View Full Version : Contemplating the Zip Stove for thru-hike '07
BirchBark
01-19-2007, 00:34
I have the Gigapower stove now, but find that I carry too much weight in spare fuel canisters (I keep thinking the fuel'll run out). I'm thinking that getting new canisters along the trail may be both a hassle and a major expense.
If one can get over the soot issue, why not opt for a Zip? It seems to me that the additional weight of the stove itself is generally offset by not needing to carry fuel canisters. Furthermore, in my mind it's alright if dinner takes a few additional minutes to prepare. Very rarely am I so rushed or exhausted at the end of the day that the five extra minutes needed to use the Zip would result in my not eating- if so I've hiked unwisely and will pay accordingly (as usual).
It'd be great to get some user feedback on the prospect of relying on a Zip for a thru-hike.
Thanks all!
The soot and the extra bother eventually wore me down. Other than that, the Zip's been a good companion. It's not the best stove to have when you arrive late to camp in wet weather... and all you want is a (quick) hot meal or a cup of tea before retiring.
Why not opt for an alcohol or esbit stove? They are light and dependable.
Why not opt for an alcohol or esbit stove? They are light and dependable.
Because with alcohol, at least, the weight of the fuel far exceeds the weight of the stove.
I like the idea of the Zip, though I haven't used one myself. You might as well start the hike with it. You can always switch, if it doesn't work out.
BTW, I used a canister stove for most of my hike, having started with an alcohol stove. I never carried a spare canister. A couple of times I thought I might run out of fuel, but never actually did. The canisters last quite a while; there are frequently partially-empty ones in hiker boxes and shelters; and if you're running low you can scale back using it, for instance, not boiling so much water for hot drinks.
superman
01-19-2007, 07:59
I started the AT with a zip stove. The soot didn't bother me since I'd just wrap my cook stuff in a plastic grocery bag that was replaced with every resupply. The problem is that it requires the most fiddling with when you least feel like fiddling (fiddle factor). I sent mine home after the smokies. Pat from Maine and I still use it on our day or weekend hikes. Pat and I have enough gear to be outfitters (+ many stove) but we use a simple homemade alcohol stove when we want to do any real hiking.
Because with alcohol, at least, the weight of the fuel far exceeds the weight of the stove.
even adding the fuel, i can't find a zip stove lighter than an alcohol. interesting idea though...
Johnny Swank
01-19-2007, 09:34
I really like the idea of the zip stove, I think I'd use an alcohol stove again if I did another thru-hike and augement that with cooking on a small cookfire. I've been doing that lately on hikes just for the heck of it, and it works fine in most conditions when I'm not in a hurry. Push 3 stakes in the ground, grab a few handfuls of twigs and go to town.
You might want to check out Zelph's thread on the Martha Stewart stove. It's a passive wood burner that you can put any alcohol stove into when you want to go that route.
even adding the fuel, i can't find a zip stove lighter than an alcohol. interesting idea though...
Obviously it depends on your resupply interval and your cooking/eating habits. My experience to date has either been white gas (Svea, Whisperlite) and the Zip stove. I've never had to think much about fuel resupply... until now. You can last a month in the woods with a Zip or a Whisperlite and a 22-oz fuel bottle.
I can't seem to boil 2 cups of water reliably with 1 oz of alcohol. That concerns me. Next summer I'll probably take my canister stove as primary, and maybe some alcohol stove as backup. Unless I get more comfortable and confident using alcohol stoves in the meanwhile.
If one can get over the soot issue, why not opt for a Zip? It seems to me that the additional weight of the stove itself is generally offset by not needing to carry fuel canisters. Furthermore, in my mind it's alright if dinner takes a few additional minutes to prepare. Very rarely am I so rushed or exhausted at the end of the day that the five extra minutes needed to use the Zip would result in my not eating- if so I've hiked unwisely and will pay accordingly (as usual).
It'd be great to get some user feedback on the prospect of relying on a Zip for a thru-hike.
Thanks all!
