Loop (or "lollipop loop") Itineraries [Archive]

madfarmer

11-12-2019, 16:31

Greetings,

I lead a large group of young folks on a 4 day, 3 night backpack trip every February. Typically, we do 30 mile sections of the AT (about 8 miles a day).

We've pretty much done from Springer to Fontana over the past five years. I'd love some loop options to make shuttling easier. The Standing Indian loop was perfect of course, but we've done that twice now. The Duncan Ridge loop is a bit too long.

I need some creative suggestions from you fine folk! Here's my thinking/problems:
1) Cohutta has options, but river crossing in February... yikes.
2) Smokies would be great, but they cap group sizes at 8. We have 12-14. Anyone know if they grant exceptions? Especially in the off season... fingers crossed. Gregory Bald or other loops would be great.
3) Maybe Grayson Highlands, but that could get super cold. Also, I'm hoping to stay within 3-4 hours of Chattanooga.
4) Maybe Bob Bald / Hangover / Citico Creek?
5) What about creative treks that aren't exactly loops. As in, we could do a ten mile loop with a "stem" of the lollipop that we re-trace our steps on for a total of 25-35?
6) Joyce Kilmer? Pisgah? What am I missing?

Thanks for any ideas.

HooKooDooKu

11-12-2019, 18:10

Great Smokey Mountains
GSMNP has enough trails that there can be many options for 3 night loops.

But their Compendium of Rules and Regulations limit party sizes to 8. There is an exception for campsites #12, 20, 46, 60, 86, & 90, but these are not located in positions that are conducive to 3 night loops, and even then you're still limited to a maximum party size of 12.

Exceptions for parties of greater than 12 are pretty much out of the question because there are only a dozen back country sites that have a capacity greater than 12 (most are 8 to 10).

Could you break up into two separate groups on different itineraries?
I assume with a group that size you're not all in one vehicle which would open up options to shuttle yourselves (such as two groups hiking in opposite directions with a car-key swap in the middle)?

TNhiker

11-12-2019, 18:47

your best bet for the smokies is to break up into two groups........actually, this is probably true for any place you go....

i have run into scout groups in the smokies who break up into two groups and have the groups either be based on age or on experience.....

and then base the hikes around the groups (as in, dont have the lesser experienced kids pull heavy mileage and/or elevation)

glenlawson

11-16-2019, 10:47

Tipi Walter

11-16-2019, 11:17

1) Cohutta has options, but river crossing in February... yikes.
I'm hoping to stay within 3-4 hours of Chattanooga.
4) Maybe Bob Bald / Hangover / Citico Creek?
5) What about creative treks that aren't exactly loops. As in, we could do a ten mile loop with a "stem" of the lollipop that we re-trace our steps on for a total of 25-35?
6) Joyce Kilmer? Pisgah? What am I missing?

Thanks for any ideas.

I highlighted my neck of the woods---Cohutta, Big Frog, Citico, Slickrock/Kilmer, Pisgah.

First, let's start with Big Frog/Cohutta---which I can't believe you haven't already done since it's so close to Chattanooga.

Loop opportunities in Big Frog/Cohutta are awesomely great---You could park at the "safe" area at Thunder Rock campground on Ocoee River and take the BMT south to Big Frog Mt and do loops from there---like Wolf Ridge to Pace Gap and up Big Creek to Grassy Gap trail and over to Low Gap for a night---etc. Pull all your trip in Big Frog---including Licklog Ridge etc.

And Cohutta has some great loops---park at Beech Bottom trailhead and go to Jacks River and visit the falls and then cross one Jacks crossing to Rough Ridge trail and head south to East Cowpen and go north to Panther Creek and down to Conasauga and cross Connie once to Hickory Creek up to Rice Camp and down to Jacks for one crossing back to the Falls and up to Beech Bottom.

