View Full Version : max weight carried w/ trail runners?
iamscottym
12-19-2006, 15:05
I know footwear is a personal thing, but I was wondering what everyone thought was their weight limit with trail runners for a thru AT.
I've used trail runners with 50+ lb packs on other trails, but not for the long hall like a thru.
The reason I ask is that I'm joining the Marines, and that it doesn't make sense to blow a grand on new UL gear, when I just bought all new gear this summer. Right now I'm looking at a 13lb 11oz base (+ pack weight). My pack is an osprey crescent 85. While I love the pack, and while I am in very good shape, I just don't think I'm going to be able to hike a 4 month pace with it with boots. I was able to do some 20 mile days in SNP this fall, with about 90 lbs in it(yes, I'm marginally insane), and my asolo FSN 95 GTX boots, but I know I couldn't sustain that for 4 months, even on the flatter terrain of SNP. For that trip, my avg was closer to 12mpd.
My question is two fold; how much do people carry with trail runners, and how many miles/day were you doing.
Thanks,
iamscottym
I don't know about weight but I think it all has to do with how strong your ankles are. My ankles are pretty flexible and strong. I work about 9 months out of the year in cheap $7.00 Okabashi flip flops. I clean and repair swimming pools. I walk up and down rock waterfalls and am on uneven surfaces a lot.
Over the past few weeks I started wearing shoes because it cooled off. I twisted/rolled my ankle twice in the first week of wearing shoes. I didn't hurt myself but I did notice how shoes/boots can screw you up.
I just got a pair of Chacos that I'm hiking in now. You're young and strong like me. Just make sure your ankles are strong and flexible and walk on. Don't worry about it. I'd rather carry 40-50 lbs in sandals than 60-80 lbs. in boots.
Toughen your feet and keep your footwear light.
Just my thoughts though. HYOH!!!
astrogirl
12-19-2006, 18:19
I've carried up to 35 lbs. in sneakers, but no more than that.
It's a matter your conditioning. I live near the AT and hike on it as well as other local trails that are not well graded and are very rocky. This is excellent training for the ankles and the little muscles in your feet that help you balance.
I find I'm actually clumsier in boots than shoes, and that's saying something because I'm quite clumsy. I've been saved from many a fall by my poles (though sometimes I only use one, I've got to have one at least).
Weight is still weight and I doubt one's choice of footwear would make much difference as a means of comparison for the ease of comparing loads of different weights. So dont get so hung up on lightweight footwear as only good only for lightweight loads and, conversely, heavyweight footwear best for heavier loads. I recall seeing photos of Sherpas carrying huge loads upon their body while walking atop some flimsy footwear. I suspect they were capable of outwalking their clients whose gear they carried, while the client trod upon the newest and best.
All things being equal it is the footbed upon which one's foot rests that carries one's load-including one's own weight- and not the heavy (leather?) sides of the footbed attached to it. sadly enough, those heavy boots often have such a hard footbed that it requires a long break-in period for the wearer to conform their feet to the constricting confines of their footbed when, in fact, it should be quite the opposite: the wearer should be conforming their footbed to the shape of their feet. It makes a huge difference in comfort. Put your money in the footbed and dont be afraid to go light-even down to a good pair of sandals designed for the trail.
iamscottym
12-19-2006, 18:51
highway, good point. my main concern with trail running shoes is not my ankles, but rather the effect of lots of miles with extra weight on my arches. I do have superfeet in my boots, so I guess I'll get some for trail runners as well.
I just had a meeting/appointment with a podiatrist to express my concerns of a long distance hike... He stated that no matter what I do (boots, shoes, superfeet, sandals...) my arches are going to fall. It may only be millimeters or completely, but some flattening out will be done to them.
He became quite concerned when I told him my plans and said he'd do what he could to help, but nothing he or I could do would prevent at least some falling of the arches...
