View Full Version : tent or no tent?
Timinator
03-13-2017, 13:55
I'm looking to reduce weight in my pack, my usual gear is a bit overkill for the AT. Since the AT is well marked and what I consider to be the kiddy pool of the big trails I'm ditching as much stuff as I can.
I'm doing away with gps, cellphone, etc.
I'd like to ditch my fancy 3 lb boots for trail runners as well but I've never once got blisters with my boot/sock combination even when they were waterlogged. I don't think I'm willing to mess with success in this area.
The last thing I'd like to ditch is the tent. It's a 5 lb 4 season 1 man tent, and while it's really nice in diverse weather, I'm in a struggle to justify the weight. The pack feels much lighter without it.
I often just throw down my sleeping pad/bag wherever anyway and just sleep in the open, the bag is heavily weather resistant and I've slept comfortably in all manner of conditions this way.
I know the environment on the AT will probably make this an annoying approach as a long term solution and that I should just bring the tent but I'm hoping somebody can talk me out of it.
I'm looking to reduce weight in my pack, my usual gear is a bit overkill for the AT. Since the AT is well marked and what I consider to be the kiddy pool of the big trails I'm ditching as much stuff as I can.
I'm doing away with gps, cellphone, etc.
I'd like to ditch my fancy 3 lb boots for trail runners as well but I've never once got blisters with my boot/sock combination even when they were waterlogged. I don't think I'm willing to mess with success in this area.
The last thing I'd like to ditch is the tent. It's a 5 lb 4 season 1 man tent, and while it's really nice in diverse weather, I'm in a struggle to justify the weight. The pack feels much lighter without it.
I often just throw down my sleeping pad/bag wherever anyway and just sleep in the open, the bag is heavily weather resistant and I've slept comfortably in all manner of conditions this way.
I know the environment on the AT will probably make this an annoying approach as a long term solution and that I should just bring the tent but I'm hoping somebody can talk me out of it.
i gave up carrying my tent last year after being on the cusp of doing so for a few years. i never use it unless i have to and i generally plan to not use it. many times it was just something to carry around. its been replaced with an emergency bivy. if i plan a hike where it seems the tent will be more likely necessary than not ill carry it a long. otherwise, probably not.
i'm sure at some point this is going to bite me hard and i'm going to suffer an absolutely miserable night somewhere. so be it. ive decided it's worth the risk.
MtDoraDave
03-13-2017, 14:14
If you're willing to just flop on the ground, but don't like the idea of a rainy night, buy a small tarp... There are lots available that are under a pound, priced from $10 on up to well over $100.
Right on. Go for it.
The delete key rules!
Wayne
johnnybgood
03-13-2017, 14:27
Ditch the 5lb tent for a lightweight tarp. Many options to choose from depending on your budget.
Timinator
03-13-2017, 14:35
Alright, I'll head down to REI and check out some tarps. What are the cons of tarps practically speaking other than skitos? How do they handle the rain on the AT? What are the nit pick cons of this approach?
Alright, I'll head down to REI and check out some tarps. What are the cons of tarps practically speaking other than skitos? How do they handle the rain on the AT? What are the nit pick cons of this approach?
Not to pick too many notes, but this would be one. You might not always be able to find space in a shelter. Obviously this forecast is calendar dependent. It's not quite this brutal in July.
http://www.booneweather.com/Forecast/Boone
There are tents that provide better weather & insect protection than just a light tarp and weigh a lot less than a 4 season tent and not much more than a tarp.
Wayne
Timinator
03-13-2017, 14:46
I have 0 plans to ever use a shelter honestly.
Check out MLD and other smaller manufacturers for tarps, they will have a lot more than REI. I locked into a mid-style, like the MLD solomid. No compromise at all as far as weather worthiness. And at 8oz, it is very lightweight for a shelter, or more commonly as a pillow.
I'm looking to reduce weight in my pack, my usual gear is a bit overkill for the AT. Since the AT is well marked and what I consider to be the kiddy pool of the big trails I'm ditching as much stuff as I can.
I'm doing away with gps, cellphone, etc.
I'd like to ditch my fancy 3 lb boots for trail runners as well but I've never once got blisters with my boot/sock combination even when they were waterlogged. I don't think I'm willing to mess with success in this area.
The last thing I'd like to ditch is the tent. It's a 5 lb 4 season 1 man tent, and while it's really nice in diverse weather, I'm in a struggle to justify the weight. The pack feels much lighter without it.
