Trail Ethics: Please don't feed the ....

[Mr. Bumpy]

It comes up, but I am going to be a bitchy old man and bring it up again.

Yesterday I took a little trail run to Hogback Ridge shelter. There was a group, and there was the all too typical swagger. And then there was the question: "Is there any trail magic at Sam's Gap?"

I told them that there is a trashcan, a water source, and a warm apple in my car. They seemed disappointed.

Of course I am slightly jealous that I can't hack out a significant chunk out of my calendar to take a long hike until this fall. And I always enjoy coming across a beer in a spring or an unexpected snack and often partake. But something in the tone rubbed me the wrong way. Apparently someone was serving heavy fare at Max Patch a week or so ago and they were wishing that every crossing had that set-up.

It is like bears and hiker food. Don't feed the bears.

[Old Hiker]

Well, depends. I was ALWAYS surprised and deeply grateful to any Trail magic I came across, even if I chose to decline.

Had a great start to a bad morning at a road crossing one time. Up a hill to find cold drinks, watermelon and snacks.

Got to talk with some fellow hikers from 2012 who actually decided to finish the Trail instead of breaking their ankle at mile 500 or so.

Met some gentle, kind souls at my FIRST trail magic in GA on the Yellow Deli bus. Not my world view, but people like that help a lot.

Girl Scouts in NY (?) who left water and snacks at a park on a hot, nasty day.

I didn't look for nor expect it. It was marvelous when it happened.

[johnspenn]

The term "trail magic" has been mis/over-used to the point that it's meaningless.

If you have people asking if there is "trail magic" at the next road crossing, and disappointed because there isn't any, there's no longer anything "magical" about it.

The surprise cache of cold water for a hot and thirsty hiker on a hot day? Sure, trail magic. The unexpected lift into town and invite to stay in a stranger's home, eat a hot meal take a shower and do laundry? Trail magic.

Not really sure what you call the other stuff, really.

Technically I even have a problem with calling any of it "magic" but that's a discussion for another day.

[dervari]

Never expect it, and be grateful when you find it. The was a local church giving out cold water at Stone Mountain park on the Cherokee Trail one day and even though it wasn't true "trail magic" as per AT expectations these days, that cold water sure felt magical going down.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-T337A using Tapatalk

[Rain Man]

A runner on a hiking trail complaining of someone supporting trail backpackers. The irony.

[MuddyWaters]

A runner on a hiking trail complaining of someone supporting trail backpackers. The irony.

I know of no place where the AT or any other national scenic trail is specified as a "hiking trail"

Because most walk, doesnt mean someone running is doing it wrong. Id wager day use outnumbers all else. Doesnt make it a day hiking trail.

[CalebJ]

How did trail running even become relevant to the discussion at hand? It's just a conversation about hiker feeds.

[scope]

Kinda takes the "magic" out of trail magic when someone is expecting it, huh?

[Mr. Bumpy]

A runner on a hiking trail complaining of someone supporting trail backpackers. The irony.
Hmm. I'm not sure what that comment is getting at? Are you really that strident or are you just trying to bait me for entertainment? It must really tear you up about the FKT types. I suppose you would probably might complain that I also sometimes take shears or bow saw on my day hike jogs too? Or of my custom of picking up and taking out trash bag out on my jogs too?

[gwschenk]

The magic is on the trail, not in some road crossing beer.

[scope]

The magic is on the trail, not in some road crossing beer.

Its like Reeces Peanut Butter Cups, both are great individually, but together they are magic! (trail+beer)

I think RainMan was making a reference to the flak Karl Meltzer and others sometimes get. Not being critical of the OP, just awareness of the irony.

[GoLight]

A runner on a hiking trail complaining of someone supporting trail backpackers. The irony.
In my opinion you mis-read the OP, he didn´t say that at all. He was commenting that some ¨trail backpackers¨ seem to feel entitled to a hiker feed at every crossing and its best not to encourage them.

[Storm]

I am always happy to find a small gesture of kindness on the trail. I really don't consider that trail magic. I have found the magic to be when the trail looks out for you. While hiking in Pa. on a hot July day I ran out of water for almost 4 hours. Low and behold ran into an old spring house with some of the coolest sweetest water I ever drank. At another time I was short of food and still a long way from a resupply. The trail provided an apple tree. That in my opinion is really trail magic.

