Did you hike the AT early march in 03' or 10' weather?

[petedelisio]

Did you start or hike the AT southern section in early march in 03' and or 10'?
or know somebody that did?

Details on what were the weather conditions like in the mountains? Temps, Cold, Snow, Rain, amount of precipitation etc....?

What did you have to deal with?

[Slo-go'en]

Curious as to why you want to know what the weather was like 9 and 16 years ago?

[Miner]

Likely the weather was really bad and thus gives a good worst case. Just guessing.

Petdelisio, you might try looking at trail journals from those years and see what people were complaining about at the time. TrailJournals.com ought to have several from those years who hiked in March.

[Venchka]

Likely the weather was really bad and thus gives a good worst case. Just guessing.

Petdelisio, you might try looking at trail journals from those years and see what people were complaining about at the time. TrailJournals.com ought to have several from those years who hiked in March.
I provided links to March, 2010 Trail Journals in the other thread looking for the same information.
Wayne

[soilman]

I started on April 7, 2010 with a hiker from WI who had originally tried to start on March 7. He hiked to Springer and he said he slept on a slab of ice. He returned home to WI where he said it was warmer.

[petedelisio]

[QUOTE=Slo-go'en;2233498]Curious as to why you want to know what the weather was like 9 and 16 years ago?[/QUOTE
For meteorological science...

El Nino' and a good handful of other tell tale systems are lining up pretty much the same this 18'/19' season as the 02'/03' and 09'/10' winter seasons... I am attempting to gather these first hand memory/ journal reports before I attempt to gain any Ranger/park info.

European models are showing the same pretty much. They are slightly off this far into the season but it is looking like they may recover,; come in close to those past year conditions on top of the mountains for this year 19'... below average to much below average temps with plenty of storms, rain sleet ice and snow accumulation

We may pack for more cold and wet, snow and ice.

[petedelisio]

I provided links to March, 2010 Trail Journals in the other thread looking for the same information.
Wayne

Good stuff from you and Walker!!!
Thanks

[rmitchell]

Curious as to why you want to know what the weather was like 9 and 16 years ago?

May be like trying to predict stock market ups and downs by past trends.

As good a guess as any.

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.

[Sarcasm the elf]

2003 is regarded as possibly the most wet spring in the history of the A.T. There’s a great porcast episode in which Baltimore Jack discusses hiking during that infamous season, which I’ve linked below.

https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/pox-puss-podcast-appalachian-trail-thru-hiker-experience/id574638806?mt=2&i=1000157021289

[ldsailor]

El Nino' and a good handful of other tell tale systems are lining up pretty much the same this 18'/19' season as the 02'/03' and 09'/10' winter seasons... I am attempting to gather these first hand memory/ journal reports before I attempt to gain any Ranger/park info.

European models are showing the same pretty much. They are slightly off this far into the season but it is looking like they may recover,; come in close to those past year conditions on top of the mountains for this year 19'... below average to much below average temps with plenty of storms, rain sleet ice and snow accumulation

We may pack for more cold and wet, snow and ice.

This seems like a very interesting premise. If your theory holds true, everyone leaving Springer early in the year should be paying attention.

[Venchka]

Around Christmas I read an article online about a repeat “Polar Vortex” outbreak of cold air across the USA. Either it’s not happening or it’s late. The Bears Eagles game last night in Chicago was 50 F.
You never know until it happens.
Wayne

[Tipi Walter]

Around Christmas I read an article online about a repeat “Polar Vortex” outbreak of cold air across the USA. Either it’s not happening or it’s late. The Bears Eagles game last night in Chicago was 50 F.
You never know until it happens.
Wayne

I remember the Polar Vortex we had here in the Southeast during January 2014. I was on a 24 day backpacking trip and it hit me on the Benton MacKaye trail with -10F temps and snow---effectively pinning me in camp for 3 days until temps warmed up to 0F.

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I consider polar cold snaps to be major storms like rainstorms or blizzards or windstorms etc---and so I always try to find a place to make my stand---and this was my hunker squat station during the 2014 vortex on the Benton MacKaye trail.

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Looking up the MacKaye trail on a very cold morning.

