View Full Version : Ergonomic Hiking and Foot Placement
Storyguy
11-02-2019, 15:52
I have followed with great interest threads that provide advice to "older" hikers. Several posters have said that older hikers would be well served by learning about ergonomic hiking and foot placement. Can anyone recommend a book, article or You Tube video that would give me a good start on this? I will be 65 in March and plan a thru hike starting in April 2020.
Thanks in advance for any help or guidance!
Tipi Walter
11-02-2019, 15:57
Back in my 30s I fell all the time while backpacking---didn't think much about it cuz I recovered quickly and never broke anything.
Then in my 60s I started practicing (by necessity) Slow and Careful Boot Placement on the trail. My falling has dropped by 90%---and this is with carrying butt heavy backpacks.
Point is? Go slow and concentrate everything on the trail right below your feet. This simple technique works in snow too---although ice will require Microspikes etc. Don't be hiking along and gawking at the scenery---in other words.
FlyPaper
11-02-2019, 16:13
One thing I've learned that applies especially when rocks are wet is to always ask yourself "what will happen if my foot slips?" In most cases this will be a downhill slide. A foot slipping backwards is usually a lot less dangerous than a foot slipping forward because your hands will be in front of you. Also, a foot that rolls inward is a lot less likely to injury you than a foot rolling outward. If you have to step somewhere that looks a little risky, make sure you do so in such a way that the consequences of a slippage of feet is not a major problem.
The sharp edges of rocks can be used as lines much less likely to allow slippage. Low points in rocks or between rocks are good places to step in order to leave few or no options for a direction your foot can slip. A wet rock that angles forward can be very risky. I often choose to put my foot down sideways in such places so that it would slip sideways rather than forward.
As Tipi also said, you have to be careful to look at your feet and not the scenery in many, if not most places. If you need to look around or otherwise give your attention to something other than foot placement, you may need to stop.
I was cautious before I got old, and I'm even more cautious now. When attempting a possibly risky maneuver (fording, a tricky ascent or descent), I like to have three of four points stable before I move the fourth -- the points being two feet and two hands or hiking poles, as the case may be. I also pay attention to balance, keeping my weight (center of gravity) directly over my feet as much as possible, weight being my own weight as well as the backpack. I also consider what move I'll make after the current maneuver. If any of this involves heights, I focus calmly on what I'm doing, not on my (moderate) fear.
Not being overweight helps any hiker, but older ones in particular. Not many fat 70 year old Hikers out there - for a reason.
TwistedCF
11-02-2019, 19:39
In many of the jobs I had in the military it was stressed to us over and over to always maintain three points of contact. This specifically relates to climbing where the tag line/fall protection counts as a point of contact so... if you are tied in you need both feet, or both hands, or one foot and one hand in contact with the wall. If you are not tied in you need both feet and one hand in contact. Only after placing both hands to advance up or down do you move one of your feet to the next point of contact. Sounds tedious I know but it's really pretty simple. When hiking with two trekking poles you have two extra points of contact besides your feet. Practice walking with the polls and keeping both poles in contact with the ground as you take your next step. It wont be necessary on even ground but when traversing steep, slippery or otherwise treacherous terrain, make a conscious effort to maintain three points of contact and you can seriously limit your chances of becoming over balanced.
https://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/107331-Walking-Faster-aka-Speed-Walking
This is an interesting conversation from awhile back that I think is relevant. Us old folks don't necessarily want to walk fast, but do want to walk efficiently and safely. Mostly read Just Bill's comments...
Slo-go'en
11-02-2019, 20:04
I guess it just takes practice.
The main problem I have is the knees no longer have the spring that they used to. That's mostly a down hill issue. Up hill is safer then down hill. A lot of injuries happen towards the end of the day on the down hill leg as your already tired and it's easy to slip and slide.
Like the trail I came down today. Steep, rocky, wet and with ice on ledge in places. Slow and careful foot placement. Skidded a couple of times, but stayed on my feet. Of course, a couple of fit 20 something woman came dancing by like no problem.
Traillium
11-02-2019, 20:54
https://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/107331-Walking-Faster-aka-Speed-Walking
This is an interesting conversation from awhile back that I think is relevant. Us old folks don't necessarily want to walk fast, but do want to walk efficiently and safely. Mostly read Just Bill's comments...
Great thread!
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One of those who I suspected had to be more mindful of their movement especially since going out so often for extended periods with one heavy resupply and kit while rarely to never complaining about injury was Tipi Walter. At his age, with the load he carries(both wt and bulk), combined with his fitness level, mindfulness of movement, hilly terrain he visits often, laborious trail maintenance, and combined with his daily MPD avg are all part of his longevity and basically injury limited backpacking career. I'm glad to have him reply. As TW said too often we can go mindlessly head down the trail. I don't see him doing that.