I think you're a good candidate for a zip. They are well built and dependable.
Buy one soon and start practicing your fire building skills before you head out on your hike. You'll get over the soot thing.
(Marta) I like the idea of the Zip, though I haven't used one myself. You might as well start the hike with it. You can always switch, if it doesn't work out.
And like Marta said you can always switch.
I say go for it. Enjoy your thru!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :banana
Johnny Swank
01-19-2007, 10:34
Terrapin,
What kind of stove are you using? I've had good luck with both a supercat as well as just a refried-bean can with slots cut near the top. Use a windscreen and any alcohol stove should get 2 cups of water boiling on 1 oz of fuel.
hopefulhiker
01-19-2007, 10:36
I considered the zip. But honestly at the end of the day I didn't want to bother gathering wood, or wet wood....
check out this LINK:
http://hikinghq.net/stoves/zip.html
i prefer the MSR POCKET ROCKET...its' much lighter...NO FUSS, NO MUSS!:D
good luck with your hike!
Don't let them talk you out of a Zip. It's a great thru hiking stove. It's simple, low tech, environmentally friendly, and reliable. I've never had trouble getting a fire going. I've never spent time scurrying for wood before cooking. Just pick up a few handfuls of fuel as you hike along during the day. I always picked up scraps of birch bark from fallen limbs, and snapped off bits of dry fuel from the dead lower branches of trees as I walked along.
On sunny days I could collect plenty of fuel by occasionally picking up promising looking dry sticks broken by hiker boots. Most shelter fire places had burned stubs of previous fires.
Nor is there a soot "problem." Just keep your stove and pot in a plastic bag -- the kind every trailside store fosters on you, whenever you buy a Snicker bar.
A Zip does force you to think ahead to supper time -- not a terribly hard thing to do. Thinking and looking and moving your legs is what thru hiking is all about.
Weary
Cedar Tree
01-19-2007, 11:22
I started with a Zip Stove, but sent it home at Gatlinburg. It takes way too much fiddle time. It burns the wood so quickly you must constantly keep the stove fed.
CT
Terrapin, What kind of stove are you using?
It's a TinMan (AGG) stove. Mine is from a can of Mountain Dew. ;) I'd say my success rate is about 50% (1 oz denatured alcohol to boil 2 cups tap water.) I've yet to build my own. Might try a Trangia or somethin'.
sirbingo
01-19-2007, 11:30
Why not use a zip and carry a backup alky stove (which weighs almost nothing) with and few onces of emergency alcohol.
Thats what I would do. :dance
I considered using a Zip Stove on my thru but decided to bring my Wisperlite instead. I was glad I didn't bring the Zip when I saw the smoke that they make. Folks that were using them had to cook some distance from the shelter to prevent annoying others.
on the other hand cooking with a Zip means the smoke drives the bugs away
I have the Gigapower stove now, but find that I carry too much weight in spare fuel canisters (I keep thinking the fuel'll run out). I'm thinking that getting new canisters along the trail may be both a hassle and a major expense.
If one can get over the soot issue, why not opt for a Zip? It seems to me that the additional weight of the stove itself is generally offset by not needing to carry fuel canisters. Furthermore, in my mind it's alright if dinner takes a few additional minutes to prepare. Very rarely am I so rushed or exhausted at the end of the day that the five extra minutes needed to use the Zip would result in my not eating- if so I've hiked unwisely and will pay accordingly (as usual).
It'd be great to get some user feedback on the prospect of relying on a Zip for a thru-hike.
Thanks all!
i have taken mine on a few long section hikes,plus the smoke they produce helps keep the skeeters away,i like this stove,it's cool:cool: neo
...You can last a month in the woods with a Zip or a Whisperlite and a 22-oz fuel bottle.
I can't seem to boil 2 cups of water reliably with 1 oz of alcohol. .
Try a Trangia - it heats a pint in less than 1/2 that. An ~8 fl oz container (~6 1/2 wt oz) lasts about a week- heating a pint twice a day-in spring, summer, fall temps. You dont even have to measure it out...just fill it and forget it, light it when you need it.
