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neo
09-07-2006, 22:35
were do the whites in nh start and end,i will be in gorham next tuesday evening,i will hike south to kinsman notch:cool: neo

Jack Tarlin
09-07-2006, 22:40
In this part of New Hampshire, Neo, most folks consider Mt. Moosilauke the real start of the Whites, and they effectively continue to the Maine border.

Hikerhead
09-08-2006, 00:23
Hey Neo, me and Kerosene are hiking north from Glencliff for 8 or 9 days starting this sat. We're trying to get to Gorham but we'll see how far we go. DebW is going to the Moose with us. I'm bringing this big ol' horse by the name of Stumpknocker up with me, IF I can get him in my car. He's hiking south from Glencliff to Catawba. I'll be about 4 hrs behind Kerosene. I hope that we can run into you and say "howdie".

DawnTreader
09-08-2006, 00:42
Neo & Jack,
I think, maybe Weary would know for sure, that the Mahoosuc Range is technically considered part of the Whites.

MedicineMan
09-08-2006, 01:03
i'm hoping to spend 3 weeks next September/October between Glencliff and Gorham so any and all info is appreciated. I wrote the AMC hut folks asking if it is possible to hike from hut to hut with reservations but go no answer...

Hikerhead
09-08-2006, 01:09
I believe a lot of the huts start shutting down for the season at the end of next week. The AMC site has a lot of info.

Hikerhead
09-08-2006, 01:17
I take that back, only Lake of the Clouds and Madison Springs are shutting down at the end of next week. The others appear to be open in some fashion to the mid or end of Oct. Sorry.

Kerosene
09-08-2006, 04:46
You can certainly make reservations and hike between huts. I've heard that you can also have a hut radio ahead to the next hut to reserve you space. Can't wait to find out next week!

MedicineMan
09-08-2006, 05:31
i hate to re-invent the wheel so detailed notes of your section hike would be every so swwwwwwweeeeeeeeettttttttt.

Tin Man
09-08-2006, 05:54
Neo, Hikerhead, & Kerosene,

Enjoy your hike! My brother and are doing Hanover to Kinsman the first week of October, so we will not be running into you. Any details you can share on the weather or huts at this time of year will be interesting to us as we plan to continue north from Kinsman next fall.

Neo, make sure your hammock is secure when you tie off between those cairns! :cool:

Kerosene
09-08-2006, 06:40
Will do,MedicineMan and Tin Man. I'll post a summary of my journal here and send you an e-mail with full pictures. I'm s-l-o-w-l-y trying to get everything onto Trailjournals, but I've got 20 years of hikes to enter.

neo
09-08-2006, 07:39
i'm hoping to spend 3 weeks next September/October between Glencliff and Gorham so any and all info is appreciated. I wrote the AMC hut folks asking if it is possible to hike from hut to hut with reservations but go no answer...

i will take as many hammock hanging pictures as possible:cool: neo

MedicineMan
09-08-2006, 07:41
good luck man! and def. use the neotarp on the trip so the pictures will rule :)

neo
09-08-2006, 07:41
Neo, Hikerhead, & Kerosene,

Enjoy your hike! My brother and are doing Hanover to Kinsman the first week of October, so we will not be running into you. Any details you can share on the weather or huts at this time of year will be interesting to us as we plan to continue north from Kinsman next fall.

Neo, make sure your hammock is secure when you tie off between those cairns! :cool:

have great hike:cool: neo

Gray Blazer
09-08-2006, 07:45
Neo, try to get some other pics, too, besides all the hammock shots! Have fun. Wish I was there.

neo
09-08-2006, 07:56
Hey Neo, me and Kerosene are hiking north from Glencliff for 8 or 9 days starting this sat. We're trying to get to Gorham but we'll see how far we go. DebW is going to the Moose with us. I'm bringing this big ol' horse by the name of Stumpknocker up with me, IF I can get him in my car. He's hiking south from Glencliff to Catawba. I'll be about 4 hrs behind Kerosene. I hope that we can run into you and say "howdie".


i hope i get to meet you two,hope you have a great hike:cool: neo

neo
09-08-2006, 08:00
were do the whites in nh start and end,i will be in gorham next tuesday evening,i will hike south to kinsman notch:cool: neo

i just looked at a map of nh,it look like the white mountain national forrest starts slightly south of glenciff to gorham :cool: neo

The Old Fhart
09-08-2006, 08:05
Neo asked where the Whites start and end but I think he actually wanted to know what parts of his up-coming trip are in the Whites. Where Neo is going is from Gorham to Kinsman Notch, essentially all of his trip is in the Whites, with a few exceptions.

