View Full Version : What would you do?
Shutterbug
02-17-2017, 19:35
Yesterday, my wife and I were hiking in a dry wash near the Santa Rita Mountains in Arizona. It has not rained for a couple of weeks, so the sand in the wash is really dry. Footprints in dry sand don't hold their shape very long, so if you see distinct footprints, you know they have not been there very long.
We came across these prints. I didn't think to put a dollar bill beside them to provide perspective, but they were large. Earlier in the week, we saw a Bobcat and examined it's tracks. The prints are at least 3 times as large as the Bobcat tracks. It is almost certain that they were made by a cougar.
What would you have done?
rocketsocks
02-17-2017, 19:39
Pee'd on em.
johnnybgood
02-17-2017, 20:07
Begin quickly putting my head on a swivel.
Maineiac64
02-17-2017, 20:18
I have hiked in those same mountains and in other parts of Arizona. We always were pretty careful when walking under overhangs or places like that. I never saw a lion but I know they were there.
Lone Wolf
02-17-2017, 20:23
Yesterday, my wife and I were hiking in a dry wash near the Santa Rita Mountains in Arizona. It has not rained for a couple of weeks, so the sand in the wash is really dry. Footprints in dry sand don't hold their shape very long, so if you see distinct footprints, you know they have not been there very long.
We came across these prints. I didn't think to put a dollar bill beside them to provide perspective, but they were large. Earlier in the week, we saw a Bobcat and examined it's tracks. The prints are at least 3 times as large as the Bobcat tracks. It is almost certain that they were made by a cougar.
What would you have done?
nothing. just keep walkin'. you chose to go in a non-human area
MuddyWaters
02-17-2017, 20:28
Theres at least one jaguar known to hang out in Arizona
They used to be indigenous to southeastern US just 150 yrs ago, but presence of man extirpated them. One of the last, about 9 ft long nose-tail was shot in south Louisiana in 1870s. Early settlers called them the american tygre. One reason few slaves ran away is they were petrified of the big cats in the swamps and forests.
They are in the mountains of mexico still.
"El Jefe" lives in the Santa Rita mountains......He is well known. Theres been reports of another too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Jefe_(jaguar)
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/12/El-jefe-jaguar-fws1.jpg
I'm good with tracks, and I can hardly tell what those are. Could be a mountain lion. Could be a big dog or coyote. Could be el Jefe. Next time you take a picture of a track, I'd suggest you get up close to the best one you can see, and put a coin or something next to it so we can gauge the size.
I've seen fresh mountain lion tracks numerous times, and I've never changed my behavior as a result. Even if it was a mountain lion and freshly made, I would suggest you continue enjoying your hike and hope you get a glimpse of the critter. Mountain lion attacks are vanishingly rare. From your photo, it looks like daylight, and you were with your wife. It would be exceptionally unusual for an attack in that situation. They are evening/early morning hunters, mostly, and they're more likely to attack a solo hiker/biker than a group.
If you're really afraid of mountain lions, you should probably stop hiking anywhere in the West. They are everywhere. Some people say that if you have hiked enough out west, a mountain lion has seen you, even if you haven't seen one yourself.
Looking more closely at the photo now, I think I see claws. Mountain lion tracks (like all cats) don't show claws. I'm guessing dog or coyote.
Shutterbug
02-17-2017, 21:23
Looking more closely at the photo now, I think I see claws. Mountain lion tracks (like all cats) don't show claws. I'm guessing dog or coyote.
At the time, I didn't think to put something next to the tracks to give perspective. There are always coyote tracks in the area. These are much too large to be coyote tracks. I am confident that they are cat tracks. I compared them to Bobcat tracks I was earlier in the week. I knew they were Bobcat tracks because I saw the Bobcat. These were just like the Bobcat tracks except they were 3 times larger.
fiddlehead
02-17-2017, 21:41
If you suspect mountain lion, here's what I always remember:
They will not attack unless they are quite sure they will win: This means, if you are big, or wearing a pack, they probably won't attack you.
If you are small and jogging, possibly.
They also go after faster moving animals, rather than slower
They are hard to see because they don't want to be seen. So if they are around, you probably won't know it.
So, no sense in getting too worried about it (unless you are a small woman jogger or kid moving fast, or last in line).