I have both boots and low cut trail shoes (not really a trail running type shoe) and both work great for me. You have to look at what will work best for you and give you the least amount of problems in the long run!
wacocelt
12-19-2006, 20:08
I've carried 60'ish lbs wearing keens for about 60 miles on the PCT this season and carried about the same in 2000 on the AT through the 100 mile wilderness wearing new balance running shoes, not even trail runners. If you're going to be a Devil Dog then just put on what you've got, put on your pack and quit all this sissy whining about your feet! :D
FWIW... I did a short section (45 miles) in central MA, wearing New Balance 991s and carrying a 30 lb pack. Just one small data point, not sure it it helps. Weather was fine, terrain was easy, and my feets were happy. Usually I'm wearing something a bit heavier, eg. Vasque "Breeze."
iamscottym
12-19-2006, 21:56
wacocelt....haha. I figure the DIs will cause enough pain, I don't need to add anything on top of that.
terrapin- funny you should mention 991's. I just pulled a new pair out of the closet and put my superfeet into them to see how they'd feel. they were amazing before, but with the superfeet, I'm tempted to just hike in them and not trail runners. traction be damned!
terrapin- funny you should mention 991's. I just pulled a new pair out of the closet and put my superfeet into them to see how they'd feel. they were amazing before, but with the superfeet, I'm tempted to just hike in them and not trail runners. traction be damned!
I am tempted to go with those for next years' section. As the years go on I find I'm wanting lighter and lighter footwear. The 991s have held up amazingly well. I only need them to last 600 miles... :)
I just had a meeting/appointment with a podiatrist to express my concerns of a long distance hike... He stated that no matter what I do (boots, shoes, superfeet, sandals...) my arches are going to fall. It may only be millimeters or completely, but some flattening out will be done to them.
He became quite concerned when I told him my plans and said he'd do what he could to help, but nothing he or I could do would prevent at least some falling of the arches...
I have both boots and low cut trail shoes (not really a trail running type shoe) and both work great for me. You have to look at what will work best for you and give you the least amount of problems in the long run!
Doctor's are prone to err too. He may-or may not- be right. Regardless of your footwear you have will have some built-in arch support provided and the foot -while delicate- are still quite resilient. Probably any footwear you select will work-from the heaviest of boots to the lightest of shoes/sandals to even thinner deerskin moccasins or barefoot, and actually has. Thats why its such a subjective selection, I guess.
A compromise, perhaps, is in order?Try wearing the trail shoes at the beginning and mailing your boots to Neel's Gap, "just in case". Or, suffer a little for piece of mind and carry both at the begoinning. When I went i had never seen the AT before so I started off with trail runners but carried my Teva Wraptor sandals. I wore the shoes the first day, second day went to sandals and mailed the trail runners home from Neel's gap when i got there, along with an extra Platypus water container I saw I didnt need. The AT is quite forgiving with its options provided, because of the closeness of resupply. In the final analysis only you are the best judge of your feet.
Doctor's are prone to err too. He may-or may not- be right.
Well, I like to think that I pick the best doctors I can find.
My personal physician graduated first in his class from U of M (thats Michigan) med school. My reconstuctive (I had to have some miracles performed after an accident) is THE professor of plastic surgery at U. of A. Birmingham, and his colleague, the podiatrist is the clincals supervisor of interns in the podiatry department. All 3 were voted as the who's who of doctors by their peers. (ie, if someone in their family needed a facial reconstuction surgeon, who would they go to?)
I have also done a court case background on all of them, while lawsuits do happen in the medical field, all have few cases filed against them, and all were decided for or settled with judegment FOR them, not against...
I dont think he err's too often.
RiverWarriorPJ
12-20-2006, 14:20
Not that it answers your question, but you'll most likely be issued "BelleVilles" when you join the Corps....you may like them, so i would hold off on ANY new purchases until after your advance training....you might just have everything you need by then...PS...<~~wearing a pair of USMC BelleVilles as i type..lol..
TJ aka Teej
12-20-2006, 14:56
wearing a pair of USMC BelleVilles as i type..
Welcome to Whiteblaze, River!:welcome
Well, I like to think that I pick the best doctors I can find.
