Hiking in Colder Temps

[spfleisig]

I will be hiking the whole NJ portion of the AT starting tomorrow. I've never hiked during colder temps. Other than the obvious gear one needs in the cold, what things should I consider that newbies don't normally consider bringing?

[Slo-go'en]

The important thing is not to overdress when you start out in the morning. It doesn't take long to warm up. It has to be in the teens and the wind howling before I put much on while I hike. It takes real will power to put back on the wet or damp shirts in the morning. If you make the mistake of starting out in your nice warm, dry clothes, they will also be wet or damp in short order. Then your in trouble.

Since it gets dark so early, having a couple of candles is nice. Better ambiance then LED flashlight and saves your batteries for when you really need them. If you drink go easy on the nips, alcohol can make you colder.

Be careful of your footing - it can be a lot more slippy then your used to in the summer. Try to time the trip for a good weather window. That's easier said then done, but if a big storm is predicted think twice about going. Oops, your leaving tomorrow and a big storm is coming for the weekend. Better have good rain gear, looks like it will be a cold rain followed by a cold front. That should be interesting.

[Feral Bill]

Socks. Many pairs of wool socks. Some plastic bags to cover them in very wet weather, too. Also a wool or fleece scarf.

[HooKooDooKu]

The important thing is not to overdress when you start out in the morning. It doesn't take long to warm up. It has to be in the teens and the wind howling before I put much on while I hike. It takes real will power to put back on the wet or damp shirts in the morning. If you make the mistake of starting out in your nice warm, dry clothes, they will also be wet or damp in short order. Then your in trouble.
Yes... when hiking in the cold, don't allow yourself to sweat.

I find that with a pack on my back, I can usually hike in just shorts and a t-shirt if temperatures are above freezing.

I usually start the morning in shorts, t-shirt, rain jacket, and hat. Additional layers are added if the temperatures warrant (such as a fleece pull-over and rain pants).
The moment I start to feel I'm about to start sweating, I start taking layers off. I start with any additional layers and put them back in my pack. Next, I take of the rain jacket and keep it in an external pocket so that I can quickly put it back on when ever I take a 'pack-off' break (and because you usually start cooling off very quickly when you pause for a break... unless I'm sweating in the t-shirt, I immediately place the rain coat back on even if I'm not cold... then take it back off when I'm ready to pickup my pack).

The last thing to take off is your hat. When temps are near 40, I usually find that my hat is all I need to regulate my temperature while I keep hiking. Simply stick it in your pocket when you start to feel warm, pull it out and back on when you start to feel cold.

If you do sweat in your t-shirt, try to leave it on when you stop for the day to try to get your body temperature to dry it out. You can try to keep warm in the mean time by putting on a hat and possibly pants. If your rain jacket is a breathable jacket, espeically if it doesn't have a liner, you can put the jacket on over your sweaty t-shirt. As the moisture evaporates from your shirt, it should pass thru the jacket if it is a dry day.

[rocketsocks]

Overmitts.

[spfleisig]

I should say I will also be sleeping, not just hiking. So things to consider when u r done for the day.

[egilbe]

You realize how long the night is in the Winter.

[gbolt]

As mentioned, head covering is a key hiking, camping, and sleeping. A buff is a wonderful piece of equipment to hike and sleep in, especially if using a quilt vs a mummy hooded sleeping bag. I find hiking and sleeping is easier to regulate body temp. I tend to suffer the most in camp. But that is probably the area that gets the least practice during long winter evenings. I make sure I have books on kindle to read when sheltered.

[TwoSpirits]

Protect your water filter from freezing. Or, be aware that Aqua Mira takes longer to work with colder water. I personally use a Steri-pen, so I'm mindful to keep it in a pocket next to my body to keep the batteries from the cold.

[Slo-go'en]

Yep, looks like it will be cold and wet until Monday. 100% chance of rain Friday, Saturday and Sunday. Lows 40's during the day, high 20's at night. Icy trails in the morning/north facing slopes are very likely. This is ideal hypothermia weather. Being able to get dry and stay warm after sunset will be imperative. The weather improves later in the week. If you can delay the hike a few days, it would make it much more pleasant. If not, hope you have good rain gear.

[saltysack]

I’ve found a wind jacket works great over a syn or wool T shirt for a wide temperature range while on the move. Shorts with wind pants over them also work well for the legs... If it’s really cold in morning start with the rain shell over the wind shell but normally within 15 minutes it’s to hot but the wind shell alone is perfect on the move from about 20-60 degrees...


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[egilbe]

Slow down if you starttoget too warm. The idea is to avoid soaking your clothes with sweat. Moving quickly raises your body temp, moving slowly balances it out. It takes practice to balance your layers and hiking speed to avoid overheating and sweating throughyour insulating layers.

[Coffee]

Bring foods for dinner that are easy to prepare inside your tent or in the vestibule in case of bad weather. My favorite for cold hikes is Idahoan mashed potatoes. Something about warming up and heating a package of Idahoans while ensconced in my sleeping bad warms me up and allows me to get to sleep easily shortly after dinner. If I'm already cold when I get into my bag, this is especially important in order to warm up. Very important to have a hot dinner with plenty of calories before going to bed in order to stay warm all night. Oh, also, while I no longer use pee bottles during most of my hikes I make an exception if I expect temps to be below freezing overnight. If I get up to pee, I find it hard to warm up again. And as I progress through middle age, peeing at night is becoming the norm... Your mileage may vary on the last point ...

[Game Warden]

Don't eat breakfast in camp. Wake up, pack up, and hit the trail. Walk for a half hour or more, then stop and enjoy a good breakfast in a sunny, comfy spot. You'll be warm from walking, the drudgery of breaking camp will be behind you. Try it, you'll see what I mean.

[Sarcasm the elf]

Throw an extra garbage bag around your sleeping bag and sleep clothes, these are your insurance policy when hiking in cold rain. No matter how miserable the hiking is, you have sufficient insulations to sleep in inside a decent tent, then you should be okay.

Check the "R-value" insulation rating of your sleeping pad, if you have a particularly low R-value then consider getting an extra foam pad to put underneath it and keep you warm from the cold ground.

Use waterproof footware, or goretex liner socks over normal socks.

Look up the definition of "Type II fun" and understand that it is both very real and very fun.

[u.w.]

As others have said, hat, rain jacket, shirt, and shorts - if it's cold. Throw in gloves if your hands get cold easily.
Also, that water filter. Don't let it freeze. A pint freezer bag, or the like, to keep it in so you can throw it in the sleeping bag/quilt with you and not worry about it getting water on your stuff. Plus that same bag works very well as a water scoop if ya need to.
One I didn't see mentioned is knots. When it gets cold, your hands/fingers can stop working so well for you sometimes. Don't tie hard knots in cold weather.

And,, Enjoy your hike.

u.w.

[QuietStorm]

I hike the AT through the winter. I always bring a merino Wool buff, wear a merino Wool t-shirt, and have a fleece jacket and puffy when it’s really cold I bring fleece pants and down booties to sleep in. I sleep in a hammock, so the extra warmth with little extra weight is much appreciated.


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[Stone1984]

Things I learned hiking in the low 20's

Dry clothes were a life saver
You would be surprised how hard it is to get out of your UGQ Outdoors Top quilt in the morning.
Start off very cold, you will warm up fast even though it is miserable the first 5-10 min.
A good down jacket is a must.
If you can afford the weight 1 hot hands per night turns a cold night into a very tolerable one.

The views were better, the clearing of the trees is a different view and it is amazing.