The few I have seen while hiking, were either at dusk, nighttime, or once in the middle of the day when a car camper had a dog who was running around. The lion was about to attack the dog from a small cliff when I came around a corner and scared it away. It disappeared from sight in no time, and was so big and strong looking that I was scared. (but realized it's goal)
If you ever are attacked, consensus seems to be to fight back. They don't want to lose a fight and will not continue one that is close to fair, or one where they might get hurt.
Start a list of life experiences that I missed out on?
Shutterbug
02-17-2017, 21:46
i don't fear cougars. Over the years, I have seen several. They are beautiful animals.
When my wife and I saw these tracks, we got our camera ready and attempted to follow the tracks. Unfortunately, they went into some heavy brush and we did not actually see the animal.
We see a variety of wild animals in the Santa Rita Mountains. The only ones that frighten me are the killer bees -- http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2321435/Mountaineer-dead-hanging-cliff-climbing-gear-covered-BEE-STINGS--loyal-dog.html
Maineiac64
02-17-2017, 21:50
Anish Heather Anderson said she saw four mountain lions on her PCT thru hike but she hiked a lot in the dark with early starts and late stops.
TexasBob
02-17-2017, 22:08
We where on vacation in British Columbia in Whistler and I asked a number of the locals about bears which where common there. Everyone I asked had a bear encounter story and seemed relatively nonchalant about the bears. No big deal to them. Cougars where a different story. Several different people told me they had been stalked by a cougar while hiking, cross country skiing and snowmobiling and they felt very lucky to not have been attacked.
Shutterbug
02-18-2017, 00:29
We where on vacation in British Columbia in Whistler and I asked a number of the locals about bears which where common there. Everyone I asked had a bear encounter story and seemed relatively nonchalant about the bears. No big deal to them. Cougars where a different story. Several different people told me they had been stalked by a cougar while hiking, cross country skiing and snowmobiling and they felt very lucky to not have been attacked.
Several years ago, my wife and I were hiking in Roxborough State Park near Denver when we were followed by a cougar. He didn't threaten us, but he kept showing up on the top of big rocks along our hiking trail. I got some pictures, but have misplaced them.
Looking more closely at the photo now, I think I see claws. Mountain lion tracks (like all cats) don't show claws. I'm guessing dog or coyote. Exactly what I thought as soon as I saw them.
peakbagger
02-18-2017, 08:05
When doing the PCT near Mt Adams we camped at a established horse camp in mid September after the outfitters had cleared out. We camped near a brook. We pumped water out of one spot in the evening and then pumped the next morning. In the morning there was a clear set of fresh cougar tracks where we had pumped the night before.
Your track
38264
Identifying a dog (canid) track
38265
Identifying a Cougar track
38266
Side by side
38267
If I was forced to bet, I would stick with a canid of some sort.
MuddyWaters
02-18-2017, 08:36
Cat attacks are rare
They wont attack unless they can see neck of prey, thats what they go for, and a pack may prevent that. As a predator, they must be efficient and not waste energy or get injured in attempting to bring down large prey.
Shutterbug
02-18-2017, 10:43
Your track
38264
Identifying a dog (canid) track
38265
Identifying a Cougar track
38266
Side by side
38267
If I was forced to bet, I would stick with a canid of some sort.
You are not forced to bet, and I won't argue the point, but I also have a lot of experience with tracks. The best way to identify tracks is to actually see the animal. If you don't see the animal, then look for the scat. In this case I didn't see the animal and it didn't leave any scat where I could see it.
I am very familiar with the animals in this area. These tracks were too large to be coyote tracks. There is a possibility they could be dog tracks, but the quail season ended last week. The tracks were too fresh to have been a week old and it would be very unlikely for a big dog to have been out in the desert after hunting season closed. There were no parallel human tracks, so it wasn't a dog on a leash.
A year ago, we saw a cougar in this same wash. These tracks look very much like the tracks of the cougar we saw.
rocketsocks
02-18-2017, 15:34
Wear your sunglasses backwards behind your head, that's what some tribes do in India, well they wear masks anyway...but I'd still pee on em.
Feral Bill
02-18-2017, 16:27
Cougars are common around here, if rarely seen, even in the city. I'd keep walking and hope to get a glimpse.
I would just be more aware of my surroundings...more than fear, I'd want to be lucky enough to see one. But I'd also try to avoid putting myself in a position where I might corner one or otherwise put it in a position where it might feel threatened...stay away from overhangs/caves or places it would be likely to hide.