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tinybee
01-02-2020, 00:10
Hi everyone,

I am gearing up for my 2020 AT thru hike. I thought I could figure out this puzzle of what to take with me but in the process have become very frustrated. My issue is my pack weight. I am already at 52 lbs (food and water included). I am not sure where/what I should/can cut from my pack. Of course, in my opinion, I NEED everything on the list. Any suggestions on how to whittle this list down would be helpful. I will be starting the trail at the end of February and have tried to account for cold, snow and ice in my gear.

https://lighterpack.com/r/694if5

RockDoc
01-02-2020, 00:34
Well congrats on putting a lot of thought into packing, obviously. I noticed possible duplication in the clothing dept, four hats, two hoodys, more than one wool top, at least two kinds of pants... Yes it's going to be cold and you are wise to prepare, but one idea is to pack a layered outfit that will keep you very warm if you need to put everything on at once (this won't happen often). Perhaps question items that are in addition to that? Mostly, your kit looks pretty well designed, even luxurious.

I don't know what you are bringing for food, but maybe that can be trimmed down (expand or contract that based on resupply distance). And my rule is not to carry water up to water. Study maps and adjust water weight based on what is needed for distance, weather, temp, etc. But you are on the right track!

4eyedbuzzard
01-02-2020, 06:50
1) Start later in warmer weather and you can likely shed 5 lbs of insulation, food, fuel, other gear. Winter hiking means heavier loads. No way around the required gear.
2) Many multiple entries as noted in RockDoc's post, including little things like knives, Bic lighters, etc. - it all adds up.
3) 9 pounds of food is pretty extreme from an average standpoint - usually you'll have maybe four days worth at 1.5 lbs per day leaving town. The average food load obviously goes down as you go. As does the 4+ pounds (2 liters) of water - it's all use as you go, and many places you'll only need to carry 1 liter.
4) 3.34 pounds of electronics? Is it ALL really needed?
5) 1.39 lbs meds/first aid? Is it ALL really needed?
6) All the little things add up, like the foot roller/massager. A water bottle could serve double duty here. Look for other items that are nice, but not needed.
7) Take it all, carry it for a week plus to Franklin, NC, then other than warm stuff and foul weather gear for the Smoky's and TRUE emergency stuff like the epipen, mail home what you haven't used.

NEEDS vs WANTS - explore this concept further ;)

Traffic Jam
01-02-2020, 06:54
Only you can decide what’s necessary for your hike. The best way to figure it out is to go backpacking with your gear (more than once) and then decide what’s necessary. Once you start hiking the AT, you will have opportunities to readjust. Have a great hike!

Two Tents
01-02-2020, 07:06
Leave the bivy, tent foot print and poncho.Take one sleep mattress not both. Only one knife. Filter or drops not both. The 'bella is heavy. Your pack is heavy in my opinion. Are you planning on using the tent only? Not staying in shelters? Have you done an overnight trip with this load? You'll find that you do not need as much as you think you need. I've found this to be true on the trail and well as in life.

4eyedbuzzard
01-02-2020, 07:12
Leave the bivy, tent foot print. Take one sleep mattress not both. Only one knife. The 'bella is heavy. Your pack is heavy in my opinion. Are you planning on using the tent only? Not staying in shelters? Have you done an overnight trip with this load? You'll find that you do not need as much as you think you need. I've found this to be true on the trail and well as in life.

^^^So much truth in this.

Traffic Jam
01-02-2020, 07:27
Leave the bivy, tent foot print and poncho.Take one sleep mattress not both. Only one knife. Filter or drops not both. The 'bella is heavy. Your pack is heavy in my opinion. Are you planning on using the tent only? Not staying in shelters? Have you done an overnight trip with this load? You'll find that you do not need as much as you think you need. I've found this to be true on the trail and well as in life.
I have to disagree, which is why it’s all about personal preference and experience. I always carry two sleep mats when bp’ing in winter because I’m a cold sleeper. :)

Two Tents
01-02-2020, 07:38
I have to disagree, which is why it’s all about personal preference and experience. I always carry two sleep mats when bp’ing in winter because I’m a cold sleeper. :)

I hear ya. If I'm sleeping on the ground in winter then maybe if I did not have an insulated mattress I'd consider a closed cell and an inflatable. If I'm in a shelter then I only need one mattress. If my pack weighed 52 lbs I'd look at any redundancies.

JNI64
01-02-2020, 08:19
Hi everyone,

I am gearing up for my 2020 AT thru hike. I thought I could figure out this puzzle of what to take with me but in the process have become very frustrated. My issue is my pack weight. I am already at 52 lbs (food and water included). I am not sure where/what I should/can cut from my pack. Of course, in my opinion, I NEED everything on the list. Any suggestions on how to whittle this list down would be helpful. I will be starting the trail at the end of February and have tried to account for cold, snow and ice in my gear.

https://lighterpack.com/r/694if5

That's heavy for a tiny bee. I'm not a thru hiker but as said above by some pretty smart folks that's been doing this for awhile, I see alot of redundancy that's really not needed. And by the way! :welcome. !!

Cheyou
01-02-2020, 09:15
Less is more

thom

FreeGoldRush
01-02-2020, 09:46
It’s not nearly as much a survival experience as you may currently imagine. You’re just walking from hotel to motel and hostel to hostel. Staying warm should be priority 1. Starting later in the year makes that a LOT easier. Anything you label as “just in case” should probably be left at home. Start with too little with the expectation of picking it up later if you really need it.

Here are suggestions:

Leave the cup
Pot cozy is too heavy. What’s it made out of?
Leave the aquamira since you have a filter
Leave the compression socks
Leave the knee braces unless you know from experience you need these
Leave the watch. You’ll have a phone.
Leave the gators unless you just really like them. Less to fool with.
8 oz compression sack? Replace with Cuben fiber
Leave the balaclava
Replace gloves. Consider zpacks possum down with rain mitts
Camp shoes too heavy. Go to Walmart. Get the absolute lightest shoes you can find. Will save several ozs.
Hike in shorts. Do not carry insulation for legs except for sleeping. This works down to about 25 F.
Leave the umbrella
Replace rain pants with rain skirt
Leave the micro spikes
Leave the cold weather mitts. Use rain mitts only
Leave the poncho since you have a rain jacket
Leave the portable toilet thing whatever it is
You have two packs of wet wipes. Leave one
Med kit too heavy. Leave most of that. Can detail suggestion in another message.
Leave pepper gel
Knife way too heavy. Get smallest you can find.
Leave camera remote
Leave Hoya filters
Leave extra lenses
Leave lens brush and cloth
Battery WAY too big. I started with a 13000 Ah and finished with a 3500 Ah. You have a 20000
Leave thermometer
Leave the Logitech keyboard. Oh my.
Leave the awol guide. Use PDF version on phone

JC13
01-02-2020, 11:34
Your Reactor liner is ridiculously heavy and might give you an extra 5 degrees of warmth. You could add a 50 degree quilt to put over your Bandit, "should" give you close to 20 degrees of additional warmth and weigh ~11 oz.

peakbagger
01-02-2020, 11:35
The other approach is start with whatever gear you want and plan on stopping at Mountain Crossings and pay them ship a lot of stuff home plus plan on a big credit card bill after they sell you new gear. Some folks skip Mountain crossings and litter the trails and shelters with "essential" stuff they quickly discover is not so essential (don't be one of those folks ). No substitute for experience and that first couple of days with a cinder block of extra gear in your pack is going to give you lots of hard won experience. There is no substitute for experience on the trail in the weather conditions you are encountering. Keep an eye out on what other folks are doing and fairly quickly you will see what you can live without. Some folks make a further gear tweak in Hot Springs or Damascus.

A few comments on the above detailed list. I carry an OR lightweight balaclava pretty much year round and a pair of liner gloves. Both are minimal weight but makes a big difference in heat loss. Ideally if you can cover all your skin even with thin synthetic fiber it dramaticly reduces heat loss when windy. When I do not need the balaclava I roll it up into a beanie (I am mostly bald on top of my head so I need a bit of extra coverage ;) ) . I leave the filter and go with Aquamira, water sources are plentiful in the spring and once you figure out the tricks for getting clean water to begin with aquamira works with a bit of planning. If you want carry a life straw to get that quick initial sip out of the spring but just plan to always stay one bottle ahead.

