View Full Version : Personal locater beacon
Thoughts on which personal locater beacon to use?
Shutterbug
05-25-2019, 11:21
Thoughts on which personal locater beacon to use? Technically, it isn't a "beacon" but I prefer the Garmin InReach.
If your sole issue is getting rescued in an emergency, a true personal locator beacon is best. I carried one when I was a USAF pilot.
I carried a SPOT for many years. I only needed it once and in that situation, the signal failed to get out. That was several years ago and I assume they have improved.
After that, I switched to the InReach. It has two way communication. It permits me to stay in touch with my family when I am out of cell phone range. It does have an emergency feature. What I like about that is it allows the user to tell the emergency responders exactly what the problem is. A PLB only lets the responders know there is an emergency.
ldsailor
05-25-2019, 11:28
Spot and InReach are the popular ones. Rather than go into detail, check out their web sites. The units are not all that expensive, but it's the yearly fee they charge that gets you. I have a Spot, which I used for long distance sailboat deliveries and hiking. It worked great, but I discontinued the service after my AT LASH last year. Spot came back with an unbelievable deal to renew for $50 just a couple of weeks ago, so they must be feeling competition or a lot of service cancellations or both.
After that, I switched to the InReach. It has two way communication. It permits me to stay in touch with my family when I am out of cell phone range. It does have an emergency feature. What I like about that is it allows the user to tell the emergency responders exactly what the problem is. A PLB only lets the responders know there is an emergency.
I debated for quite some time, and those^^^ are the reasons I bought an inReach Mini.
I haven't actually used it, yet, or even decided on a subscription plan. Really bought it for trips out West, but will probably activate and test it soon. A friend has the fullsize, and his wife has the Mini, and they're happy with them. Recently had to remind him to remove my parents from his list of contacts or whatever. They'd been getting notifications from him since we did a trip together last fall. They LOVE getting those confirmations with location details.
My wife and I like our in-reach mini. 4 oz. With the included carabiner and all the extraneous functions are accessible through your phone via bluetooth.
However if you're doing some off trail stuff having a display for topo maps is invaluable so you might want the normal in reach if that's the case.
steady123
05-25-2019, 12:22
I have had both. spot 2 and Inreach SE. I have set up the Inreach to include my inreach email on the distribution list. That way i have a feed back loop to know if the signal got through.
clay pot
05-25-2019, 12:38
InReach Mini / have others / carry battery pack / iphone SE (which stays off until I am positive I am lost and clueless) / and hiking solo at 79 by family requires it. The funny part is that you can't get the splend extra insurance if you are over 70. All insurance companies are betting against me now. I understand it is not personal. Just business.
Technically, it isn't a "beacon" but I prefer the Garmin InReach.
If your sole issue is getting rescued in an emergency, a true personal locator beacon is best. I carried one when I was a USAF pilot.
I carried a SPOT for many years. I only needed it once and in that situation, the signal failed to get out. That was several years ago and I assume they have improved.
After that, I switched to the InReach. It has two way communication. It permits me to stay in touch with my family when I am out of cell phone range. It does have an emergency feature. What I like about that is it allows the user to tell the emergency responders exactly what the problem is. A PLB only lets the responders know there is an emergency.
I like the inReach because of the two way capabilities, too, not only for the ability to clarify an emergency situation, but for more mundane issues as well, such as changing a pickup time or place.
What did you fly, Shutterbug?
BlackCloud
05-25-2019, 13:02
I got into the game early so I have the fairly large, fairly weighty and very expensive ACR Electronics PLB. It appears to be fairly indestructible as well. They now make a version that is half the weight, size and price.
peakbagger
05-25-2019, 13:58
To answer the OPs post I have the Fast Find 220. Its about as small as they get. Its getting on in years. Its has some limited capacity for self testing the battery and GPS function until the battery goes below a set level of charge.
I expect the inreach and spot devices are going to be changing radical with the launch of the new low earth orbit internet satellites.
MuddyWaters
05-25-2019, 15:14
A plb is a plb.
A spot or in reach is something else
If you use a devices battery routinely, like in sattelite communicators, you remove a level of protection. If having it encourages you to take risks you otherwise wouldnt......your approach is fundamentally flawed. It is a last ditch chance for survival....not something to be depended on or a replacement for good judgement, planning, skill.
45210
I got one of dese. It goes with me remote places. Not AT.
A plb is a plb.
A spot or in reach is something else
If you use a devices battery routinely, like in sattelite communicators, you remove a level of protection. If having it encourages you to take risks you otherwise wouldnt......your approach is fundamentally flawed. It is a last ditch chance for survival....not something to be depended on or a replacement for good judgement, planning, skill.
45210
I got one of dese. It goes with me remote places. Not AT.
I love white blaze... didn't know about this plb. It weighs 1.4 ounces less than my ACR rescue link, which is about to require a service/ battery. Might consider a change!
Puddlefish
05-25-2019, 16:54
The one person I talked to in real life got annoyed with her Spot, back in 2016. She was using it so that her elderly'ish parents could track her hike. They got panicky a few times when it lost coverage, she said she'd have been better off having an adult conversation with her parents.
