View Full Version : leaving pack in towns a concern?
Ok..so I get off trail and walk to a town grocery store to reprovision myself.. Presumably my pack would be left outside store or inside somewhere..of course unattended. Should I be concerned about this? I am sure there will be times where I go to a store to resupply but am not going to stay night in the town. Do most hikers leave pack with someone? what if you arent with a buddy?
David
Usually I tried to avoid leaving my pack unattended in towns. More than once at supermarkets I just plunked my pack in the bottom of a shopping cart and shopped. Restaurants would usually let me leave it just inside the door.
i never let mine leave my sight:cool: neo
RITBlake
01-30-2006, 23:16
put your pack right in the shopping cart. Nobody will give you a hard time. Mine never left my site unless I knew it was 100% secure
hikerjohnd
01-30-2006, 23:18
Ok..so I get off trail and walk to a town grocery store to reprovision myself.. Presumably my pack would be left outside store or inside somewhere..of course unattended. Should I be concerned about this? I am sure there will be times where I go to a store to resupply but am not going to stay night in the town. Do most hikers leave pack with someone? what if you arent with a buddy?
David
Would a woman leave her purse outside, unattended? The few times I had to take the pack to a store, I put my pack in my cart and went about my business. Most of the places are used to hikers and won't give you trouble - and more often than not, you will be leaving your pack at a hostle or hotel while you shop.
mweinstone
01-30-2006, 23:39
sometimes ill be offered to leave my pack in a secured place in the store.sometimes i leave it in a cart other times its stashed in the woods.but only outside in small towns that dont have the size of say,...duncannon.but on the porch in eckvill is safe as is anywhere that small.i worry much more when i hide it in the woods.this is cause i go so far off trail and i might forget where it is or animals might drag it off.the answer is to have a smaller load that comes more easily to town .carry on size is hard to achive if your not a lightist.
freefall
01-30-2006, 23:55
sometimes ill be offered to leave my pack in a secured place in the store.
...has signs outside that say backpacks are to be checked at the service desk.
Ok..so I get off trail and walk to a town grocery store to reprovision myself.. Presumably my pack would be left outside store or inside somewhere..of course unattended. Should I be concerned about this? I am sure there will be times where I go to a store to resupply but am not going to stay night in the town. Do most hikers leave pack with someone? what if you arent with a buddy?
David
Great question!
I have seen pictures of packs line up outside of busineses but have always wondered about the sanity of doing so when your whole hike is at stake.
I think there are certain places that it would be OK to do so but we shouldn't be leaving our packs unatteded at all places.
Where is it OK?
wacocelt
01-31-2006, 06:19
Great question!
I have seen pictures of packs line up outside of busineses but have always wondered about the sanity of doing so when your whole hike is at stake.
I think there are certain places that it would be OK to do so but we shouldn't be leaving our packs unatteded at all places.
Where is it OK?
You'll know a trail town that it's safe to do this in when you are in one, believe me. Damascus is one that immediately comes to mind. Even if someone were of a mind to do something to a pack in a trail town it wouldn't be outside a business, but more likely at a hostel or even in a shelter while you've gone for water or the privey. I've heard of more things going missing from the latter than the former.
Iffin this guy offers to watch your pack, do like Nancy Reagan, and "just say no."
generally I ask someone at the counter!Hey would it be ok if i leave my pack right here!most time I like to leave it near the managers area.I use to hate going to stores,but thru the yrs I have noticed most people are just curious.ky
Footslogger
01-31-2006, 10:15
Depends on the town. I've left it leaning on the wall outside on occasion and also took it with me inside with the shopping cart. I'm thinking that taking inside with you is probably best in the long run. Just don't stay inside too long and suffocate the other patrons with backpack stank. Then again ...we hikers don't have such a pleasant bouquet ourselves !!
