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goldielocks
04-10-2017, 13:02
What is the best type/brand to purchase to treat my clothes with Permethrin? Also - have you treated your clothes with Permethrin; how did the process go? What other measures are you taking to protect yourself from ticks and other creepy-crawlers?

soumodeler
04-10-2017, 13:04
https://smile.amazon.com/Sawyer-Products-SP657-Permethrin-Repellent/dp/B001ANQVYU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1491843853&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=sawyer+permethrin&psc=1

I have heard good things about this. I have a bottle but have yet to treat any of my clothes.

Busky2
04-10-2017, 13:20
https://smile.amazon.com/Sawyer-Products-SP657-Permethrin-Repellent/dp/B001ANQVYU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1491843853&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=sawyer+permethrin&psc=1

I have heard good things about this. I have a bottle but have yet to treat any of my clothes.

Been using it for years without failure to protect me. I treat everything but my down sleeping bag! I have used concentrate and diluted it to soak clothes in but now I just spray away and have not seen a difference.

Sarcasm the elf
04-10-2017, 13:32
I sent my clothes out to be professionally permethrin treated by a company called Insectshield. It cost about $10 per piece of clothing, but unlike home applications which have to be done every few washings, the professional treatment lasts the average lifetime of a piece of clothing (or so they claim). It was well worth it to me to have it done right once and to not have to deal with any backyard pesticide applications or chemistry experiments. Best part is that because it lasts so much longer than home applications, it can end up being cheaper than Sawyer in the long run.
https://www.insectshield.com/ISYOC.aspx

Uncle Joe
04-10-2017, 13:35
I use Sawyer. This year I tried something different and poured it into a bucket and tumbled my clothes in. Didn't go as well as I'd hoped. If you do this, do your socks last. They soak up a ton of the liquid. I ended up leaving the socks in and tumbling other garments in with the socks to try to get the excess off the socks. Others have used like gallon ziplock bags. Putting the garment inside and pouring in some Permethrin. I may try this next. Spraying is a bit cumbersome which is why I tried this method. Plus spraying will allow it to run off a bit too. I like to get good coverage. In the end, I'm still trying to find the best method besides just sending them off to be treated professionally.

RockDoc
04-10-2017, 13:45
Search function, please
We've covered this many times.

Time Zone
04-10-2017, 15:54
I sent my clothes out to be professionally permethrin treated by a company called Insectshield. It cost about $10 per piece of clothing, but unlike home applications which have to be done every few washings, the professional treatment lasts the average lifetime of a piece of clothing (or so they claim). It was well worth it to me to have it done right once and to not have to deal with any backyard pesticide applications or chemistry experiments. Best part is that because it lasts so much longer than home applications, it can end up being cheaper than Sawyer in the long run.
https://www.insectshield.com/ISYOC.aspx

I have just used them as well, and while I came to the same conclusion regarding your cost/benefit analysis ( btw they claim it lasts 70 washings) there are a couple idiosyncrasies of their service that deserve mentioning.

First, and most notable, is that every item I sent them came back with an orange paper slip that was safety-pinned to the garment. Much like what is done with laundered dress shirts, where the slip is fed through a button hole and stapled. However these slips were pinned through the fabric of the garments. Without getting into detail of my experience, suffice it to say that I would recommend that one consider only sending items that have less-than-fine weaves. Socks of course are fine, and pants often have an interior waistband where any lasting effects of safety-pinning such slips is out of view.

Second, each item came back with an Insect Shield tag sewn in, which describes the treatment (incl. EPA reg. # and the % permethrin), and amends the laundering instructions (wash separately from other clothes). For socks, the tag information was printed on the toe area, topside.

FreeGoldRush
04-10-2017, 17:56
What is the best type/brand to purchase to treat my clothes with Permethrin? Also - have you treated your clothes with Permethrin; how did the process go? What other measures are you taking to protect yourself from ticks and other creepy-crawlers?

Treat your clothes and gear. Next most important thing is to AVOiD GRASS. I cringe when it grows over a trail and I always bend over and check my legs for ticks after being forced to follow a trail through grass. Very often you will find ticks immediately after brushing up against grass.