On the other end of the spectrum are big time MPD avg backpackers like Skurka. Watch Andrew particularly when he's in HIS Zone. He flows, born out of his competitive track days and now racing in events like the Leadville 100. He uses trekking poles backpacking but his movements are still less impactful very ergonomic very deliberate very mindful putting less stress on his body whether he was using poles or not. He almost glides not fighting his momentum. FKTers like Scott Williamson and the many other LD serialists as well as Ultra runners I witness have the same non plodding mindful ergonomic approach with less wasted motion.
I don't know about books or vids but some things to offer as a suggestion:
1) Consider the places we step. Pick rocks that are not likely to move or if they might predicting how they might... not just so we might not fall or trip but so that when they move we maintain balance while moving with them and the momentum of our bodies instead of fighting it. Consider the weather in this. Consider the type of rock like climbers do because it affects traction. Consider where we can slip on wet leaves on a descent, even when the wetness is under the top leaf layer, or on wooden trail construction(steps, pontoons, boardwalks, etc) particularly when that construction uses trees with bark removed. They can be as or slippery than that algae covered stream crossing. This might make Rocksylvania less intimidating.
It's not just wet or icy conditions where traction can fail but under dry conditions with AlMOST an imperceptible layer of fine sand on some rock/asphalt that acts like mini ball bearings that with attempting a quick stop or start can have us sliding uncontrollably with wt and bulk on our backs making it more problematic. Over the escarpment or dry pour off we can go or down a flight of steps or slope. Avoid screeching halts and accelerations unless conditions allow...just like when behind the wheel of an automobile. Ever been a passenger in a motor vehicle when the driver is hard on the accelerator and brake? I feel like a bubblehead in an off road race. FWIW, auto accidents are caused by that fine dust on streets out west causing ice covered road like conditions after the lightest of rain.
2) Dont blast down descents taking huge step riser heights in one leap possibly breaking up the riser height into more than one step. Same thing on ascents. These are places on trail where wet or slimy well worn wood or slimy step construction combined with a turn the mind of approach is recipe for slip, trip, and fall scenarios. Dont take deep knee bends when not absolutely required. This is conservation of energy and movement. It seems like we all should know and be mindful of this but watching hikers it's obvious that is not the case.
3) Dont stretch out the gait/stride length when conditions are most slippery or on steep slopes. Save the longer stride lengths for flatter fair weather.
4) Learn to scissor and side step employing a wider number of muscle groups to spread the physical impact.
5) Keep the center of gravity under neath us. Be mindful of pack adjustments and form. Feet spread shoulder width and shoulders leaning neither too far forward or erect. Swing arms to increase forward momentum on flats even if not using trekking poles to establish a mindful rhythm. Trekking poles assist many to establish a cadence but it can also be done without them.
One thing that can happen on maintained trail like the AT or PCT is we take footing for granted. We can so easily turn our minds off. We follow the blazes, beaten 30-40" wide tread, and the herd turning our minds off. This increases slips, trips, and falls. Take hints from the "pros."
Now, of course proper trekking pole use can help but IMHO should not be assumed a panacea for otherwise ignorant non ergonomic movement.
Now, if you're a new backpacker this makes an even stronger case for going out slower more mindful not too fast too hard or too long as we practice these techniques incorporating them while possibly also incorporating trekking poles. However, it is NOT simply about putting in the miles but taking hints from others more experienced while putting in the miles to shorten the learning curve. Learn to embrace the success of others while noting but NOT majoring on the causes of so many injuries and other problems.
HeartFire
11-03-2019, 07:47
I've been working with a personal trainer now for a couple of years - we concentrate a LOT on core strengthening and balance - it's made a huge difference. I did not fall once on my last 5 week long backpack trip, and I trail run as well, and have not fallen in a long time - I'm able to catch myself and recover easily if I miss step. (OK, I did slip on this last trip - walking down to a creek, it was very muddy and I ended up sitting on my butt - but I don't consider that a 'fall')
An important lesson I soon learned was to not step on wet roots. Roots become quite slippery, especially roots that parallels the trail.
My situation is a little different. My "Achilles heel" are my ankles. They are prone to rolling. I have unintentionally developed an almost reflexive response to this phenomenon. When one of my ankles starts to roll, I simply collapse. Seems this is protective; rather than having a bad ankle injury, I risk injury during the collapse, but, knock on wood, I have been able to fall with relative safety. So for me, falling in this case is a good thing.
Like Slo-goen commented on an earlier thread, I most commonly get in trouble on what appear to be the less risky types of trail. This points to the importance of never losing focus. Of course on rock scrambles we intensely scrutinize every step, thus, I almost never have trouble on this type of terrain. On easy trails we tend to drop our guard. I can't tell you how many times I have stumbled when I encounter another hiker traveling toward me! My attention is diverted and I get in trouble.
Lastly, the importance of good footwear cannot be underestimated. What works for one person won't work for another. I loved my first pair of Altras (3.5s). I replaced them with Altra Timps(since 3.5s were no longer available) and had 4 bad falls within 30 miles (slick as snot in wet conditions). I hated shelling out $150 for Salomons, but it would have been false economy to continue with the Altra Timps. The Salomons were great and got me through Maine, NH, and most of VT. Trying different shoes when one pair is not working is WAY cheaper than sustaining an injury.
