View Full Version : Stealth camping in the Smokies
KilroyWasHere
08-01-2017, 08:23
Hi all. Planning a Nobo thru hike in 2018. My understanding is that camping is limited to the shelters or directly around the shelters through the Smokies. What is the reasoning to this and do most thru hikers abide by it? Thanks.
Kilroywashere
based on my observation travelling through there in may with some nobos, they either abide by it or do a really good job of not abiding by it.
the reasoning should be obvious. whether you agree with the reasons or not is another matter, but the justification isnt anything unique or earth shattering or interesting.
Slo-go'en
08-01-2017, 08:46
You are required to stay in the shelter unless you get there and the shelter is full, then you can go set up a tent in the poop mine field near the shelter. Chances are you will want to stay in the shelter because it's raining.
KilroyWasHere
08-01-2017, 08:55
Still unsure why this restriction is obvious. Kindly respond as if I was a rather dull six year old. Thanks.
MuddyWaters
08-01-2017, 09:10
Still unsure why this restriction is obvious. Kindly respond as if I was a rather dull six year old. Thanks.
To protect the park.
Small areas are sacrificial. Thats it.
Small areas around shelters, or designated campsites.
Two reasons:
Be
Cause.
The NPS makes the rules.
Users must follow the rules or avoid the Parks.
Wayne
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illabelle
08-01-2017, 09:17
Still unsure why this restriction is obvious. Kindly respond as if I was a rather dull six year old. Thanks.
The "obvious" part is Leave No Trace. Of course LNT principles are interpreted and implemented differently by different people and in different environments. So the not-so-obvious part is this: by concentrating human activity at the shelters, it reduces human impacts elsewhere on the trail. In effect, the shelter areas become sacrificial in order to preserve other areas. The Smoky Mountains do get a lot of visitors. I think most people do obey the rules, at least loosely. Most people do stay at the shelters or in the vicinity. Not so sure they adhere to the part about not tenting unless the shelter is full.
PatmanTN
08-01-2017, 09:19
Kilroy,
The Smokies are loved to death. The AT across the crest sees incredible usage year-round. Not just AT through and section trips but park loops too. (There are over 850 miles of maintained trails in the GSMNP).
SteelCut
08-01-2017, 09:21
It's not just the AT, all backcountry camping in the GSMNP is by reservation at designated sites.
Sarcasm the elf
08-01-2017, 09:23
Still unsure why this restriction is obvious. Kindly respond as if I was a rather dull six year old. Thanks.
1) Because they can
2) It's a popular national park that gets overused, so concentrating the use into certain small areas reduces the destruction in other parts.
3) Because it is a popular national park it attracts a lot of people who have no idea what they're doing in the woods. It's an attempt to keep the idiots safe from the wilderness and the wilderness safe from the idiots.
johnacraft
08-01-2017, 09:38
[QUOTE=KilroyWasHere;2162680]Still unsure why this restriction is obvious./QUOTE]The goal is to minimize impact to the environment by concentrating human activity at or near shelters. (One of the Leave No Trace (https://www.nps.gov/grsm/planyourvisit/bc-lnt.htm) principals is to use existing campsites, and not create new ones.) Most of the Great Smoky Mountains National Park backcountry (including the route of the Appalachian Trail) is designated as Wilderness, in which campers are expected to follow LNT principals in order to preserve the wilderness for everyone. Regulations are designed to protect the resources of this park for you and for future generations.Camp in areas that have already been impacted by use.
As to whether most thru-hikers abide by these guidelines, they do, for a simple reason: finding a flat spot large enough to set up a tent is almost impossible. There is little to no open, flat ground along the Appalachian Trail in the Park.
Thousands of hikers have passed through before you. Thousands will pass through after you. We all follow LNT principals so that we see the beauty of nature, not human damage to the environment.
Rain Man
08-01-2017, 09:43
The GSMNP is by no means the only stretch of the AT where camping is restricted due to abuse or "being loved to death.". Several entire states restrict camping, fires, etc.
And yes, most properly respect these reasonable restrictions.
KilroyWasHere
08-01-2017, 09:47
Thank you all for your response. Last time I did any substantial hiking on the AT was probably around 1990, so this was helpful.
