View Full Version : VBL advice
Thinking of trying silnylon top and argon 90 pants over a light base layer. With a 30° regular regular size quilt and 20° wide regular quilt over top. Both quilts are down. If I used VBL would it eliminate bivy bag moisture ? Or not use the bivy bag. Does argon 90 breath to well to b a VBL ? Your VBL choices ?
This is for winter camping .
Thanks Thom
Argon 90 does breathe, has a DWR, so isn't a true VBL. The A 90 is usually sufficient as top fabric in a WR bivy. I can't say wearing silny top(??) and A 90 pants(Lukes's?) will eliminate all moisture into the quilts but it should help. I call at leats your pants a psuedo VBL(not true VBL). I do the same thing in winter mixed conditions wearing a dry breathable rain jacket and rain pants into a down bag/quilt protecting some of my loft for a longer duration usually sandwiched between a thinnish base layer and exterior insulation(puffy, vest, etc). Under such conditions I'll have along a beanie and gloves that are worn into the sleep system as well that helps encapsulates. The rain jacket hood is worn up as well. Under such mixed conditions, especially if layering two down quilts and using a WR or WP bivy, I find it imperative to not use a sleep system too warm for that evening, make adjustments to tweak the temp rating on the fly, not exhaling into the sleep system, and not bringing wet things into an enclosed sleep system(this includes me).
It's not clear to me if you're now throwing a bivy(?) into the mix with the two layered quilts.
most of the condensation in a bivy or tent is from respiration, not perspiration, the trick with a bivy is to breath outside the system - which is of course not possible in a tent
most of the condensation in a bivy or tent is from respiration, not perspiration, the trick with a bivy is to breath outside the system..
^ Under such conditions I'll have along a beanie and gloves that are worn into the sleep system as well that helps encapsulates...(meaning respiration). Doesn't always totally alleviate it but I can usually get by with how long I'm typically out before going back into a town stop while still making 20 MPD, quilt/bag fabrics, using treated down, wearing pseudo VBL(really a misnomer), etc. Going across Alaska or doing a continuous c2c through winter, having 100's of miles between resupply not avg 30+(sufficient enough) miles/day in relation to down loft loss, intense cold, remote town stops where amenities are not as comprehensive to be able to dry down to fully reloft, etc is a different story. True VBL apparel can then be worn while on the move. Obviously, some have much more experience with true VBL's than others in different situations where they find great usage.
20 degree quilt next to you. 30 degree quilt on top.
Read the quilt stacking chart at Enlightened Equipment.
VBLs are recommended for below zero in a closed up mummy bag. Western Mountaineering makes one.
Wayne
Thanks all . I don't want to use a VBL bag liner. Trying to use what I carry if it will work or help. I could make silnylon pants . My 30° quilt is smaller then my 20° that's y it's inside the 20°.
Thom
Yes I have a bivy argon 90 and a SMD net tent . I am not married to a bivy ,have not used one with VBL clothing. Had moisture using them . Using net tent would give me a double wall tent. Well kind of ;0)
Thanks all . I don't want to use a VBL bag liner. Trying to use what I carry if it will work or help. I could make silnylon pants . My 30° quilt is smaller then my 20° that's y it's inside the 20°.
Thom
Doesn't matter. The chart says reverse them for maximum advantage.
Wayne
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Thanks all . I don't want to use a VBL bag liner. Trying to use what I carry if it will work or help. I could make silnylon pants . My 30° quilt is smaller then my 20° that's y it's inside the 20°.
Thom
My take too. In my UL fantasy I want VBL apparel that can be used both for wearing on the move and sleeping in CoLd temps. A VBL liner is dead wt on the move though maybe some have good regular use for it at that time too. Again don't take my word for anything. I have very limited VBL liner and dedicated named VBL apparel experince . Your situations may be different.
I'm hoping for lots of winter hiking and camping this year . We do get some cold and snow in N NY
Thanks all thom