Tipi Walter
11-03-2019, 13:12
An important lesson I soon learned was to not step on wet roots. Roots become quite slippery, especially roots that parallels the trail.
Slick roots on the trail---don't step on them---this is something we learned the hard way at the very beginning. Practicing this is second nature now. Wait until you step on a trail root that's covered with an invisible sheen of ice.
Slumgum brings up the importance of footwear---so true. Ankle rolling occurs in some boots/tennis shoes alot more than in other boots. Nobody backpacks in high top boots anymore but these things did prevent ankle rollovers.
And this subject should be divided into Two Separate Subjects---Foot placement and/or falling with a 15 to 30 lb pack---and falling with a 90+ lb pack. World of difference. The 90 lb pack will take you where you don't want to go during a fall. I remember in 2016 I was coming down the Brush Mt trail in Citico wilderness in 4-6 inches of snow and my microspikes were picking up way too much globs of snow underneath---essentially causing me to backpack on big balls of wet snow.
I slipped of course and the pack swung around and I performed a Five Point landing---elbow, hips, knee, etc etc. It was comical and sobering. Took the blasted Kahtoolas off fast and it was so much better in regular full leather boots.
https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpack-2016-Trips-171/17-Days-in-the-Snow/i-vJdRB6X/0/e35a1af6/XL/TRIP%20172%20072-XL.jpg
Pic taken on Brush Mt trail just before the fall.
This pic shows the location of the fall---all those "score" marks in the snow was me flailing down in the Five Point landing etc.
https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpack-2016-Trips-171/17-Days-in-the-Snow/i-cHvnq82/0/dfd6487d/XL/TRIP%20172%20139-XL.jpg
With time, increased flexibility and strength, better foot placement, and perhaps lighter loads we can reach a pt that rolling an ankle withOUT injury is preferable to attempting to stop the momentum and 'jam' joints and tendons abruptly. For myself I roll my ankle occasionally but without injury more so wearing low cuts without proper heel cupping or when my foot rises too high out of the shoe or with improper lacing. I practice off trail on asphalt and grass walking on the sides of my feet in low cuts which helps collapsing like Slumgum stated. I do have to then be careful other joints especially knees aren't damaged.
This is a topic like learning how to breathe better. We often assume we know all there is to know about it - breathing, walking, gear, etc. It leads some to say we're over thinking these actions. In my experiences I've learned I didn't know as much as I initially assumed. Keeping our minds ever open to incorporating new ideas and info is a good thing. As easy as it is to dismiss it as a past experience, that we're beyond it happening again, like right now, we no longer believe our new bicycle came down the chimney with a jolly old fellow in red suit. So it is now with other beliefs.
If we thought about these aspects and incorporated these techniques/skills before using or as we initially used trekking poles we would even more so reduce bodily impacts. This is what developing our skill set is about.
FlyPaper
11-03-2019, 16:08
One other thing I'll mention. On my most recent hike in PA, there had been no recent rain, but the dew point seemed to be just right so that the cool rocks were surprisingly wet.
Wet can be bad, but when you're not expecting it, it can be really bad. Look out for slick rocks even when it hasn't rained recently.
To employ ergonomic hiking I find myself, like Liz 'Snorkel', adjusting pace according to conditions like terrain, weather, slope, fitness level, wt carried etc. As a newb I tried to go at a quicker pace than I was ready or at inappropriate times. This was because I hiked with too much ego attempting to judge myself and performance while competing with or constantly comparing myself with others. Some try to go at their quickest pace all the time when they witness others flying. That is no longer me. I learned to happily accept responsibility for my hike, to let go of the need for constant competitive comparisons. As I did I hiked more joyously, less fatigued, for longer hrs day after day after day wk after wk, less less prone to injury, according to someone else's agenda. This is a most wonderful aspect of hiking. Now, I find I can hike almost always faster if desired. Sometimes that's needed. And, those that may hike past me don't have the long term endurance I do so that ultimately I hike further than them if not on a daily basis over several days. Best of all I'm not fatigued. I've found my natural acceptable pace and style.
Going out too fast too hard too long expecting to always do as others not HYOH not working our way into our hikes is what causes some AT thru Newbs injury or emotional or psychological discontent that leads to quitting. We need to be honest where we're at when we hit the starting TH without so much of the ego. We don't all hit a new hike in elite backpacker condition as we may fool ourselves.
Slo-go'en
11-03-2019, 20:10
I would think weekenders and short section hikers are the most likely to overestimate their abilities and pace. It looks easy on the map and you want to maximize the distance to make it worth the trip.
On a thru hike or LASH your less confined by deadlines, so you have the time to work up to longer days and longer miles. But then, if you don't want to be the last one to a shelter when there are 50 others headed in that direction, do what you can. Sometimes it does turn into a race :)
Daniel-J
11-05-2019, 03:00
The most important thing is not to forget safety precautions and a positive attitude!