[Tipi Walter]

Around Christmas I read an article online about a repeat “Polar Vortex” outbreak of cold air across the USA. Either it’s not happening or it’s late. The Bears Eagles game last night in Chicago was 50 F.
You never know until it happens.
Wayne

And we should never forget the so-called Arctic Outbreak of January 21, 1985. I was in Boone NC and we got -30F. Knoxville hit -24F. It could happen again.

[The Old Chief]

Here's what you are looking for. I can vouch for the accuracy of these journal entries in early March.


http://www.trailjournals.com/journal/entry/27376

[4eyedbuzzard]

If there's one constant regarding an AT thru-hike, and especially so the earlier one starts, it is wetter and colder than most anticipate.

[ScottTrip]

I left Springer on March 9th 2014 the weather was typical early spring with nice days of sun (40 to 50s) then several cold rainy days the nights were cold. Nothing that I did not expect being from the south myself. But that all changed about 2 weeks later in GSMNP. We had foot of snow all the way across the park with below freezing nights. Nice weather at Standing Bear for a day, then burtal cold temps into single digits, and snow for the next week into Hot Springs. On my hike it really didnot get into the constant nice weather until early April. You just have to be ready for bad weather and hope it is good.

[The Solemates]

It never ceases to amaze me how people act paralyzed when they are in the woods and cold weather, say -10 with a foot of snow and a few miles to walk, happens. People do this every week, in say bwca or talkeetna, just to get the mail.

[Slo-go'en]

It never ceases to amaze me how people act paralyzed when they are in the woods and cold weather, say -10 with a foot of snow and a few miles to walk, happens. People do this every week, in say bwca or talkeetna, just to get the mail.

Well, if your not prepared for it and not acclimatized to it, it is brutal. But if your going to be in the mountains of North Carolina in March, you best be prepared for it.

[Venchka]

People who are not familiar with altitude and it’s effects on temperatures and precipitation are caught unawares.
No matter how many times it’s said, somebody doesn’t get the message about how miserable it is when the temperature drops below 50, the breeze picks up and the atmosphere turns liquid.
Be dry. Be warm. Be safe.
Wayne

[4eyedbuzzard]

It never ceases to amaze me how people act paralyzed when they are in the woods and cold weather, say -10 with a foot of snow and a few miles to walk, happens. People do this every week, in say bwca or talkeetna, just to get the mail.AT thru-hikers simply aren't prepared for such extremes. It's a trade off between lighter and faster and total preparedness. People in Talkeetna going out for the mail aren't carrying their lives on their backs, plus they have local experience and knowledge. Typically hikers should be prepared for conditions roughly 20 degrees below the average lows at the elevations they are hiking - which are not the temps in the valley below. And if it's worse than that, be prepared to bail out. The problems usually arise when they prepare for average temps in Knoxville - and then learn the hard way about mountain weather.

[Tipi Walter]

It never ceases to amaze me how people act paralyzed when they are in the woods and cold weather, say -10 with a foot of snow and a few miles to walk, happens. People do this every week, in say bwca or talkeetna, just to get the mail.


AT thru-hikers simply aren't prepared for such extremes. It's a trade off between lighter and faster and total preparedness. People in Talkeetna going out for the mail aren't carrying their lives on their backs, plus they have local experience and knowledge. Typically hikers should be prepared for conditions roughly 20 degrees below the average lows at the elevations they are hiking - which are not the temps in the valley below. And if it's worse than that, be prepared to bail out. The problems usually arise when they prepare for average temps in Knoxville - and then learn the hard way about mountain weather.

Thru-hikers simply aren't prepared for such extremes---is true. I like to come back from a winter trip and check in with Trail Journals to see what AT backpackers did during the times I got hit by terrible weather. Invariably and almost to the man (or woman) they leave the trail and pull town zeros waiting for the cold weather to end. And yet in my opinion the best time to be out is during Miss Nature's best winter storms. Why pull zero town days when you can pull zero tent days and hunker in??? Dance with the Woman who brung ya . . . . as in Momma Nature.

[gpburdelljr]

Thru-hikers simply aren't prepared for such extremes---is true. I like to come back from a winter trip and check in with Trail Journals to see what AT backpackers did during the times I got hit by terrible weather. Invariably and almost to the man (or woman) they leave the trail and pull town zeros waiting for the cold weather to end. And yet in my opinion the best time to be out is during Miss Nature's best winter storms. Why pull zero town days when you can pull zero tent days and hunker in??? Dance with the Woman who brung ya . . . . as in Momma Nature.
I suspect most people think getting off the trail for the duration of extreme weather makes far more sense than carrying a 70 pound pack with the gear to stay out in extreme weather.