Jeff
ScottTrip
08-01-2017, 09:50
Since you are thru hiking you will be able to purchase the $20 permit so reservations not needed on the AT section of GSMNP. Just follow the rule and camp in the shelter area, it only took me 5 days to cross the park. Just get use to some of the rules, this not following the rules (even if you disagree) is causing a huge conflict on the AT. Don't be one of those hikers ...
You will get a mix of shelter users that follow the rules and those who don't. We went through a couple of weeks ago and at every shelter we stayed at except for Double Spring Gap and Davenport Gap, people tented that were not thru hikers per the GSMNP definition. No rangers were seen the entire trip except at Clingman's Dome.
All that to say, follow the rules so that additional rules don't get levied upon us.
Goes beyond what is being said. GSMNP is the most visited NP in the U.S.. The AT through GSMNP is the most used trail in GSMNP annually. The AT through GSMNP in the spring when the AT NOBO bubble comes through and AT hikers in the fall are high peak usage times. Imagine what would happen to the environment we all so enjoy if through GSMNP and the Whites if we started doing what we wanted ignoring regs that are in place for darn good "let's consider a larger whole" reasons.
In case it wasn't already made clear. Thru Hikers in the GSMNP are allowed to purchase a thru hikers permit ($20) which allows them to stay at the shelters along the AT without getting reservations. A thru hiker (by GSMNP's definition) is someone who starts and ends their hike 50 miles outside the park (so at least a 170 mile section with the park in the middle). Per the parks regulations, thru hikers must stay in the shelter unless the shelter is already full. If the shelter is already full, then the thru hiker can set up their tent outside the shelter.
Any other hiker must get reservations in advance from the GSMNP's website. Reservations cost $4 per person per night and must be made for the specific day you wish to stay at that specific shelter.
Indeed, the goal is to limit heavy use to a specified area. Shelters along the AT all have bear cables, water sources, and most have composting privies to make it convenient to stay there.
Campsite 113 is the only campsite along the AT in the park. It used to be a shelter site, but now it has a series of wooden platforms for you to set up your tent. If you are going to stay there, make sure you can set up your tent either free standing or take enough cord/anchors/etc to make your tent work on a platform.
Campsite 113 is the only campsite along the AT in the park. It used to be a shelter site, but now it has a series of wooden platforms for you to set up your tent. If you are going to stay there, make sure you can set up your tent either free standing or take enough cord/anchors/etc to make your tent work on a platfor
pretty sure it's a wood frame with dirt in the middle part allowing stakes to be used........
HooKooDooKu
08-01-2017, 10:42
pretty sure it's a wood frame with dirt in the middle part allowing stakes to be used........
That's what I experienced at #113 many years ago.
I'm not sure what the area around the old shelter spot might be like, but I camped at the far side of the campsite (beyond the piped water source). That area is basically a hillside where cribbing and fill dirt have been used to create some tent pads.
HooKooDooKu
08-01-2017, 10:44
No rangers were seen the entire trip except at Clingman's Dome.
While rangers are rare in the back country, ridge runners work the AT corridor (staffing levels vary based on the season).
KilroyWasHere
08-01-2017, 10:49
Thank you all for making the ecological pressures clear to me. I will definitely abide by these rules.
Emerson Bigills
08-01-2017, 11:01
I have not heard any stories of thru-hikers not following the GSMNP guidelines as far as stealth camping. It is not uncommon for them to play the game of hoping the shelter fills up so they can tent outside in close proximity to the shelter. That goes for section hikers as well. The limited spots to shelter/camp in the Smokies make them a little more challenging, but it is a special experience. If the weather is great, you will never forget the views. If the weather is terrible, you will talk about the experience for years. You can't lose.
My opinion is that all hikers need to understand the park rules in the areas they are hiking in and comply with them. They are not punitive in nature and are there for good reason. Not picking on you, but I have a real bug in my rear for the attitude many thru-hikers have regarding GSMNP and Baxter. Great parks that provide a tremendous experience for hikers. Their rules are not difficult to comply with.
Thank you all for making the ecological pressures clear to me. I will definitely abide by these rules.
That sounds nice. The fact remains that the NPS makes the rules. Good, bad or inconsistent. I'm thankful that some park rules are not uniform throughout the system.
Conscientious citizens bide by those rules.