Try to do the same thing, but a little slower. Craftsmanship sometimes requires grinding and the slow execution of any element gives exactly this result. Even if you have a lot of experience, this tip will help you.
This is what my grandfather told me when he taught me hiking and climbing.
Slo-go'en
11-05-2019, 11:05
I almost took a tumble on a steep trail yesterday when the tip of my shoe caught the top of a rock. Not lifting the foot high enough to clear the obstacles is one of my problems. PA chewed up the toes of my boots really bad last spring.
In addition to roots, watch out for log water bars. It's tempting to step on them as you go over the ditch, but if they are nice polished wood, they are very slippery and usually angled down across the trail.
I don't remember too many rocky sections south of VA, but the leaves can be an issue and Georgia clay can be really slippery when wet.
I did take a tumble last week. Going down a hill I go down 7 or 8 times a day, 3 or 4 times a week. One of countless places along the trail with loose dirt, rocks, leaves -- just ready to "get" you if you get a little careless.
My head hit the ground hard. Must have stuck my right arm out, cause I sprained that too. Thankfully, no permanent damage. It DID scrape my head up pretty good -- just in time to help with my Halloween look!
Well, I don't remember, but, since I sprained the right arm, logic tells me that I was carrying my hiking poles, unused, in my left hand. There's a lesson there...
I've fallen on limestone covered with Lady Bugs on a slight slope in Florida. Same thing happened at higher elev in Yellowstone when the scree slopes were covered with moths making them even slipperier. I fell one time because a slab was covered with dead hardened casings of millipedes that acted like little rolling sticks. Better to maybe throw the trekking poles held if not using them on a downslope. Better yet maybe is to use them?
Tipi Walter
11-05-2019, 14:34
I've fallen on limestone covered with Lady Bugs on a slight slope in Florida. Same thing happened at higher elev in Yellowstone when the scree slopes were covered with moths making them even slipperier. I fell one time because a slab was covered with dead hardened casings of millipedes that acted like little rolling sticks. Better to maybe throw the trekking poles held if not using them on a downslope. Better yet maybe is to use them?
My best falling comes on a hillside covered in acorns. Miss Nature's ball bearings.
My best falling comes on a hillside covered in acorns. Miss Nature's ball bearings.
You should have seen my driveway before I cleaned it. Acorns. Forgot about those fall fall magnets. You prolly mash them into acorn flour though. :D
Traffic Jam
11-05-2019, 18:38
OP, about 9 yrs ago, I found a book at the library by a man and woman who wrote about the physical act of hiking including proper foot placement, gait, and stride. It was old back then and for the life of me, can’t recall the name. Does anyone remember this book?
At the time, I thought the info in the book was outdated and now regret not paying more attention.
Also, have you checked out The Complete Walker by Colin Fletcher? I haven’t made it through the entire book but you may find useful tips on hiking ergonomics.
I have followed with great interest threads that provide advice to "older" hikers. Several posters have said that older hikers would be well served by learning about ergonomic hiking and foot placement. Can anyone recommend a book, article or You Tube video that would give me a good start on this? I will be 65 in March and plan a thru hike starting in April 2020.
Thanks in advance for any help or guidance!
Lots of good stuff above. I think there is something I can add.
It relates to the 'gliding' comment of Dogwood's about Skurka and that he looks like he glides. This type of walking is what I am talking about when I mention that I work on my mechanics every day. I usually start the walking day consciously thinking about my mechanics for about 10-15 mins. This is to get me in the groove so to speak. And later in the day, if I notice for some reason that I have had some heavy foot placements or 'hear' my steps starting to sound loud or realize I am bobbing up and down too much, then I go back to concentrating on mechanics for a time again.
What I am striving for with my mechanics is to both walk quietly and not to bob up and down. Glide and walk silent. If you concentrate on not taking steps which are beyond your bodies ideal length (overstriding) you don't hit the ground hard with your heel. Your lower leg will not be way out in front of your knee. Your heel touches first but only by a little before your mid-foot comes down. Put your foot down softly. Have soft knees. Cave men did not overstride because they did not wear shoes. Sticking your leg way out and hitting the ground hard with your heel is a bad idea when barefoot. Walk like you are barefoot. The zero drops shoes help with this btw.
A big benefit of this is that when (not if) you start to roll your ankle you can unweight it easier and reduce the chance of injury. I have noticed that many folks who hike constantly, or thru hikers who are about 500 miles or more into a hike have relearned what I call the Hiker Hop (which I am sure all cave men knew well). You will be watching your partner cruising down the trail and he all of a sudden does this weird little twitch where he starts to take a step and instantly unweights his foot with a sort of hop/skip/stutter and does not even break stride and keeps going. Before he pulled this little trick up from his ancient DNA he would have fallen on his face due to that little rock in the leaves he just stepped on.