I often just throw down my sleeping pad/bag wherever anyway and just sleep in the open, the bag is heavily weather resistant and I've slept comfortably in all manner of conditions this way.
I know the environment on the AT will probably make this an annoying approach as a long term solution and that I should just bring the tent but I'm hoping somebody can talk me out of it.
I just got got to know what sleeping bag you have that is be heavily weather resistant enough to not need a tent.
Thom
I have 0 plans to ever use a shelter honestly.
You obviously don't know what can and is happening on the AT above 4,000 feet as I type.
You plan to bypass or have a helicopter chartered for the Smokies?
The delete key failed me again.
Wayne
gollwoods
03-13-2017, 15:33
😊
Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
You obviously don't know what can and is happening on the AT above 4,000 feet as I type.
You plan to bypass or have a helicopter chartered for the Smokies?
The delete key failed me again.
Wayne
whered did the OP ever say he was going to the smokies? seemed a much more general question. in some cases, carrying a tent is more prudent, doesn't necessarily mean that its universally a bad idea not to. it depends on a whole lot. through all of the mid atlantic states during the summer months, barring some unexpected extreme weather, you're most likely going to be fine without a tent for a night or two. basically you're risking discomfort and the chance that some freak one in a million thing happens a tent would have prevented.
Timinator
03-13-2017, 15:39
I just got got to know what sleeping bag you have that is be heavily weather resistant enough to not need a tent.
Thom I think it's this one http://www.westernmountaineering.com/sleeping-bags/microfiber-series/kodiak-mf/
You obviously don't know what can and is happening on the AT above 4,000 feet as I type.
Unless it's a flooding water I'll be fine. Snow has never bothered me while sleeping.
One Half
03-13-2017, 15:40
I would definitely ditch the 5+ lb tent. There are plenty of much lighter options. Some very cheap.
While there will likely be someone around IF you need a phone, I would still carry one. My phone, backup battery, wall charger and cords, packed in a QT freezer bag weigh only 12.66 oz/359 grams. The phone and backup battery will last at least 7 days. Today is actually day 8 and I have 61% of my battery in my phone.
The AT is very well marked and while I am going for 30 days this year, it's the first time I am contemplating NOT carrying a map and compass. I know it's unnecessary, it's just a matter of habit and safety. I have NEEDED a map exactly ONCE when backpacking on the trail and very happy I had it!
It's all clear as mud now.
All Y'all have fun.
Wayne
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Slo-go'en
03-13-2017, 16:02
it depends on what you plan to do. A weekend where your confident of the weather report or an extended trip? Not bringing a tent and not staying in shelters? That idea isn't going to last long. Attempting a thru and hit a week of rain? You'll be begging for shelter space.
You might get away with a good sized tarp, but you really need a bivy sack to go with it and then you might as well just get a tent. Sure, ditch your 5.5 pound tent, but get something a bit more reasonable.
lawrencelytle
03-13-2017, 16:04
Yes, you need a tent, or Kammock wth tarp, or at least a bivy. It would be fool hearty to go out with no backup shelter. REI has a product called Camp Dome 2 - two person for just under $100 that weighs about 4 lbs. Take a look at it.
You might also try a pair of Solomon Trail Runners. I don't own them (yet) but I've heard great things about them... light weight, no break-in time. Those with either Wright or Darn Tough socks and you'd be good to go. The rule of thumb is that every pound you can take off your shoes has the effect of taking 5 pounds off your back.
I would definitely ditch the 5+ lb tent. There are plenty of much lighter options. Some very cheap.
While there will likely be someone around IF you need a phone, I would still carry one. My phone, backup battery, wall charger and cords, packed in a QT freezer bag weigh only 12.66 oz/359 grams. The phone and backup battery will last at least 7 days. Today is actually day 8 and I have 61% of my battery in my phone.
The AT is very well marked and while I am going for 30 days this year, it's the first time I am contemplating NOT carrying a map and compass. I know it's unnecessary, it's just a matter of habit and safety. I have NEEDED a map exactly ONCE when backpacking on the trail and very happy I had it!
bring a phone but leave a map and compass? the phone is necessary, but the map isnt?
i dont even own a cell phone. i own maps.
it depends on what you plan to do. \
yup. i doubt we've ecer agreed more.