Have fun Y'all!
Wayne
Still unsure why this restriction is obvious. Kindly respond as if I was a rather dull six year old. Thanks.
why do anyone rules exist at any protected area? why do we have national parks at all?
it is not like the rest of the AT, simply stated, because it is a national park, and with that comes all that being inside the back country of a national park entails.
Puddlefish
08-01-2017, 13:06
If you need another reason, it's pretty close to being a rain forest. There are parts that are just moss covered and damp. You'd have a hard time finding a place to setup that didn't immediately destroy the plant life.
If you need another reason, it's pretty close to being a rain forest. There are parts that are just moss covered and damp. You'd have a hard time finding a place to setup that didn't immediately destroy the plant life.
pretty close? is it not, in fact, a temperate rainforest, and one of the only ones in north america at that?
map showing the location of all temperate rain forest's in the world. on a worldwide scale, they are more rare than i was even remembering-
40001
perdidochas
08-01-2017, 14:22
Hi all. Planning a Nobo thru hike in 2018. My understanding is that camping is limited to the shelters or directly around the shelters through the Smokies. What is the reasoning to this and do most thru hikers abide by it? Thanks.
Kilroywashere
The reasoning is that they want to reduce the impact of campers, by keeping them to a few sacrificial sites. From all I've read, most thru hikers abide by it.
more-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Appalachian_spruce%E2%80%93fir_forest
Emerson Bigills
08-01-2017, 15:02
Some truth to that, but thru hikers have a lot of time to talk to one another and they run out topics over the course of 6 months.
Puddlefish
08-01-2017, 16:19
I'd just hate to lose areas like this, because someone decided to tent on top of some low scrub.
40002
illabelle
08-01-2017, 16:28
I'd just hate to lose areas like this, because someone decided to tent on top of some low scrub.
40002
Beautiful!
While rangers are rare in the back country, ridge runners work the AT corridor (staffing levels vary based on the season).
Last 3-4 hikes in GSMNP involving AT segments or AT lean-to stays I've seen/met and have had questions asked of me by a ridge runner or NP Ranger half the time.
Umm, I once heard it said character and integrity is doing what one knows they should be doing when they think no one is watching. ;)
Thank you all for making the ecological pressures clear to me. I will definitely abide by these rules.
You are welcome. Very nice that you considered what was being shared. :banana
map showing the location of all temperate rain forest's in the world. on a worldwide scale, they are more rare than i was even remembering-
40001
Thx for sharing this. It was a learning experience.
Criticism leveled against being forced to stay in crowded shelters in the Smokies, is that for $20 all you are getting in return is Norovirus
Criticism leveled against being forced to stay in crowded shelters in the Smokies, is that for $20 all you are getting in return is Norovirus
lets see----ive stayed in crowded shelters and never have gotten norovirus...
i feel so left out.....
but on the other hand-----ive had plenty of shelters to myself..........and some on holiday weekends....
Starchild
08-27-2017, 15:29
....Imagine what would happen to the environment we all so enjoy if through GSMNP and the Whites if we started doing what we wanted ignoring regs that are in place for darn good "let's consider a larger whole" reasons.
I imagine it would look pretty much like the AT.
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Slo-go'en
08-27-2017, 20:42
Criticism leveled against being forced to stay in crowded shelters in the Smokies, is that for $20 all you are getting in return is Norovirus
Don't like the rules, go someplace else.
Tennessee Viking
08-28-2017, 09:35
The restrictions is to limit camping impact to the Park's terrain. If you want more details, I suggest contact the GSMNP themselves.
I wouldn't stealth as if you are caught, you will be fined. The AT is patrolled by ridgerunners on a regular basis. They are trained to identify illegal camping.
If you list yourself as a long distance hiker, you will have more freedom to camp at shelters. Hang out at the shelters till full then make camp.
swjohnsey
08-28-2017, 11:06
Fat rangers ain't gonna walk far. I think there was one shelter with road access nearby where a couple of rangers showed up and chased off a bunch of hikers camped around the shelter.
Fat rangers ain't gonna walk far. I think there was one shelter with road access nearby where a couple of rangers showed up and chased off a bunch of hikers camped around the shelter.
I haven't seen any fat rangers in the Smokys......
neither in the front country or back country....