Rex Clifton
04-10-2017, 19:04
Permetherin works great on everything but deer flies. Those things bite through anything. You can use the Sawyer but there are much cheaper alternatives. I buy the 10% concentration (on Amazon) and dilute to a .5% solution. Get the indoor/outdoor stuff since since, otherwise, there is a slight residual odor.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Traillium
04-10-2017, 20:51
I've used the Sawyer spray 0.5% Permethrin (as well as 3M Ultrathon spray). This year I got Martin's 10% Permethrin liquid, diluted it to 0.5% and soaked clothing in big ziplocks. I hung the clothing outside in shade for several days. The Martin's has a slight oily smell that mostly dissipates over a day or more.
Here in Canada, we cannot buy Permethrin (unless we have an agricultural pesticide license or a commercial pesticide license). I ordered through 'AmazingZon' and got it through the border without difficulty.
This year I treated my wife's hiking clothing as well as mine. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170411/d66ad3fc8c70e56eb2f06153bff32bcb.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170411/d66ad3fc8c70e56eb2f06153bff32bcb.jpg

Uncle Joe
04-10-2017, 23:53
Sawyer recommends keeping clothes in dark bags between washings. What about Insect Shield? I personally haven't been doing that but they are typically hung in an interior closet and out of any light.

Greenlight
04-11-2017, 11:50
This is the way to go, IMO. Professionally treated clothing lasts 70 washings, which is more than most people will wash anything before purging it from their wardrobe.
DIY permethrin only lasts six washings. Do the math. You're more than likely only going to take one change of clothes with you on a long hike.


I sent my clothes out to be professionally permethrin treated by a company called Insectshield. It cost about $10 per piece of clothing, but unlike home applications which have to be done every few washings, the professional treatment lasts the average lifetime of a piece of clothing (or so they claim). It was well worth it to me to have it done right once and to not have to deal with any backyard pesticide applications or chemistry experiments. Best part is that because it lasts so much longer than home applications, it can end up being cheaper than Sawyer in the long run.
https://www.insectshield.com/ISYOC.aspx

Deadeye
04-11-2017, 12:55
Search function, please
We've covered this many times.

No need to post a helpful reply then, is there?

BuckeyeBill
04-12-2017, 01:26
Sawyer recommends keeping clothes in dark bags between washings. What about Insect Shield? I personally haven't been doing that but they are typically hung in an interior closet and out of any light.

I have read everything on their site and even called them a few times before I first used them. The only restrictions I could find state that 1.) Garments must be washed even if they are new. 2.) Under garments are not accepted for treatment. 3.) Garments labeled dry clean only can not be treated. 4.) items labeled water resistant (DWR), line dry only, do not tumble dry may not be suitable for treatment.

As far as Gear being treated, Chris at ULA recommends using the spray and only treating the outside of the pack. I have never had any problems with my tarp or hammock needing treatment. YMMV

aaronthebugbuffet
04-12-2017, 08:35
I diluted some 10% permethrin concentrate used for livestock. It's cheap but has a strong smell so I only use it for pants.
How does the Sawyer's smell?

FreeGoldRush
04-12-2017, 09:34
I diluted some 10% permethrin concentrate used for livestock. It's cheap but has a strong smell so I only use it for pants.
How does the Sawyer's smell?

Although you are getting the permethrin you have to remember that most of what is in the bottle (even the concentrate) is not permithrin. My bottle of concentrate (forgot the brand) says not safe to use on clothing. The variety used to treat your clothes also has chemical(s) to help it bind to your clothes. Who knows how important these minor details are, but that is what the manufacturers tell us.

cbxx
04-12-2017, 10:21
Can anyone tell me when the Tick danger ends, or is greatly reduced? After a couple freezes? Certain month? Any info here?

FreeGoldRush
04-12-2017, 10:26
Can anyone tell me when the Tick danger ends, or is greatly reduced? After a couple freezes? Certain month? Any info here?

Here in Georgia the ticks were really bad even in February. Before this year I'd have said you have nothing to worry about in February. It's probably good to be on your best tick behavior anytime there isn't snow or ice on the ground.

Sarcasm the elf
04-12-2017, 10:40
Can anyone tell me when the Tick danger ends, or is greatly reduced? After a couple freezes? Certain month? Any info here? As a general rule, if it's above freezing then ticks can be active. With mild winters like the one we just had, they were active every time we had a thaw.