Dirty Girl type gators that cover the gap between the top of the hiking shoe or boot and the sock is all you need. Standard gaiters are heavy and overkill unless you plan to be trudging through snow drifts. Learn how to "bread bag" your feet, put a thin pair of liner socks on then slide a bread bag over your foot then slide a standard sock over that. it keeps your feet warmer for minimal weight. Just make sure in typical wet spring that you let your feet dry out at night.

Strategic
01-02-2020, 12:13
All good advice above about shedding weight by eliminating extras and redundancies. Something else you might want to think about is looking at your big four again. You have a lot of weight in your pack, shelter, and sleep system. Start with the pack, which is pretty heavy at 64oz. Look into a lighter option, like one of the ULA packs (https://www.ula-equipment.com/products/packs/) (a Circuit, for instance, has a larger capacity but still weighs 23oz less.) You can get all the features of the Osprey in a much lighter package. Ditch the fanny pack, since any decent pack will have hipbelt pockets sufficient for what you're listing as carrying in it. Likewise, cut down on your shelter's weight by switching to a lighter alternative, like one of the light Tarptent models (https://www.tarptent.com/tents/). You could drop as much as 29oz by switching to something like the Aeon. Get rid of the redundancy in your sleep system. You're already using a 20* quilt and inflatable matt in the Bandit/Vector combo. With the listed sleep clothes, you'll be good down to about 10* (or lower) so there's no need for the liner or the Z-lite. Just getting rid of them saves you another 27.5oz without even needing to buy other gear. Put just those three suggestions together and you could drop just shy of 5lbs off your base weight. Couple that with the kind of trimming that other people have suggested above and you could easily get your total weight down to somewhere around 20lbs (minus food and water) and make your hike a lot less burdensome.

Slo-go'en
01-02-2020, 14:22
I have like five pair of long gaiters cuz I figure I don't need them and then find out I do. They go a long way in keeping the bottoms of your pants clean and dry and duff out of the boots. It's not so much snow you need them for, but wet, muddy trail and there will be a lot of that until you get into VA.

tinybee
01-02-2020, 15:31
Thanks so much for all of your helpful suggestions! You have made some good points. I am always planning for "just in case" and "what if" which I don't think is necessarily a bad thing. I just have to temper it a little. :) I will definitely use your suggestions to lighten my load as well as re-examine how necessary some of my pack items are.

Additional suggestions are welcomed!

Slo-go'en
01-02-2020, 19:39
When all the "what if" and "just in case" stuff pushes the pack weight up over 50 pounds, that is not a good thing.

Ideally, you want to shoot for about a 25 pound base weight. (no food or water). Your at just under 33 now, so you don't have to skimp on too much extra stuff. Realistically, your not going to be carrying 17 pounds of food and water at once. But you will hit the low to mid 40's though and that is still a heavy load to lug any distance up hill. In the rain. Through the mud.

Your basic gear list looks pretty generic. Any changes there is nit picking clothes options or replacing hardware at great expense, not likely an option at this point.

You need to pare down all the little optional things. There are items in your list which you might eventually want, but not right now in the cooler weather.

BTW, I don't think I saw sun block on your list. That's one thing a lot of people forget. There will be no shade until well into April or early May. While you might go days and days without seeing that bright light in the sky, when it does appear, it doesn't take long to burn.

The best thing to do is load up all the stuff on your list into the pack (and see if it actually fits) and go for a one or two night hike near your home. It looks like a quick run up the interstate and you'd be in the SNP. If you don't use something at least once during the hike, you don't need it.

I keep all my little odds and ends in a 24 oz Rubbermaid rectangular food container. It keeps everything in one place and is water proof. Fully loaded, it weighs about a pound of "what if?" stuff and spare parts. It comes into the tent with me at night.

Old Hillwalker
01-02-2020, 20:49
Shades of Minnesota Smith.

Traffic Jam
01-02-2020, 20:57
I can’t help myself...ditch the tampons and get a Diva cup.

(That’s life-changing advice that will affect you long after your thru hike is completed.)

4eyedbuzzard
01-02-2020, 20:59
Shades of Minnesota Smith.Hardly. Only one roll of mountain money. Winton Porter reported that MS had 9. Plus a few other odds and ends. Mostly odds...

George
01-02-2020, 21:11
Shades of Minnesota Smith.

but, he got it done

4eyedbuzzard
01-02-2020, 21:33
but, he got it doneThis is true. But I'd hesitate to recommend that anyone emulate his behavior.

Traffic Jam
01-02-2020, 22:23
This is true. But I'd hesitate to recommend that anyone emulate his behavior.
No one can predict who will have a successful thru hike. We think we know what’s best and what it takes to succeed but we are wrong. We are arrogant.

SkeeterPee
01-02-2020, 22:27
Good Luck Tinybee. I'm leaving 2/10 and started with a 42 lb pack. I have been able to take out 6 lbs so far and plan to do one more pass at trying to reduce items. When it finally warms up I should be able to reduce about 5 lbs in extra sleeping pad, extra quilt to supplement a 20F bag, microspikes and other things. I am looking forward to sending those home!


Some things I eliminated.

eliminated 1 full set of clothes, but kept the socks so I have 3 pair total. I figure I could add a few more clothing items in late spring, but for now I wear the same thing every day. to hike I have one base layer, a short sleeve shirt to add some body warmth, a fleece, and my rain coat. At camp I have a puffy to wear.

I decided to eliminate the wet wipes, unless I find I do not like this. I plan to just wet tp so that can go right in the privy, no reason to carryout. I will take a few dry wysi wipes at 2gm each just in case. those have to be packed, so I will have few small ziplocks to take them out with the trash. overall less wipes and baggies.

I am leaving the picaridin at home until probably April. I don't think we ill see any in February/March and you can always find some in town when they appear.

Do you need Clorox wipes or would just one type of wipe work.

Do you need to bring some items like PI wipes. I've not gotten PI from hiking, just working in my wooded back yard. You have several items which people don't need in most cases, but you have to decide what to need from the start vs what you could pick up at the next resupply.

Do you need a paper guide? I will carry pdfs of both guides on my phone at zero extra weight. I also downloaded various atc pages and took pictures of National park info.

Good luck, i'm sure you will find things you don't need. I've been training with 38 - 40 lbs in my pack. Currently about 36 with 5 days food and 1ltr water. (at winter temps I can walk 8 miles with 1 liter so I am sure I will find water.)

Can someone send you a box in case you eliminate things you want? I'm planning to send myself a box with some of the eliminated items to Fontana dam as I leave. then I can bounce them forward or home if I do not need them at all.

Time Zone
01-02-2020, 23:44
I plan to just wet tp so that can go right in the privy, no reason to carryout.

Practice this at home first several times, and see how you do. TP is designed to disintegrate when wet. It may not stay adequately together for your intended purpose.

SkeeterPee
01-02-2020, 23:50
Practice this at home first several times, and see how you do. TP is designed to disintegrate when wet. It may not stay adequately together for your intended purpose. I do this at home so it works with good tp, but I should probably try with the 1 ply stuff you can usually find in single rolls on the trail.

ghetto-okie
01-03-2020, 01:05
IMO, I'd probably keep the brace and the compression socks.

Siestita
01-03-2020, 04:10
Every ounce adds up, so I'll question taking two Sham Wows. One is listed under "Shelter" and the other one as "Packed Clothes". For me one of them would serve both purposes. And, those, like the 'camp towels' that many people buy, those Sham Wows may be larger than necessary.

I've always carried a "camp towel" purchased at outdoor stores, but I imagine a Sham Wow would work just as well. But for me, even the smallest camp towels that I see sold are larger than what I need (and choose to carry). Using a pair of scissors to reduce the towel's size resolves the issue. My current "camp towel" measures just 20 inches long by 4 inches wide. That works fine for soaking up condensation or rain water within my tent, for use as a wash rag, and also for drying my body. Yes, carrying a larger camp towel would occasionally make it possible for me to dry myself off more quickly after showering, but I accept that inconvenience in order to get some weight reduction.

When it's dry, my cut down camp towel weighs just 1/10 of an ounce. But after use it remains damp, even after I've squeezed out as much water as possible. So, the little towel goes back into my pack quite heavy, then weighing about 1/3 oz. I wonder how much two full sized 1 Oz. Sham Wows together weigh after they've become damp.