Citico/Slickrock has sorts of loops---and more difficult than the Frog/Cohut area. One is park at Citico's South Fork 105 trailhead and head up the South Fork trail to Cold Spring Gap (9 miles) and take Trail 149 up to Cherry Log Gap and head north towards Farr Gap and take Big Stack Gap trail down to Slickrock Creek and go up the Nutbuster trail to Naked Ground Gap and swing over to the Hangover and then pass over Bob Bald and take 54A (North) to Cherry Log Gap and head down North Fork trail and out etc.

Or just get some good maps and figure it out. I won't even touch my old stomping grounds in Pisgah/Wilson Creek area---which is full of awesome trails like Upper Creek/Steels Creek/Harper/North Harper/Lost Cove Creek etc.

Tipi Walter

11-16-2019, 11:29

One time I was backpacking up Crowder Branch on the Citico side and ran into 17 or 18 Mormon backpackers pulling an intricate loop---

https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpack-2018-Trips-188-/18-Days-with-Jimmy-Johnny-and-Billy/i-FFzK4K4/0/773f5699/XL/Trip%20191%20%28187%29-XL.jpg
Their route? Beech Gap to Bob/Hangover Mt down to Slickrock Creek/Wildcat Falls and up Big Stack to Crowders (this picture) and south on Fodderstack Ridge to Beech Gap.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpack-2018-Trips-188-/18-Days-with-Jimmy-Johnny-and-Billy/i-G47z2ZG/0/808799f2/XL/Trip%20191%20%28166%29-XL.jpg
Filling up their water bottles at Crowder Spring. Obviously this group is too big and outside wilderness limits.

OwenM

11-18-2019, 06:43

nm, noone I recommend the place to ever goes there, either!:p

Mockernut

11-18-2019, 08:35

Here's a figure 8 loop that I think is about 26 miles:
Out of Vogel State Park, take the Coosa Backcountry trail, it is a loop and take the counter-clockwise side. It joins the Duncan Ridge trail about 2/3 around the loop.
Take the Duncan Ridge to the AT just south of Springer (Slaughter Gap). Continue south to Jarrard Gap. Take the Jarrard Gap trail north to Lake Windfield Scott. Then go up the Slaughter Creek trail, (it parallels the Slaughter Creek road) to Slaughter Gap. Then back north on the Duncan Ridge Trail until the Coosa Backcountry Trail/Bear Hair Gap trail turn off. Then Coosa Backcountry trail back to Vogel.

You could add the Freeman trail and loop around Springer if you need an extra 4 miles or so.

I'm pretty sure you mean Blood Mountain instead of Springer...

Paleolith54

11-18-2019, 19:38

Walter, regarding Nutbuster: is that the one that used to (and perhaps still does) have the line from Dante (Abandon All Hope...) carved on the trail sign? Thanks.

Tipi Walter

11-18-2019, 20:26

Walter, regarding Nutbuster: is that the one that used to (and perhaps still does) have the line from Dante (Abandon All Hope...) carved on the trail sign? Thanks.

The Upper Slickrock #42 trail aka Nutbuster used to have this sign---

45861
But someone ripped it off.

45862
It also had this "Ballbuster" craved into a tree---until someone came out and hacked it off with a hatchet.

The sign you're probably thinking of is the very steep (not as bad as the Nutbuster) trail called Hangover Lead North---running from Yellowhammer Gap to Big Fat Gap. "DO NOT TRY" and YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!" the pertinent messages.

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/39157721_10156749020638814_4120869022835146752_n.j pg?_nc_cat=106&_nc_oc=AQlwcaht1nYeduB11ew7xGu0XyfSKy1v9abme9I_-OxYAxaPy0-lvzjBZLeUgYKcSeM&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&oh=c16b4fb94914d7c0b3d555e9cc9fdff0&oe=5E5564B3

Paleolith54

11-19-2019, 09:38

The Upper Slickrock #42 trail aka Nutbuster used to have this sign---

45861
But someone ripped it off.

45862
It also had this "Ballbuster" craved into a tree---until someone came out and hacked it off with a hatchet.

The sign you're probably thinking of is the very steep (not as bad as the Nutbuster) trail called Hangover Lead North---running from Yellowhammer Gap to Big Fat Gap. "DO NOT TRY" and YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!" the pertinent messages.