[Leo L.]

One tiny trick I learned, during the camp chores I wear a down jacket. This jacket is the last piece I take off when already being half buried into the sleeping bag. and then I stuff it into the empty bag of the Thermarest, to use it as a pillow.
In the morning, the first thing I do is to put on the down jacket, which is still warm from my body. And as soon as everything is packed and I'm ready to leave camp, the jacket is the last item I take off and stuff into the backpack.

[DownEaster]

A good night's sleep is very important. To sleep well in the cold, start out warm. Eat a hot meal and drink a hot beverage just beforehand, giving your body fuel to burn through the night. When you're mostly inside your sleeping bag, if your body isn't toasty warm do a few push-ups and crunches until you've elevated your temperature sufficiently, then zip up all the way. And if your insulation isn't quite adequate for the cold, keep a Snickers bar or other snack handy so you can refuel and do a few more exercises if you wake up shivering. You almost certainly won't feel like performing calisthenics on a cold night, but forcing yourself to warm up your body through exercise can give you a good couple hours of comfortable sleep, whereas waiting for your inactive body to slowly warm up your frigid bag will make that time miserable.

[Bronk]

When you start out in the morning, hike for 5 or 10 minutes and then stop to take off some layers. Otherwise you will sweat in all of your clothes and they will be wet when you finish at the end of the day. When you stop to take a break, you'll know when the break is over because you will start to get cold. I've often done winter backpacking trips where I never once put my gloves on. You won't be cold if you have enough food and you keep walking.

[TX Aggie]

It sounds counter intuitive, but make sure your base layer is a moisture wicking shirt, such as Heat Gear, or at least a lightweight winter equivalent. NO COTTON T-shirt against your skin.
The main reason is as precisely mentioned you want to keep from sweating, but if you do sweat you want that moisture off of you, pronto. Additionally, even in colder weather these type shirts still have a good chance at drying out in the morning. Cotton won’t.
Also, sequester camp/sleeping clothing from hiking clothing. Especially on multi-day hikes this will insure that you’re going to sleep dry each day. If you have to put wet clothes back on in the morning, you’re still better off because you will at least end the day with dry clothes on.

My $.02.


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[TwoSpirits]

I've never done calisthenics in my sleeping bag (because I'm weak & lazy!), but if I am even a little chilled when I get into my bag (and for me that can happen even in relatively mild evening temps, like the 40s if I've just been sitting around and not active, even sitting around a fire...) I will just give my thighs, buttocks, and arms a good vigorous rubdown. This gets blood moving to those areas and I warm up nicely after a few minutes -- all without breaking a sweat!

Also, I sleep with (not in) my hiking clothes in my bag at night. It is brutal to put on frozen clothes in the morning! (I also sleep with my gas canister, phone, headlamp, and Steri-pen.) I unlace my boots WIDE open, because they are going to be stiff and maybe frozen laces in the morning.

I will fill a nalgene with hot water and insulate it with socks, but after one minor leak once I don't like to bring it into my bag. I will invert them and put them in my boots though.

[wordstew]

In your neck of the woods don't just go by the standard forecast of outside temp gotta be well aware of windchill even much more so if there's rain or any moisture in the air.

Here are some suggestions that may help

1. Try wearing pair of womens nylons or runners tights.
2. Deluxe Boston Electric Ignite Metal Pocket Hand Warmer - reuseable.
3. Fine wool Throw/scarf has many uses IE: mini blanket/towel/neck-head/ear warmer
4. If the cool wind bothers your ears and a hat is too warm you may want to consider a light pair of ear muffs.
5. For wet shoes Extra pair of dry wools socks and extra pair of shoe insoles (you can get lightweight wool insoles) The extra socks can double as glove/mits
6. Newspaper to stuff inside your wet shoes to speed up drying.
7. A beloved pet or someone to spoon with. Just make sure the pet has some weather protection.

8. Most importantly a good cell phone with a map of the area and family/friends are aware of your plans and return date/time.

Have fun

[Venchka]

Heads up!
Coulda. Shoulda. Woulda. Asked this question earlier. Much earlier. Like a month ago.
I hope your overall planning was thought out sooner than this last minute question.
Be warm. Be dry. Be safe.
Have fun!
Wayne

[gwschenk]

You realize how long the night is in the Winter.

There's nothing better than 16 hours in the tent!

[gwschenk]

One more thing: a pee bottle.

[Cheyou]

AM FM radio is nice for short daylight camping

Thom

[peakbagger]

You definitely want enough gear to cover all exposed skin. I carried a lightweight balaclava for most of the AT and used it on occasion. For most folks when hiking you need breathable layers and your skin covered and that is about it. If its windy add a wind shell that you can ventilate. Once you stop hiking even for few minutes you need to put on a layer over your core and a warm hat. Dont wait too long as once you have chilled it takes a lot longer to warm up. One thing that trips up most folks is eating lunch, your body only has so much warm blood, while hiking your stomach is in idle so the blood is going out to your extremities to keep you warm. The second you eat something, the stomach goes out of idle and starts using blood and that is routed away from your hands and feet. Pounding down a big meal will inevitablly cause you to really start to freeze in few minutes and it takes a lot to warm up. The far better alternative is to graze easy to digest snacks frequently that you can eat on the run. Save the big meals for supper. Speaking of supper you also need to up your calories, the colder it is the more fat you want. Talk to seasoned winter campers and they are always adding fats to meals to increase calories. Some even carry squeeze parkay and add a squirt to every meal.

Boots can be problem, ideally you need boots that are slightly large to fit in heavier socks or possible toe warmers. If you dont have the space in the boot to fit extra socks then extra socks really dont help unless you rotate them out along the day.

Remember water bottles and hydration systems can freeze if its below freezing. If you are cold, filling a Nalgene type bottle with near boiling water make a nice foot warmer. Just make sure its seals tight and some folks put it inside of ziplock.

Ideally leave the self inflating pads home and switch to a standard foam pad.

If you are new to it realize that its steep learning curve and especially solo the first thing that goes when hypothermia is kicking in is your mind. Realize if the weather is worse than expected you may have to bail out. Ideally its best to camp out in the backyard and try the gear out to get things dialed in first.

Another odd thing is in cold weather the relative humidity of the air is quite low. You will be putting a lot of moisture in the air in your breath and if your layers are working you still may be perspiring quite a bit but the cold dry air will dry you out. The combination of the two means many folks dont drink enough and electrolyte imbalance is easy. I get more leg cramps in the winter after hiking then the summer. They really suck when you are all warm in sleeping bag. Keep track of your fluid intake and make sure you drink enough and use an electrolyte supplement if you need it.

[Feral Bill]

One more thing: Travel with a companion so you can monitor each other for signs of hypothermia. The only time (in many years of winter camping) I got slightly hypothermic, I did not notice, and my son sent me to my sleeping bag while he cooked dinner. If you are alone, relentlessly self monitor.

[Venchka]

Technically, it ain’t winter yet.
If you did start this morning and you can read these posts you aren’t nearly far enough back in the woods. Or you’re at Walmart shopping for things mentioned above.
Have a great trip.
Wayne

[TX Aggie]

.

Another odd thing is in cold weather the relative humidity of the air is quite low. You will be putting a lot of moisture in the air in your breath and if your layers are working you still may be perspiring quite a bit but the cold dry air will dry you out. The combination of the two means many folks dont drink enough and electrolyte imbalance is easy. I get more leg cramps in the winter after hiking then the summer. They really suck when you are all warm in sleeping bag. Keep track of your fluid intake and make sure you drink enough and use an electrolyte supplement if you need it.

