View Full Version : BV-500 or BV-450: Which One?
Utah Hikes
08-16-2019, 22:46
I'm leaning toward using one of these two bear canisters for my 2020 thru-hike, for ease of use (no bag-hanging hassles) and for doing my part in potentially keeping a few bears safe.
So... looking for feedback from "experienced canister users" on what size canister to choose.
Initially thinking to base my choice on needing to store an "average" 4-day food supply, plus toiletries/scented items. But should cook pot, stove, fuel also go in the canister? Thinking "yes", and with that, also thinking the larger BV-500 is the way to go, especially since the 500 is but 6 ounces or so heavier than the 450. Or is the 500 overkill?
What say you, bear canister veterans?
The Cleaner
08-17-2019, 00:00
No and you can use it for a seat or table too.45527
HooKooDooKu
08-17-2019, 00:25
IMHO: The jump to a bear canister imposes such a large weight penality that unless the extra room is just NEVER going to be needed, it seems like a small weight penality to go with a larger size.
Other wise, there is no need to put your cooking pot, fuel, and stove in the bear cannister. The bear isn't going to try to eat these, aftwr all, they should be washed of food odors, and there will be food odors on everything else as well to some degree.
I just purchased the 500 for a couple hikes in Colorado. I've no experience with it yet but nice to know I pack 7 days or more in there if I want. I will also be taking it on my section hikes of the AT. I'm tired of trying to find a decent hang at the end of the day. I just boil water so my cook kit will not go in there.
I use both sizes, though the larger one is usually for cacheing food. Depends in part on the size of your pack, but I'm happy using the smaller canister for 3-5 day trips/sections - it carries what I need, and fits easily. Otherwise, I agree with HKDK - the extra size doesn't come with much of a weight penalty, if you have the room to carry it.
Tipi Walter
08-17-2019, 10:27
If I had it to do over again I'd go with a Wild Ideas Bearikade and forego the BearVault experience. After you open and close the BearVault a thousand times a month you'll see why. The BV lid tends to bind and sometimes unscrewing the BV lid past the locking notches is a real hassle most esp when very cold.
But I will say that my two BV-500s withstood the gnawing of a hungry bear---see pic---
45528
https://www.wild-ideas.net/
colorado_rob
08-17-2019, 10:27
If you don't mind spending (quite!) a bit more, like around 3 bills, consider the wild ideas berikade series.... significant weight savings, the equivalent model in volume to the BV500 is about 10 ounces less, PLUS a big bonus is that it is easier to open, plus the lid seals with a gasket, meaning more odor and waterproof than the bear vaults.
Another bonus is that you can dial the exact size you want in increments of 1" in length. We wound up buying the Weekender, $288, 31 ounces, 650 cubic inches, perfect size for myself for 7+ days, or with my wife for 4+ days (assuming you carry your first day's food NOT in the canister, because you'll eat it before retiring).
From your trail name, looks like you might like hiking in Utah, where bears aren't much of a problem, but rodents are, which makes carrying a canister nice. Same deal for Grand Canyon hiking.
So, yeah, steep $300 investment, but if you plan on hiking a lot out west longer-term, so many places now require canisters, like parts of the PCT (and JMT, make that a must-do!) and lots of areas in Colorado.
If you're a relative rookie hiker and not sure if long distance is your thing, go cheap with the BV500, as said, not much heavier than the 450. If you know you'll want to do a lot of other long distance hiking, consider the $300 investment.
HooKooDooKu
08-17-2019, 11:59
I used the Bearikade for the JMT and LOVED it.
Opening it was such a breeze. It sat in the top of my pack (lid up) so that I was able to get lunch and snacks out without removing it from my pack.
Two Tents
08-17-2019, 13:47
I have a tall one I'd sell ya! I don't know what a fair price would be be as the shipping would kill the profit. Anybody give an idea of a fair, for me and fair for the buyer, idea?