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/39157721_10156749020638814_4120869022835146752_n.j pg?_nc_cat=106&_nc_oc=AQlwcaht1nYeduB11ew7xGu0XyfSKy1v9abme9I_-OxYAxaPy0-lvzjBZLeUgYKcSeM&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&oh=c16b4fb94914d7c0b3d555e9cc9fdff0&oe=5E5564B3

Thanks. It's been a LONG time. Yeah, the last pic looks like the most likely one. I went downhill on it to Slickrock Creek, and all I remember is a long struggle with gravity.

Mr. Bumpy

11-19-2019, 21:51

Near Charlotte is the Kings Mt. State Park/National Park perimeter trail combined with the Crowder's Mt. trail is a great lollipop hike mid-30's mileage. It is always a little warmer there than in the mountains and it is something a little bit different.

madfarmer

11-20-2019, 09:26

Here's a figure 8 loop that I think is about 26 miles:
Out of Vogel State Park, take the Coosa Backcountry trail, it is a loop and take the counter-clockwise side. It joins the Duncan Ridge trail about 2/3 around the loop.
Take the Duncan Ridge to the AT just south of Springer (Slaughter Gap). Continue south to Jarrard Gap. Take the Jarrard Gap trail north to Lake Windfield Scott. Then go up the Slaughter Creek trail, (it parallels the Slaughter Creek road) to Slaughter Gap. Then back north on the Duncan Ridge Trail until the Coosa Backcountry Trail/Bear Hair Gap trail turn off. Then Coosa Backcountry trail back to Vogel.

You could add the Freeman trail and loop around Springer if you need an extra 4 miles or so.

This sounds intriguing. I never noticed that figure 8 possibility. Are there campsites large enough for 3 - 4 tents along the Duncan Ridge, Jarrard, and Slaughter trails? Also, other than Blood Mtn, are there other note-worthy views? It's all nice to me, but the young ones like a "payoff" after long climbs...

madfarmer

11-20-2019, 09:31

I highlighted my neck of the woods---Cohutta, Big Frog, Citico, Slickrock/Kilmer, Pisgah.

First, let's start with Big Frog/Cohutta---which I can't believe you haven't already done since it's so close to Chattanooga.

Loop opportunities in Big Frog/Cohutta are awesomely great---You could park at the "safe" area at Thunder Rock campground on Ocoee River and take the BMT south to Big Frog Mt and do loops from there---like Wolf Ridge to Pace Gap and up Big Creek to Grassy Gap trail and over to Low Gap for a night---etc. Pull all your trip in Big Frog---including Licklog Ridge etc.

And Cohutta has some great loops---park at Beech Bottom trailhead and go to Jacks River and visit the falls and then cross one Jacks crossing to Rough Ridge trail and head south to East Cowpen and go north to Panther Creek and down to Conasauga and cross Connie once to Hickory Creek up to Rice Camp and down to Jacks for one crossing back to the Falls and up to Beech Bottom.

Citico/Slickrock has sorts of loops---and more difficult than the Frog/Cohut area. One is park at Citico's South Fork 105 trailhead and head up the South Fork trail to Cold Spring Gap (9 miles) and take Trail 149 up to Cherry Log Gap and head north towards Farr Gap and take Big Stack Gap trail down to Slickrock Creek and go up the Nutbuster trail to Naked Ground Gap and swing over to the Hangover and then pass over Bob Bald and take 54A (North) to Cherry Log Gap and head down North Fork trail and out etc.

Or just get some good maps and figure it out. I won't even touch my old stomping grounds in Pisgah/Wilson Creek area---which is full of awesome trails like Upper Creek/Steels Creek/Harper/North Harper/Lost Cove Creek etc.