[Venchka]

The effects of elevation on temperature and precipitation makes parts of GSMNP and similar elevations along the TN-NC border resemble Maine and Quebec.
https://www.us-parks.com/great-smoky-mountains-national-park/plants-and-wildlife.html
Being prepared won’t require a 70 pound pack.
Wayne

[Tipi Walter]

I suspect most people think getting off the trail for the duration of extreme weather makes far more sense than carrying a 70 pound pack with the gear to stay out in extreme weather.

Yeah but I'm carrying around 50 lbs of just food and stove fuel. The subzero winter gear I carry does not approach a 70 lb load even with microspikes and snow shovel and down parka/pants etc.

[Hosh]

Yeah but I'm carrying around 50 lbs of just food and stove fuel. The subzero winter gear I carry does not approach a 70 lb load even with microspikes and snow shovel and down parka/pants etc.

Its really irrelevant, isn’t it. Thru hiking versus squat camping, zero days in a tent versus a hostel, half a jar of Skippy versus a cheese burger

[Tipi Walter]

Its really irrelevant, isn’t it. Thru hiking versus squat camping, zero days in a tent versus a hostel, half a jar of Skippy versus a cheese burger

It's not really irrelevant because we're talking in part about Winter Backpacking. And what exactly is squat camping? Basecamping is what you probably meant to write. Basecampers just hike in with a pack and sit put for the duration of their trip---something I never do. Unless weather stops me for a zero hunker (those in-town cold weather days for thruhikers)---I'm packing and moving every day. It's called Backpacking. Some pull 30 mile days, some pull 4 mile days---along as we're outdoors what difference could it make? AT thruhiker elitism I suppose rears its ugly head.

I read one recent AT thruhike journal and they were pulling on average 5 mile days. So Hosh, in your opinion---are they're irrelevant and don't deserve to share their experiences? Are they merely Squat Campers??

Petedelisio started the thread with this:

Did you start or hike the AT southern section in early march in 03' and or 10'?
or know somebody that did?
Details on what were the weather conditions like in the mountains? Temps, Cold, Snow, Rain, amount of precipitation etc....?
What did you have to deal with?

No mention of thruhiking. And I was out extensively in March of 2010---shared my pics on another thread. So what was it like in the Southern Apps adjacent to the AT?? See my trip report here---

https://tipiwalter.smugmug.com/Backpacking2010/Five-Miles-of-Living-Hell-on/


And what about his question of the weather conditions in the mountains---cold, snow, rain etc??? I have a crapload of experience in such conditions---and not as a basecamper---unless you count my Tipi years.

[Slo-go'en]

I predict it will cold and wet with at least one significant snow event in the southern Appalachians in March this year. Can't go too far wrong with that forecast, since that's the way it always is :) The only thing which changes is the exact timing of events.

[Tipi Walter]

I predict it will cold and wet with at least one significant snow event in the southern Appalachians in March this year. Can't go too far wrong with that forecast, since that's the way it always is :) The only thing which changes is the exact timing of events.

I remember a couple years ago we got the hottest March on record in the Southeast mountains. It was so bad I remember I needed my bug headnet but didn't bring it. I think it was 2016. And then of course we got the big Blizzard of 1993 around March 12. It killed 318 people in the Eastern US. I remember it of course.

I currently backpack with several people who were out backpacking during that storm and had to get helicopter rescued. My friend Hoppin John was in the Smokies and couldn't get out for 5 days until a Black Hawk came for him.

My friends from the Cranbrook school in Michigan got walloped by the storm and had to get helo extracted along Tellico River and out of the Citico Creek wilderness.

These pics are from this source---

https://www.knoxnews.com/story/weather/2017/03/10/remembering-knoxville-blizzard-93/99010718/

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A helicopter flying over Tellico River in TN to pull out backpackers.

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Cranbrook students waiting for extraction. They were pulling a 10 day wilderness trip. This March 2019 marks their 50th Anniversary trip.

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A Cranbrook trip leader coming out of the Citico. That's big ice clumps around his feet.

[Tipi Walter]

See this for video of the TN mountains---

https://www.wbir.com/article/weather/remembering-the-blizzard-of-93-in-stories-photos/51-520726952