This point can’t be overemphasized. You may not be sweating, but since your body has to warm and humidify cold air, it’s not uncommon to expel as much or more moisture through normal breathing than through heavy perspiration. You won’t necessarily need as much water as during mid summer, but you’ll still need a liter or two daily at a minimum.


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[Emerson Bigills]

When you are going up and down hills, your body work rate will change significantly. With the same set of clothing, you might perspire going up the hill and get chilled on the way down. Within a certain range, I found I could regulate my perspiration and body comfort by adding and removing my hat and gloves. They are a whole lot easier to remove and put on than a jacket/sweatshirt or pants. Have a great hike. Winter hiking is quite peaceful. Not many people out there, but that means fewer people to assist if you get in trouble. Be safe and smart.

[fiddlehead]

You realize how long the night is in the Winter.

That's ^ what I was thinking immediately.
Good book, headlamp and batteries, and definitely a good sleeping bag.
Balaclava and possible goggles if it's windy.
Have fun.
Wear some orange, it's hunting season (bear) in PA, don't know about NJ but their similar seasons I believe.

[Scrum]

Yes... when hiking in the cold, don't allow yourself to sweat.

This is the key, but very hard to do. As others said, taking off/putting on a hat is useful. Also unzipping/zipping jacket or fleece to can help. I sometimes pull of my gloves, or switch to very light weight fleece gloves. I find the hardest part to be staying warm, but not sweating when caught in a strong wind and temps in the teens or lower.

When you take in some water or a bite of food, you can feel yourself warm up, so keep sipping and eating as you go. I heat up water (or make tea) and keep it in an insulted bottle, and throw it into an old wool sock. It will stay warm longer than you think.

Keep moving slow and steady and you will stay warm. As soon as you stop for a break, through on the down jacket and hat -- you will cool down really fast.

Microspikes help a lot with traction.

Recognize that the margin for error is smaller and the temp goes down. Know how to recognize hyperthermia and deal with it. I also carry a Spot in case you need to call in SAR.

Winter hiking is my favorite. No humidity, bugs, more solitude (though you will probably be surprised by how many other people are out in the cold), and better views without leaves on the trees. Have a great hike

[DownEaster]

One additional thing to keep on top of in cold weather hiking is hydration. Cold air, even if damp, when heated up to body temperature ends up with a very low relative humidity. You're losing a substantial amount of moisture from your body with every exhalation. At the same time, cold suppresses your thirst. You need to remind yourself to keep drinking as you hike. Scrum's suggestion of sipping from a big container of warm tea as you walk is good advice.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

Tootsie Rolls and peanut butter. It saved me from a nasty bit of hypothermia once.

[rocketsocks]

Tootsie Rolls and peanut butter. It saved me from a nasty bit of hypothermia once.I seem to remember a tootsie roll, or maybe it was a peppermint in my T&S Time goody bag...it hit the spot.

[peakbagger]

One other thing is make sure the food you carry can be eaten in cold weather or is kept where it can stay warm. Cliff Bars may not freeze but unless they are chopped up into small pieces in advance, the are just about impossible to bite pieces off a bar. Its pretty easy to test snack foods in advance, throw it in freezer, let freeze and then eat it directly out of the freezer.

If the snack is bite sized, you can thaw out in your mouth but ideally you want something that doesnt freeze. Nuts works well and sugar does not freeze so hard candy works well. Trying to chew tootsie rolls will rip fillings out when they are cold.

[cmoulder]

Good advice on frozen food!


Yes, get the "fun size" or "bite size" Sinckers, Milky Way, etc, remove the wrappers and put them in a ziploc. As long as they stay cold they won't stick together. Power Bars are hard as a brick so you have to put them in an inside jacket pocket or under your hat for a while to warm them up.

[Pringles]

The thing that surprised me, when hiking in temperatures that you described, are how treacherous the stream crossings are. The stream is moving along happily, but those rocks that you want to balance on to keep your feet from getting wet, they have a layer of ice. I planned extra time for stream crossings.

[Tipi Walter]

The thing that surprised me, when hiking in temperatures that you described, are how treacherous the stream crossings are. The stream is moving along happily, but those rocks that you want to balance on to keep your feet from getting wet, they have a layer of ice. I planned extra time for stream crossings.

Creek crossings when backpacking (vs dayhiking) are very difficult when the temps plunge to 0F and there's snow on the ground. On my last 21 day trip (just got back) I pulled a total of 46 creek crossings and either rock hopped in boots or used barefeet in my crocs to get across. There wasn't snow on the ground but the water was butt cold. Dual hiking sticks also help immensely in tough crossings UNLESS you need to lean down and grab creek rocks for balance as you cross.

Another big challenge is to NOT use your boots for these crossings and instead use creek shoes. Why? To keep the boots and socks as dry as possible for as long as possible. This also includes trail runners. 0F temps change everything.

So then the challenge becomes backpacking a long trail with a dozen or more crossings in quick succession---which requires staying in your creek shoes the whole time. This is made worse with snow on the trail. Because snow comes into crocs and plasters your bare feet.

40958
Last year I was in the Upper Bald wilderness and had to cross Upper Bald River which was half covered in a sheet of ice. How fun was it? Extremely fun. I had to stomp on the ice to break it apart and let it float downstream and ice break my way across.

40959
One of my worst crossings was during the Polar Vortex of 2014 after it warmed up to 0F and I had to cross Brookshire Creek on the Benton MacKaye trail. In bare feet and crocs.

40960
Let the games begins.

[clusterone]

Seal Skinz (waterproof and merino insulated) socks are my friend for cold crossings, and deep winter hiking in general. Sure beats barefoot. I have the near knee high socks, so unless the water comes over the top you have dry feet. FYI - tried Rocky Goretex socks (they leaked at seams) and NRS socks(also leak).

https://www.sealskinzusa.com/customer/pages/why-sealskinz-waterproof-socks?gclid=EAIaIQobChMItLXQlIvO1wIVDEwNCh1IGwNZEA AYASAAEgI8MvD_BwE

[Tipi Walter]

Seal Skinz (waterproof and merino insulated) socks are my friend for cold crossings, and deep winter hiking in general. Sure beats barefoot. I have the near knee high socks, so unless the water comes over the top you have dry feet. FYI - tried Rocky Goretex socks (they leaked at seams) and NRS socks(also leak).

https://www.sealskinzusa.com/customer/pages/why-sealskinz-waterproof-socks?gclid=EAIaIQobChMItLXQlIvO1wIVDEwNCh1IGwNZEA AYASAAEgI8MvD_BwE

Gotta give them a try---but only for winter creek crossings in my crocs. A Christmas pre-order for January---too late for a December trip.

[egilbe]

Up here, Tipi, the Brooks and streams freeze solid or there are snow bridges one can cross. Heaven help you tnough, if you fall in.

[kayak karl]

Stay dry. Drinks lots of water even if you don't want it. Stay dry

[spfleisig]

So here is the summary and it is way boring.

We started hiking at the Delaware Water Gap at 5:22am on Friday and did 24.4 miles to the Brinks shelter. We finished hiking around 4pm. I hiked in running shorts and mid-weight running tights. On top I had a SS running top and a mid-weight fleece top. Wore a buff on my head and some fleece gloves. That was fine for the whole day.