To answer Neo's and some other's questions, the Whites do extend into Maine but you leave the Whites just before you cross RT-2 in Shelbourne, NH and head north toward the Mahoosucs, so there is about 27 miles of the A.T. from RT-2 through the Mahoosucs in New Hampshire that isn't in the WMNF but was James River Paper Company land.

The AMC owns 1 acre of land, I believe at Madison Hut, the other huts are on land they lease from the WMNF. There is also the summit of Mount Washington that is a state park as well as a few miles in Crawford Notch and Franconia Notch State Parks. Interestingly, Dartmouth College owns a large chunk of land kind of south and east of the summit of Mt. Moosilauke so you actually can be hiking on college land and not be in Hanover. Parts of Glencliff are outside the WMNF and hiking northbound you enter the Whites around RT-25C, west of Glencliff.

Probably a more pertinent question would be where northbound in New Hampshire does the hiking get rough, which is what most people associate with the Whites. I certainly would include the climb up Smarts Mountain to be an eye-opener.

neo
09-08-2006, 08:05
good luck man! and def. use the neotarp on the trip so the pictures will rule :)

i will carry my 9x9 camo tarp
and my camo hammock with no netting,
and my jetboil with camo cozk
and picture of hillary clinton in camo:cool: neo

Tramper Al
09-08-2006, 08:29
Hey,

The White Mountains (and even the place name) are a lot older than any National Forest Boundary. I mean if people asked you about the extent of the Appalachian Mountain Range, no property line or political boundaries would affect your answer, right? You might even start talking about Newfoundland or Ireland, yes? Of course it depends on what neo was really after, but the White Mountains as a mountain range go well into Maine with the AT. I have always put the line at Grafton Notch, but some may go a bit further even.

Peaks
09-08-2006, 09:11
If you go to www.outdoors.org, you can get an updated status of hut availablity. Generally speaking at this time of the year, the is ample space during the week. It's just Saturday night, and sometimes Friday night when space may be tight.

And, as others have posted, Madison and Lakes close September 16 this year. Others remain open later.

The Old Fhart
09-08-2006, 11:12
Tramper Al-"Of course it depends on what neo was really after, but the White Mountains as a mountain range go well into Maine with the AT. I have always put the line at Grafton Notch, but some may go a bit further even."
i just looked at a map of nh,it look like the white mountain national forrest starts slightly south of glenciff to gorham:cool: neoI was going by what his plans were and his last post confirms that is what he meant. If a hiker is hiking the A.T. they are interested in the narrow footpath they are on and generally don't care about any area outside of where they are going to walk. I had tried to answer the question both ways before to satisfy all. The Appalachian chain may go much farther north (Newfoundland or Ireland?) but the Whites do not.

neo
09-08-2006, 11:19
I was going by what his plans were and his last post confirms that is what he meant. If a hiker is hiking the A.T. they are interested in the narrow footpath they are on and generally don't care about any area outside of where they are going to walk. I had tried to answer the question both ways before to satisfy all. The Appalachian chain may go much farther north (Newfoundland or Ireland?) but the Whites do not.

thats right oldfhart,only interested in the whites the AT goes thru,i am shooting for gorham to kinsman notch in 8 days and 91 miles that would be
11.38 miles per day.thanks again:cool: neo

Heater
09-08-2006, 11:24
i will carry my 9x9 camo tarp
and my camo hammock with no netting,
and my jetboil with camo cozk
and picture of hillary clinton in camo:cool: neo

I bought a new hat yesterday an saw one of these.

http://www.hartfordyork.com/images/uploads/913_747_large.jpg (http://www.hartfordyork.com/product/913/toby-keith-hats#)

:D I said to myself, Neo would like one of those.:cool:

Have fun on your hike.:)

neo
09-08-2006, 11:25
I bought a new hat yesterday an saw one of these.

http://www.hartfordyork.com/images/uploads/913_747_large.jpg (http://www.hartfordyork.com/product/913/toby-keith-hats#)

:D I said to myself, Neo would like one of those.:cool:

Have fun on your hike.:)

cool hat,i like it:cool: neo

Tramper Al
09-08-2006, 13:57
If a hiker is hiking the A.T. they are interested in the narrow footpath they are on and generally don't care about any area outside of where they are going to walk.


thats right oldfhart,only interested in the whites the AT goes thru . . .