When you walk down hill don't fall down to your next foot placement. Many people stride off into space and accelerate downwards until their foot hits the ground and then they have to catch their falling weight. This is an inefficient use of your strength and somewhat prone to resulting in injury and falling on your face periodically. "Reach" downwards with your lead foot and put it down softly - this requires that your back leg thigh muscles be used to lower you down rather than just letting you drop.
When you get this all down right (and it is easier said than done) you will not bob up and down and you will walk softly. It will result in many fewer injuries and greater endurance due to less wasted motion and inefficient use of your muscles.
Every body has an ideal stride length where you will be most efficient. It is determined by the length of your leg bones. Find that sweet spot and perfect it.
Hiking speed does not come from long strides (unless you have really long legs of course - and I am jealous because I don't). Real speed comes from stride rate. The faster you take steps the faster you go. There is an optimum for each person I believe in that if you hit your perfect stride length and hit the rate you can hold all day that is the best your body can do in terms of daily mileage. For some of us old guys that may not turn out to be that much and for Anish it is 50 mpd.
Something I find works pretty well when training in the gym is the treadmill. For working on stride length and rate I set the machine at 2% and slowly run the speed up past 3 mph. I concentrate on not striding too far and not making a sound (no pounding feet) and just keep ramping up the speed while trying to hold my mechanics solid. If you do this you will reach a point where you just cannot go beyond the rate you are at without losing your form. So stay at that rate as long as you can. If you get too out of breath then dial it back a bit. You can also use one of those machines to practice your hill climbing mechanics (the machine I use goes up to 15 degrees).
What I am striving for with my mechanics is to both walk quietly and not to bob up and down. Glide and walk silent. If you concentrate on not taking steps which are beyond your bodies ideal length (overstriding) you don't hit the ground hard with your heel. Your lower leg will not be way out in front of your knee. Your heel touches first but only by a little before your mid-foot comes down. Put your foot down softly. Have soft knees. Cave men did not overstride because they did not wear shoes. Sticking your leg way out and hitting the ground hard with your heel is a bad idea when barefoot. Walk like you are barefoot. The zero drops shoes help with this btw.
I started practicing this as a teen when hunting which for me was more like wandering through the woods, mountains and swamps.
Walking in the woods with Ricahard Pryor - https://vimeo.com/33965191
I think that most good practices described and recommended here come automatically when hiking barefoot.
The fastest hiker I saw on the AT (3.5 plus mph) was an average-looking guy in his twenties (I think). Medium height, thin but not overly so. Anyway, I watched him walk and he appeared to glide over the trail with minimum effort and great efficiency. He was a cross-country runner in college, he said.
When you walk down hill don't fall down to your next foot placement. Many people stride off into space and accelerate downwards until their foot hits the ground and then they have to catch their falling weight. This is an inefficient use of your strength and somewhat prone to resulting in injury and falling on your face periodically. "Reach" downwards with your lead foot and put it down softly - this requires that your back leg thigh muscles be used to lower you down rather than just letting you drop.
When you do this are you leaning slightly forward, backward, or neither?
Most of the "damage" is probably done on ups and downs. Give me a flat trail with minimal roots and I can pull a 20 mile day no problem. I am a small person so steps are the biggest challenge for me. When I hike up rocky steps (which is all the time since I hike almost exclusively in the whites) I try and keep my center of gravity tight. I will take smaller steps up , for example if I come to a spot where there is a large step up, I may take several smaller steps up instead by skirting the end rocks as opposed to going straight up the center. I switch the foot I lead with on and off. This can sometimes almost look like a limp but I will be limping if I step down onto the same foot for the entire hike! Side steps up as opposed to forward steps are also helpful. I might do a parkour type side to side motion to get up and over two rocks that are pushed together. Occasionally I will just bull my way through a section but that just makes you tired and sweaty faster. It really is about taking your time and finding alternate routes within the LNT priciples to avoid huge steps and over extending yourself as well as repeated impact to the same joints for too long. I am also not ashamed to veggie belay as needed. My zipline gloves, fingerless leather gloves we use here to guide zipline tours, theyre singing rock climbing gloves, are a must have in my pack and are almost always on me to protect my palms when swinging around trees and climbing rocks. When climbing a long set of steps I will stay low and slow, not fully extending myself back up with each step. That combined with the stepping methods I mentioned before is how I keep my center of gravity tight and makes me almost seem like I am floating up the trail. Occasionally you may come to a flat rockface that needs to be climbed such as towards the top of Katahdin or Mt Washington. These are my favorite. I like to do hikes that include class 3 or 4 climbs. When that happens I stay close to the rock, almost flat to it and spider man my way up the wall. Friction climbing is what I am most familiar with so just making sure to keep weight in your toes should keep you from slipping which can be fatal in those cases. I left a group of people in awe at how easily I climbed up a wall like that on Katahdin. Damp conditions are the enemy. My falls have been from slipping on wet rocks or roots (wet roots are the worst) As we all know, when you fall on the trail its a very slow process. Try and use that time on the way down to think about how you are about to fall. I met a girl who would fall on her pack since she carried the bedding and her partner had the hard stuff. Personally I try to land on my butt and slide if its a big rock that I'm slipping on. Again, Im small so those are the problem areas for me. I fell once while crossing a very small rocky stream. It that situation there was no good way to fall. I went down in a crab walk type position so my body wouldn't hit any of the water or sharp rocks but ended up jamming my hand between two rocks, I split a fingernail and lost a small chunk of cuticle but was otherwise unharmed thanks to my gloves. If they had fingers I wouldve been fine but I like fingerless. So yeah, avoid the fall by stepping close and careful, anticipate the fall by wearing the right protective gear, and plan the fall on your way down as best you can. They say when older folks fall in a facility to not try and catch them, to help them to the ground. Help yourself to the ground because a lot of damage can be done fighting the inevitable. That's my 50 cents.