[ScareBear]

It comes up, but I am going to be a bitchy old man and bring it up again.

Yesterday I took a little trail run to Hogback Ridge shelter. There was a group, and there was the all too typical swagger. And then there was the question: "Is there any trail magic at Sam's Gap?"

I told them that there is a trashcan, a water source, and a warm apple in my car. They seemed disappointed.

Of course I am slightly jealous that I can't hack out a significant chunk out of my calendar to take a long hike until this fall. And I always enjoy coming across a beer in a spring or an unexpected snack and often partake. But something in the tone rubbed me the wrong way. Apparently someone was serving heavy fare at Max Patch a week or so ago and they were wishing that every crossing had that set-up.

It is like bears and hiker food. Don't feed the bears.

I was at "a" feed at Max Patch a few weeks ago. Were the hikers "Red", "GumpCheese" or "LadyPants"? Great guys....

Highlife put on the feed to celebrate his return to the Patch. He thru'd two years ago and has done the CDT 2x, so it was just his way of paying forward and having an awesome thru party at the Patch. It's not uncommon....

Sorry you don't like those thru's "attitude". But, what is it to YOU if they feel entitled? They didn't mooch anything or try to Yogi you, did they?

And, what is it to YOU if Highlife or me or anybody throw's a feed or some gap gulps and trash relief???

Seriously folks, why in the world is anybody getting bent about what a stranger does for a stranger? What is it to YOU, exactly??????????

[hikernutcasey]

I think one of these days I'm going to make me a sign that says "Trail Magic Just Ahead" and put it just before some gap. Then I'm going to go down into the parking lot, dress up with a top hat and cape and proceed to do remedial magic tricks.

[Puddlefish]

I was at "a" feed at Max Patch a few weeks ago. Were the hikers "Red", "GumpCheese" or "LadyPants"? Great guys....

Highlife put on the feed to celebrate his return to the Patch. He thru'd two years ago and has done the CDT 2x, so it was just his way of paying forward and having an awesome thru party at the Patch. It's not uncommon....

Sorry you don't like those thru's "attitude". But, what is it to YOU if they feel entitled? They didn't mooch anything or try to Yogi you, did they?

And, what is it to YOU if Highlife or me or anybody throw's a feed or some gap gulps and trash relief???

Seriously folks, why in the world is anybody getting bent about what a stranger does for a stranger? What is it to YOU, exactly??????????
I had a few negative trail magic moments:

- I was looking for the water source at some gap and got preached at by some pushy evangelist handing out cookies for god.
- Walked past an umbrella and picnic table a few feet from the cars and motorcycles at a busy crossing, politely declined the offer of trail hospitality and kept walking. The woman screamed out after me... "and thank you for all that you've done for us!" She apparently was gravely insulted that I didn't thank her for nothing.
- At Beauty Spot, I was chatting with a young couple, when some yahoos in the parking lot spotted me as a potential thru hiker and started screaming across the field that they had "trail magic."
- On Max Patch, I described in my prior post above. I set up camp in a field a mile or so away, legally stealth camped and it sounded like I was attending a minor league ball game with all the noise.
- Some twit covered a sign with a bag full of Ramen, which made me miss my trail. This one worked out alright as the blue blaze I ended up on was lovely.
- Someone left a "trash bag" by one of the Balds, and didn't pick it up before nightfall. It was strewn over the trail by morning.
- Some brainless clown left a big green tent set up on a beautiful level spot a few hundred feet from a nice waterfall. I was complaining to my friend the next day how I had to set up in a borderline muddy spot a mile down the trail, because the green tent guy beat me to the nice spot. My friend told me that he set up in an unlevel rocky spot near that tent. Eventually he noticed that no one was home. Turns out there was a note inside the tent, welcoming people to use the tent and sleeping bags for the night. I was tempted to walk back a mile and pack out that tent to the nearest dumpster.
- Numerous occasions of fruit being left at a trail head unattended. Which results in bears and other animals turning into nuisances and being put down.
- Several nights, beer got packed into tent sites and people partied until midnight.
- Some guy in a yellow pickup with a custom Trail Angel paint job, yelled halfway across a mountain asking if I had water. Waking up the poor people I was hiking past.