BirchBark
01-19-2007, 20:46
I considered using a Zip Stove on my thru but decided to bring my Wisperlite instead. I was glad I didn't bring the Zip when I saw the smoke that they make. Folks that were using them had to cook some distance from the shelter to prevent annoying others.
I can see that happening. Funny, considering most folks crashing in the shelters smell something fierce themselves. In my case, I'll be hammocking out nearly every evening so there likely won't be anyone close enough to annoy.
The idea of carrying a soda can stove and an bit of alcohol as a back-up system that was mentioned might be the way...
I just like the idea of a wood fire, no matter how small.
I'm toying with the idea of using a hobo stove ( coffee can size or smaller) as a windscreen when using the alcohol stove and switching to wood when in the mood.
Juicy Hamburgers would sure sound good after a few days of hot water cooking. You could do this the day or two after a resupply, then go back to alcohol.
Miles of Smiles
Tom
TJ aka Teej
01-24-2007, 17:44
I like my Zip a lot. It's fun collecting fuel as you hike along, too. My only suggestion is that you practice cooking with it quite a bit before you take it on a long hike.
Skidsteer
01-24-2007, 19:37
Obviously it depends on your resupply interval and your cooking/eating habits. My experience to date has either been white gas (Svea, Whisperlite) and the Zip stove. I've never had to think much about fuel resupply... until now. You can last a month in the woods with a Zip or a Whisperlite and a 22-oz fuel bottle.
I can't seem to boil 2 cups of water reliably with 1 oz of alcohol. That concerns me. Next summer I'll probably take my canister stove as primary, and maybe some alcohol stove as backup. Unless I get more comfortable and confident using alcohol stoves in the meanwhile.
It's a TinMan (AGG) stove. Mine is from a can of Mountain Dew. ;) I'd say my success rate is about 50% (1 oz denatured alcohol to boil 2 cups tap water.) I've yet to build my own. Might try a Trangia or somethin'.
There's something wrong with your windscreen or pot size, or something is horribly wrong with your stove, Terrapin.
Even a Supercat does better than your results.
A 2 cup boil(and then some) with a full ounce of alcohol with an AGG stove should be closer to a 100% occurrence.
A 2 cup boil(and then some) with a full ounce of alcohol with an AGG stove should be closer to a 100% occurrence.
So tell me what I'm doing wrong. :-? I was on the phone for 45 minutes with TinMan, believe it or not. He sure gave it his best. I've tried a few different pots, starting with the small (3-cup) Open Country pot from an old boy scout mess kit. I've used TinMan's windscreen (with variations suggested by TinMan himself.) I've even tried a couple of different brands of denatured alcohol.
There are some things in life that are supposed to be great but just never worked out for me. Hard liquor, religion, internal frame packs and alcohol stoves come to mind.
Skidsteer
01-24-2007, 20:34
There are some things in life that are supposed to be great but just never worked out for me. Hard liquor, religion, internal frame packs and alcohol stoves come to mind.
First: If you're bent on using alcohol stoves, you really should give religion and hard liquor another look.
Seriously? The 3-cup Open Country is ...what? 4 1/2" to 5" diameter, right?
First make a Supercat (http://jwbasecamp.com/Articles/SuperCat/index.html). It's easy, cheap, and it's close to the same height as the AGG.
Try it with the same windscreen and pot. If it performs better, then I'm inclined to say that you got a rare lemon(the AGG stoves are pretty good) and should replace it. But not with a Supercat. They suck.
I'm being facetious but you get the idea, I hope. You're an engineer so ply your trade by mixing and matching components until you find a workable combination. There are lots of good ideas in the Homemade Gear forum to check out.
Hell, even a simple tea light container will boil water on 1/2 oz of alcohol with the right setup.
First: If you're bent on using alcohol stoves, you really should give religion and hard liquor another look.