Sorry, but I really was talking about the White Mountains to the extent that the trail goes through. When I wrote "with the AT" and "Grafton Notch", I was suggesting that the Mahoosucs and Old Speck are part of the White Mountain Range, geologically speaking. You guys disagree, which is fine.

Have a great hike, neo, and thanks O.F. for clarifying.

Trillium
09-08-2006, 22:08
neo,
will you be updating turtle's trail journal before you go? I see it's still stuck on Aug 26.

neo
09-08-2006, 22:23
neo,
will you be updating turtle's trail journal before you go? I see it's still stuck on Aug 26.

she has her husband updating it,i just post the link,i leave for gorham tuesday morning myself:cool: neo

Tinker
09-09-2006, 00:15
In this part of New Hampshire, Neo, most folks consider Mt. Moosilauke the real start of the Whites, and they effectively continue to the Maine border.

I agree with Jack on the subject in question. The Whites, however, imo, are not the toughest part of New England's AT. I think the Mahoosucks (on the NH/Me. border and the mountains north, Baldpate, and especially Hall and Moody mountains, are much tougher. In the Whites, or should I say the Presidentials, the highest peaks in the Whites, once you're up, you're up, basically. After that, it's a couple hundred feet up and down from peak to peak on the AT. The rocks are tough on knees and ankles, however.

weary
09-09-2006, 00:25
Neo & Jack,
I think, maybe Weary would know for sure, that the Mahoosuc Range is technically considered part of the Whites.
The White Mountain National Forest pretty much ends at Gorham Shelburn, though a piece extends into Maine south of the Mahoosucs.

The Mahoosuc Range runs from Gorham, NH another 15 miles to the Maine border and continues another 15 miles or so through Maine to Grafton Notch At least this is the area that that is traditionally called the Mahoosucs.. However, geologists tell me that identical mountains continue northerly another 25 miles or so through the Baldpates and some say, the triple peaks of Bemis.

The Maine Bureau of Parks and Lands owns the Maine portion of the Mahoosucs, through the Baldpates. I don't know which agency owns the narrow trail corridor in New Hampshire, but it's either the National Park Service or the US Forest Service, probably.

I guess my answer is I really don't know where the Whites end. I know that if the Whites are considered a geologic area they don't "end" at the Maine-New Hampshire border since there is nothing there but an invisible line. The mountain range, whatever it may be called, just keeps going.

Logically, if the White Mountains include the Mahoosuc Range, they include all of the range.

Weary

Mr. Clean
09-09-2006, 13:19
I always considered Gorham the end of the Whites, the Mahoosucs being another mtn chain, but of course, the Whites, geologically speaking, prolly run to the end of the Baldpates. I'm still gonna say they end in Gorham, esp. since the Mahoosucs are so different.

weary
09-09-2006, 16:04
I always considered Gorham the end of the Whites, the Mahoosucs being another mtn chain, but of course, the Whites, geologically speaking, prolly run to the end of the Baldpates. I'm still gonna say they end in Gorham, esp. since the Mahoosucs are so different.
If I remember rightly, the term "Whites" was originally a label applied by seamen sailing along the Eastern coast. The above timberline portion of the Presidential Range especially appeared "white" to those sailing by, compared to other east coast ranges that were distinctly "green."

The cluster of peaks near the Presidentials soon took on the descriptive "whites," but I doubt if anyone ever set precise boundaries until the creation of the National Forest, which usurped the name.

Weary

rickb
09-09-2006, 16:08
I think the camping regulations change north of Gorham, too. Even though its
still the WHite Moiuntain National Forest, it's shelters/designated sites only until ME right?