Berserker
08-17-2019, 14:16
If I had it to do over again I'd go with a Wild Ideas Bearikade and forego the BearVault experience
If you don't mind spending (quite!) a bit more, like around 3 bills, consider the wild ideas berikade series.... significant weight savings, the equivalent model in volume to the BV500 is about 10 ounces less, PLUS a big bonus is that it is easier to open, plus the lid seals with a gasket, meaning more odor and waterproof than the bear vaults.
If you're a relative rookie hiker and not sure if long distance is your thing, go cheap with the BV500, as said, not much heavier than the 450. If you know you'll want to do a lot of other long distance hiking, consider the $300 investment.
I used the Bearikade for the JMT and LOVED it.
Opening it was such a breeze. It sat in the top of my pack (lid up) so that I was able to get lunch and snacks out without removing it from my pack.
I agree with all the above. I have been using a Bearikade Weekender for about 7 years now. I originally bought it for my JMT hike in 2013 where I used it on the AT some before that hike to get used to it. Then after I finished the JMT I started randomly using it on the AT up until a few years back when the bear activity started increasing, and then I started using it on every trip. Got sick of hanging and never could get comfortable sleeping with the food in the tent.
I thought I'd go ahead and add on a few data points since the three posts above covered the high level stuff in regards to the Bearikade. After some use the lid does not fit perfectly on the can and you may get a tiny bit of water leakage into the can if you leave it out in a heavy rain sitting right side up. I remedy this by setting it upside down on a few sticks. That way water doesn't pool underneath it, and just drains off.
Also, the Weekender fits horizontally into the top of a Z-packs Arc Haul, which is really nice for access and storage. So if you use this pack you can pack all your stuff and basically slap it on top. Z-packs does sell a "V" strap in order to strap it on the top outside of the pack, so I thought it worth mentioning that it does actually fit inside.
One other thing of note is that I have personally been able to fit 6 days of food in mine. It totally depends on what type of food is packed. If you pack a bunch of Mountain House meals and things like that then less will fit in there. Compact and/or repackaged stuff is the way to go with the can.
The other points have already been covered, but I will echo that it's light (for a bear can), and makes a great chair. So $300 is steep at first, but if you are going to actually use it a lot, then it's a no brainer in my opinion.
Utah Hikes
08-17-2019, 14:50
If you don't mind spending (quite!) a bit more, like around 3 bills, consider the wild ideas berikade series.... significant weight savings, the equivalent model in volume to the BV500 is about 10 ounces less, PLUS a big bonus is that it is easier to open, plus the lid seals with a gasket, meaning more odor and waterproof than the bear vaults.
Another bonus is that you can dial the exact size you want in increments of 1" in length. We wound up buying the Weekender, $288, 31 ounces, 650 cubic inches, perfect size for myself for 7+ days, or with my wife for 4+ days (assuming you carry your first day's food NOT in the canister, because you'll eat it before retiring).
From your trail name, looks like you might like hiking in Utah, where bears aren't much of a problem, but rodents are, which makes carrying a canister nice. Same deal for Grand Canyon hiking.
So, yeah, steep $300 investment, but if you plan on hiking a lot out west longer-term, so many places now require canisters, like parts of the PCT (and JMT, make that a must-do!) and lots of areas in Colorado.
If you're a relative rookie hiker and not sure if long distance is your thing, go cheap with the BV500, as said, not much heavier than the 450. If you know you'll want to do a lot of other long distance hiking, consider the $300 investment.
All this feedback is much appreciated. Thanks to all.
CO Rob, I'm based in Boone, NC. "Utah" is a trail name that was bestowed upon me a couple decades ago and has nothing to do with the state of UT, rather it was an abbreviation for "Uncle Tony." Thanks to my lovely nieces.
With attractive price points and functionality, the BV-500 seems like the right choice for my AT thru-hike. I'll likely keep my 700ml cook pot, fuel, and stove in it, as well as toiletries qt-bag, since 4 days of food won't fill it up.
All that said, this piece of gear will be my last purchase, but will look to pick one up for using on a few fall over-nighters in western NC/eastern TN.
