Hand over hand north of Fontana?

[KCNC]

Had a chance encounter with a pretty avid section hiker today. (A nurse at one of my wife's doctors' offices.)

She mentioned a STEEP (as in hand-over-hand) section of the AT near Fontana. I've looked over the elevation profiles in AWOL and examined the online interactive AT Map and can't identify anything that might meet this description. I've read multiple trip reports as well, and don't recall a mention in them, either. I know there's about a 2000 ft elevation change from the dam to Shuckstack Tower over a couple of miles, but I've never heard this called "hand over hand" conditions.

Has this just been glossed over by people, or is it really that steep?

[TNhiker]

if its part of the AT in the Park---ive never heard or seen that.....

unless she means lost cove trail that connects to the AT............its steep but not hand over hand steep...

not sure about the AT south of fontana.....

[MuddyWaters]

Closest thing to be the trail going up the jump from NOC going south. And that's like one four or five foot Rock

Maybe Albert Mountain going northbound

I don't recall any hand-over-hand in the park on the at

[tiptoe]

Albert Mtn. going northbound? This is south of Fontana, and not a big deal at all for anyone who has hiked in New England.

[Malto]

There are a couple of steep sections I believe between Spence Field and Derricks knob. But I don't recall anything that I would hand over hand. The areas that I'm thinking wouldn't show up on a topi map as they are maybe 20' change in elevation.

[MuddyWaters]

Albert Mtn. going northbound? This is south of Fontana, and not a big deal at all for anyone who has hiked in New England.

Right before you get to the top you got to put your poles on top of a rock and kind of climb up that's about it

[Berserker]

I don't recall anything hand over hand on the AT south of the Whites with maybe the exception of a couple of rock scrambles near Dragon's Tooth (VA) and a short steep climb somewhere (can't remember exactly where) in NY.

[Starchild]

I don't recall anything hand over hand on the AT south of the Whites with maybe the exception of a couple of rock scrambles near Dragon's Tooth (VA) and a short steep climb somewhere (can't remember exactly where) in NY.

I was going to say Palmington PA superfun(d) site, but yes I would say Dragon's Tooth as the next one coming out of NOC.

[Dan Roper]

There is nothing in the Smokies, nor anywhere between Springer and Grayson Highlands, that fits in the "hand over hand" description. That's just one of those "fish got away" stories.

The steepest climb south of Grayson Highlands (which is as far as I've gone) is Jacob's Ladder aka Sweetwater Cliffs, just north of Tellico Gap, North Carolina. It is definitely nowhere near hand over hand. Albert Mountain isn't either.

The nurse is probably way over exaggerating the climb up to Shuckstack from Fontanta Dam. And that's really a steady, well-graded climb. Nothing in the Smokies is brutal - not even the climb up Rocky Top from Spence Field.

I suppose there are some folks who are out of shape and don't know what they're getting into that end up on their hands and knees from sheer exhaustion. But that's the only way someone would end up that way.

[ScareBear]

There is nothing in the Smokies, nor anywhere between Springer and Grayson Highlands, that fits in the "hand over hand" description. That's just one of those "fish got away" stories.

The steepest climb south of Grayson Highlands (which is as far as I've gone) is Jacob's Ladder aka Sweetwater Cliffs, just north of Tellico Gap, North Carolina. It is definitely nowhere near hand over hand. Albert Mountain isn't either.

The nurse is probably way over exaggerating the climb up to Shuckstack from Fontanta Dam. And that's really a steady, well-graded climb. Nothing in the Smokies is brutal - not even the climb up Rocky Top from Spence Field.

I suppose there are some folks who are out of shape and don't know what they're getting into that end up on their hands and knees from sheer exhaustion. But that's the only way someone would end up that way.

Coming NB from Mooney Gap(?)I found Albert Mountain to be far more of a "climb" than the hike up Jacob's Ladder. You had to select hand and foot holds. Far more dangerous, as well. A fall climbing Albert will result in "pinballing" down the crevice, with serious consequences. Not so much with Jacob's Ladder....

A good way to judge how dangerous the ascent of Albert v. Jacob's Ladder is obvious. There is a bad weather yellow blaze around Albert. No such blaze needed for Jacob's Ladder....just sayin...

Honestly, Albert felt like a bit of a scramble, Jacob's Ladder was merely a hike...YMMV...

[KCNC]

Thanks everyone, my wife is quite interested in doing some sections after her kidney transplant and this "news" was quite alarming to her. Since we live in NC the NC and VA areas make the most sense to go after first and I didn't want to risk crushing her spirit with something that should have been avoided until much later in the game.

Just having her express interest gives me a thrill, and all these random encounters only serve to pique her enthusiasm.

[AllDownhillFromHere]

Did you accidentally climb Shuckstack?

[KCNC]

Did you accidentally climb Shuckstack?

I'm thinking this is what the lady was referring to, it's the only thing that begins to make sense that I've been able to identify in the area.

[Puddlefish]

Albert Mtn. going northbound? This is south of Fontana, and not a big deal at all for anyone who has hiked in New England.


This would be my guess. My friend from Florida had trouble with it at the end of a long day. I thought it was refreshingly like home. I remember a couple of rock piles in the area as well, but they were more like a twenty foot obstacle kind of deal.

[daddytwosticks]

Other than the short rock climb up Albert Mountain, all I can think of is the "Jacob's Ladder" climb just a mile or two north of Stecoah Gap. This is located near Fontana. I would't consider this hand over hand, but it sure was major steep with no switchbacks. :)

[Curious G]

No. The answer is: "No!".