LOL. I'm not much of a gear tinkerer. I tend to stick with what works. I've used mainly three stoves since I've been trekking thru woods: 1) Svea, 2) Whisperlite, 3) Sierra Zip. Being on this gram-weenie kick means I need to consider other options. Given my ***** luck with alky stoves, I'll probably just go with a canister stove or JetBoil. With either of these, I consume approximately 0.1 oz. of canister fuel for every cup of water boiled. Very predictable and reliable. Means I can go maybe 10 days on a small canister. Works for me!
oldfivetango
01-25-2007, 09:22
It's a TinMan (AGG) stove. Mine is from a can of Mountain Dew. ;) I'd say my success rate is about 50% (1 oz denatured alcohol to boil 2 cups tap water.) I've yet to build my own. Might try a Trangia or somethin'.
You can make an alcohol stove in a matter of minutes with
no more in the way of tools than a simple "push pin"(like you see
on bulletin boards etc) Got the idea from SGT ROCK.Used it the
other night-2 cups water in the small AG pot and 2/3 oz of alcohol.
It requires either a small lid or piece of foil under the apparatus to
hold a squirt or two of primer alcohol.Place the pot on the can(Frito
Lay Bean Dip) in my case and light the primer.When I came back to
the stove after fumbling around in the house for some rice I raised the
lid to see a rapid rolling boil and my trusty Timex reported 4:33.In just
a few more seconds the fuel ran out.You might want to experiment with
the proximity of the windscreen to the pot etc.I was using about 3/8 inch.
Too loose and you loose alot of your heat;too tight and your fuel may
sort of "flash" off which will require more fuel and starting over.
Now all I want to know is whether or not anyone is successfully cooking
rice in the Freezer Bag or not.Mine was too crunchy,even after 30 minutes
and all coozied up top and bottom.Was hoping not to have to clean up
the bottom of the boiler as I always burn things.Note:If I intend to cook
rather than just boil water I will use the Brasslite Turbo 2D.The new
FeatherLite(I think is the name) looks very promising as well.Note:
my weather conditions on the above stated boil time was 46 degrees F
and very light to no winds.
Cheers,
Oldfivetango
superman
01-25-2007, 10:36
Here's the easiest alcohol stove ever. When I changed to alcohol from my beloved zip I bought the tiniest can I could find in the store which was a tiny, aluminum weenie can. I used my, sole source of protection on the AT, 1.5 inch blade knife to cut vent holes just below the can lip. I just pushed the little knife in four times per square vent hole. I put the little can on the Nesbit frame that I found in a hiker box. I very quickly learned how much alcohol it took to boil 2 cups of water in my pan. The can came so close to the bottom of the pan that the vent holes were needed for air in-flow. The frame was solid and didn't need a wind screen. Everything fits inside my pan easily. It was only meant as a temporary solution to fiddling with my zip stove. I carried it from Gatlinburg north and I would carry it again...still works great.
OFT,
I admit that I have never cooked white rice on an alcohol stove, but I routinely cook it on a regular stove in no more than 20 minutes.
Of course, that's with high heat to get it boiling.
That would translate to 5 plus 20 on an alcohol stove.
Brown rice takes twice as long and 25% more water.
This would be why SARBAR always uses instant rice in her recipes.
So, your choices would be to:
1 figure out a simmering setup that can be switched to "in flight"
a. that's one of the strong points of the trangia. You could copy their method on a side burner, I guess.
b. with a pot stand and a top burner stove, it's pretty easy to do. just add two half lids and index to get the flame you want.
2. use precooked (instant) rice.
Miles of Smiles
Tom
oldfivetango
01-25-2007, 12:46
Thanks Tom,
I had forgotten about instant rice as I was
raised on the cooked kind.Sure hope it is better than
instant coffee and instant grits but when you're hungry
it probably won't matter.I like the cook in the freezer bag
idea ALOT cause I am too lazy to want to fiddle with
cleaning a pot.
Cheers,
Oldfivetango
Why not use a zip and carry a backup alky stove (which weighs almost nothing) with and few onces of emergency alcohol.