Feral Bill
03-13-2017, 16:25
Large silnylon tarp, line, pegs, groundsheet, and bug net are less than two pounds. Nice and airy, too. Or see Lightheart Gear or others for tents at similar weight.
Ive got a haven tarp from six moon designs that, with tieouts and bug bivy, weighs a hair over two pounds. I use it most of the time and if I stay in a shelter, the bug bivy works well to keep the bugs off me, as well as the mice.
ZPacks Tents...expensive but light and work well.
ZPacks Tents...expensive but light and work well.
If you can swing the cost...I completely agree.
One Half
03-13-2017, 21:04
ZPacks Tents...expensive but light and work well.
If you can swing the cost...I completely agree.
yep. can't wait to use mine!
I really liked my Big Agnes Copper Spur UL1 on the trail last year, and it weighs less than half of what your 4 season tent weighs. Tarps can keep you dry, but they don't block wind or bugs.
ScareBear
03-13-2017, 21:36
PennyPincher using a Zpacks tent....
You owe me a new irony meter...my old one just exploded...
Siestita
03-13-2017, 22:02
Have you ever had hypothermia? Having some shelter available could potentially affect your survival someday. In other words, being cold and wet overnight can be dangerous, not merely unpleasant.
But, these days my 5 1/2 pound tent usually stays home home on the shelf. Instead I now usually carry one of Henry Shires' Tarptents with me, a one person Rainbow. With a tyveek ground sheet that Tarptent weighs just slightly more than two pounds. I sleep dry and mosquito free in the Tarptent, but with a pack weight that is 3 1/4 pounds less than what I previously carried.
Being somewhat "old school", I don't own a cell phone nor Do I bring any electronic devises with me while backpacking. I believe carrying weather appropriate clothing and some form of lightweight shelter is much more important. I've only rarely needed to use a map and compass in the woods, but on those occasions they've been invaluable.
bigcranky
03-13-2017, 22:14
Where do you normally hike? Is this for an AT thru-hike?
Just flopping down on the ground in a bag can work pretty well on some trails. On the AT, for a thru-hike, not so much. It's easy to have 3-4 days of solid heavy rain, and that bag will not be worth much after the first night with a couple of inches of rain. (For a weekend hike with a solid good forecast, maybe okay.)
But a 5 pound 4-season tent is way overkill. Plenty of sub-2 pound tents out there, or sub-1 pound tarps. Lots of choices, I'd look hard at the Tarptent Notch for a lightweight, 3+ season, well ventilated tent that weighs about a pound and a half and doesn't cost an arm and a leg. Or the Moment if you don't use trekking poles.
Timinator
03-13-2017, 22:22
I just realized I can take out the inner "wall" of my tent and use it essentially as a free standing tarp tent. That should cut the weight in half. I'll have to take it apart and weigh it.
ScareBear
03-13-2017, 22:42
I just realized I can take out the inner "wall" of my tent and use it essentially as a free standing tarp tent. That should cut the weight in half. I'll have to take it apart and weigh it.
My Big Agnes Fly Creek has that option built in...many tents do...
Blindwolfoncasters
03-13-2017, 23:46
I grew up in the Southern Adirondacks, which are full of mosquitoes and no-see-ums, so to sleep without bug netting anytime of year earlier than September does not compute for me. They will drive you insane. No kidding. i have noticed in my spring and fall hikes in Georgia an N.C. a rather strange lack of insects. I have yet to go there in summer, but might be doing it this year, so I'm curious as to the bug situation as I traverse N.C. on my A.T. journey. But, anyway, back to the question, I use a tent. I only sleep on the floor (like at a shelter) when I was young and passed out at a party. I prefer the ground to a shelter floor any time. I have used tarps and all manor of tents, and frankly, the new fabrics are so light, and the designs so efficient, that any weight differential is null. Tarps can give you lots more interior space, that's for sure, but you need some kind of floor to keep the crap and bugs out of your bag. Then there is the dreaded Lyme tick. I fear that little mother more than bears, more than crazy locals. With warmer winters, they are spreading like crazy. Lyme disease is no joke.
So, I would suggest a one person tent with the door on the long side, and opposing venting. Several brands out there at about 2 1/2 lbs and very little pack size. Of course, there is the zpack cuben fiber job at 19 oz! a little out of my price range though! Good Luck!
