2020 2 Week trip New Hampshire Plan

[Gambit McCrae]

Time: The 2 weeks prior to July 4th holiday

Plan: The plan is for myself and 2 hiking buddies to fly up to Boston and rent a minivan. Drive it to Franconia Notch and start hiking. 1 of the hiking buddies has zero desire to hike every mile, and when I pitched the idea of him being in charge of a support van for 2 weeks he went nuts with excitement. The other buddy would like to hike all the miles with me.

Cost: I spent $220 getting from Franconia Notch to Boston last year. Spending that BOTH ways this year would put me/ us at $440. The van rental will be $1k for 2 weeks. So between the airport shuttles, and slack pack shuttles, rides to and from the trail and the luxury of having a resupply van bouncing up the trail with us, it seems like both a fun twist to a trip, as well as accommodating for the friend that has no interest in living out of a backpack for 2 weeks. He can hike as he wants, when he gets tired, shuttle/ hitch back to the van, do day hikes, slack us around etc.
I am aware that thru the next several sections of the whites there is not motor access so the first 6 days or so there will not be a lot of use of the van. But we will be able to bounce it at the notches that have road access.
At this point in the completion of the AT....What does cost even mean....and this expense will be divided by 3, well employed young men on vacation.

[steve_zavocki]

You could probably save some $$ getting larger car, since there are only three of you. Vans are substantially higher to rent than cars. Another idea is to take the bus to Concord and rent from there. Often airport locations have higher taxes, and NH rates are likely cheaper than Mass. It is easy to get a bus to Concord.

Sounds like a good plan, you are lucky to have someone willing to drive you. I assume you are trying to make it to Grafton Notch in Maine, you should be able to make it that far pretty easily if not well farther.

In late July, my wife and I are hiking SB from Grafton Notch to Gorham and I am very excited about that. We have a friend driving to the start and taking the bus back to Boston for the return trip. This will complete NH for me, and give me my first Maine miles.

[Gambit McCrae]

You could probably save some $$ getting larger car, since there are only three of you. Vans are substantially higher to rent than cars. Another idea is to take the bus to Concord and rent from there. Often airport locations have higher taxes, and NH rates are likely cheaper than Mass. It is easy to get a bus to Concord.

Sounds like a good plan, you are lucky to have someone willing to drive you. I assume you are trying to make it to Grafton Notch in Maine, you should be able to make it that far pretty easily if not well farther.

In late July, my wife and I are hiking SB from Grafton Notch to Gorham and I am very excited about that. We have a friend driving to the start and taking the bus back to Boston for the return trip. This will complete NH for me, and give me my first Maine miles.
Thanks I will look into that! I learned last year in NH to expect 7-8 miles a day and be happy if you get more. So I really havent even planned an end location and dont know that I will, but yes I am planning on walking into Maine this trip.

[ldsailor]

There is an Enterprise car rental in Gorham, NH. Prices and availability of rental cars and vans are pretty good. It might be easier renting there, so you can pickup the vehicle when you want it and drop it when you want, and save money by using the bus to and from Boston. I used Concord last year to get to Gorham, and it was pretty easy; although it arrived in Gorham late in the evening.

Now the downside. Concord Trailways, which is the only bus company I know of going to the White Mountains area of NH has suspended all operations until further notice. Surely in two months that will change - won't it?

[illabelle]

I hope you enjoy your trip Gambit. May be the bugs be few, and the winds light. We'll be up there in Aug/Sept.

[ldsailor]

So I really havent even planned an end location and dont know that I will, but yes I am planning on walking into Maine this trip.

If you make it to Andover, Maine or actually most anywhere south of there, try this shuttle:

Pine Ellis Lodge
Andover
S.D. Rousselin
Cell 207-890-9172
[email protected]

I didn't stay at the hostel, but the driver told me it's right in town as opposed to the Human Nature Hostel, which is way out of town and near nothing. The shuttle gave me a ride to Gorham for under $90 where I caught a bus to Boston, but they would just as easily drive you to the Portland airport (for more money of course).

[Astro]

If you make it to Andover, Maine or actually most anywhere south of there, try this shuttle:

Pine Ellis Lodge
Andover
S.D. Rousselin
Cell 207-890-9172
[email protected]

I didn't stay at the hostel, but the driver told me it's right in town as opposed to the Human Nature Hostel, which is way out of town and near nothing. The shuttle gave me a ride to Gorham for under $90 where I caught a bus to Boston, but they would just as easily drive you to the Portland airport (for more money of course).

I did stay at Pine Ellis this past summer multiple nights, shuttle to US 2 and then later slack packing a couple days around Andover. I enjoyed my stay with them and would recommend them as both a hostel and shuttle. Also really enjoyed eating at the diner inside the general store that is only a block or two away. :)

[Astro]

Why fly (unless the airline have really reduced prices)? I would just rent a car and drive up together. With gas at 99 cents a gallon, this could probably save you a lot of money. With three drivers should not take that much more time than the hassle through the airports. 18 hours/3 drivers, drive 6 hours, sleep 12. Also no worries about fuel, protecting your pack, and all the rest of the hassle with flying.
Key assumption is that your two friends are near and not spread out with Boston as your connection point.

[Slo-go'en]

There is no public transportation from the Manchester airport. At best you might get an expensive taxi ride up to Concord, but your timing has to be impeccable, since there is only one bus a day to Gorham. The fact that it arrives in Concord about 6 PM (assuming no traffic coming out of Boston, usually it's an hour late) helps.

Your trip is still 2 months away, but there are a lot of unknowns. Airlines will likely still be on a much reduced schedule. Will the Concord bus be running again? If it is, will they keep the Concord to Berlin run since it never has much ridership to begin with? Will the campgrounds be open? Will hostels bother to open?

So far we have managed to keep the virus out of Coos county, but that can change once tourist season starts. Once it does get here, it could hit the local population hard. You know my position on this, put the hike off until next year and stay home. With all the uncertainties, that's your best option.

[peakbagger]

Slacking the whites used to be a much discussed topic and its still relevant. Unless you want to add a zero to you budget ($ 2200) you are not staying at the AMC huts so your choice is carrying more gear and using the public campsites or going light and putting in longer daily miles. A possible breakdown would be.