'Slogger
sleepwalker
01-31-2006, 10:25
God, I couldn't imagine leaving my pack out of sight. I don't care what anyone says, it shops with me and eats with me. On occasion when I am hiking with someone else we take shifts standing guard if we absolutely can't bring the packs with us. There's thousands of dollars invested in those packs not to mention the emotional investment in homemade gear and trip planning. There are too many unscrupulous people out there. Sad but true.
One of the great lessons I learned from my thru hike in 2003: America is still a Great country! Random strangers help you out and those strangers that support you, never know how much their kindness means and brings. I think it would be great for you to show a little faith for what little humanity we have left. What is worth stealing anyway? If someone needs a dirty pack, and dirty clothes..then they probably need it more than you do.
I'm a doubter of the human race, and taking chances on my thru hike taught me to believe in others. I carried a Golite Breeze (small pack, easier to steal), but it all worked out.
sleepwalker
01-31-2006, 12:57
I'm not sure if it's a case of needing it more then I do. Anyone can come by and decide to take the easy route to some gear....and skip all the work and savings. But a homeless guy coming along and stealing the pack because he can't survive w/out the sleeping bag, that's probably a very rare occasion.
Examples of things that are worth stealing are your $150-$200 pack, maybe a $300- $400 sleeping bag, I carry an Arc'teryx rain shell that cost $400 on ebay. Myraid items that would take me months or years to replace. Not to mention, my wife would kill me....and I mean kill me.:-?
Jack Tarlin
01-31-2006, 13:07
Never leave your pack out of sight anywhere for more than a few minutes.
In many cases, tho, you'll have to leave it unattended, usually outside a restaurant. Make sure it's out of people's way, not blocking anything. If possible, try and get a window seat so you can keep it in sight. Sometimes, a restaurant will have double doors and a small vestibule; your pack will be safer here than outside. Most restaurants don't want packs inside or by your table, and hikers should respect this. Always remove and carry with you such items as wallets, money, ID, and maybe your camera. That way, in the worst-case scenario, you're not stranded in the middle of nowhere with no pack and forty cents.
A few other quick tips:
*A lot of your hitch-hiking rides will be in pick-up trucks. I try to ride in the back with my pack. If your ride is in a regular car, avoid if possible putting the pack in the trunk. It is EXTREMELY unlikely that the driver plans to peel out with your stuff after you've exited the car, but I've heard of it happening. Always get a mental description of every car/truck you ride in (color/model/driver), and maybe try and remember the license plate or at least part of it.
*I've seen some folks drape dirty bandannas or socks over their packs when they leave them outside a store or restaurant; this may indeed discourage people from going near it!
*Never, and I mean NEVER leave your pack by the roadside or Trailhead, even if you think it is "hidden", when you go into town. I know several folks who lost their packs doing this.
*When hitch-hiking, always do an "idiot check" when retrieving your pack at the end of the ride. The most frequently "lost" items while hitching or getting a shuttle are hiking sticks. I always try and weave mine thru my pack straps as this makes it impossible forget the sticks when retrieving the pack.
minnesotasmith
01-31-2006, 13:10
[quote=blhmsoc]I think it would be great for you to show a little faith for what little humanity we have left. What is worth stealing anyway? If someone needs a dirty pack, and dirty clothes..then they probably need it more than you do.[quote]
Need does not constitute a claim. If someone has a need of some kind (a private matter outside their family), let them find a legal way to make money. I worked to save money for my hike; someone else who wants to own a backpack can do so as well.
BTW, I haven't yet seen anyone use anything like a bicycle lock to secure a pack when around other people. This would of course be more for in town than among other hikers. Anyone ever seen this done?
David and others,
Mr Tarlin makes some great points about tips. My post was a little deeper than the "material sense". As a thru hiker, I learned that maybe I should not carry stuff of "value"- you don't really need it to survive. I'm not suggesting: "Need constitutes a claim". I was stating: "steal from we what you want, it is only the basics to live off of, and smelly at most". I think as a "hiking community" we can express "values" (like the idea of trusting others); where as a "town" (those that are afraid of their neighbors) cannot. Hikers can show that "value" to the "town" by displaying it.