Thats what I would do. :dance
I now use a wood stove (coffee can, no Zip) and carry the MSR Pocket Rocket + 4 oz fuel can as a backup. I tried thye alky route and boiled lots of water. the problem (reason I went away from alky) is it was almost impossible to control the alky falme and there seemed to be a lot of wasted fuel. I gather from other posts that nobody else has these alky problems?? Especially as a backup, the Pocket Rocket is great.
Stag3
Johnny Swank
01-25-2007, 17:35
stag,
Some folks measure each drop of alcohol and have burn times down to the second. I just kind of eyeball it and seem to do OK. I think it's just a matter of using what you have for a number of meals and see what works best.
superman
01-25-2007, 19:06
There all good. They'll all get the job done for you. Pat and I have about every type of stove out there. The only short coming of the canister type is the canister. You usually carry two fuel containers...even if it's just to get rid of the empty. They're great for simmering if you're a gourmet (I don't simmer). We have the Wisperlight that doesn't whisper but its ok. We have a few alcohol stoves. I use my simple alcohol can stove mostly. Pat and I cook more stuff when we take the zip stove. We like to have tea and extras just because we can with the zip stove. I still like my zip stove but I had to send it home early from the AT because it wasn't working for me. In 99 I hiked the Long Trail with a guy who hiked the AT with his zip stove. He had a plastic bag hanging from his belt that he collected wood in. Just take what ever stove you're comfortable with...they'll all do the job. You don't get points off when you reach Mt K if you have the wrong stove. The thing is to not fall in love with any particular piece of gear. All of it is disposable. You have to adapt and over come. You need to make your gear help you accomplish what you're trying to achieve.
sirbingo
01-31-2007, 13:18
I now use a wood stove (coffee can, no Zip) and carry the MSR Pocket Rocket + 4 oz fuel can as a backup. .
***snip***
Hey Stag3,
How much better is you homemade wood stove over the Zip stove? :-?
I am so on the fence about purchasing a zip for this comming spring and summer...
Hey Stag3,
How much better is you homemade wood stove over the Zip stove? :-?
I am so on the fence about purchasing a zip for this comming spring and summer...
Well, I don't know if it is "better" since I've never used a zip stove. Mine is a coffe can with a screen grate about 1 " off the bottom and air intake holes below the grate. On top I have about 1 " of clearance between the stove and the pot. The natural draft (like a fireplace) draws in the air. I think maybe an advantage over the zip is cost (free), weight (about 3 or 4 oz) and no moveing parts. But like I said, I've never used a zip stove.
Stag3
mweinstone
01-31-2007, 18:38
only prob with it is smoke in others faces and noise in others ears. walk far away and dont come back till your done. its a wonderfull way to cook but uses more human power and therefor defeats the savings.owned one for years. its a must have when teaching kids.had the big camp one sierra made. gave it to starlyte for others to enjoy. never used it cause i dont drive a car. didnt think of that then.
I tried to use a zip stove for my 06 thru-hike and I sent it home at the NOC (after around 140 miles or so). I used an alcohol stove that I made at the NOC about mile 600, and then I didn't cook until Maine. I slowed down so much in Maine (I didn't want my thru-hike to end) and found an abandoned pot in a shelter, and ended up cooking over campfires in that pot on and off for the rest of my hike.
It's a hassle to use. by the time you've even collected /broken up enough wood to cook your dinner, an alcohol stove would have had that meal almost cooked. Also, you need to tend to the fire the entire time your meal is cooking, instead of being able to set up your tarp or whatever while your dinner cooks.
It's really not all that light. If you're going out for 4 days, you probably need 6-9 oz of alcohol or so, and an alcohol stove weighs an ounce at the most. The lightest zip stove weighs 10 oz, so even with a full fuel bottle, the alcohol is lighter. Alcohol is faily cheap and very easy to resupply on the AT.
The titanium zip stove is expensive, alcohol stoves are nearly free.
Batteries don't really work when they are cold.