Glencliff to Kinsman Notch (2) some treeline
Kinsman Notch to the parkway (3) some treeline
Parkway to Garfield (3) 1/2 treeline
Garfield to Zealand (2) minimal treeline
Zealand to RT 302 (1) short day no treeline
RT 302 to Lake of the Clouds (2) 1/2 treeline
Lake of the Clouds to Jefferson (2) all treeline
Jefferson to Great Gulf. (2)1/2 treeline
Great Gulf to Pinkham (short day)no treeline
Pinkham to 19 Carter Notch (2) no treeline
Carter Notch to Gorham (3) some treeline

The numbers in ( ) are my swags at difficulty. The trick is you need to move around picking the sections to match the weather. Start out with the (1)s to get your trail legs and then grab the treeline sections on the good days and fill in with the 2s on iffy days. There are free WMNF campsites hidden away in few spots along FS roads that would be good to base camp at, they have zero services (no outhouses) but are dispersed and you can stay at them for up to 10 days in a row.

Some campsite are not be missed while some arejust spots to camp. Both Kinsman Pond, Guyot and Liberty Springs are in the woods for shelter but a 10 to 15 minute walk gives you summit views to watch sunrise or sunset. Ethan Pond, Nauman both are crowded in the woods

Many of the slack points are not roads you will need to hike up a side trail and possibly have to gain 2 to 3 thousand feet in the AM to get the the AT. Hopefully your "driver" is a fisherman or he can just day hike and meet you almost daily for lunch and hang out at the campsite on iffy days. If you spring for ride up the autoroad for two days you can hike down off of Mt Washington both north and south without a hike in from a trailhead.

Obviously the big caveat is CV-19. AMC is still taking reservations after June 1st for the huts but they are probably the last option to open up. I expect anyone with early summer hut reservations may be rescheduling. Even if you do not stay at the huts it means planning water sources a bit more carefully as some parts of the ridgeline are dry except for the huts. At a minimum it means more filtering. The WMNF has currently blocked many trailhead for parking but allow foot travel so being dropped off is currently acceptable.

I am more optimistic about July but right now May and June are still looking dicey.

[Astro]

Why fly (unless the airline have really reduced prices)? I would just rent a car and drive up together. With gas at 99 cents a gallon, this could probably save you a lot of money. With three drivers should not take that much more time than the hassle through the airports. 18 hours/3 drivers, drive 6 hours, sleep 12. Also no worries about fuel, protecting your pack, and all the rest of the hassle with flying.
Key assumption is that your two friends are near and not spread out with Boston as your connection point.

Or better yet, take your own car and eliminate the rental fee.

[4eyedbuzzard]

Food for thought:
Driving will be cheaper out of pocket and at worse break even - even if you can get <$150 RT flights Nashville to Logan. Downside is driving time, but flying is still always a whole day event IMO, so ...
Factor in parking fees at Nashville or transport costs and car rental costs at Boston - $500 in flights + $1K rental car
Taking your own vehicle approx 3000 miles (roughly 2400 Cookeville to Gorham + driving around NH) is a true cost of around $1380 (@ 46¢ / mile) once you factor in wear and tear, depreciation, etc into the cost - not just the out of pocket gas. Add in some tolls and such as well. Call it $1500.
Taking your own vehicle will allow the non/less hiking friend to bring more base camp gear - large tent, stove, cookware, cooler, etc, etc, etc - all that glamping stuff ;) Then he can chill some beers in the cooler and cook some steak dinners for you while you're off slacking the Whites.

[Alligator]

Why do you say it like that, the two weeks prior to the July 4th holiday? When in June are you going? June 20th? Do your buddies have to fly to Boston because they don't live near you? Not even a single mention of how you might take into account that there is currently a pandemic? That is NOT going to change in 7 weeks. Did you test positive for antibodies? It's like you are ignoring the elephant in the room. This reads like a thread from last year. It's not 2019. You are planning to go to NH, where there is a Hike Safe program? What are you going to be doing to safely hike in the middle of a pandemic? Passing through a couple airports and the bus terminal? Last year when I rode the bus up there, I practically had to beg not to miss my bus it was packed. Better hope it's not that way if you use it.

[Crushed Grapes]

This reads like a thread from last year. It's not 2019.
Had the same thoughts myself. Did a double take at the time stamp.
The Whites are going to be packed then with day hikers. I'd seriously reconsider.

[peakbagger]

The whites are packed with dayhikers from May to October, They tend to be doing the side trails going up to ridgeline, while thruhikers are hiking the ridgeline. Yes there are some stretches that coincide with popular hiking loops like Franconia Ridge from Haystack to Lafayette and the stretch from Lake of Clouds (AKA Lake of the Crowds) to the south side of Mt Clay where the Jewell trail cuts off. Daytime crowds is not a significant issue, the problem is campsites. unlike much of the AT, the terrain and vegetation types in the whites along the ridgeline make "stealth camping" quite difficult. Add in various WMNF regulations and a hiker tends to need to stay at established campsites. They are crowded with groups prior to summer vacation and then busy with overnighters the rest of the time. AMC has caretakers at the campsites from Franconia Notch to Shelburne and some of the sites in the Mahoosucs. They manage the site to cram in as many people as possible and have some backup sites identified when full. The sites fill up early so by the time a thruhiker makes it there, they may be relegated to the oveflow sites. Thus my recommendation is do longer days as slackpacks

[Gambit McCrae]

Why do you say it like that, the two weeks prior to the July 4th holiday? When in June are you going? June 20th? Do your buddies have to fly to Boston because they don't live near you? Not even a single mention of how you might take into account that there is currently a pandemic? That is NOT going to change in 7 weeks. Did you test positive for antibodies? It's like you are ignoring the elephant in the room. This reads like a thread from last year. It's not 2019. You are planning to go to NH, where there is a Hike Safe program? What are you going to be doing to safely hike in the middle of a pandemic? Passing through a couple airports and the bus terminal? Last year when I rode the bus up there, I practically had to beg not to miss my bus it was packed. Better hope it's not that way if you use it.

IMO it was common sense that if the pandemic is still an active concern that the trip would not occur. Rentals, flights etc can be canceled for a small fee or for no fee a lot of times.

No I will not be driving from TN to NH, 4eyedbuzzard had good points in that cost wise it would cut even minus wear and tear.