4eyedbuzzard
01-03-2020, 06:46
..........

kestral
01-03-2020, 11:14
Many great suggestions, a few small adds...

Is the sham wow the towel that gets hard when dry? Usually stays wet and slimy and heavy. I hated mine. Got a microfiber wash cloth which worked better.

No Clorox bleach towelettes.

I loved my baby wipes, but I dehydrated them prior to trip (hot car or low oven) would add warm water on trail for a lovely evening cat bath, then nighttime hot cocoa. They become amazingly light.

Get comfortable with toilet kit (female urinary diversion tool) prior to trip, also diva cup or similar for menstruation

i love a book at night (ebook on devices already carried)

start Very slow to prevent injuries. No shame in sending back extra stuff at mountain crossings.

You will see lots of different gear and get lots of solicited and even more unsolicited advise on gear choices when you are on trail. Especially being female from men. They generally mean well. Everything from ultralight highest tech to super heavy winter military, and then some guy with a shower curtain and rotisserie chicken in a Walmart bag, wearing Levi’s, cowboy boots and a leather jacket (yup I met him too) not sure which if any finished, but they were all glad to be starting.

did you have a headlamp? Missed that.

Mostly have fun !!!

tinybee
01-03-2020, 13:31
Thanks RockDoc. I will take a look at the hat situation. I also need to pull together exactly what specific items I will be bringing along for food. Point taken about carrying water up to water.

tinybee
01-03-2020, 13:36
I will comb through my list and get rid of some of the redundancies. Food weight is also something I will reduce. I will use the 1.5 lbs per day suggested. I can reduce the electronics; not worth all the weight. As far as the med kit and first aid, I am not sure where to cut. I am only taking minimal amounts of each med. I agree that foot roller can probably go and not sure how the bottle of water would work for the same purpose unless frozen. I am definitely re-evaluation my wants vs needs~ Thanks

tinybee
01-03-2020, 13:39
Hi Two Tents. My thoughts with the foam sleep mattress and the blow up is that if the blow up goes out in the middle of the night (as I have often heard people speak of), at least I would have something to carry me over. In addition to the added barrier to the coldness of the ground when there is snow or it is really cold outside. I agree that it is a lot of additional weight. Is there some lighter weight option to the foam mattress that you could suggest? And still trying to pare down load quickly so that I can get out with it asap.

tinybee
01-03-2020, 13:40
Yes. I am a cold sleeper as well. :)

tinybee
01-03-2020, 13:43
That's heavy for a tiny bee.

Ha ha! :) Thank you

tinybee
01-03-2020, 13:50
In regards to the gloves, I actually purchased those from Zpacks. They did not work for me. The pot cozy seems to be the thing to use to maintain heat. I will adjust the weight after I make i out of the Reflectix material. The "portable toilet" will hopefully prevent me from having to go out in freezing cold and rain to use the bathroom. I am also looking into downsizing my battery. Great suggestions! I will definitely use some of them.

trailmercury
01-03-2020, 13:52
Many great suggestions, a few small adds...

Is the sham wow the towel that gets hard when dry? Usually stays wet and slimy and heavy. I hated mine. Got a microfiber wash cloth which worked better.










nope, does not harden.

I get two generous camp towels by cutting of one of these in half:

https://harborfreight.com/home-outdoor/cleaning/rags-towels/3-sq-ft-synthetic-drying-towel-60400.html

Dries fast!

It's a hiker trash version of a brand name Camp Towel!

trailmercury
01-03-2020, 13:54
also here:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B013CZN24A/ref=sspa_dk_detail_3?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B013CZN24A&pd_rd_w=BNqon&pf_rd_p=45a72588-80f7-4414-9851-786f6c16d42b&pd_rd_wg=l4UI7&pf_rd_r=VWAK0GZ4SHZ1PDDH8212&pd_rd_r=e2b65527-6f3a-4237-95e3-9916449e93bd&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUEzN1lYWUlPVDZHQ0pRJ mVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwNTM1MTYxMkZHVEpSSlg3SUxPSiZlbmN yeXB0ZWRBZElkPUEwNTQyODk5MVJKWDY3RkEwQzZIWCZ3aWRnZ XROYW1lPXNwX2RldGFpbCZhY3Rpb249Y2xpY2tSZWRpcmVjdCZ kb05vdExvZ0NsaWNrPXRydWU=

tinybee
01-03-2020, 13:54
Thanks for the advice peakbagger. It is my goal to not start out with a bunch of stuff that I will not need. I will need a bit of "extra coverage" as well. My hair is very short. ;) The gators are a what if item. If there is snow in the early part of the trail, I saw that as a way to protect my feet and lower legs. And I like the bread bag suggestion. I will use that if necessary.

tinybee
01-03-2020, 13:55
Yes. The Reactor is heavy. I am definitely carrying the fear of being uncomfortably cold.

Slo-go'en
01-03-2020, 13:57
There is something of a trade off between how much water to carry and how often to stop to get water. I rarely treat or filter water so unless the water is a long way off and down a steep hill, I'll stop for a drink along the way.

I've given up on the so called "camp towels". "Absorbs 10X it's weight in water". Which isn't much water. I just use my bandana of which I carry at least 2 of anyway.

Shaking your tent will remove as much or more water as wiping it down with a towel will. And then you got a wet towel to carry.

tinybee
01-03-2020, 14:01
I agree. My big four are pretty darn heavy. You have provided a lot of good suggestions. But at this point, for much of the bigger items, returning them is not an option. I would have to shell out more money to have another tent or quilt. I have to work with what I have. Ultimately, as you said though, I do want to make the hike a lot less burdensome and may see about trying to change out the backpack for another one that REI offers that is equally as comfortable.

tinybee
01-03-2020, 14:02
TrafficJam, that was the goal. But "training" has not been going so well. User error I guess. But will try again!

tinybee
01-03-2020, 14:07
That was my initial goal! How ever did I end up so far away? :) I will blame it on what if and just in case. LOL. Still, I will get this pack weight down to something more comfortable. Point taken about items I might need when it is not as cold and leaving them until later. In regards to the sun block, I don't wear it at all. I have an allergic reaction to it. Any suggestions to what I might use in place of the standard zinc oxide type sun screens? And I will examine the Rubbermaid container option as well. Thanks!

tinybee
01-03-2020, 14:08
Just noticed that you can't see what posts I was responding to unless I included the quote. Sorry!

tinybee
01-03-2020, 14:13
Good Luck Tinybee. I'm leaving 2/10 and started with a 42 lb pack. I have been able to take out 6 lbs so far and plan to do one more pass at trying to reduce items. When it finally warms up I should be able to reduce about 5 lbs in extra sleeping pad, extra quilt to supplement a 20F bag, microspikes and other things. I am looking forward to sending those home!


Some things I eliminated.

eliminated 1 full set of clothes, but kept the socks so I have 3 pair total. I figure I could add a few more clothing items in late spring, but for now I wear the same thing every day. to hike I have one base layer, a short sleeve shirt to add some body warmth, a fleece, and my rain coat. At camp I have a puffy to wear.

I decided to eliminate the wet wipes, unless I find I do not like this. I plan to just wet tp so that can go right in the privy, no reason to carryout. I will take a few dry wysi wipes at 2gm each just in case. those have to be packed, so I will have few small ziplocks to take them out with the trash. overall less wipes and baggies.

I am leaving the picaridin at home until probably April. I don't think we ill see any in February/March and you can always find some in town when they appear.

Do you need Clorox wipes or would just one type of wipe work.

Do you need to bring some items like PI wipes. I've not gotten PI from hiking, just working in my wooded back yard. You have several items which people don't need in most cases, but you have to decide what to need from the start vs what you could pick up at the next resupply.

Do you need a paper guide? I will carry pdfs of both guides on my phone at zero extra weight. I also downloaded various atc pages and took pictures of National park info.

Good luck, i'm sure you will find things you don't need. I've been training with 38 - 40 lbs in my pack. Currently about 36 with 5 days food and 1ltr water. (at winter temps I can walk 8 miles with 1 liter so I am sure I will find water.)

Can someone send you a box in case you eliminate things you want? I'm planning to send myself a box with some of the eliminated items to Fontana dam as I leave. then I can bounce them forward or home if I do not need them at all.