Water Rat
04-12-2017, 11:36
Another vote for Insectshield.

The ticks in my area have not really had much of a dormant season over the past few years. I also have dogs (who do effective monthly tick treatments) and we are outside all the time. I have not tried the concentrated Permethrin, but have used the Sawyer products. I found the Sawyer products to be very effective as long as I maintained the 6 washings (Sawyer says 6 washings or 6 weeks on their website) rule. My only issue with Sawyer was having to constantly re-apply treatment throughout the year. It was also expensive, but I figure using Sawyer was less expensive/less painful than treating Lyme.

I switched to Insectshield because it was a lot easier to ship the clothes off and know the treatment would (most likely) last for the life of the garment. Insectshield does offer an Easy Pack option for 8-10 articles of clothing (1 pair of socks equals 1 article of clothing) and you can save money via this option. https://www.insectshield.com/EZ-Packs-P442.aspx

Ticks can be present anywhere an animal can come into contact with it ("it" being grass, branches, shrubs, etc).

MtDoraDave
04-20-2017, 07:06
Yes it works.

I treated my clothes and backpack prior to my last overnight hike in FL. My hiking partner did not treat his clothes. At camp, leaning against the same tree for dinner, he found 7 ticks either on him or his gear. I found none on or near me. He took one of the ticks he found crawling on his equipment and put it on my pant leg (which I had tucked into my sock after he found the first tick). It walked around for a while, but stopped its progress after five minutes. At the fifteen minute point, it turned over onto it's back, taking the "dead bug" stance.

I treat my backpack because once on a conditioning/ training hike in the Ocala Nat'l Forest I put my pack down next to the trail for a break - and when I looked back at it, it had several ticks crawling on it.

I use the concentrated stuff from Tractor Supply. It does take a couple days for the smell to go away, and the smell does come back slightly when I start to sweat... but as someone else said, I'd rather deal with a slightly unpleasant smell than deal with the agony of Lyme Disease.

Dogwood
04-20-2017, 08:08
I have just used them as well, and while I came to the same conclusion regarding your cost/benefit analysis ( btw they claim it lasts 70 washings) there are a couple idiosyncrasies of their service that deserve mentioning.

First, and most notable, is that every item I sent them came back with an orange paper slip that was safety-pinned to the garment. Much like what is done with laundered dress shirts, where the slip is fed through a button hole and stapled. However these slips were pinned through the fabric of the garments. Without getting into detail of my experience, suffice it to say that I would recommend that one consider only sending items that have less-than-fine weaves. Socks of course are fine, and pants often have an interior waistband where any lasting effects of safety-pinning such slips is out of view.

Second, each item came back with an Insect Shield tag sewn in, which describes the treatment (incl. EPA reg. # and the % permethrin), and amends the laundering instructions (wash separately from other clothes). For socks, the tag information was printed on the toe area, topside.

Be careful to note with InsectShield that you do not want a staple or safety pin hole impaled through various gear you have treated. I've heard of tents, outer layers, a few sleeping bag/quilt shells, etc where this was done creating a small hole.

Rain Man
04-20-2017, 09:00
I use the concentrated stuff from Tractor Supply. It does take a couple days for the smell to go away, and the smell does come back slightly when I start to sweat... but as someone else said, I'd rather deal with a slightly unpleasant smell than deal with the agony of Lyme Disease.

The Tractor Supply stuff is for barn and livestock use and is petroleum based. Avoid it. Get a water-based version intended for in-home use. No odor. Martins 10 is the brand and version I use from bugspray.com.

grubbster
04-20-2017, 13:38
The Tractor Supply stuff is for barn and livestock use and is petroleum based. Avoid it. Get a water-based version intended for in-home use. No odor. Martins 10 is the brand and version I use from bugspray.com.
Martins 10 is the stuff I got from Tractor Supply. It is not petroleum based.

MacBrave
04-20-2017, 15:13
I purchased a gallon of this permethrin product last year: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00TNYPQY4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Seems to work well.

Rain Man
04-20-2017, 15:21
For less than this $35 purchase price, you could buy 32 oz of Martin's 10 also on Amazon for $20 and some change and dilute it 20-to-1 and save a ton of money and get many more treatments, if you like DIY that is.