If I were to do the AT again with a 2-3 person group I would use a zip stove. If you will be hiking solo, it simply doesn't make sense.
.....It's a hassle to use. by the time you've even collected /broken up enough wood to cook your dinner, an alcohol stove would have had that meal almost cooked. Also, you need to tend to the fire the entire time your meal is cooking, instead of being able to set up your tarp or whatever while your dinner cooks.
.....Batteries don't really work when they are cold. If I were to do the AT again with a 2-3 person group I would use a zip stove. If you will be hiking solo, it simply doesn't make sense.
I've used a Zip Stove for years, including on my solo walk north in 1993. I rarely had to collect enough wood before cooking dinner because I would oicj up enticing pieces of wood as I walked during the day, I almost always had more than enough by the time I stopped for the day.
Nor did I ever have battery problems in temperatures I found on the trail. I started in mid April, but did not finish until Oct. 16 after nights had regularly dropped below freezing.
I haven't used an alcohol stove, but if you only need two cups of hot water, I'm convinced that is the way to go. But I was into cooking real rice (20 minutes), NearEast rice Pilaf (25 minutes) and occasional half hour concoctions -- for taste, economy and vaRIety reasons. Plus I would boil (purify) two quarts of water most evenings for use the next day.
The Zip has a learning curve, especially if you don't use wood fires at home, which I have for most of my life. But with a bit of planning, it is an ideal backpacking stove for those of us who are into natural things.
BTW, unlike most other fuels, especially white gas and cartridges, the Zip does not contribute to global warming. the CO2 released by burning the dead wood I find on the forest floor or on the dead branches of trees, would decay anyway in a few years, releasing the same gases that are released by burning.
Alcohol fuel is also a bit of a wash, global warming wise. It's made from corn. But corn growers use enormous amounts of fossil fuel energy in fertilizers, tractors and transportation. Factories that ferment the corn and evaporate the water use additional fossil fuels. Despite the hype about ethanol, most studies say alcohol-related products use more energy than they produce. Others suggest a break even. Only a few honest studies report a net gain in energy.
So all of you folks who are willing to sacrifice a wild trail to 400-foot high wind turbines should throw away your alcohol, white gas, and cartridge stoves and cook with wood to be consistent.
Weary
So all of you folks who are willing to sacrifice a wild trail to 400-foot high wind turbines should throw away your alcohol, white gas, and cartridge stoves and cook with wood to be consistent.
There's still that pesky little battery... "Sacrifice" the trail. A bit melodramatic, no?
Make a wood burner like this one using (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=20680)a flour sifter.
Or Consider using a stove like this one for larger meals. (from an earlier post)
My wisperlite boiled 8 cups in 9.5 min.
This open flame alcohol stove boiled 8 in 10.5 min.
This is a wick style stove. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/obijiwa/megwkwrkhrse001.jpg)
Has a central wick made of fiberglass. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/obijiwa/megwkwrkhrse002.jpg)
This is the flame pattern under the 5 1/2 in diameter pot (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/obijiwa/wrkhorse001.jpg)
The fiberglass will absorb 1 1/2 ounces of denatured alcohol completely. If the stove is tipped over the fuel will not spill out.
Maximum fuel capacity is 2 ounces.
The stove will boil 8 cups ( 1/2 gallon) of water in 10 1/2 min. using 2 ounces of denatured alcohol and continue to boil for an additional 4 min. Tests were made in a 5 1/2 diameter aluminum pot.
Will boil 2 cups in 5 1/2 min. using 1/2 ounce denatured alcohol.(3 cup pot)
Will boil 4 cups in 6 1/2 min. using 1 ounce of denatured alcohol.(8 cup pot)
Will boil 6 cups in 8 1/2 min. using 1 1/2 ounce denatured alcohol.(8 cup pot)
Stove weighs 1.9 ounces
Stove is complete with attached pot stand
DawnTreader
02-01-2007, 15:15
Hell, even a simple tea light container will boil water on 1/2 oz of alcohol with the right setup.