Tipi Walter
11-06-2019, 10:07
Also, have you checked out The Complete Walker by Colin Fletcher? I haven’t made it through the entire book but you may find useful tips on hiking ergonomics.
One of my take aways from Fletcher's book was his mentioning the importance of achieving a hiking cadence or rhythm---it's one of the few things I remember from his books.
Years ago I developed a category of Gaits---which in effect were the distance of one boot from the other boot. I came up with about 4 or 5 different gaits. When going up a steep trail with a big pack I was in my first gait---one boot length overlapped with the next boot length---"baby steps" in other words. ETC.
And baby steps also work well on very steep descents---and also the "side step gait" whereby you stand sideways on a steep nut trail and go down sideways one step at a time---this helps to prevent sliding and wiping out.
The fastest hiker I saw on the AT (3.5 plus mph) was an average-looking guy in his twenties (I think). Medium height, thin but not overly so. Anyway, I watched him walk and he appeared to glide over the trail with minimum effort and great efficiency. He was a cross-country runner in college, he said.
Loose but no overly so, losing the tension. Too loose and form can be off. Too tight and it leads to greater stresses. It's important also when using trekking poles. Watch some who rigidly tightly hold onto their poles white knuckling the grips and hold their shoulders and arms which affect being tight elsewhere. You might see the muscles and tendons in the arms tightly flexed. Straps help to loosely hold on and reduce muscle tightness and stress. Now watch someone like Skurka using trekking poles. They also glide with him. Same with skiers doing moguls who have to be loose moving/gliding/sliding with the terrain but still under mindful control. They don't fight their momentum! They have examined and know their line and approach it as one controlled but loose movement as each movement seamlessly leads to another. Watch how they use their poles. They barely, for such short duration, touch the earth. First thing as a Newb runner I was told is to loosen my wrists and tension particularly upper body. It affected breathing and breathing affected it, which affected so many other things like, um performance, injury risks, circulation, energy expenditure, etc. My hands and arms flop around somewhat loosely while running now. Same thing learning to serve in tennis; instructors call it having a spaghetti arm or loose arm. It allows for greater pop, lower potential injury risks, and disguise on the serve. Same in Yoga. Yoga instructor immediately caught my tension and breathing were related. Tennis teachers caught the same thing. I had to learn to breathe and breathe correctly which led to not only better performance on the serve but more sustained focus ready for the return. Watch Roger Federer. His professional longevity at such a high level is related to all this. He's a decent person too because of it. In all cases others were teaching me breathing was affecting not only my body but emotional and psychological states...hence performance. Sounds ridiculous that we may need to revisit walking, or interestingly breathing, as technique to become more ergonomic less energy wasteful less prone to injury as hikers. These details can allow a hiker to hike faster IF one wants and be less prone to injury with greater joy .
As physical stress can lead to emotional and mental stress the reverse has also been shown to be true. Allowing oneself to constantly be in a state of emotional or psychological stress is not good for the physical body. Think whole person or holistically rather than just bodily. Although there will be some that would scoff this extends to one's spirituality, however that broad concept may be personally defined. Regularly(habitually) being in a state of anger, ingratitude, complaint, high judgment, hate, offense, sadness, depression, selfishness, fear, impatience, unforgiveness, bitterness, unkindness, etc negatively affect the body. Likewise the way we hold our bodies(physiology) affects our mental and psychological states. What do we want in our lives? Is it not love, peace, joy, self control, patience, forbearance ...? Being in these later states offer positive consequences for not only ourselves but for other in the environments/aura or atmosphere we create.
Since I'm not a regular trekking pole user I gently without tension swing my arms like a pendulum in a shallow arc as if I was using trekking poles, often. Doing this adds to momentum, can increase the workout, helps maintain balance and center of gravity...and ultimately conservation of energy. My arms are similarly used as a squirrel's, monkey's, or cat's tail assisting balance.
Stresses are also magnified by extreme TPW's when technique and improper gear adjustments are ignored. Yet on nearly every hike I witness heavy highly impacting plodding, shallow breathing, tightness, or consistently extremely stressed out of breath breathing even by 20 yr olds in otherwise seemingly very good physical shape.