[capehiker]

There is some erosion that occurred from the fires last year just south of Fontana that made for some tricky navigating, about 2 miles north of Cable Gap shelter before the long descent into Fontana. If one was going SoBo that would require some hand over hand but only for about 25 Fet worth. It was the only time in my Thru hike to that point that I actually had to stop and think how I was getting down.

[ldsailor]

I'm pretty sure the OP is talking about Bear Pen Gap and the climb up to the fire watch tower on Albert Mountain. I remember it well. There were parts of the climb that were vertical. You could not stand up and simply walk up the approach to the tower. It's mile 100 for NOBO hikers. The Smokies are another 67 miles NOBO.

[tawa]

Went North out of Fontana Dam in the winter months with a fully loaded pack, So yes its a long pull that first day out of Fontana. However, you know once you get up there its going to be more ridge top hiking. I didn't think the Smokies were a really difficult section compared to what I had already hiked from Springer.

[Turk6177]

I remember a couple spots on the way up to Thunder Mountain that were short but steep. They were similar but not as steep or long as Albert Mountain.


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[George]

my guess is a fear of heights/ falling would have some use all fours

[Berserker]

The only thing "hand over hand" that I'm aware of in the Smokies (but it's not on the AT) is the top of Chimney Tops. That's an actual steep rock scramble if you go up the front of it (of course there's an easier way around the side/back).

[Berserker]

The nurse is probably way over exaggerating the climb up to Shuckstack from Fontanta Dam. And that's really a steady, well-graded climb. Nothing in the Smokies is brutal - not even the climb up Rocky Top from Spence Field.
^ This.

The AT through the Smokies is very well graded, and a quite enjoyable hike. I wasn't in the best of shape (disclaimer: I do exercise regularly though), and I was able to do all 74 miles of it in 6 days back in May of this year. Probably the "hardest" part that I remember was that piece from Fontana up to Mollies Ridge Shelter, but it's a 2,886' climb over 10.4 miles, which translates to it's graded pretty nicely. The steepest part of this piece is the first 4 or so miles up to Shuckstack.

[JC13]

We did Fontana to Hot Springs in July and no hand over hand climbs come to mind. Hardest climb according to my wife and Troubletrev was the 19.4 miles from Mollies Ridge Shelter to Double Spring Gap Shelter.

[HooKooDooKu]

The only thing "hand over hand" that I'm aware of in the Smokies (but it's not on the AT) is the top of Chimney Tops. That's an actual steep rock scramble if you go up the front of it (of course there's an easier way around the side/back).
Not anymore...

First of all, they had closed the easier way around the side of The Chimney's many years ago due to loss of vegetation.
But after the fire last year, ALL vegetation is gone and a part of the rock crumbled and fell off.
From what a ranger was telling me, for the foreseeable future, there will be a viewing platform where you'll be able to see the Chimney's, but you might not ever be allowed to climb out on them again.


Otherwise, what I recall of the AT thru GSMNP, there are two or three spots (some for sure near Thunderhead) where the trail could be described as a nearly vertical climb... but its like only 6 feet high. So you might need to use your hands, but certainly NOT hand-over-hand climbing.

[Berserker]

Not anymore...

First of all, they had closed the easier way around the side of The Chimney's many years ago due to loss of vegetation.
But after the fire last year, ALL vegetation is gone and a part of the rock crumbled and fell off.
From what a ranger was telling me, for the foreseeable future, there will be a viewing platform where you'll be able to see the Chimney's, but you might not ever be allowed to climb out on them again.
Holy crap...that sucks! That was a really neat hike with a great view that required actual work (i.e. climbing up the face of the pinnacles) to see the full view.

[SouthMark]

I had to do hand over hand over Thunderhead and Rocky Top but only because the wind kept blowing me down on my knees.

[TNhiker]

From what a ranger was telling me, for the foreseeable future, there will be a viewing platform where you'll be able to see the Chimney's, but you might not ever be allowed to climb out on them again.




we---wbir----and other media outlets have reported on this....

because thats the plan.......according the to NPS...

and to be honest----the top part might never open again..........or open 75 years from now when the vegetation has come back...

[HooKooDooKu]

Holy crap...that sucks! That was a really neat hike with a great view that required actual work (i.e. climbing up the face of the pinnacles) to see the full view.
Yea, I always considered the view from Chimney Tops to be the best in the whole park.
While places like Clingman's Dome would let you see far off places, Chimney Tops gave you a view of Mt LeConte that felt like it was in your face while New Found Gap Road looked like a tiny ant trail.

[Longboysfan]

Albert Mtn. going northbound? This is south of Fontana, and not a big deal at all for anyone who has hiked in New England.

Good. So I'm past where it straight up hill. For now.

[JumpMaster Blaster]

There is ONE section on the AT in the Smokies that has a spot where I threw my poles about 2-3' away and used my hands to balance on the way up and over. It was literally a 4 foot section that went up over a small rock formation. If I recall it was on day 2 or 3 into the Smokies, so somewhere between Mollies Ridge and Silers Bald shelters. Absolutely nothing that I would consider "hand over hand" though.

[Dan Roper]

That sounds like the tough little climb up Brier Knob, a bit north of Thunderhead.

[HooKooDooKu]

That sounds like the tough little climb up Brier Knob, a bit north of Thunderhead.
I was thinking the same thing... a little less than half way between Spence and Derrick Knob shelters.

[MuddyWaters]

That sounds like the tough little climb up Brier Knob, a bit north of Thunderhead.
Didn't make enough impression on me to even notice if that's the case...

[HooKooDooKu]

Didn't make enough impression on me to even notice if that's the case...
I was specifically meaning that the spot where I recall needing to put down hiking sticks and hold on to the rock was north of Thunderhead... because yea, I don't recall anything that was "tough" in that area, especially if going NOBO.