Thanks for the well wishes! And good luck to you as well SKeeterPee. I will leave the bottle of Picardin and maybe just take on packet. The clorox wipes are for hostels and as needed and not for my skin. I will definitely enlist help from home to send things to me on the trail.

tinybee
01-03-2020, 14:16
Thanks Siestita. I have cut the ShamWow pieces down. Personal preference to use two separate towels. I may try to look for a lighter option for one or the other though.

SkeeterPee
01-03-2020, 14:20
Hi Two Tents. My thoughts with the foam sleep mattress and the blow up is that if the blow up goes out in the middle of the night (as I have often heard people speak of), at least I would have something to carry me over. In addition to the added barrier to the coldness of the ground when there is snow or it is really cold outside. I agree that it is a lot of additional weight. Is there some lighter weight option to the foam mattress that you could suggest? And still trying to pare down load quickly so that I can get out with it asap.

I had he same debate and posted a thread about the pad question. https://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php/135593-Ground-cover-closed-cell-foam-pad-needed-for-winter-hiking?p=2260720&highlight=#post2260720

Here is a link on R-values https://sectionhiker.com/sleeping-pad-r-values/

your pad and mine are both about the same. yours is rated at 30F by manufacture, mine at 32F. So neither are warm enough for winter camping. you could get a warmer pad, but then you have nothing to fall back on if it leaks. So I am taking zlite and an inflatable. when it warms up I will swap the zlite with a thin 1/8 inch gossamer gear pad for the zlite.

tinybee
01-03-2020, 14:21
Hi kestral! I know exactly the towel you are speaking of. I hated it and switched over to the ShamWow. BTW, the nighttime hot cocoa and the evening cat bath sound wonderful! I do have a Black Diamond headlamp that is listed. I am looking at options for making that lighter with a different band but starting to wonder of those point x ounces are worth the time. You have a cool sense of humor :)

trailmercury
01-03-2020, 14:24
a single 13.5 in x 20 in "Shammy" is a buck at Dollar Tree.
I think this is actually where I got mine, not Harbor Freight or Amazon

Put the chlorox wipes in a bounce box if you are only using at a hostel.

tinybee
01-03-2020, 14:45
Does anyone have any suggestions on reducing the weight of my med kit? Also, I have heard of people taking Doxycycline with them on their hike. Is this typical? I can't seem to get a prescription from my doctor. I am aware that treatment can require different doses. My concern is that if I do need to take the medication that I might be too far out from a pharmacy/2-3 days from a town.

trailmercury
01-03-2020, 14:59
Does anyone have any suggestions on reducing the weight of my med kit? Also, I have heard of people taking Doxycycline with them on their hike. Is this typical? I can't seem to get a prescription from my doctor. I am aware that treatment can require different doses. My concern is that if I do need to take the medication that I might be too far out from a pharmacy/2-3 days from a town.

Find a new doctor, Some provider in your area should be able to prescribe you the Doxy and devise a plan on exactly when you would use it.

SkeeterPee
01-03-2020, 17:08
Does anyone have any suggestions on reducing the weight of my med kit? Also, I have heard of people taking Doxycycline with them on their hike. Is this typical? I can't seem to get a prescription from my doctor. I am aware that treatment can require different doses. My concern is that if I do need to take the medication that I might be too far out from a pharmacy/2-3 days from a town.

My doctor would not give me antibiotics either. You have time to get to town and see a doctor if you are sick.

You have to decide what you need. I am taking my prescription meds and a few over the counter. I saw an EpiPen on your list, is that for you or someone else. You probably want to teach someone in your tramily how to use it in case you can't.

think how often you would use these items. There are very few places you could not get to town the same day or next. It seems like you cross a couple roads most days.

your list
Anbesol
Imodium AD
Benadryl
Iron Tablets
Aleve
Vitamin D
AZO Urinary Pain Relief
Burts Bees Lip Balm
Aquaphor Lip Repair
Twinject Epi/Auvi-Q
Neosporin
Cortizone
IvyX Towelettes
ids, Gauze Pad, Cleansing Wipes, Alcohol Prep
Leukotape
Duct Tape
Needles, Safety Pins, Floss Thread
Tear Aid Patch and Nemo Pad Patch Tent/Mattress Repair Kit
SOL Bivvy
Medical Gloves

my list
Imodium AD a few
Benadryl a few
Ibuprophen can replenish as needed
Tylenol can replenish as needed
Burts Bees Lip Balm
Neosporin - just removed from kit. have not used in hundreds of miles of hiking. will have soap/water, and sanitizer
Band Aids, Gauze Pad just a few
Tenacious Tape
Needles, Safety Pins, Floss Thread

Slo-go'en
01-03-2020, 18:32
Allergic to sun block? Then cover up. Get a wide brim hat or use the umbrella. Work on your tan now.


My odds and ends list is similar to SkeeterPee's.


Mostly what you need to treat are blisters and pain.

For blisters I use New Skin. Much more effective then any type of pad. It seals the wound, disinfects and stays put.

Generic aspirin is my pain killer of choice, but I usually have some Ibuprofen mixed in. I try to use them sparingly.

Benadryl is new to my med kit, but am finding it good to have.

You'll be in a winter dead zone for several months, so it's unlikely you'll need Aleve or the epi pen. It's unlikely you'll encounter any bees for quite some time.

I have a small pair of scissors in my sew kit, which can come in handy. Be sure to keep a thimble in the sew kit too, so you can patch heavy material. I also have a needle threader thingie, which is indispensable.

Always have a spare lighter. I learned the hard way why that's important.

Finally, the patch kit for the air pad (10 years of heavy use and haven't needed it yet) and some tenacious tape.

I'm not a heavy phone user so a 5500 ma/hr battery pack is enough for me. 2A wall charger and cord. Spare set of earbuds.

All this goes into the Rubbermaid container.

Hand wipes are more effective then hand sanitizer, which actually does more harm then good.

I carry a small bar of Ivory soap and a little shampoo. Nothing is worse then getting to a hostel and finding out all the soap is used up. If there is soap, it's usually some cheap body wash and I much prefer bar soap. Once out of the frequent hostel areas down south, you can occasionally score a shower at a campground, but have to supply soap. So, good idea to have some on hand.

greentick
01-03-2020, 19:25
Shades of Minnesota Smith.

Whoa! haven't heard that in a while... canned octopus?

greentick
01-03-2020, 20:37
I use my z-rest as a sit pad. I keep it strapped to the top of my pack so I can pull it off easy if I want to sit on it. Unfortunately I have had 3 separate inflatables fail me and I do not trust them anymore (I'm reasonably sized: 6-3, 215).

When I started hiking my previous "backpacking" was with Uncle Sam, weights up to 126lbs was the most I carried (not counting boomstick and LBE). You learn to live sparsely because your personal comfort items are the only thing you can cut.

My first 3 day hike (after doing a lot of reading (in this very forum most of the time) I was culled down to about 35lbs. I'm not going to go into specifics but there was a lot of redundancies. On the AT there is very little that so critical that you need double. Anyhow, I learned 90-95% of what I needed to learn on that single 3-day hike. Gradual application of cash and knowledge has me down to less than 25lbs with 3 days of food, 2.5L of water, and will take me to 0*. That includes a few "luxury" items like insulated coffee mug, coffee, an 8oz FAK/survival items, and bourbon.

Pack all your stuff up and do a 3 day hike. As previously mentioned, you may find you can ditch some of your "walking" clothes. You will also ID a lot of things you can drop.

Read up as much as you can, knowledge weighs nothing.

RockDoc
01-04-2020, 17:32
I agree. I think that if you get out and hike your kit will sort itself out.

When you return home, mark on the list what was used or not; you'll find much is not used and can go, unless it is first aid or emergency gear.

sketcher709
01-04-2020, 19:29
Don't leave your microspikes behind. When you reach that one gnarly and icy spot even if it gets you across a 20' patch safely, they will have been worth the weight.

Siestita
01-05-2020, 00:44
These items are listed within your "Medical/Edmergency" category:

SOL Bivvy
Medical Gloves

I understand why professional first responders carry medical gloves with them and it may be appropriate to include them in first aid kits that are carried by group leaders. But, as an ordinary long distance hiker, how likely are you to actually use those medical gloves? And, since you'll be taking a tent, why additionally carry the SOL bivvy?