I've carried a PLB when coastal sailing, registered properly, for when the ship is sinking, and you want the coast guard alerted and a massive expensive rescue to begin.
http://www.bushwalking101.org/how-a-plb-works/
MuddyWaters
05-25-2019, 17:50
The one person I talked to in real life got annoyed with her Spot, back in 2016. She was using it so that her elderly'ish parents could track her hike. They got panicky a few times when it lost coverage, she said she'd have been better off having an adult conversation with her parents.
I've carried a PLB when coastal sailing, registered properly, for when the ship is sinking, and you want the coast guard alerted and a massive expensive rescue to begin.
http://www.bushwalking101.org/how-a-plb-works/
I crewed for an ultrarunner attempt at a fkt in 2014.
Spot didnt work, or gave impossible locations we had no idea where she was, if she had quit, etc, when late reaching resupply stations.
Shutterbug
05-25-2019, 19:41
What did you fly, Shutterbug?
I flew CH-3 helicopters in Vietnam. They were called the "Jolly Green Giant" when they were used for rescue. My missions were to catch recon drones in the air after they returned from North Vietnam. If you are interested, you can read about us here -- https://medium.com/war-is-boring/nsa-spies-helped-save-drones-from-a-fiery-death-over-vietnam-80fbf986e02d
Technically, it isn't a "beacon" but I prefer the Garmin InReach.
If your sole issue is getting rescued in an emergency, a true personal locator beacon is best. I carried one when I was a USAF pilot.
I carried a SPOT for many years. I only needed it once and in that situation, the signal failed to get out. That was several years ago and I assume they have improved.
After that, I switched to the InReach. It has two way communication. It permits me to stay in touch with my family when I am out of cell phone range. It does have an emergency feature. What I like about that is it allows the user to tell the emergency responders exactly what the problem is. A PLB only lets the responders know there is an emergency.
There it is!
Thank you for your service.
Wayne
peakbagger
05-26-2019, 06:55
Note that even PLBs are not guarantees of rescue. There was high profile hiker death in the whites a few years ago where the PLB sent out confusing signals. This occurred in conditions that were well outside normal hiking conditions. https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2015-trader-in-the-wild
Many of the small PLBs have a roll out antenna and recommendations on how the unit has to be oriented to maximize the signal quality. The batteries on PLBs are optimized for long life and extreme conditions, spots and in reaches are not. There have been several high profile FKTs attempts that have had signal gaps and battery issues where the spots and inreach devices either lost coverage or ran out of batteries. In one case in the whites there was a individual participating in a event where he had carry all his gear on his back with no resupply that had issues with his record as he had to stash and drop off batteries along the route.
The units that communicate are improving, many use the Iridium low earth satellite network and that network is being substantially improved. If you have money to burn on monthly and yearly subscriptions they may be the right thing to use. The business model is sell the gear at cost or below cost and make the money on the subscriptions. Definitely do a lot to research on battery rating if you are considering using it in winter conditions.
The other thing to keep in mind is the First Net rollout of rural cell towers is going to improve cell coverage nationwide. If you just want to check in with the family, there is coverage on the currently ridgelines on 90% of the AT. https://firstnet.gov/
BTW, Something many folks dont realize is that if you need to get a message out, use text over voice.
kolokolo
05-26-2019, 09:50
I had two different Spot models over the years, and they reliably sent my position and preset message on a number of hikes. I never activated them for an emergency.
But, due to the absurd cost of the annual service contract, I started last year just renting an InReach during my hike. For my recent one week section, it cost about $100 total, less than half what the Spot service contract would have been. And I always get the latest model in good working condition. For an occasional hiker like me, this is a good option. If you hike for multiple weeks at a time or do a lot of hikes at different times of year then it may not work for you.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
4eyedbuzzard
05-26-2019, 11:20
...BTW, Something many folks dont realize is that if you need to get a message out, use text over voice.
While it's true that many times a text will go through clearly when voice transmission is garbled or no connection can be made - in an emergency, I would use/try both. Text/SMS has lower network priority than voice. Unless I received a text reply back from the recipient (not just a network sent/delivered on the sending device), there's no way of really knowing that the other party received it. I've had both incoming and outgoing text messages delayed by many hours at times and even "lost" a few outright. Unless you have established actual two-way communication, you just don't know.
Feral Bill
05-26-2019, 12:09
Throughout my rather long hiking career, I never would have considered such a thing. As I get older, and continue to hike alone in places with few people and no cell service, I have n
become interested. Still pondering the issue.
What is firstnet?... the online info is pretty hard to get a handle on.
gpburdelljr
05-26-2019, 16:11
What is firstnet?... the online info is pretty hard to get a handle on.
They are working on a communication network for first responders to a disaster (firefighters, police, etc.). They don’t provide emergency communication for the general public.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Responder_Network_Authority
peakbagger
05-26-2019, 18:46
The trick with First Net is the government pays ATT to put the in the tower sites and infrastructure in support First Net. Its a lot easier to piggy back other standard cell tower capabilities on the back of the First Net install. I have not kept up with the final tech standards but my understanding from a few years ago is the ATT could just take a existing cell site and prioritize access to First Net enabled equipment.If there is no First Net traffic its a normal cell site but if there is the site recognizes a First Net device it give its priority.