Tipi,

Thanks for the suggestions. I've been to Cohutta a lot both solo and with groups, but I always venture near Jacks or Conasauga areas, so lots of waist deep rivers crossings in February might be a bit much for the young folk (they're softer than they like to admit...). I admit I've never played around much in Big Frog, so I'm checking my maps to see about campsites, daily mileage, water, etc... That might be a great, close option.

I'm also leaning toward Citico. Last summer I did the loop that was published in Backpacker Magazine. I was hilariously under-prepared for it after getting spoiled on the AT and falling for the magazine's smooth rhetoric. Briars, bees, nettle, blowdowns every 5 minutes. I loved it! I think going back in winter would be nice since long pants are almost required but insufferable in July. We would also plan short miles to account for navigation (we got lost at that tricky switchback near hangover...) and blowdowns.

Tipi Walter

11-20-2019, 10:56

Tipi,

I'm also leaning toward Citico. Last summer I did the loop that was published in Backpacker Magazine. I was hilariously under-prepared for it after getting spoiled on the AT and falling for the magazine's smooth rhetoric. Briars, bees, nettle, blowdowns every 5 minutes. I loved it! I think going back in winter would be nice since long pants are almost required but insufferable in July. We would also plan short miles to account for navigation (we got lost at that tricky switchback near hangover...) and blowdowns.

Do you have an online trip report or pics of your Citico trip? I'd like to see it.

It sounds like you got lost on the switchback going up to Hangover Mt on the Hangover Lead South trail from Big Fat Gap to the Hangover (now it's part of the BMT). What's weird is the very first time I went up this trail I too got lost---and turned right at the Tee instead of left etc. But I ended up at this pretty rock so it wasn't a waste of time---

This pic shows an overlook just below Hangover Mt (and on the "lost" section of the Hangover Lead South trail)--- and looking down into Slickrock Creek valley with Fodderstack Ridge on the left---running from Cherry Log Gap on left to Rockstack Mt and Big Fodderstack Mt as the high teat in the middle of the picture. The ridge continues to the right (north) to Little Fodderstacks and Farr Gap etc.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpacking2010/23-Days-with-Hootyhoo-Sgt-Rock/i-m7sNBCF/0/b3c163cf/L/TRIP%20115%20166-L.jpg

TNhiker

11-20-2019, 10:59

It sounds like you got lost on the switchback going up to Hangover Mt on the Hangover Lead South trail from Big Fat Gap to the Hangover (now it's part of the BMT). What's weird is the very first time I went up this trail I too got lost---and turned right at the Tee instead of left etc.

i think pretty much everyone gets lost right at that point.........

Tipi Walter

11-20-2019, 11:04

And oh wait---there's another tricky switchback below Hangover Mt too---and it's right below Saddle Tree Gap/Hangover. The trail climbs gradually near the top and then doglegs sharply to the left at a big rock. I know this SB well because on one trip I was coming up from Big Fat Gap in deep snow (2 feet near the top) and dangit lost the trail in this switchback section---so I just bushwacked up the mountain to the top of the ridge and directly reached the Hangover this way. It was a HELL SLOG. Only had the energy and time to take one picture during the terrible trek---me atop Haoe Peak at 5,240 feet.

It took me 3 hours to go from the Hangover to Naked Ground Gap---about 1.5 miles. In 3 feet of ridgetop snow. TIP: Never wear shorts when postholing up a mountain---ice crystals will abrade the legs and you'll end up with road-rash like wounds.

45867

madfarmer

11-20-2019, 12:15

i think pretty much everyone gets lost right at that point.........

Yep, there was a sharp switchback to the right (we were descending from Saddle Tree toward Big Fat) at a rock, so we continued straight on the rock to that amazing view and then saw a false trail leading down into really thick Rhodo/laurel. Real pain in the ass. Had to backtrack and only then saw the switchback we missed.

Hold up, though. I thought that view after the tricky switchback WAS the "HANGOVER" view? Is it not? I saw something about a spur trail from Saddle Tree that dead ends at a view, but we missed that completely (I don't recall seeing a short spur on my map). I just assumed the Hangover lead trail (#56) was the view.