2 weeks prior to the July 4th Holiday would June 20th yep...

[LittleRock]

Good luck Gambit - hope you have a blast!

[Alligator]

IMO it was common sense that if the pandemic is still an active concern that the trip would not occur. Rentals, flights etc can be canceled for a small fee or for no fee a lot of times.

No I will not be driving from TN to NH, 4eyedbuzzard had good points in that cost wise it would cut even minus wear and tear.

2 weeks prior to the July 4th Holiday would June 20th yep...There's going to still be a pandemic is 7 weeks Gambit. I'd love to tell you otherwise, but there comes a time when the slightly possible is effectively zero. MA is still very active in cases at the moment. Passing through Boston both on a plane and then possibly the bus is not a good bet. If you go ahead and buy a plane ticket, keep in mind that with the pandemic known, the airlines are less likely to offer full exchange policies, particularly if the states have "reopened". Be real thorough in researching how might be able to rebook or possibly get a refund. And the buses out of Boston are like the buses out of NY, actual crowded terminals as you probably have already seen.

When you have a plan like this, it's good to have what's called a "trigger point". It's the criteria that activates Plan B, or C, or D when things go south. That way you are not overly committed and in the moment make the wrong decision. Make yourself a solid trigger point(s) and stick to it.

I'll play optimist for a bit. I won't suggest anything to do with Boston though. Suppose infection rates and testing make things manageable in other places. Let's rule out NY, NJ, MA for the moment too. Maybe you could fly into Portland, or Manchester. You're going to need PPE, hand sanitizer, soap, masks, disposable gloves. You will need a rental car and I cannot emphasize strongly enough how well you will want to read and understand the rental car agreement. The agents at the airports are pros in screwing customers. They have hundreds to thousands of customer interactions under their belts and they will screw you without a second thought. They know you want to get out of there. Next, having your buddy as resupply and transport is great but please seriously consider minimizing interactions with the local population. Sure they need the money but they don't need Covid-19. Anything more frequent then the usual weekly shopping run has the potential to strain the system. The longer this goes, the more people will need some outlets, but we have to be real careful about how we go about it. There is no return to normal until there are effective therapies and/or a vaccine. There really are people's lives at stake. It's up to you to be a good trail steward and that includes while you are in the trail communities that are part of the AT.

I have to say also that Peakbagger made some excellent points about campsites. Very good chance you will need to use established sites. Those sites force people to congregate and share the bear boxes. Maybe start something a little closer to home, perhaps the BMT? Or do a little bit of Maine perhaps instead?

[Slo-go'en]

You MUST use official designated sites in the Whites (along the AT). To do otherwise is irresponsible and in most places, simply not physically possible or illegal.

To travel any distance from home to go hiking is also very irresponsible. There is a big push to "re-open" (damn the consequences), but everyone with any sense is going to say "not on my life". The tourist industry is dead for the foreseeable future. The trail will still be here when this finally blows over, hopefully you will be too.

[peakbagger]

Maine is definitely a lot easier to self distance especially around June 20th as the black flies are still out which will keep a lot of folks off the trail.

[Alligator]

You MUST use official designated sites in the Whites (along the AT). To do otherwise is irresponsible and in most places, simply not physically possible or illegal.

To travel any distance from home to go hiking is also very irresponsible. There is a big push to "re-open" (damn the consequences), but everyone with any sense is going to say "not on my life". The tourist industry is dead for the foreseeable future. The trail will still be here when this finally blows over, hopefully you will be too.His trip is 7 weeks out and he has placed the caveat of if the pandemic is still an active concern so we are not talking about right now. We have two other threads for right now and the very immediate future. Leave the judgements on reopening remarks out of it. There are some legal "stealth" sites but no need to argue about must. His suggested pace makes it moot.

[Slo-go'en]

Well, I just hope he makes the right decision.

[FromNH]

Our state has closed most trails in the White Mountains and campgrounds. I wouldn’t book anything until the next update on May 4th.

[JPritch]

Have a good hike Gambit!

[QuietStorm]

I didn't see any reference to the ATC and its recommendations regarding hiking again on the AT. Is the assumption in this plan that the ATC will recommend overnight backpacking by mid-late June? At this point the AT has become the same or similar patchwork of stay at home orders and re-openings as the rest of the country. Georgia, Tennessee, Pennsylvania, Vermont, and Maine are beginning various degrees of re-opening. Will the ATC follow suit? It doesn't appear their petition to close the trail completely was approved; in any case, they asked for the trail to be closed through April 30. I am in Maryland, which is under an indefinite stay at home order with no overnight camping anywhere. I have 188 miles left to complete of the AT and had planned to do so beginning June 28. I postponed the hike to August 30 with a summit day around September 14. Even then Maine may still have a 14-day quarantine for non-residents. I hope not, but it's possible. So even if the pandemic has lessened in severity by June-July, many of the states continue to have restrictions, and the ATC has yet to loosen its recommendations. Tough to plan.

[Emerson Bigills]

I also stayed at Pine Ellis Hostel a couple years ago for a couple nights. Decent hostel, the buffet at the Red Hen was among the most memorable on the entire AT. The shuttler at Pine Ellis was a Mayan Indian named David. Guy was awesome. Great wealth of knowledge and just a super all around guy. Lots of good people around the trail towns, but David really was a standout. Southern ME is the real deal.

[Astro]

I also stayed at Pine Ellis Hostel a couple years ago for a couple nights. Decent hostel, the buffet at the Red Hen was among the most memorable on the entire AT. The shuttler at Pine Ellis was a Mayan Indian named David. Guy was awesome. Great wealth of knowledge and just a super all around guy. Lots of good people around the trail towns, but David really was a standout. Southern ME is the real deal.

I really enjoyed my shuttles with David also. Besides his knowledge of the areas, he told me stories about pitching for his country's Little League team. Even threw a few no hitters back in the day.

[Berserker]

Not even a single mention of how you might take into account that there is currently a pandemic? That is NOT going to change in 7 weeks. Did you test positive for antibodies? It's like you are ignoring the elephant in the room. This reads like a thread from last year. It's not 2019.
Gambit addressed this, but I'm going to have to agree with most on this thread that it appears that most if not all 2020 long distance trips are pretty much out of the question at this point. Just my opinion, but if I had anything overnight planned more than a couple of hours from where I live I'd be cancelling and thinking about doing it next year.




