View Full Version : First ever thru-hike in 85 days possible? 25mpd.
bishbash
05-19-2017, 07:17
The reason I am asking is that it is much easier to get a 90 day visa. My experience is I've done a few coast 2 coast walks in England they are about 200 miles and quickest I did it in was 8 days I think, It is only 11 of these in a row, no big deal. That was a few years ago. I am much fitter and slimmer now than then. I have done ironman triathlons, 5 mile swims 41 mile ultra runs and a 3:28 marathon in the last few years. While I accept this is different to walking 25 miles day in day out up and down hills with a rucksack, It still makes me far better prepared than when I did those coast to coast walks. So a 90 day visa, a day getting to start and from finish to airport, plus a few zero days. 3 months off work will be much easier to sell to my boss than 5 or 6 months. I've got a good pair of legs on me, I can travel quite light and, touch wood, I don't pick up injuries as a general rule - even when doing 20 hours of exercise a week for ironman training. The AT is something I have wanted to do for 20 years, I will be 40 next January and I fancy doing the Brighton marathon on April 15 then getting a flight to Atlanta on April 16th and then trail day 1 = April 17th. All done and dusted and get a flight back to blighty about July 15th, back in work soon after. Am so excited about it, I am feeling like I might actually do this.
So is this a reasonable aim, bearing in mind most people take a more leisurely 5-7 months.
(Note: The only answer I want to hear is "yes")
dudeman_atl
05-19-2017, 07:22
My 100 Day Appalachian Trail Thru-Hike: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYYwNtuG8QTj7eIkalb_jjoZWiz7e9ZVb
You will likely hear a chorus of people saying it is impossible. Here is the answer to your question.
http://www.postholer.com/journal/Pacific-Crest-Trail/2011/gg-man/2011-11-05/Can-you-Should-you/27590
dudeman_atl
05-19-2017, 07:25
Another very strong hiker is Early_Riser_71 who is on day 92 and isn't quite done.
bishbash
05-19-2017, 07:26
Would also be interested to know what the minimum weight of rucksack people have taken. Hopefully I can maybe get away without much cold weather gear. Just walk in shorts and tshirts, maybe 1 pair of combat trousers. Walking boots, baseball cap. Food and water, toothpaste, toothbrush, shower gel, mobile phone, wallet, contact lens stuff and spectacles, cheap poncho, 1xlightweight fleece, sleeping bag, 1 pair of trainers, 1 pair of trousers, socks and underwear, small towel, shaving gear (not using this as an excuse to go unshaven, that is most unseemly). I am a naturally light packer so sure if anyone can do it threadbare it is me.
bishbash
05-19-2017, 07:32
Interesting read malto. My plan is similar to that said in the document. I doubt I will necessarily hike fast, just will put more hours in. I will also hike light. As I said I will be doing a marathon before I leave and part of that marathon training will be putting in as much as 100miles per week running, much of it hilly. Whilst this isn't hiking with a backpack it will give me tough legs. I feel confident, just need the visa ok and the work ok and I'm there.
rocketsocks
05-19-2017, 07:39
Sure, go for it kid!
ARambler
05-19-2017, 07:42
I see one hiker in four make it at all. I see lots of British hikers, who have a higher success rate, and they all have 6 month visas. For me, a four month hike is reasonable, but 100 days is 20 % faster and perhaps possible, but not reasonable. Your hike would be another 15 % faster. At some point you are not entitled to hike another 15 % faster.
Rumor has it that you can leave to Canada, and come back, butt not sure that is with the 3 month visas and I have not actually met anyone doing this. Get a 3 month visa.
ARambler
05-19-2017, 07:43
I see one hiker in four make it at all. I see lots of British hikers, who have a higher success rate, and they all have 6 month visas. For me, a four month hike is reasonable, but 100 days is 20 % faster and perhaps possible, but not reasonable. Your hike would be another 15 % faster. At some point you are not entitled to hike another 15 % faster.
Rumor has it that you can leave to Canada, and come back, butt not sure that is with the 3 month visas and I have not actually met anyone doing this. Get a 3 month visa.
Get a 6 month visa.
You could do it, but you wouldn't enjoy it. Either get the longer visa or use the loophole and zip to Canada for a day and start the three month clock again. With the money and time wasted going to Canada I strongly recommend that you pay the money and get the extended visa up front. It will give you much more flexibility.
I should have also noted that the Appalachian Trail is a much more rigorous trail than most think it will be. Although 25 miles a day is very achievable on some sections, it is nothing but a pipe dream in others.
Probably. But if it were me, I would push to late May or even June to be able to go as light as possible. Both last year and this year is has snowed in May as far south as the Smokies and even into parts of the Georgia section. People are still carrying their 20* bags this year because of the cold. A 3 month June-August, would put you at the hottest time of the year but also have the least likelihood you don't get crazy lows. Just something to think about.
Last post, I promise. Think very carefully about what rocketsocks said and try to read between the lines. Don't set yourself up for failure. If you do, you've been warned.
Hikingjim
05-19-2017, 08:23
Having 4 months to allow a bit of flexibility would be wise
dudeman_atl
05-19-2017, 09:16
I'm in a north Georgia triathlon club where our motto is "Do Epic ****". Let me know when you need a ride from the airport to the trail head at Springer.
loguon_theguy
05-19-2017, 09:53
Get in REALLY good shape and prepare mentally. Andrew Skurka did it in 3 months back when he wasn't the elite athlete he is today.
loguon_theguy
05-19-2017, 09:55
But I could see how only 5 days of leeway could be pretty risky
bigcranky
05-19-2017, 10:10
Sure it can be done. Possibly even by you :)
I'd second the advice to start in mid to late May to avoid cold weather. You can hike in shorts and a t-shirt the whole time. You'll want a decent sleeping bag or quilt rated to about freezing, a very lightweight tent (your schedule will not allow stopping early in the day at a shelter, nor do you have any leeway if the shelter is full), a good sleeping pad, and the usual kitchen and personal items. I would bring a dry change of clothes for sleeping and a warm layer, plus a decent rain shell though a poncho will work. Resupplying along the way is easy, so no problem with food.
