thread while referring to the Solomid but is just as valid for the Duomid. https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/105676/page/2/#comments

One of things I so appreciate in reviews and why decisions were made are when hikers give supporting details like anticipated conditions, THEN, move forward with their gear choices. Helps to provide context and perspective. This is why I like Skurka's and like minded and formulated trip and gear reports/lists. Then "the Skurk" follows up with some general comments about what he liked, he could have done better, what he thought was problematic, etc. That shows development, evolution as a hiker. Helps me understand and make better decisions for myself.

[bret]

Tyvek 1443R kite material has been used 20-30 nights and still like new (3.5oz for solo and 4.4 oz for double). Polycro ripped after a few nights and it's a little more fussy to lay out. I'll tape the edges to prevent ripping before trying again. Often don't bother, but if going somewhere rough/rocky I'll bring one.

[Leo L.]

After some discussions here on WB I made a groundsheet from housewrap, similar to Tyvek but non-slippery.
While it is not really waterproof, I love it, and made another one for my most recent tent, of a similar, but lighter housewrap material.
Its a bit on the heavy side, and it doesn't fold and roll very easy.
Everything else is very positive: Cheap, easy to make, very durable, non-slippery, has a white (= clean) and a dark-grey (= dirty) side, dries very quick when grey side exposed to the sun.
Due to the straps on each corner there is more use to it than only as ground sheet.
I carry it on the outside of the pack and use it as sitpad for every break, or as sleepingpad for a longer noon break every now and then.

[Gambit McCrae]

Tyvek is a great DIY material. Its cheap and easy to replace/ try new ideas out with.

I have used a tyvek sheet for a ground cloth for under my tarp for 3 trips now and although I have not had bad weather, it has held up really well. I got some grommets to put in the corners, and they have worked well too.

[cmoulder]

I use a Tyvek housewrap bathtub in my Duomid. it is easy to fold the corners like a box and tape them with duct tape, using some pieces of bamboo chopsticks in the corners as stays to help the bathtub hold its shape. It is held in place with 2.5mm shock cord attached to the corners of the Duomid, and plastic hooks to attach/release quickly.

3728937290

[saltysack]

I use a Tyvek housewrap bathtub in my Duomid. it is easy to fold the corners like a box and tape them with duct tape, using some pieces of bamboo chopsticks in the corners as stays to help the bathtub hold its shape. It is held in place with 2.5mm shock cord attached to the corners of the Duomid, and plastic hooks to attach/release quickly.

3728937290

Perfect!!! Exactly what I was thinking...any pix of chop sticks in corners?


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[cmoulder]

Sorry, I don't have a pic of that but it's fairly easy to describe...

After the corners are folded, make a small hole in the corner crease where you want to attach the shock cord, which is about in the middle. Feed the shock cord through the hole to the chopstick (about 4" long) and then tie it to the chopstick. Align the chopstick along the inside of the corner and the hole where the shock cord exits, and then tape it in place with a piece of duct tape.

[saltysack]

Sorry, I don't have a pic of that but it's fairly easy to describe...

After the corners are folded, make a small hole in the corner crease where you want to attach the shock cord, which is about in the middle. Feed the shock cord through the hole to the chopstick (about 4" long) and then tie it to the chopstick. Align the chopstick along the inside of the corner and the hole where the shock cord exits, and then tape it in place with a piece of duct tape.

I wonder if this set would would work with poly? You use the lighter kite tyvek or std house wrap?


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[cmoulder]

Don't know is this would work with polycryo.

Mine was the stiffer housewrap tyvek. The one in my pic is kinda heavy at 7.5oz, but it is extremely functional and durable. Especially on packed snow it is nice to have stuff not skittering around and out the edges of the tent at night.

I have a Zpacks twin ground sheet that I might try to adapt to the Duomid. It is about half the weight of the Tyvek and I got a good deal on it. It has got that long, hex shape to it so I'll likely have to get creative when I finally gather the motivation to tackle that job.

[egilbe]

I've been a polycro proponent for years, and so far, the only thing I've used for my zpacks tent floor (the solo+, with mesh floor).

But talking to a triple crowner recently (I met him on the Long Trail this September), he swears by 1443R Tyvek. Lighter than the Tyvek a lot of folks use, and makes zero noise, so I bought 3 meters of it, and cut it into a bath tub floor for my zpacks, and will try it out.

Here's the link:

https://www.amazon.com/Kitemaking-Material-Durable-Lightweight-Breathable/dp/B00G28H9QW/ref=pd_lpo_21_bs_t_2?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=1Q6WR8RDTGQ2HF8F9WS5

My polycro floor was 2 ounces, the 1443 Tyvek floor is just over twice that, basically the same as the cuben, around 4.5 ounces. We'll see how I like it, probably go back to polycro though, because that has always worked fine.