I purchased a gallon of this permethrin product last year: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00TNYPQY4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Seems to work well.

tflaris
04-20-2017, 19:10
I use permethrin regularly.

String up a clothes line in the back yard. Using a spray bottle doused the clothing. Sun dry or throw in the dryer. Works great. I love the stuff.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Wise Old Owl
04-20-2017, 20:25
Search function, please
We've covered this many times.

Folks post their fears.

egilbe
04-21-2017, 06:59
The Tractor Supply stuff is for barn and livestock use and is petroleum based. Avoid it. Get a water-based version intended for in-home use. No odor. Martins 10 is the brand and version I use from bugspray.com.

I've just used up the last of my petroleum based permethrin. It is very aromatic for a few days, but it lasts all year. Mixed with water, it turns milky white, like Sawyers. The Martins I just started using stays clear and has no odor when mixed with water. I'll be curious how long it lasts in comparison to the smelly stuff.

Snowleopard
04-21-2017, 12:29
Can anyone tell me when the Tick danger ends, or is greatly reduced? After a couple freezes? Certain month? Any info here?
I've seen a report that ticks remain active in forest litter even in mid winter. But the risk is much reduced below freezing -- they won't survive climbing up blades of grass to fall on you. Just don't roll in leaf litter.

Navy Salad
04-21-2017, 19:13
Another vote for the Martin's permethrin from Amazon, except I bought it in the 36.8% concentration, one quart for $27 -- basically a lifetime supply. Link here. (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003IMO3I2/ref=pe_385040_30332190_TE_3p_M3T1_ST1_dp_1?tag=nwh inet-20) To get to a 1.5% military grade concentration, it just takes one tablespoon to a 12 ounce spray bottle with the remainder filled up with water. FAR cheaper than Sawyer and quite a bit stronger. Plus, no odor after it dries. You DO, of course, need to be very careful when spraying. I put on full coveralls, plus a bandana on my face, plus a dust mask to breathe through, all done outsider. Military studies found it to be harmless after it's dried.

RangerZ
04-21-2017, 21:09
I use permethrin regularly.

String up a clothes line in the back yard. Using a spray bottle doused the clothing. Sun dry or throw in the dryer. Works great. I love the

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sprayed my clothes, pack and tent mesh today with Sawyers. They're drying overnight and tomorrow out in my garage. I've never had a problem with bugs or side effects.

nascarmikeb
05-09-2017, 10:21
SO I enjoy hiking in shorts when the weather permits. Is it advisable to hike in pants, or if I use a tick repellant spray on my legs would this reduce the risk? Ill be starting my section hike from Newfound to Hot springs in 10 days. Not sure of the tick problem in this area. I do plan on getting either the Martins or Sawyer to treat my shirt, shorts or pants and socks.

Rain Man
05-09-2017, 11:01
Well, it is safest to hike in pants (tucked into your socks), yes, but most hike in shorts, as do I. I use Picaridin rather than DEET on my legs, etc. And while treating your gear and clothes with Permethrin, don't forget your gaiters. I even treat my underwear.


SO I enjoy hiking in shorts when the weather permits. Is it advisable to hike in pants, or if I use a tick repellant spray on my legs would this reduce the risk? Ill be starting my section hike from Newfound to Hot springs in 10 days. Not sure of the tick problem in this area. I do plan on getting either the Martins or Sawyer to treat my shirt, shorts or pants and socks.

BuckeyeBill
05-09-2017, 11:35
Well, it is safest to hike in pants (tucked into your socks), yes, but most hike in shorts, as do I. I use Picaridin rather than DEET on my legs, etc. And while treating your gear and clothes with Permethrin, don't forget your gaiters. I even treat my underwear.

Rain Man you is one tough hombre. Even Insect Shield won't due underwear. The idea of the boys sweating into a permethrin soaked covering would turn me into a eunuch.

BuckeyeBill
05-09-2017, 11:46
due =do...........

Rain Man
05-09-2017, 15:45
Rain Man you is one tough hombre. Even Insect Shield won't do underwear. The idea of the boys sweating into a permethrin soaked covering would turn me into a eunuch.