Traveler
01-05-2020, 09:50
I agree. I think that if you get out and hike your kit will sort itself out.

When you return home, mark on the list what was used or not; you'll find much is not used and can go, unless it is first aid or emergency gear.

This!

Take your spreadsheet, jam all that stuff into a pack and go out for three days of a moving backpacking trip that requires at least 2 (3 or more would be better) camp set up/break downs and at least 7 miles between them that will include climbs and descents that are fairly robust. Use the spreadsheet to keep track of equipment, clothing, and other items you use during the shakedown hike. If something is not used, or only used once, it's probably not going to make it too far past the 3rd night hiker box or 5th day to a town to ship gear home on a thru hike.

The value of an extended shakedown hike is to help determine your current level of physical capability as it relates to hiking with weight over long distances. It can be difficult to assess what level of pack weight would be tolerable in the static environment of home or short day hikes. Carrying weight beyond one's capability typically takes a few days to demonstrate itself over an extended period of hiking that includes climbing/descending significant slopes, scrambling over difficult terrain, dealing with bad weather, and setting up/breaking down camp. This will be the hard nosed judge of what you will likely be able to successfully carry in a through hike. My guess is your experience will be like mine, somewhere around hour 5 on day one you will start daydreaming about removing some clothing from the pack, on day two you will probably start reducing carried water load, and looking forward to evening mealtime to reduce weight by a little bit in food consumption, by the end of day three you will have a very good idea of what you cannot live without (needs) and what you would like to carry (wants).

In a thru hike, your physical condition will greatly improve as it applies to long distance hiking. However getting your pack and contents dialed into a sustainable weight for your current condition will be a tremendous value in that conditioning, developing your "trail legs" and improve your physical conditioning without strains, sprains, or joint impact heavy loads create over long periods of time.

Good luck!

rickb
01-05-2020, 11:05
My doctor would not give me antibiotics either. You have time to get to town and see a doctor if you are sick.




The biggest health risk on the Trail is Lyme Disease.

I would highly recommend that everyone read up on this from multiple sources, as well as discuss with a Lyme-savy physician so as to have a plan of action ready should they discover an embedded tick. A tick should nothing to freak out over, but needs to be something everyone is ready to deal with.

IMO one’s plan should be formulated IN ADVANCE OF STEPPING ONE FOOT ON THE TRAIL, and consider the full range all reasonable scenarios.

If that plan includes a FAST prophylactic course of Doxy you may conclude a couple pills are something one should secure in advance. On the other hand, if you conclude that such a course of action would not be right for you, that is OK too. Just consider options now. If for no other reason than being confident in your decision when the time comes.

BUT I do think there is one REQUiRED element of a first aid kit:

Something better than tweezers on a leatherman micra or Swiss Army knife to remove ticks

I have dug some rather ugly holes to get out all the bits left after using tweezers (incorrectly?) but I had great results with “Tick Twister” after finding one in a particularly difficult and sensitive spot.

I also carry good tweezers, but will never be without one of those miracle devises — almost too good to be true (but this is based on a single experience using one, YMMV).

rickb
01-05-2020, 11:30
Also probably a good idea to have a plan for blister care in your medical kit.

Perhaps you do already with the duct tape and all. I still believe moleskin has a place, but am probably living in the dark ages.

Speaking of the dark ages, is Tetanus still a thing? I recently ran a cut coat hanger through my finger and was surprised to learn that I had not had a booster in more than 20 years — just assumed I was up to date but time flies.

kestral
01-05-2020, 11:37
I’m a nurse. The “ fish” antibiotics are the exact same thing as what the local pharmacy supplies. If you have insurance it won’t work, but you don’t need a prescription.

I have have very mixed feelings about antibiotics available without prescription, but it is an option.

https://www.heartlandvetsupply.com/p-5710-fish-doxycycline-capsules.aspx

Patrickjd9
01-05-2020, 16:47
Med kit too heavy. Leave most of that.
Knife way too heavy. Get smallest you can find.
Leave the awol guide. Use PDF version on phone

You've definitely gotten good advice here. I did take notice of several things.

My current first aid kit is one of these, but I suspect I could cut back.

https://www.rei.com/product/695383/adventure-medical-kits-ultralightwatertight-7-medical-kit

I've always used a very small, lightweight knife. This is my current one:

https://www.opinel-usa.com/collections/opinel-carbon-blades/products/opinel-no-6-carbon-steel-blade

On the guide, you can also carry photocopied sections in a plastic cover/ziplock, or simply cut it up and have it sent to you as needed.

A silk/cotton liner is dead weight if it gets wet. You also list an emergency bivy, which appears to be reusable. It's OK to use it if you get too cold. A 30 degree quilt might need some supplementing through March, but a 20 degree should be good just with your long underwear. You can always wear your fleece jacket to bed, and wearing a knit hat is a given.

I'm hardly someone with ultralight gear, but my base weight for March on the AT would be 21.5-22 pounds.

Good luck from a (recent) Richmond local!

tinybee
01-05-2020, 20:35
I appreciate that you all have taken the time to help me get my packing weight down. I am considering all of your suggestions and have begun to lighten my load little by little. I agree with Traveler that a 2-3 day shakedown hike will really help me identify what I don't need.

Deadeye
01-05-2020, 22:08
Lots of good ideas already out there. Here's what I used as a guide to get my pack down to it's current base weight of 12-15 pounds depending on season:

https://www.backpacking.net/27-pound.html#pack

I don't feel like I'm ultralight, or deprived at all. I hike & camp comfortably in all sorts of weather. I do carry an umbrella and highly recommend it.

rickb
01-08-2020, 13:49
I’m a nurse. The “ fish” antibiotics are the exact same thing as what the local pharmacy supplies. If you have insurance it won’t work, but you don’t need a prescription.

I have have very mixed feelings about antibiotics available without prescription, but it is an option.

https://www.heartlandvetsupply.com/p-5710-fish-doxycycline-capsules.aspx



With all due respect, this strikes me as a horrible idea.

George
01-08-2020, 23:12
With all due respect, this strikes me as a horrible idea.

besides almost certainly being a felony

Paleolith54
01-08-2020, 23:53
besides almost certainly being a felony

Buying fish antibiotics online? A felony? How did you come up with that nonsense, and why would you post it?

Traveler
01-09-2020, 08:42
The issue of physicians providing prophylactic prescription to someone not demonstrating symptoms is problematic due to several factors. I have had three GPs over the past decade, none of whom would prescribe doxy (or any medication) without demonstrated need. These were not simple "no" responses and each took time to explain why they held this professional standard. Some commonalities were cited by each, including some States prohibit prescribing medications to patients who do not demonstrate symptoms that would lead to diagnosis warranting the antibiotic, MD ethics guidelines are also a concern for most MDs as well. The CDC provides information that specifically states antibiotics following any tick bite may be counter productive and delay onset of the illness unless specific symptoms are determined to exist (see the quote below from the CDC site).

"In areas that are highly endemic for Lyme disease, a single prophylactic dose of doxycycline (200 mg for adults or 4.4 mg/kg for children of any age weighing less than 45 kg) may be used to reduce the risk of acquiring Lyme disease after the bite of a high risk tick bite. Benefits of prophylaxis may outweigh risks when all of the following circumstances are present:


Doxycycline is not contraindicated.
The attached tick can be identified as an adult or nymphal I. scapularis tick.
The estimated time of attachment is ≥36 h based on the degree of tick engorgement with blood or likely time of exposure to the tick.
Prophylaxis can be started within 72 h of tick removal.
Lyme disease is common in the county or state where the tick bite occurred (i.e., CT, DE, DC, MA, MD, ME, MN, NH, NJ, NY, PA, RI, VA, VT, WI, WV).

Antibiotic treatment following a tick bite is not recommended as a means to prevent anaplasmosis, babesiosis, ehrlichiosis, Rocky Mountain spotted fever, or other rickettsial diseases. There is no evidence this practice is effective, and it may simply delay onset of disease. Instead, persons who experience a tick bite should be alert for symptoms suggestive of tickborne illness and consult a physician if fever, rash, or other symptoms of concern develop." (https://www.cdc.gov/ticks/tickbornediseases/tick-bite-prophylaxis.html)

The Old Chief
01-09-2020, 10:51
Does anyone have any suggestions on reducing the weight of my med kit? Also, I have heard of people taking Doxycycline with them on their hike. Is this typical? I can't seem to get a prescription from my doctor. I am aware that treatment can require different doses. My concern is that if I do need to take the medication that I might be too far out from a pharmacy/2-3 days from a town.

