View Full Version : Martin's Permethrin
lilgodwin
02-27-2017, 11:27
I've got the 1QT 10% stuff, went through the instructions and it only applies to pets, livestock, and lawns.
So, what's the deal. Better to spray or soak? Been reading and much of the forums suggest approximately 1:19 dilution, bringing it to .5%. Let all my clothes, minus undies, soak for an hour then air dry?
I've heard about ironing while still somewhat damp to help set it in the fabric real good. Thoughts?
Manual days it's only a minor eye irritant, so it's ok to handle, just wash up afterward? Or should I be really cautious, stirring with a stick if I'm soaking them, and using gloves to put them out on a clothesline.
Leaving in less than 2 weeks!
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wayside_mn
02-27-2017, 11:42
I make my solution a bit stronger , and wear rubber gloves. I dry them on the clothes line and they tend to last a couple months. I do 2 treatments during the Minnesota tick and skeeter season. And yes, i do every layer. I've never dunked a hammock though. I reserve some for a spray bottle and soak my hanging hammock and net. Works great!
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I make mine stronger also. 1 to 11.5 (10% Permethrin to water) yields a 0.8% solution, consistent with US military protocol. You may as well be careful with it, but the shampoo they sell to treat head lice has an even stronger concentration, 1%, and people obviously come into direct contact with that. I soak thoroughly and then let dry, preferably flat.
Rex Clifton
02-27-2017, 17:04
I used and it left a bad odor on my clothes, especially when I perspired. The fact is, this stuff is for outdoor (gardening) use and probably has some sort of petroleum base. The smell eventually went away but it took a long time. In any case, I threw out the Martin's and paid the extra $$$ for the Sawyer spray.
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swisscross
02-27-2017, 17:27
I used and it left a bad odor on my clothes, especially when I perspired. The fact is, this stuff is for outdoor (gardening) use and probably has some sort of petroleum base. The smell eventually went away but it took a long time. In any case, I threw out the Martin's and paid the extra $$$ for the Sawyer spray.
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There are both water base and petroleum base. Sounds like you purchased the petro version and yes it stinks.
The sawyer stuff is pretty scentless after it dries. Martins takes a couple days for the smell to go away. It still works as well as sawyers and is much cheaper. I soak mine in a tub and let it dry in the basement out of the sunlight, since sunlight destroys it eventually. Permethrin breaks down in direct sunlight.
the petroleum based permethrin is sprayed in barns and the oils helps it stick to walls and floors.
Rain Man
02-27-2017, 20:25
I use the water-based Martins, diluted to .5%. I soak everything I can, including my hammock, for at least 2 hours, usually 4 hours or more, often over-night. Then dry hanging in my garage with a fan on. Sunlight isn't good for Permethrin, so I do not hang on outdoors clothesline.
I do wring-out all the liquid I can before hanging, and squeeze in a towel wrap, so the clothes/gear is damp but not dripping.
I spray my pack and shoes.
Here's a link to a video by Sawyer itself (post #16)--
https://whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/109815-Permethrin-Dilution
saltysack
02-27-2017, 20:28
I make mine stronger also. 1 to 11.5 (10% Permethrin to water) yields a 0.8% solution, consistent with US military protocol. You may as well be careful with it, but the shampoo they sell to treat head lice has an even stronger concentration, 1%, and people obviously come into direct contact with that. I soak thoroughly and then let dry, preferably flat.
That shampoo is very dangerous! A friend of ours daughter died from using it....
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Rex Clifton
02-27-2017, 22:22
There are both water base and petroleum base. Sounds like you purchased the petro version and yes it stinks.
How do you tell one from the other?
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I use the Hi-Yield brand. It starts at something like 38%. You get it from a farm/feed store, or Amazon. Its a brown bottle with a yellow label. They give you instructions on how to mix the .5% emulsion (I think it's 2 ounces in a gallon of water). I dunk my clothes and then hang them outside until dry, usually a few hours in the summer for synthetics is plenty. The smell evaporates when the clothes are dry. I've never had an issue with the smell coming back when sweating or anything.
ScareBear
02-28-2017, 08:36
That shampoo is very dangerous! A friend of ours daughter died from using it....
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Not from permethrin poisoning...possibly an allergic reaction to other ingredients? It takes a whopping amount of pure permethrin INGESTED to cause death in a human....something in excess of 5g/kg of weight...that's....a pound of pure permethrin for a 200 pound person....pure permethrin...