HooKooDooKu
08-17-2019, 15:21
I had used the Bearikade Expedition with almost 1,000 cu-in of space. It took a lot of planning in minimizing volume, but I was able to get 9 to 10 days of food @ 3,000 calories per day.
I'm leaning toward using one of these two bear canisters for my 2020 thru-hike, for ease of use (no bag-hanging hassles) and for doing my part in potentially keeping a few bears safe.
So... looking for feedback from "experienced canister users" on what size canister to choose.
Initially thinking to base my choice on needing to store an "average" 4-day food supply, plus toiletries/scented items. But should cook pot, stove, fuel also go in the canister? Thinking "yes", and with that, also thinking the larger BV-500 is the way to go, especially since the 500 is but 6 ounces or so heavier than the 450. Or is the 500 overkill?
What say you, bear canister veterans?
I do not put my pot, stove, or fuel in my bareboxer, which holds about 4 days of food. I FBC, though, so no food smells int he pot. As mentioned, the bearikade would be the one to have if you can spare the cash.
TwistedCF
08-17-2019, 16:06
I can easily carry five days of food and my cook pot/stove/fuel in the BV500. I have seen a lot of people strapping the BV500 on top of their packs. The variables are limitless but with my particular load out I can carry the BV500 inside my 65 liter pack along with all my three season gear, i.e. shelter, sleep system, clothes, poop kit, etc. If you're just looking at the difference between the BV500 and the BV450 my advice would be to go with the 500. Not much heavier and a third more space for snacks.
Easy to open with a hotel card or credit card
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QyEbLfL_lSU
If I had it to do over again I'd go with a Wild Ideas Bearikade and forego the BearVault experience. After you open and close the BearVault a thousand times a month you'll see why. The BV lid tends to bind and sometimes unscrewing the BV lid past the locking notches is a real hassle most esp when very cold.
But I will say that my two BV-500s withstood the gnawing of a hungry bear---see pic---
45528
https://www.wild-ideas.net/
As long as your trips are I'd thought you'd need like 4 of them . Did you see the bear doing this?
Elaikases
08-17-2019, 19:33
IMHO: The jump to a bear canister imposes such a large weight penality that unless the extra room is just NEVER going to be needed, it seems like a small weight penality to go with a larger size.
Other wise, there is no need to put your cooking pot, fuel, and stove in the bear canister. The bear isn't going to try to eat these, after all, they should be washed of food odors, and there will be food odors on everything else as well to some degree.
Well, the pot may not get clean enough, but otherwise this is nicely said. And there is real time savings with a canister. I can't believe this is happening, but when we go back out, we are taking one.
I use the BV500 and have a 450 that I plan to use for a shorter trip series. Weight difference between the two is 8 ounces. I had planned to eventually go to a Bearikade model but after reading multiple mentions of the lid abrading DCF packs, I decided to save the cash and stick with my bearvaults.
Utah Hikes
08-18-2019, 13:35
I can easily carry five days of food and my cook pot/stove/fuel in the BV500. I have seen a lot of people strapping the BV500 on top of their packs. The variables are limitless but with my particular load out I can carry the BV500 inside my 65 liter pack along with all my three season gear, i.e. shelter, sleep system, clothes, poop kit, etc. If you're just looking at the difference between the BV500 and the BV450 my advice would be to go with the 500. Not much heavier and a third more space for snacks.
Twisted, Curious to know what brand-model 65L pack you use and whether you orient your BV vertically or horizontally, and is it just above your sleeping bag/quilt/spares clothes? I'm currently using a GG Crown 2. I'm thinking it will allow the BV to be packed horizontally. But that's TBD.
Tipi Walter
08-18-2019, 13:51
As long as your trips are I'd thought you'd need like 4 of them . Did you see the bear doing this?
I would need 4 BearVaults if I had to package a trip's food load in them but thankfully every place I go backpacking does not require canisters.
When my two BVs got "attacked" they were being used a food caches during a long-ago trip and I wasn't around for the festivities. The bear did manage to roll each canister several hundred feet down a hillside so it took a while to find them.