You'll probably want to start the trail at less than 25 mpd, ramp it up through Virginia and the mid-Atlantic states, and then slow it down again through New England. If you are on the trail and realize you won't make it, then you could flip up the trail a few hundred miles. Yeah, then it's not a complete hike, but I'd rather skip ahead and hike New Hampshire and Maine instead of Pennsylvania if I were running out of time. :)
Good luck with the planning and the hike.
evyck da fleet
05-19-2017, 10:21
Let's see, a 2200 mile trail /25 mpd is 88 days. Add a day at the start and end for travel equals 90 days with no leeway. That seems like more of a hassle than whatever getting the 6 month visa will cause. I would think a 3-4 month hike would be more enjoyable than having to worry that if anything goes wrong you'll run out of time.
Maybe you'll surprise yourself and average more than 25 mph or maybe you won't. As with money, just because you have six months doesn't mean you have to use it. But I'd rather have six months if I could.
The reason I am asking is that it is much easier to get a 90 day visa. My experience is I've done a few coast 2 coast walks in England they are about 200 miles and quickest I did it in was 8 days I think, It is only 11 of these in a row, no big deal. That was a few years ago. I am much fitter and slimmer now than then. I have done ironman triathlons, 5 mile swims 41 mile ultra runs and a 3:28 marathon in the last few years. While I accept this is different to walking 25 miles day in day out up and down hills with a rucksack, It still makes me far better prepared than when I did those coast to coast walks. So a 90 day visa, a day getting to start and from finish to airport, plus a few zero days. 3 months off work will be much easier to sell to my boss than 5 or 6 months. I've got a good pair of legs on me, I can travel quite light and, touch wood, I don't pick up injuries as a general rule - even when doing 20 hours of exercise a week for ironman training. The AT is something I have wanted to do for 20 years, I will be 40 next January and I fancy doing the Brighton marathon on April 15 then getting a flight to Atlanta on April 16th and then trail day 1 = April 17th. All done and dusted and get a flight back to blighty about July 15th, back in work soon after. Am so excited about it, I am feeling like I might actually do this.
So is this a reasonable aim, bearing in mind most people take a more leisurely 5-7 months.
(Note: The only answer I want to hear is "yes")
hummmmm.....................well, I guess the answer is yes. Go for it.
capehiker
05-19-2017, 10:38
Look up Follow Bigfoot on YouTube. He did his Thru hike in 100 days last year and has a lot of post hike videos talking about strategy, planning, etc. Can it be done? Sure! The biggest observation I have is people who have never hiked on the southern or northern portions don't/can't grasp the difficulty of it. It's not impossible but knocking out 25-30 miles a day requires experience, conditioning, and a very dialed in kit.
Let's see, a 2200 mile trail /25 mpd is 88 days. Add a day at the start and end for travel equals 90 days with no leeway. That seems like more of a hassle than whatever getting the 6 month visa will cause. I would think a 3-4 month hike would be more enjoyable than having to worry that if anything goes wrong you'll run out of time.
Maybe you'll surprise yourself and average more than 25 mph or maybe you won't. As with money, just because you have six months doesn't mean you have to use it. But I'd rather have six months if I could.
and that math requires no days off...basically a marathon a day for 88 days straight.
Slo-go'en
05-19-2017, 10:54
It's possible to thru hike in less then 90 days as a handful of people have shown. But it's really, really hard to pull off. Having to average 25 MPD, everyday for 85 days puts a big strain on the body. Keep in mind you have to maintain this average even on days when you need to go to town to resupply and shower. And of course, there aren't convenient places camp more or less 25 miles apart, so you often end up having to less then 25 MPD, which have to be made up by doing 30+ mile days.
Many of those who try to maintain that kind of pace right out of the gate end up with injuries before long, like massive blisters or other foot problems, tendon problems, shin splints. You'll also loose a lot of weight since you can't possibly eat enough and after a while that saps your energy.
Rather then beat yourself up trying to do the whole thing in less then 90 days, consider taking your time and enjoy what you can in that time period. Another option is to skip the less interesting part of the AT (the middle section) and just do the south and the north. Doing Springer to Marion, VA, then bumping up to NJ would eliminate a lot of the drudgery and save a lot of time.
Hikingjim
05-19-2017, 11:01
Many of those who try to maintain that kind of pace right out of the gate end up with injuries before long, like massive blisters or other foot problems, tendon problems, shin splints. You'll also loose a lot of weight since you can't possibly eat enough and after a while that saps your energy.
Have to listen to your body when you're going for months.
Know lots of hikers that can easily go 30 miles on any given day (or week) on the AT but know they can't sustain it
Nothing wrong with giving it a go though, and if you don't make it, it's not a failure (just an attempt). It's just a reality that your chances are lower as you reduce your time window and flexibility
English Stu
05-19-2017, 11:15
Hi bishbash, Firstly it will be doable if you can keep your strength up but with few town visits to boost your calorie intake regularly I reckon it could pay on you. I have done 18 of the 19 GB National trails. the C-C is not like the AT. I am retired marathoner and an elite vet triathlete, the fitness will help.
I am in the UK and done over 1000ml in three sections of the AT, the most being 715 mile in ten weeks. Another section was coming halfway home :)from the John Muir Trail; the other the 100 mile wilderness + some. On my ten week hike the best thing that happened was that I hooked up with a guy for seven weeks who introduced me to Zero and Nero days in towns mainly to get food. I had intended to move faster but the enjoyment is vastly increased by living the dream and not just walking.