IMO it was common sense that if the pandemic is still an active concern that the trip would not occur.
No I will not be driving from TN to NH, 4eyedbuzzard had good points in that cost wise it would cut even minus wear and tear.
Glad you are considering the current situation. As for the driving though, let's assume everything "kind of" blows over (I think we all know this is gonna drag on for quite a while). Why not drive? I drove up there for all my sections and I realize I'm probably several hours closer than you, but this seems like a pretty dang good compromise. Then you are staying away from public transportation and depending on the logistics you could potentially avoid hotels too. The driving would take a little longer, but would definitely be the far safer option (for you and the surrounding communities) to get there considering things aren't going to be 100% back to normal.

I guess what I'm trying to say is if I were thinking of doing this I would be driving, camping and bringing everything with me that I need to eliminate all unnecessary stops. Ideally I'd stop for gas a few times, maybe hit a few drive thrus for food, and the rest of the time I'd be in my car, at a campsite or hiking.

[peakbagger]

With respect to wear and tear on vehicles for section hiking. i really do not see it as an issue. I was sectioning for about 8 years. I had Honda Cicic that got 40 MPG. If anything I did not use it enough when nor backpacking. Long distance driving does not wear out a vehicle, its the stop start warm up cycles that do it. About the only wear item is tires and on my civic I could buy a set of 4 for under $200 and change. I was going to own a reliable var whether I section hiked or not. The civic lasted 8 years and was sold to a college kid who got a couple of more years on it. I think it died by neglect. I hiked with another person and we frequently took two cars down. No waiting for shuttles, resupply from trunk and options if we needed to change our itinerary. I never minded the long drives south but must admit the drives home at the end or a week or two of hiking was not as nice.

[Slo-go'en]

Drive vs Fly

Google says it takes about 18 hours to drive from Cookeville, TN to Gorham NH ~1200 miles. At best that's two 9 hour days of driving. With breaks that's about 12 hours on the road. Best to make that 2 and a half days, to arrive in daylight hours and not so beat. Round trip, your looking at loosing 5-6 days to travel out of your 14. That's a pretty big hit.

In terms of maximizing trail time, flying wins. Deciding if it's something you really want to do at this time is another question.

[Gambit McCrae]

Glad you are considering the current situation. As for the driving though, let's assume everything "kind of" blows over (I think we all know this is gonna drag on for quite a while). Why not drive? I drove up there for all my sections and I realize I'm probably several hours closer than you, but this seems like a pretty dang good compromise. Then you are staying away from public transportation and depending on the logistics you could potentially avoid hotels too. The driving would take a little longer, but would definitely be the far safer option (for you and the surrounding communities) to get there considering things aren't going to be 100% back to normal.
I guess what I'm trying to say is if I were thinking of doing this I would be driving, camping and bringing everything with me that I need to eliminate all unnecessary stops. Ideally I'd stop for gas a few times, maybe hit a few drive thrus for food, and the rest of the time I'd be in my car, at a campsite or hiking.

SO driving up is currently our plan A. 3 of us going, starting at 4pm on a Friday, we will be in New Hampshire around 10am Saturday. Each taking a 6 hour driving shift, and otherwise sleeping. Our 3rd companion is looking very forward to being a dedicated transporter and day hiking and doing some overnights when logistics allows. But he has never had any desire to do every mile, 12 hour days or the terrain like NH has to offer.

I have discussed this and all trip plans with both of my trip companions, as well as my WIFE (Yes Gambit finally got married, life is great) and they all 3 are going to help me put common sense over dedication to going on the trip.

My plan B is if NH just doesn't look reasonable for Late June, that the 3 of us will save our vaca time for October, and redo a section for a week or two that they two have not yet done. I am always up for some more PA time so that wouldn't be that bad :)

Lets just say for sanity check, how does the following table look from a reasonable perspective?




June 20

July 4th

15








Start
Total Miles
Stop
Miles
Days
Total Day
Slack?
Drive Miles
Drive Time
Nights Location
Driver POI


US3 - Franconia Notch, NH
27.7
US302 - Crawford Notch, NH
27.7
3
3
No
21.1
25




US302 - Crawford Notch, NH
40.2
Mt Washington
12.5
1
4
Yes
42
90
Mt Washington Summit



Mt Washington
53.7
NH16 - Pinkham Notch, NH
13.5
1
5
Yes
10.4
45




zero
53.7
Zero - Gorham, NH
0
1
6
NA
10.6
15
Gorham, NH



NH16 - Pinkham Notch, NH
74.8
US2 - Gorham, NH
21.1
2
8
No
10.6
15




US2 - Gorham, NH
105.9
ME26 - Grafton Notch, ME
31.1
3
11
No
39.3
48
1/2/West Bethel



zero
105.9
Zero - West Bethel
0
1
12
NA
19.4
25
West Bethel



ME26 - Grafton Notch, ME
116.2
EB Hill RD - Andover, ME
10.3
1
13
Yes
11.2
20




EB Hill RD - Andover, ME
126.3
S Arm RD, Black Brook ME
10.1
1
14
Yes
16.3
30




S Arm RD, Black Brook ME
139.6
ME-17 Oquossoc, ME
13.3
1
15
Yes
19.9
35






Total
139.6
15


200.8
348

[Christoph]

Looks like great plan, with a backup plan. I'm planning one around the Smokies so I can get miles in and be with my brother who's sectioning the whole thing.

[Slo-go'en]

Driving straight through, eh? It will take longer then 18 hours, even if you break the speed limit most of the way. You will need to stop for gas at least 3 times and to stretch legs, switch drivers, get something to eat. You might snooze a little when not driving, but don't expect to be rested. Then you expect to find an open tent platform at Liberty Springs on a Saturday afternoon? Not going to happen. Unless it's raining buckets, which is a possibility.

A better plan would be to rest Saturday and head up Sunday. It's a long hard day, but it's possible to go from Franconia to Garfield tent site, then to Crawford the next day, but it will be almost dark by the time you get to Crawford and you will be very tired.