TwistedCF
08-18-2019, 16:09
Twisted, Curious to know what brand-model 65L pack you use and whether you orient your BV vertically or horizontally, and is it just above your sleeping bag/quilt/spares clothes? I'm currently using a GG Crown 2. I'm thinking it will allow the BV to be packed horizontally. But that's TBD.
Very inexpensive pack, it's The North Face Terra 65 litter. The pack is a little heavy compared to some of the pack choices but it suits my needs. Sleeping bag goes in the bottom compartment, then the tent goes in the main compartment oriented horizontally and my sleeping bag liner gets stuffed in between the tent and back of the pack. This creates a flat floor in the bottom of the main compartment and the BV 500 goes in vertically. This leaves two long cylinders of space down each side of the canister. Inflatable sleep pad on one side, stuff sack of clothes on the other. Rain gear in the top/lid compartment. I haven't done a long/thru hike yet but I've done some two night trips close to home to shake down for my 2020 AT thru and so far I'm happy with this set up. I have to take the bear canister out to get to my tent but it makes a nice table/chair while I'm setting up camp.
HooKooDooKu
08-19-2019, 00:42
Twisted, Curious to know what brand-model 65L pack you use and whether you orient your BV vertically or horizontally, and is it just above your sleeping bag/quilt/spares clothes? I'm currently using a GG Crown 2. I'm thinking it will allow the BV to be packed horizontally. But that's TBD.
When I did the JMT, I got an Osprey Volt 75, placed my sleeping bag and cloths in the bottom, the bear canister standing up, and everything else fit around the bear canister.
Utah Hikes
09-20-2019, 01:04
Completed my second trial hike with full kit including that BV500 w/3 days food, as well as a toiletries bag and cook pot w/stove and fuel. First hike was a section of the MST in NC. For that, I fastened the BV atop my pack (GG Crown 2) under the brain, which secured it fine. Carried a bit top heavy, though. It was bearable, no pun intended.
Today I completed the second trial hike, a shorter route, this time on the AT, an out-and-back from Carvers Gap NOBO over Round Bald, Jane Bald, to Grassy Ridge. Same full-kit w/3-day food load (30 lbs). But this second time I managed to fit the BV horizontally inside the pack, just above my quilt and clothes dry sack, with my tent and sleep pad above the BV. Tight as a tick, but much better result, with that BV in a lower spot. Carried very nicely.
stephanD
09-20-2019, 08:33
I have the BV 450. I really wanted to like it, but I can't. (A) I have knee problems, and i cannot afford the extra weight. (B) it feels awkward in my pack, no matter how I place it. (C) there's no guarantee it will be where you placed it when you come to retrieve it in the morning. I decided to go with the Almighty Ursack instead. Personally, I'm more concerned about mice and other critters than bears. My advice to you is see if you can rent instead of buying. There's actually a thread now running about this issue of renting gear vs buying.
chknfngrs
09-20-2019, 09:11
I bought a 450 and used it along the section of the JMT this summer. Was able to fit 5 days of food and my toiletries. Of course it was bursting at the seams with nutrition. I will never bear hang a food bag again knowing how easy the BV is. The main benefit of the 500 is of course space, and it’s not that much heavier than the 450. I’ve never needed one but glad the 450 worked. It’ll do well for shorter weekend hikes with my kids, too!
Utah Hikes
09-20-2019, 15:41
I have the BV 450. I really wanted to like it, but I can't. (A) I have knee problems, and i cannot afford the extra weight. (B) it feels awkward in my pack, no matter how I place it. (C) there's no guarantee it will be where you placed it when you come to retrieve it in the morning. I decided to go with the Almighty Ursack instead. Personally, I'm more concerned about mice and other critters than bears. My advice to you is see if you can rent instead of buying. There's actually a thread now running about this issue of renting gear vs buying.
I already own the BV500. Was just posting a follow up per my OP re: which size can to choose, with the completion of my first two trial hikes, using the can in different positions.