We set up the tents in the shelter. A two-man free standing tent and the Zpacks Duplex. Halfway through the hike it struck me that maybe the Duplex isn't the right tent for sub 25 degrees. Well we finished our dinner around 6pm and we had a whole bunch of night ahead of us. Because the Duplex couldn't be put up properly, I think it led to a colder night than anticipated. After watching some stuff on my phone, I called it quits around 9:30pm. I have a Western Mountaineering Alpinlite 20 degree bag and the NeoAir Xlite pad. I slept with the same socks, bottoms, tops plus another LS running top and a puffy jacket and the same buff and gloves. I was ok in the bag and was either entirely in the bag or just had my face outside the bag.

It was a very long night. Didn't sleep well...it was 23 degrees at 9:30pm and 23 at 5:30am. The bag is rated to 20 degrees but I had a lot more clothes on than what I understand is the standard of long bottoms, long top and hat. That leads me to question whether the 20 degree rating on my bag is legit given I had a lot more clothes on and I'm normally a warm sleeper.

I also was left wondering how much of a difference the "proper" tent would have made. What do "professionals" say is the typical temp you stop using a 3 season tent and move to a winter tent. What makes a winter tent different than a 3 season tent? How much difference would have been made with a pad with a higher R value?

Bottom line for me is I have no problems hiking in 25 degrees but I thinking sleeping in 25 degrees isn't my cup of tea. Worrying about freezing water filters and water...long nights....

One valuable lesson I did come away with was to carry extra Smart water bottle caps. My bottle came out one time and the cap cracked.

After waking up on Saturday, we saw the weather report called for a 50% chance or better of rain and wind from Saturday afternoon to Sunday afternoon. So we opted to just hike 4 miles into Branchville and we got picked up and driven back to the Gap to our cars. We went out again today and started back in Branchville and did the 14 miles to High Point State Park office.

[egilbe]

Neoair xlite has an r-value of 3.2. kinda light for subfreezing temps. Adding a z-lite or the like would have boosted it to 5+ and been more suitable to those temps. EN ratings are measured with a pad with an r-value of 5. Probably why you were cold.

[egilbe]

I use our 4-season tent when I expect sub freezing temps and/or snow and/or high winds. I like the dual wall design, I just wish it didn't weigh 7 lbs.

[Venchka]

So here is the summary and it is way boring.

We started hiking at the Delaware Water Gap at 5:22am on Friday and did 24.4 miles to the Brinks shelter. We finished hiking around 4pm. I hiked in running shorts and mid-weight running tights. On top I had a SS running top and a mid-weight fleece top. Wore a buff on my head and some fleece gloves. That was fine for the whole day.

We set up the tents in the shelter. A two-man free standing tent and the Zpacks Duplex. Halfway through the hike it struck me that maybe the Duplex isn't the right tent for sub 25 degrees. Well we finished our dinner around 6pm and we had a whole bunch of night ahead of us. Because the Duplex couldn't be put up properly, I think it led to a colder night than anticipated. After watching some stuff on my phone, I called it quits around 9:30pm. I have a Western Mountaineering Alpinlite 20 degree bag and the NeoAir Xlite pad. I slept with the same socks, bottoms, tops plus another LS running top and a puffy jacket and the same buff and gloves. I was ok in the bag and was either entirely in the bag or just had my face outside the bag.

It was a very long night. Didn't sleep well...it was 23 degrees at 9:30pm and 23 at 5:30am. The bag is rated to 20 degrees but I had a lot more clothes on than what I understand is the standard of long bottoms, long top and hat. That leads me to question whether the 20 degree rating on my bag is legit given I had a lot more clothes on and I'm normally a warm sleeper.

I also was left wondering how much of a difference the "proper" tent would have made. What do "professionals" say is the typical temp you stop using a 3 season tent and move to a winter tent. What makes a winter tent different than a 3 season tent? How much difference would have been made with a pad with a higher R value?

Bottom line for me is I have no problems hiking in 25 degrees but I thinking sleeping in 25 degrees isn't my cup of tea. Worrying about freezing water filters and water...long nights....

One valuable lesson I did come away with was to carry extra Smart water bottle caps. My bottle came out one time and the cap cracked.

After waking up on Saturday, we saw the weather report called for a 50% chance or better of rain and wind from Saturday afternoon to Sunday afternoon. So we opted to just hike 4 miles into Branchville and we got picked up and driven back to the Gap to our cars. We went out again today and started back in Branchville and did the 14 miles to High Point State Park office.
I own an Alpinlite and use an Xtherm Large under the bag inside an MSR HUBBA HUBBA NX. To date I have been totally comfortable in my lightest synthetic long underwear top and bottom, fleece beanie and Darn Tough AT logo socks at 25 degrees. The following night I switched to mid weight merino wool underwear and added fleece gloves and slept fine to 15 degrees when I woke up at 6 am.
I was on the ground.
I think a higher R value pad and on the ground would be better than off the ground in a shelter. The net venting at ground level in the Duplex didn’t help either.
I’m not a fan of the current tent fashion of placing net near ground level. The Hubba Hubba netting starts well above ground level and my StratoSpire 1 has the solid inner tent. The way double wall tents should be made.
I’m totally impressed with your progress on the first day. Well done!
Wayne

[Venchka]

PS:
Move as much down as possible from the bottom of the Alpinlite to the top. That might help.
Wayne

[TX Aggie]

Seal Skinz (waterproof and merino insulated) socks are my friend for cold crossings, and deep winter hiking in general. Sure beats barefoot. I have the near knee high socks, so unless the water comes over the top you have dry feet. FYI - tried Rocky Goretex socks (they leaked at seams) and NRS socks(also leak).

https://www.sealskinzusa.com/customer/pages/why-sealskinz-waterproof-socks?gclid=EAIaIQobChMItLXQlIvO1wIVDEwNCh1IGwNZEA AYASAAEgI8MvD_BwE

Thanks for the reminder, I love seal skins and need a new pair. Their gloves are my favorite.


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[Tipi Walter]

It was a very long night. Didn't sleep well...it was 23 degrees at 9:30pm and 23 at 5:30am. The bag is rated to 20 degrees but I had a lot more clothes on than what I understand is the standard of long bottoms, long top and hat. That leads me to question whether the 20 degree rating on my bag is legit given I had a lot more clothes on and I'm normally a warm sleeper.

I also was left wondering how much of a difference the "proper" tent would have made. What do "professionals" say is the typical temp you stop using a 3 season tent and move to a winter tent. What makes a winter tent different than a 3 season tent? How much difference would have been made with a pad with a higher R value?

Bottom line for me is I have no problems hiking in 25 degrees but I thinking sleeping in 25 degrees isn't my cup of tea. Worrying about freezing water filters and water...long nights....


This in a nutshell reveals the main problems many backpackers have on winter trips---Not a warm enough bag/pad combo; and the quandary between a 3 season and a 4 season tent.

First off, the rule of thumb is a 20F rated bag works to 35F---so to stay comfy at 20F you'll need a 5F bag. It's the "15 degree" rule. If you plan on staying comfy for many long winter nights at 20F---get a Zero rated bag. What's the worst that can happen? You'll sleep too warm? If so, unzip and use it as a quilt.

Another corollary is to use a sleeping pad or pad combo of at least 5R. The higher the number the better.

The 3 vs 4 season tent is a subject hotly debated on backpacking forums. I myself won't use anything but a 4 season tent, for various reasons. Namely---
** Beefier floor and more waterproof floor (higher hydrostatic head). Comes in handy in a tent on wet slush.
** No mesh on the inner tent that cannot be sealed with zippered canopy fabric. This is important in all ways and esp so during blizzards with spindrift. Blown snow will go thru unsealable inner tent mesh.