Thats the stuff I use.

[fastfoxengineering]

Does the ZPacks bathtub floors hold their shape without out being attached to a tarp? I'm sure you get a better bathtub effect while it is clipped above but if one were to use it by itself, and it still held its shape for the most part, I would probably consider it my ideal ground sheet, albeit pricey.

I'm still trying to put together by ground shelter. So far I haven't pulled the trigger on anything. All I have discovered is no one makes a setup that is exactly what I'm looking for. So diy route is the way to go.

[MuddyWaters]

Does the ZPacks bathtub floors hold their shape without out being attached to a tarp?

No

In fact some, like twin size in hex twin, dont hold their shape that well while being clipped in

[MuddyWaters]

double post

[fastfoxengineering]

No

In fact some, like twin size in hex twin, dont hold their shape that well while being clipped in

Disappointing but thank you for the answer. On their website it showed a picture with a bunch of gear stuffed in every corner and it held its bathtub shape. I was skeptical and once the cuben broke in a little I didn't think it would.

So unless one was planning to always have it clipped it, do you think an ordinary flat ground sheet would serve one better?

[fastfoxengineering]

One thing I've noticed with completely flat ground sheets is that for some reason, they tend to attract duff and somehow always end up on top of it. I noticed that with the piece of tyvek I use under my hammock as a clean place to put some gear.

I'm more interested in a bathtub floor for keeping a clean organized space than water protection lol. I've never been flooded out because of good site selection. I guess the insurance off a bathtub is an added benefit when it comes to water resistance though.

Just one man's journey in finding that perfect shelter for himself.

[saltysack]

Good stuff. I've used stick on fiber binder ring hole washers to strengthen stake holes in polycro. To prevent the polycro from tearing, like you said you do, I don't put much force on it and attach some of the lightest wt micro bungee cord(1.2 mm) I but at Hobby Lobby or JoAnns fabrics to it to keep it almost taut but enough force that it stays put as a ground sheet with a 3-4" high bathtub edge. i stretch the nine out LOOSELY to my tarp stake so no extra stakes are need. It's the lightest wt bathtub floor I've made yet for a MLD Solomid and MLD Duomid. It's not as durable as Joes's ZPack's 1.o oz/sq yd bathtub floor but for sub $15 I can make two and one doesn't cost me $100+.

How did you get the poly edges to stand up? Assume clipped into the mid above?


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[Dogwood]

How did you get the poly edges to stand up? Assume clipped into the mid above?


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I never cut the corners of the polycro. I fold them into that position. Look here in the Generic Tub Floor corner folding design. http://www.ddhammocks.com/explore/modifications/tarp_tutorial

The "bellowed" flap consisting of two layers of polycro can be facing inwards, outwards or taped flat to create 3 or 4 layers of polycro. A small 1/16-1/8 " diam. hole is placed in the flap near the bathtub top edge that's reinforced with tiny 1/4" or so fiber stick on washers or fabric ring hole binder tab hole reinforcers. If I use the ones made for paper holes they are not a strong so I place one on each side of the hole to reinforce it. Look for the stronger fiber ones. Depending on the tape you're using if at all you may not need hole reinforcing washers. I like the added strength in these high force prone to being ripped areas so I add them. Wt penalty is less than 3 grams for 6 holes to be reinforced both sides.


From the places I have the small reinforced holes I add about 6-9" of 1.2 mm (super light wt) elasticized bungee that stretch to double their cut length that stretch out to the included mitten hooks on the inside corners of the MLD SoloMid and Duomid. The bungee allows some range of play for different set up dimensions(floor space, height, etc). If your tarps, mids, etc don't have interior lower edge attachment pts for the bungee you can attache to the tarp/tent stakes. BUT, if you do that make sure water doesn't run down it into the bathtub groundsheet. One way is simply too make sure the bungee is angled down and away from the top edge of the bathtub.

I like erecting mids with the ground edge 3" or off the ground to allow for greater airflow. I sometimes play with designs that vary the bathtub edge height 2-5" depending on what height I think needed to make it all work for me.

Another additional design feature using polyolefin that addresses the edge holding up concern is by creating a strong top edge around the entire perimeter by making a small 1" or less folded hem using the double sided tape included in window film kits, like Duck Brand, in unison with the folded corner as shown above. A good alternative that can possibly be lighter wt is using 1/4- 3/8" wide TUCK TAPE which is great for outside uses and has never failed despite being drenched and immersed in water. It comes out of Canada. I've seen some people use painters's or masking tape which is too heavy IMHO, not sticky enough, and prone to failure once wet, damp, or overly cold. Too much or too heavy a tape or too wide a hem used on the top hem of the bathtub floor and it gets material weighted down unnecessarily so. It's mostly the bungee that holds up the top edge.