How do you plan to get down off of Washington? Your buddy going to drive up? The summit of Mt Washington is a NH state park. Currently only NH residents are allowed in state parks. Maybe this will change middle of June, but maybe not.

The big unknown is weather. June can be a chilly and wet month. You can count on at least 4-5 rainy days in a two week span. Maybe more. Much of the trail you want to hike is a place you really don't want to be in stormy weather. You just have to take your chances with the weather and hope you have good days when you really need them.

[peakbagger]

I have done marathon drives in the past including Franklin TN to Gorham NH in on shot solo after 2 weeks of hiking. and a lot of one shots to PA and VA. The trick is bring a cooler and while one person is gassing up the others are using the facilities. Long stops ruin the average speed. Generally unless there is enforcement the trucks are running 80 MPH. I have also done solos from Green Bay Wi to Portland a few times. I don't sleep in car so doesn't make much difference whether I drive.

My guess is NH is going to let tourists in by July. Worst case scramble up your route a bit and save Washington for the last day so its in July if possible. That said my suspicion is that there will be attempts at limiting traffic up the mountain to prevent the inevitable crowding at the summit. They really do not like to book reservations for hikers down on the vans in the PM You may want to consider lining up at the gate in the AM or see if they are running the AM hiker shuttle and do two top to bottom hikes two days in row or maybe break them up as they are both long days due to the rockhopping. Starting out fresh in AM from the summit is nice and not having to climb up 4000 feet doesn't hurt. Once you head down Madison past treeline, not much for views but Webster Cliffs on the other end is far better going north to south then south the north view wise. Beware the hike from Pinkham has some serious elevation changes along the way. Carter Notch is steep down and up while descending North Carter and Moriah both have real steep slopes.

This is some serious mileage, bad weather could screw things up. These are thru hiker daily miles for the whites, most weekend warriors would have a tough time getting up to speed from weekend hikes to daily hikes of this magnitude, I would suggest that the last couple of days may be aspirational. You may need a zero or two if the weather is dangerous. The nice thing with the plan is if you are flexible having a transport driver can really help do on the fly revisions. There are lots of side roads with side trails that connect up with the AT (if he can find them). Do some research in advance on Success Pond road in Berlin and Bull Branch Road at the end of the Sunday River Road to cover yourself. The fire roads in the National Forest are not that hard to find.

The roads with the free national forest sites are the south end of Cherry Mountain road, Haystack Road and Gale River Loop Road. They are first come first served with zero facilities, very popular Friday and Sat nights.

[Astro]

Since appears two will be hiking with one more shuttling and day hiking, perhaps the NH locals could provide Gambitt with expectations as far as cell coverage. It is great having that third guy with the car, especially if you have to pull an audible and change plans, but how realistic is it to always have cell coverage to do that?
Perhaps not an issue, but want to make sure realistic assumptions are being made.

[Slo-go'en]

Cell coverage is mostly okay, but in the notches it's iffy. Really iffy once into Maine.

I would suggest seeing about making a weeks reservation at the FS Dolly Cop campground. It's close to Gorham and more or less centrally located. It would be easier to get in and out of, and less risky of finding campsites along the FS roads, which really aren't conveniently located for the most part. If you detour onto these roads and can't find a site and it's getting dark, what then?

Success pond road is really beat up, especially the sections the ATVers are allowed on. Top speed is 10 MPH and not recommend for a sedan.

[Gambit McCrae]

Cell coverage is mostly okay, but in the notches it's iffy. Really iffy once into Maine.

I would suggest seeing about making a weeks reservation at the FS Dolly Cop campground. It's close to Gorham and more or less centrally located. It would be easier to get in and out of, and less risky of finding campsites along the FS roads, which really aren't conveniently located for the most part. If you detour onto these roads and can't find a site and it's getting dark, what then?

Success pond road is really beat up, especially the sections the ATVers are allowed on. Top speed is 10 MPH and not recommend for a sedan.

Thanks Slo I will be checking into that campground tomorrow!

[Slo-go'en]

One other thing, It would be easier to take the Mt Washington 9AM hiker shuttle to the summit and then hiking down to either Pinkham or Crawford.

[Gambit McCrae]

One other thing, It would be easier to take the Mt Washington 9AM hiker shuttle to the summit and then hiking down to either Pinkham or Crawford.
Or both 2 days in a row aye?

[peakbagger]

Or both 2 days in a row aye?

Yes, generally in the summer the summits and ridgeline build clouds during the day, its not unusual to see the summits start to build clouds as the day heats up. Photochemical smog in the air also forms as the day warms up so views tend to haze up in the afternoon. Also air quality can degrade as the day warms up. Late June is a bit early for thunderstorms but they tend to form during the afternoon and the summits attract thunderstorms (you will be hiking past Thunderstorm Junction on Mt Adams. Obviously if there a front coming through it could be cloudy in the AM and clear during the day but in general the weather is cooler but nicer in the AM on the summit ridge. Sun exposure is also something to consider. Hiking above treeline during mid day can really cause a major sunburn. If you are hiking in the morning when its cool its easier to wear long pants and sleeves otherwise you really need to slather on the sunblock. Therefore starting on top and hiking down to the valleys improves your chances of optimizing your views and experience from above treeline. You may start out with warmer gear in the AM but you would be carrying it anyhow. The longest day of the year is June 21st so you can hike without a headlamp until about 9 PM. Logistically its easier and with the potential limits on summit capacity you are better off heading up early than taking your friend taking his chances on being able to get up to the summit late in the day. The road closes to get guests down before dark so there is chance you can get stranded if you are running late.

Its also more likely you will want to visit the various summits along the way in the AM when you are fresh. Dedicated whiteblazers skip the summits of Eisenhower, Monroe, Clay Jefferson and Adams (all worth the visit). There are definitely side trails off the AT to visit the summits but they usually are a 500 foot elevation gain. I suspect many thruhikers at this point just go over the summits and skip the AT but its little harder to get the motivation later in the day then in the AM.

[Slo-go'en]

The one time I took the hiker shuttle to the summit of Washington in late June, I was able to see the ocean. An hour later it was already clouding up.

[peakbagger]

There is book out there called Scudders viewing guide and I believe its has a section on why you typically can not see the ocean from the top of Mt Washington except in the morning when the sun angle is low enough to reflect off the water. Its been awhile but I think its even gave guidelines on what of day at different times of the day someone would have to be there. On the other hand its not unusual to be able to see Mt Washington the ocean.