** A double wall tent drastically reduces condensation reaching you and your gear---and obviates the need to wipe down the inside of your single wall tent every two hours.
** A 4 season tent is built to withstand higher winds because of beefier poles, a better design and stronger guy out tabs with ample guylines. You'll thank me later on a mountaintop in a 60mph blizzard. My current winter tent takes 14 pegs.

[spfleisig]

How does one do that?

[spfleisig]

How does one do that?


PS:
Move as much down as possible from the bottom of the Alpinlite to the top. That might help.
Wayne

[egilbe]

How does one do that?

Pick it up by the bottom and shake it.

[BlackCloud]

I find that a dry shirt and something warm to drink can overcome most.

[Venchka]

Moving the down:
Open the zipper.
Hold the bag up by the zipper half attached to the bottom of the bag.
Gently shake the bag to shift the down toward the top half of the bag.
I also lay the bag open and flat. I use my hands to push the down from the bottom toward the top.
The objective is to fill the top with as much down as possible.
If needed I will draw the collar sung around my neck and close the hood so that only my nose is sticking out. I have a light balaclava that covers my nose and keeps it warm.
The EN Male Lower Limit Rating of the Alpinlite is 16 degrees Fahrenheit. That rating is accurate according to my ancient bones. I would not have bought it if I only expected to use it at 35 degrees F.
Wayne

[Leo L.]

For winter camping, a 4 seasons tent is mandatory (as others pointed out).
The difference is dramatic.

The coldest I ever had in a tent was on the slopes of Mont Blanc (the highest in Europe). The little thermometer indicated something lower than -20°C - inside the tent.
This was in my old Salewa Sierra Nevada, double wall, not exactly the best 4-seasons, but OK.
I had "the best" Salewa expedition down bag, a double-thick CCF mat and was in full clothes, including a down jacket.
Slept fine, trouble was the nose freezing.

A year later we were tenting on another high mountain, similar height, similar cold (maybe a tad less), same bag&mattress, but the tent was a Sumitomo Nanga Parbat which at this time was "the best" expedition tent designed for Himalaya and such.
I was really warm in the bag, had to open it and was short of using it as a quilt.

A really good 4-seasons tent makes all the difference.

[cmoulder]

Once again, the problem is the air mat. In those temps, a Neoair xlite MUST be supplemented with a (minimum) 3/8" closed cell foam pad ON TOP, or, as has been suggested, use an Xtherm. If still cold, wear all (DRY) clothing as well... everything ya brung, coats, longjohns, buffs hats gloves, yada yada. Still cold? Use a hot water bottle to augment, and budget extra stove fuel for this purpose.

And yes, a Duplex is not a winter tent. I have a Duplex but for winter conditions I use a MLD Duomid. Pitched tight to the deck it blocks wind well and that is the key.

Two things I have to ask: What do you mean by "tents put up in the shelter" and "Duplex couldn't be pitched properly"??? :confused:

[Tipi Walter]

For winter camping, a 4 seasons tent is mandatory (as others pointed out).
The difference is dramatic.

The coldest I ever had in a tent was on the slopes of Mont Blanc (the highest in Europe). The little thermometer indicated something lower than -20°C - inside the tent.
This was in my old Salewa Sierra Nevada, double wall, not exactly the best 4-seasons, but OK.
I had "the best" Salewa expedition down bag, a double-thick CCF mat and was in full clothes, including a down jacket.
Slept fine, trouble was the nose freezing.

A year later we were tenting on another high mountain, similar height, similar cold (maybe a tad less), same bag&mattress, but the tent was a Sumitomo Nanga Parbat which at this time was "the best" expedition tent designed for Himalaya and such.
I was really warm in the bag, had to open it and was short of using it as a quilt.

A really good 4-seasons tent makes all the difference.

I really like the way your mind thinks, probably because we are in total agreement. I call it this: "when push comes to shove" phenomenon. Severe cold coupled with high winds and the truth emerges; what works and what does not. We get pushed and shoved by Miss Nature until we figure out the solution.

Here in the Southeast mountains we too get subzero temps with high winds, especially on mountaintops above 5,000 feet. Study Mt LeConte winter temps---they commonly get to -20F. And the winds can get hellish.

One reason I see very few backpackers in the winter is because of their lack of good gear and their unwillingness to both purchase or carry such gear: a stout 4 season tent and a high quality subzero down bag.

[Leo L.]

Thanks for the kind words, Walter. I always tell my wife some anectodes you give here.

The last few outings I did I was suffering quite a bit, in the night. Instead of my Prolite Plus (which had developed a blowout) I was using my wife's Prolite (without plus). Noticeabely lighter and thinner. And much less warm, so I was on the brink of shivering through the night. The temps were around freezing.

I know my sore points when getting cold: The head (easy to solve, by putting on a woolen hat and closing up the mummy bag), and the mattress (can be improved a bit by putting as much other stuff under the mattress as possible).

Again, as many had pointed out here before, the hiking itself is no problem, in the cold. Just hike as fast as you need to stay warm, but well away from sweating.
Some problems might arise as soon as you stop, for a break or for the night. The cold creeps into the body sooner or later.

One thing I had to learn the hard way:
Whatever you do, always keep a bit of personal energy as a safety margin, never walk/hike/climb to the edge of exhaustment.

[saltysack]

Once again, the problem is the air mat. In those temps, a Neoair xlite MUST be supplemented with a (minimum) 3/8" closed cell foam pad ON TOP, or, as has been suggested, use an Xtherm. If still cold, wear all (DRY) clothing as well... everything ya brung, coats, longjohns, buffs hats gloves, yada yada. Still cold? Use a hot water bottle to augment, and budget extra stove fuel for this purpose.

And yes, a Duplex is not a winter tent. I have a Duplex but for winter conditions I use a MLD Duomid. Pitched tight to the deck it blocks wind well and that is the key.

Two things I have to ask: What do you mean by "tents put up in the shelter" and "Duplex couldn't be pitched properly"??? :confused:



Finally got permission from the sheriff(wife)...I’m starting this Friday afternoon at iron mtn gap sobo doing the 88 miles to Hot Springs by Tuesday evening. Weather looks good but will probably be lil chilly in the 20* Enigma under the duomid. I’m definitely bringing the xtherm and the bivy to add lil warmth. Planned on going stove less but think I’ll bring the achy stove. Here’s forecast for Erwin down at 1,700’.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171121/9bac46bf5efccba18702d9b1cf922b5b.jpg


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[Tipi Walter]

One thing I had to learn the hard way:
Whatever you do, always keep a bit of personal energy as a safety margin, never walk/hike/climb to the edge of exhaustment.

Leo L.: That's funny . . . the prolite . . . without plus . . .

And you bring up the fact of how exhaustion coupled with cold can significantly accent possible hypothermia; going beyond that safety margin. I see it in myself all the time---getting to camp exhausted and cold. Exposure really happens faster when exhausted.

Oh and btw---it REALLY helps to get a Ridgerest Solar pad (silver thing) along with an inflatable and get a two-pad system going for winter camping. See pic. Advantages---
** In case the inflatable dies you can double up the Solar ccf pad and get 7R for hips and chest and arms and torso.
** When placed on top of inflatable the solar really augments warmth on butt cold nights at 0F on rock hard frozen ground. (Thru experimentation I've found the ccf on top works better than underneath).
40979


Finally got permission from the sheriff(wife)...I’m starting this Friday afternoon at iron mtn gap sobo doing the 88 miles to Hot Springs by Tuesday evening. Weather looks good but will probably be lil chilly in the 20* Enigma under the duomid. I’m definitely bringing the xtherm and the bivy to add lil warmth. Planned on going stove less but think I’ll bring the achy stove. Here’s forecast for Erwin down at 1,700’.