Permethrin does faster damage to the body when inhaled, but that is damage to the lungs, primarily...
https://www.nap.edu/read/9274/chapter/6#55
hyperhiker
02-28-2017, 10:45
I use this: https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B003IMO3I2/ref=sxr_rr_xsim1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_p=2795440402&pd_rd_wg=SULk4&pf_rd_r=TQZVES8B2R5FMC5H5GJS&pf_rd_s=desktop-rhs-carousels&pf_rd_t=301&pd_rd_i=B003IMO3I2&pd_rd_w=VrP0D&pf_rd_i=permethrin&pd_rd_r=Q31H2Q6K5HJ9V9VW4ED0&ie=UTF8&qid=1488293046&sr=1
saltysack
02-28-2017, 10:51
Not from permethrin poisoning...possibly an allergic reaction to other ingredients? It takes a whopping amount of pure permethrin INGESTED to cause death in a human....something in excess of 5g/kg of weight...that's....a pound of pure permethrin for a 200 pound person....pure permethrin...
Permethrin does faster damage to the body when inhaled, but that is damage to the lungs, primarily...
https://www.nap.edu/read/9274/chapter/6#55
Not permethrin but the active ingredients in the lice shampoo...it was used twice in a week which caused multiple seizures and death.....
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This has been educational--thank you.
swisscross
02-28-2017, 11:16
Not permethrin but the active ingredients in the lice shampoo...it was used twice in a week which caused multiple seizures and death.....
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That is so sad.
I have epilepsy and am usually very concerned with what I put into my body.
Did not until I was given Phenergan, oh my...multiple back to back grand mal seizures. So violent I actually broke three vertebrae. (I was in my 20's at the time, first seizure at the age of 13)
My girls had lice last year and we used the shampoos. I even used a deterrent shampoo until we knew we had them eradicated.
I think I have some research to do.
Thanks Salty!
I too have read several publications regarding permethrin. I did come across a few with references of seizures and refused to use it for years until a friend got lyme. I tried in in small amounts and did not have any adverse affects. Increased the percentage and was still fine. I am now a dunker of my families clothing for outdoor adventures.
lilgodwin
03-08-2017, 12:59
Just to verify, I should be using this whole 1 quart of 10% pemethrin with only about 15 quarts of water for my clothes? There's no going back once I dump the whole thing.
I only ask because the instructions for treating livestock suggests much lower doses. (Ie. 8oz of 10% Permethrin in 12.5 GALLONS of water). The differences are so great, I just wanted to make sure one last time! I know, there's a difference in livestock and clothes.
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TexasBob
03-08-2017, 22:37
Just to verify, I should be using this whole 1 quart of 10% pemethrin with only about 15 quarts of water for my clothes? There's no going back once I dump the whole thing.
I only ask because the instructions for treating livestock suggests much lower doses. (Ie. 8oz of 10% Permethrin in 12.5 GALLONS of water). The differences are so great, I just wanted to make sure one last time! I know, there's a difference in livestock and clothes.
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Are you starting in Georgia? Are treating your clothes to help prevent Lyme's disease? Consider sending your clothes to insectashield for a safe and reliable permethrin treatment, you should have them back in two weeks or less and if you are leaving sooner than that then have your treated clothes mail dropped to you. Lyme's is endemic from northern North Carolina onward and you will have your treated clothes long before that. There is a reason that the product you are using is not labeled for use on clothing. If you are concerned about Lyme's why use something that may or may not work as intended or have unintended side effects?
Sarcasm the elf
03-08-2017, 23:08
Are you starting in Georgia? Are treating your clothes to help prevent Lyme's disease? Consider sending your clothes to insectashield for a safe and reliable permethrin treatment, you should have them back in two weeks or less and if you are leaving sooner than that then have your treated clothes mail dropped to you. Lyme's is endemic from northern North Carolina onward and you will have your treated clothes long before that. There is a reason that the product you are using is not labeled for use on clothing. If you are concerned about Lyme's why use something that may or may not work as intended or have unintended side effects?
I'll second insectshield's professional treatment. Unlike self applied solutions that only last a few washings, insectshield's process reportedly lasts 70 washings which is the average life of a garment.
http://www.insectshield.com/mobile/Product.aspx?ProductId=338