I did consider the Ursack Allmitey but decided against it, for the fact it can be chomped and slobbered and, yes, hauled off. And it was not "approved" for certain environs.
I get the pros and cons of the canister vs bags. Still, the ATC is urging hikers to adopt the canister, with the increase in bear-human interactions and with the fact that bears are adapting and figuring out how to get at hanging bags. With that, cans do help protect bears.
I'm ok with the weight of the 500, especially since I won't have to mess with bag hangs and retrieval, and in not so ideal weather or lighting.
I just wish GG was more thoughtful in its design, so as to allow a can to be carried internally and horizontally. In the case of the Crown 2, just one-inch more width would have made for perfection. As is, it's a seam-stretcher.
One Half
09-20-2019, 18:16
Since you are attempting the AT, why are you using a bear canister at all?
Utah Hikes
09-20-2019, 19:39
Since you are attempting the AT, why are you using a bear canister at all?
Because... there are many black bears on the AT.
Seriously, I think you can piece it together by reading the earlier posts. But, in short, a can very effectively protects the contents from bears and little critters. A can is easy to manage; wedge it 100 ft from tent. No hanging challenges. The weight penalty, for me, is acceptable. And it helps prevent bears from getting hiker food and scented products, and so helps protect them from having to be relocated or destroyed. The ATC approves.
Drifting a bit, but I have both sizes, and really would like a BV475!
Utah Hikes
10-28-2019, 20:56
So far, so good with the BV-500, with three shakedown hikes completed. Also looks like my timing was right. These BVs could be in great demand, very soon.
Drifting a bit, but I have both sizes, and really would like a BV475!
Wild Ideas (https://www.wild-ideas.net/custom-bearikades/) will make any length bear canister one likes. Of course one pays for this. My feeling is, if it's something I will use and/or makes me happy, then the premium price is worth it to me. Everyone makes their own decision on that.
HooKooDooKu
10-29-2019, 11:23
Since you are attempting the AT, why are you using a bear canister at all?
While bear canisters are generally not "required" on the AT, they still have lots of benefits:
1. Saves time compared to trying to hang your food.
2. Keeps you from considering the questionable (and in some places, illegal) practice of sleeping with your food.
3. Protects your food from not only bears but also mice
(in GSMNP, each campsite has bear cables to protect your food from bears, but mice can climb the cables, and flying squires can... well... fly to it and nibble thru stuff sacks).
Thank you for the video! I nominate you for "Post of the Year"!
Hikingjim
10-30-2019, 10:19
Completed my second trial hike with full kit including that BV500 w/3 days food, as well as a toiletries bag and cook pot w/stove and fuel. First hike was a section of the MST in NC. For that, I fastened the BV atop my pack (GG Crown 2) under the brain, which secured it fine. Carried a bit top heavy, though. It was bearable, no pun intended.
Today I completed the second trial hike, a shorter route, this time on the AT, an out-and-back from Carvers Gap NOBO over Round Bald, Jane Bald, to Grassy Ridge. Same full-kit w/3-day food load (30 lbs). But this second time I managed to fit the BV horizontally inside the pack, just above my quilt and clothes dry sack, with my tent and sleep pad above the BV. Tight as a tick, but much better result, with that BV in a lower spot. Carried very nicely.
Good stuff. I applaud you for taking the rising bear concerns seriously and hauling a couple extra lbs. On hikes and canoe trips near where I live, almost everyone hangs properly, and it is no doubt a hassle but necessary. The first time I did a hike on the AT a decade ago I couldn't believe that everyone was just putting their stuff on a hook in the shelter or hanging ridiculously, such as 7 ft off the ground. I just went along with that at the time.... since 8 food bags in a shelter will probably be similar to 9!
Have witnessed personally several incidents on the AT, and it's not just one or two areas. Bunch of people in my shelter in VA lost all their food with a "pretty good" bear hang (problem bear, caused lambert meadows to be temp. closed the next day). They added a bear box.
Have had many other bear encounters (along with bear calls in the night) in areas where people's stuff is just not bear-proof.