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Good plan and good idea to bring the stove---as a mental buffer against the cold---a true comfort item.

[Leo L.]

A <like> at Walter.

A stove and a good amount of fuel is essential, in the real cold.
During the aforementioned trip to Mount Blanc, we were 4 guys, occupying two tents.
My mate brought a sturdy, heavy steel-and-brass gas stove (automotive gas) and the other party had a canister stove for very normal camping use (the Blue one, using Butane).
The gas stove worked perfectly fine, we had our morning tea and started off from the tent at 4:00am for the summit.
The other partys canister stove failed miserabely and they took off so late that they finally missed the summit.

Nothing better than a cup of hot tea when its really cold...
(but keep an empty bottle at hand for the night when drinking it in the evening <G>)

[Tipi Walter]

A stove and a good amount of fuel is essential, in the real cold.
During the aforementioned trip to Mount Blanc, we were 4 guys, occupying two tents.
My mate brought a sturdy, heavy steel-and-brass gas stove (automotive gas) and the other party had a canister stove for very normal camping use (the Blue one, using Butane).
The gas stove worked perfectly fine, we had our morning tea and started off from the tent at 4:00am for the summit.
The other partys canister stove failed miserabely and they took off so late that they finally missed the summit.

Nothing better than a cup of hot tea when its really cold...
(but keep an empty bottle at hand for the night when drinking it in the evening <G>)

I like the morning and evening ritual of using my stove on a backpacking trip. It's a comfort item but also allows me to carry less food weight due to the tricky but understandable math---Dehydrated foods-ready-to-cook are lighter than a no-cook diet with snack foods. Why? Because water exists in more amounts in snack foods vs dehydrated foods---and this water doesn't have to be carried and can instead be retrieved on a daily basis around camp/along the trail---so it's not carried in your pack as an ingredient in snack foods.

In other words, a bag full of 21 home-dehydrated dinner meals is very small---just add water. And oatmeal for breakfast---just add water.

And a stove is vital on a trip with 0F or -10F temps---just to melt snow or to thaw stored pot water (keep your water in the cook pot overnight in the tent vestibule and it will turn to a solid block of ice---but it's in the pot and not in your water bottle(s) so you can quickly crank the stove for liquid water.

[Venchka]

Leo L.: That's funny . . . the prolite . . . without plus . . .

And you bring up the fact of how exhaustion coupled with cold can significantly accent possible hypothermia; going beyond that safety margin. I see it in myself all the time---getting to camp exhausted and cold. Exposure really happens faster when exhausted.

Oh and btw---it REALLY helps to get a Ridgerest Solar pad (silver thing) along with an inflatable and get a two-pad system going for winter camping. See pic. Advantages---
** In case the inflatable dies you can double up the Solar ccf pad and get 7R for hips and chest and arms and torso.
** When placed on top of inflatable the solar really augments warmth on butt cold nights at 0F on rock hard frozen ground. (Thru experimentation I've found the ccf on top works better than underneath).
40979



Good plan and good idea to bring the stove---as a mental buffer against the cold---a true comfort item.

I’m headed for Boone, NC (north and higher elevation than Irwin) this weekend. I started packing and figured I should check the forecast. I immediately packed my woolies and down jacket.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171121/2eb5dfdaa0110eddc346692c1fddb4cd.jpg
Be warm!
Wayne


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[Tipi Walter]

I’m headed for Boone, NC (north and higher elevation than Irwin) this weekend. I started packing and figured I should check the forecast. I immediately packed my woolies and down jacket.

Be warm!
Wayne


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You know why I'm so fixated on cold weather backpacking and camping and overkill gear? Because I spent 30 years living and backpacking in Boone and around Watauga County. The old Boone winters will make a believer out of you.
41026
Standing outside my Tipi in 1990---Watauga County.

[egilbe]

I’m headed for Boone, NC (north and higher elevation than Irwin) this weekend. I started packing and figured I should check the forecast. I immediately packed my woolies and down jacket.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171121/2eb5dfdaa0110eddc346692c1fddb4cd.jpg
Be warm!
Wayne


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That looks downright balmy!

[Venchka]

Balmy is relative.
To folks from Florida the forecast for Boone might as well be the Yukon.
Something about cold weather not yet mentioned: Your internal thermostat needs a few days to adjust to being outdoors in the cold around the clock. It takes a few days for your body to adjust to the new temperature. If you only go on weekends then you will think that your gear is adequate and that you are going to freeze. After a week things get better.
Wayne


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[Venchka]

“Gear is INADEQUATE “
Wayne


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[Tipi Walter]

Balmy is relative.
To folks from Florida the forecast for Boone might as well be the Yukon.
Something about cold weather not yet mentioned: Your internal thermostat needs a few days to adjust to being outdoors in the cold around the clock. It takes a few days for your body to adjust to the new temperature. If you only go on weekends then you will think that your gear is adequate and that you are going to freeze. After a week things get better.
Wayne


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Cold adjustment is true. I just finished a hot summer season of backpacking in the humid furnace of Georgia and Tennessee---so when I pulled my recent November trip I was shaking like a monkey in a vaseline factory being chased by a silverback gorilla. After 15 days of the cold I got used to it and so it goes.

And here's a winter tip---You stay warmer outdoors if you do not bathe. Your body oils keep you warmer. I wrote this on December 28, 2013 as a short blurb in my trip report during a winter backpacking trip---

ATTENTION WINTER BACKPACKERS
We've been told for decades to not bathe on winter trips and you'll stay warmer. Well, here's a post about winter survival on Bushcraft USA titled Swedish Tips and Tricks for Winter(9/3/13)started by a guy from Sweden named Thump and a guy named Fnixen says---


"I'm from Sweden as well and I have also been told not to wash my face with soap because the dirt and fat will protect the skin in cold weather."

[LIhikers]

.......Check the "R-value" insulation rating of your sleeping pad, if you have a particularly low R-value then consider getting an extra foam pad to put underneath it and keep you warm from the cold ground........
.

This is sage advice.
A sleeping bag won't keep you insulated from the cold ground so you need a good pad, or two.

[Dogwood]

Drink copious amounts of water. This is often forgotten during colder hikes. Protect H2O from freezing overnight.

It's not just about bringing warm gear but gear that breathes and is capable of being ventilated should you start exerting yourself. Perhaps, a 4 layer system with each layer slightly less weightier is more versatile than a 3 layer system with 1 heavier insulation layer? Clothing accessories should be carefully considered that compliment your hiking style during this time of the yr, your specific layering scenarios, and that are easily altered(removed or added) aka hat, balaclava, socks, gloves/mittens, Buff, etc. It's also a time of yr when some forget sunglasses which could prove useful on very sunny days with the leaves off the trees. Thermoregulation is as important than ever. Don't overheat on the move or allow to get too cold when at rest. This requires attention and diligence.

Shells should breathe, be able of being ventilated, be WP, and have some good level of being wind proof. On the move wearing a loaded backpack sometimes a mid layer underneath such a shell with these qualities while addressing extremities with these accessories could be all you need.

Consider higher fat % food of total daily calories, a warmed b-fast and dinner possibly with something hot like a hearty soup or drink.