Your best bet is to treat your hiking clothing with permethrin to keep tick bites from becoming a concern. Some hikers also treat their backpacks and tents with permethrin. I've had Lyme disease twice from hikes on the AT, and for the past 4 years have treated all my "outdoor" clothing with permethrin. You can treat your garments yourself with available sprays from Walmart or Tractor Farm Supply or you can send your garments to InsectShield and for $10.00 per garment they will do a treatment that will last for at least 60 washings. I do both and haven't had a tick on me for the past four years. In North Carolina we have to worry about Lyme and Alpha Gal so I think it's a good investment and precaution.

JNI64
01-09-2020, 12:20
Your best bet is to treat your hiking clothing with permethrin to keep tick bites from becoming a concern. Some hikers also treat their backpacks and tents with permethrin. I've had Lyme disease twice from hikes on the AT, and for the past 4 years have treated all my "outdoor" clothing with permethrin. You can treat your garments yourself with available sprays from Walmart or Tractor Farm Supply or you can send your garments to InsectShield and for $10.00 per garment they will do a treatment that will last for at least 60 washings. I do both and haven't had a tick on me for the past four years. In North Carolina we have to worry about Lyme and Alpha Gal so I think it's a good investment and precaution.

Without a doubt a must!! Above all other concerns please do yourself a huge favor and make sure this gets done before you leave!!

JNI64
01-09-2020, 12:22
Treat your pack and tent as they spend alot time on the ground! I remember reading somewhere that the tick population in order to get killed off, there has to be 10 or more consecutive days of 30' or less. And the winters we get anymore that rarely happens. So last year's ticks still remain along with ever increasing breeding !! Here we are almost the middle of January, Saturday temp. Expecting almost 70' so crazy !!

Deadeye
01-09-2020, 17:38
Your best bet is to treat your hiking clothing with permethrin to keep tick bites from becoming a concern.

+100. I use permethrin religiously now. When I'm hiking with others who aren't using it, the difference in the number of ticks they see is stark. I treat any fabric that will absorb it - it just runs off most tent flies or tarps, but if it soaks in, the ticks will fall right off.

Five Tango
01-09-2020, 18:04
JT Eaton makes a permethrin gallon premix that is labeled for use on clothing,luggage,etc.Kills ticks and also bedbugs.Yes,bed bugs are becoming a "thing" now.

I spray the Eatons's product on my outer articles of clothing and the waist band of underwear and totally treat socks.As a hammock camper I do not treat my hammock or tarp but I have treated my groundsheet in the past.

It could be a wives tale but B complex vitamins and apple cider vinegar are said to repel mosquitoes and I believe ticks as I have been bothered by neither since I started using the supplements.Of course the data would be flawed since my clothing is treated with permethrin.However,when I get up in the middle of the night in untreated clothing the mosquitoes are no longer an issue.YMMV.

So as not to be guilty of thread drift.Over the years I have cut the total weight of my load by 50% and that includes food for 4 or 5 days plus 2 liters water.Most of the gains have come from better technology and simply saying "no" to some of the items I want to take.

Traveler
01-10-2020, 08:14
Treat your pack and tent as they spend alot time on the ground! I remember reading somewhere that the tick population in order to get killed off, there has to be 10 or more consecutive days of 30' or less. And the winters we get anymore that rarely happens. So last year's ticks still remain along with ever increasing breeding !! Here we are almost the middle of January, Saturday temp. Expecting almost 70' so crazy !!
Not to pick a nit here, however the adult black-legged tick (aka deer tick) is still active at 35-degrees but starts to slow its activity at that point. At about this temperature ticks typically start to seek shelter in leaf litter and other ground detritus, venturing out again when temperatures reach above 30-degrees (or if sunlight warmth is favorable) to try and catch a ride on a warm mammal. It takes several days of sustained temperatures of 10 degrees or less (in some scientific circles Zero is the benchmark) to have much population impact to ticks actually exposed to the elements. However, when covered with insulating forest floor litter and snow, they can easily survive below zero conditions for a long time. I have always been amazed to find a tick or two when out on snowshoes in robustly cold weather that sense the body heat or a stove and are drawn to it.

JNI64
01-10-2020, 08:51
All good in the woods brother, I very much enjoy reading your posts. Always well spoken and well versed as well as perfect punctuation. Me not so much, I just throw my thoughts down. One that's been around for awhile can tell you know what the hell you're talking about. What info you posted is even more disturbing. I knew they burrowed down into leaves and such to survive. The point here is to enlighten everybody and the new hikers to the east coast the dangers of these little boogers straight from hell.

4eyedbuzzard
01-10-2020, 12:08
When I moved to northern NH (Littleton area) in the early 90's we had very few, if any, ticks in the area. You usually didn't encounter them until you got further south and into the lower elevations in the Connecticut River valley. But over the last 20 years, the winters have generally been milder and the frost depth has been shallower. Last year, while cleaning up my old property up there, I removed several ticks almost daily when out and about in late spring. Their range has moved northward at an alarming rate.

Dogwood
01-10-2020, 17:05
Hi everyone,

I am gearing up for my 2020 AT thru hike. I thought I could figure out this puzzle of what to take with me but in the process have become very frustrated. My issue is my pack weight. I am already at 52 lbs (food and water included). I am not sure where/what I should/can cut from my pack. Of course, in my opinion, I NEED everything on the list. Any suggestions on how to whittle this list down would be helpful. I will be starting the trail at the end of February and have tried to account for cold, snow and ice in my gear.

https://lighterpack.com/r/694if5

You said it yet have not fully grasped what you said. Reducing pack wt is not always a finalized end goal. It is a process, an evolutionary journey...that sometimes people eternally obsess. Chill. Most AT thrus go through processes like reducing pack wt by changing out gear, changing logistics, etc. A LD hike is similar. There are learning and adaptive curves. Sure, the geographical starting pt and final end pt are integral to the hike but the real experiences, the most time and energy is spent in between. Embrace that.

Want to reduce TPW(Total Pack Weight) consider a greater focus on the consumables category(food, water, fuel, etc). Reducing TPW also includes this category!
HOW: 1) Resupply more often. AT thru hiking is as logistically ideal as it gets on the Triple Crown Trails for accomplishing this. It was a major factor in how Garlic, a TCer who posts here on WB, says to his very low TPW when he thrued the AT.
1.b.) Learn to food and resupply supplement near or on the AT and not stopping the hike for a full food resupply ie; Neels Gap - Mt Crossings, Pine Furnace, walking through Hot Springs NC and Hanover NH, AMC Huts, etc
2) Aim for a 120 cal/oz ratio and, this is important yet often ignored, high overall nutritional density. Maybe even a greater cal/oz ratio early on when it's cold and you're adapting to trail life. The higher good fat content, when your body adapts to burning it, may snowball into getting less cold hence needing less insulative less bulky lower wt apparel. See the potential positive wt saving and perhaps comfort trade offs? Let you bod shed some wt as temps warm to get into that svelte LD hiking condition.
3) Carrying only the amt of water wt necessary. It also may be a process assessing that personal need but again chill. You don't need to know everything pre hike or have the supposed perfect kit. One advantage of your start date is you may not require as much drinking water. However, understand pack wts trend down as weather transitions to late spring and summer. Yours will too! :cool::)
4) Don't buy into Newbie posting UL Internet sites that obsess over reducing wt only or primarily by myopically focusing on gear. I suggest accessing the advice of LD UL serialists, those that live the life across a diversity of environments spanning a longer range of yrs - Cam Honan, Andrew Skurka, Erin Saver, Liz Thomas, Justin Licther, etc

mclaught
01-10-2020, 18:43
In regards to the sun block, I don't wear it at all. I have an allergic reaction to it. Any suggestions to what I might use in place of the standard zinc oxide type sun screens?