Regardless of the design making bathtub floors out of polycro results in a UL/SUL TLC required groundsheet. They don't last forever and they will not function well if care isn't taken in the design and use.


For larger ground sheets for larger floor area shelters where the approach is a one stop polycro one and not everyone is on same extra TLC needed page that might use the shelter(children, dog, etc) I can recognize problems concerning concerning durability, holes, tears, dislodging of the polycro ground sheet, slipperiness, etc. Add really wet conditions, some lack of site prep(sand spurs/cockle spurs/manzanita spurs, sweetgum or sycamore tree fruit, a tiny pine cone, pine tree sticks, tree sap, sharp pebbles, bulky sometimes hard nodes of various ornamental turf grasses etc), mud, etc and polycro can become just more crap needed to be hauled out.

[MuddyWaters]

Disappointing but thank you for the answer. On their website it showed a picture with a bunch of gear stuffed in every corner and it held its bathtub shape. I was skeptical and once the cuben broke in a little I didn't think it would.

So unless one was planning to always have it clipped it, do you think an ordinary flat ground sheet would serve one better?

well if you put rocks in the corners maybe
but site selection is everything
shouldnt need a bathtub really with enough tarp overhang
with minimal overhang a high one like 8" helps with the splashing from heavy rain

If you have oversized flat polycro sheet, or PE, or whatever, gather corners and use the elastic cord and keepers to hold each corner, you can make a bathtub floor with anything .

Works very well.

[Dogwood]

One thing I've noticed with completely flat ground sheets is that for some reason, they tend to attract duff and somehow always end up on top of it. I noticed that with the piece of tyvek I use under my hammock as a clean place to put some gear.

I'm more interested in a bathtub floor for keeping a clean organized space than water protection lol. I've never been flooded out because of good site selection. I guess the insurance off a bathtub is an added benefit when it comes to water resistance though.

Just one man's journey in finding that perfect shelter for himself.


With a flat ground sheet set up on duff like a thick bed of leaves whenever I can I walk the spot to decompress the fallen leaves first. Sometimes if the leaves are particular thick I may scatter them a bit to make less thick sometimes getting down to matted wet fallen leaves than adding a few dry ones on top. Then putting the polycro on top. I find this important during the fall with lots of dry leaves and swirling wind. Running my feet and hands quickly over the site also exposes sharp objects, roots, depressions hidden by leaves, etc. I don't do this to the extent that after I pack up in the morn I now leave what is easily visible or recognizable as a newly established campsite. I may even rearrange the leaves sticks or pine cones as I originally found them.

Might additionally make note of prevailing wind setting up shelter like a tarp or mid with the leading edge heading into the wind set low to the ground or nearly so. This applies to groundsheet in a floor less shelter too. The groundsheet can be raised up on the leading edge heading into the wind or raised up higher if it's a slightly sloped campsite to allow water to flow under rather than onto the top of the groundsheet. In this way one can possibly avoid bathtub floor designs entirely in milder weather.

[Dogwood]

Disappointing but thank you for the answer. On their website it showed a picture with a bunch of gear stuffed in every corner and it held its bathtub shape. I was skeptical and once the cuben broke in a little I didn't think it would.

So unless one was planning to always have it clipped it, do you think an ordinary flat ground sheet would serve one better?

I follow Muddy Waters approach more than having a need always for bathtub designed floors. For those perhaps not inclined to view things more profoundly or want not to think about shelters or campsite prep or CS locations as profoundly or aren't into considering and anticipating hike conditions matching their heart to the hike and those conditions as fully as others the one stop totally integrated tent can be a mentally easier digested shelter approach.

[saltysack]

I never cut the corners of the polycro. I fold them into that position. Look here in the Generic Tub Floor corner folding design. http://www.ddhammocks.com/explore/modifications/tarp_tutorial

The "bellowed" flap consisting of two layers of polycro can be facing inwards, outwards or taped flat to create 3 or 4 layers of polycro. A small 1/16-1/8 " diam. hole is placed in the flap near the bathtub top edge that's reinforced with tiny 1/4" or so fiber stick on washers or fabric ring hole binder tab hole reinforcers. If I use the ones made for paper holes they are not a strong so I place one on each side of the hole to reinforce it. Look for the stronger fiber ones. Depending on the tape you're using if at all you may not need hole reinforcing washers. I like the added strength in these high force prone to being ripped areas so I add them. Wt penalty is less than 3 grams for 6 holes to be reinforced both sides.