I'm looking to reduce weight in my pack, my usual gear is a bit overkill for the AT. Since the AT is well marked and what I consider to be the kiddy pool of the big trails I'm ditching as much stuff as I can.
I'm doing away with gps, cellphone, etc.
I'd like to ditch my fancy 3 lb boots for trail runners as well but I've never once got blisters with my boot/sock combination even when they were waterlogged. I don't think I'm willing to mess with success in this area.
The last thing I'd like to ditch is the tent. It's a 5 lb 4 season 1 man tent, and while it's really nice in diverse weather, I'm in a struggle to justify the weight. The pack feels much lighter without it.
I often just throw down my sleeping pad/bag wherever anyway and just sleep in the open, the bag is heavily weather resistant and I've slept comfortably in all manner of conditions this way.
I know the environment on the AT will probably make this an annoying approach as a long term solution and that I should just bring the tent but I'm hoping somebody can talk me out of it.
Granted, the AT doesn't require much in the way of navigation skills, but if it's the kiddie pool, why do you need our help deciding what shelter, if any, to carry? Please be sure to let us know when you get from one end of the kiddie pool to the other.
5lb tent is overkill. Are you attempting a thru-hike? If so, you better bring some sort of shelter with you. Have you seen the tick forecast for this year? Better get something with a bug net. I don't go into the woods without a shelter of some kind. A good tarp/bivy setup can cost as much or more than some tents.
As far as the "Kiddie Pool" comment goes, I thought it was pretty funny. The AT is logistically far easier than the PCT or CDT, so a lot of newbies seem to gravitate to it. That said, the actual hiking part can be rather challenging. Besides the rain and insects, the AT is Olympic pool caliber when it comes to elevation gain and loss. Neither the PCT nor the CDT exceed it, and they are longer trails. Surprised?
PennyPincher using a Zpacks tent....
You owe me a new irony meter...my old one just exploded...
Pinching pennies makes ZPacks gear possible. If you like that sort of stuff.
Wayne
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rocketsocks
03-14-2017, 09:08
Just bring a poncho, you'll be fine.
I believe that you should always bring some sort of shelter. That said, it does not need to be a tent or anything fancy at all. Just some sort of emergency shelter that will keep you warm and dry enough during a soaking wet rainy, snowy, sleety night. Heck, I saw a dude who carried an emergency bivy he made himself for weekend trips out of a couple trash bags taped together... he figured it would get him through a night, maybe two, of terrible weather. He wouldn't be comfortable in it, but he'd be alive, and then he would hike out the next morning to head home. And it weighed maybe 3 or 4 ounces would be my guess. Not a solution for a thru hike, but for a weekend hike it was fine.
That's really all you need, but I am a firm believer that you do need at least something like that.
ScareBear
03-14-2017, 09:24
I grew up in the Southern Adirondacks, which are full of mosquitoes and no-see-ums, so to sleep without bug netting anytime of year earlier than September does not compute for me. They will drive you insane. No kidding. i have noticed in my spring and fall hikes in Georgia an N.C. a rather strange lack of insects. I have yet to go there in summer, but might be doing it this year, so I'm curious as to the bug situation as I traverse N.C. on my A.T. journey. But, anyway, back to the question, I use a tent. I only sleep on the floor (like at a shelter) when I was young and passed out at a party. I prefer the ground to a shelter floor any time. I have used tarps and all manor of tents, and frankly, the new fabrics are so light, and the designs so efficient, that any weight differential is null. Tarps can give you lots more interior space, that's for sure, but you need some kind of floor to keep the crap and bugs out of your bag. Then there is the dreaded Lyme tick. I fear that little mother more than bears, more than crazy locals. With warmer winters, they are spreading like crazy. Lyme disease is no joke.
So, I would suggest a one person tent with the door on the long side, and opposing venting. Several brands out there at about 2 1/2 lbs and very little pack size. Of course, there is the zpack cuben fiber job at 19 oz! a little out of my price range though! Good Luck!
There are some reasonably priced tent options at or under 2 pounds for a solo. The lighter you get, the less you get. In other words, single wall single door and single vestibule are the price paid for lightest weights. There are a few freestanding double wall tents at or under 2 pounds as well, but they come in over 300 bucks. Of course, you can go with Zpacks Soloplex, a great single wall single vestibule single door tent that comes in under 16 ounces but will lighten your wallet almost 600 bucks.