This is true. I get 2 cups to boil with 1/2 oz. of denatured alcohol with Sgt. Rocks Ion stove. It's amazingly efficient, light, and I only carry around 5 oz. of alcohol at a time.
There's still that pesky little battery... "Sacrifice" the trail. A bit melodramatic, no?
My global warming aside was just that. I just saw a chance to get people to think. But you are right. The trail, of course, will remain. The surroundings, however will change from mostly trees, views of undeveloped ridges, and high elevation plants to a $150 million industrial complex, stretching over two wild ridge lines that begin just a mile across a remote, development-free valley.
Weary
This is true. I get 2 cups to boil with 1/2 oz. of denatured alcohol with Sgt. Rocks Ion stove. It's amazingly efficient, light, and I only carry around 5 oz. of alcohol at a time.
Originally Posted by Skidsteer http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?p=309221#post309221)
Hell, even a simple tea light container will boil water on 1/2 oz of alcohol with the right setup.
Skidsteer hit it right on the nose when he said "with the right set up" and the same thing goes for the the Ion and other stoves as well.
It is my belief that the longer it takes to get the right setup and the longer it takes to boil the 2 cups, the efficiency drops. It takes time to get the right set up, time is part of the equation, and the stuff required in the set up, insulator for the bottom of the burner, primer pans, heat retaining sheilds, these are all part of the equation also. Being able to perform well in all temperatures is part of the eficiency equation.
A STOVE THAT CAN BOIL 2 CUPS OF WATER USING 1/2 FLUID OUNCE OF FUEL IS AN EFFICIENT STOVE.
In the world of backpacking, a stove that boils 2 cups of water with less than 1/2 ounce of fuel is more efficient.
A STOVE THAT CAN BOIL 2 CUPS OF WATER USING 1/2 FLUID OUNCE OF FUEL IS AN EFFICIENT STOVE.
If the fuel is alcohol, I'd say that stove is non-existent. My experience, anyway. :confused:
If the fuel is alcohol, I'd say that stove is non-existent. My experience, anyway. :confused:
I was able to do that reliably with a Caldera stove. I don't this it's the stove that's so special. The windscreen/pot stand is the key.
Cheers!
Marta/Five-Leaf
homebrew
02-01-2007, 18:15
Go with an alcohol stove. I used a whisperlite up to the smokies then sent it home; it was very reliable during cold weather. You can get denatured alcohol anywhere these days, it burns clean and doesn't leave a residual smell.
Skidsteer
02-01-2007, 18:37
If the fuel is alcohol, I'd say that stove is non-existent. My experience, anyway. :confused:
For goodness sake, don't post your mailing address.
My wife would wait till I'm out of the house, clean out my stove boxes and mail them to you. The shipping would break me.
BirchBark
02-04-2007, 20:47
After much thought I ordered the Zip this afternoon. Thanks to the helpful discussion here at Whiteblaze I was able to make an educated purchase.
I went with the SIERRA STOVE with the upgrade kit.
Includes Cross Grate, Wrap Around Shield, Zip Fires Sample. 1LB 7oz.
It seems to me that canister stoves shine their brightest when used exclusively for boiling water for freeze-dried meals. There's no doubting it, firing up a Zip just to boil water is inefficency at its peak. But what happens when the $7.50 Mountain House meals run out five nights north of Springer? I can see myself shopping at tiny rural markets with limited inventory, finding no option but rice or pasta mixes that require 15 minute cooking times. That's a lot of canisters.
And like I said, I'd probably carry too many canisters out of fear that the fuel would run out and leave me stranded. I'd rather not deal with the weight or bulk anyway.
The ideal hike I envision in my mind is one on which I am not tethered to town. Hopefully not needing to resupply fuel canisters along the way will free me up to spend just a little more time on the trail.
And I like the smell of a wood fire.
superman
02-04-2007, 21:22
Good choice...enjoy.
Two Speed
02-04-2007, 21:47
. . . And I like the smell of a wood fire.Sounds like you picked the perfect stove for your hiking style, then. Good luck!