From the places I have the small reinforced holes I add about 6-9" of 1.2 mm (super light wt) elasticized bungee that stretch to double their cut length that stretch out to the included mitten hooks on the inside corners of the MLD SoloMid and Duomid. The bungee allows some range of play for different set up dimensions(floor space, height, etc). If your tarps, mids, etc don't have interior lower edge attachment pts for the bungee you can attache to the tarp/tent stakes. BUT, if you do that make sure water doesn't run down it into the bathtub groundsheet. One way is simply too make sure the bungee is angled down and away from the top edge of the bathtub.

I like erecting mids with the ground edge 3" or off the ground to allow for greater airflow. I sometimes play with designs that vary the bathtub edge height 2-5" depending on what height I think needed to make it all work for me.

Another additional design feature using polyolefin that addresses the edge holding up concern is by creating a strong top edge around the entire perimeter by making a small 1" or less folded hem using the double sided tape included in window film kits, like Duck Brand, in unison with the folded corner as shown above. A good alternative that can possibly be lighter wt is using 1/4- 3/8" wide TUCK TAPE which is great for outside uses and has never failed despite being drenched and immersed in water. It comes out of Canada. I've seen some people use painters's or masking tape which is too heavy IMHO, not sticky enough, and prone to failure once wet, damp, or overly cold. Too much or too heavy a tape or too wide a hem used on the top hem of the bathtub floor and it gets material weighted down unnecessarily so. It's mostly the bungee that holds up the top edge.


Regardless of the design making bathtub floors out of polycro results in a UL/SUL TLC required groundsheet. They don't last forever and they will not function well if care isn't taken in the design and use.


For larger ground sheets for larger floor area shelters where the approach is a one stop polycro one and not everyone is on same extra TLC needed page that might use the shelter(children, dog, etc) I can recognize problems concerning concerning durability, holes, tears, dislodging of the polycro ground sheet, slipperiness, etc. Add really wet conditions, some lack of site prep(sand spurs/cockle spurs/manzanita spurs, sweetgum or sycamore tree fruit, a tiny pine cone, pine tree sticks, tree sap, sharp pebbles, bulky sometimes hard nodes of various ornamental turf grasses etc), mud, etc and polycro can become just more crap needed to be hauled out.

Perfect thx....


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[Elaikases]

I have used poly-cro for many years and it is very durable and light weight. Walmart has an off brand of patio door thermal window film that is wide enough for most tent footprints.

Tyvek is noisy unless ran through a washer several times, it is also heavier. I used it for several years before switching.

I have roll of Tyvek left over from building a house, if you want some, pay shipping and it's yours.

How much for the shipping to Texas?

[Dogwood]

Does the ZPacks bathtub floors hold their shape without out being attached to a tarp? I'm sure you get a better bathtub effect while it is clipped above but if one were to use it by itself, and it still held its shape for the most part, I would probably consider it my ideal ground sheet, albeit pricey.

I'm still trying to put together by ground shelter. So far I haven't pulled the trigger on anything. All I have discovered is no one makes a setup that is exactly what I'm looking for. So diy route is the way to go.

without being bungeed up the ZP CF walls of the bathtub groundsheets flop some along the long sides. However even if not bungeed and say a piece of decent wt gear is held against the inside walls on the top(head) and foot ends the ZO bathtubs tauten up a bit.

[saltysack]

I never cut the corners of the polycro. I fold them into that position. Look here in the Generic Tub Floor corner folding design. http://www.ddhammocks.com/explore/modifications/tarp_tutorial

The "bellowed" flap consisting of two layers of polycro can be facing inwards, outwards or taped flat to create 3 or 4 layers of polycro. A small 1/16-1/8 " diam. hole is placed in the flap near the bathtub top edge that's reinforced with tiny 1/4" or so fiber stick on washers or fabric ring hole binder tab hole reinforcers. If I use the ones made for paper holes they are not a strong so I place one on each side of the hole to reinforce it. Look for the stronger fiber ones. Depending on the tape you're using if at all you may not need hole reinforcing washers. I like the added strength in these high force prone to being ripped areas so I add them. Wt penalty is less than 3 grams for 6 holes to be reinforced both sides.


From the places I have the small reinforced holes I add about 6-9" of 1.2 mm (super light wt) elasticized bungee that stretch to double their cut length that stretch out to the included mitten hooks on the inside corners of the MLD SoloMid and Duomid. The bungee allows some range of play for different set up dimensions(floor space, height, etc). If your tarps, mids, etc don't have interior lower edge attachment pts for the bungee you can attache to the tarp/tent stakes. BUT, if you do that make sure water doesn't run down it into the bathtub groundsheet. One way is simply too make sure the bungee is angled down and away from the top edge of the bathtub.