Now, consider ignoring some or most of these pts? Do you think it leads to slips, trips, and falls or other injuries or quitting as a backpacker/hiker. Do you think it affects one's personality or likability and those around us? Do you think it doesn't affect us in the bedroom? Does it not affect employment?, lifespan, health, and the quality of life one experiences?
Food for thought.
I started practicing this as a teen when hunting which for me was more like wandering through the woods, mountains and swamps.
Hah! Me too. Politically incorrect today but I was pretending I was an Indian (I'm a little more Native American than Warren at least - lol).
When you do this are you leaning slightly forward, backward, or neither?
You always want to be in balance (easier said than done of course), so you want to be neutral. That being said all you have to do is watch people going down hill and you can often tell that they are on the verge of having their feet slip away from them (leaning back) and landing on their butt. I doubt hardly anyone actually leans forward going down hill as they would fall to often - most face plants are caused by catching a foot when striding and having your mass surge ahead of your feet and down you go.
What I am trying to say is when you are going down is to not let your mass accelerate as you step down (like it does when you fall) as then you have to catch (absorb) a much higher impact with your downhill foot. This impact is very hard on your joints and, since you are going downhill, there is a much higher chance of slipping and falling.
Remember (or imagine if you have not done it) walking down a really steep slope when not on trail. You are concerned about slipping so you walk carefully and reach out with your downhill foot and carefully place it. This is done by 'lowering' your mass with the planted back leg by slowly releasing muscle tension. Now on a downward sloping trail you use the same basic technique while keeping yourself loose and relaxed. You can go quite fast this way as long as the slope is not too steep and you will not hurt yourself.
It is much harder to describe this stuff than one would imagine. The words only sort of come together.
Re: Dogwoods description of how to use poles. This is exactly how Justin Lichter describes how he uses poles. He was also a cross country ski racer and he actually gave a figure about how much faster he could hike using poles than without them (but I forget what the number was).
I always carry poles. I always use them when going up or down slopes and normally not when on the level (unless the footing is bad and calls for them for safety reasons). The reason I try not to use them on the flats is that I am saving my arm strength for using them on the ups and downs as they really help get more out of your legs there. Though I do sometimes replicate the cross country ski technique when on the flats - it is kind of fun actually as one flies along.
It is worth noting that I use different hand grip/positions when going up as opposed to down. Maybe everyone does this - I don't know. Being old and really wanting to protect my knees I switch to a grip which places the top of the pole sort of resting in the base of the palm of my hand when going down a steep hill. I reach down with the pole just like I reach down with my leg and then I have the pole catch a small amount of the force. This also gives me a planted point of support when the inevitable slip happens.
I agree also on how emotions effect the hiking. I sometimes use them on purpose. When I am dying on a huge uphill I deliberately start thinking about things that make me mad sometimes and I get all pumped up and charge up the hill like doing so will fix things. It has never fixed anything but I get up the hill lickity split.
Tipi Walter
11-06-2019, 16:25
I never fall going up a steep uphill which is weird---but my falls come from downhills and on level ground.
The way I described a mogul skier, examining their lines, knowing them, and flowing with one controlled series of motion, much like a lumberjack on rolling logs partially submerged floating in the water, also maintaining balance, is the way I went through the often dreaded Rocksylvania. I first assessed the rock, born out of climbing/non tech mountaineering and learning some local geology on every hike, which were stable, which I knew would roll and in what direction, traction with my footwear, determining if either I was going high on the top surface or if allowed, although I have size 14 EEEE ft, between the rock, or some combo. I blew through the state. Many things were coming together at the same time but the technique can still be used by segment ATers. Same thing out of Lehigh at the old zinc Superfund site with rocky brushy tread and Kittatiny Ridge in NJ. I'm not optimally unique or attempting to puff myself up. I witnessed a couple of other thrus doing the same thing, one from Great Britain, Ireland if I/m who literally almost ran over the rock in Rocksylvania with such precision and conservation of motion never once falling. He made it seem like the rock wasn't even there. I saw one petite younger female thru with small feet blast through these conditions by mostly going between the rock. I saw her sometimes on top but she was always right anticipating how rock would move. Later I found out she was from OR and had competed in Lumber Jack/Lumber woman(?) competitions. I listened to the way they saw this part of the AT obstacle course. It widened my perspectives on how to successfully deal with these trail conditions. This is the same as considering Justin's winter S&R and skiing experiences and how he translates that to winter conditions LD backpacking and using trekking poles, a natural transition, much like an elite collegiate runner/athlete who applies himself to LD endurance backpacking first ever GW Loop or Alaska Traverse or continuous NCT. Here this. We don't have to be elite runners, athletes or S&R personnel to personally excel at backpacking or move forward, be better.
Say what we will about TW but he knows what serves him and his body. He knows the why's of why he 's out there. Even with the way he does things, hiking his own hikes, he has learned to make his way with the style(s) he chooses. I respect that despite giving him some good natured shart.