Managing food and water,a light carry with being flexible was the big lessons I learnt from the AT. Keeping your own schedule can be lonely and that can take effect.
In the 100 mile wilderness I met a fellow Brit with a six month visa who was completing and openly admitted he had broken down three times sobbing during the trip with a bit of homesickness and at those times the enormity of the trail ahead. It is different for us; we are a long way from home- so are some of those from the US but least they are still on their home continent and some get family visits, can take in a TV game in a town which is familiar.
Yes the internet/social media is great but that for some can make things worse as they get messages. I forgot all that and said to her indoors I will get in touch when I can, which I did.
Whatever enjoy your hike.
James GAME2009
05-19-2017, 11:17
With your resume of endurance activities, I think you're well suited to make an attempt at a sub-90 thru. The major difference, as others have pointed out, is that this is an every day activity, not a one-day or one-week activity. Absolutely heed the advice of others concerning a May start date. If you start in April, a snowstorm or other weather event is likely to become the "excuse" you need to bail.
Keep in mind that it is just walking. You need to start walking early and keep walking late. You will see as much of the trail and views as everyone else, and likely much more wildlife due to starting hiking earlier and continuing hiking later. I would recommend you consider going with no stove. You will likely be tired at the end of the day and taking the time to cook and then clean will seem like a major chore.
There are a few things you need to keep in mind. You will be hiking all day in the cold rain multiple times. Being up early, you will be the first down the trail, getting covered in spider webs, likely until you make it to the next shelter or two. You will want to aim for 30 miles per day, with 20-ish miles per day on town resupply days. You can count on a 3mph average, possibly slightly more, but you will not hit 4mph. In NH and southern Maine this will drop.
I think that a 90-day thru is an excellent way to see the trail. If you accomplish your goal, you will truly feel that you have accomplished something, as you will have absolutely earned it! Give it a go!
You could do it, but you wouldn't enjoy it. Either get the longer visa or use the loophole and zip to Canada for a day and start the three month clock again. With the money and time wasted going to Canada I strongly recommend that you pay the money and get the extended visa up front. It will give you much more flexibility.
How do you know if he would enjoy it?
Have to listen to your body when you're going for months.
Know lots of hikers that can easily go 30 miles on any given day (or week) on the AT but know they can't sustain it
Nothing wrong with giving it a go though, and if you don't make it, it's not a failure (just an attempt). It's just a reality that your chances are lower as you reduce your time window and flexibility
Here's my rule of thumb to address whether you can sustain the pace. You should be able to do 150% of your max single day mileage and get up and walk the next day. So, if you are shooting for 28mpd out the gate which is what I would do in your case then I would train IN SIMILIAR TERRAIN to be able to comfortable do a 42 mile day. I have used this rule of thum for the last 8 years to get a pretty good idea what I would be capable of doing on a trail like the Colorado Trail this summer.
The above rule of thumb also lines up with Swamis advice of not pushing yourself beyond about 70% on a multiday hike. I will also throw another one out. Don't overdo the miles today if it will keep you from doing your average tomorrow, that is all about multiday pacing which is going to be the biggest learning that you haven't seen in your training.
The reason I am asking is that it is much easier to get a 90 day visa. My experience is I've done a few coast 2 coast walks in England they are about 200 miles and quickest I did it in was 8 days I think, It is only 11 of these in a row, no big deal.
Why limit yourself to 85 days of walking 3-4mph for 15-20 hours? Just run half the time and you can do it in 60 or maybe beat the record of 45! Seriously, if you're trying to get it done as quickly as possible you might as well trail run it. All of those who have attempted and completed the AT in 100 or less days have no time to stop and enjoy anything. They all lament this once they've completed it or quit. So, calling it a hike isn't accurate, it's more of an endurance challenge for the body and the definitely the mind.
If you want a more prestigious accomplishment just sign up or the Barkley Marathons next year. It's only 100 miles.
Why limit yourself to 85 days of walking 3-4mph for 15-20 hours? Just run half the time and you can do it in 60 or maybe beat the record of 45! Seriously, if you're trying to get it done as quickly as possible you might as well trail run it. All of those who have attempted and completed the AT in 100 or less days have no time to stop and enjoy anything. They all lament this once they've completed it or quit. So, calling it a hike isn't accurate, it's more of an endurance challenge for the body and the definitely the mind.
If you want a more prestigious accomplishment just sign up or the Barkley Marathons next year. It's only 100 miles.
***? Do you always make up statements and pronounce them as fact?
***? Do you always make up statements and pronounce them as fact?
I'll bite. Since you quoted the whole post, I'm not sure which part you are referring to. Surely you're not referring to the entire post.
Starchild
05-19-2017, 13:56
It can be done, but I would question if one can get the AT thru hiking experience in that time. The AT in traditional NoBo form is a traveling community, you know many of the hikers and will see them time and time again. It is part of that experience and what attracts many to do the AT Thru and what is in some opinions causing a overuse issue on the trail, in other opinions is much better for the trail, expanding its appeal and benefits to many more people. If you want to experience this part of the AT Thru hike your timeframe will not work and in 90 days you will have to just do a long section hike and become a LASHER (Long Ass Section HikER), or find some way of doing the thru by extending the time.
earlyriser26
05-19-2017, 14:49
Like everyone else, it is possible, but unlikely. Also, a thru hike can become a job. This seems like a very bad job. The only good thing I can say about a speed hike is that you will only have to carry about half the consumable supplies of a typical hiker, because you will hit resupply points often. Get a longer visa or cut out northern pennsylvania (belive me you won't regret it).