I get it, people want to be the trail hero, to be thought of as generous, and be loved, to feel like they're still part of the trail community. I understand the reasoning, but some of these people are causing far more harm than good.

[Mr. Bumpy]

I was at "a" feed at Max Patch a few weeks ago. Were the hikers "Red", "GumpCheese" or "LadyPants"? Great guys....

Highlife put on the feed to celebrate his return to the Patch. He thru'd two years ago and has done the CDT 2x, so it was just his way of paying forward and having an awesome thru party at the Patch. It's not uncommon....

Sorry you don't like those thru's "attitude". But, what is it to YOU if they feel entitled? They didn't mooch anything or try to Yogi you, did they?

And, what is it to YOU if Highlife or me or anybody throw's a feed or some gap gulps and trash relief???

Seriously folks, why in the world is anybody getting bent about what a stranger does for a stranger? What is it to YOU, exactly??????????

I'm not getting bent over the issue any more than it seems like you are getting bent at my post. To be fair, I probably should have posited a question in my OP instead of a statement - I wish I would have done that. I am very much a live and let live person - I like car racing, heavy metal, Gordon Lightfoot, and dislike cigarettes - these are just preferences - each to his own and feel free to disagree.

But yeah, it does diminish my experience and my confidence and trust in others when after arriving with a friendly, "Hello," to be ignored, not greeted likewise, and then hear how everyone was doing 19 mile days and so and so couldn't keep up. I'm pretty positive that that chatter was for my ears as there was only silence as I was walking up on the shelter. Then only after being there for five minutes and picking up a couple handfuls of trash their only greeting went pretty much like, "Which direction were you coming from? Is there any trail magic at the gap." To me, that IS just rude and crass, and if it were my child making that comment he would get a talkin'.

Ultimately, ScareBear, your implication is right, it is exactly NOTHING to ME, except for a rub. And I don't think you need to be cheesed up me for it - personal choice and all that.

I made my original post and that is why I hope many people post here, to try to get answers to questions that they have.

I like parties and all that, but I don't think Hell Hole Holler is the place for them any more than someone would be bothered if I set up a laser projector and showed a movie at a shelter. I have never really bitched on this forum about entitled attitudes - each to his own - but I have been hiking around here for 20 years, and attitudes like I describe here I judge as negative, the ARE increasing and I think can be directly fueled by what are well meaning intentions.

[RockDoc]

It's a sign of overpopulation when hikers start arguing amongst themselves like little children, as in this thread.
The more people, the more negative trail moments.
Regrettably, it will get worse.

[Lone Wolf]

It comes up, but I am going to be a bitchy old man and bring it up again.

Yesterday I took a little trail run to Hogback Ridge shelter. There was a group, and there was the all too typical swagger. And then there was the question: "Is there any trail magic at Sam's Gap?"

I told them that there is a trashcan, a water source, and a warm apple in my car. They seemed disappointed.

Of course I am slightly jealous that I can't hack out a significant chunk out of my calendar to take a long hike until this fall. And I always enjoy coming across a beer in a spring or an unexpected snack and often partake. But something in the tone rubbed me the wrong way. Apparently someone was serving heavy fare at Max Patch a week or so ago and they were wishing that every crossing had that set-up.

It is like bears and hiker food. Don't feed the bears.

i feed the the truly hungry and needy. AT walkers are neither.

[rickb]

i feed the the truly hungry and needy. AT walkers are neither.

What about beer?

[Lone Wolf]

What about beer?

i will give them beer. i'm a trail devil

[ScareBear]

I'm not getting bent over the issue any more than it seems like you are getting bent at my post. To be fair, I probably should have posited a question in my OP instead of a statement - I wish I would have done that. I am very much a live and let live person - I like car racing, heavy metal, Gordon Lightfoot, and dislike cigarettes - these are just preferences - each to his own and feel free to disagree.

But yeah, it does diminish my experience and my confidence and trust in others when after arriving with a friendly, "Hello," to be ignored, not greeted likewise, and then hear how everyone was doing 19 mile days and so and so couldn't keep up. I'm pretty positive that that chatter was for my ears as there was only silence as I was walking up on the shelter. Then only after being there for five minutes and picking up a couple handfuls of trash their only greeting went pretty much like, "Which direction were you coming from? Is there any trail magic at the gap." To me, that IS just rude and crass, and if it were my child making that comment he would get a talkin'.