Does the Cherohala close in the winter like parts of the BRP? Wondering where to start/end in Feb...

Tipi, I may have posted about it, but no trip report. I did this loop the last week of July. https://www.hikingproject.com/trail/7027638/slickrock-and-citico-wilderness-loop
Didn't see another person for 3 days. Thousands of bees up on the ridge having a feast on the neck-high purple flowers (joe pie weed?). Bear sighting at the campsite at the top of the Big Stack Gap trail (#139). Amazing campsite. From Fodderstack all the way back to the car on the "old bmt?" there was neck-high weeds, especially bad on the old roadbed sections, and tons of stinging nettle destroying my legs.

TNhiker

11-20-2019, 12:25

Does the Cherohala close in the winter like parts of the BRP? Wondering where to start/end in Feb..

i dont think it officially closes as opposed to be more like---"the snow is so deep, that i cant get through without a 4X4".....

i have been up there and driving through it with a sedan with 3-4 inches on ground.........

TNhiker

11-20-2019, 12:26

Hold up, though. I thought that view after the tricky switchback WAS the "HANGOVER" view? Is it not? I saw something about a spur trail from Saddle Tree that dead ends at a view, but we missed that completely (I don't recall seeing a short spur on my map). I just assumed the Hangover lead trail (#56) was the view.

that spur trail from saddle tree gap that goes up to the rocks-----that's the hangover....

TNhiker

11-20-2019, 12:30

from that link you posted----"At the next junction (mile 6.0), bear left on Hangover Lead Trail # 56 . At mile 6.2, detour right 0.3 miles to The Hangover for great views of lakes and ridges. "

it dead ends at the top of hangover so one would have to backtrack to complete that loop in the link....

Tipi Walter

11-20-2019, 12:57

Yep, there was a sharp switchback to the right (we were descending from Saddle Tree toward Big Fat) at a rock, so we continued straight on the rock to that amazing view and then saw a false trail leading down into really thick Rhodo/laurel. Real pain in the ass. Had to backtrack and only then saw the switchback we missed.

Hold up, though. I thought that view after the tricky switchback WAS the "HANGOVER" view? Is it not? I saw something about a spur trail from Saddle Tree that dead ends at a view, but we missed that completely (I don't recall seeing a short spur on my map). I just assumed the Hangover lead trail (#56) was the view.

Does the Cherohala close in the winter like parts of the BRP? Wondering where to start/end in Feb...

Tipi, I may have posted about it, but no trip report. I did this loop the last week of July. https://www.hikingproject.com/trail/7027638/slickrock-and-citico-wilderness-loop
Didn't see another person for 3 days. Thousands of bees up on the ridge having a feast on the neck-high purple flowers (joe pie weed?). Bear sighting at the campsite at the top of the Big Stack Gap trail (#139). Amazing campsite. From Fodderstack all the way back to the car on the "old bmt?" there was neck-high weeds, especially bad on the old roadbed sections, and tons of stinging nettle destroying my legs.

The actual Hangover overlook is higher than the overlook in my picture---significantly higher. It's off the spur trail in Saddle Tree Gap---Here's a pic of the real Hangover---You are looking directly into the Smokies/Gregory Bald and Mt LeConte towards the top right. Below is Calderwood Lake/near Fontana Lake/Dam.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpack-2015-Trips-161/Welcome-to-2015/i-Lj35xQR/0/b3a41631/XL/Trip%20161%20131-XL.jpg

i dont think it officially closes as opposed to be more like---"the snow is so deep, that i cant get through without a 4X4".....

i have been up there and driving through it with a sedan with 3-4 inches on ground.........

Sadly the Cherohala Skyway stays open all year long but in the winter the godawful roaring and screaming motorcyclists aren't out racing the thing.

that spur trail from saddle tree gap that goes up to the rocks-----that's the hangover....