Consider warm sleeping socks. I love the Goose Feet down booties/socks for foot specific warmth when sleeping.

Consider chemical heat packs like Toasty Toes, hand warmers(drop one inside each hand pocket or glove/mitten), Footbed insert warmers or battery operated warming socks, etc.

[Dogwood]

Start the process of extending your comfortable temp range by sleeping outside a few nights in the same set up as you'll be employing on the hike before the hike. Take brisk walks pre NJ AT section wearing your hiking clothes set for the hike wearing your backpack. Feel the cold on your face. Go ice skating. Outside in the cold and preferably in the wind and/or rain set up your shelter, cook your food, change layers/accessories, etc before the hike. It's called training. ;)

[Dogwood]

Pay attention to altering pace during the pre hike training to assist in thermoregulating. We don't have to all hike like run away freight trains maintaining the same pace under all trail conditions. This assists in also achieving the best energy bang/getting down the trail with less input which could reduce food needs/wt of food, muscle fatigue, etc.

[Odd Man Out]

As mentioned, head covering is a key hiking, camping, and sleeping. A buff is a wonderful piece of equipment to hike and sleep in, especially if using a quilt vs a mummy hooded sleeping bag. I find hiking and sleeping is easier to regulate body temp. I tend to suffer the most in camp. But that is probably the area that gets the least practice during long winter evenings. I make sure I have books on kindle to read when sheltered.

+1 on the Buff. On my last fall hike, it was not winter conditions, but still pretty chilly, especially in camp at dawn. One morning I was feeling a bit chilled during morning camp chores. I put on my Buff and almost immediately I felt warm. It was amazing what a difference it made.

[clusterone]

You know why I'm so fixated on cold weather backpacking and camping and overkill gear? Because I spent 30 years living and backpacking in Boone and around Watauga County. The old Boone winters will make a believer out of you.
41026
Standing outside my Tipi in 1990---Watauga County.

Now that is a winter hat!

[nsherry61]

Drink copious amounts of water. . .
And, practice peeing into a bottle while you're in bed until you manage to train yourself to do so without issue. For many of us it is really, really hard to get our bodies to let pee flow while in bed. Not to mention, it can take some practice to figure out how to do it without risking a spill. It is harder than one would think and being able to do so is a big plus when it is the middle of a dark and stormy night and you don't want to get out of your warm sleeping bag to relieve yourself, and holding it is uncomfortable enough it will keep you awake.

[saltysack]

And, practice peeing into a bottle while you're in bed until you manage to train yourself to do so without issue. For many of us it is really, really hard to get our bodies to let pee flow while in bed. Not to mention, it can take some practice to figure out how to do it without risking a spill. It is harder than one would think and being able to do so is a big plus when it is the middle of a dark and stormy night and you don't want to get out of your warm sleeping bag to relieve yourself, and holding it is uncomfortable enough it will keep you awake.

I’d love to see my wife’s reaction to me practicing this skill at home![emoji23]


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[nsherry61]

I’d love to see my wife’s reaction to me practicing this skill at home!

Maybe you can convince her that snow camping is fun and that she should practice as well. :p

[MtDoraDave]

Rather than check the weather in a town near where you'll be, check ATweather.org . Pretty simple to navigate - just select AT, select the state, then select the shelter you'd like the forecast for - but some of the shelters in the NC/TN border will make you search twice because they may be in either TN or NC

[LittleRock]

First off, the rule of thumb is a 20F rated bag works to 35F---so to stay comfy at 20F you'll need a 5F bag. It's the "15 degree" rule. If you plan on staying comfy for many long winter nights at 20F---get a Zero rated bag. What's the worst that can happen? You'll sleep too warm? If so, unzip and use it as a quilt.

This. If the forecast has lows below freezing, I switch from 20 to 0 degree bag.

[squeezebox]

Balmy is relative.
To folks from Florida the forecast for Boone might as well be the Yukon.
Something about cold weather not yet mentioned: Your internal thermostat needs a few days to adjust to being outdoors in the cold around the clock. It takes a few days for your body to adjust to the new temperature. If you only go on weekends then you will think that your gear is adequate and that you are going to freeze. After a week things get better.
Wayne


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So would you suggest sleeping outside and spending as much time ouside as possible to adjust a few days before the hike?

[TX Aggie]

So would you suggest sleeping outside and spending as much time ouside as possible to adjust a few days before the hike?

Absolutely. Acclimation is only part of it, you also need to know IF your gear will actually work for you, but also specifically HOW to beat deploy that gear. It may be something as simple as the best direction to lay your sleeping bag to keep condensation off of you.

I’m signed up for my first winter backpacking trip in January, I’ve been testing and tweaking my hammock setup in my backyard a couple of nights a week for the past 3 weeks. Each time I’m tweaking. Plus, it gives me another excuse to sleep outside.

Same goes for even just hiking: know what combination of layers work best for any given temperature.

[Bronk]

No cotton clothing...if it gets wet from sweat or any other reason you're going to freeze.

[Redbird2]

Dress in layers that you can quickly put on and take off. Usually it's not always cold. There will be times when your body feels colder than other times.

[nsherry61]

So would you suggest sleeping outside and spending as much time ouside as possible to adjust a few days before the hike?
Yes. Sleep naked in a hammock outside for one week before your trip to acclimate to the cold. You're allowed to drink warm drinks to try and stay warm, but not cloths or sleeping insulation.

On a more serious note. I find I acclimate to cold weather by being out in it for extended periods of time and keeping my clothing minimal, so I'm constantly cool, but NOT cold. Sleeping cold sucks and makes getting adequate sleep difficult or impossible, and thus sleeping cold is probably not the best way to acclimate.

[Fredt4]

Yes... when hiking in the cold, don't allow yourself to sweat.

I find that with a pack on my back, I can usually hike in just shorts and a t-shirt if temperatures are above freezing.

I usually start the morning in shorts, t-shirt, rain jacket, and hat. Additional layers are added if the temperatures warrant (such as a fleece pull-over and rain pants).
The moment I start to feel I'm about to start sweating, I start taking layers off. I start with any additional layers and put them back in my pack. Next, I take of the rain jacket and keep it in an external pocket so that I can quickly put it back on when ever I take a 'pack-off' break (and because you usually start cooling off very quickly when you pause for a break... unless I'm sweating in the t-shirt, I immediately place the rain coat back on even if I'm not cold... then take it back off when I'm ready to pickup my pack).

The last thing to take off is your hat. When temps are near 40, I usually find that my hat is all I need to regulate my temperature while I keep hiking. Simply stick it in your pocket when you start to feel warm, pull it out and back on when you start to feel cold.

If you do sweat in your t-shirt, try to leave it on when you stop for the day to try to get your body temperature to dry it out. You can try to keep warm in the mean time by putting on a hat and possibly pants. If your rain jacket is a breathable jacket, espeically if it doesn't have a liner, you can put the jacket on over your sweaty t-shirt. As the moisture evaporates from your shirt, it should pass thru the jacket if it is a dry day.

I agree with this post, this method of hiking has worked for me over the years. As you pull into camp I get into my sleeping bag when I'm still warm as it will heat your bag. I generally don't need to dry my clothing but if you find that it's still a bit damp I'll continue wearing it until it's dry.

[Tipi Walter]

And, practice peeing into a bottle while you're in bed until you manage to train yourself to do so without issue. For many of us it is really, really hard to get our bodies to let pee flow while in bed. Not to mention, it can take some practice to figure out how to do it without risking a spill. It is harder than one would think and being able to do so is a big plus when it is the middle of a dark and stormy night and you don't want to get out of your warm sleeping bag to relieve yourself, and holding it is uncomfortable enough it will keep you awake.