I like erecting mids with the ground edge 3" or off the ground to allow for greater airflow. I sometimes play with designs that vary the bathtub edge height 2-5" depending on what height I think needed to make it all work for me.

Another additional design feature using polyolefin that addresses the edge holding up concern is by creating a strong top edge around the entire perimeter by making a small 1" or less folded hem using the double sided tape included in window film kits, like Duck Brand, in unison with the folded corner as shown above. A good alternative that can possibly be lighter wt is using 1/4- 3/8" wide TUCK TAPE which is great for outside uses and has never failed despite being drenched and immersed in water. It comes out of Canada. I've seen some people use painters's or masking tape which is too heavy IMHO, not sticky enough, and prone to failure once wet, damp, or overly cold. Too much or too heavy a tape or too wide a hem used on the top hem of the bathtub floor and it gets material weighted down unnecessarily so. It's mostly the bungee that holds up the top edge.


Regardless of the design making bathtub floors out of polycro results in a UL/SUL TLC required groundsheet. They don't last forever and they will not function well if care isn't taken in the design and use.


For larger ground sheets for larger floor area shelters where the approach is a one stop polycro one and not everyone is on same extra TLC needed page that might use the shelter(children, dog, etc) I can recognize problems concerning concerning durability, holes, tears, dislodging of the polycro ground sheet, slipperiness, etc. Add really wet conditions, some lack of site prep(sand spurs/cockle spurs/manzanita spurs, sweetgum or sycamore tree fruit, a tiny pine cone, pine tree sticks, tree sap, sharp pebbles, bulky sometimes hard nodes of various ornamental turf grasses etc), mud, etc and polycro can become just more crap needed to be hauled out.

I assume you fold the poly into bath tub floor then punch holes for corner tie outs and simply fold up as bath tub when packing up...


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[rocketsocks]

I've heard that particular "fold" called a military bend as it resembles the foot end of a neatly dressed bed you could bounce a quarter on...or else!

[Dogwood]

I assume you fold the poly into bath tub floor then punch holes for corner tie outs and simply fold up as bath tub when packing up...


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You got it. Poly on the bottom side sometimes is damp so I may air it out a few mins before packing it up. Poly, even bathtub polycros, can be very compacted. It goes right in the stuff sack with either the Duo or SoloMid. Just don't puncture it or it can shred outward from the puncture. It's definitely not ripstop. Repair any small rips along edges especially promptly with duct tape.

[saltysack]

You got it. Poly on the bottom side sometimes is damp so I may air it out a few mins before packing it up. Poly, even bathtub polycros, can be very compacted. It goes right in the stuff sack with either the Duo or SoloMid. Just don't puncture it or it can shred outward from the puncture. It's definitely not ripstop. Repair any small rips along edges especially promptly with duct tape.

Thx...I see GG calls there's polycro but Mld doesn't? Assume same....


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[MuddyWaters]

I recall theres more than one wt of the polycro
Mine have been from GG, worked fine. Dont know which it is

Can mail order the frost king ? w indow insul kit on amazon

Was a thread on bpl once discussing relative merits of different ones. I dont remember anything about it except some were heavier

[saltysack]

I recall theres more than one wt of the polycro
Mine have been from GG, worked fine. Dont know which it is

Can mail order the frost king ? w indow insul kit on amazon

Was a thread on bpl once discussing relative merits of different ones. I dont remember anything about it except some were heavier

Great thx....looks like indoor film is lighter weight than outdoor....probably just order from GG....thx


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[Dogwood]

Thx...I see GG calls there's polycro but Mld doesn't? Assume same....

I suspect that may be because MLD is sourcing their material based on being used in the food industry with the idea that it is more food safe that PVC plastics. I'd like Ron to spec the thickness in mils although he does offer .5 oz/sq yd which I'm estimating is a .7 mil thick material. I haven't bought any from MLD to make any valid personal comparisons though.

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I recall theres more than one wt of the polycro
Mine have been from GG, worked fine. Dont know which it is

Can mail order the frost king ? w indow insul kit on amazon

Was a thread on bpl once discussing relative merits of different ones. I dont remember anything about it except some were heavier

Definitely. I've noted various thicknesses of window film from .6 mils to 1.5 mils similar to all manner of plastic thicknesses that range from the flimsiest window film to corrugated rigid clear plastic roofing. I find these polycro, and Dyneema Composite(Cuben Fiber), Tyvek, Xpac, and silny comparisons and discussions always problematic when the wts and versions aren't explicitly noted.