Lone Wolf
05-19-2017, 14:54
The reason I am asking is that it is much easier to get a 90 day visa. My experience is I've done a few coast 2 coast walks in England they are about 200 miles and quickest I did it in was 8 days I think, It is only 11 of these in a row, no big deal. That was a few years ago. I am much fitter and slimmer now than then. I have done ironman triathlons, 5 mile swims 41 mile ultra runs and a 3:28 marathon in the last few years. While I accept this is different to walking 25 miles day in day out up and down hills with a rucksack, It still makes me far better prepared than when I did those coast to coast walks. So a 90 day visa, a day getting to start and from finish to airport, plus a few zero days. 3 months off work will be much easier to sell to my boss than 5 or 6 months. I've got a good pair of legs on me, I can travel quite light and, touch wood, I don't pick up injuries as a general rule - even when doing 20 hours of exercise a week for ironman training. The AT is something I have wanted to do for 20 years, I will be 40 next January and I fancy doing the Brighton marathon on April 15 then getting a flight to Atlanta on April 16th and then trail day 1 = April 17th. All done and dusted and get a flight back to blighty about July 15th, back in work soon after. Am so excited about it, I am feeling like I might actually do this.
So is this a reasonable aim, bearing in mind most people take a more leisurely 5-7 months.
(Note: The only answer I want to hear is "yes")
yes. totally reasonable. go for it
BuckeyeBill
05-19-2017, 16:06
I won't say yea or nay, because you do have a very respectful resume behind you and I would never take someone's dream away from them. I would suggest a trip to the Scottish Highlands where you can get in some decent mountain work and see if you can do 25 MPD there. The other thing I would suggest is talking to your boss now instead of waiting until it is almost time to leave. You may be surprised to learn he/she would give you a 6 month LOA. If not, you can try for the 90 days then. I would float the 6 month thing first and ask him/her to think it over. If his/her answer is no, wait a few days and ask him/her if 90 days would be possible. If they are familiar with your current activities they may go either way. Best of luck to you.
ScareBear
05-19-2017, 19:17
The reason I am asking is that it is much easier to get a 90 day visa. My experience is I've done a few coast 2 coast walks in England they are about 200 miles and quickest I did it in was 8 days I think, It is only 11 of these in a row, no big deal. That was a few years ago. I am much fitter and slimmer now than then. I have done ironman triathlons, 5 mile swims 41 mile ultra runs and a 3:28 marathon in the last few years. While I accept this is different to walking 25 miles day in day out up and down hills with a rucksack, It still makes me far better prepared than when I did those coast to coast walks. So a 90 day visa, a day getting to start and from finish to airport, plus a few zero days. 3 months off work will be much easier to sell to my boss than 5 or 6 months. I've got a good pair of legs on me, I can travel quite light and, touch wood, I don't pick up injuries as a general rule - even when doing 20 hours of exercise a week for ironman training. The AT is something I have wanted to do for 20 years, I will be 40 next January and I fancy doing the Brighton marathon on April 15 then getting a flight to Atlanta on April 16th and then trail day 1 = April 17th. All done and dusted and get a flight back to blighty about July 15th, back in work soon after. Am so excited about it, I am feeling like I might actually do this.
So is this a reasonable aim, bearing in mind most people take a more leisurely 5-7 months.
(Note: The only answer I want to hear is "yes")
Sure, you can do it. Maybe. Depends on the weather. And a host of other variables. But, I have a question. Why would you want to do something so ambitious and then get...oh...200 miles from the end on day 85? Or would you figure you were a goner long before, and just give up on your "dream" somewhere before New York? What is the major impediment to obtaining a 6 month visa?
Finally, since I am the ScareyBear, there is another variable you must consider. Elevation gain/loss, but primarily elevation gain. What is your maximum elevation gain in a single day? Have you looked at the elevation profiles for Georgia, North Carolina, and Tennessee yet? How used to climbing 1000 feet per mile are you? Descending 1000 feet per mile? Can you do a 10,000 foot elevation gain/loss in a single day? That's almost two miles...
You seem to have the potential. I'd love to see you blog/vlog your effort!
ARambler
05-19-2017, 20:00
Not sure why we assume nobo. Most speed hikers go sobo.
If you go home for the winter and come back in early spring, it is officially a thru hike (within a 12 month window). So no trip to Canada required.
Big difference between hiking the AT in 85 Days, and starting a thru having to hike the AT in 85 days.
All the people who have done the former get my respect.
Any new hiker who does the latter gets my sympathy.
So you have a 90-day visa, 85 days to thru-hike the AT, your hiking experience is all in the UK it seems. You are talking about hiking 25 miles per day every day. Figure you take NO zero days..85 days x 25 miles per day comes out to 2125 miles. The AT is closer to 2200 miles (2175 or so back in 2006).
Let me spell it out for you about your odds of your accomplishing your stated goal:
NOT.GONNA.HAPPEN!!!!!
Lone Wolf
05-19-2017, 20:41
bishbash, listen to nobody. you do your thing. big mistake asking advice on here
saltysack
05-19-2017, 21:29
I'm in a north Georgia triathlon club where our motto is "Do Epic ****". Let me know when you need a ride from the airport to the trail head at Springer.
Well said!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You could do it, but you wouldn't enjoy it. ...
Why wouldn't he enjoy it? Totally subjective call.
Try it OP, Hike for 85 days, maybe you finish, maybe you don't
glenlawson
05-20-2017, 14:09
Lone Wolf is correct, but I'll jump in anyway. Take the dudeman from Atlanta up on his offer. Having someone who can take your from the airport to the trail with a quick stop at an outfitter store will be a real boost. I'm sure you can do this, Marathoners and Tri-Athletes see a real challenge in knocking out the miles.