Do your research. Know what you can and cannot live with. Be sure to check the INSIDE dimensions of your bug net interior...and see whether it spreads out or is constant thru the tent. I can live with front door, some only want side entry. I can't live with short heights, some can. I can't live with constant narrow tents(under 30 inches), some can. YMMV.
No need to carry a tent that heavy. Plenty of offerings much lighter (check out Tarptent).
But I'm sorry, anyone who is planning to be out more than 2-3 days (about the length of any good weather forecast) needs to be self sufficient. That means carrying a shelter. I personally use a tarp that weighs less than a pound and have weathered plenty of storms with it.
Having once experienced someone coming into a full AT shelter and DEMANDING space because he was special in that he couldn't be bothered to carry a shelter. One person, against the opinion of the majority, moved outside in the rain to set up his tent, because in his words, he didn't want to see a darwin awards death from exposure in front of him. You can imagine the hate that guy generated.
double d
03-14-2017, 11:02
Its always a great question about tents/tarps, but I like to have a tent to protect against rain-wind-insects. But tarp lovers defend their use as well. Maybe do a shake down hike using both.
Timinator
03-14-2017, 11:19
Good point about the ticks actually. I think I will use a tent, I hate pullin those buggers off.
As far as the "Kiddie Pool" comment goes, I thought it was pretty funny. The AT is logistically far easier than the PCT or CDT, so a lot of newbies seem to gravitate to it. That said, the actual hiking part can be rather challenging. Besides the rain and insects, the AT is Olympic pool caliber when it comes to elevation gain and loss. Neither the PCT nor the CDT exceed it, and they are longer trails. Surprised? I live in new england so I'm fully aware of the elevation gain of the AT. I've done plenty of hiking in the whites and other areas of new england.
I'm used to sectioning the CDT which is on another level other than elevation gain and perhaps rainfall. Generally speaking the AT is in comparison a "kiddy pool" as long as you're in shape. For the most part your always within a few miles of civilization, it's difficult to get lost, help is always around, lots of water sources, short resupplies, etc.
Good point about the ticks actually. I think I will use a tent, I hate pullin those buggers off.
I live in new england so I'm fully aware of the elevation gain of the AT. I've done plenty of hiking in the whites and other areas of new england.
I'm used to sectioning the CDT which is on another level other than elevation gain and perhaps rainfall. Generally speaking the AT is in comparison a "kiddy pool" as long as you're in shape. For the most part your always within a few miles of civilization, it's difficult to get lost, help is always around, lots of water sources, short resupplies, etc.
I completely agree with you. The AT is VERY forgiving when it comes to newbies. On the other hand, the only place I backpacked for almost 15 years before I thru-hiked the AT was in the Wind River Mountains of Wyoming, where I lived. I NEVER went more than a few miles from the trailhead without a map, compass, protractor (remnant from my Army days), GPS, and PLB. Overkill? Sure, but the consequences for mistakes and injuries were much greater, and I often went solo. It wasn't unusual to hike all day and see no one else (in parts of the Southern Winds and on the Reservation). That said, I found the actual hiking more challenging on the AT than in the Winds. The constant ups and downs of the AT required a certain mental and physical toughness if you wanted to go the distance.
I believe that you should always bring some sort of shelter. That said, it does not need to be a tent or anything fancy at all. Just some sort of emergency shelter that will keep you warm and dry enough during a soaking wet rainy, snowy, sleety night. Heck, I saw a dude who carried an emergency bivy he made himself for weekend trips out of a couple trash bags taped together... he figured it would get him through a night, maybe two, of terrible weather. He wouldn't be comfortable in it, but he'd be alive, and then he would hike out the next morning to head home. And it weighed maybe 3 or 4 ounces would be my guess. Not a solution for a thru hike, but for a weekend hike it was fine.
That's really all you need, but I am a firm believer that you do need at least something like that.
thats basically my current approach. i'm carrying a $20 survival bivy. figure during the summer at not high elevation itll get me through a night and if i need to then ill hike the 5 miles ( at most) to the nearest road and go home if thats whats in the cards.
the frequency that that event might occur does not come close to equaling how much better it is hiking without a tent, even one that only weights 2 lbs, strapped to my back that i never use.
Timinator
03-14-2017, 15:11
The idea of sleeping in a crowded shelter while hiking in the woods does not appeal to me at all sadly.
One Half
03-14-2017, 15:22
PennyPincher using a Zpacks tent....