I think we are not giving people who we do not know a fair shot. I posted above that I was surprised how Great Americans still are, and they were complete strangers. I'm not saying to not take your pack with you if you feel it is unsafe. It has been discussed that hikers are seen as "different" to the locals. Leaving your pack outside seems to show respect. But to be politically correct: it's not necessary ALL the time.
Minnesotasmith:
When I rode my road bike from Savannah, GA to Key West and back up, I hung my Golite Breeze pack on my bicycle outside of stores and restaurants. I was alone and in a foreign place every time I needed food, water, shelter; but I gave the locals a chance. I rationalized that I'm only carrying material stuff...And if someone wants to steal it, they will eventually steal it.
wacocelt
01-31-2006, 14:47
Alot of people that steal don't do so because of need, but out of sheer maliciousness.
My post was a little deeper than the "material sense". As a thru hiker, I learned that maybe I should not carry stuff of "value"- you don't really need it to survive.Well, if you don't need it, why is it in your pack. Most of us spend a lot of effort to weed out unnecessary gear. What's left is what is needed.
I think we are not giving people who we do not know a fair shot. I posted above that I was surprised how Great Americans still are, and they were complete strangers. I'm not saying to not take your pack with you if you feel it is unsafe. It has been discussed that hikers are seen as "different" to the locals. Leaving your pack outside seems to show respect. But to be politically correct: it's not necessary ALL the time.Sure. Leave your keys in your car, too. People who are not thinking about stealing stuff don't notice or care if you take off your pack and put it in your shopping cart. You don't have to show them respect. People who are looking for things to steal do care, and if you leave a pack where they can grab it, you are not giving respect, you are giving an opportunity :D
And if someone wants to steal it, they will eventually steal it.Sure, if someone had a goal of stealing blhmsoc's pack, they would plot and scheme and eventually they'd have it. Fact is, that if your pack is stolen, it will be by someone you don't know, who doesn't want to steal your pack, did not keeping trying to steal your pack, following you until they eventually succeeded. They just want to steal something, anything, the easier the better, to sell for the money. Keep the pack away from them for the few minutes they are around, and they will not eventually steal your pack. They will be too busy stealing someone, anyone, else's pack.
And maybe they are trying hard to stop stealing. Be nice. Don't throw temptation in their path.
David,
Sorry bout my other posts...they obviously did not answer your question. You asked: "Should I be concerned about this?"- I was.
"Do most hikers leave pack with someone?"- If that option is available, it seems like the best option; and I did that where available.
"what if you arent with a buddy?"- I was concerned, used some of Jack's tips, but 99% of the time I left my pack outside, taking my money & camera with me.
To Frosty,
You stated: "You don't have to show them respect." Referring to town people.
What I think to be above All Else: "Respect" for others is the ONE thing, possibly the ONLY thing, in this World that others MUST offer others. Without Respect you get all the crime and violence you so deem that I create by leaving my cars unlocked and my belongings outside.
Let me know if you want the other stuff clarified you quoted me on?
To Frosty,
You stated: "You don't have to show them respect." Referring to town people.
What I think to be above All Else: "Respect" for others is the ONE thing, possibly the ONLY thing, in this World that others MUST offer others. Without Respect you get all the crime and violence you so deem that I create by leaving my cars unlocked and my belongings outside.
Let me know if you want the other stuff clarified you quoted me on?You cannot clarify your post by taking a sentence of mine out of context and applying a meaning that was never intended, but thanks for the opportunity to clarify what I meant.
I never said you should not respect anyone. Respecting others is very important. What I said was that leaving your pack unattended does not show respect to honest people, and that you do not have to show honest people respect by leaving a pack unattened. In fact, you cannot do it.
First, how would any honest person see a pack unattended and say, "Wow, this person is showing respect to me." An honest person would never think of stealing your pack to begin with, and miss the connection of not stealing and respect, and if told about your plan might reasonably be insulted that you are going through this effort to show they are not thieves.