There are a lot of big brother issues with First Net as in the case of a emergency, the network can flip a switch and shut down the standard networks and only let First Net registered phones use the bandwidth. It may start out as first responders but there is pretty clear speculation that politicians and "important" people will get access so the government will paying for a two tier cellular network. Pretty much standard SOP in third world countries these days is if there are political protests, the first thing the government does is shut down the cellular networks to keep the population from figuring out what is going on. I have no doubt that if Tesla or Amazon get low earth orbit satellite internet up and running there will a couple of government black boxes in the system so if the US or other governments want to they can shut down of limit access to the network. Once those LEO satellite networks get running I expect the spot type devices will jump over to that system and the accuracy and availability will increase substantially.
I flew CH-3 helicopters in Vietnam. They were called the "Jolly Green Giant" when they were used for rescue. My missions were to catch recon drones in the air after they returned from North Vietnam. If you are interested, you can read about us here -- https://medium.com/war-is-boring/nsa-spies-helped-save-drones-from-a-fiery-death-over-vietnam-80fbf986e02d
Shutterbug,
I'm very interested in that. I can't believe I'd never heard of that operation before. Have you ever thought of writing a memoir book about your experiences?
Or has anyone in your unit written one?
I'ma private pilot, incactive but still very much interested...and a huge aviation nerd. Just about the only thing I read is military memoirs and biographies. I was never a reader through school or as a young adult..the only thing I'd ever read was required stuff for school, or text books about things of interest...when I was learning to fly, scuba diving when I got into that, etc... Strictly non-fiction. Never novels or fiction...just have never been able to get into it.
Then I went to Oshkosh one year for Airventure. One of the presentations I saw was Chuck Yeager and his friend Bud Anderson. It was just a couple regular guys up there not trying to impress anyone really...just sharing stories and answering questions about there time fighting the nazis in their P-51's, and then after doing all the test pilot stuff. Well, those stories were better than any Tom Clancy movie...PLUS they really happened to these guys. Right away I went and bought Chuck Yeager's book, then Bud Anderson's...then I read every WW2 aviation memoir I could find....when I couldn't find more I branched off into other things...submarine guys, korea, viet nam, desert storm, etc....
Anyway, my point is that I have huge respect for what you did, and what your buddies did...and I'm very interested in learning all I can. I think a lot of people like reading that kind of thing. Even the folks that think what they did wasn't anything special have written very interesting stories.
Shutterbug
05-27-2019, 22:27
Throughout my rather long hiking career, I never would have considered such a thing. As I get older, and continue to hike alone in places with few people and no cell service, I have n
become interested. Still pondering the issue.
A few years ago, I was hiking the Wonderland Trail. I was on the steep slope between Mowich River and the Golden Lakes. The edge of the trail gave way and I fell over the edge. On the way down, my head came within inches of hitting a limb on a tree. Fortunately some bushes broke my fall and I was not seriously injured. But as I was lying there in the bushes, I realized that if I had hit my head it would have been unlikely that anyone would find me. That was when I decided to carry a SPOT and keep it in the tracking mode. That way, if I fell off an edge somewhere the searchers would know my position. My wife doesn't actually track my hikes, but she knows how to check the track if I fail to return from a hike.
Shutterbug
05-27-2019, 22:33
Shutterbug,
I'm very interested in that. I can't believe I'd never heard of that operation before. Have you ever thought of writing a memoir book about your experiences?
Or has anyone in your unit written one?
I'ma private pilot, incactive but still very much interested...and a huge aviation nerd. Just about the only thing I read is military memoirs and biographies. I was never a reader through school or as a young adult..the only thing I'd ever read was required stuff for school, or text books about things of interest...when I was learning to fly, scuba diving when I got into that, etc... Strictly non-fiction. Never novels or fiction...just have never been able to get into it.
Then I went to Oshkosh one year for Airventure. One of the presentations I saw was Chuck Yeager and his friend Bud Anderson. It was just a couple regular guys up there not trying to impress anyone really...just sharing stories and answering questions about there time fighting the nazis in their P-51's, and then after doing all the test pilot stuff. Well, those stories were better than any Tom Clancy movie...PLUS they really happened to these guys. Right away I went and bought Chuck Yeager's book, then Bud Anderson's...then I read every WW2 aviation memoir I could find....when I couldn't find more I branched off into other things...submarine guys, korea, viet nam, desert storm, etc....
Anyway, my point is that I have huge respect for what you did, and what your buddies did...and I'm very interested in learning all I can. I think a lot of people like reading that kind of thing. Even the folks that think what they did wasn't anything special have written very interesting stories.
I have written an account of what my unit did. It will soon be printed in the Magazine for the Vietnam Helicopter Pilot's Association. Once it is printed, I will be glad to share a link. It isn't a surprise that you have never heard of it. The missions involving drones were all Top Secret during the war. Only those actually involved were authorized to know about our missions.