BTW the autoroad in the past few years offered reservation only monthly sunrise viewing events where they opened early to let folks see the sunrise. Obviously everything is up in the air this year.

[Astro]

The warning about sunburn is real. I grew up in South Flordia and rarely ever get one, but coming down Madision I was exposed on a sunny day (for which I was grateful), and the back of my neck got pretty red. Also some on my scalp as the wind was blowing too hard to keep a hat on. Of course you will be moving faster than me, but still not a bad idea to have a little sun screen lotion, even if it is not something you usually need.

The AT is the green tunnel where I usually loose my tan on my summer section hikes, but walking on the ridge above treeline is an exception, especially on a clear sunny day.

[Gambit McCrae]

Trip Update:
Both friends bailed.
My wife wanted to go and to be a full time support for 2 weeks.
We have an AirBnB in Bethel, a rental car for 2 weeks and I will be doing a mix of 2-3 night overnight sections, along with 5-6 day hikes to complete the rest of NH and up into ME however far I end up.
She is working very hard on her masters and has never been to NH, nor ME so this will give her distraction free time to work on that, visit some new states and fulfill her want to support me while on trail.
It will help me greatly in NH/ ME logistics, resupply, packweights etc.

With the way long distance hiking has been due to Covid this year, I feel that this is the safest, most logical way to both hike in 2020 and realistically complete NH and ME as a section hiker.

[Astro]

Trip Update:
Both friends bailed.
My wife wanted to go and to be a full time support for 2 weeks.
We have an AirBnB in Bethel, a rental car for 2 weeks and I will be doing a mix of 2-3 night overnight sections, along with 5-6 day hikes to complete the rest of NH and up into ME however far I end up.
She is working very hard on her masters and has never been to NH, nor ME so this will give her distraction free time to work on that, visit some new states and fulfill her want to support me while on trail.
It will help me greatly in NH/ ME logistics, resupply, packweights etc.

With the way long distance hiking has been due to Covid this year, I feel that this is the safest, most logical way to both hike in 2020 and realistically complete NH and ME as a section hiker.
Still planning to start June 20th?
Looking forward to your trip report. Have a great and safe hike!

[Gambit McCrae]

Still planning to start June 20th?
Looking forward to your trip report. Have a great and safe hike!

Not quite but within a week of june 20th. For some reason I am weird about reporting start days sometimes lol

[Slo-go'en]

I guess like most everywhere else, it's gotten crazy busy around here all of a sudden. (they lifted the ban on 4K qualification) Weekends are of course nuts. The good news is the Dolly Copp campground is open. Be sure to arrive mid week or it could be full.

[BillyGr]

Just be sure to check - I had seen it posted somewhere that ME was asking for a recent negative test for those visiting from some areas, so you'd want to be sure if that was needed for either/both of you.

[Alligator]

If you aren't aware of it, here are Maine's requirements for out of state visitors, including out of state lodgers at AirBnB. https://www.maine.gov/covid19/restartingmaine/keepmainehealthy.

[peakbagger]

Bethel has a recently opened Maine Mineral Museum that has gotten a lot of good press. All the trail crossings in Maine are readily accessible, I would not punish your wife by forcing her to drive on Success Pond Road. Its a very rough and slow some years and cell coverage is bad. If you want to break up the Mahoosucs you can get at the eastern half from North Road in Shelburne. There is good cell coverage along RT 2 but once you get off it, it degrades down in the notches. Make your calls while up on the ridge facing south. The shortest blue blaze to the road is from Gentian Pond via Austin Brook trail. You can save a mile of walking by being picked up or dropped off on Mill Brook road, an improved dirt road that turns off North Road in Shelburne. The other lesser used blue blaze is the Goose Eye trail that goes south from the Mahoosuc trail to Bull Branch road. Bull Branch road is a dead end extension to the Sunday River road that starts in Bethel and then cuts into Newry Me. Drive all the way to the end of the road and take a left over Twin Bridges then an immediate right. the end of the road is blocked with the Goose Eye trailhead to the left. Bull Branche stream is popular local swimming spot. East B Hill road and South Arm road are accessed from Andover and are excellent dirt roads. There is logging road that ends near the AT between Blue and Elephant but I am unsure what condition the Road is. Height of Land on Rt 17 is an excellent paved state highway but infested with Moose who will walk out f the woods across the road with no care if you are speeding at them. That said the views from Height of Land are about as good as it gets. Sunset or sunrise are both worth the wait.

[Slo-go'en]

I drove the Success pond road to the Goose Eye trail head the other day. Wasn't toooo bad. Rough in the usual spots where the ATVers tear it up, but relatively short. Still, high clearance and all wheel drive is recommended. And it takes about a half hour to go the 8 miles at 15 mph. Look out for the yahoos with big trucks, one almost skidded into me coming around a corner too fast!

[Gambit McCrae]

All-
Grafton to EB Hill - 10.3 miles
EB Hill to S Arm Rd - 10.1 Miles
S Arm rd to ME17 - 13.3 Miles

Are these 3 reasonable day hikes?

[Astro]

All-
Grafton to EB Hill - 10.3 miles
EB Hill to S Arm Rd - 10.1 Miles
S Arm rd to ME17 - 13.3 Miles

Are these 3 reasonable day hikes?

Definitely for you. It pretty much what I did there last summer, and I am old and slow.

[somers515]

Trip Update:
Both friends bailed.
My wife wanted to go and to be a full time support for 2 weeks.
We have an AirBnB in Bethel, a rental car for 2 weeks and I will be doing a mix of 2-3 night overnight sections, along with 5-6 day hikes to complete the rest of NH and up into ME however far I end up. . . .With the way long distance hiking has been due to Covid this year, I feel that this is the safest, most logical way to both hike in 2020 and realistically complete NH and ME as a section hiker.