Ultimately, ScareBear, your implication is right, it is exactly NOTHING to ME, except for a rub. And I don't think you need to be cheesed up me for it - personal choice and all that.

I made my original post and that is why I hope many people post here, to try to get answers to questions that they have.

I like parties and all that, but I don't think Hell Hole Holler is the place for them any more than someone would be bothered if I set up a laser projector and showed a movie at a shelter. I have never really bitched on this forum about entitled attitudes - each to his own - but I have been hiking around here for 20 years, and attitudes like I describe here I judge as negative, the ARE increasing and I think can be directly fueled by what are well meaning intentions.

Well, you started off by admitting that you were a grouchy old dude....:rolleyes:

Your post is part of a growing trend against trail magic or helping thrus with their journey. I still fail to see how any of it affects you or anyone else.

It is as if, somehow, the AT with all it's campsites and shelters has become sacred ground and the "general public" is to be chastised for using it. And, the folks I see/hear most complaining about TM/feeds/gulps/trash-outs haven't thru'd or even done a complete Section. Yeah, I don't care for ANY camper/hiker who can't keep their noise to themselves. But, those are the exception really. Not the rule. And, it really doesn't have anything to do with TM. Highlife's dealio on Max was over by 10p and everyone was cowboy'd out enjoying the nightlight of a full moon in 45F and 40mph winds....even though there was...shudder...beer involved.

And, yeah, if there is a "message" along with the TM, I don't go for it and agree it shouldn't be alongside the TM...I got some TM that had a sticker on it with the Church's name and "message on it...almost too steep a price sticker for me...almost...lolol.....

Yeah, there are some folks that get addicted to the wide-eyed "thank you''s that you get for a simple Coke at a forlorn, mosquito-plagued gap with nothing but a trickle of sour water in a damp dank stream bed. No doubt. But, if they clean up after themselves....what is the dealio? Really. An "entitlement" attitude? The attitude of hiking towards free something? Sorry if it seemed like I was spewing vitriol at you. I was venting a bit on the topic in general.

Whatever TM we do is pretty much trash-outs and jug water for refills at gaps. If a hiker needs something, like a bandage, blister kit, electro tabs, shoelace, whatever....we are happy to provide it. Big deal. The shoelace is a custom job from a spool of paracord....lolol....

Honestly, the things that get the most response/appreciation are trash-outs, replacement ziploc baggies, Cokes and packs of tissue or wipes. We don't provide beer. Apples are a surprise huge hit as well....just sayin....

Just last weekend after only a couple of days we left with more than 20 pounds of extra garbage from mostly thru hikers, not including the freaking tire some jackwagon left in the middle of a USFS hell road....I mean I get that the damn road ripped it off, but take the freaking thing with you...grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

I also think that some people are just chapped by the fact that the AT crosses "roads" that the "general public" can access with their vehicles. Well...most of their vehicles...don't bring your Miata....but your minivan may actually work. I've seen two on that incredibly crappy "road" that is the North route from Max to Brown Spring Gap. Wowza...no wonder that tire was in the middle....minivans....

If it's after 10pm and noise is keeping me up, it's my fault. I didn't hike hard enough.

[TrappedInsideACube]

A runner on a hiking trail complaining of someone supporting trail backpackers. The irony.

Trail runners are hikers too; we're just faster.

[GoLight]

It comes up, but I am going to be a bitchy old man and bring it up again.

Yesterday I took a little trail run to Hogback Ridge shelter. There was a group, and there was the all too typical swagger. And then there was the question: "Is there any trail magic at Sam's Gap?"

I told them that there is a trashcan, a water source, and a warm apple in my car. They seemed disappointed.

Of course I am slightly jealous that I can't hack out a significant chunk out of my calendar to take a long hike until this fall. And I always enjoy coming across a beer in a spring or an unexpected snack and often partake. But something in the tone rubbed me the wrong way. Apparently someone was serving heavy fare at Max Patch a week or so ago and they were wishing that every crossing had that set-up.

It is like bears and hiker food. Don't feed the bears.