Logistically, you might want to go with the 6 month visa. If you have 90 days, that's from customs in Atlanta to check in at Portland (or whatever airports you are using). That doesn't give you much extra time to deal with food, replace shoes, equipment, or what ever else might happen in those 85 days. I looked at Meltzer's trail run last night and while he did it in 46 days, his support team did everything. You'll be doing this self-supported in every sense of the word. If you can find other endurance athletes who can support you in any way, that would be great.
Good luck!
Why limit yourself to 85 days of walking 3-4mph for 15-20 hours? Just run half the time and you can do it in 60 or maybe beat the record of 45! Seriously, if you're trying to get it done as quickly as possible you might as well trail run it. All of those who have attempted and completed the AT in 100 or less days have no time to stop and enjoy anything. They all lament this once they've completed it or quit. So, calling it a hike isn't accurate, it's more of an endurance challenge for the body and the definitely the mind.
If you want a more prestigious accomplishment just sign up or the Barkley Marathons next year. It's only 100 miles.
Really???? I hiked the PCT in under 100 days and greatly enjoyed it. There isn't a day that goes by I don't want to go do it again in the exact same style. Keep in mind, not everyone is like you.
MuddyWaters
05-20-2017, 23:57
Many could do it
Many couldnt
Can you? And have fun?
No one here knows.
No harm in trying
Beats typing at a computer keyboard
Really???? I hiked the PCT in under 100 days and greatly enjoyed it. There isn't a day that goes by I don't want to go do it again in the exact same style. Keep in mind, not everyone is like you.
Why directly quote a comment about the AT and then talk about the PCT? The PCT isn't even remotely close to the AT. I've never thru-hiked the AT, so this really isn't about everyone being like me, but of those I've seen that have attempted or completed the AT in 100 or less days it's very clear, to me at least, that it's a grueling task that doesn't afford you the time to smell the flowers, enjoy the towns, explore the blue blazes, etc.
Why directly quote a comment about the AT and then talk about the PCT? The PCT isn't even remotely close to the AT. I've never thru-hiked the AT, so this really isn't about everyone being like me, but of those I've seen that have attempted or completed the AT in 100 or less days it's very clear, to me at least, that it's a grueling task that doesn't afford you the time to smell the flowers, enjoy the towns, explore the blue blazes, etc.Just what I got from watching Bigfoot last year seemed he enjoyed it and finished in 99 days. Now that's not to say that there may have been a couple times where he might have wished he could stay an extra day/night in town or checking something out. But all in all, it seems to me that he had a great time.
garlic08
05-21-2017, 09:00
Why directly quote a comment about the AT and then talk about the PCT? The PCT isn't even remotely close to the AT. I've never thru-hiked the AT, so this really isn't about everyone being like me, but of those I've seen that have attempted or completed the AT in 100 or less days it's very clear, to me at least, that it's a grueling task that doesn't afford you the time to smell the flowers, enjoy the towns, explore the blue blazes, etc.
I agree with Malto. The average hike of the PCT takes about 140 days. To accomplish it in less than 100 is quite a feat that many would call reckless. But he enjoyed it. No reason a fast hiker on the AT can't do the same.
But there is a subtle difference between a fast hike and a speed attempt!
For what it's worth, my average speed on the PCT was about 18 miles per day. When I hiked the AT five years later, my average speed was 20 miles per day. (At 106 days, that was not a speed attempt, just the average pace I'd developed on the PCT and improved on the CDT.) Using that one empirical datum as fact, I can prove the AT is actually easier than the PCT. In fact, I did enjoy the AT more than the previous hikes. I didn't have a single bad day on the AT. Many days on the other trails were definitely "type II fun."
In fairness, I also believe one's first thru-hike is the hardest, no matter which trail it is. For most, that happens to be the AT.
I agree the AT and PCT had few similarities, but I thought the AT's ease of resupply, low elevation, and unbelievable water access greatly eased many aspects of long distance hiking.
Why directly quote a comment about the AT and then talk about the PCT? The PCT isn't even remotely close to the AT. I've never thru-hiked the AT, so this really isn't about everyone being like me, but of those I've seen that have attempted or completed the AT in 100 or less days it's very clear, to me at least, that it's a grueling task that doesn't afford you the time to smell the flowers, enjoy the towns, explore the blue blazes, etc.
I have hiked more miles on the AT than the PCT and while the trails are different the concept of a fast hike is not. And what makes you think that others want to "enjoy towns" and smell flowers? Everyone has different motivations, you don't seem to be to accept this.
Just what I got from watching Bigfoot last year seemed he enjoyed it and finished in 99 days. Now that's not to say that there may have been a couple times where he might have wished he could stay an extra day/night in town or checking something out. But all in all, it seems to me that he had a great time.
It appeared to me that he enjoyed it a lot more when he knew he was going to complete his goal. I met him on the trail in 2016 and he only spoke when I engaged him despite at least 12 hikers being within 5ft of him. He looked beat down, unhappy, and talked about the remaining miles he had to do. He did keep most of his videos positive from what I saw, but I don't think the videos accurately reflected what he was going through out there.
Feral Bill
05-21-2017, 13:24
I have hiked more miles on the AT than the PCT and while the trails are different the concept of a fast hike is not. And what makes you think that others want to "enjoy towns" and smell flowers? Everyone has different motivations, you don't seem to be to accept this.
The OPs stated motivation is to stay inside a 3 month visa. It appears he may be able to do that. He might be wiser to take the trouble to get a 6 month visa, and do the trip as fast or slow as suits him, without excess time pressure.
In fairness, I also believe one's first thru-hike is the hardest, no matter which trail it is. For most, that happens to be the AT.