Yes, as in my above pic. It's off the main BMT route so if backpackers want to see it they need to blue blaze about a quarter mile to the overlook---perhaps the best view in the Southeast.

Tipi Walter

11-20-2019, 13:21

Okay Madfarmer---I got your route---

** Beech Gap Entrance/54A South to Bob Bald.
** Seven Mile Ridge (what is also called Trail 53) East to Hangover Mt.
** Down Hangover Lead South to Big Fat Gap/Big Fat down to Slickrock Creek.

** Slickrock trail to Wildcat Falls.
** Up Big Stack trail to Fodderstack Ridge.
** South on Fodder Ridge past Cherry Log Gap to "BMT Connector" trail.
** Trail 149 to Cold Spring Gap.
** Out to Beech Gap.

I just got back from an October trip and pulled Big Stack down to Slickrock Creek etc.

The last time I pulled Fodderstack Ridge trail it was in terrible shape and full of thickets and blowdowns and almost impenetrable brush. Here's the ridge trail near Glenn Gap---

Welcome to the Citico---
https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpack-2015-Trips-161/20-Days-on-Medicare/i-jWJPSKM/0/669b5c8a/XL/TRIP%20166%20479-XL.jpg

CalebJ

11-20-2019, 14:30

TW - do you have much trouble keeping track of the trail when it gets that bad?

Tipi Walter

11-20-2019, 14:58

TW - do you have much trouble keeping track of the trail when it gets that bad?

Sometimes I get a little turned around but in the pic you can see the "obvious" foot trail underneath all the crap. It's slow going of course but I carry Felco pruners on all my trips and cut as I go---all backpackers should carry pruners in the summer etc.

And as you know the trail itself is more packed and feels more solid under foot so you know when you're on the trail vs off trail.

TNhiker

11-20-2019, 15:27

Tipi Walter

11-20-2019, 16:31

on some of the trails in that area----there are some faint, probably decades old blazes along with some ax marks in the trees.....along with some years old ribbons in some places as well...

those are what i was following for brush mountain for the last 2 miles or so getting to the top.....

Thanks for bringing up Brush Mt---a Citico trail which is a whole other ball of wax from all the other Citico trails. Every time I backpack Brush I put up new ribbon from top to bottom---and the stuff you saw probably was my contribution.

And in fact the top section of Brush from 149 down about a mile is sometimes very difficult to follow---and then you climb hard on Satan's Tit and the very steep and very faint trail down to Bug Hollow and beyond to Testicle Creek etc. (Not names on anyone's map except for my map, thank you). This drop is the steepest part of the whole trail.

Some neato Brush pics for drooling purposes---

45871
Ripped out bottom Brush trailpost thrown into South Fork Creek. Vandalism is common on the Brush trailposts.

45872
The engine block on the bottom part of the Brush Mt trail---it's now been moved and hidden.

45873
Me somewhere on the Brush trail.

45874
If you're gonna backpack the Brush make sure you bring trail tools.

45875
The top trailhead to Brush Mt in Citico. Yes, the trail leaves right from my pack and behind the post. Have fun, boys.

45876
About 2 miles from the top you fall steeply off Satan's Tit and reach this little gap---I call it Bug Hollow Camp.

TNhiker

11-20-2019, 16:45

Every time I backpack Brush I put up new ribbon from top to bottom---and the stuff you saw probably was my contribution.

i havent been back up there since my first time in either 2013 or 2014....

the ribbons i was following were sun faded and looked to be years old.......

Tipi Walter

11-20-2019, 16:51

New ones are up now.

Dogwood

11-20-2019, 17:04

Satan's Tit, Bug Hollow, Testicle Crk

TNhiker

11-20-2019, 17:15

New ones are up now.

nice....

if i ever get back into backpacking---i wanna stroll along brush mountain for a few hours......

maybe even get lost.....

Tipi Walter

11-20-2019, 18:18

nice....

if i ever get back into backpacking---i wanna stroll along brush mountain for a few hours......

maybe even get lost.....