My daughter is allergic to sunscreens as well, but there are two main types (that I know of). The first group works by using chemicals, such as Octinoxate, avobenzone, or octocrylene. These are the most common sunscreens. Then you have the other group of mineral-based sunscreens that use either zinc oxide and/or titanium dioxide. We cannot use the chemical sunscreens without her face blowing up and burning, so we have to use zinc oxide, and then we have to check the label and make sure there's no funny inactive ingredients in there. If you have truly narrowed it down to zinc oxide causing the allergy, try one of the other ones. But from what I've read, it's almost 100% guaranteed that it is the typical chemical based sunscreens that are causing your allergic reaction. That seems to be the more common allergy. And the ones labeled "for sensitive skin" or "child safe" or even the really expensive neutrogena stuff seemed to be the worst offenders for us. Good luck!

4eyedbuzzard
01-10-2020, 19:33
That was my initial goal! How ever did I end up so far away? :) I will blame it on what if and just in case. LOL. Still, I will get this pack weight down to something more comfortable. Point taken about items I might need when it is not as cold and leaving them until later. In regards to the sun block, I don't wear it at all. I have an allergic reaction to it. Any suggestions to what I might use in place of the standard zinc oxide type sun screens? And I will examine the Rubbermaid container option as well. Thanks!Long pants, long sleeve shirt, hat. There's a lot of lightweight clothing made with synthetic sunblock fabrics available.

Traillium
01-10-2020, 20:20
Long pants, long sleeve shirt, hat. There's a lot of lightweight clothing made with synthetic sunblock fabrics available.

I’d emphasize a broad-brimmed hat. Being a Canuck, I favour a Tilley, the old T1. A ‘boonie’ is a good style for my liking.

Long pants and long sleeves. Always.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Dogwood
01-10-2020, 20:40
I appreciate that you all have taken the time to help me get my packing weight down. I am considering all of your suggestions and have begun to lighten my load little by little. I agree with Traveler that a 2-3 day shakedown hike will really help me identify what I don't need.

The Dahlonega Hiker Hostel under the previous management did bag checks for wt. I dont know if the new owners have someone on staff like Pilgrim that does it. They may help.

Mt Crossings at Neels Gap will do it too.

It helps to have someone who is familiar with lowering pack wt on the AT to assist rather than doing it alone as a Newbie or just from impersonal(not in person) online mash ups.

Dogwood
01-10-2020, 20:42
The biggest health risk on the Trail is Lyme Disease.

Not convinced until I see compared reliable stats with slips, trips and falls. I would say it's still slips, trips, and falls.

Dogwood
01-10-2020, 20:54
I think that if you get out and hike your kit will sort itself out.

I agree. That's what tends to happen. Enlisting inquirer targeted input from others is good but yet to see any two people with the exact same kits and be in the exact same situation anywhere on the AT so there's a large degree of personalizing that only that individual can do as their job. So many take at face value the advice of others those taking the advice don't grasp that most advice is based on what someone else would or has done. Thruhiking entails a good measure of individuality and independent responsibility. Others can't do the thru hike for you.

rickb
01-10-2020, 22:15
The biggest health risk on the Trail is Lyme Disease.

Not convinced until I see compared reliable stats with slips, trips and falls. I would say it's still slips, trips, and falls.


Could be — and as such, a good reason why pole(s) are probably worth the weight for most people other than Lone Wolf.

My hyperbole was driven in part by just how much I valued the “Tick Twister” after getting one embedded in a spot that the OP doesn’t have to worry about.

Dogwood
01-10-2020, 23:34
Says the inventor of the "Tick Twister." :D

tinybee
01-12-2020, 20:07
Thanks for that information JNI64. I simply assumed that in the winter I was safe from both bears and ticks.

tinybee
01-12-2020, 20:19
You said it yet have not fully grasped what you said. Reducing pack wt is not always a finalized end goal. It is a process, an evolutionary journey...that sometimes people eternally obsess.

Thanks Dogwood. That makes sense. I have definitely been obsessing over the "right" answers/gear.

tinybee
01-12-2020, 20:22
Thanks mclaught. I am also seeing an allergist tomorrow.

WesleyCBruce
01-13-2020, 15:56
I haven't read all the replies, so my apologies if this notion has been shared... Instead of asking how one can trim gear weight, I encourage you to think about how you can maxamize the notion of simplicity. Your spreadsheet is pretty cool and detailed, and I'm quite certain as a case could be made about why to bring every item you listed. But 50 pounds is a lot. How can you simplify to a lifestyle that is still safe and comfortable without weighing you into a grave.

Dogwood
01-13-2020, 20:23
Don't be a complete simpleton.

garlic08
01-14-2020, 08:57
Says the inventor of the "Tick Twister." :D

First time I heard the term "tick tweezer" I burst out laughing. I love Spoonerisms, even quasi-Spoonerisms.

Deadeye
01-14-2020, 12:09
Don't be a complete simpleton.
So we're clear, who were you directing this insult at?

Traffic Jam
01-14-2020, 14:29
So we're clear, who were you directing this insult at?
This was simply Dogwood making a pun, not making fun. Unless I’m the simpleton. :)

perdidochas
01-14-2020, 15:24
Hi everyone,

I am gearing up for my 2020 AT thru hike. I thought I could figure out this puzzle of what to take with me but in the process have become very frustrated. My issue is my pack weight. I am already at 52 lbs (food and water included). I am not sure where/what I should/can cut from my pack. Of course, in my opinion, I NEED everything on the list. Any suggestions on how to whittle this list down would be helpful. I will be starting the trail at the end of February and have tried to account for cold, snow and ice in my gear.

https://lighterpack.com/r/694if5

Way too much clothes, IMHO. Do you really need two pairs of gloves and mittens? I can see one pair and mittens.
Also, do you need two sleeping pads?

Deadeye
01-14-2020, 18:50
This was simply Dogwood making a pun, not making fun. Unless I’m the simpleton. :)

Since I didn't get the pun, maybe not...

Traffic Jam
01-14-2020, 20:05
............

Time Zone
01-14-2020, 22:25
In the post right above the one where Dogwood uses the word "simpleton", the words "simplify" and "simplicity" were used. My guess is that's where TJ got the notion that it was probably a play on words. But I simply can't speak for either of them! :D

Dogwood
01-15-2020, 00:03
So we're clear, who were you directing this insult at?

No one specific named person It could definitely be construed that way so pardon my mistake in any any disconnect you experienced. I was vague. Previous poster said simplify things. I agree. It can be a good thing up to some personally acceptable degree. It was my way of adding and saying simplifying things is good but dont be an utter fool/ utterly foolish lacking in total judgement totally clueless or an utter simpleton. To thru the AT you eventually have to learn how to do somethings if you don't already know.:)

cmoulder
01-15-2020, 07:59
There are some great blogs 'out there' specific to LD hiking. My favorite is Beardoh and SweetPea's "Long Distance Hiker."

Link here (https://www.longdistancehiker.com/beardohs-pct-gear-list-2016/) to Beardoh's discussion of his and SweetPea's gear for PCT, but there is tons of good information if you thoroughly peruse this one blog.

The main thing is to get outside and do trips with whatever kit you have because, as others have said, you can't truly understand what YOU need and don't need based on someone else's experience. So many times, here and in other forums, we see folks stuck in "analysis paralysis" trying to dial in the perfect kit without ever having set foot on a trail, or never getting more than a few hours walking distance from their cars.

Beardoh sums it up nicely in his blog, from the link above, and I don't think I've ever seen it stated more succinctly:

All the above being said, I encourage/champion/condone hiking, camping and getting outside above all else…heavy pack, light pack, $25 tent, $1000 tent…whatever. Be outside on cold days, warm days, climb mountains in the rain, ford rivers in the heat, walk through deserts, plains, jungles, the dark green tunnel and below perfect blue Sierra skies – above all else…just get out.

cmoulder
01-15-2020, 08:01
...........................

(Sorry.... double post after edit!)

Dogwood
01-15-2020, 17:36
For you Cmoulder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EV9IdeU3D0

cmoulder
01-15-2020, 20:43
Not sure how to respond because I don't know what message you're trying to convey with this.

Or maybe I'm the only one who doesn't get it.

Whatevs.