[Dogwood]

Just to note window film is just a possible use for polycro or polyethylene materials. I've seen 4 - 6 mil polyethylene used for window film material which could be called....umm, window film. So window film is not an absolute statement of thickness or wt of material although the most common thickness I've generally seen advertised as window film is .7 or .75 mils.

[saltysack]

I've been a polycro proponent for years, and so far, the only thing I've used for my zpacks tent floor (the solo+, with mesh floor).

But talking to a triple crowner recently (I met him on the Long Trail this September), he swears by 1443R Tyvek. Lighter than the Tyvek a lot of folks use, and makes zero noise, so I bought 3 meters of it, and cut it into a bath tub floor for my zpacks, and will try it out.

Here's the link:

https://www.amazon.com/Kitemaking-Material-Durable-Lightweight-Breathable/dp/B00G28H9QW/ref=pd_lpo_21_bs_t_2?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=1Q6WR8RDTGQ2HF8F9WS5

My polycro floor was 2 ounces, the 1443 Tyvek floor is just over twice that, basically the same as the cuben, around 4.5 ounces. We'll see how I like it, probably go back to polycro though, because that has always worked fine.

What are your thoughts of the lighter wt tyvek? Had a chance to use it yet or fold into bathtub floor? I'm leaning towards trying that as seems more durable as others said with a dog. Than poly....

Poly $8.00
Kite making tyvek $16.00
Cuben $80.. and up....


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[swisscross]

I use 1443r kite tyvek as a ground sheet.
Highly water resistant but not waterproof.

Soft to the touch and no crinkle sound.
I dyed mine. White is bright.

[saltysack]

I use 1443r kite tyvek as a ground sheet.
Highly water resistant but not waterproof.

Soft to the touch and no crinkle sound.
I dyed mine. White is bright.

You had any issues with water getting through it? I plan to use alone not as a footprint for tent. Thinking I'll try it as not sure poly will hold up with dog.


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[saltysack]

thread drift warning:

Curious what precautions are need in alligator country. Seems like they would be hard to scare off.

I have heard stories of golfers praying they don't get drug into a lake or canal. It would be pretty scary to wake up with a 10'er outside your tent, cuben fiber or otherwise

Here's one a friends dad got few seasons back....also an area where I paddle and camp. Don't think any tent would help....http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161231/da646cb45d93c7ac59f6747771571f39.png


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[rocketsocks]

thread drift warning:

Curious what precautions are need in alligator country. Seems like they would be hard to scare off.

I have heard stories of golfers praying they don't get drug into a lake or canal. It would be pretty scary to wake up with a 10'er outside your tent, cuben fiber or otherwisetheres not a anti virus program alive that can help you in gaitor country, if the gaitor wants you and your times up, you're beat...I mean bit. :D

[saltysack]

Don't know is this would work with polycryo.

Mine was the stiffer housewrap tyvek. The one in my pic is kinda heavy at 7.5oz, but it is extremely functional and durable. Especially on packed snow it is nice to have stuff not skittering around and out the edges of the tent at night.

I have a Zpacks twin ground sheet that I might try to adapt to the Duomid. It is about half the weight of the Tyvek and I got a good deal on it. It has got that long, hex shape to it so I'll likely have to get creative when I finally gather the motivation to tackle that job.

What stakes did you find that held best in the corners of the mid? I forgot to order the 9" nails when ordered it..I'll try with my shepherd hooks first but thought corners might do better with more beefy stake...just curious and I'm mainly in SE...


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[cmoulder]

I've been using Ground hogs with this one when there's no snow cover. It is mostly my winter tent, however, and when there's snow cover I use some found sticks as deadmen and bury them in the snow.

[saltysack]

I've been using Ground hogs with this one when there's no snow cover. It is mostly my winter tent, however, and when there's snow cover I use some found sticks as deadmen and bury them in the snow.

Thx


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[G-FOURce]

I use 1443r kite tyvek as a ground sheet.
Highly water resistant but not waterproof.

Soft to the touch and no crinkle sound.
I dyed mine. White is bright.

I use 1443R for all my footprints but never even thought to dye it... thats brilliant!

[Miguelon]

My plan was to emulate your system but use shock cord to connect polycro to tarp stakes....
Thanks for your post....

Miguelon

I like very thin poly for weight; it's tougher than it seems.

I put a dab of tape in each corner, doubled over so it grabs on each side of the corner. Then I paper-punch a hole through the tape. I then use shepherd hook stakes to hold each corner down, not tight but with a little slack. First thing I do in camp.