Almost all of the posts on this thread have pretty much ignored what the OP said/asked/deduced. Some of the younger hikers have an entitled attitude. If they don´t get trail magic at every crossing they bitch. Its almost as if they don´t pack their own food because they expect trail magic to feed them day after day. I´ve seen it, and I agree with the OP, don´t feed the ¨bears¨, it only encourages them. Trail magic is a sacred thing, meant to offer a treat at opportune moments. Its not there to feed you day after day.

[Miner]

I remember when I hiked the PCT. Just after Tahoe, I ran into a nice man who was out for 2 weeks giving some trail support to his daughter who had just gotten back on the trail after being off with an injury. For several days, I'd run into him at a road crossing and he'd give me and other hikers a soda or gatoraide. A few days later, I stopped seeing him as I was hiking faster than his daughter. However, for the next several weeks, whenever I'd come to a road, I would get a strong craving for a soda and would constantly be hoping for trail magic. I later likened it to becoming a "park" bear that got habituated to human food and no longer wanted his natural diet. So yes, unexpected trail magic is great, but it shouldn't be overdone or it raises further expectations of it.

[Puddlefish]

Almost all of the posts on this thread have pretty much ignored what the OP said/asked/deduced. Some of the younger hikers have an entitled attitude. If they don´t get trail magic at every crossing they bitch. Its almost as if they don´t pack their own food because they expect trail magic to feed them day after day. I´ve seen it, and I agree with the OP, don´t feed the ¨bears¨, it only encourages them. Trail magic is a sacred thing, meant to offer a treat at opportune moments. Its not there to feed you day after day.
I didn't address it from the entitled point of view, because i didn't see it personally. In 600 miles last year, I met exactly two hikers who seemed just a little bit overly excited about trail magic. About the only vaguely negative" impact was that they rushed off immediately ditching the group in mid conversation. Certainly nothing to take offense at, unless you're looking to be offended. A lot of hikers talked abut various trail magic/feeds they enjoyed or missed. It was just another topic of conversation, like chatting about gear, views, or elevation.

I met no one who didn't pack sufficient food, no one that relied on hiker feeds. I met rich people who stayed in fancy inns, and poor people who largely skipped the towns, and they got along well with each other on the trail. There were all sorts of odd people on the trail, who annoyed me in tiny ways. I can't pretend that I'm enough of a mind reader to determine if anyone felt entitled or not.

I'm not a fan of hiker feeds for other reasons, but some sort of "it allows unworthy people to hike" reasoning just seems bizarre to me.

[ScareBear]

Almost all of the posts on this thread have pretty much ignored what the OP said/asked/deduced. Some of the younger hikers have an entitled attitude. If they don´t get trail magic at every crossing they bitch. Its almost as if they don´t pack their own food because they expect trail magic to feed them day after day. I´ve seen it, and I agree with the OP, don´t feed the ¨bears¨, it only encourages them. Trail magic is a sacred thing, meant to offer a treat at opportune moments. Its not there to feed you day after day.

I've never met a thru that has bitched if they don't get trail magic at every crossing. Never. Ever. How many have you REALLY met that have done this? How many thru's have you actually met? Me...hard to say....more than.....50 this year....probably more than 500 lifetime....I've shared camp with more than 30 so far this year. All but one has been awesome this year. There is always an outlier or two. This guy wasn't evil, just terminally clingy/annoying/yakking. None were looking for a handout or felt entitled.

I've never met a thru that didn't pack enough food because they were counting on TM. Never. Ever. How many have you REALLY met? I have met people who say they are thru's that did not arrive in GA with appropriate gear and have tried to mooch everything from food to tents. I don't think any of those misguided fools ever made it out of GA or were serious contenders for a thru, let alone making out of GA. BTW, I've taken food OFF of thru's who have admittedly packed too much! No thru has EVER asked for $$. Only a couple have tried to mooch a ride at a gap where there was a shuttle available by phone.

And, more to the fact, precisely WHERE have you encountered these thru's? Anywhere but the first 80 miles in GA?

And, finally(?), let's get back to my point. If a thru wants TM at every crossing, what is it to YOU? If a thru wants TM's to feed his thru, what is it to YOU? If a thru feels entitled to TM, what is it to you? Do you think those particular thrus will be any less of jerks without TM? Nope. They will probably be looking right at YOU for it!!!!! LMAO!!! Like an attitude will disappear if TM goes away...I could write a book about all the entitled stupidity I have heard on the AT by non-thrus...let's start with this entitlement. "What do you mean there isn't a bathroom except for the shelters?"