Wife had that done a few years back! Besides, it's ticks crawling all over "the boys" or perfectly safe clothing. I picked the latter. ;)

VatoGato
05-10-2017, 04:14
I had a great experience using Sawyer insect shield on my AT thru last year. I didn't see any ticks on my clothing or on me once during my trek. It also seems to repel mosquitos. I treated a cotton bucket hat and noticed mosquitos wouldn't get within 3 inches of my face while it was on. I was a little paranoid about ticks on my journey and rightfully so (met 5 or 6 hikers with lyme disease). I took lyme disease medicine when I got back from my hike even though I had no symptoms, just to be on the safe side. I tucked my pants into my socks and treated all my clothing. I also re-treated all my clothing once when I knew I was going through a particularly bad area. Another option if you are worried about being hot wearing pants is to buy insect mesh pants. They look dorky, but who cares as long as they keep you from getting lyme disease or that new scary tick born disease. I used the mesh pants as well, the only downsides are that they get smelly really fast and are easy to snag and tear on brush.

AngryGerman
05-24-2017, 11:31
Every time I come across this topic I get this urge to ask what did the natives do? How did they protect against ticks; blackflies, mosquitos and such? There has to be a natural way to deter those little buggers right! :-? Not saying I'm a native or stating that I know what the natives did but... I've found rather than opting for a chemical based solution opting for a natural solution will do the trick as well. The stuff I use does not keep all the bugs off you but minimizes the chances by far and is a healthier solution.

I wash my gear and clothing in a lemongrass/eucalyptus based detergent and I wash daily with lemongrass soap. I tend to carry a very small vial of lemongrass oil and use a homemade lemongrass/eucalyptus bug spray when hiking. I also tend to not roll around in the underbrush, leaves, tall grass etc. My gear gets hung not laid on the ground and hammocks/tents shook thoroughly before packing.

Have had great success the last 26 years with the above approach and I've yet to wear clothing treated with permethrin and I've yet to treat my gear with that garbage! I've spent an immense amount of time on the AT, in the Adirondacks and Catskills, logging thousands of miles and have had only two ticks on me. Both were found on me in December and both times I did not take the precautions I normally do because I was much younger and hastier. Blackflies, mosquitos and ticks do not bother me but those dang deer flies will get you no matter what!!!

My uncle, whom has spent equal amounts of time in the same locals as I, likes to treat his stuff or has it professionally treated now. He has had good success using the chemical option too as many on here have stated but beware... He and I ran into a couple at Abol Bridge a few years ago whom through discussion divulged they treated their clothing with permethrin before they set out from home. We again crossed paths with them in Monson finding out they got yanked out because they both got a severe skin rash/burns wherever the treated clothing laid on their skin and had to get medical attention.

Snowleopard
05-24-2017, 16:23
Every time I come across this topic I get this urge to ask what did the natives do? How did they protect against ticks; blackflies, mosquitos and such? There has to be a natural way to deter those little buggers right! :-? ... beware... He and I ran into a couple at Abol Bridge a few years ago whom through discussion divulged they treated their clothing with permethrin before they set out from home. We again crossed paths with them in Monson finding out they got yanked out because they both got a severe skin rash/burns wherever the treated clothing laid on their skin and had to get medical attention.
I've seen a child's bug protection at the Native Museum of Mashteuiatsh on Lac St. Jean, QC, north of Montreal. It was a like a cotton balaclava, with only the child's eyes exposed. I don't know what they used before the Europeans brought cotton cloth. The mosquitoes were pretty numerous in August. I've read that natives in the USA spread bear fat over their skin for insect protection.

For the couple with the rash, if only one of them had the rash/burns it could have been an allergic reaction to the permethrin. With both of them, it was probably improperly diluted permethrin concentrate or they were using a permethrin concentrate that had solvents that should not be used on humans.

Deacon
06-08-2017, 12:48
I don't like to wear long pants, but the threat of encountering ticks on my legs in New Hampshire and Maine is apparently a real possibility this year. I've treated all my clothes with permethrin, but am still concerned with bare legs.

My wife recently developed a rash on her back, and had a Dermtaologist examine her. The doctor said it could be a mite of some sort, and prescribed a cream that contains 5% Permethrin. She only used half the tube so I'm going to take it along for my New Hampshire/Maine section.



https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170608/09651f29a2e13a73779b171820f7648b.jpg

lonehiker
06-08-2017, 13:00
I don't like to wear long pants, but the threat of encountering ticks on my legs in New Hampshire and Maine is apparently a real possibility this year. I've treated all my clothes with permethrin, but am still concerned with bare legs.