Respect people certainly, but not by giving them a chance to prove they are not thieves, but by not littering in their town, not getting drunk and rowdy, not stealing toilet paper from their restrooms and spoons from Wendy's, being polite, cleaning up before coming into town, being pleasant to people on the street. There are a lot of ways you can show respect. Leaving a pack on the sidewalk just isn't one of them.
Second, you are confusing trust with respect. Leaving a pack unattended is a sign of trust, not respect. Unlike respect, which everyone deserves, trust is earned based on past experience.
Also, I never said that you create crime by leaving your keys in your car, though I do think a car theft unplanned-crime-of-opportunity is much more likely if you do. I asked if you "respect" people by leaving your keys in your car, as well as your pack on the street. You never answered. Do you?
RITBlake
01-31-2006, 18:50
Hey its not a bad idea to take Jacks advice one step further. Before you even stick out your thumb for a hitch, take out your wallet, ID, camera, money etc.... So if for some reason the guy does pull away you arn't screwed. Also try to hitch hike w/ at least one more person. If you start to feel suspicious when you are getting out, have your partner go to the trunk to unload the gear, while you fumble around w/ the seatbelt. Sounds corny, but its much much better then losing your gear.
Its a pretty safe trail, and 99% of your town experiences will be positive. But even in the 'friendly' trail towns like Damascus, people are ready and willing to steal your gear. Just be smart, use your head, and always trust your gut.
Jack Tarlin
01-31-2006, 18:55
I do that, too, Blake, and I should have included that.
Thanx for sending it along.
mountaineer
01-31-2006, 19:38
I usually left my pack just inside the door of a business, if possible, but never had a problem when I left them outside, either. But, I always took the precaution of keeping my wallet and camera with me when I left my pack, figuring if someone did steal my pack they wouldn't have my money or pictures, which were most important not to lose.
Tortuga
digger51
01-31-2006, 23:52
Jacks advice is right on as usual. This thread got me thinking about how few towns I visited without staying the night at either a hostel or motel. This year I might have to skip some of those overnights in town. Those few times I did leave my pack unattended in town I attached it around a light pole or tree with its straps and rope.
minnesotasmith
02-02-2006, 06:57
Hey its not a bad idea to take Jacks advice one step further. Before you even stick out your thumb for a hitch, take out your wallet, ID, camera, money etc.... So if for some reason the guy does pull away you arn't screwed. Also try to hitch hike w/ at least one more person. If you start to feel suspicious when you are getting out, have your partner go to the trunk to unload the gear, while you fumble around w/ the seatbelt. Sounds corny, but its much much better then losing your gear.
Its a pretty safe trail, and 99% of your town experiences will be positive. But even in the 'friendly' trail towns like Damascus, people are ready and willing to steal your gear. Just be smart, use your head, and always trust your gut.
I wish I'd thought of it, and intend to follow it whenever I can.
I left my pack and poles unattended outside of groceries, restaurants and stores throughout my 2005 thruhike and it was always where I left it. I never had a problem.
The Cheat
02-02-2006, 15:13
Where I live in NY you could leave it outside all day and nobody will steal it. However, it might wind up on the 11 o'clock news being blown up by the bomb squad.
gargamel
02-02-2006, 15:57
http://www.pac-safe.com/product.aspx?pId=644
Maybe a little bit overkill, but if you are really concerned it might be an alternative.
QHShowoman
02-02-2006, 16:14
One of the "tricks" I use when riding in cabs in NYC is to leave the passenger door wide open until I've retrieved all my stuff from the trunk. I never even open the door to get out until the trunk has been popped by the driver. Yes, if they really want to steal your stuff, they'll take off with the door open ... but it hasn't happened yet.
Ditto on what someone said about keeping your wallet, etc., with you in the cab of the truck ... the removable lid (if you have one on your pack) is a great place for this kind of stuff ... you can just pop it off and take it with you when leaving your pack unattended.