How does your plan not violate NH's rule for visitors from out-of-state to self-quarantine for 14 days? I don't see the if-you-test-negative exemption that Maine has or the if-you-come-from-county-that-has-under-400-active-cases-per-million exemption that Vermont has. I'm asking because I'd like to legally hike in NH too.

https://www.covidguidance.nh.gov/out-state-visitors

[Gambit McCrae]

How does your plan not violate NH's rule for visitors from out-of-state to self-quarantine for 14 days? I don't see the if-you-test-negative exemption that Maine has or the if-you-come-from-county-that-has-under-400-active-cases-per-million exemption that Vermont has. I'm asking because I'd like to legally hike in NH too.

https://www.covidguidance.nh.gov/out-state-visitors

Covid will not be discussed in this thread. Tired of hearing about it. If we cant discuss the hike, shut down the thread and i will just go walk like i intend to do regardless of the comments here.

I am looking for helpful information only at this time thanks

[egilbe]

All-
Grafton to EB Hill - 10.3 miles
EB Hill to S Arm Rd - 10.1 Miles
S Arm rd to ME17 - 13.3 Miles

Are these 3 reasonable day hikes?

Yep, perfect day hikes. MY GF and I wanted an overnight when we did S. Arm to 17, so we stopped at the lake, an early day, and continued the next morning. Two short days, but it was fun being out for the weekend. I think its Swift Pond campsite, or something like that. Worst privy I've seen on the AT. I think they've since replaced it with the new ADA compliant ones. Those things are a mansion!

Just a warning, those are some steep up and downs in those three days, but they aren't tall hills. It will probably be hot and muggy. Hall Mountain and Old Blue made me physically ill. Two of the three times I remember bonking while hiking.

[rubyvermonter]

Covid will not be discussed in this thread. Tired of hearing about it. If we cant discuss the hike, shut down the thread and i will just go walk like i intend to do regardless of the comments here.

I am looking for helpful information only at this time thanks

The most helpful information anyone can give you is what you will face in NH or ME if you do not follow COVID-19 protocols. In those states, as well as Vermont, the confirmed cases are pretty low because people are following the protocols. You won't be able to get lodging and you may not find anyone willing to shuttle you if you don't follow the state protocols.

[Gambit McCrae]

The most helpful information anyone can give you is what you will face in NH or ME if you do not follow COVID-19 protocols. In those states, as well as Vermont, the confirmed cases are pretty low because people are following the protocols. You won't be able to get lodging and you may not find anyone willing to shuttle you if you don't follow the state protocols.

Covid will not be discussed in this thread. Tired of hearing about it. If we cant discuss the hike, shut down the thread and i will just go walk like i intend to do regardless of the comments here.

I am looking for helpful information only at this time thanks

[Gambit McCrae]

Yep, perfect day hikes. MY GF and I wanted an overnight when we did S. Arm to 17, so we stopped at the lake, an early day, and continued the next morning. Two short days, but it was fun being out for the weekend. I think its Swift Pond campsite, or something like that. Worst privy I've seen on the AT. I think they've since replaced it with the new ADA compliant ones. Those things are a mansion!

Just a warning, those are some steep up and downs in those three days, but they aren't tall hills. It will probably be hot and muggy. Hall Mountain and Old Blue made me physically ill. Two of the three times I remember bonking while hiking.

You have always been a great source for useful information! I am excited to see how this adventure goes

[Alligator]

People telling you about the changing Covid-19 regulations regarding out-of-state visitors should be considered helpful since it helps you to abide by the laws of the state you are visiting.

To meet the state's quarantine requirements, visitors must attest that they "remained at a home for at least 14 days before arriving in New Hampshire, only going out for essential items and when outside of the home maintaining social distancing and wearing face masks when within less than 6 feet of another person during this 14 day 'quarantine.'"

Besides that, part of the WB user agreement states


4. Discussions involving how to commit illegal acts, or involving the use, production and/or distribution of illegal drugs are forbidden.

Since you have told me personally you will have satisfied both NH and ME's conditions for out-of-state travelers, I have reopened the thread. There are no further issues there legally so no further discussion is necessary regarding pandemic regulations.

[Gambit McCrae]

Thank you everyone for posting helpful knowledge as well as concerns about the pandemic.
I have taken all actions required to abide by NH and ME CDC regulations.
I appreciate the kind messages while the thread was not available.
I am looking forward to the trip, and will certainly post a trip report upon my return.

If anyone has further information or data to share please do so that others and myself can gain the knowledge.

This is what I have planned but am going to let the weather determine schedule, and order of the sections.

Franconia Notch to Crawford Notch - NOBO 2.5 days backpack 27.7 miles

Mt Washington Summit to Crawford - SObo Slackpack 12.5
Mt Wasington summit to Pinkham - NObo Slackpack 13.5

Pinkham Notch to Gorham - NoBo 2 days backpack 21.1
Gorham, NH to Grafton Notch ME - Nobo 3 Days backpack 31.1

Grafton Notch to East B HIll Rd - NObo slackpack 10.3
East B Hill Rd to south Arm - NoBo Slackpack 10.1
South Arm to ME17 - Nobo Slackpack 13.3

This leaves me with 2-3 zero days to take, and a daily average of <10 miles per day. Extra zeros/ time can be picked from the backside of the trip if needed

[Slo-go'en]

I don't know if AMC tent sites are officially open yet or not. You need to call to make sure. Once north of RT 2, that won't be an issue.

It gets wicked hot and humid this weekend and the black flies are getting thick. You have a choice - wear t-shirt and shorts and get eaten alive or cover up and sweat to death. It's been really dry, so water sources are starting to dry up.

3 days from Gorham to Grafton is gonna be hard, especially after the previous couple of days. Those 10 mile days are like 20 in effort.

[Slo-go'en]

Looking over to Jefferson, Clay and Washington from the Gulf side trail (AT) yesterday afternoon. Wait until you have to hop over that rock pile!
46546

[steve_zavocki]

Somehow it seems like cheating not climbing Mt, Washington ;) It was memorable climbing in the wind and cold where I only see the next carin (sobo). I made a wrong turn and took the bypass trail and had to turn around.

It is possible to do Pinkham Notch to Rt 2 as a slackpack. It is tough but doable and took me 12:45 hrs.

IMO Franconia Notch to Crawford Notch would be better SOBO. Climbing the waterfall before Garfield campsite was memorable. If it were me, I would determine the direction based on the weather. If day 1 is sunny then go NOBO to ensure you get the full majesty of Franconia Ridge, if it was cloudy on day 1 then I would start at Crawford Notch and hope for better weather by the time you get to Franconia ridge.