My wife recently developed a rash on her back, and had a Dermtaologist examine her. The doctor said it could be a mite of some sort, and prescribed a cream that contains 5% Permethrin. She only used half the tube so I'm going to take it along for my New Hampshire/Maine section.



https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170608/09651f29a2e13a73779b171820f7648b.jpg

If applied directly to skin, enzymes (I think) will fairly quickly (20 min?) break this chemical down rendering it ineffective for what you are probably figuring on using it for. Additionally, I don't think that anyone recommends applying this to an embedded tick.

egilbe
06-08-2017, 16:23
Mammals, except cats, render the toxin inert when applied to skin. Unless you have hairy legs, its not going to do a damn thing to repel ticks on bare skin.

Deadeye
06-08-2017, 16:34
I just returned from a 4 day hike in New Hampshire tick country. My clothes were treated with Sawyer spray permethrin; my friend's were not. He found far more ticks on his clothes than I, on the order of 20-to-1, yet I was always in front. Based on that experience, I'm sending my clothes out to the professionals next year.

Deacon
06-08-2017, 16:50
If applied directly to skin, enzymes (I think) will fairly quickly (20 min?) break this chemical down rendering it ineffective for what you are probably figuring on using it for. Additionally, I don't think that anyone recommends applying this to an embedded tick.

Language on the back of the tube indicates it is effective 8 to 14 hours.

lonehiker
06-08-2017, 17:10
Language on the back of the tube indicates it is effective 8 to 14 hours.

You should do a bit more research, and maybe you are correct. But, I have read a couple of different articles over the last few years that are contradictory to that. http://tickinfo.com/permethrin.htm Read the 3rd paragraph. Another article was in Backpacker magazine many years ago but I do not remember which issue. Shouldn't be too difficult to find reference to the article. Up to you what you do but I think that you are giving yourself a false sense of security. Might also point out that the effective hours may somehow apply to the treatment of the parasite i.e. mites, lice, etc.

Deacon
06-09-2017, 06:06
Ok, it looks like this isn't a good choice for use as a deterrent for ticks. It would be good to use once the days hiking is done, and applied to hard to see areas, as it would kill any small mites/ticks, etc.

That said, now I'm having second thoughts about carrying the extra ounce and a half.

TTT
06-10-2017, 08:03
Will Permethrin remain active if clothes are washed in diluted vinegar, and will it bind to pants that are wax treated for waterproofing?

Ethesis
06-10-2017, 08:55
Will Permethrin remain active if clothes are washed in diluted vinegar, and will it bind to pants that are wax treated for waterproofing?

good question

my question is will wax treating pants mess up Permethrin?

lonehiker
06-10-2017, 11:25
My understanding is that it is more the agitation rather than the detergent that breaks the chemical bonds. But vinegar could be a different story. If treated with wax I would wonder if the chemical could form its bond. This is all speculation and you would be better served to contact someone like Sawyer products and ask them.

BuckeyeBill
06-10-2017, 15:33
"will it bind to pants that are wax treated for waterproofing"

According to Insect Shields website they will not treat any clothing with waterproofing or DWR treatment. The treatment they use is good for about 70 wash cycles and has always well for me because by wash cycle the clothes are well worn by then and I replace them.

TTT
06-10-2017, 17:51
Thanks. That basically rules out treating my Fjallraven pants which are wax coated
Soaking clothes in diluted vinegar appears to be a common practice on the AT to eliminate odor causing bacteria before or during a normal wash cycle. If it is at odds with Permethrin it becomes counterproductive which was the reasoning behind my other question. I'm also guessing that adding Aqua Mira to small wash loads would result in less of a smell as well.

lonehiker
06-10-2017, 20:31
Soaking clothes in diluted vinegar appears to be a common practice on the AT to eliminate odor causing bacteria before or during a normal wash cycle.

Is it? I've never heard of anyone doing it on any of the long trails I have hiked. I would guess some may do this, but to call it common practice? Maybe I'm out of touch...