4eyedbuzzard
02-05-2007, 12:41
I've owned, modified, and used a Zip since 1991. I love it. Limitless fuel supply for backcountry cooking. I would not, however, take it on a thru hike, especially in the early spring. It is too smokey and too much a fire hazard for use in a tent or shelter, and it just takes too long and requires too much effort when it's cold and wet and the days are not yet very long. I'd go with another alternative at least early in the hike, and then possibly replace it with the Zip further up the trail. Just my opinion. YMMV.
sirbingo
02-05-2007, 12:50
Cool BirchBark!..glad you bit the bullet
I am so on the fence with purchasing a zip....Please let us know how it works out for you.
:sun
Sirbingo
BirchBark
02-15-2007, 11:49
The Zip came in the mail yesterday. This thing is extremely cool! I immediately tested it out on the back porch, and it burns like a sumbitch. It literally took me less than 45 seconds to get a really hot fire going. What I really like about the Zip is its ability to blaze like hellfire or lay down to a low heat as needed.
This wonderful little gizmo will allow me to venture into unexplored areas of backpacking cuisine. I can deal with a little soot, and the time and effort needed to feed it fuel is hardly a chore. I managed to have a hot fire going for 5 minutes with a small handfull of snapped branches that took me all of fifteen seconds to collect.
I do have some concerns, however.
1. it seems like the "weak link of the chain" is the battery/switch box. Should it be sealed somehow, with duct tape or something?
2. how to deal with the fire ban in Baxter State Park and Connecticut? For those of you that used a Zip on your thru, how did you manage?
3. pot stability/size. Unfortunately for me, the diameter of my cooking pot is just less than the diameter of the Zip. This means that have to get a wider pot (unless the cross grate solves this issue). Any recommendations for a lightweight pot that the Zip can nest in?
Also ordered (but not yet received) was the cross grate & wrap-around shield. Does anyone have experience with these items, good or bad?
1) Never had a problem with the battery/switch box.
2) That's one of the problems with a Zip stove...
3) Pot stability is no worse than most other stoves. Use a 5" diameter (2.5 cup) Open Country aluminum pot, or an Evernew Titanium pot.
4eyedbuzzard
02-15-2007, 12:38
My '91 Zip had a poorly designed/flimsy battery/switch assembly which I switched out for a proper battery holder (from electronics store). I also got rid of the damper and made the fan variable speed by putting a potentiometer in series with the motor long before Zip sold the stove that way standard. I never had a battery or electrical problem after that in over 15 years of use.
I would simply get a little soda can alcohol stove and carry it as a back up along with a little fuel. Make a riser out of a section of soda can to raise the alcohol stove off the bottom of the zip combustion chamber. The alcohol can help as a fire starter when no dry fuel is available and is great for that morning cup of coffee when it's nasty out and you need to heat water in a tent or shelter. In CT and Baxter you can just carry more alcohol and use the alcohol stove.
Pot stability is what is.
applejack
02-15-2007, 14:05
1. it seems like the "weak link of the chain" is the battery/switch box. Should it be sealed somehow, with duct tape or something?
2. how to deal with the fire ban in Baxter State Park and Connecticut? For those of you that used a Zip on your thru, how did you manage?
3. pot stability/size. Unfortunately for me, the diameter of my cooking pot is just less than the diameter of the Zip. This means that have to get a wider pot (unless the cross grate solves this issue). Any recommendations for a lightweight pot that the Zip can nest in?
Also ordered (but not yet received) was the cross grate & wrap-around shield. Does anyone have experience with these items, good or bad?
i didn't need to seal mine for my whole thru, just kept it in the nylon sack when not in use.
used the stove in both ct and baxter with no problems. i don't think i bothered to ask permission, but no problems. it's a wood stove, not an open fire. i did ask permission when i went into the grand canyon, and they let me, going by the thought that zip users tend to be of the more careful type anyway. though they wanted me to pack out the ash. hmm.
i think i tried the grate when i got it, once, but not again. makes the stove all the more unstable.