My personal physician graduated first in his class from U of M (thats Michigan) med school. My reconstuctive (I had to have some miracles performed after an accident) is THE professor of plastic surgery at U. of A. Birmingham, and his colleague, the podiatrist is the clincals supervisor of interns in the podiatry department. All 3 were voted as the who's who of doctors by their peers. (ie, if someone in their family needed a facial reconstuction surgeon, who would they go to?)
I have also done a court case background on all of them, while lawsuits do happen in the medical field, all have few cases filed against them, and all were decided for or settled with judegment FOR them, not against...
I dont think he err's too often.
Why so testy about the doc?
I thought it good advice. I still do
rswanson
12-20-2006, 18:17
iamscottym,
I'm not sure what your concern is. With a base pack weight of 13.5lbs and the Crescent weighing an additional 7.5lbs, it doesn't sound like you'll be carrying much more than 35lbs, including a week's food and a few liters of water. That's certainly do-able in either boots or trail runners. Am I missing something?
Why so testy about the doc?
I thought it good advice. I still do
Having had a botched operation at 15 years old... I tend to do my homework before I let anyone give me any kind of medical advice. Doing background checks is quite easy especially in the medical field, so I dont take any chances with my life. No surgery is "minor," its all surgery. And since my feet have to last me, I really want them in good shape before and after my hike.
Sorry for the sarcasm in the first reply, Highway, but it is something that I am passionate about...:o
ahodlofski
12-23-2006, 23:56
OK....I"m a little confused....whats the verdict here?
My hiking partner are having the same debate...i have a pair of Asolo Gortex boots...she wants to wear trail runners...we're doing pretty much all of maine in august.
OK....I"m a little confused....whats the verdict here?
Ask N hikers for an opinion, you'll get at least N opinions. As usual, you'll have to sort it out for yourself. Such is life (and internet forums.)
ahodlofski
12-24-2006, 00:17
I love getting N opinions...its like being in law school...all the answers are "well...it depends..." Sounds like it just depends!!!
:-)
I love getting N opinions...its like being in law school...all the answers are "well...it depends..." Sounds like it just depends!!!
:-)
So what do old folks wear for underwear?
... depends!
iamscottym
12-24-2006, 01:17
rswanson-
As the addage goes, if you have a big pack, you'll fill it up. Plus, I plan on eating a little more than most hikers, and going farther between resupplys. Combine this with a large pack, and I'm liable to leave town with 30 lbs of food. While the weight doesn't personally worry me, nor my ankle strength, I was worried about the impact on my arches or anything else that could go wrong from being young and stupid and carrying heavy pack with inadequate footwear. As has been mentioned, insoles should solve this.
Combine this with a large pack, and I'm liable to leave town with 30 lbs of food.
Are you serious? Why 30 lbs? How long are you planning to stay in the woods between town stops? This is going to be interesting... :-?
iamscottym
12-24-2006, 03:08
Well, first off I eat a lot. I'm a small guy (5'9", 170), but just with working out at home I eat about 4,000 calories/day, and that's to maintain weight. On the trail my appetite goes up dramatically. On my recent trip to SNP, I lost 10 lbs (mind you, I don't have 10 lbs to lose, it's all muscle) and couldn't even keep track of how much I was eating. In addition to what I was carrying(lots of MH meals, power bars, etc), everytime I got near a wayside I'd pull in, down a couple cheeseburgers, assorted other junk, and grab 6-8 things of fudge, which would last me the day, and maybe a couple bites left for breakfast. I don't have a hard count, but I'm betting I ate around 6k calories on the trail. Granted, I was loaded to the max with my pack(~90lbs+water). I'll be lighter for my thru, but I still need a lot of food.
As far as days between resupply, 10-12 if possible. I don't particularily like pulling into towns, and as I said, I'm joining the Marines so carrying extra weight is beneficial. However, I'm also trying to do the trail in 4 months, so I'm trying to balance carrying a lot of weight and making big miles.
I'd rather err on the side of big miles at first, because I want to be able to finish and my finish date will be set in stone (I don't want to delay joining the Marines more than I have to as I'm currently paying student loans, which they'll pay off in their totality as soon as I'm in).