TTT
06-11-2017, 06:30
Here's one example. I know of three more


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOzV9kLRfhQ

lonehiker
06-11-2017, 08:19
Well I guess that makes it common practice...

2 Samuel 22
06-11-2017, 20:13
We treat our clothes with Sawyer Permethrin and Sawyer Picaridin for bare skin. No problem with ticks or mosquitoes here.

Wise Old Owl
06-11-2017, 23:21
I diluted some 10% permethrin concentrate used for livestock. It's cheap but has a strong smell so I only use it for pants.
How does the Sawyer's smell?

Some of the agricultural versions is loaded with Petroleum Distillate, Similar to Kerosene. Sawyers is water based and only has a light odor when applying. It dissipates when dry.

Wise Old Owl
06-11-2017, 23:26
If applied directly to skin, enzymes (I think) will fairly quickly (20 min?) break this chemical down rendering it ineffective for what you are probably figuring on using it for. Additionally, I don't think that anyone recommends applying this to an embedded tick.

Can I suggest to Decon that this is a bad idea. Just because it lasts or has a residual Its a prescription for a reason. Get it wrong and this may itch like hell. Just treat your clothes use Deep Woods Off or Ultrathon.

Wise Old Owl
06-11-2017, 23:35
I am posting this as an alternative to synthetic chemicals. Over time new things do come to market that present an honorable mention. Cedar Tree Oil appears to have some merit. You can apply this over and over again and it is a true repellent. You can spray directly on your dog or cat and yourself. I am still testing this myself, and there is real science behind this product and has been used in California for years, FDA and EPA approved and registered.

https://www.amazon.com/Nature-Cide-32oz-Outdoor-Pesticide-Repellent/dp/B003DX2JJQ

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41WdgSHxcDL.jpg

MtDoraDave
06-12-2017, 07:30
I just bought a pair of the Rynoskin pants, which are a very light, tightly woven nylon/lycra blend, base layer designed to keep insects from biting you without chemicals.
Sunday morning, I did 2 hours at a local preserve wearing shorts with those Rynoskin tights underneath to protect my legs - but mostly to see if they are hot to wear in the summer.
They are not hot to wear in the summer. Since they are thin and ultra light, the sweat evaporates just as quickly (if not more so) as it would from bare legs.

They claim 99.x percent effective against biting insects including ticks, fleas, and biting flies. On my 2 hour walk, I was bitten on the calf by 4 horseflies. Through the Rynoskin pants. :(

I'm still going to wear them in a couple weeks when I go up for my next section, but they will have been treated with permethrin. I sweat too much for applications of insect repellent to be reliable.

peakbagger
06-12-2017, 10:50
I doubt this approach would do much. Ticks are very good at latching on and hiding for hours until the crawl out and find a place to latch onto. They don't immediately latch on. The concept with permethrin is they wont even attempt to land on your treated clothes which means its far less likely that you have a hitchhiker that appears several hours later.


I just bought a pair of the Rynoskin pants, which are a very light, tightly woven nylon/lycra blend, base layer designed to keep insects from biting you without chemicals.
Sunday morning, I did 2 hours at a local preserve wearing shorts with those Rynoskin tights underneath to protect my legs - but mostly to see if they are hot to wear in the summer.
They are not hot to wear in the summer. Since they are thin and ultra light, the sweat evaporates just as quickly (if not more so) as it would from bare legs.

They claim 99.x percent effective against biting insects including ticks, fleas, and biting flies. On my 2 hour walk, I was bitten on the calf by 4 horseflies. Through the Rynoskin pants. :(

I'm still going to wear them in a couple weeks when I go up for my next section, but they will have been treated with permethrin. I sweat too much for applications of insect repellent to be reliable.

Deacon
06-12-2017, 11:54
Can I suggest to Decon that this is a bad idea. Just because it lasts or has a residual Its a prescription for a reason. Get it wrong and this may itch like hell. Just treat your clothes use Deep Woods Off or Ultrathon.

I got that, thanks.

MtDoraDave
06-12-2017, 16:55
I doubt this approach would do much. Ticks are very good at latching on and hiding for hours until the crawl out and find a place to latch onto. They don't immediately latch on. The concept with permethrin is they wont even attempt to land on your treated clothes which means its far less likely that you have a hitchhiker that appears several hours later.