I agree the AT and PCT had few similarities, but I thought the AT's ease of resupply, low elevation, and unbelievable water access greatly eased many aspects of long distance hiking.
No doubt resupply is easier on the AT, but the cumulative elevation gain is a good deal more than what's encountered on the PCT, and what about this statement from the AMC?
Are the Appalachians lower in elevation? Sure. Do they pack in steeper and more rugged trails than mountain ranges out West on a mile-per-mile basis? Absolutely.And these stats don’t take into account the much more challenging trail conditions you often find in the East compared to out West, including mile after mile of rock-choked, root-crossed trail, as well as some extremely steep and sustained climbs that were seemingly developed before the term ‘switchback’ existed in trail building jargon. Not to mention the more fickle weather conditions of the Appalachians compared to the long, long stretches of sun and favorable weather you get during the summer in many Western states (especially California).
I'm not saying it's impossible to enjoy a 100 day or FKT type of hike, but it's most definitely a grueling task that doesn't afford a person adequate time to enjoy many aspects the trail has to offer. Since a fast hike is focused on making miles, it's seems more about the challenge than sitting on a beautiful vista or spending a zero riverside because it's a great spot. All of these things can be experienced on the AT, but I have yet to see person with a goal like 100 days or FKT actually doing it. Add in aspects like the headache of keeping all of your devices charged so you can upload and document progress and you're leaving little room for the good stuff IMO.
I have hiked more miles on the AT than the PCT and while the trails are different the concept of a fast hike is not. And what makes you think that others want to "enjoy towns" and smell flowers? Everyone has different motivations, you don't seem to be to accept this.
See my previous reply. There are outliers in every random sample. I guess my thinking is more in line with backpacking than thru-hiking. Forgive me! The horse is screaming, so we should quit beating on it and let this thread return to the guy trying to knock out the entire AT in 85 days on a 3-month Visa and find enjoyment doing it.
No doubt resupply is easier on the AT, but the cumulative elevation gain is a good deal more than what's encountered on the PCT, and what about this statement from the AMC?
I'm not saying it's impossible to enjoy a 100 day or FKT type of hike, but it's most definitely a grueling task that doesn't afford a person adequate time to enjoy many aspects the trail has to offer. Since a fast hike is focused on making miles, it's seems more about the challenge than sitting on a beautiful vista or spending a zero riverside because it's a great spot. All of these things can be experienced on the AT, but I have yet to see person with a goal like 100 days or FKT actually doing it. Add in aspects like the headache of keeping all of your devices charged so you can upload and document progress and you're leaving little room for the good stuff IMO.
FYI. The year I hiked the PCT was a huge snow year. Nobody in their right mind was ever suggest hiking that year was easier than the AT. The PCT is also 500 miles longer and I average the similiar mileage on both trails.
However, I have now seen the light. I would like your email so i (and others) can contact you to make sure we would enjoy our trips prior to undertaking it. In fact I see a new career for working for the ATC and maybe the PCTA and other organizations. They could require all hikers to get a certified stamp of -Rush- fun approval prior to undertaking any hike on the trails. They would have to submit a detailed plan of town stops and vista rest points and durations. And at a reasonable cost of $5 it would be a huge moneymaker.
I wish I had had my epiphany a couple of days ago. I did what I thought at the time was a fun 55 mile day Friday night and Saturday. But now I realize how wrong I was. Now my toe blister hurts, my muscles ache, I am physically and mentally exhausted and I missed bing watching the Real Housewives of Atlanta. I now have a whole perspective on hiking thanks to your brilliant insight based on meeting and talking to one hiker for a few minutes.
ARambler
05-21-2017, 14:54
FYI. The year I hiked the PCT was a huge snow year. Nobody in their right mind was ever suggest hiking that year was easier than the AT. The PCT is also 500 miles longer and I average the similiar mileage on both trails.
However, I have now seen the light. I would like your email so i (and others) can contact you to make sure we would enjoy our trips prior to undertaking it. In fact I see a new career for working for the ATC and maybe the PCTA and other organizations. They could require all hikers to get a certified stamp of -Rush- fun approval prior to undertaking any hike on the trails. They would have to submit a detailed plan of town stops and vista rest points and durations. And at a reasonable cost of $5 it would be a huge moneymaker.
I wish I had had my epiphany a couple of days ago. I did what I thought at the time was a fun 55 mile day Friday night and Saturday. But now I realize how wrong I was. Now my toe blister hurts, my muscles ache, I am physically and mentally exhausted and I missed bing watching the Real Housewives of Atlanta. I now have a whole perspective on hiking thanks to your brilliant insight based on meeting and talking to one hiker for a few minutes.
I know this was meant to be cynical, if not hurtful, but it is as humorous as anything I could come up with, so I will continue.
The basis of the OP was that the answer to trying was yes. We all know the odds are low. Lone Wolf predicted MS had a 1:25 chance and LW seems to be a lot more optimistic here. So maybe the odds are only a little worse than average, say 1:5 or 20%. If $5 is a reasonable amount to go to the ATC, I will counter with a $25 pledge if he completes the AT in 88 days by December 2018. Any takers?
I wish I had had my epiphany a couple of days ago. I did what I thought at the time was a fun 55 mile day Friday night and Saturday. But now I realize how wrong I was. Now my toe blister hurts, my muscles ache, I am physically and mentally exhausted and I missed bing watching the Real Housewives of Atlanta. I now have a whole perspective on hiking thanks to your brilliant insight based on meeting and talking to one hiker for a few minutes.