Dogwood
01-15-2020, 21:23
Beardoh sums it up nicely in his blog, from the link above, and I don't think I've ever seen it stated more succinctly:

All the above being said, I encourage/champion/condone hiking, camping and getting outside above all else…heavy pack, light pack, $25 tent, $1000 tent…whatever. Be outside on cold days, warm days, climb mountains in the rain, ford rivers in the heat, walk through deserts, plains, jungles, the dark green tunnel and below perfect blue Sierra skies – above all else…just get out



That's the message of the song. Guess you didn't get the connection. I thought you'd enjoy it since you said what you said.

rickb
01-15-2020, 21:50
Beardoh sums it up nicely in his blog, from the link above, and I don't think I've ever seen it stated more succinctly:

All the above being said, I encourage/champion/condone hiking, camping and getting outside above all else…heavy pack, light pack, $25 tent, $1000 tent…whatever. Be outside on cold days, warm days, climb mountains in the rain, ford rivers in the heat, walk through deserts, plains, jungles, the dark green tunnel and below perfect blue Sierra skies – above all else…just get out
.


That ignores human nature — i.e. the powerful need to fit in and have the same stuff that the cool kids have — be it Kylie lip kits, or ultra light hiking kits.

4eyedbuzzard
01-15-2020, 22:28
There are some great blogs 'out there' specific to LD hiking. My favorite is Beardoh and SweetPea's "Long Distance Hiker."

Link here (https://www.longdistancehiker.com/beardohs-pct-gear-list-2016/) to Beardoh's discussion of his and SweetPea's gear for PCT, but there is tons of good information if you thoroughly peruse this one blog.

The main thing is to get outside and do trips with whatever kit you have because, as others have said, you can't truly understand what YOU need and don't need based on someone else's experience. So many times, here and in other forums, we see folks stuck in "analysis paralysis" trying to dial in the perfect kit without ever having set foot on a trail, or never getting more than a few hours walking distance from their cars.

Beardoh sums it up nicely in his blog, from the link above, and I don't think I've ever seen it stated more succinctly:


I appreciate that you all have taken the time to help me get my packing weight down. I am considering all of your suggestions and have begun to lighten my load little by little. I agree with Traveler that a 2-3 day shakedown hike will really help me identify what I don't need.Just an observation: There's no teacher like experience. But listening carefully to the experience of others and heeding their advice when it makes sense to do so (usually there will be some consensus in a group of experienced people) can sure make those first hand lessons less painful. I've seen new hikers struggle trying to pitch a tent for the first time in the wind and rain; trying to cook a meal having never practiced beforehand, shivering in the cold wind in the Whites without the proper clothing... I would always recommend hopeful thru-hikers get out a bit on a few shakedown hikes and see what gear they really need, what skills they need to master, and what works for them personally. It isn't one size fits all. And while there isn't as much discussion on camp skills as there is on gear itself, being able to efficiently and timely make and break camp, cook food, etc, in the woods takes some practice and some time to learn. And knowing how to do so will make the early part of a hike much more enjoyable rather than expending significant time and often frustration trying to learn those skills on the fly. But if you error, error on the side of too warm, too much food, too much water, too much gear. You can mail what you learn you don't need home after the first week. Overloaded in this day and age is still lighter than what we hiked with 30 years ago, and we all seemed to manage just fine. Don't lose sleep because someone says your pack is 5 lbs too heavy - you'll figure it out.

cmoulder
01-16-2020, 13:10
That's the message of the song. Guess you didn't get the connection. I thought you'd enjoy it since you said what you said.

OK thanks, but there's so much reverb on the vocals I couldn't understand the words at all! I'll have to look up the lyrics.

Traveler
01-17-2020, 10:15
Speaking of songs related to this activity, Treeline (Bristlecone Music) may be of interest to listen to.

The Josh
01-17-2020, 12:52
...be it Kylie lip kits, or ultra light hiking kits.

Is this in gear lists now? Should I get one and update my lighterpack sheet? I haven't heard about these, do I need a spare one, how long do they last? Does it improve my aerodynamics? Is there an ultralight Kylie lip kit by some cottage company yet?

Papa Muskrat
01-18-2020, 15:19
Heading to SNP Monday AM for a 3 day hike. Low-mid teens expected on mtn. 3 days food, alchohol fuel, no water, loaded, ready to carry pack weighs 20.2#. Tarp (polycro) w/guy lines. Zero deg Lithium bag. Cook kit under 1/2 pound. Tyvek ground cloth. Exped UL winter down mat, Mass Drop Crown X60 pack modified, at 2#. BW at 12#

Took me 40 years to get here. I remember the 50# expedition pack weights. Good luck.

Papa Muskrat
01-18-2020, 15:23
Beware filters in Feb. Aquamira way to go and less weight.

Papa Muskrat
01-18-2020, 15:25
2# food/day in winter is very real.

Papa Muskrat
01-18-2020, 15:35
Tinybee, let's talk sometime. I'm in Glen Allen as well.

cmoulder
01-18-2020, 15:45
Heading to SNP Monday AM for a 3 day hike. Low-mid teens expected on mtn. 3 days food, alchohol fuel, no water, loaded, ready to carry pack weighs 20.2#. Tarp (polycro) w/guy lines. Zero deg Lithium bag. Cook kit under 1/2 pound. Tyvek ground cloth. Exped UL winter down mat, Mass Drop Crown X60 pack modified, at 2#. BW at 12#
Took me 40 years to get here. I remember the 50# expedition pack weights. Good luck.

I wanna see that polycryo tarp, construction details such as how guy lines are attached. Very interested to hear how it performs for you. Clear packing tape is good for repairs! :)

cmoulder
01-18-2020, 15:47
And great job getting the weight down there. I remember the old days carrying 50-70lbs. :(

4eyedbuzzard
01-18-2020, 15:55
I wanna see that polycryo tarp, construction details such as how guy lines are attached. Very interested to hear how it performs for you. Clear packing tape is good for repairs! :)
I've never built one, but there's a great tutorial on one here https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/how-to-make-a-polycryo-a-frame-tarp/

JNI64
01-18-2020, 15:56
Beware filters in Feb. Aquamira way to go and less weight.

Yeah after letting a couple sawyers freeze, I had to switch to aquamira in winter. You just have to keep them some place warm like jacket pocket or something . Guess I'm not as responsible as I thought. :eek:

Papa Muskrat
01-18-2020, 16:03
Who wants to carry a wet filter inside your jacket in winter? Or inside a snug down bag? Been there, dun that.

Papa Muskrat
01-18-2020, 16:14
I just use duct tape doubled over on the polycro edges and corners. Leave a couple inches hanging off and use stake directly thru to ground or thread guy lines thru middle end of tape. Use trek poles for height. I took a pic, but don't see how to post from phone.

cmoulder
01-18-2020, 16:14
I've never built one, but there's a great tutorial on one here https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/how-to-make-a-polycryo-a-frame-tarp/
Thanks, in fact I remember that one from a few years back. I think the edge taping would be the most tedious part.

I made a tyvek tarp that I actually used a couple of times when I was a ground dweller. I now hammock and it's not nearly long enough for that. Never got to use it in really nasty weather like gales+heavy rain, but it did okay with some spiffy 20mph breezes.

I used some pieces of bamboo chopsticks and duct tape for the guy line and ridge line attachment points. Worked quite well.

However, this tarp is still heavier than a comparably-sized .51 DCF (Sorry, don't have exact weight...)

46062

Papa Muskrat
01-18-2020, 16:58
Looks good. Same color duct tape too.

JNI64
01-18-2020, 17:19
Who wants to carry a wet filter inside your jacket in winter? Or inside a snug down bag? Been there, dun that.

Well it would have to be in a zip lock baggie of course.

Dogwood
01-19-2020, 02:18
Thanks, in fact I remember that one from a few years back. I think the edge taping would be the most tedious part.

I made a tyvek tarp that I actually used a couple of times when I was a ground dweller. I now hammock and it's not nearly long enough for that. Never got to use it in really nasty weather like gales+heavy rain, but it did okay with some spiffy 20mph breezes.

I used some pieces of bamboo chopsticks and duct tape for the guy line and ridge line attachment points. Worked quite well.

However, this tarp is still heavier than a comparably-sized .51 DCF (Sorry, don't have exact weight...)

46062

Using bamboo chopsticks for ridge line attachment pts should be in the humor section LOL We're they Ul chopstick pieces? Could toothpicks have been used? LOL.