Makes it easy to lay down on it, both directions, maybe move the setup around in various spots to make sure I'm not going to be trying to sleep head downhill or rolling side to side. This would be a major PITA when the flimsy stuff blows around in the wind. The tape is felt-pen-marked so I know which side is "clean" and up.

This stable clean platform is nice to have to lay stuff on when I'm unpacking and packing up next morning. As I'm setting up I may remove the corner stakes for other purposes once there is weight on the sheet; if I'm cowboying that night I just leave the stakes in. Over time I have evolved to using four of those very thin titanium shepherd hook stakes for this purpose and leaving them in, those four stakes serving double duty as my extra "batten down" stakes for tent or tarp in a major storm.

The sheet usually lasts a very long time; a corner will tear or stretch out more often and require re-taping, maybe every 20-30 nights. Since the plastic is so light I cut it over-sized and spray all around the perimeter, top & bottom, with permethrin since I cowboy so often. The permethrin needs to be re-applied every 15+ nights or so because it doesn't "take" to the plastic as it does to fabric.

[Venchka]

I used a ground sheet for the first time in Colorado. 2 mil painters drop cloth from Ace Hardware. I'm pretty sure I can get 4 4'x8' pieces. The piece I used for 2 weeks is fine. Plenty of use left in it. I didn't weigh it. I could weigh it if you care.
Wayne

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So I got bored. I weighed my ground sheet.
2 mil plastic sheet. Nominally 4' x 8'.
3.62 ounces / 103 grams. Approximately $2.50 - $3.00 each from a larger piece of plastic.
Not bad for an impulse buy at the hardware store.
Wayne

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One more time. I spend money in the hope of saving a gram or an ounce.
But NO!
This discussion is another case in point.
"I love POLYCRYO. It's lighter than Tyvek."
Maybe. Unfortunately, nobody specified the thickness of said polycryo (a.k.a. cross-linked polyolefin or heat shrink film).
a couple years ago I ran across a thread at BackpackingLight where a person gave detailed information about a 1.5 mil window film at Ace Hardware. Alas, the particular product mentioned had disappeared from Ace's online inventory. The only products listed at the time were in the range of 0.6 to 0.75 mil. That seemed awfully thin.
Last week the idea resurfaced in my brain and I went to Ace Hardware online. SHAZAM! There it was. 1.5 mil window film. Item #59903. 84" x 110" - 64 sq. ft. $9.99. Free Shipping to store. DONE!
http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1286193
I collected the Window Film this afternoon. The first thing I did was to open the package and weigh the new polycryo sheet.
Alas, there is no joy in Mudville or East Texas. 64 sq. ft. = 7.78 ounces or 0.1215625 ounces per square foot.
So, for another $10 I saved a whopping 3.62 - 3.4 = 0.21625 ounces. Comparing the painters plastic vs. window film.
So, in the future I shall take all incomplete weight reports with a grain of salt. Apparently all of the reports of light weight film are referring to the 0.6-0.75 material.
By the way, Gossamer Gear makes no mention of the thickness or weight of their heat shrink film, a.k.a. Polycryo. I just checked.
The good news: I now own a lifetime supply of 1.5 & 2.0 mil groundsheet material.
I shall never again spend money to save weight unless the weight saving equals or exceeds 1 pound verified by my own eyes on my own scale.
Cheers!
Wayne

[swisscross]

I use 1443R for all my footprints but never even thought to dye it... thats brilliant!

Standard rit dye will not work.
You need to use Jacquard's iDye Poly.
I actually dyed mine because I bought a LHG camo Solong and the white just looked out of place.

[orthofingers]

This is just a general comment about Tyvek house wrap. Many people recommend washing it to quiet it down a bit. In my experience, it will get softer, more supple and less noisy by just using it for a couple of nights. Also, there are lots of other house wraps out there with different vapor permeability numbers. I've only used tyvek but if anyone has used others, I'd like to hear their experiences.

[blw2]

I used a Tyvek sheet under my Lunar Solo on a long AT section hike last June/July. The Lunar Solo has a bathtub floor but I wanted the extra protection against the wet ground. It worked very well. Weighs almost nothing and, in the wind, I used four titanium pins to hold it down while I pitched my tent on top of it. Important to void having the Tyvek stick out from under the tent or it just channels rain water right under your floor.