[egilbe]

Haha, reminds me of two nobo hikers we met just after Grafton Notch State Park. One was complaining there was no soda in the trail magic bucket, only beer. I laughed at him.

[BuckeyeBill]

I can remember when trail magic to me was walking into a town, between 1.5-2 miles, and having an elderly couple pull up and ask me if I was a thru hiker. I said "Yes Ma'am" and they told me to get in their car they would give me a ride. They were dress in their Sunday best returning from church services and while their car was not new it was very clean. While I was not caked in mud, I was dirty and worried about getting their car dirty. Both said not to worry. The next thing I know, I am their house having a hot shower, while the lady of the house was washing my clothes. She even washed them twice, as they weren't clean enough for her. They fed a wonderful meal and asked me to stay the night. I did decline, telling them I just needed to get some groceries and then head on down the trail. They took me to the store and took me back to the trail head and wished me luck. THAT IS TRAIL MAGIC!!!!

I have seen unprepared hikers all along trails. I don't think anyone wants to see some one not finish, so you gently offer advise, encouragement, and guidance. Some people try to walk a thru on a very, very tight budget. They don't plan for bad weather or other extenuating circumstances. I think it is great that they are trying, but you do need a reasonable budget to at least attempt to finish. Running out of cash is one of, if not the number one reason for having to quit the trail and go home, with injury a close second. Should it matter to me, should I care? To some people the answer is NO. But I do care. If I can help some one with an equipment repair, (Yes I do carry common repair gear), or hand some one an extra meal pouch that I know I won't use why shouldn't I? I always make sure to do so no one else sees it and causes embarrassment to them.

While I have seen a few people complain about TM not being available over four decades of hiking, these same people are the ones at hostels who clean out a hiker box of everything edible. Again, should I care? Yea I should, what about the next person who may need a helping hand, oh yea, screw them they should have prepared better. I have bought extra food to put in the hiker box, because it is the right thing to do. I have waited until the mooch leaves before putting it in the box, figuring they got their share already.

I was sectioning the AT one year and a female was in a shelter soaking wet as it had been raining hard. She seemed really timid and it appear as if she was shy about changing in front of the others. I walked over to her and pointed to my hammock and tarp setup and told her she could go there and change her clothes. She looked at me and I told not to worry I won't let anyone look. She smiled and returned and said thanks. Was it a big thing? Not to me, but to her it was. Was that trail magic? Maybe not to some but to her it was what she needed at the time.

So yes what others do and when they act like an entitled little brat that they are, I try ignoring them first. Then If they don't shut up yea I say something.

This post is not, in any way, directed at any previous post presented here. They are just my thoughts on the issue.

[LittleRock]

This thread reminds me why I avoid hiking the AT during peak season.

[bayview]

I at times live my bucket list by doing trail magic. I do remember about 3 years ago, I was giving RCs and Moonpies around Siler Bald. One man sat and talked with me for an hour. We had a great chat. I gave him my email asking him to keep me posted for his thru hike. Around Oct, I got an email from him telling me that my spirits and chat kept him motivated the entire hike. He said he was earlier thinking of stopping at Franklin and quiting, but I motivated him and he finished.

That is what I think is trail magic. Expecting it is not magic. Unexpected is what makes something magical.

When I hike next month as a section hiker, I do not feel obligated to partake but some feel that if it there take it regardless.

[4eyedbuzzard]

I think a lot of the issue is just is old farts remembering a time when TM was virtually always just random acts of kindness. Planned/ promoted hiker feeds are also much more a southern thing. You won't run into many on the northern half of the trail.

[MuddyWaters]

Trail magic is when the trail provides , out of the blue, what you really need, at the time you need it the most.

By very definition, a hiker MUST be in need.

It might be food, water, ride, money, lodging, moral support, etc .

[GoLight]

I can remember when trail magic to me was walking into a town, between 1.5-2 miles, and having an elderly couple pull up and ask me if I was a thru hiker. I said "Yes Ma'am" and they told me to get in their car they would give me a ride. They were dress in their Sunday best returning from church services and while their car was not new it was very clean. While I was not caked in mud, I was dirty and worried about getting their car dirty. Both said not to worry. The next thing I know, I am their house having a hot shower, while the lady of the house was washing my clothes. She even washed them twice, as they weren't clean enough for her. They fed a wonderful meal and asked me to stay the night. I did decline, telling them I just needed to get some groceries and then head on down the trail. They took me to the store and took me back to the trail head and wished me luck. THAT IS TRAIL MAGIC!!!!