In case you missed the second to last sentence, I'm going to treat them with permethrin. A tick that gets on me will be dead several hours later. Less than an hour, if my one timed experiment is a good approximation (15 minutes after a happy healthy tick was put on my pant leg, it had turned upside down, assuming the dead bug position).

Permethrin isn't used as a repellent - at least that's not why I use it - it is so any tick that gets on me DIES a terrible death within minutes.

...but now that you mention it, although I have found a dead tick or two on my clothing, generally speaking I think they are, indeed, repelled. :)

Chris_Cates
06-12-2017, 18:41
I just bought a pair of the Rynoskin pants, which are a very light, tightly woven nylon/lycra blend, base layer designed to keep insects from biting you without chemicals.
Sunday morning, I did 2 hours at a local preserve wearing shorts with those Rynoskin tights underneath to protect my legs - but mostly to see if they are hot to wear in the summer.
They are not hot to wear in the summer. Since they are thin and ultra light, the sweat evaporates just as quickly (if not more so) as it would from bare legs.

They claim 99.x percent effective against biting insects including ticks, fleas, and biting flies. On my 2 hour walk, I was bitten on the calf by 4 horseflies. Through the Rynoskin pants. :(

I'm still going to wear them in a couple weeks when I go up for my next section, but they will have been treated with permethrin. I sweat too much for applications of insect repellent to be reliable.

Permethrin hasn't helped me with horse flies at all. I've been bitten through a shirt that was soaked in it and allowed to air dry. I'm going to try lemon eucalyptus oil next.

Haven't found a single tick on me since I started treating my close with the permethrin though.

MtDoraDave
06-12-2017, 22:04
Yeah...the horseflies are just a nuisance to me. Ticks are my main concern, due to the risk of diseases they carry.

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GScout
06-17-2017, 22:19
Have any women used this on their underwear? I use it on all my clothing, socks, bras but not undies. Advice?

egilbe
06-18-2017, 08:28
Have any women used this on their underwear? I use it on all my clothing, socks, bras but not undies. Advice?
It should be safe, but probably isn't necessary. Treated outer clothing should be enough to keep away ticks. One thing about permethrin that I like is that its a non-persistant chemical. Sunlight destroys it. Treating underwear can be another line of defense once the effectiveness of the treatment on the outer clothing has worn off.

BuckeyeBill
06-18-2017, 11:53
Have any women used this on their underwear? I use it on all my clothing, socks, bras but not undies. Advice?

Insect Shield is a company that treats clothing for you. They do not accept underwear of any kind. I do know Rain Man said he treated his undies, but I go with Insect shield's recommendation.

egilbe
06-18-2017, 15:22
I think that's because they don't want to handle someone's skivvies, not because they can't.

BuckeyeBill
06-18-2017, 19:24
Not that either, because even if your clothing is brand new, they want you to wash it a couple of times before sending it. They also don't want anything marked waterproof or DWR. Personally the idea of having chemicals that kill bugs on contact that close to, well you know.

egilbe
06-18-2017, 19:38
It kills bugs because they have a different neurosystem than mammals. Mammals break the chemical down to inert ingredients. Its why you don't apply it directlt to skin. Our bodies render it harmless.

BuckeyeBill
06-18-2017, 20:01
I know, it was just a little tongue in cheek humor. :D

TKE402
06-19-2017, 14:13
I use Sawyers brand. I have a rollie clothes hanger thing. I hang all my clothes on that except for underwear (i believe I read somewhere to not spray underwear). I then spray away. I let the clothes hang dry. So far no ticks. I do this with my kids hiking clothes and no ticks for them either.

Snowleopard
06-19-2017, 17:05
Have any women used this on their underwear? I use it on all my clothing, socks, bras but not undies. Advice?
The military uses permethrin. Their instructions say do not treat underwear or headbands. Treating outer clothing should be sufficient. The US military recommends treating clothing with permethrin and exposed skin with Ultrathon time release DEET; other time release DEET should work as well.

TTT
06-20-2017, 10:03
Bought some Vital Protection AM-2 TODAY. It contains 2.2g/L of Permethrin. Unlike Sawyer, where one treatment will last up to six washings or six weeks before clothing has to be treated again, this one apparently lasts 30 washings or three months.