I've always used groundsheets under my tents for the same reasons.
Have been considering rounding up some tyvek or even a cuben fiber since my current nylon is about worn out and I am gearing up with better and lighter stuff.
I read something a while back, this fellow made a pretty good case for putting the poly groundcloth INSIDE a tent floor rather than under it, for the purposes of waterproofing and staying dry.
Personally though, i like it under so that the condensation and dirt in the AM is on the ground cloth and the tent floor is dryer, and also as a layer of protection against abrasion

[oldwetherman]

I'm not a hanger....so I beg forgiveness if I kind of hijack this thread....but I came across an item a few weeks ago on another backpacking website .....that caught my attention. It's sold by Gossamer gear and it's called a Thin light foam pad. I bought one to try as a pad under the inflatable sleep pad I use in my tent or in a shelter. It's a 1/8 inch piece of "evazote" foam pad. It weighs next to nothing (2.4oz for a 19x59 inch piece). I was intrigued by the reviews I read about it because it's not slippery. I've tried Tyvek and polycro but if my tent is even on a slight incline everything slides. I've tried the silicon dots and strips without much success. I've used this pad twice on my silnylon tent floor intentionally set on uneven terrain and I don't slide. Another benefit is that it adds some insulation value when it's cold. The downside is that it's bulky. Gossamer gear also has a 1/4 inch pad of the same stuff as an under pad for hangers.

[Elaikases]

"By the way, Gossamer Gear makes no mention of the thickness or weight of their heat shrink film, a.k.a. Polycryo. I just checked."

When I looked it was .7 mil.

[Elaikases]

http://gossamergear.com/polycryo-tent-ground-sheets-protection.html

Under additional information:

SpecsMEDIUM
Weight 1.6 oz. (46 g.) each
Size 40 x 96 in. (102 x 244 cm.) each (75 gauge / .75 mil material)
Materials Multilayer, cross-linked polyolefin film
Quantity Shipped as a 2-pack

LARGE
Weight 3.65 oz. ( 104 g.) each
Size 72 x 96 in. (183 x 244 cm.) each (100 gauge / 1.0 mil material)
Materials Multilayer, cross-linked polyolefin film
Quantity Shipped as a 1-pack

[Elaikases]

For Mylar film: https://www.amazon.com/Emergency-Mylar-Thermal-Blankets-Pack/dp/B00WH7AE9Q

[colorado_rob]

http://gossamergear.com/polycryo-tent-ground-sheets-protection.html

Under additional information:

SpecsMEDIUM
Weight 1.6 oz. (46 g.) each
Size 40 x 96 in. (102 x 244 cm.) each (75 gauge / .75 mil material)
Materials Multilayer, cross-linked polyolefin film
Quantity Shipped as a 2-pack
This is consistent with my home made zpacks solo+ groundsheet, using 1 medium GG PC sheet, trimmed a bit, but with tie-outs at six places, total weight right at 2.0 ounces. I made a virtually identical piece, maybe slightly larger, out of 1443R Tyvek, which is lighter than HD builders Tyvek, total weight = 4.5 ounces including its set of tie outs. The GG PC is less than half the weight. One of these home made jobs last me roughly half an AT, call it 40-50 nights. I use it under my mat in shelters when not tenting.

[saltysack]

This is consistent with my home made zpacks solo+ groundsheet, using 1 medium GG PC sheet, trimmed a bit, but with tie-outs at six places, total weight right at 2.0 ounces. I made a virtually identical piece, maybe slightly larger, out of 1443R Tyvek, which is lighter than HD builders Tyvek, total weight = 4.5 ounces including its set of tie outs. The GG PC is less than half the weight. One of these home made jobs last me roughly half an AT, call it 40-50 nights. I use it under my mat in shelters when not tenting.

I recently bought some 1443r...tried the bath tub configuration but it's lil flimsy..which did you find better tying out or staking? You like the poly better?


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[colorado_rob]

I recently bought some 1443r...tried the bath tub configuration but it's lil flimsy..which did you find better tying out or staking? You like the poly better?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalkin zpacks solo, ground sheet is inside tent over mesh, clipped to sides, so flimsy doesn't matter. I'm actually using the tyvek sheet for first time, 5 days in grand canyon, starting tomorrow. I want to see how it works compared to polycro, whether it's worth extra ounces. I'll report back next Wednesday.

Supposed to get down to zero here on south rim tonight! Good thing I have my +20 degree bag...

[saltysack]

in zpacks solo, ground sheet is inside tent over mesh, clipped to sides, so flimsy doesn't matter. I'm actually using the tyvek sheet for first time, 5 days in grand canyon, starting tomorrow. I want to see how it works compared to polycro, whether it's worth extra ounces. I'll report back next Wednesday.

Supposed to get down to zero here on south rim tonight! Good thing I have my +20 degree bag...

Your a colorad u should survive! I'd freeze my a$$ off!


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