Right now I'm thinking I'll just buy a new pack; I can save a few pounds with something smaller, but still get a pack that can haul 40-50lbs if need be. I've got my rei dividend coming, so I won't be wasting any cash. I can always get my bigger pack back after I've got my legs. And if my feet start hurting, I can get my boots back.
SGT Rock
12-24-2006, 03:28
I think It was about 40 pounds while still in running shoes. I have carried up to 50 pounds in my Gearskin but cannot remember if I had on boots or shoes at the time. I PROBABLY had on shoes, but I cannot be 100% certain.
Having had a botched operation at 15 years old... I tend to do my homework before I let anyone give me any kind of medical advice. Doing background checks is quite easy especially in the medical field, so I dont take any chances with my life. No surgery is "minor," its all surgery. And since my feet have to last me, I really want them in good shape before and after my hike.
Sorry for the sarcasm in the first reply, Highway, but it is something that I am passionate about...:o
Me too!
Once a young doctor stood beside my bed to brief me on my medical situation and remarked that I'd never walk without a limp. I remember looking at him and thought to myself, "you're full of $*it". He was!
As far as days between resupply, 10-12 if possible. I don't particularily like pulling into towns, and as I said, I'm joining the Marines so carrying extra weight is beneficial. However, I'm also trying to do the trail in 4 months, so I'm trying to balance carrying a lot of weight and making big miles.
I'd rather err on the side of big miles at first, because I want to be able to finish and my finish date will be set in stone (I don't want to delay joining the Marines more than I have to as I'm currently paying student loans, which they'll pay off in their totality as soon as I'm in).
HYOH, of course. The CW, and my own experience & observation, says that if you want to make big miles, the best way to do that is to travel light. With a few exceptions, the folx with the lightest packs did the biggest miles.
frequency
12-29-2006, 18:37
I know footwear is a personal thing, but I was wondering what everyone thought was their weight limit with trail runners for a thru AT.
I've used trail runners with 50+ lb packs on other trails, but not for the long hall like a thru.
The reason I ask is that I'm joining the Marines, and that it doesn't make sense to blow a grand on new UL gear, when I just bought all new gear this summer.
My question is two fold; how much do people carry with trail runners, and how many miles/day were you doing.
Thanks,
iamscottym
iamscottym:
I remember watching the movie Platoon at MCAS Iwakuni in 1987 and Willem Dafoe's character tells Charlie Sheen "...you're packing too much stuff troop..." and he summarily empties out his pack. Your load sounds too heavy to me too: I had to unlearn a lot of the things I learned in the USMC when it came to the AT Journey: better for me to go light - which meant trail runners accompanied a load nmt 30 lbs (which includes food and water).
But you are a young hard charger - so you can likely carry more than me and be comfortable in go-fasters. There is no mathematical function except the one in your head to make a weight determination
While 782 gear has improved a ton (no more canvas shelter halves) and is more hi-tech but the weights are still heavy compared to market eqpt designed for UL pilgrimages (versus combat). Hold your $$$ until you know what can cross over from milspec to UL spec.
If you haven't read it yet - try Ray Jardine's Beyond Backpacking. I wouldn't swear by a lot of the things he does (he is on the extreme end of a normal distribution) but he makes a lot of sense about his philosophy of going light.
the goat
12-29-2006, 21:35
i've done 55 lbs. w/ trail runners in the past. no biggie, but i was glad to have had my hiking poles for stability....especially through PA.
gsingjane
12-30-2006, 09:06
I have been suffering with something that is either metatarsalgia (best case) or a stress fracture (worst case) in my right foot since last summer. Of course it was aggravated by five months of marathon training, but I am pretty sure it started when I hiked with three days in trail runners with a heavy pack. (I had my kids with me and believe me, "fast" and "light" aren't words you use much when you're hiking with them!). I had never had any foot pain of any kind before this hike, but after I got back it had started and got worse and worse until it was chronic. So I am not sure that trail runners work for everyone, at least not with a heavier pack.
Jane in CT