I have seen unprepared hikers all along trails. I don't think anyone wants to see some one not finish, so you gently offer advise, encouragement, and guidance. Some people try to walk a thru on a very, very tight budget. They don't plan for bad weather or other extenuating circumstances. I think it is great that they are trying, but you do need a reasonable budget to at least attempt to finish. Running out of cash is one of, if not the number one reason for having to quit the trail and go home, with injury a close second. Should it matter to me, should I care? To some people the answer is NO. But I do care. If I can help some one with an equipment repair, (Yes I do carry common repair gear), or hand some one an extra meal pouch that I know I won't use why shouldn't I? I always make sure to do so no one else sees it and causes embarrassment to them.

While I have seen a few people complain about TM not being available over four decades of hiking, these same people are the ones at hostels who clean out a hiker box of everything edible. Again, should I care? Yea I should, what about the next person who may need a helping hand, oh yea, screw them they should have prepared better. I have bought extra food to put in the hiker box, because it is the right thing to do. I have waited until the mooch leaves before putting it in the box, figuring they got their share already.

I was sectioning the AT one year and a female was in a shelter soaking wet as it had been raining hard. She seemed really timid and it appear as if she was shy about changing in front of the others. I walked over to her and pointed to my hammock and tarp setup and told her she could go there and change her clothes. She looked at me and I told not to worry I won't let anyone look. She smiled and returned and said thanks. Was it a big thing? Not to me, but to her it was. Was that trail magic? Maybe not to some but to her it was what she needed at the time.

So yes what others do and when they act like an entitled little brat that they are, I try ignoring them first. Then If they don't shut up yea I say something.

This post is not, in any way, directed at any previous post presented here. They are just my thoughts on the issue.
This thread reminds me why I like backpack camping. Thank you BuckeyeBill, you´ve hit the nail on the head.

[TexasBob]

I can remember when trail magic to me was walking into a town, between 1.5-2 miles, and having an elderly couple pull up and ask me if I was a thru hiker. I said "Yes Ma'am" and they told me to get in their car they would give me a ride. They were dress in their Sunday best returning from church services and while their car was not new it was very clean. While I was not caked in mud, I was dirty and worried about getting their car dirty. Both said not to worry. The next thing I know, I am their house having a hot shower, while the lady of the house was washing my clothes. She even washed them twice, as they weren't clean enough for her. They fed a wonderful meal and asked me to stay the night. I did decline, telling them I just needed to get some groceries and then head on down the trail. They took me to the store and took me back to the trail head and wished me luck. THAT IS TRAIL MAGIC!!!!
................

To me the true trail angels are the local folks who provide support like these folks did out of the goodness of their heart. How many times did a local provide a hitch that saved you from a long walk to town or worse? I saw people I hiked with gradually come to expect such things as the miles piled up and it bothered me that they seemed to take for granted the help locals provided as we moved northward. Hiker entitlement is not new, this was 9 years ago when a hiker feed was a Twinkle and Coke (rarely encountered). It is hard not to feel special when you have hiked a few hundred miles but when the locals get fed up with arrogant hikers, the AT will be in trouble and thru hiking will become a lot more difficult.

[BuckeyeBill]

People need to remember what another wise WB member said. When you are hiking the trail you are on vacation. Do you go on a standard style vacation and expect the locals to pay for everything for you? Buy your food and drinks, then if someone sets up a TM opportunity all the better. But realize you are on vacation.

[Mr. Bumpy]

To me the true trail angels are the local folks who provide support like these folks did out of the goodness of their heart. How many times did a local provide a hitch that saved you from a long walk to town or worse? I saw people I hiked with gradually come to expect such things as the miles piled up and it bothered me that they seemed to take for granted the help locals provided as we moved northward. Hiker entitlement is not new, this was 9 years ago when a hiker feed was a Twinkle and Coke (rarely encountered). It is hard not to feel special when you have hiked a few hundred miles but when the locals get fed up with arrogant hikers, the AT will be in trouble and thru hiking will become a lot more difficult.