[Gambit McCrae]

Looking over to Jefferson, Clay and Washington from the Gulf side trail (AT) yesterday afternoon. Wait until you have to hop over that rock pile!
46546

Man O Man that looks awesome!


Somehow it seems like cheating not climbing Mt, Washington ;) It was memorable climbing in the wind and cold where I only see the next carin (sobo). I made a wrong turn and took the bypass trail and had to turn around.

It is possible to do Pinkham Notch to Rt 2 as a slackpack. It is tough but doable and took me 12:45 hrs.

IMO Franconia Notch to Crawford Notch would be better SOBO. Climbing the waterfall before Garfield campsite was memorable. If it were me, I would determine the direction based on the weather. If day 1 is sunny then go NOBO to ensure you get the full majesty of Franconia Ridge, if it was cloudy on day 1 then I would start at Crawford Notch and hope for better weather by the time you get to Franconia ridge.

I totally feel like i am cheating myself on Mt washington :( But I have to set myself up logistically for what makes sense for me. And I can most definitely make another trip to NH during better times and climb it both ways!

Thanks SZ that definately makes sense about choosing direction based on forecasts.

I will also look into the Pinkham to rt2 as a slack. My best day in the Whites is only 16.3. I want a 20+ real bad... Looks like this stretch is my chance

[peakbagger]

Plenty of bail out points along the way once you get on the Carters. If you are feeling good after dropping steeply down off Wildcat to C notch and then back up to Carter Dome you have the worse of it done. Make sure you tank up with water at C Notch, the next reliable water is Imp Shelter.

[Gambit McCrae]

Detailed Closures and Cancellations
Cancelled and closed until July 1, 2020:

All AMC facilities, shelters, campsites, trips, programs, and activities

[jigsaw]

have fun gambit. the section from pinkham to grafton is unlike any other.watch out for those ladders on goose eye.you dont want to slip there

[Gambit McCrae]

Day 1 - hiked 13.3 miles ME17 to South Arm.
Day 2 and 3 Were a wash. Heavy rain and storms. Drove out to the trail this morning and the ford was raging. :(
should be back on track in the morning for another 10 miles or so. Took the rain out days to explore maine and grafton notth state park.
saw a female moose on day 1 along south arm rd
maine is beautiful

I have now hiked in all 14 states of the AT!!! Now to plug away at these last few hundred miles

[Slo-go'en]

Looks pretty unsettled for a while. Saturday the 4th looks to be the best day in near future. Good luck. Afternoons are the high risk times.

[Gambit McCrae]

Day 1-hiked
day 2-4 rained and I hung low
days 5-7 hiked

Have completed Grafton Notch to ME 4 as well as Mt Washington to Crawford Notch

60 miles complete so far

Back out in the morning to knock more off the list.

I can not explain how Perfect of a day it was for the washington to crawford section yesterday. Spectacular.
What a trip so far

[Slo-go'en]

One last good day tomorrow then it will too blasted hot and humid the rest of the week.

[Gambit McCrae]

Day 8- hiked washington to pinkham
Day 9- kayaked the Androscoggin River 10 miles and saw 2 Bald eagles.
Day 10-Tomorrow is a wash with storms.
Day 11 & 12 Will be spent from Franconia notch to Crawford.
Day 13 & 14 - Traveling

[peakbagger]

Great you had a chance to do the river. I expect you did the stretch from Shelburne to Bethel (or maybe Gilead). The various channels around the islands are fun. Almost always a few eagles and herons. I have seen moose on occasion and even two bears over the years.

BTW for your partner, there is small farmers market on the common in Gorham Thursdays 3 to 6. There is a lady who makes great Thai food. This time of th year its a lot of jellys, jams, baked goods and maple syrup although its fresh strawberry season.

Looks downright hot and muggy Thursday and Friday, good time to be up high on the ridgeline. At least the water source will get a recharge. FYI if Zealand and Galehead Hut is open with caretakers, they treat the water with some product that has bad aftertaste. You are pretty well stuck with Galehead but you can just pull it out of the falls and treat it at Zealand.

[Slo-go'en]

I was at Galehead recently (couple of weeks ago) and it was still locked down. There was water at the outdoor spigot. I didn't think it tasted too bad, but I did add a couple of lemon-lime NUUNs to it.

[Gambit McCrae]

Well this is frustrating. NH and Southern Maine weather have been tricky. Due partially to being solo on this trip, as well as trying to become wiser as I age, I have sat out heavy forecasted storm/ rain days this trip. I recall several sections this trip that I recall telling myself it would not be fun and in many cases downright unsafe to do them in a storm or rain. Looks like today bit me in the rear though. It was 90% of bad storms forecasted. Which ment i didnt start a section yesterday so that I wasn't putting myself in danger of ridge line storms today. But now as the day goes on, forecast gets better and better. However at this stage of the trip, i only have time for one more section if I were to hike today or start tomorrow. So Im going to stick to my plan and start tomorrow.

As of today I have 300.3 miles of the AT left.

[Slo-go'en]

We could still be in for a good storm this afternoon. It is a bit of a hit or miss. Tomorrow looks okay (although wicked hot and humid), but Friday afternoon is looking iffy again. Thankfully, once you get down to Zealand, your in the woods on reasonably easy trail.

This is why I don't like to hike much in July. I told my young hiking partner if she wants to keep me around, we need to dial back our hikes until the weather cools down again. We've done some seriously strenuous hikes lately and they are starting to take a toll on me!

[Gambit McCrae]

Well folks. My walking is done for this trip. I wrapped up the adventure with crawford to franconia and finished at 8:30 last night getting a 21 mile day in the white mountains of NH, and as well it marked 1900 miles of the AT complete. I did not get all of the miles in that I had planned for as I go home with Pinkham to Grafton Notch still to walk. But I am happy with the trip for sure.

270 miles left and my dream becomes reality. Full trip report to come soon. Thank you everyone for all the help!

[Slo-go'en]

Come back in the fall next time. September is great around here.

[Recalc]

Enjoy following your progress Gambit. Looking forward to the trip report.

[Gambit McCrae]

Come back in the fall next time. September is great around here.

I will be back September 1st for another week. Will be seeking out a shuttle!