You owe me a new irony meter...my old one just exploded...
Yep. Should really be FrugalFannie. makes more sense.
Timinator
03-14-2017, 15:53
I might actually buy a zpacks tent, and bag. How are they? I could get my base weight down to about 6-7lb with that zpacks stuff, not too shabby.
scrabbler
03-14-2017, 17:38
I might actually buy a zpacks tent, and bag. How are they? I could get my base weight down to about 6-7lb with that zpacks stuff, not too shabby.
6-7lb base weight, rocking the Zpacks shelter and bag, yet wears 3lb boots - that's gotta be a trail story there.
I might actually buy a zpacks tent, and bag. How are they? I could get my base weight down to about 6-7lb with that zpacks stuff, not too shabby.
Zpacks tents are very highly regarded as some of the best ultra light shelters you can get. I have one myself. Their bags (i'm assuming you mean backpack?) however, tend to be more criticized. Not due to construction quality but due to the fact that cuben is inherently not the greatest against abrasion. A lot of hikers have had trouble with their cuben backpacks not lasting an entire thru hike.
fastfoxengineering
03-15-2017, 08:57
Sounds like an mld poncho tarp might be of an interest to you. Something to consider if your really trying to go very light.
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Spirit Walker
03-15-2017, 11:43
Are you planning to be out for a weekend, or a thruhike? It makes a difference. You can be uncomfortable for a night or two with no problem, or you can bail if the weather gets really nasty on a weekend trip, but if you are out for months, you'll want to be able to sleep dry. On an AT thruhike, the average is one in three days has some sort of precipitation. A lot of that is fog/mist which gets under tarps and can soak you. Out west you can cowboy camp pretty easily, because it is so dry, but on the AT, even when you go to sleep on a cloudless night, you are likely to wake up soaked with dew.
fastfoxengineering
03-15-2017, 11:51
Are you planning to be out for a weekend, or a thruhike? It makes a difference. You can be uncomfortable for a night or two with no problem, or you can bail if the weather gets really nasty on a weekend trip, but if you are out for months, you'll want to be able to sleep dry. On an AT thruhike, the average is one in three days has some sort of precipitation. A lot of that is fog/mist which gets under tarps and can soak you. Out west you can cowboy camp pretty easily, because it is so dry, but on the AT, even when you go to sleep on a cloudless night, you are likely to wake up soaked with dew.
Fact. In the Northeast. Even on the most beautiful nights, you still wake up and everything is cold and damp.
I've grown to really appreciate synthetic clothing on the east coast. Still use a down quilt though.
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bigcranky
03-15-2017, 12:48
I've not seen a Zpacks sleeping bag, but we own two of their tents. Very well made and designed, and so light that if I handed you one in a stuff sack you would think I was joking.
I'm looking to reduce weight in my pack, my usual gear is a bit overkill for the AT. Since the AT is well marked and what I consider to be the kiddy pool of the big trails I'm ditching as much stuff as I can.
I'm doing away with gps, cellphone, etc.
I'd like to ditch my fancy 3 lb boots for trail runners as well but I've never once got blisters with my boot/sock combination even when they were waterlogged. I don't think I'm willing to mess with success in this area.
The last thing I'd like to ditch is the tent. It's a 5 lb 4 season 1 man tent, and while it's really nice in diverse weather, I'm in a struggle to justify the weight. The pack feels much lighter without it.
I often just throw down my sleeping pad/bag wherever anyway and just sleep in the open, the bag is heavily weather resistant and I've slept comfortably in all manner of conditions this way.
I know the environment on the AT will probably make this an annoying approach as a long term solution and that I should just bring the tent but I'm hoping somebody can talk me out of it.
Going this route without any shelter at all as a rule is being stupid light. Others may disagree.
peakbagger
03-15-2017, 13:48
My friend carried one of these https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iD3P1Gn3sCw while we sectioned and I carried a caribou bivy. Both worked for emergency shelter both had their limitations. My OR was hot and trying to get it to ventilate in the rain was close to impossible without getting wet. It had a bug net. My friends rig was the same, hard to ventilate and keep dry but he didn't have bug netting.
We tried and mostly succeeded to avoid the bubble so tent nights were pretty rare and most of the time as we were off season, we had the shelters to ourselves.
Timinator
03-15-2017, 15:06
We tried and mostly succeeded to avoid the bubble
How does one do this?