A crew of high school kids backpacked down Brush Mt last year and got lost and had to bushwhack down off the trail to South Fork Creek and popped out on the SF trail.

The Brush trail is sandwiched between the North Fork above and the South Fork below so it depends which way you bushwhack to reach either creek.

TNhiker

11-20-2019, 18:26

The Brush trail is sandwiched between the North Fork above and the South Fork below so it depends which way you bushwhack to reach either creek.

yeah..........

that's what was going through my mind when i wrote the lost part....

either way, still going to hit a creek and get out.........

Tipi Walter

11-20-2019, 18:31

yeah..........

that's what was going through my mind when i wrote the lost part....

either way, still going to hit a creek and get out.........

But it won't be fun. Here's a typical Brush Mt blowdown . . . on the actual trail---

https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpack-2018-Trips-188-/22-Days-in-the-Cold/i-kjcKHzQ/0/8f0e1f37/XL/Trip%20189%20%28382%29-XL.jpg

Traffic Jam

11-20-2019, 18:37

Ashepabst

11-22-2019, 10:59

Do you have an online trip report or pics of your Citico trip? I'd like to see it.

It sounds like you got lost on the switchback going up to Hangover Mt on the Hangover Lead South trail from Big Fat Gap to the Hangover (now it's part of the BMT). What's weird is the very first time I went up this trail I too got lost---and turned right at the Tee instead of left etc. But I ended up at this pretty rock so it wasn't a waste of time---

This pic shows an overlook just below Hangover Mt (and on the "lost" section of the Hangover Lead South trail)--- and looking down into Slickrock Creek valley with Fodderstack Ridge on the left---running from Cherry Log Gap on left to Rockstack Mt and Big Fodderstack Mt as the high teat in the middle of the picture. The ridge continues to the right (north) to Little Fodderstacks and Farr Gap etc.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpacking2010/23-Days-with-Hootyhoo-Sgt-Rock/i-m7sNBCF/0/b3c163cf/L/TRIP%20115%20166-L.jpg

I thought this rock was the Hangover on my first Slickrock trip. Turned around like a half mile too soon

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Tipi Walter

11-22-2019, 13:53

I did the same route as the Mormon group, it’s tough. The only trip that I honestly thought there was a chance that I might die.

I do all my trips in the same area where you "thought there was a chance that I might die." I think that's why my trail journals are so . . . uh . . . weird and twisted.

Pretty much all of Citico/Slickrock has numerous 3,000 foot elevation gains are some crappy trails---but heck you therefore won't see many people.

On my last trip in October I pulled "the hardest trail" in the Southeast---Upper Slickrock Nutbuster---and was greeted by a fellow hiker who didn't make it to the top---and got shrunk up in the process---

https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpack-2019-Trips-195-/47th-Nutbuster-Trail/i-t2t6V9t/0/75fbb33a/XL/Trip%20200%20%28176%29-XL.jpg

Traffic Jam

11-22-2019, 21:24

I do all my trips in the same area where you "thought there was a chance that I might die." I think that's why my trail journals are so . . . uh . . . weird and twisted.

Pretty much all of Citico/Slickrock has numerous 3,000 foot elevation gains are some crappy trails---but heck you therefore won't see many people.

On my last trip in October I pulled "the hardest trail" in the Southeast---Upper Slickrock Nutbuster---and was greeted by a fellow hiker who didn't make it to the top---and got shrunk up in the process---

https://photos.smugmug.com/Backpack-2019-Trips-195-/47th-Nutbuster-Trail/i-t2t6V9t/0/75fbb33a/XL/Trip%20200%20%28176%29-XL.jpg
Having obscure, overgrown trails and not having great maps is very scary. It forces you to use your brain and figure things out. Can’t say I want to repeat the experience but it helped me become a better hiker and boosted my confidence.

(on that trip, it was a magical experience to hear a vixen. It sounded like a screaming woman and initially scared the crap out of me. I cherish that experience and will never forget it.)