One thing I learned about myself and winter camping---in tough conditions you don't want to leave the tent for ANY REASONS. Peeing inside the tent in a bottle or squatting in the vestibule is just one consideration. The other big challenge is birthing a pesky Turtlehead in a hellstorm blizzard at 0F with 40mph winds. To drop trousers and push out a human turd in such conditions can be done inside the tent or vestibule with just a couple paper towels and a ziploc bag. Place the whole wad in the bag afterwards and throw bag in the snow outside the tent. It will freeze solid. The next day when packing up dig a cathole and empty the contents of the bag into the ground. Put old ziploc in your trash bag. Voila, 7.6 lbs lighter.

I know, I know, I can hear the replies: "I'm just glad I don't camp with you." The mantra "when push comes to shove" has new meaning here.


So would you suggest sleeping outside and spending as much time ouside as possible to adjust a few days before the hike?


Absolutely. Acclimation is only part of it, you also need to know IF your gear will actually work for you, but also specifically HOW to beat deploy that gear. It may be something as simple as the best direction to lay your sleeping bag to keep condensation off of you.

I’m signed up for my first winter backpacking trip in January, I’ve been testing and tweaking my hammock setup in my backyard a couple of nights a week for the past 3 weeks. Each time I’m tweaking. Plus, it gives me another excuse to sleep outside.

Same goes for even just hiking: know what combination of layers work best for any given temperature.

It's true that the more time you spend in cold temps backpacking and camping, the better you can handle the cold. My recent December trip is proof of this. I was shocked after a long hot summer to get a couple first snowy nights at around 10F but I slowly came around to embracing Miss Nature's plans.

Therefore there's a sliding scale of what you can endure. After 3 or 4 days at 0F or -10F, a day at 10F seems balmy. Acclimation. When the forecast calls for 20F you know you have it made and that particular challenging cold snap is over . . . until the next one. Plus, sleeping out in the backyard every night between trips really helps too.

[Nuke1]

I know your hike is probably over, but other people can benefit from all this cold weather advice. It's been a while, but I remember a few things from COLD cold weather hiking from back in the day:

I used spare wool sox as mittens.

I kept my night and next morning water supply in the sleeping bag because it froze solid if I didn't. I kept my hiking water relatively close to my skin all day in really cold weather so it wouldn't freeze.

Boots will freeze up overnight, but if you stick your feet in them and walk around on your tip toes, the boot will eventually thaw and your foot will eventually slide in and fit properly.

I only made 6 miles per day in knee deep snow. I couldn't afford snow shoes back then. It is possible to get so much snow, you could get trapped.

Any food with liquid in it (canned meat, etc) can freeze solid. You can still eat it, but it will eat like a popsicle.

During long stretches of cold, it was too cold to clean up in the evening. After 4 or 5 days, I stank so badly, the smell woke me up at night. Consider how you're going to keep clean. You can shower with any temperature of water as long as it's not frozen. Start off by building a good fire, 5 quarts of water, and a cup. Pour a cup of water on your head. Shampoo your head and wash your face. The next cup or two rinses your head and face, and gets your upper body wet. Wash your upper body. Then next cup or two rinses your head, face, upper body and gets your mid and lower body wet. Keep working your way down. If you can warm the last quart of water, use it last to rinse from head to toe, and to warm up. A small hand towel, or thick dry washcloth, is good enough to dry off with.

Sunglasses in case you hike in snow with lots of sunshine.

Some kind of metal traction thingies to attach to the bottom of your boots in case you get a snow melt in the afternoon, and a hard freeze during the night, and end up having to walk on hard ice. Rare, that you'd need it, but it can happen. Same thing with hiking sticks. I use 2 mop handles as walking sticks, drill a hole in the bottom, cut the head off of a heavy duty nail, put in the drilled hole in the bottom so the point can be used for ice traction.

A sleeping bag far, far warmer than you think you could possibly need. Good padding to insulate from whatever kind of deck you'll sleep on, be it ground, wood shelter, rock.

You don't have to try and wear your dirty or wet outer hiking clothing, in camp at night. Walking around in thermal underwear is OK. Bring a heavy duty thick top and bottom.

A fire is really good at boosting morale when it's super cold, and good at drying out clothes. Make sure you have good wet weather fire building skills. A hatchet is the most helpful, but very heavy. However, a fire with a good supply of wood could save your life....never can tell.

Stay hydrated, even if you end up drinking TOO much water. Always eat high fiber in your meals so you can crap before you go to bed, and definitely use a pee bottle INSIDE your sleeping bag, while laying on your side. I use Nalgene wide mouth. If you're female, I have no idea how to take care of this.

Make sure some of your foods are high in fiber. You'll need lots of calories, so a slightly higher amount of fat helps. Fat boosts the effects of carbohydrates for energy and generating body heat. If your food doesn't have enough fat, consider bringing a small bottle of oil and add a small amount to each meal.

Do whatever you have to do to stay dry.

[saltysack]

One thing I learned about myself and winter camping---in tough conditions you don't want to leave the tent for ANY REASONS. Peeing inside the tent in a bottle or squatting in the vestibule is just one consideration. The other big challenge is birthing a pesky Turtlehead in a hellstorm blizzard at 0F with 40mph winds. To drop trousers and push out a human turd in such conditions can be done inside the tent or vestibule with just a couple paper towels and a ziploc bag. Place the whole wad in the bag afterwards and throw bag in the snow outside the tent. It will freeze solid. The next day when packing up dig a cathole and empty the contents of the bag into the ground. Put old ziploc in your trash bag. Voila, 7.6 lbs lighter.

I know, I know, I can hear the replies: "I'm just glad I don't camp with you." The mantra "when push comes to shove" has new meaning here.





It's true that the more time you spend in cold temps backpacking and camping, the better you can handle the cold. My recent December trip is proof of this. I was shocked after a long hot summer to get a couple first snowy nights at around 10F but I slowly came around to embracing Miss Nature's plans.

Therefore there's a sliding scale of what you can endure. After 3 or 4 days at 0F or -10F, a day at 10F seems balmy. Acclimation. When the forecast calls for 20F you know you have it made and that particular challenging cold snap is over . . . until the next one. Plus, sleeping out in the backyard every night between trips really helps too.

You just killed the resale value of your tent![emoji23]


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[Deadeye]

Hot chocolate warms the belly before bed, I always bring some on winter trips. The old nalgene full of hot water trick is also good. small nalgenes can heat up your boots in the morning, too.

[Dogwood]

That's ^ what I was thinking immediately.
Good book, headlamp and batteries, and definitely a good sleeping bag.
Balaclava and possible goggles if it's windy.
Have fun.
Wear some orange, it's hunting season (bear) in PA, don't know about NJ but their similar seasons I believe.Consider winter night hiking. Dont immediately assume you have to dive into camp. With rime and snow on the trees, crunching of snow underfoot, coming across a herd of deer or elk, while being temp comfortable wearing a headlamp out under a clear winter night sky has been one of the most memorable experiences. Think planetarium experience but more profound. Many sections of the AT this is possible. Never forget doing this across Roan Mt. No regrets passing up the Roan Mt cabin to reach the next AT lean to at 1 a.m. MAGICAL.

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[Venchka]

New Year’s Eve on top of Roan Mountain is absolutely on my Bucket List.
Wayne