97X Bam. That's it!

[Cosmo]

Trail magic should be unexpected for both the receiver and the giver.

Of course then there are 6000 trail volunteers who do trail magic all year long...

Cosmo

[lonehiker]

The graspy thing on my Frogg Togg zipper broke off many years ago. I did not abandon all hope though. The next camp area I simply looked around the fire pit until I found a bread bag twist-tie. Worked like a charm. Trail magic or litter?

[BuckeyeBill]

Litter turned to TM

[Singto]

Trail Magic = Any unexpected act of kindness.

[Rain Man]

Trail Magic = Any unexpected act of kindness.

True, but not only. Finding something you need is even more truly magical. Need a bandana? Find one snaged on a bush. That's "magic."

[Tipi Walter]

A little left field, but here's REAL TRAIL MAGIC---

https://photos.smugmug.com/Gear-TheSevenHolyNylons/Tents-I-Have-Known/i-ZPzPTvk/0/6416d7e5/XL/tRIP%20182%20%28314%29-XL.jpg

Pic taken on my last trip and this would be May 6, 2017 in the mountains of North Carolina.

[Old Hiker]

i will give them beer. i'm a trail devil

Not just beer, if I recall correctly from an early road crossing in 2016. You and Pirate were there giving out the "hard stuff" as well. Mostly, MOSTLY, to the younger female types. :rolleyes: In fact, I believe a young lady I kept up with for a while got her Trail name from YOUR Trail magic - Hard Stuff or Hard Liquor or some such.

I was 2 days down the Trail before someone told me who the two *ahem* "older" Trail Magicians had been. I did not partake, but I truly appreciated the gesture. Wish I had known - I would have greatly enjoyed a picture with a couple of legends.

[Lone Wolf]

Not just beer, if I recall correctly from an early road crossing in 2016. You and Pirate were there giving out the "hard stuff" as well. Mostly, MOSTLY, to the younger female types. :rolleyes: In fact, I believe a young lady I kept up with for a while got her Trail name from YOUR Trail magic - Hard Stuff or Hard Liquor or some such.

I was 2 days down the Trail before someone told me who the two *ahem* "older" Trail Magicians had been. I did not partake, but I truly appreciated the gesture. Wish I had known - I would have greatly enjoyed a picture with a couple of legends.

Hogpen gap. beer, wine and liquor. and pirate grilled hot dogs. the gal with the alcohol related name was from Belgium

[Riocielo]

I at times live my bucket list by doing trail magic. I do remember about 3 years ago, I was giving RCs and Moonpies around Siler Bald. One man sat and talked with me for an hour. We had a great chat. I gave him my email asking him to keep me posted for his thru hike. Around Oct, I got an email from him telling me that my spirits and chat kept him motivated the entire hike. He said he was earlier thinking of stopping at Franklin and quiting, but I motivated him and he finished.

That is what I think is trail magic. Expecting it is not magic. Unexpected is what makes something magical.

When I hike next month as a section hiker, I do not feel obligated to partake but some feel that if it there take it regardless.

RCs and Moonpies!?! You'd be popular in my town, Mobile, Alabama. On New Year's Eve our town raises a giant Moonpie at midnight. During Marci Gras, all the parades throw moonpies, too. We even have a Moonpie store where the moonpies are made fresh!


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[Riocielo]

Trail magic is when the trail provides , out of the blue, what you really need, at the time you need it the most.

By very definition, a hiker MUST be in need.

It might be food, water, ride, money, lodging, moral support, etc .

We encountered this type of TM this week. We were descending Blood Mountain and weren't sure we were still on the trail. Up behind us comes Marty who hiked with us for a while and gave us the TM of much-needed encouragement and moral support. If we hadn't met his wife at Neels Gap I would have been convinced Marty was actually an angel.


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[Theosus]

I think it's the entitled generation AND a sense of expectation. "If everyone else is getting it why shouldn't I?"
its not just the AT it's everywhere. My wife is on several Disney boards and lots of people whine about not getting "pixie dust" or "extra magic" - unexpected room upgrades, bonus fast passes, etc. Everyone seems to expect free stuff just for showing up like everyone else. I like Trail magic, I've run into it once and it was very nice. But I don't expect it. It makes a nice surprise