Wow Malto.. I think you need more electrolytes cupcake. 55 mile days? This thread is about a thru-hike, not a trail run. There's a stark difference between the two. A hike by definition is walking, and I've yet to meet a hiker that sustains 4mph, the speed I consider the peak speed of walking, on 15+ grade trails with a backpack or even an UL grocery bag full of Maltodextrin. 55 mile days would require a AVERAGE speed of 4mph through all elevation changes for 12+ hours - enjoyable? That's not hiking, it sounds like grueling challenge-focused running to me. Dare I say 99% of "hikers" would echo this sentiment.
Haha! Hope everyone enjoyed yet another short but sweet battle of the blazes. I'm out! :D
Wow Malto.. I think you need more electrolytes cupcake. 55 mile days? This thread is about a thru-hike, not a trail run. There's a stark difference between the two. A hike by definition is walking, and I've yet to meet a hiker that sustains 4mph, the speed I consider the peak speed of walking, on 15+ grade trails with a backpack or even an UL grocery bag full of Maltodextrin. 55 mile days would require a AVERAGE speed of 4mph through all elevation changes for 12+ hours - enjoyable? That's not hiking, it sounds like grueling challenge-focused running to me. Dare I say 99% of "hikers" would echo this sentiment.
Haha! Hope everyone enjoyed yet another short but sweet battle of the blazes. I'm out! :D
Wasn't a trail run. I averaged 3.2 mph, had my normal BPing gear, experienced a spectacular dusk and dawn, saw more deer than hikers and didn't run a step. It was a very long, consistent day. On the downside, I'm out of maltodextrin, (it was gatoraid and pop tarts fueled) and I had little sleep. Other than the length of the day it was a pretty normal, though slightly faster day.
Do you have a good recipe for electrolyte cupcakes? I had some serious food carvings at the end.
to the OP. I actually thought about this thread quite a bit while hiking yesterday. If I were in your shoes I would do several multiday hikes prior to next year to see if you are capable and willing to hike at this pace. With your running background you have demonstrated either (or both) a good athletic base or a good mental base either of which are a great asset. Where I do agree with many on this thread is that most are not able or willing to do a thru at this pace hence why it is viewed as being drudgery. Only you can answer whether you are capable and/or willing but it's not hard to find out. Good luck
Tough
Pros and cons for your situation compared to others posting here of their or others speedy hikes? Rarely is everything mentioned.
Like most people, Malto found a pace on his hikes that worked for him. I am not sure he had a preset "requirement" to hike the PCT in 100 days or less. Or if that is just the way his hike evolved. It makes a big difference.
Hiking fast is physically hard.
Hiking to even a moderately challenging but inflexible schedule is mentally hard.
Hiking fast on rigid schedule is physically and mentally very hard..
For most new AT thru hikers starting the Trail with the idea you had to finish it in 90 Days is just nuts. Unless finishing the whole thing would be just bonus, and you would be OK with adjusting your goal along the way.
How do you know if he would enjoy it?
Point taken. Everyone hikes the trail for different reasons. I was wrong to assume that he wouldn't enjoy a pure physical challenge with time constraints.
Another option is to skip the less interesting part of the AT (the middle section) and just do the south and the north. Doing Springer to Marion, VA, then bumping up to NJ would eliminate a lot of the drudgery and save a lot of time.
I like that idea, maybe because I found MD and PA to be very boring (except for the historical sites). As some others have noted, NJ is a rather surprising section of trail that I thoroughly enjoyed. NY as well.
Why limit yourself to 85 days of walking 3-4mph for 15-20 hours? Just run half the time and you can do it in 60 or maybe beat the record of 45! Seriously, if you're trying to get it done as quickly as possible you might as well trail run it. All of those who have attempted and completed the AT in 100 or less days have no time to stop and enjoy anything. They all lament this once they've completed it or quit. So, calling it a hike isn't accurate, it's more of an endurance challenge for the body and the definitely the mind.
If you want a more prestigious accomplishment just sign up or the Barkley Marathons next year. It's only 100 miles.
***? Do you always make up statements and pronounce them as fact?
I'll bite. Since you quoted the whole post, I'm not sure which part you are referring to. Surely you're not referring to the entire post.
Apologies for not being completely clear. I was referring to this:
"All of those who have attempted and completed the AT in 100 or less days have no time to stop and enjoy anything. They all lament this once they've completed it or quit."
There may be cases of that, but it's certainly not accurate to imply that no one has ever enjoyed a thru-hike at 25 or more miles per day. Maybe it's not your style, but for those who prefer hiking to camping, it's not that unusual to spend enough hours on the trail to comfortably hit those numbers without rushing.
Not for or against a sub 90 AT thru.
What Rush was getting at which is commonly dismissed by those with such agendas is understanding this...
When you say yes to something, it is imperative that you understand what you are deciding what you are saying no to.
When you say yes to something, it is imperative that you understand what you are deciding to say no to.
rocketsocks
05-22-2017, 20:41
When you say yes to something, it is imperative that you understand what you are deciding to say no to.In and of itself...I like that :)
rocketsocks
05-22-2017, 20:42
...and would think the opposite is also very true.
When you say yes to something, it is imperative that you understand what you are deciding to say no to.
From the second response to the OP on this thread....... I think it sums up both sides of the equation. If you have suggestions then I would be more than open to amend the list.
"Now the most important question, should you?
Just so you know the downsides of a fast schedule....
1) You will likely be hiking solo. There will be few people able and/willing to hike at your pace. I hiked solo until I left the Sierra.
2) You will miss some of the trail town experiences.
3) There will be days when you find that perfect place to camp at mile 18 but you will have to move on another few miles. I probably had much less desirable campsites then the average hiker but I was only using them to sleep.
4) You will feel the schedule pressure. I took five zeros in Tahoe to spend with my wife. I was a couple of days behind due to the high snow and calculated that I would have to average well over 30mpd for the rest of the trip. There were no more zeros and I could feel the schedule driving me to the border. This is also part of the mental game. You can see in my journal times when I struggled with this especially up near Ashland.