I never fall going up a steep uphill which is weird---but my falls come from downhills and on level ground.
Some say climbing falls(some types) occur more often on the descents too. Falls at home most often, I think, occur in Bathrooms. ie;wet floor, in a hurry, lots of things going on, inattention, in out of tubs, shower stalls/stepping up or down onto a different ht platform. This is our backpacking step up's/step down's, combined with uneven slippery surfaces, wt on the back which in normal life we are un accustomed. Same around waterfalls.
I've never fallen going uphill, but one I climb frequently has the potential. Loose dirt, loose rocks, steep. You really need to test where you're going to step before you commit in a ome places, especially because you're about to transfer your weight and you want to be sure where your foot is going to go is going to hold.
sometimes, on a sketchy, steep downhill, I'll plant both poles in front of me before I take that downhill step. lift the poles and repeat for the next step. Till the trail levels out a little.
What amazes me is, I'll be doing that, and then here comes some young kid running down these hills! Don't see how none of these runners don't ever break their necks!
Traillium
11-07-2019, 20:23
Lots of good stuff above. I think there is something I can add.
It relates to the 'gliding' comment of Dogwood's about Skurka and that he looks like he glides. This type of walking is what I am talking about when I mention that I work on my mechanics every day. I usually start the walking day consciously thinking about my mechanics for about 10-15 mins. This is to get me in the groove so to speak. And later in the day, if I notice for some reason that I have had some heavy foot placements or 'hear' my steps starting to sound loud or realize I am bobbing up and down too much, then I go back to concentrating on mechanics for a time again.
What I am striving for with my mechanics is to both walk quietly and not to bob up and down. Glide and walk silent. If you concentrate on not taking steps which are beyond your bodies ideal length (overstriding) you don't hit the ground hard with your heel. Your lower leg will not be way out in front of your knee. Your heel touches first but only by a little before your mid-foot comes down. Put your foot down softly. Have soft knees. Cave men did not overstride because they did not wear shoes. Sticking your leg way out and hitting the ground hard with your heel is a bad idea when barefoot. Walk like you are barefoot. The zero drops shoes help with this btw.
A big benefit of this is that when (not if) you start to roll your ankle you can unweight it easier and reduce the chance of injury. I have noticed that many folks who hike constantly, or thru hikers who are about 500 miles or more into a hike have relearned what I call the Hiker Hop (which I am sure all cave men knew well). You will be watching your partner cruising down the trail and he all of a sudden does this weird little twitch where he starts to take a step and instantly unweights his foot with a sort of hop/skip/stutter and does not even break stride and keeps going. Before he pulled this little trick up from his ancient DNA he would have fallen on his face due to that little rock in the leaves he just stepped on.
When you walk down hill don't fall down to your next foot placement. Many people stride off into space and accelerate downwards until their foot hits the ground and then they have to catch their falling weight. This is an inefficient use of your strength and somewhat prone to resulting in injury and falling on your face periodically. "Reach" downwards with your lead foot and put it down softly - this requires that your back leg thigh muscles be used to lower you down rather than just letting you drop.
When you get this all down right (and it is easier said than done) you will not bob up and down and you will walk softly. It will result in many fewer injuries and greater endurance due to less wasted motion and inefficient use of your muscles.
Every body has an ideal stride length where you will be most efficient. It is determined by the length of your leg bones. Find that sweet spot and perfect it.
Hiking speed does not come from long strides (unless you have really long legs of course - and I am jealous because I don't). Real speed comes from stride rate. The faster you take steps the faster you go. There is an optimum for each person I believe in that if you hit your perfect stride length and hit the rate you can hold all day that is the best your body can do in terms of daily mileage. For some of us old guys that may not turn out to be that much and for Anish it is 50 mpd.
Something I find works pretty well when training in the gym is the treadmill. For working on stride length and rate I set the machine at 2% and slowly run the speed up past 3 mph. I concentrate on not striding too far and not making a sound (no pounding feet) and just keep ramping up the speed while trying to hold my mechanics solid. If you do this you will reach a point where you just cannot go beyond the rate you are at without losing your form. So stay at that rate as long as you can. If you get too out of breath then dial it back a bit. You can also use one of those machines to practice your hill climbing mechanics (the machine I use goes up to 15 degrees).
Great stuff, Wyoming! I have learned these points slowly and sometimes painfully, both as a self-taught race walker, and now as walker and occasional distance hiker.
A big benefit of this is that when (not if) you start to roll your ankle you can unweight it easier and reduce the chance of injury. I have noticed that many folks who hike constantly, or thru hikers who are about 500 miles or more into a hike have relearned what I call the Hiker Hop (which I am sure all cave men knew well). You will be watching your partner cruising down the trail and he all of a sudden does this weird little twitch where he starts to take a step and instantly unweights his foot with a sort of hop/skip/stutter and does not even break stride and keeps going. Before he pulled this little trick up from his ancient DNA he would have fallen on his face due to that little rock in the leaves he just stepped on.
This^^^