But there are positives.
1) You will see more sunrises and sunsets due to longer days. It is a myth that you have to move so fast that you can’t “stop and smell the roses.” My trail speed was just slightly faster than average. But my time lying in a tent was greatly reduced.
2) The main source of satisfaction may be the physical challenge.
3) Because you can “cherry pick” your window you will likely have better weather than the average thru hiker. My late start avoided the rain in SoCal and my early finish avoided most of the rain in Washington. I set my tarp up three nights and was rained on once and snowed on once in 98 days.
4) But the biggest benefit may be that a fast schedule is the only way many could ever have the opportunity to hike a long trail. My fast schedule was the only possible way I could afford to thru hike the PCT; I couldn’t put my life on hold for five months.
So bottom line, you should know what you are getting into, this hike is not for most people. But I enjoyed my experience and would do it again. Enjoy"
Yes Malta those r excellent facets of approaching a sub 90. I read through your journal entry the first time it was posted. Excellent tips.
However, as u r well aware, very fast hikes take more than a high fitness level or athleticism
I strongly expeCT you were a reasonably possibly highly exp
logistically trail life experienced hiker when you did your 100 dy PCT NOBO. This is an important factor in very speedy unsupported hikes. When I see this, not being from the US on a 90 Visa, a person not of Cams world LD experience,
Tinstaafl
05-22-2017, 23:24
Another angle to consider is resupply. Even if you're physically capable of doing those miles per day, as a "foreigner", where's your support? The great majority of throughhikers rely on someone to mail supplies to drop points so they can just pick 'em up and keep rolling. Without that, you'd spend a lot of time shopping vs grab a package and go.
not being recognized from the onset yet expectin only a yes go for it answer it makes me question the sub 90
English Stu
05-23-2017, 06:15
I don't agree not to ask on here, why not learn from other peoples experiences. You can decide what is valid to you or not.
On my hikes I still follow Ray Jardine`s advice and do a shakedown hike of a third of the mileage of the intended hike with all kit, with mileage just as you would intend the full hike. If you accomplish that you are well on your way to completion as you know your kit and fitness are good, your confidence will be great and any gremlins sorted out. 25 mile days in Scotland would be a good test. Advice in these situations is to not to walk fast but walk long...hours.
On my first AT section I met very briefly two of the first likely to finish SOBO hikers. I was also going the south so saw may of their Register posts-walking at five o'clock a.m, massive miles. However starting at five o'clock walking till dark, no time to chat eating biscuits on the hoof; similar on the JMT meeting PCT hikers, again superfit by then just sailing along.
Another angle to consider is resupply. Even if you're physically capable of doing those miles per day, as a "foreigner", where's your support? The great majority of throughhikers rely on someone to mail supplies to drop points so they can just pick 'em up and keep rolling. Without that, you'd spend a lot of time shopping vs grab a package and go.
Thru hikers on the AT don't really need much mailed resupply. Food can be obtained locally. Besides, any equipment or favorite freeze dried food can be ordered from REI and sent to a Post Office farther down the trail. REI doesn't care if you have a UK passport, as long as your credit card works.
The great majority of throughhikers rely on someone to mail supplies to drop points so they can just pick 'em up and keep rolling.
I should have noted that I disagree with that assumption. That might have been true in the past, but not anymore. From my experience last year the great majority of thru hikers buy their food locally.
Thru hikers on the AT don't really need much mailed resupply.
Depends. Thats not a given. Mailing boxes can very often saves valuable time on trail.
Food can be obtained locally. Besides, any equipment or favorite freeze dried food can be ordered from REI and sent to a Post Office farther down the trail.
That takes time. Again, theREI doesn't care if you have a UK passport, as long as your credit card works.[/QUOTE]
Again the OP is not from the US. It would benefit the OP to have US based logistical support. Additionally, reaching out to more of the international hiking community that have done fast AT hikes might also help.
Slo-go'en
05-23-2017, 12:05
Mail drops can also slow you down if you don't hit town at the right time of day or week. Show up after noon on Saturday, your stuck until Monday morning if the package is at the Post Office. Sending to a business or hostel can help avoid that problem to some extent, but not always. In the context of a fast hike, you really need to have this all planned out exceptionally well before hand for it to work out.
The real issue is still the fact you pretty much have to hike dawn to dusk with few breaks in order to cover 25-30 miles in a day. To do that everyday for nearly 3 months is a big strain both physically and mentally. It stops being fun after a few days and becomes a very hard job. Sure it can and has been done, but you have to be one of those exceptional people to do so.
I would put it this way: with good planning and preparation you might have about 10% chance of doing this - standard schedule hikers have about a 20% success rate - no big deal either way, as long as you are not the type that would regret the attempt because the schedule did not work out
Tinstaafl
05-23-2017, 19:03
Food can be obtained locally. Besides, any equipment or favorite freeze dried food can be ordered from REI and sent to a Post Office farther down the trail.
True enough, but that still takes time and energy you might not have when hiking 25+ miles a day.
A good trail boss can orchestrate supply logistics for you, including equipment and supplies that might not be stocked locally--and often at less expense than ordering from REI/Amazon/whoever. Probably more dependably too--though Slo-go'en has a point about making it to the post office on time.
From my experience last year the great majority of thru hikers buy their food locally.
Were the great majority of through-hikers trying to do it in less than 90 days? ;)
Yes, you can do it! Now that that's settled, I would suggest putting up with the visa process to get a longer visa, so that you can take your time and enjoy the Trail as it may be best enjoyed - at your leisure. They don't call it the Appalachian National Scenic Trail for nothing :)
Ultimately, hike your own hike, at whatever speed you choose. You only go around once....